S03.E02: Chapter Thirty-Seven: Fortune and Men's Eyes

[The Wild Sow]

21 hours ago, nilyank said:

I think the Innocence Project has better things to do than help a kid from a white, middle class family with an attorney mother who decided to take a deal for a few years in juvie despite getting a mistrial from a hung jury.

Right!  And he wasn't "wrongfully convicted" -- he wasn't "convicted" at ALL.  He PLED GUILTY.

 

4 hours ago, SourK said:

Oh, man. Catching up on two weeks at once. I guess this show already didn't understand high school, or journalism, or contract law, or organized crime, or gangs, or conflict of interest, so it's not totally surprising that it doesn't understand the justice system, but can it not even understand how tattoos work?

I forgot to mention last week, you don't SWIM right after getting a tattoo -- they need about 2 weeks to heal!

[thuganomics85]

Holy shit!  Riverdale Juvie is hardcore to the extreme, huh?!  It's pretty much full-fledge Shawshank Redemption with the shivs, gangs, brutal guards, and the corrupt warden whose cast description pretty much had to read "someone like Bob Gunton, but not the actual Bob Gunton, because we can't actually afford Bob Gunton."  I shudder to imagine what Riverdale's adult prison must be like!

Of all the preposterous things to happen in this episode, the most is that not a single Vixen had a phone to record the guards clearly attacking defenseless teenage prisoners unprovoked.  Or is Hiram just so powerful now that everyone knows it wouldn't matter, anyway?

Fun seeing Eli Goree a.k.a. Wells from the first season of The 100, as Mad Dog.

Uh, Veronica?  Cheryl?  Does the Innocence Project even work if the person actually pled guilty? 

Meanwhile, Jughead and Betty seem to have gotten themselves into a bizarre Dungeons & Dragons knock-off game that has gotten mixed into an actual deadly cult.  Ethel's involved too.  And it just happens to be connected to pretty much all of the main characters' parents.  Should be fun!

Sometimes, you can almost just hear the writers pitching ways to get the cast to show skin:

Writer 1: "OK, so where should we have Veronica confront Cheryl about the president thing.  The hallways?  Pops?"

Writer 2: "How about in the locker room, so we can get Madelaine Petsch in her underwear, again?  Maybe toss in Ashleigh Murray too, since we still can't figure out what we want to do with Josie."

Writer 1: "Brilliant!  That's why they pay you the big bucks!  Now, onto Archie!  Do we even need K.J. Apa to wear a shirt anymore..."

This show is just so fucking nuts!  But I can't stop watching it!  It's somehow both stupid but brilliant at the same time.  I want more!

[rmontro]

7 hours ago, SourK said:

Maybe the guards took their cell phones at the same time they gave them permission to do a cheer routine on prison property?

If they were there with permission, why grant them permission to be there at all, considering the plan to beat down the "riot"?

But that whole musical number cheer routine, complete with the guys hanging on the fence, was pretty hilarious.  Veronica even had time to fit in a fight with her father in between verses.

6 hours ago, The Wild Sow said:

Right!  And he wasn't "wrongfully convicted" -- he wasn't "convicted" at ALL.  He PLED GUILTY.

Yep, what an idiot.  I can't stand Archie.

3 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Holy shit!  Riverdale Juvie is hardcore to the extreme, huh?!  It's pretty much full-fledge Shawshank Redemption with the shivs, gangs, brutal guards, and the corrupt warden whose cast description pretty much had to read "someone like Bob Gunton, but not the actual Bob Gunton, because we can't actually afford Bob Gunton." 

For a moment there, I thought the camera was going to reveal Bob Gunton lol.  By the way, this whole "fight club in prison" plotline was lifted straight from the Flash when Barry was spending time incarcerated.

[willgracefan]

On 10/17/2018 at 9:14 PM, Dee said:

This show SO bad. And NOT in a good way. It's hilarious.

It so is. The only reason why I still watch is because my coworkers watch and it gives us something to laugh about 

[CletusMusashi]

17 hours ago, The Wild Sow said:

I forgot to mention last week, you don't SWIM right after getting a tattoo -- they need about 2 weeks to heal!

