S12.E05: Not So Model Behavior

[Carolina Girl]

On 4/30/2020 at 6:49 PM, Vanderboom said:

I just can't with Sonja's Mogul theatrics. She's acting like she thinks a real fashion businesswoman should act.  

Leah definitley seems like a Cool Girl.  While I doubt she singlehandedly began Streetwear for Women, I like that she used her own experiences to find her own space in the fashion world. Can't knock her hustle.

I can understand why Leah's mom is so upset.  Living with an addict can be exhausting, and she's probably flashing back to her worst nightmare, even though she wasn't there.

As the Mom of an adult kid who had a drinking problem, I can completely relate to Leah’s Mom’s reaction.  I have done the same thing.  

[Raiderred]

On 4/30/2020 at 9:27 PM, LibertarianSlut said:

I had to give this its own post, because it was uniquely disgusting on a show and network full of disgusting displays:

Dorinda said she had a skirt with “General” Mao on it and it was “gangstery” and “fashionable”?  What’s “fashionable” about a man who killed and tortured and starved millions of people?  Mao was a 20th century totalitarian dictator, right up there with Hitler and Stalin, except I would argue that he was worse.  What is “gangster” or “fashionable” about a man who sent people to prison camps and starved them by the millions?  How can she say that?  He is, according to The Washington Post, “the biggest mass murderer in the history of the world.”  He killed 45 million people between 1958 to 1962.  

Hey LS, I did not see you already posted this when I made my post.  I was as shocked as you and I quickly came on and posted just before going to bed and had not read the previous posts.  I think she will get huge backlash from this. 

[The Ringo Kidd]

34 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

Salami thrown on a plate.  Was it left from someone’s antipasto on Italian night?
 

 

 

 

 

 

“Salami thrown on a plate”

That describes Luanns whole tenure on the show.

She had a lot of salami thrown at her.

Edited May 2, 2020 by The Ringo Kidd

[sasha206]

Sonja is trying to do a "I'm a business woman like Bethenny" act and failing spectacularly!

 

[LibertarianSlut]

6 hours ago, Raiderred said:

Hey LS, I did not see you already posted this when I made my post.  I was as shocked as you and I quickly came on and posted just before going to bed and had not read the previous posts.  I think she will get huge backlash from this. 

Here’s hoping, but there is no good evidence of that yet.  I am not social media savvy at all.  I have no idea how to go on Twitter or Instagram, but I googled “Dorinda Mao apology” and nothing came up, except I I saw one person tweeted at her what we were saying, but zero from the network.  I’d love to be wrong!

I even looked up the Vivienne Tam collection, to see if there was an argument to be made that Dorinda was satirizing Mao, and there’s simply no evidence.  From Tam’s quotes, she did the collection to be “an agitator,” but Dorinda’s comments didn’t reflect any appreciation of that.  I’m not going to create something that’s not there.  It goes against any type of Socratic or scientific inquiry that I’ve ever learned.  

My husband saw something really caught my attention this episode, as I rewound to make sure Dorinda said what I thought she did, so he found this article of what people were tweeting about the episode as it aired.  

People were primarily upset that Sonja confused Lil Kim for Beyonce, a seldom few were outraged by what Dorinda had said, and most just thought it showed Dorinda to be clueless and/or behind the times, such as "Dorinda's comparison of General Mao & Lil' Kim shows the generational divide between her and Leah....#RHONY."

Missing the point much?  Geez.  

I think the people who wrote tweets such as the one above, and people like Dorinda simply have no idea how bad he was.  That’s the most obvious conclusion.  It makes me think of the quote by one of my favorite authors: “At some point, ignorance becomes sin.”

On Dorinda’s first season, she told the story about how she was so embarrassed that she saw a black man in a tie in a restaurant and mistook him for the coat check.  She is still getting skewered to this day for that.  No one said, “perhaps his shirt and tie matched the staff’s almost perfectly” or “I’m sure she’s eaten there before and there is a black man who looked just like the black man in question who worked there and she was just confused.”  They didn’t say that, because there was no evidence that it was the case, just like there’s no evidence now that Dorinda considers wearing Mao to be anything other than “gangstery,” “fashionable” and comparable to Lil Kim.  

Sonja and Dorinda are receiving more flak for making comments at Tinsley’s fashion show that the models were not women, or they didn’t look womanly, and it turned out in the aftermath that some of the models were transgender and felt hurt.  

At least Dorinda’s getting nailed for something.  Al Capone went down for tax evasion.  

Edited May 3, 2020 by LibertarianSlut
Typos

[ShawnaLanne]

4 hours ago, sasha206 said:

Sonja doesn't hurt anyone either with clinging to her  past.  But we still talk about her too.  [deleted "protected class" comment!]

Sonja is a menace, and she does hurt people. The way she went after Tinsley the first season she was on was awful, she's the one who started the rumour that Tinsley is a kept woman. She also has to absolutely humiliate her daughter with her antics. 

 

[biakbiak]

Just now, ShawnaLanne said:

Sonja is a menace, and she does hurt people. The way she went after Tinsley the first season she was on was awful, she's the one who started the rumour that Tinsley is a kept woman. She also has to absolutely humiliate her daughter with her antics. 

 

Yeah they showed that season this week and I forgot how absolutely vicious and petty towards Tinsley and still tries to deflect any comments about her marriage on to Tinsley even though there aren’t similarities.

