S01.E08: You Found Me

[AnimeMania]

8 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Starlight mentions she had a crush on him, she turns around, and he drops his pants so she can get a look at him.  She freaks out.  He acts like it never happened and it was all a misunderstanding.

You missed the part where "The Deep" forces Starlight to give him a blowjob to stay on the team.

10 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Shaving the head, maybe.  But I truly am baffled by the leg and chest shaving.  I don't get what he was trying to say.

Most swimmers shave all the hair off of their bodies because it makes them swim faster.

[blackwing]

45 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

You missed the part where "The Deep" forces Starlight to give him a blowjob to stay on the team.

Most swimmers shave all the hair off of their bodies because it makes them swim faster.

Oh, did she actually go through with it?  I know he said that's what she needed to do, but I didn't get the impression that she actually did it.  I thought she walked out of the room, but maybe I am misremembering.

As for the swimmer shaving, I get that, but he's been in the water for years, so if that's his reasoning, I'm not sure why he wouldn't have always shaved.

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Oh, did she actually go through with it?  I know he said that's what she needed to do, but I didn't get the impression that she actually did it.  I thought she walked out of the room, but maybe I am misremembering.

It cuts to Starlight crying and vomiting in the toilet. She also says she was sexually assaulted/harassed during the Christian camp scene and, later when confronting Stillwell about being fired for not playing ball.

Plus, I think Maeve even said she had to do the same thing when she joined the team.

So yeah, she was forced to give The Deep a blowjob...that's also the whole point of The Deep's banishment and fake apology video. Oh and when Stillwell forces The Deep to make the apology video she points out that there were other women out there he sexually assaulted/harassed.

Edited August 12, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[AuntiePam]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

So in this final episode, are we supposed to sympathise with him?  He assaulted Starlight by exposing his genitals to her.  Now he gets physically assaulted by this woman, so he now knows what Starlight felt?  And his response is to feel so bad about himself that he shaves his entire body?
 

I thought he did more than just expose himself to Starlight.  She was gagging and spitting in the bathroom after the encounter.  The mere sight of a penis doesn't usually induce that reaction.

[blackwing]

36 minutes ago, AuntiePam said:

I thought he did more than just expose himself to Starlight.  She was gagging and spitting in the bathroom after the encounter.  The mere sight of a penis doesn't usually induce that reaction.

Ah, thanks everyone.  The whole thing with her reaction at the Christian festival now makes a whole lot more sense to me.  I don't know why I thought she was merely disgusted at the whole thing.  I had just assumed that she was young and naive and new to the "superhero as a  corporate business" thing.  She mentioned to the Deep that she had a crush on him.  He presents himself to her and makes a demand.  She is the naive Christian girl and was completely disgusted and felt violated.

I never thought she actually went through with it, I'll have to go rewatch that episode.  Definitely changes my perspective a lot on The Deep and Starlight and all of this.

[Sakura12]

3 hours ago, blackwing said:

I'm a bit confused about the entire story arc for The Deep as well.  Besides Elisabeth Shue, I would think that Chace Crawford is arguably the most recognisable "name" actor amongst the cast because of "Gossip Girl".  Curious as to the casting decision, and why he would want this role, assuming he could have lobbied for one of the other roles instead.

The character is a joke.  He's great in the water but out of the water all he can seemingly do is talk to sea creatures.  They could have at least have given him water blasts like Nicole Kidman could do in the Aquaman movie.  Because of this, I'm not sure if he suffers from low self-esteem.  Starlight mentions she had a crush on him, she turns around, and he drops his pants so she can get a look at him.  She freaks out.  He acts like it never happened and it was all a misunderstanding.

In the meantime, he tries and fails to save a dolphin.  Apparently the incident affected Starlight way more than he had thought.  She talks open in public with anguish about what was done to her.  Everyone at Vought knows it was him.  He apologises and gets banished to Sandusky.  He tries and fails to save a lobster.

