S02.E19: 'Til Death Do Us Part

[alexvillage]

20 hours ago, debraran said:

They don't research or care because it's not a drama, but a "soap" as Nash puts it. I feel he thinks that lessens the reality but it's still stupid to ignore rules.

That is the most ridiculous explanation (Nash's, not yours). If they don't want to research and stick to a minimum of reality, why stick to reality at all? Just ignore time and space, ignore socially held norms, ignore racism, ignore homophobia, ignore the science behind cancer...

Agreeing with everyone that it was cliche after cliche in the finale. Theo is ever so annoying. Which 10-year old sees someone and yells their name? "Uncle Rome! Auntie Regina!" Maggie is so full of herself. "Aren't you coming with me?" To London. Right now. 

Eddie found his clothes that were put in a backpack while wet some 20 years ago, and there is no mold, they are dry and not smelly, they are basically new and washed? That was laughable.

My take for next season:

Time jump, Maggie comes back, Rome and Gina are separated, Delilah will be happy and helping everyone because OBViOUSLY that's what she does, we all know that, Gary will be waling Colin and with Darcy but will fall back into his annoying self once he sees Maggie, Eddie will be depressed or in a coma because that accident was SO SERIOUS!, Katherine will be cuddling with Theo. And I am not even trying to be sarcastic here. I think this is all the the realm of possibilities for the writers of this show.

 

 

[geauxaway]

Ashley, PJ, Barbara, gas station guy should have been found in the crawl space, too.  All huddled up living in there.  
 

Not much else to say.  I’m still mad over the dumb adoption story.  What a joke.  Rome and Regina are naive AF and should have been going to parenting classes and transition therapy (Eve should have, too).  They could have had a written parenting plan IN PLACE, not some notarized piece of paper that was executed under false circumstances.  Fricking serves them right for what happened to them.  Whoever called it with Regina crying into her baby shower gifts, here we are.

 

 

[Clanstarling]

13 hours ago, iwasish said:

Colleen‘s parents didn’t bother to wake Eddie or Colleen to ask where the sister might be?  That makes no sense at all. They just wake up while her body is being hauled in? 
The cops never questioned him? I can see him not remembering the actual drowning, but he doesn’t have a memory of the aftermath of her body being found? If her parents are that angry at him, why? Do her parents stIll own/live there? The dad just randomly showed up when Eddie came  around?  So many questions... never to be answered.

The parents waking up when the body is found makes sense to me. The grownups go to bed and let the kids hang out, and usually wake up well before the kids do. After a certain age, you don't helicopter as much (and certainly not during the era when they were kids) That's the way it worked in my house, anyway.

Yeah, I have trouble with him not remembering the aftermath. The actual event, not so much.

I think the parents do still have the house, and the dad didn't just randomly show up. I think he lives there. I mean, I sure wouldn't after something like that. But I think that's what we were supposed to get from that scene.

On a better show I wouldn't say never to be answered. But you're probably right.

[mikem]

I really hope the questions are never answered, because I hope that's the last that we hear about the lake house.  The whole plotline dropped out of the sky.  Other references to the characters' past (like Maggie's brother's story) seem to have some role in helping us understand why they are the way they are today, and have some rationale embedded in their current behavior.  But that's not true here.  And it's too filled with weird looks and unearned emotion.  It feels really forced, especially given the other plotlines.  It seems grafted in from some other show.

If the creators are thinking about delving into the lake house mystery next season, please don't.  Nobody cares what happened at the lake house.

[smartymarty]

Last year I found a neighbor's purse under trees in my yard; it had been stolen five years before. It was disintegrating, and despite being zipped closed, had dirt and debris inside. No way has Eddie's backpack sat under that house for 20 years and be in the condition we saw.

Was Delilah's boyfriend working? If not, why was he dressed in his EMT clothes? And he doesn't own that ambulance, right? He can't use it to drive around town, drop off his date.