[ShawnaLanne]

38 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Here’s hoping, but there is no good evidence of that yet.  I am not social media savvy at all.  I have no idea how to go on Twitter or Instagram, but I googled “Dorinda Mao apology” and nothing came up, except I I saw one person tweeted at her what we were saying, but zero from the network.  I’d love to be wrong!

I even looked up the Vivienne Tam collection, to see if there was an argument to be made that Dorinda was satirizing Mao, and there’s simply no evidence.  From Tam’s quotes, she did the collection to be “an agitator,” but Dorinda’s comments didn’t reflect any appreciation of that.  I’m not going to create something that’s not there.  It goes against any type of Socratic or scientific inquiry that I’ve ever learned.  

My husband saw something really caught my attention this episode, as I rewound to make sure Dorinda said what I thought she did, so he found this article of what people were tweeting about the episode as it aired.  

https://meaww.com/rhony-real-housewives-of-new-york-sonja-confuses-lil-kim-beyonce-dorinca-lil-kim-general-mao

People were primarily upset that Sonja confused Lil Kim for Beyonce, a seldom few were outraged by what Dorinda had said, and most just thought it showed Dorinda to be clueless and/or behind the times, such as "Dorinda's comparison of General Mao & Lil' Kim shows the generational divide between her and Leah....#RHONY."

Missing the point much?  Geez.  

I think the people who wrote tweets such as the one above, and people like Dorinda simply have no idea how bad he was.  That’s the most obvious conclusion.  It makes me think of the quote by one of my favorite authors: “At some point, ignorance becomes sin.”

On Dorinda’s first season, she told the story about how she was so embarrassed that she saw a black man in a tie in a restaurant and mistook him for the coat check.  She is still getting skewered to this day for that.  No one said, “perhaps his shirt and tie matched the staff’s almost perfectly” or “I’m sure she’s eaten there before and there is a black man who looked just like the black man in question who worked there and she was just confused.”  They didn’t say that, because there was no evidence that it was the case, just like there’s no evidence now that Dorinda considers wearing Mao to be “gangstery,” “fashionable” and comparable to Lil Kim.  

Sonja and Dorinda are receiving more flak for making comments at Tinsley’s fashion show that the models were not women, or they didn’t look womanly, and it turned out in the aftermath that some of the models were transgender and felt hurt.  

At least Dorinda’s getting nailed for something.  Al Capone went down for tax evasion.  

There's been an explination here of the print Dorinda thought it was, why it was controversial at the time, the designer did it as a taking back of power other people thought it was awful.

As the proud mother of a transgender daughter, Sonja and Dorinda absolutely deserve to be dragged. Transgender people are discriminated against, right now, in our country and are at higher risk for being murdered. Particularly women and particularly people of color. So Dorinda and Sonja, feeding into that crap can go f themselves on a rusty post.

1 minute ago, ShawnaLanne said:

 

 

Edited May 2, 2020 by ShawnaLanne

[LibertarianSlut]

4 hours ago, sasha206 said:

I mean, I think that b/c Tinsley is so well liked b/c she is sweet, people gloss over the fact that she acts like she's still 20 and don't seem to like any criticism of her on the board unlike others.  

I think Tinsley is sweet but she's also cartoonish to me.

 

I thought I saw a post that Tinsley seems to get a pass, but I think it’s gone now.  I agree with that sentiment if it’s out there.  If it’s not out there, I’ll just say it.  

I think Tinsley is self-centered and immature.  I don’t enjoy her on the show for the most part.  She’s just not my cup of tea.  There are a few Housewives I can name across the franchises who seemed like good people, but very few lasted more than a season (Joyce from RHBH comes to mind).  Maybe Stephanie Holman on Dallas is a good example.  She has had to go through some more difficult things, but she has a better attitude than Tinsley IMO.

On this franchise, Jules was an example of someone who was kind and sweet and wounded like Tinsley, and she was facing personal crises while on the show, and she stood up to the bullies (and Jules was approximately ten years younger when she filmed this show than Tinsley is now). Have we ever heard Tinsley once, in a sober situation, say, “back off, Bethenny, you’re being a bully”?  She has gotten into screaming fights with Sonja and Dorinda when she was drunk, but that’s a completely different animal.  Heather Thomson was also someone who came on and showed character.  Character goes a lot longer with me than keeping sweet (for the most part). 

I just don’t see the great person that Tinsley is presented as.  I think she has had many things go her way, so she seems sweet.  She would have to be fully delusional not to be sweet under her current circumstances.  I would be so interested in what she would be like if the $30,000 a month hotel penthouse suite was taken away, and she had to put together a resume on Microsoft Word and live in a 300 square foot apartment in one of the outer boroughs and go on interviews in $80 heels that pinched like a regular person.  Not a poor person, but a regular person.  I think she would completely fall apart, and I don’t respect that. 

I know I have posted this before, but we have never seen Tinsley go through anything difficult on this show.  The breakup of her marriage and her relationship with Fanjul and her arrest happened off the show.  The other women didn’t have that luxury.  

We saw Tinsley go through a breakup/makeup which she didn’t take well, and the death of her dog, which she also didn’t take well.  When she broke down at the circus, I was so turned off.  This fucking woman has everything, but she is still miserable?  It’s like a more palatable version of Bethenny in that way.  Get thee to some serious therapy.

I think a lot of times Tinsley’s relative quiet is mistaken for kindness, but maybe that’s just her thinking that she’s Tinsley Mortimer, so her place on the show is secure, she doesn’t need to get into the pettiness and the fights, and she’s probably thinking about what color she’s going get her nails painted when filming is finished.  In other words, her seeming kindness can just be lack of engagement. 

