Past Seasons Talk: The Tribe Has Spoken

[fishcakes]

1 hour ago, nlkm9 said:

So which season was yuman? The guy who promised his car to “dreamz “ and had to give it to him even though he lied? Or is it yauman? I loved that guys .

It's Yau-Man with a hyphen, but if I don't look it up, I usually forget and get it wrong, so I'm not being scoldy or anything 😊. Anyway, he's one of my favorites as well. He was on season 14, the original Fiji season (that was the one with Dreamz and the car), and he also returned for season 16 Fans vs. Favorites/Micronesia.

Edited March 2, 2020 by fishcakes

[nlkm9]

10 hours ago, fishcakes said:

It's Yau-Man with a hyphen, but if I don't look it up, I usually forget and get it wrong, so I'm not being scoldy or anything 😊. Anyway, he's one of my favorites as well. He was on season 14, the original Fiji season (that was the one with Dreamz and the car), and he also returned for season 16 Fans vs. Favorites/Micronesia.

So is it true that even though dreamz lies to him he had to give him the car? I don’t remember a lot of seasons but he stood out to me.

[fishcakes]

3 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

So is it true that even though dreamz lies to him he had to give him the car? I don’t remember a lot of seasons but he stood out to me.

I don't think Dreamz really lied; he just broke his promise. Yau won the car and said he'd give it to Dreamz, and in return he asked that if Dreamz won immunity at F4, that he'd give it to Yau. Jeff clarified that Yau understood that he couldn't hold Dreamz to the promise and Yau said he did. So giving him the car was already a done deal before they got to F4. Then Dreamz did win F4 immunity, and it seems like he actually thought about giving it to Yau (no idea how genuine that was), but ultimately didn't. They talked about it at the reunion, and Yau said he had no hard feelings about it. Some of us speculated here that Yau didn't really want the car (as I recall, it was a full-size pickup truck) or dealing with having to sell it, so he took a gamble on turning it into a game advantage and it just didn't work out for him, but he wasn't mad about it.

[Guest]

Yau-Man doesn't seem like the type to get mad about very much.

[Nashville]

Plus, many in-show gifts have an established history of sometimes being more trouble than they’re worth - particularly gifts like vehicles where the “winning” contestant has to lay out their own money for such things as state sales tax, vehicle tax, registration fees, proof of insurance, etc., etc., before they can even claim the prize.

[nlkm9]

I feel like if he didn’t deliver what he promised , the car should have reverted back to yau- at that point what he chose to do with it was his choice . Ugh.

[nlkm9]

4 hours ago, Nashville said:

Plus, many in-show gifts have an established history of sometimes being more trouble than they’re worth - particularly gifts like vehicles where the “winning” contestant has to lay out their own money for such things as state sales tax, vehicle tax, registration fees, proof of insurance, etc., etc., before they can even claim the prize.

a deal is a deal--he didnt really lie he just broke a promise? in my eyes thats a lie. lol

[Nashville]

2 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

a deal is a deal--he didnt really lie he just broke a promise? in my eyes thats a lie. lol

???  I wasn’t arguing that point all, one way OR the other - just saying Yau-Man may have had more than one reason for considering the truck more valuable as a strategic tool than as a material acquisition.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Nashville
Typo

[fishcakes]

I think @nlkm9 meant to quote me. And I agree that's I'm splitting the hair pretty finely there, but I don't think Dreamz intended to break the promise at the time he made it (which would make it an out-and-out lie). He more likely just really wanted/needed the truck and thought either that when the time came, he could honor his promise or that he wouldn't even win immunity at F4, or that Yau might not even still be there (since there were still six people in the game when he made the promise) so it wouldn't even be an issue. Dreamz does not come off looking great in that whole thing, but I don't think he set out to fool Yau-Man, who didn't seem to care one way or the other about the truck. Anyway, here's the clip of how it happened, which I love just because Yau-Man was something of an unexpected challenge beast that season. 

