Elizabeth Webber: Forever The Manipulative Miss Or Adorable Angel?

[tallyrand]

My question is: do the writers understand that the way they are writing Liz right now is just angering people more (including her fans) or do they genuinely think this is somehow good soap? I get that no matter what not everyone would like Liz and they shouldn't. But they are writing her particularly awful and contradictory. 

 

I am very frustrated about the way this whole reveal as played.  While I definitely don't think what Liz has done is like the worst thing ever (in fact she didn't endanger anyone or kill anyone and may have prevented death's by keeping Jason away from being a murderer again even if she prevented the greatest love that ever loved from finding each other), I don't understand what the writers are going for.  I feel like she was more a pariah during the Niz debacle than she is now.  So her saying she's a pariah doesn't fly.  And then she says has no remorse about what she did which frankly is fine with me, but then she cries to Jason to forgive her rather than be strong in her convictions that lying was right.  I don't know if the writers mean for Liz to be wishy-washy or they can't figure out what to do with her at this point.  

Edited December 28, 2015 by tallyrand

[KerleyQ]

And it makes zero sense for her to say she'd do it all over again at this point.  It's pretty clear that, had she told him the truth, she wouldn't have lost Jason.  Even now, knowing the truth, and leaving Liz for lying to him, he's not running full speed back to his old life and seems pretty put off by his old life.  So why in the world would she say she'd do it all over again to lose him again instead of "I wish I would have told him, and maybe we still would have had a chance together"?  

 

It's just absurd writing that does her zero favors.  Make her "bad" fine, but have it make some damn sense. 

Edited December 28, 2015 by KerleyQ

[tallyrand]

I didn't even think of that point KerleyQ.  It makes no damn sense that Elizabeth has not come to that realization. 

[dubbel zout]

GH is the Seinfeld of soaps: No learning.

[peachmangosteen]

Monica treated Liz like shit after she found out about Jake, and even accused her of hurting Aiden when he was in the hospital, so I just don't really care about her either. 

 

And why should Liz care about Danny?

 

The thing is, Liz presents herself as someone who's a good person and who's better than all the low life lying criminals that make up most of PC's population, so I sure as fuck expect that she would care about what her lie did to Monica, Danny, Emma, etc. 

 

She hurt her own child, she lied to HER OWN CHILD. Justify that. You can't.

And there you go. That's the truly disgusting part. I can't believe she said she would do it again. She would hurt her kids again. Wow. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

Is Patrick actually hurt though? He's been saying that he doesn't regret a single second him and Sam spent together, and now he has Robin back, and Emma is happy as a clam.

 

 

Yes, Patrick was hurt. Yes, he may be getting his happy ending with Robin, but that doesn't negate the hurt he went through when he ended things with Sam. By that logic, is what Sam did watching Jake be kidnapped such a big deal since Liz was reunited with Jake soon after?

 

Look, I certainly don't think Liz was right for lying, and I wish she had never been involved in this story, but all these people that she supposedly hurt seem to be doing ok. Its not like Liz and Michael have some deep relationship. They only barely shared scenes when her and AJ were together. I just can't get worked up over people she has no relationship with, being hurt, and I can't get all worked up over people being hurt, when they look pretty happy to me onscreen.

 

 

Does Liz have to have a close relationship with someone to care about hurting them, especially when the person never did anything to her? Yes, Jason's friends and family are happy that he's back now, but given it was Jason, we witnessed their devastation when they thought he was dead. They suffered then and she didn't care. It's not some all's well that ends well situation where now that Jason knows the truth Liz shouldn't care about the hurt she caused. Especially when some of the people she hurt were her own children, and apparently she has no remorse over that.

[ulkis]

GH is the Seinfeld of soaps: No learning.

 

I think that has been a weakness of the genre as a whole, not just GH.

[HipOldBat]

I continue to remain confused as to why Liz needs comeuppance. So far as I can see, she's gotten it: losing Jason. She lost Lucky in the aftermath of the affair with Nik years ago; got reamed out by Lucky and then by Lulu, publicly, at her place of work.