Also, she gets so mean when she’s drunk.  Even when she’s right (like when she schooled Luann on the difference between “West Palm Beach” and “Palm Beach,”) it was really rude, because it was done in front of a table full of women who were gunning for Luann at the time, and she did the same thing last season—she piled on Luann at Barton G when everyone else was attacking Luann.  Piling on even when someone is wrong is the opposite of class.  Trying to change the subject and addressing it at a later time is the right thing to do, but that’s not what Tinsley did. 

Has Tinsley ever done something really nice or treated someone well when they were going through a tough time?  I am honestly asking.  She gave Sonja that huge gift bag and paid for her hotel suite...but was that because everyone and their mother (literally) was chiding her to be more generous toward Sonja and/or because she didn’t want to share living space with Sonja, or was it coming from a kind place?  There’s no way for me to tell. 

I do agree that Tinsley does share more about her personal life than, say, Ramona, who is always sneaking off with dates.  Ironically enough, I realized I have absolutely no idea what’s going on with Sonja’s dating life (feel like I never have), when she is the one who pressures Tinsley to give up more info.  

I don’t think Tinsley’s the worst.  She might even be the best person on this cast.  But I feel like she skates a lot, she gets a favorable edit, I’m not sure how much she brings to the table, and I’ll never really warm to her because of that.  She has shown good manners and I think it’s been mistaken for good character.  I know very little about her character.  I find her uninspiring.

And now that she stained Ramona’s bedsheets, dabbed at it with a tissue and didn’t throw the tissue away (but did make sure to tell us the sheets were cheap) I’m even doubting her manners.  

Of course, when Tinsley is right, I’ll defend her.  Sometimes the women are incredibly cruel to her for no good reason.  I just don’t think she’s like a gift to the franchise or a living example of grace and humility.  I just kind of see a vapid chick who has a fair share of mental health issues, and quite possibly a substance abuse issue.  

[biakbiak]

15 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

As the proud mother of a transgender daughter, Sonja and Dorinda absolutely deserve to be dragged. Transgender people are discriminated against, right now, in our country and are at higher risk for being murdered. Particularly women and particularly people of color. So Dorinda and Sonja, feeding into that crap can go f themselves on a rusty post.

Particularly because both Sonja, especially Sonja, and Dorinda pay lip service to being LGBTQ allies but it’s mainly having a gaggle of gay men telling them they are fabulous. 

[Hiyo]

I'll join the people who like Tinsley at their table. She does balance out the other HWs nicely, I feel.

[LibertarianSlut]

31 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

There's been an explination here of the print Dorinda thought it was, why it was controversial at the time, the designer did it as a taking back of power other people thought it was awful.

As the proud mother of a transgender daughter, Sonja and Dorinda absolutely deserve to be dragged. Transgender people are discriminated against, right now, in our country and are at higher risk for being murdered. Particularly women and particularly people of color. So Dorinda and Sonja, feeding into that crap can go f themselves on a rusty post.

 

An explanation was proffered as to why Dorinda might have purchased that Mao skirt, and I wrote two posts methodically explaining why I respectfully rejected those explanations, as I found no evidence that this was Dorinda’s motive.

I’m not going to get into it again.  I will just watch the press and hope for a desired outcome and respectfully agree to disagree with people who feel otherwise. 

I just want to make it clear that I didn’t say it was alright for Sonja and Dorinda to make comments about transgender models in any way; my only point is that that’s getting more attention than promoting (IMO) the worst dictator of the 20th century, because I don’t like murderers.  Mao also criminalized homosexuality.  I think he was a really bad guy.

I don’t have anything else to say on the topic.  I respect everyone’s opinion.  

[Carolina Girl]

How far this series has come in terms of watch ability.  I watched the first season on Hulu recently and it was SO enjoyable.  The biggest drama was that Hamptons cooking party that Ramona didn’t invite Jill to.  That hysterical tennis match.  Bethenny and Jason.  Eight episodes of that season had more to offer than eighteen episodes of this one.  
 

Note to Luann.  You are no longer a countess. You lost the title when you married the bald grifter.   

[SunnyBeBe]

I feel like this is a different show from usual and not in a good way.  It’s awkward...almost like no one knows what to say and they’re making it up and acting too hard. Maybe it’s me...this is a weird time, but it just doesn’t feel like my show:(

[ShawnaLanne]

3 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

An explanation was proffered as to why Dorinda might have purchased that Mao skirt, and I wrote two posts methodically explaining why I respectfully rejected those explanations, as I found no evidence that this was Dorinda’s motive.

I’m not going to get into it again.  I will just watch the press and hope for a desired outcome and respectfully agree to disagree with people who feel otherwise. 

I just want to make it clear that I didn’t say it was alright for Sonja and Dorinda to make comments about transgender models in any way; my only point is that that’s getting more attention than promoting (IMO) the worst dictator of the 20th century, because I don’t like murderers.  Mao also criminalized homosexuality.  I think he was a really bad guy.

I don’t have anything else to say on the topic.  I respect everyone’s opinion. 

 

I felt, since this actually effects my life and the safety of transgender people right now at this moment, not 40 years ago, that that I wanted to address your throw away comment that dismissed it as being no big deal. Because it is. An issue. Right now. 

