S06.E14: Sex, Lies & Facials

[ryebread]

I hate Carole but even if I didn't already hate her, I would have rooted for Aviva to suddenly stop bidding and leave Carole with the overpriced dress. If this wasn't for charity I think I'd be done with Carole. That was the one saving grace for her actions. She's just so awful and petty and uninteresting but she refuses to acknowledge it! She thinks she's fabulous and all her attempts at self-deprecation never feel genuine. She's that girl who is insecure who makes self-deprecating comments so people will contradict her. While she lacks confidence in that sense, she's also smug and prideful enough that she doesn't really believe the things she says about herself. 

Yes!  There's a show called 'Storage Wars' and this guy constantly drives up the bids against his frenemies.  It's not even for charity, it's just to be a dick.  And he revels in it.  I'm happy that the charity benefitted from Carole's game but her TH about that day sealed the deal for me.  Carole is a dick.

[quaintirene]

I've always (or at least mostly) liked Kelly.  Scary Island apart, she seemed to be a very involved mom who actually gave a little bit of thought to the effect her actions had on her girls.  I realize that posing nekkid for Playboy isn't exactly gonna go down well at the next PTA meeting.  But in general she was more circumspect in her behaviour.  I liked how her kids were expected to be and were well-mannered.  (I'm looking at you Alex and Simon!)  And I liked how her oldest kid was allowed to be a bit chunky and it didn't seem to be an issue for her or her mom, which was refreshing.  (I'm looking at you, Jill Zarin!)   I'm not suggesting that Kelly is someone I'd want to be pals with.  And I got to be so tired of hearing about her wonderful wonderful talented amazing ex-husband and the status she got through being associated with him.  But in general I prefer her to most of the other witches.

[MMLEsq]

And then there was Luanne telling everyone that Aviva said Avery's painting was phallic. No, she didn't. That wouldn't even make sense. It's a figure drawing. She said it was sexual. And it is, with the figure drawing containing other naked figures Gatsby eyes style. Or like the figures from the Dali photo in the Silence of the Lambs poster. Side note: really not that impressed with Avery's art.

 

Honestly, I think that either Luanne is lying about not having invited Miss USA or that someone involved didn't invite her or the RHONYC production team invited her. How could Aviva have invited Miss USA? That makes no sense. It was a weird thing to start.

I think you meant Victoria, not Avery (Avery is Ramona's daughter).

 

I didn't think Luann was lying.  My guess -- supported by no facts; it's just my hunch -- is that "Production" invited Miss USA -- maybe at the request of Aviva (who then could later state, with technical accuracy, that she (Aviva herself) didn't invite Miss USA) or because Production had planned to film additional scenes with Miss USA at Aviva's house, but those scenes didn't make it into the show.  IMO, it's just too much of a coincidence that Miss USA was at Aviva's house and then shows up at this event. 

[motorcitymom65]

Like someone else mentioned above, I never believe the gals who say they didn't watch the show, and think it is strange that they would try to pass this story off. Both Yolanda and Carlton on the BH series swore they never watched the show before they came on, although Yo admitted at her first reunion that she had since watched a few episodes and wished she would have done so before she started the gig.  Heather on the OC show said she hadn't watched the show before, but did catch up on I believe the prior season before accepting the job.

 

I don't ever remember hearing Carole say she hadn't watched the show.  On one of the early episodes this season when she was arguing with Aviva, Aviva used one of Kelly's lines from the Scary Island Season, and Carole pointed out that it had first been said by Kelly.  Clearly she watched that season, or she heard about it. I also didn't take the fact that Carole was polite to Kelly to be any type of a signal that Carole is going to start hanging out with her. Carole's background in TV news gives her an additional depth of knowledge of the editing process.  Really, TV news is not that different from a reality show. There is no script, and folks can edit a story to say pretty much what they want it to say. Carole would know this and might just be a bit more weary of buying into a person's character based solely on what edited footage we see.  I certainly believe that Kelly was about the looniest person every to be on a Reality Show, but I think it just shows that Carole is pretty smart and would want to judge someone for herself.  All she said was that she enjoyed talking with her and it was nice that she showed a bit of interest in her career. Hardly an endorsement of Kelly's mental health. 

[ScoobieDoobs]

All she said was that she enjoyed talking with her and it was nice that she showed a bit of interest in her career. Hardly an endorsement of Kelly's mental health.

 

And just why did she enjoy talking to Kells so much?  Cuz Kells was smooching her butt & telling her how great her book is?  Oh, c'mon now, as if Kells could actually read a book -- hee, hee, hee!  I think Carole just luvs, luvs, luvs having her butt smooched.  Hmmmm, she ain't so different than the Moaner, is she?