Normally, when people have only had 2 dates, and one of them has some big event with other friends, the date bows out, saying "I'll let you deal with this with your friends." I'd probably shoe away any only-two-dates-person as being in the way. But not in MLT's land.

Loved Gary's reaction to Maggie at the soda machine. His racing to see her at the airport, though, had to have been originally written prior to September 2001, because his chances of catching her between a cab and security were next to nil. (Prior to 9/11, he at least could run through the airport to find her waiting at a gate, if there was only flight to London that night, and she wasn't instead at an airport bar drowning her sorrows, or in the Admiral's Club that Gary doesn't have a membership to.)

So did Rome and Regina only have the father sign away parental rights, not Eve? And no other contracts? Because all the legal documents should have been signed prior to the birth, since, as many have pointed out, R&R paid for all of Eve's doctor's appointments, etc., in exchange for getting the baby (plus likely some money to Eve). When Regina ran out, I thought she was going to find Katherine to enforce the contract. If Eve has now breached that contract, good luck collecting damages from her on her waitress salary. (would think that in this type of adoption situation, the birth mother would not get to see the baby; it would be handed over to the adoptive parents. That is what happened when my cousin gave up a baby for adoption.)

Wouldn't Eddie have tapped Theo as his best man well prior to the morning of the ceremony? I didn't understand why Gary and Rome would have thought that either of them would be chosen over Theo.

Couples waiting for their baby to be born do not care about missing your vow renewal ceremony.

Why couldn't Eddie's sister tell Katherine where Eddie was? "Katherine, Eddie's suddenly become obsessed with this thing from 20 years ago. I told him to let it go, but he drove to the lake house today." Katherine: "Hmm. Maybe I need to re-think renewing my vows to this dumbass." Okay, I guess that was why....

Just as Eddie was leaving the bar, my husband said "And now he'll get hit by a car." So we actually thought it hilarious when he was right. The Rules of Soap Operas mandate amnesia, but I think others are right that there will be a painkiller crisis.

[iwasish]

Why tell Theo about his Aunt puking on the wedding cake?  

[Lady Calypso]

18 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

So did Rome and Regina only have the father sign away parental rights, not Eve? And no other contracts? Because all the legal documents should have been signed prior to the birth, since, as many have pointed out, R&R paid for all of Eve's doctor's appointments, etc., in exchange for getting the baby (plus likely some money to Eve). When Regina ran out, I thought she was going to find Katherine to enforce the contract. If Eve has now breached that contract, good luck collecting damages from her on her waitress salary. (would think that in this type of adoption situation, the birth mother would not get to see the baby; it would be handed over to the adoptive parents. That is what happened when my cousin gave up a baby for adoption.)

I think that Rome/Regina didn't even bother to get Eve to sign a proper contract stating that when she gives birth, the child becomes Rome and Regina's; it doesn't seem like they secured their rights prior to the birth because they figured that they could trust Eve to give the baby up. Yes, I know that they did go through an adoption agency in the first place so you'd think that it wouldn't be as easy as Eve changing her mind and boom, the child isn't Rome/Regina's anymore....but this is AMLT. They probably figure that they can get away with it by saying something like Eve needing to sign away her rights after the baby is born. 

21 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

Was Delilah's boyfriend working? If not, why was he dressed in his EMT clothes? And he doesn't own that ambulance, right? He can't use it to drive around town, drop off his date.

He absolutely was on shift. His boss had even called him to check in. But what's ridiculous is thnking that Miles would be the only one in the ambulance on shift. This is veering into 9-1-1 territory; on that show, there's an officer who works solo and doesn't really have a partner. But I find it more ridiculous here since Miles was able to drive around in the ambulance WHILE ON A DATE ON SHIFT. And then got to hang out at the hospital while never receiving a call in those many, many hours. Literally, he was there all day. It's as ridiculous as Gary bringing Maggie to a funeral for their first date, which means that Miles and Delilah are totally meant to be, right? 