I've done it, though, (well, two days after.. I'm not sure Archie's tme lag was shorter or longer than that,) and the tattoo healed up normally anyhow. Sometimes in life you ignore good advice and still have good luck. Also, I like to think that overall my judgement is better than Archie's, so if I can be stupid enough to say "fuck it" and jump right into the water with a hot girl I don't think it's implausible for him to. Now, there was about forty minutes of other implausible stuff in this episode, but that particular one I can shrug off.

All I know is: Archie sure is lucky everybody liked football as much as they did. Otherwise Veronica's idea to hang around outside the fence giving erections to everybody that the new boy is locked up with could have gone very, very wrong.

[bara007]

On 18 October 2018 at 11:22 AM, jay741982 said:

I think Archie gets disconnected from the main plot sometimes for a chunk of the season is frankly IMO Cole and Lili are the best actors of the kids  with Madeline and Camilla behind them. TPTB seem to think so with Jug and Betty getting more of the Dramatic Angst plus others can say Bughead being the most famous coupling of the show could be helping 

For me Archie is the best actor - he is a bit more subtle, but I like that.

What he is feeling, I instantly feel it too, which is great in an actor. :)

[WhosThatGirl]

10 hours ago, bara007 said:

For me Archie is the best actor - he is a bit more subtle, but I like that.

What he is feeling, I instantly feel it too, which is great in an actor. :)

Eh. KJ to me is the weakest. He’s been doing okay these last two episodes but I suspect he will go back to being not so great, but that’s also the writing for the Archie character. For me LR is the best out of the teens and then I’m not sure. I like Cole but sometimes Jughead can be a little much, again.. that’s the writing. As for CM, she’s fine. 

[PeekaBoo]

23 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Eh. KJ to me is the weakest. He’s been doing okay these last two episodes but I suspect he will go back to being not so great, but that’s also the writing for the Archie character. For me LR is the best out of the teens and then I’m not sure. I like Cole but sometimes Jughead can be a little much, again.. that’s the writing. As for CM, she’s fine. 

Have to agree, KJ is weak but I won't look away with how Archie's been written on the shoe. 

Lili, is ahead of the rest of gang, she truly has potential in the future. 

Bit uncertain with Cole. He's good alright but his tendencies to overract is annoying... but he's very good at emotional scenes and very versatile... 

Madeleine too is quite good! I'm impressed.

[AnimeMania]

On 10/19/2018 at 2:32 PM, CletusMusashi said:

I've done it, though, (well, two days after.. I'm not sure Archie's tme lag was shorter or longer than that,) and the tattoo healed up normally anyhow. Sometimes in life you ignore good advice and still have good luck. Also, I like to think that overall my judgement is better than Archie's, so if I can be stupid enough to say "fuck it" and jump right into the water with a hot girl I don't think it's implausible for him to.

Did you swim in a pool or did you jump in a mud hole full of leeches?

[WhosThatGirl]

Another thing I haven’t talked about much is the Kevin and Moose thing. I said before I don’t ship Kevin and moose and before the season I stated that as someone who doesn’t even like Kevin all that much, I thought Kevin deserved better than someone who won’t come out or whatever. But now seeing Kevin go above and beyond for Moose who clearly doesn’t want him enough to come out I’m over it. And I know we’re probably supposed to feel for Kevin but.. Kevin should have known what he was getting into, he went through this a year ago when moose hooked up wth him in the woods and then.. didn’t want to be out publicly. This seems to be the situation now. It also doesn’t help Kevin’s case when  the episode before this he was giving Moose a deadline for when they should lose their virginity together. I just can’t feel bad for him right now. I mean honestly I don’t like either of them but yeah.