 

What she did was wrong, but it's not like she locked him in a cage like an animal and let Jason's loved ones think he had abandoned them. If Jason had been working on trying to figure out his past from the day he woke up as Jake Doe, I could probably blame Liz for her actions. Even though he had flashes and she tried to brush it off, so what?  The only people who should ream her, as I've stated before are Monica and Sam; Especially Monica.  And I know that according to the population of PC, Jason was this paragon of perfection and wuved by everone, but he's a fucking murderer/hitman. I just don't care and am not up in arms over this. What does irk me is the continued trashing of Liz's character.  And the reason why she doesn't learn from her mistakes is because the fucking writers won't let her.  She's held to a higher standard as opposed to everyone else. She is fallible, as this stupid ass storyline has revealed.

 

Until and If the Michael and Vito Corleone wannabe and Cujo get their just desserts and actually suffer--LONG TERM, meaning for the rest of this life of this show, I just don't care if Liz doesn't "pay" as she didn't comit any kind of crime. Unless lying is a crime. And really, lying compared to murder, blackmail? Liz is nowhwere near the level of those guilty of the latter. Nothing she's done is cause for her to lose her kids, even if temporarily. She didn't put her kids in danger; shd didn't abuse them. And last I checked, those are the main reasons for taking one's kids away.

 

This.  A million times.

 

I cannot for the life of me understand why the writers continue to write this character into a corner, having her say things like, "I'd do it all again!" after showing that she has processed what happened and why, and was torturing herself for months when she was keeping the secret of Jason's identity.  It's almost as if the writers think they have to have Liz say or do something outrageously awful every time she appears on-screen.  I don't know of any other characters on any other soap (barring some campy villain types, but even then...) who are not allowed one scintilla of redemption, are vilified to such a ridiculous extent, and whose character does and says things that make no sense in terms of their history or even recent events as they have done to Liz.  

 

I also do not understand the depths of the hatred shown to this character, and some of the comments elsewhere on other forums are rather sickening (people wanting to see the character beaten/killed and so on).  

 

And, like the person I quoted above, I agree that Liz IS "being punished" for this lie she sustained. Every character has a go at her whenever possible, even the odious Hayden, and I really do think it's all way out of proportion to her "crime".  There were many times when Jason stated he didn't care about knowing who he was, and it wasn't as if he had no decision-making abilities of his own - amnesiac or not, he still retained his cognitive abilities, held a job at a garage, made his own decisions and generally functioned fairly well.  Liz lost Jason, and is the town pariah, and I think that's more than enough punishment for what she did.

 

The way I see it, Liz' extreme anxiety about "losing Jason" trumped everything - her guilt over what she was doing (thankfully the writers did throw that in on occasion), her sense of fairness, and her inability to see how what she was doing would affect her kids.  Sorry, but as a therapist I have seen people do far, far worse than anything she has ever done, with nary a conscience about it.  She didn't set out to hurt her kids, she didn't see the consequences because, even though she feared it would all come tumbling down, she held on to the hope that it wouldn't, and that's a pretty human way to react.  The writers could have kept writing her in this human way, but for some reason decided to then make Liz this "evil" person with no chance of redemption unless she has a psychotic break or tries to kill herself, and I have no idea why this had to be the case.

 

They can and should do so much better by this character.  She's a single mother with a career, and she doesn't need Jason or anyone, really.

[yowsah1]

My question is: do the writers understand that the way they are writing Liz right now is just angering people more (including her fans) or do they genuinely think this is somehow good soap? I get that no matter what not everyone would like Liz and they shouldn't. But they are writing her particularly awful and contradictory....  I don't know if the writers mean for Liz to be wishy-washy or they can't figure out what to do with her at this point.  

 

And we can't even put this down to Ron's insane(ly wrong) conviction that there wasn't a corner he could write a character into that he couldn't write them out of.  The new writers have had months to fix this story, to plan out some way to redeem Liz.  They chose not to, and now they are caught between the devil of Liz fans tuning out in disgust at how one of their favorite characters was turned into a cartoon villain to service one of the most horrible stories GH has forced us to suffer through, and the deep blue sea of viewers who have responded to the shows enthusiastic efforts to whip up hatred against the character by - SURPRISE!![Not!!!] - hating her and wanting her to be practically flayed alive.