24 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

Why couldn't Eddie's sister tell Katherine where Eddie was? "Katherine, Eddie's suddenly become obsessed with this thing from 20 years ago. I told him to let it go, but he drove to the lake house today." Katherine: "Hmm. Maybe I need to re-think renewing my vows to this dumbass." Okay, I guess that was why....

To give Lindsay no credit, she's the one who brought it all back up. She's the one who had to mention that time at the lake house and talk about Alex. So, technically, it's her fault that Eddie became obsessed with the truth. 

Also, fun fact. Until this episode, I mistakenly thought her name was Rebecca. Why? I have no idea.

[Sandman]

16 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

Sure, she screwed up, she cheated, she's made mistakes, but she's not evil, she's not malicious, she loves her family and friends. No matter what she does, people just keep saying "she's the worst." Nah, not even close. It's to the point where she could rescue orphans from a burning building and people would still find some fault.

I can speak only for myself, but I think it's because she lacks self-awareness (not a unique fault on this show, by any means). She believed that it would be better for her kids not to be honest with them, when everything on this show demonstrates that keeping secrets ends in disaster. She never really acknowledged that keeping Charlie's parentage a secret was just more comfortable for her, and she got angry at her friends (including Katherine, which ought to have been a non-starter) for not going along with her wishes. And it does seem that the show has punished Eddie more than Delilah for the affair. Delilah's dream about Jon where he told her he abandoned the marriage before she did was pure wish fulfillment -- but the show seemed to treat it like a moment of grace.

I agree that Stephanie Szostak is a beautiful woman, and her accent is charming (has the show retconned that she spent most of her life in France? I could've sworn that in the first season she was said to have spent a few years there) -- but sometimes the high, slightly squeaky pitch of her voice gets on my nerves.

Miles's comment that Delilah spent the whole day caring for her friends was patently inaccurate, and seemed like gratuitous flattery -- as a poster upthread mentioned, Miles himself was more active in seeing to the gang's welfare than she.

Edited March 28, 2020 by Sandman

[hoodooznoodooz]

5 hours ago, alexvillage said:

Theo is ever so annoying. Which 10-year old sees someone and yells their name? "Uncle Rome! Auntie Regina!" 

This moment definitely landed in my top five most annoying Theo scenes. 

The thing that irks me is that I think the writers and director want us to think Theo is adorable. 

[debraran]

I thought birth moms always had a right to change her mind within a certain time period. From one adoption site:

In most states, birth mothers can sign TPR anywhere from 48–72 hours after birth. In many states, TPR is irrevocable, meaning once the paperwork is signed, it is impossible for the birth parents to change their mind. However, other states have revocation periods that last anywhere from one week to 30 days.

This is fictional but I would think she would have the right too and Rome and Regina should have gotten proper counseling with her about this. Very odd how it was written. Would any sane person in their shoes have done this?

Rome knew she could change her mind because he half joked when she met his dad "don't let him know you can change your mind" She looked ill after that.

I'm beginning to think except for Katherine, Jon was the only sane one. I think they drove him crazy!

Edited March 28, 2020 by debraran

[KaveDweller]

2 hours ago, smartymarty said:

So did Rome and Regina only have the father sign away parental rights, not Eve? And no other contracts? Because all the legal documents should have been signed prior to the birth, since, as many have pointed out, R&R paid for all of Eve's doctor's appointments, etc., in exchange for getting the baby (plus likely some money to Eve). When Regina ran out, I thought she was going to find Katherine to enforce the contract. If Eve has now breached that contract, good luck collecting damages from her on her waitress salary.

I am certainly no expert, but my understanding was that you don't sign final adoption papers until the baby is actually born. You would sign papers with your intent, but not the final papers.  

Because what if the something happens to the baby? You obviously can't live up to your end of the contract of giving someone your baby in that case. Plus I would imagine lots of people don't think they can be a parent, but change their mind once they see it. That happens on lots of TV shows and movies, but I am sure it happens IRL too. 