[UNOSEZ]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I said before I don’t ship Kevin and moose and before the season I stated that as someone who doesn’t even like Kevin all that much,

Same here.. To b honest I'm only interested in Kevin right now in so much as he's another example of how minority characters on this show get short changed.. But man they really got him out here doing the most... And now he runs the risk( and as a teen soap Its almost garunteed)  he will out moose to his ROTC pals and his seemingly tough dad.. Which I will not be cool with.. And now that his former Bff Betty is too busy being a amateur detective/gang queen/ boo'd up with Jiggy... She don't have time for him... The obvious solution would be for him to express his feelings with his new insta-family sister Josie... But let's be real the show muzzled her early in season one when ppl complained about her being too "Black Lives Matters" and now shes just here to sing

[WhosThatGirl]

Yeah.. I think the worst thing is as I said I think the show wants us to be on Kevin’s side regarding all this. Like I bet you are right and he puts Moose but somehow we will suppused to root for Kevin and it’s like.. I don’t root for either Kevin or Moose(I think moose is pretty shady when it comes to how he treated Kevin in the past regardless of him not wanting to come out but he played Kevin like a fool and then lied that midge knew all about them when she didn’t but still) but I think

the show Is going to try and act like Kevin is in the right.

And as I said Kevin should have known what he was getting into with Moose. He did it once before. Shoving deadlines in his face and chasing him around and joining clubs that he’s in is going to push him further and further away. 

I also see this though as going a few ways, I feel like Kevin will more than likely out Moose, as you said, which isn’t cool and somehow moose will be okay with that and it’ll be happily ever after or something. Or Kevin will force Moose out of the closet.. like an ultimatum. Which also isn’t cool. I mean look I’m not a gay male but to me, this plot feels very tone deaf, like it’s not a good story. I know I’m thinking too realistic for this show but something about this plot and how I see it shaping up just bothers me.

Edited October 20, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[Dee]

2 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

Same here.. To b honest I'm only interested in Kevin right now in so much as he's another example of how minority characters on this show get short changed.. But man they really got him out here doing the most... And now he runs the risk( and as a teen soap Its almost garunteed)  he will out moose to his ROTC pals and his seemingly tough dad.. Which I will not be cool with.. And now that his former Bff Betty is too busy being a amateur detective/gang queen/ boo'd up with Jiggy... She don't have time for him... The obvious solution would be for him to express his feelings with his new insta-family sister Josie... But let's be real the show muzzled her early in season one when ppl complained about her being too "Black Lives Matters" and now shes just here to sing

The biggest issue is Kevin has an extremely limited dating pool.

It's either Moose, for him, or nothing. The show has vilified cruising, doesn't care about Fangs and Joaquin exists as a plot point.

And, as you've said, there's no point in Kevin discussing his love life with Josie, seeing as neither can achieve enough screentime to react to their new insta-family, let alone commiserate over their dating woes.

[galax-arena]

I know Kevin's a dumb lovelorn high school kid and yeah his dating pool is limited, but I just find it annoying when gay people knowingly date people in the closet and then get salty because the latter wants to stay in the closet. I mean, sure, encourage them to come out, but don't whine "are you ashamed of me?" as if you didn't know what you were signing up for. 

Quote

Also, after his awkward, privileged speech about how playing football will redeem them all as men, I kind of want Archie to get beat up by all the other prisoners.

When that one guy said how he had been running drugs since he was in the fourth grade (?), and Archie's response was to go, "Then you haven't experienced the highs and lows of high school football!! :D :D :D" .... oh my god. Someone stick a shiv in him, please. 

There's something profoundly annoying about Bughead getting pissy with Sheriff Minetta and hiding stuff from him but also resorting to using him as a threat to get Ethel to comply with their demands/questions. To be clear, I don't blame them for not trusting him, it's more the latter - invoking his name as a threat - that irritates me. 

Edited October 21, 2018 by galax-arena

[UNOSEZ]

4 hours ago, galax-arena said:

There's something profoundly annoying about Bughead getting pissy with Sheriff Minetta

The two of them get so indignant ( even more so than Cheryl and Veronica... Archie ua really the only main one who doesn't have this trait turned up past 8)... Like how dare the head police officer in town not kowtow to a bunch of nosy pushy high school kids.. One who's living some teenage rebellion as a gang queen who's dad is a serial killer and who's mom and sister are currently in a cult... The other a second generation gang leader... And how they treated Ethel( what was betty's deal constantly telling her she didn't have a boyfriend) ugh..  