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by fishcakes

[Sarahsmile416]

So I’m watching Pearl Islands for the first time...and one thing made me laugh (ironically), the episode where Fairplay lies about his “dead” grandma, later in the episode there is an anagram Immunity Challenge that Burton wins.  But he has clearly spelled “liaison” wrong (he spelled it liason).  I’m sure that this isn’t the first time it’s happened but in a challenge where spelling clearly counts, it was pretty glaring 

 

watched the rest and they did notice it lol 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Sarahsmile416
Watched more of the episode

[WhereThereIsLife]

While I am sure Burton has had many liaisons, he is probably used to spelling them as hook-ups. 😉

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 3/2/2020 at 8:52 PM, fishcakes said:

I think @nlkm9 meant to quote me. And I agree that's I'm splitting the hair pretty finely there, but I don't think Dreamz intended to break the promise at the time he made it (which would make it an out-and-out lie). He more likely just really wanted/needed the truck and thought either that when the time came, he could honor his promise or that he wouldn't even win immunity at F4, or that Yau might not even still be there (since there were still six people in the game when he made the promise) so it wouldn't even be an issue. Dreamz does not come off looking great in that whole thing, but I don't think he set out to fool Yau-Man, who didn't seem to care one way or the other about the truck. Anyway, here's the clip of how it happened, which I love just because Yau-Man was something of an unexpected challenge beast that season. 

I was so into Dreamz as a contestant before all of this.  It was so funny because he was living on the streets so he loved the conditions on Survivor.  LOL.  Then this whole thing soured me.  But I guess, living on the streets means you have to hustle.  And he sure hustled his way to the end.  LOL.  

Edited March 4, 2020 by Ms Blue Jay

[Rachel RSL]

21 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I was so into Dreamz as a contestant before all of this.  It was so funny because he was living on the streets so he loved the conditions on Survivor.  LOL.  Then this whole thing soured me.  But I guess, living on the streets means you have to hustle.  And he sure hustled his way to the end.  LOL.  

I could never hold anything against Dreamz when he was the one who was instrumental in making the infamous Edgardo boot happen!  Man, all these years later and I can still see those smug smiles disappear.....good times!

[treeofdreams]

15 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

I could never hold anything against Dreamz when he was the one who was instrumental in making the infamous Edgardo boot happen!  Man, all these years later and I can still see those smug smiles disappear.....good times!

Brilliant play - one of my favorite moments (epic moment!) of Survivor.

I don't understand how Dreamz going back on his promise was any worse than the many betrayals, lies and backstabbing that have gone on in all these years of Survivor.  If it had been someone else other than Yau-man being betrayed, I wonder if people would be so upset.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, treeofdreams said:

Brilliant play - one of my favorite moments (epic moment!) of Survivor.

I don't understand how Dreamz going back on his promise was any worse than the many betrayals, lies and backstabbing that have gone on in all these years of Survivor.  If it had been someone else other than Yau-man being betrayed, I wonder if people would be so upset.

That, and I think the fact that a large truck was involved.

[LadyChatts]

I took a break from my Survivor re-watches, but went back to Fiji and China.  On the subject of China, I got to the tribe swap.  The directions were each tribe had to pick two people from the opposing tribe to join their tribe (apparently Zhan Hu didn't read the directions carefully, because they thought they were getting two members from Fei-Long, and would suddenly go from being a tribe of 5 against 7 to a tribe of 7 against 5).  This was the episode where Aaron got royally screwed by the tribe swap.  He didn't even have a chance.  I don't blame Zhan Hu for throwing the challenge and getting rid of him, but it sucked.  I wish he'd been given a second chance at some point.  But it was interesting how they did the swap.  I partially blame Leslie, who was "kidnapped" by the other tribe earlier and pretty much exposed her entire tribe, who was the leader, running things, etc.  

BTW, I get annoyed by Probst's sound bites during the challenges, but I'd love to have Courtney do a play by play.  She definitely wouldn't hold back.

Edited March 5, 2020 by LadyChatts

[Hera]

38 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

3 hours ago, fishcakes said:

I feel like so many of the wins have been controversial though. "Tina only won because Colby was a moron." "Tony only won because Woo was a moron." "Vecepia only won because the jury was bitter." "Natalie White only won because the jury was bitter." "Tom only won because he bullied Ian into giving up final immunity." "Yul only won because he had an overpowered idol." "Ben only won because the producers changed the rules at the last minute." For every season, there's someone who thinks there's a case to be made that someone other than the actual winner was more deserving. I don't think the producers care very much about people complaining because people will complain no matter what, and if people are complaining, it means they're watching.

Some of those are 100% legit. Tina and Tony should never have been in the finals. You can argue that their great social game within their alliance led to them being in the finals and they won but the reality is that they should not have been there. But they managed to make it to the finals and won based on how they played the game.

