S13.E08: Here Comes Kitty

[CaseyRe]

1 minute ago, sATL said:

re: Jinelle & clean eating habits : She is also a big water drinker.  ( link )

 "I'm all about water, so I'll drink about 1.6 gallons — between 5 to 6 liters — every day. If I'm not hydrated, I can feel a lot less able to do my workouts. Water is so important and makes such a difference to your overall performance."

So, I guess part of the sessions with VK will include monitoring water intake .

yup, upping her water will a)help drop any water weight if she's not hydrated enough and b) anyone on a diet is generally told to drink a glass of water before a meal to help fill the stomach and make them feel more full so they eat less.  plus its just good for you to get your water intake sorted. so many people are dehydrated and don't even know it

[CaseyRe]

9 minutes ago, allirish47 said:

Perhaps Dayton would eventually have been cut, but my opinion of Kelli has sunk to the point that I truly believe that she realized that Shelly wouldn't be in the building, knew that it would be a cut night, and deliberately chose to make it the night for Dayton to go. K. was too cowardly to think about facing Shelly right away, If Shelly HAD been there. And I also wonder that if K. and Shelly ever discussed the cut, how that conversation went.

 

And somebody brought up the topic of ambassador risk - the thought of VK on appearances is both amusing and frightening. Charlotte and Kelli darn well better think about that scenario!

She's not at all wht I'd consider a good ambassador to the team. bubbly yes, but utterly unpolished, and does she even listen when others talk? she doesn't seem engaged with others, like she's truly listening to them, more like she's just there.  Compare her to someone like Rachel, who yes obviously has a leg up due to her pagent career, but consider how she interacted with those at he senior centre, how she comports herself. you can be outgoing and enaging without appearing childish and somewhat out of control.  in time that might come, but she's not remotely there yet.

I go back and forth on discussing it with Shelley/her being there.  On the one hand, its family friend, there's a relationship there both personal and professional, but on the other, it can smack of special treatment. other girls that get cut don't get to have their mothers waiting for them to comfort them, and if the legacies truly won't be treated differently, then they shouldn't be (though of course we've seen this isnt' remotely true in the case of a particular legacy and so help me if/when she's cut if TK is there...).  I'd also be upset to know my mother knew of my cut before I did, not to mention that's not a great thing to put on Shelley, that she knows her daughter is about to be crushed and there's nothing she can do.

[jlc]

14 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

I go back and forth on discussing it with Shelley/her being there.  On the one hand, its family friend, there's a relationship there both personal and professional, but on the other, it can smack of special treatment. other girls that get cut don't get to have their mothers waiting for them to comfort them, and if the legacies truly won't be treated differently, then they shouldn't be (though of course we've seen this isn't' remotely true in the case of a particular legacy and so help me if/when she's cut if TK is there...).  I'd also be upset to know my mother knew of my cut before I did, not to mention that's not a great thing to put on Shelley, that she knows her daughter is about to be crushed and there's nothing she can do

That is a great point. I did not think of Shelly not being there in that way, but you are so right in how that would make Shelly feel knowing her daughter was about to be crushed. Tough situation for everybody it seems. 

[sATL]

Do we know why Shelly was not there ? Meaning was it her day off, sent on an errand somewhere, doing something else, someplace else, went home early, sitting in the car waiting for Dayton to come out?

Did we see VK in her uniform try-on - full body length back and front ?

Edited September 22, 2018 by sATL

[ShellyB]

7 minutes ago, sATL said:

Do we know why Shelly was not there ? Meaning was it her day off, sent on an errand somewhere, doing something else, someplace else, went home early?

Did we see VK in her uniform try-on - full body length back and front ?

I was not there that day, nor were there any discussions...before or after. 

[MyFavShows]

2 hours ago, Jess14 said:

I don't know if VK has a medical condition or not, and I don't think it has to be an either/or thing, she could have a medical issue, or the weight gain could be a side effect of medication and she could be eating a very poor diet on top of that. With that said, genetics just may not be on her side. She's at an age where her body could be changing, and everyone is not meant to be super thin. Right now, she's looks fluffy, so she can correct this, but in general, I see her being a regular sized woman in the future, and that's not really compatible with the DCC uniform. If she makes the team now or in the future, I think weight would be a constant struggle for her.