[WhosThatGirl]

I don’t have a problem with the way Betty and Jughead talked to the sheriff considering they are aware he’s in cohorts with Hiram of course they don’t like him. Then again I like Betty and Jughead and most people on these forums tend to not like either of these characters but I do. Also I didn’t see her being that mean to Ethel, she just said Ben wasn’t her real boyfriend, which he wasn’t, it was a role playing thing. But apparently I missed her being rude about it? I don’t know. 

Also i dontdault for the show for making the way Kevin cruised bad.. it was bad for him to go hook up with ransoms I. The woods at night. That isn’t safe at all. So..  whatever.  And I don’t like Kevin at all, I try to but then he does stuff like the last episode where it really seems like the show is going to have him out Moose. By accident or by an ultimatum and I fear that Moose will just accept it and be okay with it because he loves Kevin. Which.. ew.

Edited October 21, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[UNOSEZ]

4 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I don’t have a problem with the way Betty and Jughead talked to the sheriff considering they are aware he’s in cohorts with Hiram of course they don’t like him. Then again I like Betty and Jughead and most people on these forums tend to not like either of these characters but I do. Also I didn’t see her being that mean to Ethel, she just said Ben wasn’t her real boyfriend, which he wasn’t, it was a role playing thing. But apparently I missed her being rude about it?

Well the way they talk to every adult seems off to me and I'm generally more critical of those two than archie and Veronica... But it was reminiscent of Jughead shouting down the mayor of his town and his friends mother it just irks me... As for Ethel all they had to go on that her and Ben button weren't dating was the word of a kid who'd been in a bunker.. I feel like the show may have been trying to frame it as Betty getting Ethel to snap outta something.. But it came off as... Oh plz Ethel nobody is dating you.. And I know that's not Betty.. But I feel that's how some folks read that  scene

[WhosThatGirl]

44 minutes ago, UNOSEZ said:

Well the way they talk to every adult seems off to me and I'm generally more critical of those two than archie and Veronica... But it was reminiscent of Jughead shouting down the mayor of his town and his friends mother it just irks me... As for Ethel all they had to go on that her and Ben button weren't dating was the word of a kid who'd been in a bunker.. I feel like the show may have been trying to frame it as Betty getting Ethel to snap outta something.. But it came off as... Oh plz Ethel nobody is dating you.. And I know that's not Betty.. But I feel that's how some folks read that  scene

Yeah I can maybe see that but sometimes I feel like Betty is just hated just because. And yeah I’m more critical of Archie and Veronica. Also Cheryl who tends to get a pass a lot of times for terrible things because people find her hilarious or something. Same with a lot of the parents. The point is all these characters are pretty awful at times it’s just funny to me how some people get hated here and others get a pass.

And I get that some people like certain characters for what the character represents. Like Kevin for example might always get a pass from certain people because of what e represents but to me, (and as I’ve said I’m not a gay male) but I feel like his character isn’t that great, even not taking in his actions so far this season which will probably end up forcing moose out of the closet at some point, I don’t think he’s a that great of a character. I think he’s kind of a fair weather friend at most and sometimes is annoying but like I said I get why people will Give him a pass because he represents the LGBT characters that the show doesn’t have many of. Also I hope I explained that well. If there was a disabled character I’d probably give them a free pass at times too. 

Edited October 21, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[sadie]

I think I’m out. When this sits on my DVR for almost a week and then I can’t even get thru 20 minutes I think I’m done. The characters just all seem too disjointed, while I love crazy storylines this is just beyond tolerable, Archie in juvie is just dumb, why is Veronica a waitress now, now the town has a mystic cult? well, I think this is now a show where I will only read comments here because they are just more entertaining than the show itself. 

[Dr Epi]

I am hoping that Kevin and Moose are found out but it turns out that Moose’s dad is ok with it. It would be a nice twist to have the kids fearing an adult/their parents when actually their parents are really cool. Would bust down some stereotypes that the kids have about their parents and show how it is the kids stereotypes about the parents that is holding them back, not the parents themselves.

[WhosThatGirl]

1 minute ago, Dr Epi said:

I am hoping that Kevin and Moose are found out but it turns out that Moose’s dad is ok with it. It would be a nice twist to have the kids fearing an adult/their parents when actually their parents are really cool. Would bust down some stereotypes that the kids have about their parents and show how it is the kids stereotypes about the parents that is holding them back, not the parents themselves.