Tom won because he was a bully and Ian handed it to him. Plenty of people love Tom and are fine with his win. I find him to be a bullying asshole and never liked his game play. His win was legit.

Natalie White's win was far more then a bitter jury, plenty of people that season said the Russell show simply dominated and what was really going on wasn't even close to fully shown. And given how much the show loved Russell, I have no problem buying that. But you will notice that Natalie is not back and I am not sure that she was asked to return.

Yul had a more powerful idol but he also figured out to play it perfectly. I don't think Richard's win is lessened because he figured out the alliance mechanism first and I don't think Yul's win is lessened because he figured out the idol.

Ben was pretty much handed the win with that twist. He managed to win immunity or find idols at the right time and then the fire making challenge was introduced. Overall, Ben did not play a good game. But there was no way that he was not going to win because his backstory was powerful. You heard the other contestants mention that for weeks in a row. They finally had a chance to get him out and there is a fire making competition for the first time ever.

The reality is that Rob is right, who ever wins their season is the winner that season deserves. That said, there are some winners that have a different feel to them because of the circumstances. Rob and Michelle tend to fall into that category.

The problem for someone like Michele is that she wasn't the focus of her season. The people we remember from Kaôh Rōng are Tai, Aubry and (sigh) Scot and Jason. I also remember Cydney (because I'd really like to see her come back) and Julia. The same for Natalie White—Samoa was The Russell Hantz Show, featuring Shambo. I feel bad for these underedited winners because I agree with the idea that there's no such thing as an undeserving winner, and it sucks that for both them and us that the audience wasn't given the chance to understand how they won their seasons.

Rob has the opposite problem in that after Russell's inglorious and early exit, Redemption Island became The Boston Rob Show, featuring Special Agent Phillip Sheppard. The audience knew exactly what game Rob was playing and very little about the other players and what they were planning and thinking, which means that we had no choice but to take Rob's word that he was dominating a game of morons.

Honestly, all of this is an argument in favor of showing everyone and against letting one or two personalities completely dominate a season. The last full season I watched before this one was Ghost Island and I remember being super frustrated that there were a number of players who got no air time, but were in on votes that were organized by people they didn't appear to be allied with and were left out of votes that were organized by people who we were led to believe were their allies. I get that the moves of these players didn't matter in the end, due to Wendell and Domenick's dominance of the game (aided and abetted by Laurel and her timidity), but it would have been nice to see what ideas they were toying with.

[treeofdreams]

4 hours ago, Hera said:

Honestly, all of this is an argument in favor of showing everyone and against letting one or two personalities completely dominate a season.

This is my biggest pet peeve about Survivor - when they feature one player so heavily that other players are practically invisible.  And unfortunately the ones they spotlight are players I usually cannot stand.  I probably do not need to name who those players are...

Edited March 7, 2020 by treeofdreams

[Lantern7]

Funny115: Spotlight on Katie Collins and her comically oversized glasses. Bonus: shots of her in Tina-related content from The Australian Outback.

[kassandra8286]

23 hours ago, Hera said:

The problem for someone like Michele is that she wasn't the focus of her season. The people we remember from Kaôh Rōng are Tai, Aubry and (sigh) Scot and Jason. I also remember Cydney (because I'd really like to see her come back) and Julia. The same for Natalie White—Samoa was The Russell Hantz Show, featuring Shambo. I feel bad for these underedited winners because I agree with the idea that there's no such thing as an undeserving winner, and it sucks that for both them and us that the audience wasn't given the chance to understand how they won their seasons.

Exactly. Another example is South Pacific which starred blowhard Coach, producer's favorite narrator Cochran, golden child Ozzy, crazy Brandon, and drama queen Dawn. It's little wonder no one can remember Sophie, not even her own teammate!

[LadyChatts]

23 hours ago, Hera said:

Honestly, all of this is an argument in favor of showing everyone and against letting one or two personalities completely dominate a season. The last full season I watched before this one was Ghost Island and I remember being super frustrated that there were a number of players who got no air time, but were in on votes that were organized by people they didn't appear to be allied with and were left out of votes that were organized by people who we were led to believe were their allies. I get that the moves of these players didn't matter in the end, due to Wendell and Domenick's dominance of the game (aided and abetted by Laurel and her timidity), but it would have been nice to see what ideas they were toying with.