I felt like I had nothing to add, one way or another to the Mao conversation. But I wanted to address it since that again was your main topic. With the transgender bashing being a throw away, I wanted to give that some atten. Seeing as it's an issue that affects people today.

Edited May 3, 2020 by ShawnaLanne

[Chit Chat]

10 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I feel like this is a different show from usual and not in a good way.  It’s awkward...almost like no one knows what to say and they’re making it up and acting too hard. Maybe it’s me...this is a weird time, but it just doesn’t feel like my show:(

With any show, sometimes they just run their course, and we all know when we've reached our limit!  I'm done with the Beverly Hills one for now, and am on the fence with the OC HWs.   I'm okay with the NYC one for now, but I can understand why you feel that way.  I am getting tired of the ladies being wasted, so I'm hoping they can all do something else besides get drunk and wreak havoc.   It's pathetic rather than entertaining.  

[Lemons]

Edited May 3, 2020 by Lemons
Can't figure out where to put text. Hideous Dorinda skirt.

[LibertarianSlut]

On 5/1/2020 at 7:41 PM, heatherchandler said:

I don't think that is "her" office.  It's probably a WeWork thing, the kind of place where you rent space.  Or that awful "Wing" place.  

I wonder if Leah went to rehab for something other than alcohol.  When she mentioned a dark place, it made me think heroin.  It would make sense for her age... heroin made a comeback around the time she went to rehab.  Probably thinks she can drink because it is not her "drug of choice."

 

I agree about the office, and the more I think about it, the more onto something I think you are with the heroin.  It just all makes sense.

I do think she had and has an alcohol problem too, and probably a problem with a stimulant, like meth, because everyone in her family was so worried about her going back to alcohol, and people tend to be on more than heroin when they assault the cops.

[njbchlover]

9 hours ago, sasha206 said:

I have to agree with Dale.  I don't like the curls on Tinsley.   And I remember Garo from PR and liked his stuff, but what he put Tins in was ugly, tacky AF.

Dorinda ought to just be honest with Tinsley.  I think you're a fucking idiot and I'll just film with you. 

I know people love Tinsley here; she is sweet but I also find her to be an overgrown teenager still dressing like Forever 21.  She'a a 44 year-old who longs for her 20s "it girl" status.  Trust me, if Scott dumps her, she'll be Sonja Morgan in another 15 years without the overtly sexual stuff but still chasing men.  She'll be clinging to her past,, wearing those god awful hoop earrings, frilly clothes, wearing her braids, with pounds of makeup and terrible falsies.   

I agree with you 1000% about Tinsley.  She seems harmless and very sweet, but does have a bad case of what I like to call "Delayed Maturity Syndrome".  She never really grew up on her own, either because she didn't want to, or wasn't allowed to, either by Topper and/or Dale.

She is already clinging to her past, so it is inevitable that if something happens between her and Scott, she will become another version of Sonja (again, as you said, without the overt sexuality), living sadly in the past.  

[njbchlover]

9 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

?  I don't mind Sonja clinging to her past either.  Dorinda attacks her for it LOL.  Not me!

In fact I'd hear even more about it.  It sounds fascinating.  If she wrote a book about it and included some 1990s photos, I'd definitely read it, whether it's partly her imagination or not.

I agree that Sonja's past does sound fascinating, maybe the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd time you've heard it.  I get the feeling that these women have all heard about Sonja's fabulous life as Mrs. Morgan about eleventy thousand times, so I imagine it gets tiring.

The other thing with Sonja, and this is what could concern someone close to her, is that it sometimes seems like Sonja hasn't realized that part of her life is over, and will probably never be again.  She sometimes speaks about her past like it is her present life.  That's the sad thing about it.

I know Sonja has been compared to Edie Beale here on this forum, and in other places, but I actually see more of a comparison to the fictional character, Blanche DuBois.  Holding onto her past, a social snob, and inwardly, very insecure and worried about losing her youth and beauty.  

Edited May 3, 2020 by njbchlover

[heatherchandler]

7 hours ago, biakbiak said:

Particularly because both Sonja, especially Sonja, and Dorinda pay lip service to being LGBTQ allies but it’s mainly having a gaggle of gay men telling them they are fabulous. 

She’s a “gay icon,” don’t you know?   Remember how she told Alex & Simon that they couldn’t speak at the gay marriage parade because SHE, as a gay icon needed to be the only speaker?  She just wanted all eyes on her.  I realized then and there that I hate her.

 

4 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I feel like this is a different show from usual and not in a good way.  It’s awkward...almost like no one knows what to say and they’re making it up and acting too hard. Maybe it’s me...this is a weird time, but it just doesn’t feel like my show:(

I agree, and I’m also feeling that way about RHBH.  Something is off.  Is it the format?  The women?  I can’t put my finger on it.

[retired watcher]

On 5/1/2020 at 2:24 AM, Feline Goddess said:

I don’t think the whole place was hers. It looked like one of those shared office spaces. 

Not every clothing manufacturer has a show at fashion week. 

[film noire]

On 5/1/2020 at 9:46 AM, LibertarianSlut said:

To that, I say, what if an artist, like a really cutting edge artist, put a picture of the Parkland shooter onto a gauzy print?  Would it be fine for someone to wear that, knowing who he is?  