[ams1001]

50 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

I am certainly no expert, but my understanding was that you don't sign final adoption papers until the baby is actually born. You would sign papers with your intent, but not the final papers.  

I don't think you can, though the rules probably vary by state. A former boss adopted in Pennsylvania, and the birth mother had (I think) 72 hours before she could officially sign away her rights. They were able to take the baby before that (he didn't need to be in the hospital that long) but they had to stay in a hotel because they couldn't take him out of state (even though they lived just over the border). The first birth mother they worked with did, in fact, change her mind before that window was up. The second worked out and their daughter is about 8 now.

I don't know if that applies to birth fathers or not, but I suspect what they did with Derek(?) would not be legally binding, either.

If they were working with an agency, where was the person who should have been working through all this stuff with them?

[Sandman]

1 minute ago, ams1001 said:

If they were working with an agency, where was the person who should have been working through all this stuff with them?

Probably run over by a car offscreen.

[Brian Cronin]

The thing that continues to gall me is that so much of this is so fixable. Nash seems like he goes out of his way to suck sometimes, like he actively searches for the hacky and cliche when he doesn't have to. 

There's a famous story about the excellent TV series, Friday Night Lights, about how the network pushed it to be less realistic and more soap-y, leading to the most absurd storyline in the show's history in Season 2, but then there was a Writer's Strike and the show basically just covered up the bad story and then was a normal show again for the rest of the run. 

This show COULD be like Friday Night Lights, a relatable, heartfelt show filled with good actors, only Nash goes for hack and artifice every damn time. 

Gary and Maggie don't have to get back together - but to have Rome break Maggie's confidence to tell Gary that Maggie was going to England but then NOT break her confidence to tell Gary that Maggie was still in love with him, which, in turn, allowed Gary to think that Maggie didn't want him until she saw him happy? That's hacky, unrealistic bullshit that doesn't match how actual humans exist. It doesn't have to be like that. You can have your "they don't get back together, but maybe do later" or whatever story while still being true to actual human emotions and behavior. But it's like Nash doesn't want to put the SLIGHT extra effort in and instead pushes the OTHER direction in a big way.

"What happened with Alex's death?" "I'm going to say a whole lot, Eddie, include travel to your home, but I won't say anything about what you asked, because I am a walking cliche and not a person who could ever exist in any reality."

[smartymarty]

Quote

Because what if the something happens to the baby? You obviously can't live up to your end of the contract of giving someone your baby in that case.

Good contracts cover all of the what-ifs.

But, the below website says that birth mothers in Massachusetts must wait four days before consenting to adoption, and that "In all states (except Massachusetts and Utah), a birth parent may revoke his or her consent to adoption in very limited circumstances." (The website does not explain what MA's rule is.)
https://family.findlaw.com/adoption/consent-to-adoption-what-biological-parents-need-to-know.html

So, knowing the law (ha!) Rome and Regina should not have been jumping the gun with the naming the baby and everything.

Edited March 28, 2020 by smartymarty

[LucyEth]

6 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

This moment definitely landed in my top five most annoying Theo scenes. 

How about when he was made Best Man and told Gary to suck it.  That was not not cute or funny it was rude and obnoxious even if it was directed at the king of rude and obnoxious.

Edited March 29, 2020 by LucyEth

[Brian Cronin]

48 minutes ago, LucyEth said:

How about when he was made Best Man and told Gary to suck it.  That was not not cure or funny it was rude and obnoxious even if it was directed at the king of rude and obnoxious.

I think it COULD have worked a lot better, but the kid's line deliveries are so obnoxious that it came off as way more aggressive than it was likely written. It was clearly written as a sort of playful banter, but it was delivered like the kid was a little dick, to the point where it was like, "What? Huh? Who let's their kid be such a jerk to their friends like that?" 