If this happens I hope Moose comes  out on his terms not being forced out by Kevin.

[Daltrey]

On 10/18/2018 at 12:01 PM, AdorkableSars said:

I am here for it. All of it. The creepy magical gargoyles, the weird game, the parents secret past, Archie in prison, a weird farm/cult...give me all the crazy multitude of storylines!! This show is going off the deep end, and it is must-watch TV for me!

Absolutely with you, 100%! THAT WAS AWESOME!!! As stated last week, just as planned, I checked my disbelief at the door and let everything wash over me, no judgement. It took me a few days to get to it this week but I'm glad I finally watched. I can't remember the last time I enjoyed Riverdale so much; It's so damn ridiculous, it's brilliant! I can empathize with @WhosThatGirl and others who say it's not the show they signed up for because I agree; it's not what I expected either. To be honest, I'm not sure what I expected, other than the Archie characters to be brought to life in some kind of overly dramatic, unlikely if not entirely unrealistic fashion. Kind of a Beverly Hills 90210/Dawson's Creek mash up of sorts, with maybe a dash of Veronica Mars or something to effect deeper storytelling. Admittedly, I'm no longer the target demographic for THAT show, but like anyone that read Archie comics as a kid, to any extent, I had at least a passing interest in seeing how it was done. For me, the first season struck a pretty good balance between comic book storytelling and real world situations, for the most part. Season two, somehow , seemed to go off the rails, leaning too far to the comic book side of things and it was jarring for the audience. I'm guessing it was intentional, to some extent, but poorly executed. Having already succumbed to the 'anything goes' mentality often afforded comics, rather than try to course correct and re-achieve that season one balance, I think they've fully embraced that world and have made the show a parody of the teen drama, comic book and horror genres. It's a dark comedic satire, as I see it; the storytelling in general, and certain scenes in particular, are outrageously OTT but they play it serious, so it's subtle. I think the show knows exactly what it's doing. In any case, it had me in stitches and I can't wait for more.

[geauxaway]

I curse my 16 year old niece for talking me into this show.  All I can say so far is, prison Archie is hotter than regular Archie.  I loved the hot dads sitting at the Pops counter.  Dylan McKay will be my #1 always.

The scene with all the parents has my attention.....

I can’t totally focus knowing about the pending Sabrina show.  I feel like this is all leading to that.  Like one big promo.

Edited October 23, 2018 by geauxaway

[rmontro]

42 minutes ago, geauxaway said:

I curse my 16 year old niece for talking me into this show.  All I can say so far is, prison Archie is hotter than regular Archie. 

 

Lol, it gives him some street cred.  He's got the Serpent tattoo (which apparently didn't do him any good.  You'd think that being friends with Jughead and FP would count for something).  If he gets a tear tattoo under one eye, I will sign up for this show for life.

Anyway, I love this show.  Stupid is part of its charm.

Edited October 23, 2018 by rmontro

[geauxaway]

On 10/17/2018 at 8:05 PM, notcreative enough said:

Way to go all Longest Yard Archie. And how do none of those girls have cell phones out to record everything.  What kind of teenagers  are these

It’s funny you mention this because when I was watching the most recent episode I realized I don’t think any of them have been shown to use a cell phone.  I may be wrong on that, but if they do exist in Riverdale they are not glued to them like most teens.

The prison definitely has the 1950’s vibe that the hospital and court room had.  Mad Dog had pictures of pin up girls on his wall.  Also in the bunker, Jughead used a traditional camera for the photos he took, and then him and Betty developed them in a darkroom.  I do love that aspect of this show, it’s almost like a game to me to pick out the retro stuff.

[rmontro]

On 10/17/2018 at 9:05 PM, notcreative enough said:

Way to go all Longest Yard Archie. And how do none of those girls have cell phones out to record everything.  What kind of teenagers  are these. 

Really old ones  :)

[PeekaBoo]

13 hours ago, geauxaway said:

I curse my 16 year old niece for talking me into this show.  All I can say so far is, prison Archie is hotter than regular Archie.  I loved the hot dads sitting at the Pops counter.  Dylan McKay will be my #1 always.