He picks up some woman in a bar.  She sticks her hands into his gills, causing him pain.  If he was in so much pain, why not throw her off him?  He's supposed to have some degree of strength I thought.

So in this final episode, are we supposed to sympathise with him?  He assaulted Starlight by exposing his genitals to her.  Now he gets physically assaulted by this woman, so he now knows what Starlight felt?  And his response is to feel so bad about himself that he shaves his entire body?

I really don't understand the shaving... was it supposed to be some kind of self-mutilation?  I feel violated and I'm in anguish so I'm going to hurt myself?  Was it supposed to be a punishment?  Starlight had a crush on me and that made me do something bad so I'm going to shave my head and make myself less attractive?

Shaving the head, maybe.  But I truly am baffled by the leg and chest shaving.  I don't get what he was trying to say.

He did more than just expose himself to her. It was implied he made her give him a blow job or he would get her kicked off the team. That's why she was vomiting when Mauve found her in the bathroom and told her to just accept that's how it is. 

The Deep is the Aquaman stand in. Aquaman was the joke of the DC heroes because out of the water he was useless. The DCEU has changed that for the movies.  With his shaving I'm guessing they are going with people that have shaved their head or done other drastic changes after being assaulted. He needs to feel and look different then how he was.  

[Morrigan2575]

15 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

The Deep is the Aquaman stand in

Which brings up something I've been pondering.

Homelander = Superman

Queen Maeve = Wonder Woman

Black Noir = Batman

A-Train = The Flash

The Deep = Aquaman

Lamp Lighter = Green Lantern (saw that online)

Starlight = ??

Translucent = ??

Starlight's costume kind of reminds me of Supergirl but, with Powergirl's color scheme.

Do they have DC hero comparison's or are the original characters/designs?

[Sakura12]

14 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Which brings up something I've been pondering.

Homelander = Superman

Queen Maeve = Wonder Woman

Black Noir = Batman

A-Train = The Flash

The Deep = Aquaman

Lamp Lighter = Green Lantern (saw that online)

Starlight = ??

Translucent = ??

Starlight's costume kind of reminds me of Supergirl but, with Powergirl's color scheme.

Do they have DC hero comparison's or are the original characters/designs?

I was thinking Stargirl with Powergirls color scheme. I don't know about Translucent, I was just thinking he was The Invisible man. 

Translucent wasn't a member of the Seven in the comics.  It was some guy named Jack from Jupiter who I think was supposed to be a Shazam stand in. He had to say the word Carpo to be granted superhuman invulnerability and flight. Translucent would be more like Mesmer. 

Edited August 13, 2019 by Sakura12

[Morrigan2575]

18 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

I was thinking Stargirl with Powergirls color scheme. I don't know about Translucent, I was just thinking he was The Invisible man. 

I thought about Stargirl as well but, I couldn't make the costume work, other than the big star on the chest.

I thought of The Invisible Man as well and actually spent some time wondering if that character had any connection to DC.

[moonshine71]

On 8/12/2019 at 4:42 PM, blackwing said:

I'm a bit confused about the entire story arc for The Deep as well.  Besides Elisabeth Shue, I would think that Chace Crawford is arguably the most recognisable "name" actor amongst the cast because of "Gossip Girl".  Curious as to the casting decision, and why he would want this role, assuming he could have lobbied for one of the other roles instead.

The character is a joke.  He's great in the water but out of the water all he can seemingly do is talk to sea creatures.  They could have at least have given him water blasts like Nicole Kidman could do in the Aquaman movie.  Because of this, I'm not sure if he suffers from low self-esteem.  Starlight mentions she had a crush on him, she turns around, and he drops his pants so she can get a look at him.  She freaks out.  He acts like it never happened and it was all a misunderstanding.

1. Chase Crawford a more recognizable name than Karl Urban or Simon Pegg? Not even close.

2. The character is a play on Aqauman, whose been derided for years as a pretty useless character outside of the water by comic book fans. 