I mean, don't get me wrong, it's a bad line period (as Theo hasn't been established as having that sort of bantering relationship with Gary and Rome - has he even had one-on-one interactions with either one of them all series long?), but if the actor wasn't so terrible (to be fair, most kid actors are terrible), it wouldn't have come off as quite so aggravating. 

56 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

So, knowing the law (ha!) Rome and Regina should not have been jumping the gun with the naming the baby and everything.

Again, it was Nash saying, "Real life anxiety that real adoptive parents go through during every newborn adoption? Fuck that, let's just have some made up soap-y shit!"

[LucyEth]

I had friends that adopted a baby, not in Boston so I don't know if each state has it's own laws, but they were not allowed to be alone with the baby at all.  The hospital staff told them they have no involvement with anything happening to the baby after it leaves the hospital. Their concern is the birth mother and the baby as long as the birth mother and the baby were still there.  The birth mother was the mother and she was the only one they took directions from or cared about concerning the baby.  

[iwasish]

8 hours ago, smartymarty said:

Last year I found a neighbor's purse under trees in my yard; it had been stolen five years before. It was disintegrating, and despite being zipped closed, had dirt and debris inside. No way has Eddie's backpack sat under that house for 20 years and be in the condition we saw.

Was Delilah's boyfriend working? If not, why was he dressed in his EMT clothes? And he doesn't own that ambulance, right? He can't use it to drive around town, drop off his date.

Normally, when people have only had 2 dates, and one of them has some big event with other friends, the date bows out, saying "I'll let you deal with this with your friends." I'd probably shoe away any only-two-dates-person as being in the way. But not in MLT's land.

Loved Gary's reaction to Maggie at the soda machine. His racing to see her at the airport, though, had to have been originally written prior to September 2001, because his chances of catching her between a cab and security were next to nil. (Prior to 9/11, he at least could run through the airport to find her waiting at a gate, if there was only flight to London that night, and she wasn't instead at an airport bar drowning her sorrows, or in the Admiral's Club that Gary doesn't have a membership to.)

So did Rome and Regina only have the father sign away parental rights, not Eve? And no other contracts? Because all the legal documents should have been signed prior to the birth, since, as many have pointed out, R&R paid for all of Eve's doctor's appointments, etc., in exchange for getting the baby (plus likely some money to Eve). When Regina ran out, I thought she was going to find Katherine to enforce the contract. If Eve has now breached that contract, good luck collecting damages from her on her waitress salary. (would think that in this type of adoption situation, the birth mother would not get to see the baby; it would be handed over to the adoptive parents. That is what happened when my cousin gave up a baby for adoption.)

Wouldn't Eddie have tapped Theo as his best man well prior to the morning of the ceremony? I didn't understand why Gary and Rome would have thought that either of them would be chosen over Theo.

Couples waiting for their baby to be born do not care about missing your vow renewal ceremony.

Why couldn't Eddie's sister tell Katherine where Eddie was? "Katherine, Eddie's suddenly become obsessed with this thing from 20 years ago. I told him to let it go, but he drove to the lake house today." Katherine: "Hmm. Maybe I need to re-think renewing my vows to this dumbass." Okay, I guess that was why....

Just as Eddie was leaving the bar, my husband said "And now he'll get hit by a car." So we actually thought it hilarious when he was right. The Rules of Soap Operas mandate amnesia, but I think others are right that there will be a painkiller crisis.

Katherine learning that Eddie is suddenly obsessed with something that happened 20 years ago, involving his drinking to the point of not clearly remembering a young girl drowning and his part in it? I’d love it if Lindsay had told her exactly that!! Then Katherine and Eddie sit down with Theo and tell him all about it. Crazy Aunt Linda, who drunkenly pukes in his parents wedding cake and Daddy who got stinking drunk and had a friend drown and instead of going for help, staggers off to bed and “represses the memory” and later goes on to get his best friend’s wife pregnant. Boy!! that Theo has got some fun relatives. 