What bothers me most about Ghost Island is that I don't even think Dom and Wendell were THAT entertaining.  I can get the attention being focused on someone like Russell, Coach, or Rob, but the only thing those two had going for them was that they won (and of course are the only people in Survivor history who had a tie between them at the FTC).  I swear if they were two women in the same situation where the FTC ended in a tie, we wouldn't have seen half of them.  But I forgot all about Wendell when the season was over, and I forget he's even on this current season.  And I barely remember Dom.  Listening to the cast talk about their season in exit interviews made me feel like we missed a lot of fun stuff and character development, and the cast itself actually seemed somewhat entertaining (especially once the stupid Naviti strong mentality died).

[Guest]

On 3/6/2020 at 9:38 PM, Lantern7 said:

Funny115: Spotlight on Katie Collins and her comically oversized glasses. Bonus: shots of her in Tina-related content from The Australian Outback.

Awww, I loved Katie! This was pretty funny.

[peachmangosteen]

13 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Why was Tom so popular?  

I feel like it had to just be because of 9/11 honestly. Also, as has been mentioned, he really was a silver haired fox!

I don't even really remember any specifics about Tom I just know I hated him from jump because I'm predisposed to hate firefighters, especially on reality tv shows lol.

[fishcakes]

The thing about Palau, which I thought was the producers at their shittiest, is that they cast both Tom, a 9/11 firefighter, and Ibrahem, a devout Muslim who brought his prayer rug and apparently prayed five times a day. That was 2004, and 9/11 and its aftermath were still in the news every day. At that time, casting a Muslim contestant in and of itself was going to draw attention; doing it in the same season with someone who was at Ground Zero seemed like they were either hoping the two would get in a big fight that TPTB could play up OR that they would be fine with each other and they could spin that as Mark Burnett: Creating World Peace and Understanding With His Stupid Jungle Show. So the Ulonging was a good thing, if for no other reason that it kept Tom and Ibrahem from ever being on the same tribe and the narrative getting spun in some false and manipulative way.

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

Also, as has been mentioned, he really was a silver haired fox!

Ha, yes. I don't much like Tom, but whenever I look at him, I think, "daaaamn."

 

[tvgoddess]

3 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I feel like it had to just be because of 9/11 honestly. Also, as has been mentioned, he really was a silver haired fox!

I don't even really remember any specifics about Tom I just know I hated him from jump because I'm predisposed to hate firefighters, especially on reality tv shows lol.

Can I ask what you have against firefighters?

[Guest]

53 minutes ago, tvgoddess said:

4 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I feel like it had to just be because of 9/11 honestly. Also, as has been mentioned, he really was a silver haired fox!

I don't even really remember any specifics about Tom I just know I hated him from jump because I'm predisposed to hate firefighters, especially on reality tv shows lol.

Can I ask what you have against firefighters?

I'm guessing this is somehow related to Jace from Big Brother XD

[LadyChatts]

5 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I feel like it had to just be because of 9/11 honestly. Also, as has been mentioned, he really was a silver haired fox!

I don't even really remember any specifics about Tom I just know I hated him from jump because I'm predisposed to hate firefighters, especially on reality tv shows lol.

I was thinking the same thing.  Honestly, I remember Tom as being a hard ass but also thought he was more likable than he was.  Actually, I can't think of any other firefighter I've disliked.  Most I've either liked or were forgettable (the ones on The Amazing Race I usually forget, as the firefighting teams don't tend to fare well on there).  Of course, I have a lot of firefighters and first responders in my family, so I'm biased.  

Quote

  The thing about Palau, which I thought was the producers at their shittiest, is that they cast both Tom, a 9/11 firefighter, and Ibrahem, a devout Muslim who brought his prayer rug and apparently prayed five times a day. That was 2004, and 9/11 and its aftermath were still in the news every day. At that time, casting a Muslim contestant in and of itself was going to draw attention; doing it in the same season with someone who was at Ground Zero seemed like they were either hoping the two would get in a big fight that TPTB could play up OR that they would be fine with each other and they could spin that as Mark Burnett: Creating World Peace and Understanding With His Stupid Jungle Show. So the Ulonging was a good thing, if for no other reason that it kept Tom and Ibrahem from ever being on the same tribe and the narrative getting spun in some false and manipulative way.