It's not the same context, imo.  Tam's collaborator was  Zhang Hongtu, an artist who fled China for NYC.   Tam & Hongtu  deconstructed Mao's official portrait (plastered everywhere throughout Mao's regime) and robbed it of power via satire: Mao in pigtails, sunglasses,  a bee stung nose, etc. Tam turned those images into defiant/wearable art - the fashion of it also an indictment of Mao's regime,  who insisted all Chinese wear the same revolutionary garb -  no individuality allowed;  the opposite of fashion.  A nation where Tam's dress on your back could destroy your life and that of your family. Our society in no way mirrors any of that, so there's no comparison that works, imo. 

And (as much as I often dislike Dorinda) calling pieces/wearing pieces in that collection gangsta isn't out of order. It required all kinds of badass for Tam to bring that collection to the light of day. Her Mao pieces may now be in museums, but at the time she faced not just praise, but hostility, criticism, and stones literally thrown at displays of her work.

Edited May 3, 2020 by film noire

[Hangin Out]

On 5/1/2020 at 7:20 PM, Lemons said:

Of course it wasn't part of Fashion Week.  There was no designer!    She takes pictures from the Ali express website based in China.  She puts their pictures of clothing on her website and marks the prices way up.  When she gets a sucker to buy something, she buys it from Ali Express and has it sent to the sucker who paid her.  

This is from Sonya's website:   

That's because they are coming from Ali Express in China!  

She is shameless to try and claim she was "showing" at Fashion Week.  She's gross. 

I once ordered a blouse from one of those pop ups.  It took two months to get here.  Slow boat from China.  The material was crap .. never again.  I must of been tired.

[Hangin Out]

On 5/1/2020 at 7:04 AM, Vanderboom said:

It was interesting hearing Leah describe her relationship with her ex (a partnership that is not at all unusual as much as she might think it is ) and then to actually see their interaction. From what I can see, he is the mature parent (no surprise) and appears to treat Leah as a second child that he needs to keep an eye on. I would imagine even more so after her stint at Ramona's. Her daughter must be so proud to see her mother buck naked and acting like a drunken fool. 

I hope that’s the last we see of this crap... running around naked and screaming.  It’s not funny.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hangin Out]

11 hours ago, ChitChat said:

 

11 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I feel like this is a different show from usual and not in a good way.  It’s awkward...almost like no one knows what to say and they’re making it up and acting too hard. Maybe it’s me...this is a weird time, but it just doesn’t feel like my show:(

 

I’m going to say it.  I miss Bethenny.  She brought laughter, you have to admit.  Her different apartments, her cooking in her pajamas, her marital troubles, everything.  She was colorful, love her or hate her.  A natural comedian.  The new girl may be nice, but she’s not funny.  We need funny.  Bethenny balanced the show.  

 

 

[Baltimore Betty]

12 hours ago, retired watcher said:

Not every clothing manufacturer has a show at fashion week. 

I think Sonja thinks having a fashion show during Fashion Week will put her on the map as some sort of fashion mogul, all she did was throw her money down the drain, she should stick to social media platforms...this fashion show looked like random things she found at Macy's. 

Edited May 3, 2020 by Baltimore Betty

[Sheenieb]

Quote

She is already clinging to her past, so it is inevitable that if something happens between her and Scott, she will become another version of Sonja (again, as you said, without the overt sexuality), living sadly in the past.  

 

On 5/2/2020 at 10:51 PM, njbchlover said:

The other thing with Sonja, and this is what could concern someone close to her, is that it sometimes seems like Sonja hasn't realized that part of her life is over, and will probably never be again.  She sometimes speaks about her past like it is her present life.  That's the sad thing about it.

"Right how [sic] you have the look of a woman who is seeing ghosts. Not everybody believes in ghosts, but I do. Do you know what they are, Trisha? Men and women who can't get over the past," Aunt Evvie said. That's what ghosts are. Not them." She flapped her arm toward the coffin which stood on its bands beside the coincidentally fresh grave. "The dead are dead. We bury them, and buried they stay." --- Aunt Evvie, Stephen King's Needful Things

Those lines hit hard for Tinsley and Sonja. It's also what I read whenever I find myself trapped in a nostalgia or "what could've been" loop. To bring it back to the show, instead of focusing on getting back to her early aughts IT girl status, Tinsley should focus on where she is now. I'm sure it was fun being the toast of the town, but it went away, and she's in a better place than where she was when she fell off. Sonja, however, is a harder sell. She fucked up her divorce settlement money, didn't take care of the townhouse, and instead of seriously parlaying her bravolebrity profile into something lucrative, she cuts corners and does these silly vanity projects. She was better off trying to get the toaster oven off the ground.

All of the women are living in the past in different ways. Sonja being the worst. Dorinda still hasn't let go of Richard fully, it's probably one of the reasons why she hasn't committed to John and only wants him when she wants him. Ramona is still searching for what she had with Mario, Luann still holds on to her countess title for "performance" purposes, but she's still acting like the lady of the manor, and Leah kinda falls back on her wild teen antics.

Stop being ghosts, ladies.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Sheenieb

[sasha206]

17 hours ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Sonja is a menace, and she does hurt people. The way she went after Tinsley the first season she was on was awful, she's the one who started the rumour that Tinsley is a kept woman. She also has to absolutely humiliate her daughter with her antics. 

 

Yes, after I posted this, I was corrected and agree!  She has indeed hurt people.  Tinsley is a very nice person.  

[sasha206]

23 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

I’m going to say it.  I miss Bethenny.  She brought laughter, you have to admit.  Her different apartments, her cooking in her pajamas, her marital troubles, everything.  She was colorful, love her or hate her.  A natural comedian.  The new girl may be nice, but she’s not funny.  We need funny.  Bethenny balanced the show.  