 

 

[Gothish520]

11 hours ago, Sandman said:

I can speak only for myself, but I think it's because she lacks self-awareness (not a unique fault on this show, by any means). She believed that it would be better for her kids not to be honest with them, when everything on this show demonstrates that keeping secrets ends in disaster. She never really acknowledged that keeping Charlie's parentage a secret was just more comfortable for her, and she got angry at her friends (including Katherine, which ought to have been a non-starter) for not going along with her wishes. And it does seem that the show has punished Eddie more than Delilah for the affair. Delilah's dream about Jon where he told her he abandoned the marriage before she did was pure wish fulfillment -- but the show seemed to treat it like a moment of grace.

I agree that Stephanie Szostak is a beautiful woman, and her accent is charming (has the show retconned that she spent most of her life in France? I could've sworn that in the first season she was said to have spent a few years there) -- but sometimes the high, slightly squeaky pitch of her voice gets on my nerves.

Miles's comment that Delilah spent the whole day caring for her friends was patently inaccurate, and seemed like gratuitous flattery -- as a poster upthread mentioned, Miles himself was more active in seeing to the gang's welfare than she.

I don't disagree with any of this. Delilah was definitely digging in her heels about Charlie's parentage. But she did come to realize that she was wrong. She was afraid her children would hate her, with good reason, but the band aid had to be ripped off. 

She's far from perfect, but I just don't see her as this horrible person. Goodness knows, the whole lot of 'em have their share of character flaws.

[bybrandy]

13 hours ago, smartymarty said:

So did Rome and Regina only have the father sign away parental rights, not Eve?

Yes Eve can't sign away her rights until the 4 days post birth in Mass.   In some states the father can sign before birth.  Not in Mass.  But in some states.   But there is no contract Regina or Rome could have had to protect them in this situation.   Eve had every right to decide to keep her baby and there have even been cases where the birth mom after a couple of days decides the changing the mind part was the bad decision although I don't anticipate that in this case.  
 

Predictions for next season: Eddie needs prescription drugs for the pain from the accident. Walks tightrope on having to have them and being prone to addiction.   

Reggie wants to try again.  Rome doesn't.  

Everybody fawns over D for no particular reason.

 

[alexvillage]

15 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

Nash seems like he goes out of his way to suck sometimes, like he actively searches for the hacky and cliche when he doesn't have to. 

That sums up the whole mess. Nothing else to say.

[Brian Cronin]

7 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I don't disagree with any of this. Delilah was definitely digging in her heels about Charlie's parentage. But she did come to realize that she was wrong. She was afraid her children would hate her, with good reason, but the band aid had to be ripped off. 

She's far from perfect, but I just don't see her as this horrible person. Goodness knows, the whole lot of 'em have their share of character flaws.

The big difference is that the others all get called out on it (some of them CONSTANTLY). She doesn't, and instead, we're constantly told how GOOD she is. Basically, it's the cardinal sin of storytelling - Nash doesn't SHOW us Delilah being a good person, he just has everyone TELL us how great she is, and when what we're seeing versus what we're being told don't match, it's annoying, and it reflects poorly on Delilah. 

If they just copped to her poor behavior, I think it'd be a lot easier to take her seriously as a character. But it never actually happens - even when characters got to disagree with her about telling the kids, it was super brief and it was quickly those same characters apologizing to her for making her feel bad (and then we had a fast-forward to skip over the worst of the repercussions for her, so when we return, it gets to be, "Man, isn't Sophie unreasonable for STILL being mad?")

That said, she definitely had been a lot better in the second half of this season. They've actually SHOWN her doing some occasionally legit good things, like her sex talk with Sophie and the office bit with Katherine. 

[Sandman]

On 3/29/2020 at 8:54 AM, Brian Cronin said:

They've actually SHOWN her doing some occasionally legit good things, like her sex talk with Sophie and the office bit with Katherine. 

I agree; there has been a little more showing than telling with Delilah's characterization lately. I think she's legitimately trying to be the mother that Sophie needs.