 

It was like RC was the drunk driver who was speeding the car towards a wall, only well before impact he was ejected from the car and another driver took the wheel - and instead of slowing down or steering away from the danger he locked the wheel in place and jammed the accelerator to the floor.  I'd feel sorry for the new driver, except that he could have prevented the awful crash and simply chose not to.  I'll reserve my sympathy for BH/Liz, the hapless passenger strapped in the back, unable to escape the carnage...

Edited December 30, 2015 by yowsah1

[dubbel zout]

I think that has been a weakness of the genre as a whole, not just GH.

 

I agree to a certain extent, and also think it's somewhat necessary for a long-running serial. You need a certain amount of consistency to stay familiar. But we rarely even get lip service on GH to wrongdoings. Liz knows she's wrong to lie about Jason, but she'd do it again, and we get no explanation as to why. Or the explanations we get—Nik is taking over ELQ because the Qs were mean to him—are laughably lame. Sonny tells people to get over it—it's not his fault.

 

But people do change: Bobbie started out a hooker and became a nurse. She was a schemer, but she'd changed her life for the better. Lucy went from a mousy librarian to the owner of a successful cosmetics company. (Not that being a mousy librarian is in any way wrong.) 

 

There's no nuance anymore, I guess is my point. Some of the actors try, but when the writing fails, they can do only so much.

Edited December 30, 2015 by dubbel zout

[33kaitykaity]

I'm taking my 1,000 lashes with a wet noodle here, but I actually found myself understanding why Liz did what she did and even sympathizing with her a small amount during that Liz/Robin conversation when Robin asked her why and Liz said plainly that Carly would start pushing Jason to Sam because Sam is the only one of Jason's many women who can tolerate Carly and I was like oh, yes, that's so absolutely true.  

 

I need soul bleach now.  

[Oracle42]

Sam and Carly have gotten into multiple fist fights and slap offs. Carly has had issues with every woman in Jason's life but she tolerates Sam because Jason told her that she has to

[dubbel zout]

she tolerates Sam because Jason told her that she has to

 

Didn't Jason tell Carly that if he had to choose between her and Sam, he'd choose Sam? Carly knew he was serious, so she's in a state of armed neutrality with Sam, and Sam is smart enough not to engage unless absolutely necessary.

Edited December 30, 2015 by dubbel zout

[MissL]

Still one of the best moments ever was Jason YELLING at Carly to "shut up about Elizabeth" that made me happy. He's stuck up for her too.

Man I'm so glad I'm not watching this crapfest. I've watched Liz since she was a teenager and hated the vitriol she seems to get on-line. just never made sense to me and hurts to see because to me she'll always be that spunky girl who hit on Lucky and that poor girl I watched crawl out of the bushes. Her YEARS of slow burn with Jason and her ability to have chemistry with a rock... Well unless that rock is named Jacob Young...i just think BH has done great work with the crap they've given her since Sonny and co. Took over and I don't get why they keep doing it to her.

I couldn't even tune back in to say goodbye to Patrick and Robin because I can't watch what they are doing to her. Lord what did they do to my soap?

Edited January 5, 2016 by thewhiteowl

[LeftPhalange]

Glad I wasn't reading message boards when Sam watched Dead Now Alive Jake get snatched. 

[OnceSane]

Stick to the topic of the thread which is Liz, not what fellow posters choose to call her. If you have a problem with a post, report it rather than engaging in thread.

[Ambrosefolly]

Giving Liez a breakdown might be good for her fans who are desperate for her to be redeemed but I don't think it would do much to improve her image in the eyes of those who don't like her or are neutral on her. Having her act like a crazy desperate bitch for 7 months, throwing her in Shadybrook for a few weeks, then expecting all to be forgiven is a cop-out and would only serve to make some of us hate her even more. Redemption is something she needs to earn and it needs to take longer than a few weeks.