I never thought of it like that.  Honestly, when I re-watched Palau, I didn't realize so many people got camera time.  It had been so long since I watched that season that I only remembered Stephenie, Bobby Jon (my second ever Survivor crush), Tom, Katie, and Ian.  And I barely remembered much about Katie other than she finished second.  So I was surprised by all the camera time everyone got.  And I had forgotten about Ibreham being Muslim until I watched again.  I do wonder if that was their motive.  Back then this is when Ghandia got mocked by her tribe for her feelings over Ted grinding on her in the night (after admitting she was a rape survivor).  So yeah, probably a good thing they didn't end up on the same tribe, to provide another black mark in Survivor's history.  

[KimberStormer]

Reasons I think Tom was popular in order of what I think their importance was:

1. He was the Gretchen who won.  Until the hardcore Survivor nerds began to take over the fandom (which I would place post-HvV at least) the majority of people wanted, and expected, the winner to be the best "survivor", and Tom was that.  He had all the skills you could need on a desert island, an undeniable natural leader, and was one of the maybe top 5 challenge beasts the game has ever seen.  None of his win seemed to come from strategy and cunning and lying (as we've heard from a zillion idiot losers in final tribal councils, "it's really easy to win by lying, but I wanted to play with integrity"...) unless you believe that he bullied Ian into giving up.  (Katie bullied Ian into giving up, Tom just rolled with it.)

2. He and Ian had a delightful odd-couple Survivor bromance partnership that went the distance.  People love this.  Earl and Yau-Man, JT and Stephen, even Dom and Wendell.  (They respond less well to pairs of women, but I think that's partly because Survivor seems nearly incapable of portraying two women as equally deserving partners.)

3. He loved the game.  It's very rare to see the level of pure joy at playing that Tom (and Ian) showed; it almost never seemed like it was getting him down at all to be out there starving in the rain.  Incidents like catching the shark he treated not as game accomplishments or even personal growth but rather as living his best life and having an amazing time on the best vacation you could ever hope for.  Positivity breeds positivity.

4. He is very telegenic: sexy to look at, strong and distinctive voice, good narrator, and somewhat surprising in that he seemed older (and therefore in Survivor logic weaker) than the buff young Ulong yet took them to school in every challenge.  If he looked like Fabio (or insert your own favorite extremely hot & muscley model dude here) he would have been less popular, I guarantee, because that surprise element wouldn't be there.

(As for Yau-Man and Dreamz, I am biting my tongue, but pointing towards the Fiji thread where I shared my semi-controversial thoughts.)

[SVNBob]

1 minute ago, KimberStormer said:

Reasons I think Tom was popular in order

One more reason I think you should add to your list, and I'd be interested to see where it falls.  He was willing to go to Rocks to try to take back control of the game when Katie flipped to Jenn (RIP) and Gregg's F3.  He and Ian were banking on Katie's self-interest to kick in and for her to flip back before rocks were drawn, but they were both ready to take the chance if she didn't.

That was the first time we saw the threat of a Rock Draw weaponized in Survivor, and Tom basically came up with that plan.

[KimberStormer]

That feels to me like a reason he'd be popular now (with the hardcore nerds), but not back when he played?  I'm not sure people had really worked out the implications of the rock-draw-as-strategy, maybe until it actually happened in Blood Vs Water?  Or maybe when Cochran chickened out in South Pacific people started thinking about it more (prompted by their sense that Cochran was a twerp, and being less willing to give Coach the credit for flipping him than if it had been someone more respectable?)  Sort of like Cao Boi's Plan Voodoo, I'm not sure Tom & Ian got the credit they deserved at the time.

[peachmangosteen]

17 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Of course, I have a lot of firefighters and first responders in my family, so I'm biased.  

Same, but I’m biased the other way because of it lol. My dad is a retired disabled firefighter and most of my uncles on his side worked as cops so I’ve been around firefighters/EMTs/ cops my whole life and most of them sucked lol. (@tvgoddess) But also, yes, that one firefighter from an early BB season really put me off them on reality tv so you are right about that @tracyscott76! I can’t remember any firefighters (or cops) on reality tv that I’ve really loved.

6 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

He is very telegenic: sexy to look at, strong and distinctive voice ...

I forgot about his voice. It was sexy as hell lol. And now I’m off to the Fiji thread to read your Yau-Man/Dreamz thoughts.