I agree that it will/would be a constant struggle - especially if she’s having issues at only 18 years old.  She certainly could overcome it with hard work and willpower, but she is probably like the vast majority of people where her “natural state” is not a body for the DCC uniform.  Guess we’ll see how she does.

Edited September 22, 2018 by MyFavShows

[Opine]

On 9/21/2018 at 4:10 AM, PBSLover said:

The other thing that I want to say is that I HATE Kelli’s recap at the end of each episode. It was introduced two or three seasons ago and I just find it unnecessary. It’s just more Kelli, which we don’t need...especially tonight’s recap. 

Can't agree with you there!  I love it.  It gives insight to what she is thinking about the specific girls.  It is one of my favorite parts.

[CaseyRe]

9 minutes ago, sATL said:

Do we know why Shelly was not there ? Meaning was it her day off, sent on an errand somewhere, doing something else, someplace else, went home early?

Did we see VK in her uniform try-on - full body length back and front ?

We got full length front but only a profile of her butt in the shorts

Edited September 22, 2018 by CaseyRe

[sATL]

1 minute ago, ShellyB said:

I was not there that day, nor were there any discussions...before or after. 

k. I was hoping the answer was "sitting in the car"...

the thought of Dayton driving home, possibly alone, it was what 11-ish and knowing how upset set was.. eyes full of tears,...makes me sadder

[CaseyRe]

1 minute ago, MyFavShows said:

I agree that it would be a constant struggle - especially if she’s having issues at only 18 years old.  She certainly could overcome it with hard work and willpower, but she is probably like the vast majority of people where her “natural state” is not a body for the DCC uniform.  Guess we’ll see how she does with the workouts.

Holly P had the same issue, but not to the degree of 11 pounds, and she struggled at first, but she was also super fit. now she's left DCC she's definitely heavier and seems happier at that weight, but she was able to ose the pounds they wanted her to

[pasdetrois]

Quite a few of my actor and dancer friends have done the cruise ship gigs. They are a grind and don't pay well. They are good experience but not a status gig. Good for Dayton for finding something to help gain experience, and being away from home broadens the horizons. She might make some great connections.

[dccfangirl]

On 9/21/2018 at 12:31 PM, cfinboston said:

Kitty sells her personal star power and access. There's a difference between letting a customer know you'll make her into a good dancer, and letting her know you have a seat at the judges table.

She pulls for girls who go to her studio - Dayton obviously didn't train there this year and VK is a kiss ass (understandably - it clearly works). 

 

On 9/21/2018 at 11:42 AM, sATL said:

Bridget - I feel like we didn't get the whole story... 

IDK I feel like the segment was toooo long. I was enjoying it and then I was like er ok enough now. She seems sweet though and she's grown on me. Looks-wise I find her pretty but not memorable so it was good to see more of her dancing which is clearly excellent. 

On 9/21/2018 at 1:15 PM, Tinydancerxo28 said:

2. I wish we had heard more of Judy’s opinions during their round table discussion. Also, I wish Kitty elaborated more on who needs an attitude adjustment. I’m very surprised that Kitty asked that VK is given more time and thinks she’s ready...on what planet?

Judy clearly disagreed with the Dayton cut. Like seriously disagreed with it. I would find that awkward to be overruled by Kitty if I were the full time choreographer. Although Dayton was making a LOT of mistakes especially when they did the dance facing the back and couldn't watch in the mirror. 

Also Kitty is their "technical coach" apparently. I like it when she teaches the across the floor combos or last year when she made them hold the devloppe on the field - that's technique. This year she basically watched someone else teach and gunned for girls on their looks.

 

On 9/21/2018 at 3:34 PM, VintageJ said:

I LOVED the Rockette at the Senior Center.  How I wish Jacie were there also.

SOOOO adorable. 

On 9/21/2018 at 4:13 PM, ReneeK said:

I also agree that Dayton’s  cut was handled with professionalism.  It’s even harder if Kelli coddles and says “I’m so sorry Honey!  You’re going to make it next time and you know we love you so much like a daughter!”  Kelli is the director and cut her like a director.  I disagree with those who said Kelli was cold and heartless.  

As much as I disagree with the cut I'm not sure Kelli could have handled it much differently. It as clearly an emotional thing and when you fire someone you can't be a wreck yourself - it's harder for them than it is for you so you need to just try and be professional. 