I know the haters wanted a line of people to get in line to tell how much they hated her but it isn't like people like Carly, Sonny, Franco, Ava got some great punishment for their careers. If Liz did wind up in Shadybrook for a few weeks, it would be more time than Carly did for covering a murder. Now Sonny and Carly are the new matriarch and patriarch of Port Charles for some odd reason.Part of the problem with Liz and the show in general is that nothing ever sticks. Instead of ending Liason for the next several months or even years, they are having Jason spend the night at the house when he shouldn't be even able to look at her. That is what they should do, just have Jason avoid her and deal with her when he is trying to spend time with Jake. Maybe they could come up with a non romance story for Liz and/or have in therapy.

[peachmangosteen]

Liz needs redemption for not telling ,but almost all of the rest of the show gets to ride their high horses for their actual sins?

I've said this before but for me it's because I believe Liz is actually a good person (and she sure as shit presents herself as better than everyone else in PC). Carly, Sonny, Jason, Franco, Ava, etc are bad people, they're criminals, so I expect them to commit crimes and lie and be generally awful. But Liz isn't a bad person so she shouldn't have lied to people for months, kept Jason's family from him, lied to and hurt her children, and slept with Jason while lying to him about his identity. She should feel bad about that and imo she should want to seek redemption because that's what good people do when they make mistakes/do bad things.

Edited January 10, 2016 by peachmangosteen

[UYI]

I know the haters wanted a line of people to get in line to tell how much they hated her but it isn't like people like Carly, Sonny, Franco, Ava got some great punishment for their careers. If Liz did wind up in Shadybrook for a few weeks, it would be more time than Carly did for covering a murder.

To be fair, LeftPhalange is the biggest (and one of only about two) Carly fans here, so she doesn't really mind losing Liz for more Carly. Just saying. ;)

Edited January 10, 2016 by UYI

[Ambrosefolly]

It isn't even. People talk about Liz losing her job, her kids and doing time in Shadybrook, but what did Carly really lose(I believe she kept the worse secret)? Sure Joss would rather spend time with Jax than her bitch mother, but Carly didn't lose custody of her and Morgan even kept the secret. She kept her hotel, her money, her house and didn't go to jail. The biggest thing was Michael wouldn't speak to her for a few months, it did end after less than a year and now everything is back to status quo. Carly willingly married Sonny so I guess she is in love with him, she moved from one mansion to another, she works for herself, owning a hotel she earned by being a gold digger and not through any actual training and hard work.

Now that Patrick and Robin have left, Liz no longer has any meaningful adult relationships in her life (I guess maybe Pip), but not a life partner. She brought that on herself but that isn't easy. She is raising 3 children under the age of 10 on her own, she has the stressful job of a nurse when she would rather be a working artist, working for a criminal that basically stole the position of chief of staff.

If you compare them, I think most people would say that Carly has the more charmed life. It doesn't excuse what Liz did, but it does give a more emotional reason.

[UYI]

I'm not saying you're wrong, I was just saying LP isn't going to see it all that way, that's all. :)

[Ambrosefolly]

I am, so I don't care. Carly isn't better than Liz and doesn't own any more of her bad behavior than Liz does.

Edited January 10, 2016 by Ambrosefolly

[Oracle42]

I've said this before but for me it's because I believe Liz is actually a good person (and she sure as shit presents herself as better than everyone else in PC). Carly, Sonny, Jason, Franco, Ava, etc are bad people, they're criminals, so I expect them to commit crimes and lie and be generally awful. But Liz isn't a bad person so she shouldn't have lied to people for months, kept Jason's family from him, lied to and hurt her children, and slept with Jason while lying to him about his identity. She should feel bad about that and imo she should want to seek redemption because that's what good people do when they make mistakes/do bad things.

That was the point of her whole Nurses Ball speech/justification. She's a good person and that hasn't gotten her the things that she wants - so she decided to lie

[katie9918]

So now she doesn't get to whine about being a better person than all those other people she looks down on. She CHOSE to lower herself to their level when she decided to keep her mouth shut about Jake's true identity, mere weeks after getting on her high horse over Ric doing the same thing.