[AncientNewbie]

On 3/6/2020 at 4:28 PM, Hera said:

 

Honestly, all of this is an argument in favor of showing everyone and against letting one or two personalities completely dominate a season. 

 

I fully admit to being not-smart, but years after giving up on Big Brother because the show had little relation to what actually happened on the feeds, it blew my little mind recently when a site made the same note about Survivor. (Minus the feeds, but...you see what I mean, being smarter than me.) We got two series of Russell H. dominating the storyline, because CBS knew people either loved his homespun tough guy character or hated it, but we tuned in regardless to see him triumph or fail. Yet the common view of what happened ignores that the rest of the cast weren't NPCs and were probably actively doing something in the background for that month. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

I can’t remember any firefighters (or cops) on reality tv that I’ve really loved.

Poor Tony 😭 He's trying so hard to make you love him.

[Nashville]

3 hours ago, tracyscott76 said:

Poor Tony 😭 He's trying so hard to make you love him.

[AncientNewbie]

Back so soon because of all the Ben/Michelle/whoever discussion in the S40 ep threads...

I'm of the opinion that a winner is a winner. If you're the one that gets to the end and gets the most votes, it's legitimate. If you didn't make big moves, but flew under the radar next to a dominating personality, you still made it safely to the end. If the jury is bitter and you're the more palatable choice, you've usually done something to be less noxious that the presumed deserving winner didn't do. Or maybe you did nothing and slept in the shelter for 39 days, but didn't offend anyone and didn't get voted out...still accomplished the goal of reaching the end. 

The most questionable for me is Ben, just because the F3 twist was unexpected and he lucked into it, but he also did what he needed to remain in the game until that point. I wonder if the moment of him teaching Denise about idols was partly a reply to the criticism that it was too easy for him to find idols (impliedly by producer interference) as he's noting things like a color not normally found in the underbrush as an indicator. Tina also fits this camp, because Colby went irrational, but even then, she played until the whistle. 

This also touches on the thing I talk about a lot about how Survivor the Game and Survivor the TV Show don't always match up. We get an edited version that looks at big personalities and TV-worthy moments. So sometimes we can't reconcile what we're shown and how people in the game react. 

[Rachel RSL]

A winner is a winner but there are definitely some people who won because they played a great game and others who basically lucked into a win.  I mean, on paper, sure - all wins are equal.  But in reality there are "winners" who aren't even close to the caliber of other players.  Sure, you could say that they earned their win by attaching themselves to a strong player and riding coattails all the way to the victory or by lucking out with a new twist and that's valid.  But it shouldn't come as a surprise that certain winners aren't as respected as others who actually did play a good game.

[Guest]

While I do hold some winning games as more equal than others, I tend to judge winners more on how I feel about them as (edited) people than the quality of their game. Did Parvati play a good game? Yes, but back then I didn't care for her. Was Fabio's game iffy? Yes, but he seemed like a nice guy. So I found Fabio's win more satisfying than Parvati's. If someone played a "passive" game but was interesting (Sandra, for example) then I liked their win; if they were passive AND I found them boring (Vecepia or a certain player on the current season) then I didn't care for their win.

There are exceptions to this rule. Bob was a nice guy, but the people allied with him/voting for him were vile, so I didn't like his win. And EoE Chris - nice guy, but I couldn't get on board with the third person out winning. 

So, I'd say there're as many reasons for liking or disliking a win as there are ways to win.

Edited March 11, 2020 by tracyscott76
Nitpicking my own grammar

[phlebas]

I wondered where she got off too once she left Fox News.

(This article is fairly rude, so be warned if you still have an Elizabeth Filarski poster 🙂 )

https://www.wonkette.com/elizabeth-hasselbeck-confident-power-of-christ-purell-will-exorcise-coronavirus

[fishcakes]

36 minutes ago, phlebas said:

I wondered where she got off too once she left Fox News.

(This article is fairly rude, so be warned if you still have an Elizabeth Filarski poster 🙂 )

https://www.wonkette.com/elizabeth-hasselbeck-confident-power-of-christ-purell-will-exorcise-coronavirus

She is either horrifyingly stupid or in need of prolonged psychiatric treatment. I don't know which and I don't care, but broadcasters need to stop giving her a platform. People are dying at an alarming rate, we have no idea the extent of the current transmissions or how long they will continue, but she thinks prayer and Purell are sufficient.