On 9/21/2018 at 7:55 PM, homelife said:

- Perhaps this episode's shitty cut and VK adoration campaign is paving the way for Kelli and Judy to hang up their boots as directors. Judy has become less and less vocal through the seasons, especially this one. Watching previous seasons, I miss that spitfire Judy. It's like she lets Kelli run the show now while she just nods at her shoulder. The DCC organization needs fresh blood. I nominate Michelle Keys for everythinnnngggg.

Judy seems like she's checked out to be honest. I miss Judy's feedback on the dances - maybe it's the edit but she seems way less involved. Shelly is technically in line to take Judy's role when she retires but I wonder if she'll want to work with Kelli after this fiasco. Kelli will die in her office - she's never going to leave. She'll be the age of the Rockette in the Senior Citizens' home and still be going "Ashley - your left kick is a dillbreakkker... don't make me hit you with my walking stick."

18 hours ago, CaseyRe said:

in terms of Kitty - have we ever seen her defend a TCC that's so 'overweight' (in DCC terms) and demand she be given the 'respect' to have time to lose it?

I also get super frustrated by the 'this is a cut night' thing when they don't even know who they want to cut, just htat they're going to. like they're forcing themselves to cut somebody, anybody just because they've decided 'it's a cut night'. 

1) It's absurd, she's humiliated girls in a completely unnecessary way before re weight - i don't like that style but I get that it's probably effective. Now she's banging on about "respect" come ON. 

2) Also I hate that they only cut one girl at a time - the suspense goes out of the show when it's one per epi. I loved the old epis when they culled 3/4 girls in one go. Sorry if that sounds mean - obviously I feel for the girls but I do watch the show for the drama. 

17 minutes ago, ShellyB said:

I was not there that day, nor were there any discussions...before or after. 

So unnecessary. Kelli could have called you and said "look - i'm sorry, this is the way it is but I wanted to do you the courtesy of giving you a heads up."

[MyFavShows]

26 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

We got full length front but only a profile of her butt in the shorts

 

Her legs are nice and thin.   She just carries her weight in her mid-section - you can notice softness in her tummy even though she doesn’t really look “big”.  I don’t think she looks so soft that she couldn’t be put on the field though, so I assume she gained a little more since those photos?

I think her face is so pretty - even in the awkwardly paused shot on top where she’s in the middle of talking/laughing, she still somehow looks good.   Plus her nice smile while lifting up Kelli.   I think she’s prettier than her mom.    

Edited September 22, 2018 by MyFavShows

[PrincessLeia]

My problem with the Dayton cut is there are girls who should’ve been cut before Dayton. I agree that she was struggling.... but an ELEVEN POUND WEIGHT GAIN from Victoria should’ve been an immediate see ya later. Kristin is a mess. Malena is a mess. Why Dayton? Why now? And for crying out loud call Shelly and tell her. You owe her that.... it’s different for Dayton and Victoria. I also think the sobbing was looped and played over and over. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by PrincessLeia

[CaseyRe]

7 minutes ago, MyFavShows said:

Her legs are nice and thin.   She just carries her weight in her mid-section - you can notice softness in her tummy even though she doesn’t really look big.  I don’t think she looks so soft that she couldn’t be put on the field though, so I assume she gained a little more since those photos?

I think her face is so pretty - even in the awkwardly paused shot on top where she’s in the middle of talking, she still somehow looks good.   Plus her nice smile while lifting up Kelli.   I think she’s prettier than her mom.    

I was trying my best with taking screenshots - she's actually dancing not talking and so it was hard to get shots of her that weren't' super blurry because the only time she was seen full length was her dancing and then when she stopped she had her arms in front of her torso so you couldn't see the uniform.

I don't think it was necessary to show VK three times during the uniform fiting segment. she had her one-to-one, then shown again in the studio dancing, then shown again with one of the other TCC, when some weren't shown at all.

Edited September 22, 2018 by CaseyRe

[RedheadZombie]

19 hours ago, blairwaldorf said:

Wow. That is just so wrong. I would have been furious.

I was fired at 16 while my mother worked one department away.  I never would have wanted my mom to be told before me.  Dayton is an adult, and she deserves to be the first told.

[RedheadZombie]

16 hours ago, healthnut said:

Mileage varies, I think Malena is prettier than all of those except maybe Jacie. 

 

You may have a point there, usually several are heavy at auditions but this year not so much but some have issues now. Of course, that wasn’t the excuse in other seasons...so who knows. 