3. Your really missing something. The Deep didn't just expose himself to her, he coerced a blowjob from her by by threatening to blackball her from The Seven and destroy her reputation. And he didn't act like it never happened, he openly mocked her at her first team meeting with his comment of how her new situation is "hard to swallow". If you have any doubt about that, her conversation with Hughie in the park makes it very clear that is what happened and what she did. He didn't simply "drop his pants so she could get a look at him"(as bad as that is on its own), he casting couched her into performing sexual acts.

[moonshine71]

On 8/12/2019 at 8:48 PM, Morrigan2575 said:

I thought about Stargirl as well but, I couldn't make the costume work, other than the big star on the chest.

I thought of The Invisible Man as well and actually spent some time wondering if that character had any connection to DC.

I felt more analogous to Stargirl, regardless of the costume, just based on her power set and he role as a young newcomer/replacement to Lamplighter(who, a least w/ the little we know about him at this point, feels a bit like a Green Lantern/Starman amalgam).

Translucent doesn't doesn't have a real Justice League/DC counterpart, i felt like he was added to open the door to a line of invisibility gags that they wanted to do.

[moonshine71]

A few comments on deviations from the comics

Spoiler

I've seen a lot of reviews and comments mention the one big deviation is the status of Butcher's wife and Homelander's son, but I've seen almost no one mention another huge change, imo, the fact that The Boys(excepting The Female) are all powerless. That changes the dynamic in such a major way. They appear to regard all the heroes as invulnerable to some extent and are almost helpless against them, whereas comic Hughie killed a super w/ his bare hands in what i believe was his first fight. I'm curious whether people belief it will continue on this path, or if The Boys will start using Compound V. I was half expecting Butcher to do so at some point once they got a hold of a sample.

[AnimeMania]

27 minutes ago, moonshine71 said:

A few comments on deviations from the comics

  Reveal spoiler

I've seen a lot of reviews and comments mention the one big deviation is the status of Butcher's wife and Homelander's son, but I've seen almost no one mention another huge change, imo, the fact that The Boys(excepting The Female) are all powerless. That changes the dynamic in such a major way. They appear to regard all the heroes as invulnerable to some extent and are almost helpless against them, whereas comic Hughie killed a super w/ his bare hands in what i believe was his first fight. I'm curious whether people belief it will continue on this path, or if The Boys will start using Compound V. I was half expecting Butcher to do so at some point once they got a hold of a sample.

Spoiler

When they were testing Compound V on the terrorists, they said it killed a lot of them before they found someone who survived.

[benteen]

I have no idea why Hughie tried to save a piece of shit like A-Train.  Let him die, he deserved it.

I very much enjoyed this series though I don't think they quite stuck the landing with this last episode.

Edited August 26, 2019 by benteen

[UnknownK]

On 8/12/2019 at 6:06 PM, AuntiePam said:

I thought he did more than just expose himself to Starlight.  She was gagging and spitting in the bathroom after the encounter.  The mere sight of a penis doesn't usually induce that reaction.

I also wonder if the penis was 100% human or looked like a fish part (he does have gills after all).

[iMonrey]

Just finished this last night and really enjoyed it. Not a comic book fan but I liked Umbrella Academy and this was fun too. However, had it not been renewed for another season I would have felt very cheated, so on that score I'm less than satisfied with the ending. There's a way to write these things so that they can be a stand-alone limited series and still leave an opening for another season. This was not that. (Umbrella Academy did a better job of being just that.)

I was never bothered by Billy Butcher's accent. I'm not overly familiar with the actor so I don't know what he normally sounds like and at no time did his accent bother me or strike me as being fake. 

I'm one of the only people in the world who isn't overly enamored of Giancarlo Esposito so I was less than thrilled to see him pop in at the end. There's just something vaguely creepy about him and he seems to play the same character in every TV show he's in.