[WendyCR72]

Let's be sure to keep this about Liz and not posters and their fan affiliations.

 

Thank you and carry on!

[Oracle42]

So now she doesn't get to whine about being a better person than all those other people she looks down on. She CHOSE to lower herself to their level when she decided to keep her mouth shut about Jake's true identity, mere weeks after getting on her high horse over Ric doing the same thing.

 

It was the same day - possibly the same hour. 

[LeftPhalange]

I totally forgot that Liez found out about Jason like 37 minutes after she dumped Ric. LMAO she's such a piece of shit.

[peachmangosteen]

I forgot about that, too. I mean damn Liz! 

 

They either need to decide Liz is awful or she's not asap because her being all "IDGAF I'd do it again for Jason's dick"  to Robin and then the next day being all "I'm sorry for what I did" to Laura isn't working at all and I think BH is having a hard time trying to play it because it makes little sense.

[peachmangosteen]

She called him once when Jake was freaked out, but the rest has been all Jason. He's the one insisting that he stay over at Liz's house, he's the one that wanted them to stay with him.

 

I must have missed the part of this story where Liz lost her ability to make her own choices.

[LeftPhalange]

I must have missed the part where Lucky signed away his parental rights to DNAJ so Jason could adopt him. As far as I'm concerned, Lucky is the father of those three kids and Jason is just DNAJ's sperm donor. Liez and Jason both agreed that Jason would play no role in DNAJ's life and he never ever had a role in Cam and Aiden's life. Jason dating Liez for a few months and Lucky being off screen doesn't change anything. Jason can give DNAJ a trust fund if he really wants to help and then go back to being the sperm donor and having nothing to do with the other two. 

[KerleyQ]

 

I must have missed the part of this story where Liz lost her ability to make her own choices.

 

In Port Charles, that goes with having a vagina.  

[peachmangosteen]

Nik started this lie, and he's not alone. Sonny does bad things all the time, and he's not alone, same with Carly and everyone else on this show. Liz lied, that hardly means she's not allowed a new love interest.

 

I think most of us wish Nik would pay and Sonny would pay and Carly would pay and Franco would pay and hell even Dante would pay, soI feel like this argument is so tired at this point. Just because no one ever pays doesn't mean I can't still be pissed that Liz did a shitty thing and is now being rewarded for it by being put in scenes with who TPTB consider a star and potentially getting a hot new love interest. I was pissed when Sonny got his bullshit pardon, too. I hate Nik/Hayden. It's not like it's just Liz who's getting some shit online. And in show she is suffering no fucking consequences and is, in fact, being rewarded, so she's in the same boat as Nik, Sonny, etc. anyway.

[KerleyQ]

But Liz actually did pay.  She lost Jason, but people still want to see more pounds of flesh extracted and are pissed off at the mere thought that she might eventually end up paired up with New Guy.  Sonny killed his son's father, and he lost his son for about 15 minutes.  Carly gleefully covered up that murder, and she lost Michael for the same length of time.  And the two of them ended up married and happy.  Nik tried to have Hayden offed, and they're "in love" with no signs that she's even going to consider holding that against him.  Hell, she'll probably end up being a really still alive Emily, so he'll be rewarded for this shit in the best way he could have hoped for.  Franco is happily cozied up to Nina.  And Dante has been handed the upper hand in the "who did worse" battle with Lulu (and poor widdle Valerie is now the biggest victim of all).  

 

Liz lost Jason.  We all know he's got his ticket punched on the JaSam train (I mean, it's a local instead of an express, but he's on it), so we know she's not going to be rewarded with a real relationship with Jason.  A real relationship she could have had, had she not kept the secret.  Her end result is no relationship with Jason, except for co-parenting Jake - along with the included opportunities to look like the evil bitch next to Saint Sam at every turn of the story.  

 

But, oh, hey, at some point in the future, she might get a chance to have a relationship with a totally new guy who hasn't had his leg peed all over by the KeMo fans - a relationship that has nothing to do with her lie, has no relationship to that whatsoever, and was not what she set out to get or keep when she decided to keep the lie.  That would be like saying that Danny is Sam being rewarded for watching Jake's kidnapping and doing nothing.  