[AncientNewbie]

6 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

 But it shouldn't come as a surprise that certain winners aren't as respected as others who actually did play a good game.

 

I guess my beef is that "good game" is so highly subjective. People will die on the hill that Hantz was the best player ever, and Brandon never really appealed to me...

[Rachel RSL]

Really? I've literally never seen anyone say that about Russell.  I thought it was fairly obvious that he had literally zero social game (calling people stupid right to their faces, threatening people, etc.) and that's why he lost.

[KimberStormer]

10 hours ago, AncientNewbie said:

 

I guess my beef is that "good game" is so highly subjective.

But that's why we get to argue and that's 90% of the fun!

[simplyme]

10 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Really? I've literally never seen anyone say that about Russell.  I thought it was fairly obvious that he had literally zero social game (calling people stupid right to their faces, threatening people, etc.) and that's why he lost.

Unfortunately, imo, there are a lot of people out there who think Russell played an amazing game and the jury was bitter and that Natalie White did nothing and never should have won.

I would say that compared to some other places I've occasionally wandered, people who post on this site tend to have a bigger belief in the importance of the social game and players moderating the attention they draw instead of Making Big Moves and thus acquiring a giant target. That might be why you haven't seen it mentioned. 

[Rachel RSL]

I mean, I visit other places on the web than this site but *shrug*. It sounds like those people are clearly choosing to ignore the most important aspect of Survivor, which is what Russell did too.

[ProfCrash]

3 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

I mean, I visit other places on the web than this site but *shrug*. It sounds like those people are clearly choosing to ignore the most important aspect of Survivor, which is what Russell did too.

Russell has a lot of fans. I never understood why because he was unwatchable from day one for me. But he has a lot of people who think he should have won his first two seasons and swear by a bitter jury theory to explain both his losses. Remember, he won America's favorite his first season and might have won it his second.

Russell's fandom was great enough that his brother was cast on Big Brother and his nephew was cast on Survivor and brought back for a second season.

So while I can't see what they hell people liked, Russell has/had a solid following.

I think it has something to do with his being such a massive asshole villain and people enjoyed watching that. But I don't get the folks who like Ben (aka Coach), Philip, and other gigantic characters who become the shows sole focus.

[Nashville]

On 3/11/2020 at 2:41 PM, phlebas said:

I wondered where she got off too once she left Fox News.

(This article is fairly rude, so be warned if you still have an Elizabeth Filarski poster 🙂 )

https://www.wonkette.com/elizabeth-hasselbeck-confident-power-of-christ-purell-will-exorcise-coronavirus

I want some of whatever it is she’s smoking.

 

9 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

I mean, I visit other places on the web than this site but *shrug*. It sounds like those people are clearly choosing to ignore the most important aspect of Survivor, which is what Russell did too.

Most likely they are people with exactly the same degree of social acumen as Russell Hantz - which would explain a LOT.

[Rachel RSL]

On 3/12/2020 at 10:41 AM, ProfCrash said:

But he has a lot of people who think he should have won his first two seasons and swear by a bitter jury theory to explain both his losses.

And yet I bet those are the same people who claim that Rob deserved to lose All-Stars because jury management is part of the social game and it's his own fault if the jury was bitter. 🙄

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

And yet I bet those are the same people who claim that Rob deserved to lose All-Stars because jury management is part of the social game and it's his own fault if the jury was bitter. 🙄

I'd be willing to bet the opposite, actually. Even though Rob and Russell are very, very different and Rob >>>>>>>>>>>>> Russell in almost every possible way, I would think that people who admire Russell's in-your-face, "active" play over Natalie and Sandra's more social, "passive" play, would also prefer Rob's more active game to Amber's, and feel like both Rob and Russell were robbed (or russelled, har-har).

But these are generalizations, so probably both are true, to some extent. And are Russell fans even still mobilized to any great degree? I know that there are many who still rhapsodize about the likes of Ozzy and Malcolm, but I didn't know Russell still had a large following.

[AncientNewbie]

I do sort of miss Ozzy. There was something reliable about how he'd continually snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Made for soothing watching. 

Edited March 13, 2020 by AncientNewbie

[Rachel RSL]

lol Ozzy.  His social game was almost as bad as Russell's, just not as in-your-face rude.