[Morrigan2575]

40 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

However, had it not been renewed for another season I would have felt very cheated, so on that score I'm less than satisfied with the ending. There's a way to write these things so that they can be a stand-alone limited series and still leave an opening for another season

They knew ahead of time that they were getting S2, so there was no danger leaving the season on a cliffhanger

[Bruinsfan]

Translucent probably corresponds most closely to the Martian Manhunter, who can turn invisible and is invulnerable (though not quite to the degree Superman is) to everything but fire. He has lots of other powers too though, basically the whole Kryptonian assortment + shapechanging + telepathy.

[Morrigan2575]

7 hours ago, Bruinsfan said:

Translucent probably corresponds most closely to the Martian Manhunter, who can turn invisible and is invulnerable (though not quite to the degree Superman is) to everything but fire. He has lots of other powers too though, basically the whole Kryptonian assortment + shapechanging + telepathy.

Oh yeah, good call. I forgot about Martian Manhunter.

[ribboninthesky1]

I was perplexed by the casting of Homelander.  He came off obviously off-kilter from his first scene.  He wasn't particularly handsome.  Or imposing for that matter - I think only the Deep was shorter in hieght.  So he never felt like a twisted Superman to me, more like Bizarro (who the public would never believe was authentic).  Karl Urban was more convincing as a narcissist  wearing a mask and manipulating others.  Homelander always came off unhinged, and a step away from losing it.            

[treasaigh]

I have a question for everyone.  All the interviews say that Homelander raped Butcher's wife.  I'm sorry I can't remember her name.  But anyway, was there anything in the show that indicated it was rape and not consensual?   I don't remember, but maybe I missed it.

[Morrigan2575]

9 hours ago, treasaigh said:

I have a question for everyone.  All the interviews say that Homelander raped Butcher's wife.  I'm sorry I can't remember her name.  But anyway, was there anything in the show that indicated it was rape and not consensual?   I don't remember, but maybe I missed it.

It was very subtle and honestly could go either way because it was told from Butcher's POV (and he's generally unreliable). The 2 scenes that come to mind are the one flashback to Butcher/Becca sitting in the kitchen, Becca looks shell shocked and, out of it, Billy says something like I can't help if you won't talk to me. I think he tries to hold her hand and she pulls away.

The other scene is the flashback of Butcher watching the security camera footage. You see Becca/Homelander walking into an office and then (we're told hours later) she sneaks out disheveled.

I believe she was raped but, the narrative kept it all in flashbacks and from Butcher's POV and, it's not like he was super trustworthy.  Hopefully, we'll get some answers very early in S2.  

Edited September 7, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[staphdude]

On 9/6/2019 at 9:51 PM, treasaigh said:

I have a question for everyone.  All the interviews say that Homelander raped Butcher's wife.  I'm sorry I can't remember her name.  But anyway, was there anything in the show that indicated it was rape and not consensual?   I don't remember, but maybe I missed it.

Home lander did it was consensual but the footage and her stare of mind cast some doubt on those claims. I almost feel as though Homelander felt it was consensual. 

In any case swing Becca’s reaction and knowing Butcher’s pain, I feel she should have shared with him if it was a rape and if not...fuck her.

[UnknownK]

Even consensual sex with that crazy freak for a few hours would make any woman want to get the hell out of there.

[Dobian]

On 8/12/2019 at 5:28 PM, Sakura12 said:

I was thinking Stargirl with Powergirls color scheme. I don't know about Translucent, I was just thinking he was The Invisible man. 

Whenever I saw Starlight it made me think of this:

Electra Woman on the right.

I guess Gus Fring from BB will be the new Big Bad next season.  He's awesome and the show will benefit.

Homelander is a total sociopath.  I thought he couldn't sink any lower when he unleashed super terrorists on the world, but making Butcher watch him take up with his wife and their illegitimate son is even worse lol.