Edited June 16, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[FozzyBear]

I'm really into Devious Maids and I think it would be great to have a show that isn't about vacuous ladies who don't do anything (the intelligent, career women we could be watching would never be on a reality show). However, the problem is always that the vacuous, rich women are the ones who own the homes. Thus we get Bravo trying to a locale or a focus where we can actually see "normal" people. So we get Below Deck, Eat, Drink, Love, and Vanderpump Rules. I watched EDL in my post Princesses: LI haze but I can't deal with the other two. A spa or nail salon would be a good idea in theory but I feel like it would just end up being so low rent and terrible. I don't want to see them fighting amongst themselves over stupid nonsense. I want to see them gossiping about their clients.

Apparently you're not allowed to mention production or the fact that you're on a TV show but I think the understanding was that the pieces would be shown during the episode and then they'd get further exposure if the show filmed at Aviva's house. Yeah, it's stupid to have an "art party" like that but that's because most people aren't filming a reality show at their cocktail parties.

I hate Carole but even if I didn't already hate her, I would have rooted for Aviva to suddenly stop bidding and leave Carole with the overpriced dress. If this wasn't for charity I think I'd be done with Carole. That was the one saving grace for her actions. She's just so awful and petty and uninteresting but she refuses to acknowledge it! She thinks she's fabulous and all her attempts at self-deprecation never feel genuine. She's that girl who is insecure who makes self-deprecating comments so people will contradict her. While she lacks confidence in that sense, she's also smug and prideful enough that she doesn't really believe the things she says about herself.

I learned a looooong time ago to avoid people who enjoy "having a little fun" at the expense of others. It's one of my biggest red flags, up there with people who take pride in being a bitch, anyone who overused the word disrespect, and anyone who says that I'm either going to love them or hate them.

Yeah, and it's that kind of thing that gave me such a bad first impression of her. After S1 I thought that underneath it all Carol was probably just as nasty a piece of work as anyone who has ever been in the show. Having a little fun, were we? God Carol, it's all just a mirror isn't it? The whole fucking world. It's all just your mirror.

[shoegal]

I think Carole just luvs, luvs, luvs having her butt smooched.

 

 

 

I don't find that to be an odd thing, or something specific to Carole.  I kinda thought that people in general were favorable to getting their ass kissed. 

 

Kelly was nice to Carole, Carole seemed pleased that Kelly was nice.  Shocking. 

[LovetoSnark]

 

 

I didn't think Luann was lying.  My guess -- supported by no facts; it's just my hunch -- is that "Production" invited Miss USA -- maybe at the request of Aviva (who then could later state, with technical accuracy, that she (Aviva herself) didn't invite Miss USA) or because Production had planned to film additional scenes with Miss USA at Aviva's house, but those scenes didn't make it into the show.  IMO, it's just too much of a coincidence that Miss USA was at Aviva's house and then shows up at this event. 

I agree with you. I think Miss USA was miked--- it looked that way to me--- and you could hear her . I also think that she signed one of the Bravo releases hoping to get some TV face time and cannot do anything about the "crap-fest" that Aviva bestowed upon her--- at least to Bravo.

I would love it if she sued the crap out of Aviva for slander.

 

IMO, Georgie Pervert until recently seemed to bring great chuckles to King Cohen. I think production planned the whole damn thing. IMO she was invited by Bravo to appear on Rhony and fit right into the perversion story line of George--- if George could get one beautiful young girl --- he could get 2.  Did Aviva know ? She may not have asked her --- but I bet she knew. Aviva was to ready to spread the gossip. As far as Aviva swearing on her leg crap--- didn't George swear before on the leg when it came to the Sonya/erection crap?

Somewhere I thought I read that Aviva and scumbag George met Miss USA at a party that Jill Zarin was hosting.

Edited June 16, 2014 by LovetoSnark

[ScoobieDoobs]

Kelly was nice to Carole, Carole seemed pleased that Kelly was nice.  Shocking.

 

 

How or why would it be shocking?  Not shocking at all, but when you just wanna have your butt smooched it blinds you to what people are like.  Guess I just thought Carole was way off if she's supposed to be the experienced investigative journalist she always claims to be.  Carole thought Kells was normal & nice.  Kelly is neither one of those.  She's a lunatic & she's a horrible snob & she's nasty as hell.  She showed her true colors in her treatment of Alex.  But she ain't gonna act that way with Carole cuz Carole is connected to famous people & she wanted to kiss up to her.  

 

It's just like when the Moaner was luving Veevs cuz she was acting like such a butt smooching phony with her.  Yeah & Veevs is a nice gal, right?  Er, don't think so.  She was acting like such a phony baloney (usual crap for her) only to butt smooch the Moaner.  No, butt smooching isn't shocking in the least -- ever.  Just annoying & phony as fuck.

Edited June 16, 2014 by ScoobieDoobs

[jaync]

Kelly was nice to Carole, Carole seemed pleased that Kelly was nice.  Shocking.