I think Malena is drop-dead gorgeous, and I'm not just comparing her to other African-American women as OP did.  I think it's her looks and her ability to speak intelligently, versus some of the dimwits on the team, that's kept her so far.  I find her unusually beautiful.

[ShellyB]

55 minutes ago, sATL said:

k. I was hoping the answer was "sitting in the car"...

the thought of Dayton driving home, possibly alone, it was what 11-ish and knowing how upset set was.. eyes full of tears,...makes me sadder

It was much later than 11 ?

[CaseyRe]

14 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

I was fired at 16 while my mother worked one department away.  I never would have wanted my mom to be told before me.  Dayton is an adult, and she deserves to be the first told.

Same, I got fired when my mom worked in the same department just another building and so she heard about it before I could tell her, but she didn't know before hand, just got the gossip later. I wouldn't have wanted anyone knowing before me. it's not fair to them and disrespectful to me

[Law Mom]

I think Malena is one of the prettiest girls in TC, a good dancer, and a great ambassador, but in my opinion of all the TCCs left she is the one least likely to improve with more time so she should have been cut. I think all of the other girls who have been in the office--Kristin, Dayton, Victoria, Tara, even Lindsay, would all do just fine in a real life game situation instead of the artificial environment of TC.

[RedheadZombie]

3 hours ago, hathorlive said:

I know nothing about the world of dance, but is dancing on a cruise ship a prestigious thing? I would hope that something better than DCC might involve college and dancing on another team to gain experience.   Dayton can dance.  She just has trouble learning DCC dances and popping.  I don't see how dancing lyrical on a ship will build those skills to make the team.

I also don't think Kelli and Judy were unprofessional or harsh.  They know these girls and it's hard.  Dayton struggled and didn't look great most of the time. Melena, in my opinion, has moments where she's stunning.  I didn't see those moments with Dayton.  I did cry along with her and it was heartbreaking to see her sob. But if she really wants it, she can work toward it.

No words on VK.  She's had every freaking advantage you can have to make this team and she's clueless. Her parents could afford to get her a professional trainer and a nutritionist. I think she's learning the hard way that our bodies start betraying us around 19 and it's not pretty.  You can't eat like you did in high school and not gain weight. She's fighting genetics because Mama K looks like she's all for the comfort food and not for healthy and nutritious.  I can't see her making this team between all the negatives.  Kitty sold her soul fighting for a girl who doesn't deserve it.  VK is about to learn some hard lessons in life.  Sometimes, wanting it isn't enough. You have to work really really hard.

Brennan rocks.  She's so well spoken.  I'll be crushed if she doesn't make this team.

The talent on cruise ships are often the "help" when not on stage.  It doesn't sound like a step up from anything, IMO.  

1 hour ago, sATL said:

re: Jinelle & clean eating habits : She is also a big water drinker.  ( link )

 "I'm all about water, so I'll drink about 1.6 gallons — between 5 to 6 liters — every day. If I'm not hydrated, I can feel a lot less able to do my workouts. Water is so important and makes such a difference to your overall performance."

So, I guess part of the sessions with VK will include monitoring water intake .

I hope she's an excessive sweater to be drinking that much.  Water toxicity is a real thing and if your urine is clear, you need to back off.  

Water in this amount is often used as hunger control.

[MyFavShows]

34 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

I was fired at 16 while my mother worked one department away.  I never would have wanted my mom to be told before me.  Dayton is an adult, and she deserves to be the first told.

Yeah - your mom being told you were about to be fired at the age of 21 would be borderline humiliating.

And the comments about needing her mom there to console her and drive her home so she doesn’t have to drive home alone?  Don’t all the other discharged candidates have to drive home alone - and they don’t have their moms there.  Wouldn’t that have looked like special treatment?  It actually may have been done on purpose and for a reason.  

[RedheadZombie]

1 hour ago, CaseyRe said:

yup, upping her water will a)help drop any water weight if she's not hydrated enough and b) anyone on a diet is generally told to drink a glass of water before a meal to help fill the stomach and make them feel more full so they eat less.  plus its just good for you to get your water intake sorted. so many people are dehydrated and don't even know it

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but being dehydrated does not make you retain "water weight".  Excess sodium with water intake is what does it.

[scorpio1031]

27 minutes ago, ShellyB said:

It was much later than 11 ?

Well then I hope she stopped on the way home for a big frickin' chocolate milkshake with whip cream and a cherry on top:)  

[CaseyRe]

3 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but being dehydrated does not make you retain "water weight".  Excess sodium with water intake is what does it.