 

 

I miss seasons 1-4 Beth.   Not her return to RHONY.  

Edited May 4, 2020 by sasha206

[SunnyBeBe]

2 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

I’m going to say it.  I miss Bethenny.  She brought laughter, you have to admit.  Her different apartments, her cooking in her pajamas, her marital troubles, everything.  She was colorful, love her or hate her.  A natural comedian.  The new girl may be nice, but she’s not funny.  We need funny.  Bethenny balanced the show.  

 

 

I was a fan long ago, before she got her own realty show, then no way. I believe I have a balanced viewpoint of her as a person/cast member/character, etc. and I am no longer a fan for numerous reasons.... too many to list here, however, she does have some talent in the comedy dept  and can be charming at times. For those reasons I was ok with her returning to the show last time. Now....I’m not invested enough in the show to care either way.  It’s unfortunate.  

 

[Kdawg82]

I disagree with LuAnn that Leah's mother cutting her out of her life "doesn't help." Doesn't "Intervention" always stress the point to family & friends that as difficult as it may be, they need to cut the addict out of their lives. Ultimatum has to be a part of it to break the cycle of enabling. When Leah's "baby daddy" showed up to have a chat with her about drinking, he mentioned she will need to give in to her mother's wishes because her mother is "the only help" they get with their daughter. Maybe not substance abuse but I've seen a lot of sh** behavior enabled by people who dump off their children on the grandparents so they could do whatever they want. I see this as Leah's mom not wanting to take on responsibility of her daughter while Leah goes around acting the way she did at Ramona's and call it "work " because she is "filming." Once her mom saw the episode (*if* she did) I think the pressure was back on Leah to stop drinking. 

Sonja & her "fashion line" & show are just sad & pathetic.  She hasn't yet found her niche in life which is sad at her age & the resources via the show have provided.

Dorinda's a looser cannon than ever. 

I get the lunch with Tinsley and how her "wavy vs straight hair" complication with her mother is laughable to some but that was mean girl behavior. But Leah has loving parents & good people in her life & has some sort of privilege in life/growing up. I'm not going to shed a tear for her. This wannabe gangster act of hers is insulting to people who have lived that life bc of poverty & negative circumstances. Real gangsters don't have the family to send them to rehabs and halfway houses or help with their kids. When you get multiple chances, buckle up & put in the work & regret your bad choices. Gangster isn't aspirational,  it's unfortunate. 

 

Edited May 3, 2020 by Kdawg82

[Hangin Out]

12 minutes ago, Kdawg82 said:

But Leah has loving parents & good people in her life & has some sort of privilege in life/growing up. I'm not going to shed a tear for her. This wannabe gangster act of hers is insulting to people who have lived that life bc of poverty & negative circumstances. Real gangsters don't have the family to send them to rehabs and halfway houses or help with their kids. When you get multiple chances, buckle up & put in the work & regret your bad choices. Gangster isn't aspirational,  it's unfortunate. 

 

I agree with you.  Did anyone here, including Leah and the child’s Father realize how hard it is for these grandparents to grow up that child, or even keep an eye on her?  It’s fine that Leah has a job, but filming all over N.Y. and vacations is another matter.  Out of love, Grandparents get stuck raising children again when they deserve for once to live a life of leisure.  These grandparents have to pay because their daughter chose to fuck up?

[Hangin Out]

48 minutes ago, sasha206 said:

I miss seasons 1-3 Beth.   Not her return to RHONY.  

I’ll buy that.  She had a lot of things going on.  Court, her business, her charities, all her apartments, all her helpers, boyfriends, etc.  I miss seeing all of that.  She got a little nuts in the last couple of seasons,but don’t they all?  You have to admit, there’s nothing nice about Dorinda lately.  Excep going to Bluestone Manor.  I really enjoyed that.  Maybe the Countessa will bring something interesting on the stage, I hope.  I like seeing her house upstate too.  The screaming has to stop.

[sasha206]

1 hour ago, Kdawg82 said:

I disagree with LuAnn that Leah's mother cutting her out of her life "doesn't help." Doesn't "Intervention" always stress the point to family & friends that as difficult as it may be, they enabling. When Leah's "baby daddy" showed up to have a chat with her about drinking, he mentioned she will need to give in to her mother's wishes because her mother is "the only help" they get with their daughter. Maybe not substance abuse but I've seen a lot of sh** behavior enabled by people who dump off their children on the grandparents so they could do whatever they want. I see this as Leah's mom not wanting to take on responsibility of her daughter while Leah goes around acting the way she did at Ramona's and call it "work " because she is "filming." Once her mom saw the episode (*if* she did) I think the pressure was back on Leah to stop drinking. 

 

I totally agree. I admire Leah's mom for being able to do that.  So few parents stop enabling their children who are substance abusers.

Edited May 3, 2020 by sasha206

[sasha206]

Sorry yesterday for my bitchiness regarding Tinsley and being protected class.  Maybe I have a little Dorinda in me and I'm subconsciously jealous of that incredible body on her.

[ShawnaLanne]

3 hours ago, sasha206 said:

Yes, after I posted this, I was corrected and agree!  She has indeed hurt people.  Tinsley is a very nice person.  

To be devils advocate for a moment, someone else pointed out that she is polite most of the time and doesn't generally go after people, but also hasn't really been shown being actively kind. Like you'll see in the mess that is Dorinda, she at times makes an effort to do special things, or just be there, for people.