Yeah, I'm not understanding what was expected of Carole in that scene. Was she supposed to run in horror upon meeting Kelly, just because Kelly flew her nutbag flag a few years ago?

[motorcitymom65]

And just why did she enjoy talking to Kells so much?  Cuz Kells was smooching her butt & telling her how great her book is?  Oh, c'mon now, as if Kells could actually read a book -- hee, hee, hee!  I think Carole just luvs, luvs, luvs having her butt smooched.  Hmmmm, she ain't so different than the Moaner, is she?

There could be a bit of that.  Who doesn't love to have their work appreciated? Would it have been better for Carole to tell her she is a nutcase and refuse to speak with her? I am often polite to folks that I secretly think are nuts. Is this unusual?

 

The difference to me is that Aviva was horrible to Ramona - really horrible (although I had no issue with it at all.  Ramona and Sonja are white trash, so I was rooting Aviva on when she said as much. I am fine with it being repeated during each episode.  As the matter of fact I would prefer it). Despite Aviva saying something that Ramona considered to be hurtful, all she had to do was tell Ramona that she looked pretty and all was forgiven. She didn't have to appreciate her work or her character, just tell her she looked good. I don't believe that Kelly has ever said or done anything specifically ugly to Carole that should mean that she would do anything except be nice to her in that moment.

Edited June 16, 2014 by motorcitymom65

[quaintirene]

 

IMO, Georgie Pervert until recently seemed to bring great chuckles to King Cohen.

Until recently?  Has George managed to piss off his patron?  (Please please please!)  

 

Actually I have come up with what I think is an ingenious hell for those two, should they end up that way.  A beautiful cocktail lounge.  Well-appointed but unfortunately no alcohol.  Where they both have to sit for eternity listening to each other's highly-detailed sex stories.  On and on and on.  Each as disgusted and appalled as the other as I'm certain Andy has as much interest in women as George has in men.  For ever and ever world without end amen.

[FozzyBear]

Carol didn't like having her work appreciated when she first met Aviva. Of course she wasn't wearing sexy hot-pants at the charity lunch. Maybe you can only appreciate Carol's talent when there aren't any men around that she would rather be talking to.

[Midnight Cheese]

I don't see Alex as a victim of Kelly at all, including the 'icing out' conversation; I think it's a very silly exaggeration to act like that was a threat let alone a Mafia-style threat.  All of these women have played the game from ep 1 season 1 about what things they'll show for, which fellow Hos they'll support at their events.  Alex's awkward, painful attempts at social climbing, her fake intellectual posturing and her guffawing 'finding her voice' would be off-putting to many people, not just Kelly.  Alex is no saint.  The people who were completely snobby about Alex were LuAnn, Bethenny and Ramona. 

[jaync]

I'm from a generation who still valued and connected sex with love and meaning.

I don't think that's exclusive to any one generation. Anyway, who's to say that Sonja doesn't love the sex she has, and that it's not meaningful to her?

[shoegal]

How or why would it be shocking?  Not shocking at all, but when you just wanna have your butt smooched it blinds you to what people are like.  Guess I just thought Carole was way off if she's supposed to be the experienced investigative journalist she always claims to be.  Carole thought Kells was normal & nice.  Kelly is neither one of those.  She's a lunatic & she's a horrible snob & she's nasty as hell.  She showed her true colors in her treatment of Alex.  But she ain't gonna act that way with Carole cuz Carole is connected to famous people & she wanted to kiss up to her

 

 

 

That was sarcasm.  It's not shocking that you might find someone nice if they are nice to you.  I don't believe that Carole needed to do any investigating, she had a superficial encounter with a woman that she doesn't know and doesn't need to know, it was pleasant and Carole stated as such.   It's not like she declared that she and Kelly are now besties and Kelly is going to be her new roommate and they will live side by side for all eternity eating gummy bears and frolicking with Al Sharpton.

Carol didn't like having her work appreciated when she first met Aviva. Of course she wasn't wearing sexy hot-pants at the charity lunch. Maybe you can only appreciate Carol's talent when there aren't any men around that she would rather be talking to.

 

Actually, Carole did like having her work appreciated by Aviva, and said as much.   Aviva just kept droning on, and Carole wanted to move on.  I don't really blame her, say that you appreciate the book or that it was moving to you, whatever, but getting in to the specifics of Anthony finding the tumor in his abdomen or the birthday present he bought for her but she didn't get until after he was dead, and yeah, maybe I might want to move on to a lighter topic of discussion.  I can't blame Carole for that, or for wanting to talk to available men.  Or really, anyone other than Aviva.

Edited June 16, 2014 by shoegal

[aradia22]

 

I think you meant Victoria, not Avery (Avery is Ramona's daughter).

Oops, sorry! I only started watching last season so I haven't seen much of the kids (and frankly can't be bothered to care too much). 