If you don't drink enough water, and thus are dehydrated, your body will retain it. sounds contrary, but it's true. Water retention can be a classic sign of dehydration. once you up your water intake, then your body flushes that retained water too as it no longer needs to keep a hol d of it. there are a number of reasons the body retains water and dehydration is one of them

[RedheadZombie]

2 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

 I don't care who her mother is,

I'm quoting myself here.  When I posted this, I didn't realize that Dayton's mom posts here.  Knowing now, my post seems like I'm having a go at her, or even seeking a response from her.  Please know this was not my intent, @ShellyB.

[sATL]

4 minutes ago, MyFavShows said:

Yeah - your mom being told you were about to be fired at the age of 21 would be borderline humiliating.

And the comments about needing her mom there to console her and drive her home so she doesn’t have to drive home alone?  Don’t all the other discharged candidates have to drive home alone - and they don’t have their moms there.  Wouldn’t that have looked like special treatment?  It actually may have been done on purpose and for a reason.  

1) I kinda figured they carpooled. There isn't an age limit, or shameful disgrace, on sharing a car ride to the same place

2) that is why I asked/wondered... was the event set up that way on purpose

[CaseyRe]

5 minutes ago, MyFavShows said:

Yeah - your mom being told you were about to be fired at the age of 21 would be borderline humiliating.

And the comments about needing her mom there to console her and drive her home so she doesn’t have to drive home alone?  Don’t all the other discharged candidates have to drive home alone - and they don’t have their moms there.  Wouldn’t that have looked like special treatment?  It actually may have been done on purpose and for a reason.  

I thought that. yes, it's incredibly sad to think of a young girl driving home heartbroken, but every other TCC that's been cut has had to do it, many of whom aren't even driving 'home' to their family, but rather a potentially empty apartment, or perhaps worse, one shared with another TCC that hasn't been cut.  many of these girls then have to travel back to their state alone at some point too. 

[RedheadZombie]

1 minute ago, CaseyRe said:

If you don't drink enough water, and thus are dehydrated, your body will retain it. sounds contrary, but it's true. Water retention can be a classic sign of dehydration. once you up your water intake, then your body flushes that retained water too as it no longer needs to keep a hol d of it. there are a number of reasons the body retains water and dehydration is one of them

I'm a nurse and this is a new concept for me.  When you're dehydrated, the body holds the water because it's necessary for hemodynamics.  I never heard that it can make you look heavier, but maybe I need to do a little research.

[scorpio1031]

5 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

I thought that. yes, it's incredibly sad to think of a young girl driving home heartbroken, but every other TCC that's been cut has had to do it, many of whom aren't even driving 'home' to their family, but rather a potentially empty apartment, or perhaps worse, one shared with another TCC that hasn't been cut.  many of these girls then have to travel back to their state alone at some point too. 

During the two hour special, one of the vets, Misty, had opened up her home to two of the rookies, Deanna and Elizabeth.  At that time, they did cuts thru practice, not just at the end.  Elizabeth got cut, the other girls still had practice and Misty was upset at the idea of Elizabeth going to an empty house.  So Kelli or Judy told Misty and Deanna to go talk to her before she left the studio.  

[kerrieway]

There are several ways to look at whether to tell legacy moms about a cut. K & Charlotte's argument could be that they shouldn't be telling them because they don't tell any other TCC's parents about cuts or there could be some kind legalities that they want to avoid.

That being said, I think all that could be avoided with a brief discussion with all legacy moms when their daughters make it to training camp saying, "Because of your personal and historical relationship with the DCC organization we will give you the professional courtesy of notifying you on the day your daughter is eliminated." Then present a form wherein legacy mom's check yes or no as to whether they want to be notified. Could say something like, "In the unfortunate event that your daughter is cut "so and so assistant" will tell you while K & J are having the elimination conversation with your daughter so that you are notified of the decision. We we will not be able to expound on the reasons for this decision and further future discussions with legacy mothers in reference to the cut decision will not take place. "

Edited September 22, 2018 by kerrieway

[Law Mom]

15 minutes ago, JohnGalt said:

Cruise ship performing varies from person to person. I have a lot of friends who have done it and loved it, and a couple who did it and hated it. It’s more of a stepping stone than a long term plan (for most). A good friend of mine was scouted on a cruise ship and landed himself a spot on the national tour of “American Idiot.” Consequently he has been on Broadway. One thing can lead to another.