I can't imagine the words Butcher will have for his wife, hiding out all those years letting him think she was dead while he sought revenge for her "rape/murder".

Edited September 30, 2019 by Dobian

[MissL]

On 8/26/2019 at 3:04 PM, UnknownK said:

I also wonder if the penis was 100% human or looked like a fish part (he does have gills after all).

I mentioned this in the thread for that episode but I swear starlight had a blue tinge to her mouth for a few scenes after that. Especially when she was sitting on the bench talking to Hughie. Could be all in my head though cuz that would be a weird detail that not many people would see.

I gasped out loud when Homelander lazered Elizabeth Shue’s eyeballs. I was not expecting that. I figured he would kill her but not that way. Was expecting a head squish or something. Guys she’s totally dead. 

I figured the kid was alive but I was about 50/50 on whether the wife would be as well. So curious where this goes and how Butcher gets out with his life. Yes he blew up a baby but I think he’d maybe figured Homelander was gonna kill the kid next and they were both goners might as well make it quick.

[wrlord]

On 8/12/2019 at 5:21 PM, Morrigan2575 said:

Starlight's costume kind of reminds me of Supergirl but, with Powergirl's color scheme.

You do know that they're the same person, right? Just from different dimensions? Supergirl is from Earth-1, and Power Girl is the same person on Earth-2.

Note: Post-Crisis does not count.

[Morrigan2575]

8 hours ago, wrlord said:

You do know that they're the same person, right? Just from different dimensions? Supergirl is from Earth-1, and Power Girl is the same person on Earth-2.

Note: Post-Crisis does not count.

Yes BUT their costumes are different which was the point of my post. 

[CigarDoug]

Seeing Gus Fring as the mysterious Mr. Edgar was awesome. But not nearly as awesome as hearing him say, "...before I head off for Belize". If that's not a nod to Breaking Bad fans, I don't know what is.

So, why are the supes so intimidated by Mr. Edgar, anyway? The other Vought executives, sure. But the supes?

[vavera4ka]

On ‎8‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 2:00 PM, bosawks said:

I wonder how much darker Homelander is going to get in season two after killing Stillwell who is now still and not well.

As jacked up as that relationship was it did seem to be the thinnest of threads tethering him to a degree of sanity.

Oh I can't wait to see this. I was seriously impressed with the actor. I don't remember last time I saw someone THAT easily go from one emotion to another within few seconds. I actually had to rewind couple scenes cause I was mesmerized by face acting.

So I want more darkness, more skeeviness, more sociopathic tendencies thrown at this character. 

[Quark]

I've just binged watch this show over the last two days. Fabulous.

The only thing I didn't like was how Butcher's accent kept changing. Make your mind up Karl Urban!

[MagnusHex]

Wow! *insert Robot Chicken's "What a twist!" clip*

Man, only eight episodes? I like the idea of having a shorter series rather than ruining a good story by dragging it too long, but still. Couldn't get enough of this show. lol

I feel like, out of all the superhero series and movies we've gotten so far from bigger corporations like Marvel and DC, Amazon ironically managed to create a superhero story that's more human than the big two. I mean, a lot of these Supes are downright villainous, but all so relatable. It's as if the Silver Age Marvel writers had written them, giving Supes relatable flaws and making them so far from the squeaky-clean goody-two shoes superheroes you come to know of (well, except Starlight, but a story like this does need at least one true hero). What if Flash got hooked up on steroids? Or if Superman was raised in isolation rather than Pa Kent and Martha? Such a great series so far that came at the perfect time when Marvel and DC's golden age have come to pass, especially when the MCU seems to be losing its shine now entering Phase 4. We're at the Alan Moore "Watchmen" subversion phase now, when subversion of superhero stories is once again needed in a time of superhero saturation.