 

In the Port Charles grand scheme of things, a lie doesn't rank very high on the crime scale.  Yet, Liz actually lost something, for good, from all indications.  People who literally kill in cold blood suffer short term losses and then regain all they lost (and then some).  She lied about Jason to keep him.  She lost him.  the punishment fit the crime, and is far more than anyone else in town suffers for theirs.  Now she should never be able to move on in her life?  New Guy, who wasn't even here for the lie, who has no skin in the game, should shun her or stone her at the nurse's station while screaming "lying harlot!"?  

[LeftPhalange]

I think words are being taken out of context and misinterpreted. I haven't seen a single person say anything about Liez never being able to move on or even that the new guy should never look her way. Is wanting Liez to stay single for at least six months really asking too much? Is wanting her to get her life together really asking too much? If I were a Liez fan I think the last thing I would want is for her to jump into another relationship. 

[ulkis]

As a Liz fan, I want her to burn everything Jason related, including that puppet that is masquerading as a child and that awful picture back from Jason's mullet days.

[dubbel zout]

the JaSam train (I mean, it's a local instead of an express, but he's on it)

 

More like it's being held in the station because of signal problems. Good lord, this story needs to move. It's coming up on two frickin' years.

[WendyCR72]

More like it's being held in the station because of signal problems. Good lord, this story needs to move. It's coming up on two frickin' years.

 

THIS. This crap ACTUALLY began - on and off - almost a DECADE ago. Kill this thing, for God's sake.

[Oracle42]

To be fair, Guza didn't seem at all interested in it after 2008(?) - RC revived it because he decided that every relationship in every age group needed to be a repetitive, stupid triangle/quad so he could really focus on developing Franco's million backstories

[peachmangosteen]

But Liz actually did pay.  She lost Jason ...

Yet they still share the majority of their scenes together. And Jason never even told her to FOAD. He barely yelled at her.

Sonny killed his son's father, and he lost his son for about 15 minutes. Carly gleefully covered up that murder, and she lost Michael for the same length of time. And the two of them ended up married and happy. Nik tried to have Hayden offed, and they're "in love" with no signs that she's even going to consider holding that against him. Hell, she'll probably end up being a really still alive Emily, so he'll be rewarded for this shit in the best way he could have hoped for. Franco is happily cozied up to Nina. And Dante has been handed the upper hand in the "who did worse" battle with Lulu (and poor widdle Valerie is now the biggest victim of all).

And people complained/complain about all that, too. It's not like Liz is the only person fans are clamoring to see pay. Hell, I want Dante killed!

[GHScorpiosRule]

It doesn't matter to me that Jason barely yelled at Liz. The bottom line is, she lost him. She will no longer live in that fantasy world with him, Cameron, Aiden and Jake forever and ever. To her, that is a loss. That is her paying. Since this fakakta show has denigrated her character even further, making her so obsessed and believing this "was their time" and keeping the lie...losing him as a result of that lie is comeuppance.

 

And I see and read in practically every thread, more demands for Liz to pay, how Liz always skates, than I do about the midgety moobster, Ava, and Cujo. Even Dante.

[Oracle42]

Losing Jason was inevitably going to happen when he got his memories back*. The fact that it happened a little earlier because her lie was exposed makes it seem like a non-event of a consequence.

*Unless RC changed his mind and decided to make the amnesia permanent or some new form of Not!DID

Edited January 19, 2016 by Oracle42

[peachmangosteen]

And I see and read in practically every thread, more demands for Liz to pay, how Liz always skates, than I do about the midgety moobster, Ava, and Cujo. Even Dante.

 

I think that's solely because it's currently happening. I'm pretty sure we were all going insane when Sonny didn't pay. And there are a few who still bring up Ava's shit. 

 

But Liz is on almost every day now so of course there's going to be more talk about her and her misdeeds than the stuff that happened months ago and that TPTB clearly want us to forget even happened at all.