I saw the American Idiot national tour. IIRC, the dancers were great, but the show was so bad I almost walked out.

[bigskygirl]

22 minutes ago, MyFavShows said:

Yeah - your mom being told you were about to be fired at the age of 21 would be borderline humiliating.

And the comments about needing her mom there to console her and drive her home so she doesn’t have to drive home alone?  Don’t all the other discharged candidates have to drive home alone - and they don’t have their moms there.  Wouldn’t that have looked like special treatment?  It actually may have been done on purpose and for a reason.  

I do not think it is special treatment if Dayton called her mom in the parking lot asking her to meet her because she was cut or ask for a ride home. It is not like Dayton came up with excuses for having problems not learning the dances well enough aka a medical condition, or running around telling others she got a spot on the squad or was ratting out others, or had Kelli, Miss Kitty or Charlotte defending keeping her in TC while other girls are being cut for the same thing.

[CaseyRe]

7 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

I'm a nurse and this is a new concept for me.  When you're dehydrated, the body holds the water because it's necessary for hemodynamics.  I never heard that it can make you look heavier, but maybe I need to do a little research.

There are a number of studies showing a correlation between dehydration and water retention. if you're carrying extra water (which weighs about a pound a pint) which tends to be carried in legs, feet and hands because of gravity (I lived it after my last surgery and it was zero fun at all), you're going to look a little/a lot(depending on the severity) thicker in those areas.  I was told by my surgeons to drink more water to encourage it to clear as I couldn't have water tablets. as VK doesn't have thick legs and the majority of her extra weight seems to be held across her middle (I know how she feels) I'd doubt much of the problem is water weight from dehydration, though she could be eating too much salt, which can come down to much the same thing in the end - an imbalance of salts in the blood.

10 minutes ago, kerrieway said:

There are several ways to look at whether to tell legacy moms about a cut. K & Charlotte's argument could be that they shouldn't be telling them because they don't tell any other TCC's parents about cuts or there could be some kind legalities that they want to avoid.

That being said, I think all that could be avoided with a brief discussion with all legacy moms when their daughters make it to training camp saying, "Because of your personal and historical relationship with the DCC organization we will give you the professional courtesy of notifying you on the day your daughter is eliminated." Then present a form wherein legacy mom's check yes or no as to whether they want to be notified. Could say something like, "In the unfortunate event that your daughter is cut "so and so assistant" will tell you while K & J are having the elimination conversation with your daughter so that you are notified of the decision. We we will not be able to expound on the reasons for this decision and further future discussions with legacy mothers in reference to the cut decision will not take place. "

While this has the potential for compromise, it's still allowing the legacy girls what can easily be viewed, and I'd say is, special treatment.  Where's the form for the parents of the other TCC to say 'hey your daughter is being cut, because of your personal relationship to her, do you want to know ahead of time?' it should be up to the girl's who is told and when, not their parents, IMHO. they're not children and they should have the respect to make the decision of whom to call or speak to about it when/if it happens, not have their mothers told beforehand.  

[kerrieway]

13 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

While this has the potential for compromise, it's still allowing the legacy girls what can easily be viewed, and I'd say is, special treatment.  Where's the form for the parents of the other TCC to say 'hey your daughter is being cut, because of your personal relationship to her, do you want to know ahead of time?' it should be up to the girl's who is told and when, not their parents, IMHO. they're not children and they should have the respect to make the decision of whom to call or speak to about it when/if it happens, not have their mothers told beforehand.  

I agree with this. It should be up to the legacy TCCs if they want their mom told.

I don't like favoritism either but IMO there's a difference between favoritism and professional courtesy. Favoritism is what K & Charlotte are doing now with not cutting VK because of weight. A 5 minute phone call to a former DCC mom, provided her daughter signs off on it, who has been an ambassador for the organization and added to the DCC legacy doesn't seem over the top just kind. Are any of the other TCC moms getting that kindness, no, but then none of the other TCC moms wore the uniform.  

However, could it cause friction between rookie's if there were perceived favoritism about the mom phone call, yes. But if there wasn't perceived favoritism during practice, appearances, weight etc then I don't see it as a big problem.  