[Rahul]

Hoo boy! Who's been writing the past few episodes of this show? It can be really great or really terrible. This episode was unfortunately firmly in the latter camp with all the cliches, including that cliffhanger for the sake of having one. Why?

At least I got a very good belly laugh at that outfit for a two year old that Rome allegedly came home in, and the fact that a "newborn" was fed a pacifier within minutes of his birth. I didn't get the memo but apparently this show is now a comedy.

[debraran]

9 hours ago, Rahul said:

Hoo boy! Who's been writing the past few episodes of this show? It can be really great or really terrible. This episode was unfortunately firmly in the latter camp with all the cliches, including that cliffhanger for the sake of having one. Why?

At least I got a very good belly laugh at that outfit for a two year old that Rome allegedly came home in, and the fact that a "newborn" was fed a pacifier within minutes of his birth. I didn't get the memo but apparently this show is now a comedy.

And having David Giuntoli pretend in interviews that he's "nervous" and was shocked he was hit...he knows nothing about what to expect. Please. Stop. If viewers believe that and don't see the "please tune in" desperation, I'm shocked. Nash thought Eddied didn't pay his sins enough, I'm so confused, and Delilah gets a young toy? I wont watch it again but I thought the car didn't hit him that hard and his hip might be broken but he wasn't hit at 50 miles an hour by a mack truck.

Either way, I agree, it's been good or horrible and no one put any effort into the finale.

[tinderbox]

I hope Maggie stays away...for good.  I’ve never warmed up to this character.

Loving Gary and Darcy.  That said, I hope her PTSD issues don’t become the center of their relationship as cancer did with the Gary/Maggie.  I understand they will need their own “storyline” but must it be a health issue?

Theo has become an obnoxious boy.  I used to cut the character/actor some slack but now I can’t stand the kid!

Miles is puke worthy....in all kinds of ways.  Meh!

Not at all surprised the adoption fell through. 

I think Lindsey is much more DIRECTLY involved in the drowning and it will be played out next season.  Not that I care.  This is an unnecessary tale.  
 

[iwasish]

3 hours ago, tinderbox said:

I hope Maggie stays away...for good.  I’ve never warmed up to this character.

Loving Gary and Darcy.  That said, I hope her PTSD issues don’t become the center of their relationship as cancer did with the Gary/Maggie.  I understand they will need their own “storyline” but must it be a health issue?

Theo has become an obnoxious boy.  I used to cut the character/actor some slack but now I can’t stand the kid!

Miles is puke worthy....in all kinds of ways.  Meh!

Not at all surprised the adoption fell through. 

I think Lindsey is much more DIRECTLY involved in the drowning and it will be played out next season.  Not that I care.  This is an unnecessary tale.  
 

I think that Colleen, Alex’s sister, knows more about what happened than she’s let on.  Alex supposedly had a major crush on Eddie, my understanding is she was a bit young for him.  Eddie won a bracelet for her, maybe she thought “he likes me” and tried to get something going with him, he rejects her advances, she realizes its Colleen he wants and  in her drunken state flips out, ends up in the water and Eddie, also drunk and high, can’t save her. Colleen either witnesses it or is actually a part of the whole scenario. Either way I think Lindsay and Colleen both know “more” than they’ve let on. And that it’s not as bad as Nash Is teasing us with. 

[Amethyst]

On 3/27/2020 at 7:03 AM, debraran said:

Do you think they will bring Maggie back? I think her character is kind of lame and the whole Eric thing ruined her more, although I'm thankful they brushed him off quickly (so offense to the actor)  If they do, she'll have long blonde hair and looking great but I hope Gary forms a good relationship with Darcy and they have him grow in time being a buddy to her son if they last. I think that will bring out more of Gary than the angst with Maggie did. He can't grow with her. 

Gary and Maggie feels like endgame to me, but I'm happy to be wrong.  It just seems like they want to play the will they/won't they game with them, despite them ending things well.  Sure, there were some hurt feelings, but no animosity.  Not all breakups can boast that.  