[Souvlaki]

Sing. If Sonja were a man, she'd be lauded as a stud, or a playboy. Also, LuAnn runs in the same peen circles (even whilst planning a baby with her boyfriend), yet she isn't considered a "slut" and/or "spiralling out of control".

 

Loved Sitako spilling the tea. I had Kristen-face when the Russ/Sonja gossip dropped, and don't even care if it was made up or not. More, please.

 

Notice LuAnn didn't deny that she likes to dominate her men, just that they're not small.

 

What was the point of Kelly returning for one scene?

 

I loved that scene with Sitako for the pure absurdity, until she got to the alleged Russ Tryst which just made her look like shit, true or not, and "her" being our Messy Miss Morgan, because it seemed obvious to me that this Facialist had been fed this gossip about Sonja from Sonja herself.  Also kinda wasn't digging watching Sitako cheerfully ruining her rep to accomplish nothing if only to make a parody of herself, but whatever thrills ya for a dollar, sug.  Sonja and Aviva conspiring these similar wacky tryst stories without regard for the reputation or harm done to a voiceless third party seems quite a coincidental move to me, just gonna ponder on that. 

 

I do have quite the picture in my head right now of Luanne swatting down a group of tiny miniature Napoleans attempting to climb up her leg; her and Carol discussing it was an enjoyeable interaction, I'm really glad they get along now.  The way Luanne repeated the gossip about herself had me laughing like crazy for some reason.  Bonus points for her gorgeous blouse, pleading the 5th on the earrings though - loved Carole's little denim and skirt combo with the boots, Kristin, pretty sure I know your boobs a bit too well by now. 

 

I'm thinking Carol did what I would - she no doubt seems the 'researcher' type to me and I think likely knew a few things on Kelly, but decided to be cordial to her, who was acting cordial back, drop assumption (which she DIDN'T do last season with Luanne, imo treated her quite coldly & never gave her a chance) and I mean, if someone was being nice to me, I would say MY experience was they seemed nice, it was a simple conversation, nice time, I don't recall their meeting having to do with any investigative journalism, even though it's her work, sure, she was off the clock.  Reputation riding is lazy too, imo, especially on a franchise that aims to seemingly like showcasing and maximizing the flaws and stumbles of these women. I didn't Carole clueless, I found her sensible.   And I like Luanne more now if her continuing friendship with Kelly is in fact real, I don't know enough to say, but if so it tells me her loyalties to friendships she's had on the show don't just turn off when the camera does.

 

I'm no Kelly fan, but her mental breakdown was not fun to see replayed again.  I hope she's in a healthier place now.

Edited June 16, 2014 by Souvlaki

[kassa]

I think anybody who signs up for a reality show and goes in without researching the overt behaviors of fellow castmates is a fool.  However, I think Kelly was gone for a few years, wasn't she?  I remember the "up here/down there" conversation, and I remember the discussion in the cab at Crazy island about how awful junk food is and then in the next breath how great gummi bears are, and I remember the dinner time breakdown.  But frankly even knowing that I would be able to greet her pleasantly and exchange small talk at a charity event.

 

I'm not acquainted with NYC rich people charity events, but at the auction held for a club I belong to there's a lot of driving the price up on stuff you don't necessarily want.  Of course you leave yourself open to being stuck with it, but that's considered part of the fun.  Carole may have been being a bitch about it, but if Aviva had dropped out to spite her I'm sure Carole would have paid good naturedly.

 

 

For example, Luanne is saying that Aviva was telling everyone the rumor about Miss USA. Aviva pointed out that she only told Heather. Heather says Aviva told her to pass it around. Really, it seems like Heather asked if she could and Aviva said fine.

 

 

I don't think it stopped there -- they didn't pass it around, giggle, and completely drop the subject.  I suspect it launched a whole discussion of when where who what and why.  I think gossip sites reported the charity event fight at the time - the Countess was NOT happy in real time. 

 

I suspect most of us have heard a joke or something and been prompted to share it at an impolite time and said "I'll tell you after," directing your attention back to the person who's speaking.  It's a skill your parents teach you when you're a child.  On the other hand, didn't a drunken LouAnn really make a scene at an early season event in a similar fashion?  Or am I misremembering?

[OhGromit]

Your point (which I agree with) raises another thought in my mind -- Sonja didn't just leave Kristen hanging when she strolled in late from her date from the night before -- she also must have known that she'd be arriving home to find Production there to capture her "walk of shame" on film. 

 

Such a great point.  Sonja orchestrated it all, the message of the scene being SONJA WANTS YOU TO KNOW SHE IS STILL DESIRED BY MEN.  Her running narrative being, "Look at me, I'm still very desirable!  I'm desired by the guy from last night so much he ripped my dress of!  See here where he ripped my dress off!  OMG and Russ flirted with me [cut to St. Barth's video.... no he didn't, honey], and I f*cked him, and that proves I'm even more desirable than Carole, the other single Howife!!  Even my dog desires me, see how he tongues my lipglossed lips while I smile coquettishly!"  