[blairwaldorf]

@ShellyB If Kelli had offered you the option of a courtesy call in the event that she was going to cut Dayton, would you have wanted that, or did you prefer not knowing? I personally feel like legacies SHOULD get special consideration, especially when their mothers are still heavily involved in the organization. Being cut as a legacy is not the same as being cut when you're just a regular candidate. It's just not. I thought Dayton handled it as well as could be expected.

I think legacies should be given every opportunity to make this team, and IMO, that includes letting them do all 8 weeks (or however long it is) of training camp before making a decision. And even then, the decision should come down to more than just "Is she top 36?" Cutting a legacy, especially one who may not quite be there yet but COULD get there with some extra help, should never be taken lightly.  I don't think it's unfair to the other girls to give a legacy, whose family has been loyal to the organization for 20 years, extra consideration or special treatment in certain circumstances. Should they put them on the team if it means bumping a more qualified girl or if there's just no way the legacy can do it? No. But should they strongly consider taking a larger team than anticipated to accommodate a legacy who may not be top 36 this year but IS DCC material? Yes, IMO. 

A legacy should never be one of the first cuts. And Dayton certainly should not have been cut before Malena, who has no DCC ties and was NOT ALLOWED TO DANCE with her previous team because she's incapable of memorizing choreography. I didn't think Dayton was necessarily top 36 at the moment, but she didn't deserve to be cut as early as she was, and if they had given her more of a chance I think it's possible she could have gotten there.

[CaseyRe]

1 minute ago, blairwaldorf said:

@ShellyB If Kelli had offered you the option of a courtesy call in the event that she was going to cut Dayton, would you have wanted that, or did you prefer not knowing? I personally feel like legacies SHOULD get special consideration, especially when their mothers are still heavily involved in the organization. Being cut as a legacy is not the same as being cut when you're just a regular candidate. It's just not. I thought Dayton handled it as well as could be expected.

I think legacies should be given every opportunity to make this team, and IMO, that includes letting them do all 8 weeks (or however long it is) of training camp before making a decision. And even then, the decision should come down to more than just "Is she top 36?" Cutting a legacy, especially one who may not quite be there yet but COULD get there with some extra help, should never be taken lightly.  I don't think it's unfair to the other girls to give a legacy, whose family has been loyal to the organization for 20 years, extra consideration or special treatment in certain circumstances. Should they put them on the team if it means bumping a more qualified girl or if there's just no way the legacy can do it? No. But should they strongly consider taking a larger team than anticipated to accommodate a legacy who may not be top 36 this year but IS DCC material? Yes, IMO. 

A legacy should never be one of the first cuts. And Dayton certainly should not have been cut before Malena, who has no DCC ties and was NOT ALLOWED TO DANCE with her previous team because she's incapable of memorizing choreography. I didn't think Dayton was necessarily top 36 at the moment, but she didn't deserve to be cut as early as she was, and if they had given her more of a chance I think it's possible she could have gotten there.

Can I ask why you think they shhould get special treatment? that's just smacking of nepotism to me. they should make the team on their own merits, as Dayton stated, not because they were given special consideration because their mom once made the team

[blairwaldorf]

5 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

Can I ask why you think they shhould get special treatment? that's just smacking of nepotism to me. they should make the team on their own merits, as Dayton stated, not because they were given special consideration because their mom once made the team

Because when you are a legacy, the organization is a big part of your life. If you cut a legacy (especially one like Dayton), you aren't just cutting her from some little dance team. You're rejecting and shutting her out of something that is a major part of her family's life. Shelly did more than "once make the team." It appears that it's been a big part of her (and Dayton's) life for the past 20 years. Legacies and their families have invested a lot in DCC (time, money, loyalty, representation, emotion) that non legacies frankly haven't. So, yes, I think DCC should invest more in them. A legacy who loves and is committed to the DCC, and has been involved with DCC for her entire life, is such a powerful asset. I would much rather have someone like Dayton, who has grown up with the organization and has family ties to it, than someone who is a great dancer but has no respect for the uniform or the tradition.

Edited September 22, 2018 by blairwaldorf
expanding on explanation

[Jazzmom]

1 hour ago, scorpio1031 said:

Well then I hope she stopped on the way home for a big frickin' chocolate milkshake with whip cream and a cherry on top:)  

All this talk of milkshakes the last few days..I am ready for one! 

Dayton did get in the elevator with a lot of the TCC, so maybe it was fine for her to be with the girls first, then mom. 