I am all in for the Hot Dads ???.

I swear the CW has their next spin-off hit for the older viewers lol.

Riverdale seems stuck in this time warp! 

[wingster55]

On 10/19/2018 at 10:38 PM, bara007 said:

For me Archie is the best actor - he is a bit more subtle, but I like that.

 

Of the "kids" I would agree. 

[Dr Epi]

10 hours ago, geauxaway said:

It’s funny you mention this because when I was watching the most recent episode I realized I don’t think any of them have been shown to use a cell phone.  I may be wrong on that, but if they do exist in Riverdale they are not glued to them like most teens.

 

The kids have been using cell phones a lot.  For example, Betty got called by the Black Mask on her cell phone with the ringtone of "Lollipop."  Archie and Betty text each other.  They have cell phones with caller ID so that they always know who is calling and start conversations with the caller's name.  Not glued to them on our TV screen because that is boring TV for us, but they definitely do have them and use them a lot.

[HunterHunted]

It really feels like nothing short of Veronica immolating herself is going to stop Hiram from punishing both Veronica and Archie. He's just pure awful. He's also pure stupid. He hasn't figured out that the more he forbids Veronica from seeing Archie and the more roadblocks he sets up, the more Veronica wars to run to Archie as refuge. Had he been slightly more innoculously supportive, then Archie and Veronica would have split up in college. Now Hiram has guaranteed that these 2 dopes will stick it out for at least a decade.

[PeekaBoo]

1 hour ago, HunterHunted said:

It really feels like nothing short of Veronica immolating herself is going to stop Hiram from punishing both Veronica and Archie. He's just pure awful. He's also pure stupid. He hasn't figured out that the more he forbids Veronica from seeing Archie and the more roadblocks he sets up, the more Veronica wars to run to Archie as refuge. Had he been slightly more innoculously supportive, then Archie and Veronica would have split up in college. Now Hiram has guaranteed that these 2 dopes will stick it out for at least a decade.

Definitely agree... and hiram might still think that Veronica will still be the lovee dovey daughter that is ever so loyal? Pffff... come on! He is thoroughly enjoying torturing his own daughter!

Seeing him fall will be ever so sayisfying!

[LadyNebula]

What did they throw on Archie in intake after he was hosed down?  And why?

[Daltrey]

3 hours ago, LadyNebula said:

What did they throw on Archie in intake after he was hosed down?  And why?

Some kind of soap powder to clean himself off; they didn't show it but he would have been hosed a second time to rinse it off. Historically, I believe this was fairly common treatment of new prisoners on intake, a form of psychological and physical abuse to put them in their place, let them know who's in charge and keep them in line..... At least that's what many prison themed movies would have you believe, I'm sure it's rooted in truth. As to why the show did it, I'd say partly in homage to any old films that contained such a scene, partly to show how evil the warden and his staff/prison is and mainly as another anachronistic element that allows Riverdale to be a town out of any time and no time all at once.

[hertolo]

I'm catching up a bit going fast through the episodes and I just have to say: This is a comedy, right? I mean it's so over the top.

It's not an educational show though with its misrepresentation of the fifties and of what prison is about. That just cements stereotypes. But well....

[Mr. Sparkle]

4 hours ago, hertolo said:

I'm catching up a bit going fast through the episodes and I just have to say: This is a comedy, right? I mean it's so over the top.

I see it as more of a soap opera. They're quickly approaching "Dark Shadows" territory. 

[PeekaBoo]

I thought I "got" this show but after this bat shit season, I'm just flabbergasted that I can't even make proper comments or speculations anymore just because something worse/better/crazier happens than I can anticipate... Now I'm just in for the ride and just happily nod my head because just when I thought this show could NOT get any crazier, IT DOES.... ooof! 

[Daltrey]

13 hours ago, hertolo said:

This is a comedy, right?

That's how I'm watching it: it's hysterical!

 

53 minutes ago, PeekaBoo said:

I'm just in for the ride and just happily nod my head because just when I thought this show could NOT get any crazier, IT DOES

and it's wonderfully wonderous, LMAO!!!