Edited June 16, 2014 by OhGromit

[ScoobieDoobs]

I'm no Kelly fan, but her mental breakdown was not fun to see replayed again.  I hope she's in a healthier place now.

 

Sheesh, that was nasty as hell.  Andy Cohen's nasty streak knows no bounds, eh?  Hey, I'm far from a Kelly fan, but it was exceptionally cruel to bring that shit up, just so Andy could give Kelly a good hard kick in the face -- or possibly get a chuckle from viewers at Kelly's expense.  Not that I feel sorry for Kelly for 1 second.  Kells is so fuckin' deluded, she probably won't even care or acknowledge what a lunatic she looked like.  

 

Look, I may not like Kelly & maybe she is stupid enough not to understand the producers are totally mocking her.  But I really can't stand watching when these asshole producers treat everyone with so much contempt & cruelty -- well, except for Veevs & George -- er, and maybe the Moaner too.

[tulip555]

Sheesh, that was nasty as hell.  Andy Cohen's nasty streak knows no bounds, eh?  Hey, I'm far from a Kelly fan, but it was exceptionally cruel to bring that shit up, just so Andy could give Kelly a good hard kick in the face -- or possibly get a chuckle from viewers at Kelly's expense.  Not that I feel sorry for Kelly for 1 second.  Kells is so fuckin' deluded, she probably won't even care or acknowledge what a lunatic she looked like.  

 

Look, I may not like Kelly & maybe she is stupid enough not to understand the producers are totally mocking her.  But I really can't stand watching when these asshole producers treat everyone with so much contempt & cruelty -- well, except for Veevs & George -- er, and maybe the Moaner too.

Was Kelly's breakdown ever really explained as being an actual psychiatric illness or was she on drugs?

[Grneyedldy]

Was Kelly's breakdown ever really explained as being an actual psychiatric illness or was she on drugs?

You mean her "breakthrough"? No, it was never explained. I think it was alcohol and stress related and not a breakdown. I also think I'm in the minority on that thought.

I would pay big bucks to see the rest of the Scary Island footage. Easy money, Bravo. Please!

[tulip555]

You mean her "breakthrough"? No, it was never explained. I think it was alcohol and stress related and not a breakdown. I also think I'm in the minority on that thought.

I would pay big bucks to see the rest of the Scary Island footage. Easy money, Bravo. Please!

Thank you very much for your response....yeah, forgot about the "breakthrough", LOL.  I would pay big bucks for that as well....would be very interesting.

[poppygibson]

I like Heather too, but she has a severe case of man-face.

Have you ever noticed her hands? They are very...'capable' looking too.

[zoeysmom]

You mean her "breakthrough"? No, it was never explained. I think it was alcohol and stress related and not a breakdown. I also think I'm in the minority on that thought.

I would pay big bucks to see the rest of the Scary Island footage. Easy money, Bravo. Please!

Kelly is kind of interesting.  To this day she still seems to think the viewers want to watch her go through daily routine and be enthralled.  I always got the impression that Kelly was convinced if she went to St. John's it would be just one long photo shoot for her.  It was apparent someone had made Kelly some sort of guarantees  that if she went she would not be expected to be involved with Bethenny drama.  Think again Kelly. 

 

Since Kelly was coming off her sentencing for the assault on the former fiancé, I always kind of thought she utilize to use some newly learnd coping tools and nothing was working for her.  I too would like to see the lost footage.  At this point I think there might be some interesting footage of both Bethenny and Kelly that might be interesting.

 

Kelly always seems so isolated to me.  When she is photographed she is never with anyone but her children.  I never thought booze played into the equation.

[FozzyBear]

You mean her "breakthrough"? No, it was never explained. I think it was alcohol and stress related and not a breakdown. I also think I'm in the minority on that thought.

I would pay big bucks to see the rest of the Scary Island footage. Easy money, Bravo. Please!

I agree it was something like that although I'm inclined to believe it was withdrawl. I think she was taking something recreational and either didn't bring it with her or didn't bring enough and spent half the trip jonesing.

[MatildaMoody]

 

I agree it was something like that although I'm inclined to believe it was withdrawl. I think she was taking something recreational and either didn't bring it with her or didn't bring enough and spent half the trip jonesing.

I always wondered about that. I just remember Sonja constantly saying that Kelly's room on the boat smelled like Cat Pee. And, there was some discussion about whether Kelly was smoking something like Meth. I know nothing about Meth but there were people on the internet swearing that it smelled like cat pee -GROSS. 

[quaintirene]

A reasonably reliable source told me she was doing a lot of drugs on that boat and had flipped right out a lot more than was shown.  The production crew was very concerned and basically insisted she leave.  What we saw was the tip of the iceberg is what I heard...