[mybabyaidan]

But, oh, hey, at some point in the future, she might get a chance to have a relationship with a totally new guy who hasn't had his leg peed all over by the KeMo fans -

 

 

There are a select few people here who have vocalized ANYTHING having to do with this new doc being for Liz....and not all are KeMo fans, so I am not quite sure I get your point here.  I don't remember peeing all over anybody, but I could have blocked it out.

 

I think Liz is paying by having lost Jason, but she SHOULD have been read by Monica and Michael.  Instead Michael said "that sucks" and we haven't heard another word about it.  And Monica hasn't even been given ANY POV here.  At this point though I just want this entire story line to end, and I want my girl free from anything having to do with Liz for a long long time.  

[dr. gailey]

I give no fucks if Liz moves on with the new doctor. The only thing that does is guarantee that I won't learn a damn thing about him as I fast-forward anything that doesn't have to do with the people I like. If Sam was freed from this current Jiz bullshit, I wouldn't post about Liz period.

[peachmangosteen]

And Monica hasn't even been given ANY POV here.

 

That's such a travesty. And maybe if Monica had been allowed to read her Liz would get a clue about how much she hurt her own children with this lie. 

[LeftPhalange]

That's such a travesty. And maybe if Monica had been allowed to read her Liz would get a clue about how much she hurt her own children with this lie. 

 

I doubt she would care. The only person whose opinion she cares about is Jason's. 

[Oracle42]

I doubt she would care. The only person whose opinion she cares about is Jason's.

Which is insane. If there'd been actual fallout from this thing aside from Liz "losing Jason" - there would be a really good excuse to bring in Liz's family (all of whom are medical professionals) to populate the hospital and rehab the character.

Since TFGH is acting like nothing is wrong with Liz, I guess they're going to just move her into her next story without doing anything to walk this back or rehab Liz? I just...why?

[fishcakes]

Liz losing Jason isn't paying because he never would have been with her, but for her lie. They were attracted to each other, but didn't get together until after she found out who he was. When he thought Hayden was his wife, he was all moony-eyed over Liz, but he still moved into Hayden's hotel room and tried to remember her, which obviously he couldn't. If he'd known that Sam was his wife, there is no way he would have started up with Liz and she knows that. To say that she paid by losing him is sort of like saying that, well, she was arrested for shoplifting but the police should just let her go because she didn't get to keep the clothes she stole so she's already suffered enough.

 

I don't expect her to be put in the stocks outside Kelly's, but at minimum, Monica and Michael get to berate until she cries, and at some point she has to have some genuine awareness of why what she did was so awful and exhibit real remorse for it. At this point, she still doesn't get it; she's issuing insincere apologies to Jason, but that's more of her manipulation, and we know that because at the same time that she's saying she's sorry, she's also implying to Sam that she and Jason are about to bed down together and telling her disturbed zombie son that the three of them could still be a family (along with those other two kids, Carl and Adam, assuming she ever remembers to pick them up from Audrey's).

[peachmangosteen]

Since TFGH is acting like nothing is wrong with Liz, I guess they're going to just move her into her next story without doing anything to walk this back or rehab Liz? I just...why?

 

It makes no sense to me at all that they did this only for it to end in nothing fucking happening. I mean that's how all the stories go, but it still gets me every single time. This is not storytelling!

 

... at some point she has to have some genuine awareness of why what she did was so awful and exhibit real remorse for it.

This is literally the only thing that really needs to happen tbh. If they're too lazy to do a real story with it and/or they don't want Liz to actually pay for anything then they could at least do this.

[dubbel zout]

I'm okay with Michael being mostly uninterested in Liz paying for the lie. He and Liz never had much contact in the first place, so I'm not sure him ripping into her would have much impact.

 

I wish the show would focus more on Jason being interested in creating a life without Liz than this crap we're getting. He has no job, no interest in trying to retrieve his memories. He's getting sucked into this dumb Jake stuff, and we know it will only get dumber as Liz deludes herself that maybe she has a chance to get Jason back. Which, way to flip-flop, writers. Pick a lane, FFS.