But unfortunately, I'm not really impressed by the season 2 trailer, if I could be honest. And maybe it's because I'm just a jaded bastard, but these original series birthed in a streaming service, so many of them don't do well in season 2. It's the season that could either make or break a series. But it's just my gut feeling. Maybe those of you who've seen season 2 could inform me otherwise. lol I'll save my thoughts about season 2's potential Stormfront plotline for the appropriate thread.

But man, Homelander's one tough villain to hate. He's not just an egomaniac like Dr. Doom or some hatemonger like The Red Skull, so even if I dislike him, it's hard not to sympathize with him either. Really fascinating characters, these Supes. I just hope that the writers could keep the ideas flowing though. Because most shows and even movie trilogies go like this: season 1 (or the first film) is where you introduce the characters, but now that you've introduced the characters, how are you going to flesh them out further in the sequel? How do you keep the audience engaged? That's the one core element that's gonna either make or break season 2.

Teddy didn't really turn out the way I thought. Guess that rumor I heard, the one I talked about in an earlier post, was false. Guess Homelander now wants to have his own genuine all-American family rather than the fake one Vought created for him, sort of a twisted Manson Family of Supes. I can't believe Vought is still around though now that Madelyn is dead. Like, is Homelander going to continue living up that PR BS now that Madelyn isn't around to control him? He feels more like someone who wants to go live on a farm with his kid or something. He doesn't seem to give a crap about normal non-Supes people at all, so I doubt he'd try to reshape America or something. And while it seems like season 2 would have some kind of plot turning ordinary people into Supes, I've got a feeling Homelander might not be the kind of person that wants an entire world of Supes. "If everyone is Super, no one will be." Homelander would want to feel special, being this god among man.

I'm glad Starlight turned out the way she did though. I saw a video titled, "Starlight is the true hero of the show," and boy, it's accurate. She's like the only genuine superhero that we're familiar with. I hope she stays that way rather than become corrupted or something during season 2. But putting that aside, man, her argument with her mum once again resonated with me. Having to live up to your mother's image your whole life, not knowing who you are, who you're supposed to be, that feels so true to life for me. Except that I'm a lot less innocent than Annie and have more of Butcher's temper. lol But I like the way her story turned out, turning what was just a fabricated brand of heroism into the real deal. Shaping reality through her dreams and belief in what was just a myth and fiction.

One thing I'm hoping to see more of is more of Kimiko's development. We didn't actually get to see enough of that in season 1, I feel, since she kinda came along halfway through the series.

[Camera One]

I thought this was a pretty solid season finale. 

The moments with Hughie and Starlight taking stock of how they strayed and then taking a stand/making a choice towards their roots were well done.  I was beginning to think Hughie was starting to be unlikeable but I think he can be redeemable.

It would be fun to watch if Starlight and maybe some of the other 7's joined their fight against Vought next season.

Butcher and Outlander though, I still find irritating to watch.  The twist that Butcher and Outlander's baby was alive was a tad predictable.  It will be interesting to see what they do with Butcher's wife, I guess.

I'm easily squeamish, so that's the only thing that makes this show a little tough for me to watch.  But the story/premise is engaging and the characters are generally likeable, so overall, I had a good impression of the first season.  I liked Eric Kripke's "Timeless" but I thought it wasn't the strongest show and missed its potential.  There was also a villain who became extreme due to revenge there as well.  Sometimes, there's only so far you can go with that.

 

[Blue Plastic]

Late to the party but just binge-watched season 1 yesterday and felt compelled to comment.

I am so confused about Deep's story arc. I hate him but do empathize with his desire to help ocean creatures, but then he's such a fuckup that he can't even rescue them correctly. I also disliked how the dolphin's and lobster's deaths were played for dark humor. Yes, it's a gory show, yada yada, but it has always bothered me to see an animal's death played for laughs on any show.

Anyway, everything with Deep was super ick to me, and I didn't quite understand what they were trying to say other than he's an incompetent creep.

Everything with Deep might have caused me to stop watching, but I really liked the corrupt political and corporation commentary and kept me watching.

Edited June 17 by Blue Plastic