But she doesn't go after people and I really hate a pile on, so Tinsley ends up getting my defense by default, if that makes sense.

Edited May 3, 2020 by ShawnaLanne

[sasha206]

2 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

I’ll buy that.  She had a lot of things going on.  Court, her business, her charities, all her apartments, all her helpers, boyfriends, etc.  I miss seeing all of that.  She got a little nuts in the last couple of seasons,but don’t they all?  You have to admit, there’s nothing nice about Dorinda lately.  Excep going to Bluestone Manor.  I really enjoyed that.  Maybe the Countessa will bring something interesting on the stage, I hope.  I like seeing her house upstate too.  The screaming has to stop.

Watching season 3 with Beth.  Damn I loved her back then.  I wish she had never changed!

[SunnyBeBe]

29 minutes ago, sasha206 said:

Watching season 3 with Beth.  Damn I loved her back then.  I wish she had never changed!

Well, to me, she didn’t. She just revealed more of the real person that was inside. I do sense that she had real ties to her cast mates though. I do still see that with current cast, like when Ramona disappeared and Dorinda discovers it was for a date, not the excuse given...she forgives her and even describes it as the way Ramona is while laughing.  And like when Luanne is FaceTiming with Sonja and Sonja mocks Luanne and abruptly ends the call, but then laughs....I do feel that bond they really have. I think it’s from years of sharing and experiences shared. I haven’t quite felt it with Tinsley yet, though I still like her.  I’m having a difficult time imagining it with Leah. 

[sasha206]

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Well, to me, she didn’t. She just revealed more of the real person that was inside. I do sense that she had real ties to her cast mates though. I do still see that with current cast, like when Ramona disappeared and Dorinda discovers it was for a date, not the excuse given...she forgives her and even describes it as the way Ramona is while laughing.  And like when Luanne is FaceTiming with Sonja and Sonja mocks Luanne and abruptly ends the call, but then laughs....I do feel that bond they really have. I think it’s from years of sharing and experiences shared. I haven’t quite felt it with Tinsley yet, though I still like her.  I’m having a difficult time imagining it with Leah. 

They do say money only magnifies who you are.

I feel like once Beth became a success, she lost the humility that she had.  And she became much more neurotic than before.  I'm sure being an entrepreneur, even a very successful one, is a tough life in many ways. 

I wonder if Beth was the type of person who thought:  If I have money I'll finally be happy.  What do you do when you finally achieve and have a level of wealth you've always wanted and still aren't happy?  

That said, I love that Beth has become a philanthropist. I don't care if there's an ulterior motive behind it (not saying there is) but she's really digging in and helping instead of counting her dollars.  Maybe this is where true happiness for her is.

Edited May 3, 2020 by sasha206

[Hangin Out]

On 5/2/2020 at 4:39 AM, ErikaOnline said:

I was surprised at how Leah’s ex was lol. He seems rough,does he have previous drug use? Seems like he’s a good dad though. 

BTW, who exactly has the kid?  Leah, the Ex boyfriend or the grandparents, or do they pass her around?  I’m wondering what kind of guy interests her.  Someone who thinks like her?  Someone said Bethenny recommended her for the show.

[Hangin Out]

1 hour ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Like you'll see in the mess that is Dorinda, she at times makes an effort to do special things, or just be there, for people.

Yes she does, but then when the time comes, she’ll throw it up in your face.  Who needs that?  She’s not the type to take favors from.

[Hangin Out]

23 minutes ago, sasha206 said:

They do say money only magnifies who you are.

I feel like once Beth became a success, she lost the humility that she had.  And she became much more neurotic than before.  I'm sure being an entrepreneur, even a very successful one, is a tough life in many ways. 

I also thought that maybe Beth was the type of person who thought:  If I have money I'll finally be happy.  What do you do when you finally achieve and have a level of wealth you've always wanted and still aren't happy?  

That said, I love that Beth has become a philanthropist. I don't care if there's an ulterior motive behind it (not saying there is) but she's really digging in and helping instead of counting her dollars.  Maybe this is where true happiness for her is.

I was just thinking of Jill Zarin and posted about her the other day.  I still can’t get over the time Beth was down and low and went to Ramona’s apartment to make peace with Jill.  She was at a very low point in her life.  Jill refused to talk with her, and the Countless dragged Jill away and said the car was waiting and they had to go.  That was the end for Bethenny, as she stood in the street crying.  I’m just happy Bethenny never forgot that.  Jill knew she was wrong and tried to make amends, but it never happened.  We all know Andy and Beth are tight, and maybe that’s the reason he didn’t take Jill back.  Just my thoughts anyhow.  I believe in forgive and forget, but in that instance, I wouldn’t forget either.  There are times when you just can’t.  Bethenny was a nobody then .. didn’t know where her rent was coming from.  She came out of it by herself and became successful, finally.  Actually, I think the only thing that makes her happy is Bryn and her charity work.  Yes, she does announce what she donates, but so does Oprah and many others.