[FozzyBear]

A reasonably reliable source told me she was doing a lot of drugs on that boat and had flipped right out a lot more than was shown. The production crew was very concerned and basically insisted she leave. What we saw was the tip of the iceberg is what I heard...

I'm surprised they didn't fire her right then and there. Bringing illegal drugs into another country is a very serious crime. Depending on the laws of that country the entire cast could have been facing criminal charges if she was caught. If that is true I probably would have refused to film with her anymore. There is no amount of Bravo money that would make me want to face trafficking charges. Jesus and she was what? 42 when this happened. I'm so with Bethany on this. What a dumb, selfish bitch.

[quaintirene]

FozzyBear, I don't know that the drugs were illegal.  I was just told drugs.  There are lots of prescription medications she could have been abusing.  

[CatMomma]

 

Yeah, is Sonja acting like a free spirit?  Or just plain sleazy -- and a continual embarrassment to her daughter?  My vote is for sleazy -- sleazy as hell, if ya ask me.

 

Exactly. I'm all for letting your freak flag fly, if that's your thing.  Sonja is constantly drunk, catty, and behaves erratically.  This isn't about a double standard.  I don't think people would see a man behaving the way Sonja has and think, "Wow, what a stud."  They would think he has some problems.

 

For me, it's not about her having sex.  Get you some, girl.  It's her destructive behavior, both with herself and others.

[FozzyBear]

FozzyBear, I don't know that the drugs were illegal. I was just told drugs. There are lots of prescription medications she could have been abusing.

True. I guess I can just totally see Kelly as being the type of pampered, spoiled, self-centered party girl who would take some coke or meth with her on vacation without ever thinking of the consequences. I never could stand her, but Carol had said she likes them pretty and weird so there you go...

[ryebread]

Not a huge fan of Kelly or Gretchen but watching Bethenny and Tamra tormenting those two when they were incapacitated (on Scary Island and at the Naked Wasted Dinner Party) was the lowest behavior from any of the Hos I'd ever seen.  Those situations are why Bethenny or Tamra can piss off forever as far as I'm concerned. 

 

There's nothing Andy can pull out of his bag of edit tricks to ever redeem those two hags for me.

[imjagain]

Watching Kelly on season 2 she is so odd and drugs make sense. And on scary island it really does seem like she was abusing some drugs and had a mental breakdown. I haven't watched it in a while but I might soon. Kelly is just hard to watch, even before scary island she was so awkward.

[MatildaMoody]

 

Not a huge fan of Kelly or Gretchen but watching Bethenny and Tamra tormenting those two when they were incapacitated (on Scary Island and at the Naked Wasted Dinner Party) was the lowest behavior from any of the Hos I'd ever seen.

 

Bethenny didn't torment Kelly. Kelly kept randomly attacking Bethenny even when Bethenny wasn't talking to her. Bethenny and Sonja having a conversation and suddenly Kelly is saying that Bethenny is not a nice person and puts others down to make herself feel bad. Sonja says Kelly should have a one night stand and Kelly says I'm not a hobag like Bethenny, and Bethenny even laughed it off as a joke. 

Even earlier, Ramona was trying to give her condolences to Bethenny and Kelly attacked her for that. Anytime anyone was nice to Bethenny or tried to simply talk with Bethenny about something, Kelly was all over it. 

If you watch that trip, you will see that the only times that Kelly was having fun was when the conversation was about her. If it was about anyone else, she wasn't interested. If it was about Bethenny she was on the attack.

What's funny is that Bethenny and Kelly had made peace and agreed to move on civilly before they even went on the trip.

Edited to add: I guess the gift bag that Bethenny gave Kelly was pretty horrific. I mean it made Kelly break down and cry on the bed. So, if that was what you meant by tormenting her, I can see it. 

Edited June 17, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[Satchels of gold]

Don't forget those knives that Bethenny had on her tongue.

[ryebread]

I guess the gift bag that Bethenny gave Kelly was pretty horrific. I mean it made Kelly break down and cry on the bed. So, if that was what you meant by tormenting her, I can see it.

 

LOL.  You're killin' me with the sarcasm, Mat.  Of course I didn't mean the gift bags, silly - I thought those were really nice.  I'm talking about Bethenny, continuing to poke someone who has a mental illness.  Whether WE believe Kelly truly was mentally ill is a moot point.  What matters, to me anyway, is that BETHENNY said she knew all along that Kelly was crazy and on the edge of a break but continued to antagonize.  Yeah, yeah, Kelly poked back but Bethenny going after Kelly in that state was like a rabid pitbull going after that spinning dog, Coconut, on Shahs of Sunset.

 

ETA:

Don't forget those knives that Bethenny had on her tongue.

Yup.  Kelly was clearly off her rocker. 