IA with you, Gary can't grow with Maggie, and she can't grow with him.  I think they really needed each other when they were together, but they grew apart.  It happens.

[geauxaway]

Gary and Maggie can totally be end game but why is end game even on the table after season 2???  

[Amethyst]

Not saying it should be endgame at this point, just IME, most couples who are paired from the beginning tend to stay that way.

[LovesTheDrama]

I think Alex committed suicide.  Colleen knows more about Alex's death than she is willing to talk about and I think she found a note Alex wrote before they went out that night.

[HighHopes]

I just binged the show so I can't really remember which episode it was mentioned in. I checked through some episode threads to see if it was mentioned or talked about and I didn't see it, so forgive me if it has been. I might have misheard, but I swear Delilah said that she and Jon spent an "entire Saturday in bed together" shortly before he died and Charlie was also "early". Is it possible that after all of this, Charlie actually is Jon's and not Eddie's? 

[doodlebug]

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2020 at 2:29 PM, KaveDweller said:

I am certainly no expert, but my understanding was that you don't sign final adoption papers until the baby is actually born. You would sign papers with your intent, but not the final papers.  

Because what if the something happens to the baby? You obviously can't live up to your end of the contract of giving someone your baby in that case. Plus I would imagine lots of people don't think they can be a parent, but change their mind once they see it. That happens on lots of TV shows and movies, but I am sure it happens IRL too. 

This is true.  While there may be an agreement in place before the baby is born, it is not legally binding.  A biologic parent can only waive their right to a child after it is born and most states require a waiting period after the birth before even that can be done.  I practiced OB in the Midwest and, in my state, there is a 72 hour waiting period after delivery before the bio parents sign away their rights.  And, in 30 years of experience, the vast, vast majority of birth mothers, like 90%, do, in fact, change their minds and take the baby home.  Rome and Regina's contract with the birth mother and the agency would've covered that possibility, but there is no way she could be legally forced to surrender custody to them if she changed her mind.  Chances are, the contract put Rome and Regina on the hook for any money they had paid prior to the birth but they wouldn't be responsible for the hospital/birth costs.  There is a fairly generous government subsidy for prenatal care and delivery in the US and the birth mother would most likely have been covered by that anyway.

Even after the initial wait of 72 hours for the parents to sign away their rights, there is an additional period during which they can still change their minds before the custody change becomes irrevocable.  And, yes, if the identity of the father is known; he has to sign his rights away after the baby comes or he can come back and assert his parental rights later.  Even if he told the mom to get an abortion and ended the relationship and she doesn't know where he is; an effort has to be made to find him and get his signature.  Also, if one bio parent agrees to the adoption and the other doesn't; the one who doesn't agree becomes the custodial parent and has all rights.  The adoptive parents are out in the cold.  I saw this happen once when the mother, a teen, wanted a private adoption and the baby's teen father agreed.  Then, when the baby was born, he changed his mind and wanted sole custody, mainly because he was a jerk.  The adoptive parents had no recourse, they were out.  The birth mother then declined to sign and took the baby home.  She later finished college, married and her son is now in his 20's.  His bio father, who was so anxious to disrupt the adoption, never played much of a role in his life and he hasn't seen him in years.

The adoptive parents have very few rights in these situations, they just have to hope and pray that the biological parents don't change their minds, most of the time, they do.  Conversely, there have been situations where adoptive parents refused the adoption when the baby was born with birth defects or was premature or had other difficulties because they wanted a 'perfect' baby,  In that instance, the birth parents can either decide to keep the baby or surrender custody to the state and it will go into foster care until/unless it can be adopted.

As far as birth mothers not being 'allowed' to see or hold the baby, that is not true, either.  The 72 hour delay is designed to encompass the hospital stay and, as long as she is the legal mother, no one can prevent her from any interaction she chooses to have with the baby including 24 hour rooming in and breastfeeding.

Edited May 22, 2020 by doodlebug