 

[ShawnaLanne]

6 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

I was just thinking of Jill Zarin and posted about her the other day.  I still can’t get over the time Beth was down and low and went to Ramona’s apartment to make peace with Jill.  She was at a very low point in her life.  Jill refused to talk with her, and the Countless dragged Jill away and said the car was waiting and they had to go.  That was the end for Bethenny, as she stood in the street crying.  I’m just happy Bethenny never forgot that.  Jill knew she was wrong and tried to make amends, but it never happened.  We all know Andy and Beth are tight, and maybe that’s the reason he didn’t take Jill back.  Just my thoughts anyhow.  I believe in forgive and forget, but in that instance, I wouldn’t forget either.  There are times when you just can’t.  Bethenny was a nobody then .. didn’t know where her rent was coming from.  She came out of it by herself and became successful, finally.  Actually, I think the only thing that makes her happy is Bryn and her charity work.  Yes, she does announce what she donates, but so does Oprah and many others.

 

Andy has no real loyalty. I've always thought Bravo never took her back because she secretly taped conversations in an effort to make Bravo look bad.

[Hangin Out]

56 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Andy has no real loyalty. I've always thought Bravo never took her back because she secretly taped conversations in an effort to make Bravo look bad.

Oh, you are right.  I forgot about that.  She was in the audience taping what was goin on.  Yes.

[Hangin Out]

5 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

Oh, you are right.  I forgot about that.  She was in the audience taping what was goin on.  Yes.

Probably old news, but I just read Anderson Cooper is the Father of a bouncing baby boy.  Guess he saw how happy Andy was with Benjamin.

[Hangin Out]

4 hours ago, sasha206 said:

Sorry yesterday for my bitchiness regarding Tinsley and being protected class.  Maybe I have a little Dorinda in me and I'm subconsciously jealous of that incredible body on her.

We all are bitchy with this virus goin on.  It’s too much already.   My state is the worst.  Still wearing masks and gloves.  Today was the first day we could sit on the patio and get some fresh air.  The only good thing that came out of this is I finally cleaned out my walk in closet. Lol.  Now, the Vets won’t even come to pick the bags up until who knows when.

[Kdawg82]

On 5/2/2020 at 3:40 PM, sasha206 said:

Sonja is trying to do a "I'm a business woman like Bethenny" act and failing spectacularly!

 

Yeah, totally! But Bethenny was covert about her act. She never truly conducted business on camera but was the expert in "dipping out" early. It was always as though she had someplace better to be (at least in her last couple seasons active). Sonja is just acting the way she thinks business women are supposed to act.

[sasha206]

1 hour ago, Silver Bells said:

We all are bitchy with this virus goin on.  It’s too much already.   My state is the worst.  Still wearing masks and gloves.  Today was the first day we could sit on the patio and get some fresh air.  The only good thing that came out of this is I finally cleaned out my walk in closet. Lol.  Now, the Vets won’t even come to pick the bags up until who knows when.

Amen to that!  This is just so crazy!  Glad you were able to get out on the patio!

[KungFuBunny]

On 4/30/2020 at 10:27 PM, LibertarianSlut said:

I had to give this its own post, because it was uniquely disgusting on a show and network full of disgusting displays:

Dorinda said she had a skirt with “General” Mao on it and it was “gangstery” and “fashionable”?  What’s “fashionable” about a man who killed and tortured and starved millions of people?  Mao was a 20th century totalitarian dictator, right up there with Hitler and Stalin, except I would argue that he was worse.  What is “gangster” or “fashionable” about a man who sent people to prison camps and starved them by the millions?  How can she say that?  He is, according to The Washington Post, “the biggest mass murderer in the history of the world.”  He killed 45 million people between 1958 to 1962.  

This is by far the most disgusting display I have ever heard from a Housewife, bar none.  Leah saying “weird white people” has absolutely nothing on this.  

I get that Dorinda, who is supposedly a good, self-described “pure” woman is probably ignorant and not malicious in her comments, but she either has to cop to having not passed high school history (ninth grade) or just say she supports evil.  I have no way that it would be anything other than one of the two.  

How dare she compare Lil Kim to Mao?  She owes Lil Kim a huge apology, and I think she owes everyone in society a giant apology for supporting a genocidal maniac dictator.  I am so angry that Dorinda, a sophisticated woman about London and New York City, would sanction Mao and it would be taken blithely.  Where is Andy Cohen going to come out on this?  

I am not only going to be paying attention to how the network handles this, but how the people who ought to know better who say they support Dorinda react to this.  Whoever hears about it and doesn’t condemn it ought to be judged IMO.

I have no idea what else to say, except that Dorinda made Leah and Sonja look positively demure and genteel.  

If this keeps going on, I don’t know if I can watch this show anymore.  Maybe Real Housewives of Beverly Hills is all bullshit and gossip and fashion, but as far as I know, none of them have made a comment this morally outrageous.  I will never look at Dorinda Medley the same again, she can save all the animals in a burning pet store like PeeWee Herman, and she won’t be redeemed until she realizes the gravity of what she said and apologizes profusely.  

John, don’t walk, run.  I wonder if how now how “gangstery” and “fashionable” this c-word found the Armenian Genocide.  Alright, I got nothing nice to say.  I’m gonna peace. 

This is me right now:

Dorinda when she saw Leah's dress and Leah said it was Lil Kim - I'm 99% sure Dorinda was clueless as to who Lil Kim is.

Dorinda said she once had a Mao dress and it was "gangsta". What I believe she is referring to is the dresses/Tshirts Vivienne Tam made that was a trend at one time. It was pictures of Mao blocked just like what Leah had with Lil Kim - but with Vivienne Tam's spin she made him into a caricature adding pigtails, had him cross eyed with a bug on his nose, etc.

I don't think Dorinda was saying she bought a Mao dress because she thinks he's awesome