Edited June 18, 2014 by ryebread

[RedheadZombie]

Don't forget those knives that Bethenny had on her tongue.

Hadn't she tried many times to kill Kelly as well?

[motorcitymom65]

Bethenny didn't torment Kelly. Kelly kept randomly attacking Bethenny even when Bethenny wasn't talking to her. 

Matilda, I remember it exactly as you do. To me it never seemed like Bethenny was attacking Kelly, it just seemed like she was at times trying to keep up. I may be remembering it wrong, but one thing that always sticks out to me is that Bethenny's father had just died. I know they were not close and had a rocky relationship, but it was complicated and intense in it's own way. I seem to remember Kelly making light of his death and acting like it wasn't a big deal - like folks die every day, so what was the problem really? She just seemed to completely have it in for Bethenny at every single turn. Maybe she was mentally unhinged, but I don't think I would have been able to tolerate basically being called a whore on TV, or having my culinary credentials questioned ("you're a cook, not a chef") over and over again. To Bethenny, her work was pretty much her life, and this complete piece of shit refused to stop taunting her and minimizing her work. Mental illness or not, I would have ripped off her head and shit down her neck. 

 

I have always believed the drugs deal. If she was that mentally ill, how would she have pulled it together so well for the next season? One other issue I had with her was the retelling of events that occurred when she met with Lu and Jill to give them the low-down. She just completely made shit up, as she did when she talked about it at the reunion.  She never took one single bit of ownership for any of her behavior, which is the most shocking part of it all. Even the craziest of ho'wives (I'm looking at you Aviva) tend to reflect a bit when they see the actual footage and take some responsibility for their part in the drama. She never did to my knowledge.

 

There are many things I hope that Andy talks about when his days at Bravo are over. I hope that he tells us exactly what went down with Jill and just how much he dislikes her (or doesn't). I hope he tells what they knew or suspected about Teresa and Juicy and their life of crime. I hope he tells us exactly how the deal with Adrienne and the surrogacy played out. More than anything, I hope he exposes just exactly what went down with Kelly on Scary Island.  This is inside scoop I would pay to learn more about. 

Edited June 18, 2014 by motorcitymom65

[LilaFowler]

Bethenny never attacked Kelly on that trip.  She defended herself when Kelly would randomly insult and attack her (cook versus chef-gate, totebag-gate).  I'm by no means a Bethenny fan--never was--but to suggest that she was antagonizing Kelly to the point that she flipped out is just inaccurate.  Kelly came at her with a vengeance right from the start.   Bethenny had just buried her father and was pregnant and wasn't even paying attention to her until she started in (called her a hoebag at one point, too). 

[ghoulina]

I'm talking about Bethenny, continuing to poke someone who has a mental illness.  Whether WE believe Kelly truly was mentally ill is a moot point.  What matters, to me anyway, is that BETHENNY said she knew all along that Kelly was crazy and on the edge of a break but continued to antagonize.  Yeah, yeah, Kelly poked back but Bethenny going after Kelly in that state was like a rabid pitbull going after that spinning dog, Coconut, on Shahs of Sunset.

 

I thought it was completely the other way around - Kelly was poking Bethenny. She called her a slut and a "cook" (not a chef!), just had to keep arguing with her and trying to correct her. I really only saw Bethenny trying to calmly defend herself for most of the trip. I do think she lost it a bit during the dinner and was a bit "mean" when she screamed at Kelly. But I could understand. Kelly may have been mentally unstable or something, but Bethenny was not in a great place herself. She was newly pregnant and her father, who she had a whole host of baggage with, had just died. She just wanted a calm, relaxing trip - but Kelly seemed determined to antagonize her the entire time. So yea, she finally lost it on her. But I do think she realized it and reigned it back in. I think everything that happened to Kelly on that trip she brought upon herself with her behavior. 

[ryebread]

I'm by no means a Bethenny fan--never was--but to suggest that she was antagonizing Kelly to the point that she flipped out is just inaccurate.

I think y'all are misunderstanding me.  I never said Beth antagonized Kelly to the point she flipped out.  Kelly had flipped, probably weeks before the trip.  Bethenny said she KNEW that but kept poking the crazy. 

 

I agree with you, Matilidia and MotorCityMom.  Kelly was attacking all over the place.  Should Beth stand back and let it happen?  No.  But when and if I ever have to deal with a riled up person whom I say I KNOW FOR A FACT is mentally ill, (because Beth said she knew that for a fact prior to the trip)  I'll usually err on the side of caution and step away.  Bethenny didn't. 

 

And then she laughed about it.  The laughing and high fiving about Kelly being crazy or being strung out (which we all seem to  agree on) is what I think was shittier than any behavior Kelly displayed. 

 

If anybody chooses to continue to antagonize someone who is mentally incapacitated via mental illness, drugs or booze, even if they might deserve it, well.....

[Grneyedldy]

Saying someone is bat shit crazy because of their bazaar behavior (Kelly) and being diagnosed with mental illness are two totally different things. Kelly signed up for the show, whether she knew what she was getting into or not. Kelly had no problem dishing it out to Bethenny and Alex because she felt she was better than them. I don't have one single fuck to give regarding Kelly's supposed breakdown and don't blame Bethenny for any of it. Kelly also attacked Bethenny for going on the trip after her father just died and in the same breath told her she (B) was wrong for feeling hurt that her father didn't show her much love during her childhood.

This was a working trip for all the ladies, not just Kelly.

[ryebread]

Kelly may have been mentally unstable or something, but Bethenny was not in a great place herself. She was newly pregnant and her father, who she had a whole host of baggage with, had just died. She just wanted a calm, relaxing trip - but Kelly seemed determined to antagonize her the entire time.

 

The bolded is just one more reason, Beth should have stayed home.  She'd been on bed rest for her high-risk pregnancy.  She left NYC highly distraught to be with her dad, she flew to L.A, dealt with his death and then chose to fly directly to St. John's.  All the while stressed about her pregnancy, work, daddy baggage, wedding planning and who else knows what goes on in her manic brain.  If she wanted a calm, relaxing trip, she should have flown ANYWHERE that didn't include Kelly whom she KNOWS is cuckoo and who we've seen her go round and round with many times. There's no way in hell I would have risked my health and the health of my baby to be around someone I already knows pushes my buttons.  Especially if I'd just had the week Bethenny had. 

[LilaFowler]

These events and trips are built into their Bravo contracts.  They mostly have to attend (unless they suddenly develop asthma and get a doctor's note *cough*).

 

Kelly was attacking all over the place.  Should Beth stand back and let it happen?  No.  But when and if I ever have to deal with a riled up person whom I say I KNOW FOR A FACT is mentally ill, (because Beth said she knew that for a fact prior to the trip)  I'll usually err on the side of caution and step away.  Bethenny didn't.

She couldn't.  They were living together on a boat.  It has been pointed out many times that Bethenny wasn't even bothering with Kelly but Kelly still attacked her. 

 

And then she laughed about it.  The laughing and high fiving about Kelly being crazy or being strung out (which we all seem to  agree on) is what I think was shittier than any behavior Kelly displayed.

That had more to do with the other women finally seeing that side of Kelly.  Up to that point, it appeared Bethenny believed she was the only one who was lucky enough to witness it.  The other women would always say, 'oh, that's just Kelly being Kelly' whenever anyone pointed out questionable behavior.

 

If anybody chooses to continue to antagonize someone who is mentally incapacitated via mental illness, drugs or booze, even if they might deserve it, well.....

They all agreed to basically placate Kelly until the producers got rid of her. No one was antagonizing Kelly on that trip.  Period.  She came ready to fight with people over nothing and if I didn't know better, had decided before she left NYC that she was going to try to ruin the trip for everybody.

[ryebread]

These events and trips are built into their Bravo contracts.  They mostly have to attend (unless they suddenly develop asthma and get a doctor's note *cough*).

 

Andy said that wasn't true.  And I would think he, being Beth's BFF, would excuse her in light of a high risk pregnancy, death in the family, etc.

 

They all agreed to basically placate Kelly until the producers got rid of her. No one was antagonizing Kelly on that trip.  Period.

 

The only period we can be sure of on that trip is that Bethenny wasn't having one.  We didn't see it all so it doesn't matter what either of us believe or not, I suppose. 

[Satchels of gold]

And let us not forget "free to be you and me 1987" whatever the hell that meant. Satches of gold!

[MatildaMoody]

Aside from the "Al Sharpton!" I think my absolute favorite part was when she ran laughing or crying (I couldn't tell) hysterically into the house wearing that satin purple monstrosity of a dress and then calmly walked back out and offered them all candy. I can't help it I am laughing as I type this.

 

That season is the only season of any Housewives Franchise that I loved enough to actually purchase and Scary Island is the reason why.

Edited June 18, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[LilaFowler]

Andy said that wasn't true.  And I would think he, being Beth's BFF, would excuse her in light of a high risk pregnancy, death in the family, etc.

 

The only period we can be sure of on that trip is that Bethenny wasn't having one.  We didn't see it all so it doesn't matter what either of us believe or not, I suppose. 

If they aren't required as part of their participation on the show, then why is Aviva running around with a doctor's note?   

 

What's not to be believed?  That Kelly had an unprovoked meltdown?  Bravo would never miss an opportunity to show Bethenny needling Kelly, but we're supposed to believe that they cut all of that out?  Hmmmm.  Doubt it. 

 

There's just no way to hang Kelly's meltdown on Bethenny, no matter how much you despise her or want it to be that way.  Nope.