[CaseyRe]

9 minutes ago, blairwaldorf said:

Because when you are a legacy, the organization is a big part of your life. If you cut a legacy (especially one like Dayton), you aren't just cutting her from some little dance team. You're rejecting and shutting her out of something that is a major part of her family's life. Shelly did more than "once make the team." It appears that it's been a big part of her (and Dayton's) life for the past 20 years. Legacies and their families have invested a lot in DCC (time, money, loyalty, representation, emotion) that non legacies frankly haven't. So, yes, I think DCC should invest more in them.

 

This is going to sound harsh, but so what? My father worked for BT for like 40 years, it was a huge part of m family's life as we travelled the world as a result. doesn't mean they have to give me a job.  its straight up nepotism. that's parents buying their daughter a spot ont he squad and is, personally, takes any smidge of honor or earning it from the girls.  could someone else, not a legacy, but who works for DC organisation therefore get their daughter on the squad?  is every legacy going to have had DCC a part f their lives? no.  do you think Kalyssa's kids or Alexandria's kids should get special treatment? their mothers were DCC too. if not, how long does a woman have to be a DCC for her daughter to get all this special consideration and kid glove behaviour/on the squad? how much time and money and loyalty does one have to put in?  frankly, its unethical and deeply unfair to the other girls that a legacy get to stay for the full 8 weeks even if she's not up to par just because her mother once was up to par.  their mother had to earn it on her own merits, so she should too. so girls that are more deserving get cut so legacy can stay? sorry, I'm never going to agree on that.

Edited September 22, 2018 by CaseyRe

[mmm]

Does anyone have a link for episode i can't find it anywhere ?

[Jazzmom]

There are a lot of retired DCC right now having babies!  Looking forward to those auditions!  

[CaseyRe]

1 minute ago, mmm said:

Does anyone have a link for episode i can't find it anywhere ?

sent you a message with a link

[blairwaldorf]

2 minutes ago, CaseyRe said:

This is going to sound harsh, but so what? My father worked for BT for like 40 years, it was a huge part of m family's life as we travelled the world as a result. doesn't mean they have to give me a job.  its straight up nepotism. that's parents buying their daughter a spot ont he squad and is, personally, takes any smidge of honor or earning it from the girls.  could someone else, not a legacy, but who works for DC organisation therefore get their daughter on the squad?  is every legacy going to have had DCC a part f their lives? no.  do you think Kalyssa's kids or Alexandria's kids should get special treatment? their mothers were DCC too. if not, how long does a woman have to be a DCC for her daughter to get on the squad? how much time and money and loyalty does one have to put in?  frankly, its unethical and deeply unfair to the other girls that a legacy get to stay for the full 8 weeks even if she's not up to par just because her mother once was up to par.  their mother had to earn it on her own merits, so she should too. so girls that are more deserving get cut so legacy can stay? sorry, I'm never going to agree on that.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that. If the mom left the squad in bad standing, no, her daughter shouldn't get special consideration. But if the mom has been actively involved and raised the daughter within the DCC, and the mom is actually employed by the DCC, then yes, I think it's appropriate to give that candidate extra consideration. They sure as heck did for Cassie Trammell. Should they give her someone else's spot if she truly didn't earn one? No. If they have to take 36 and she's not top 36, don't take her. But we've seen on the show that rookie class numbers are not set in stone, and I don't think there's anything wrong with taking a squad of 37 instead of 36 when they've got 36 great girls and a legacy right on the cusp. 

[Law Mom]

I think professional courtesy, without rising to level of nepotism, is standard in many professions. Fortune 500 companies get thousands of resumes and having a parent employed there means someone will actually look at yours. You still need to be qualified on your own merits to actually get hired, but without the connection your odds might have been nil. Also, I do think legacies in general have an added value to the DC organization, all else being equal, simply from a marketing standpoint.

[CaseyRe]

3 minutes ago, blairwaldorf said:

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that. If the mom left the squad in bad standing, no, her daughter shouldn't get special consideration. But if the mom has been actively involved and raised the daughter within the DCC, and the mom is actually employed by the DCC, then yes, I think it's appropriate to give that candidate extra consideration. They sure as heck did for Cassie Trammell. Should they give her someone else's spot if she truly didn't earn one? No. If they have to take 36 and she's not top 36, don't take her. But we've seen on the show that rookie class numbers are not set in stone, and I don't think there's anything wrong with taking a squad of 37 instead of 36 when they've got 36 great girls and a legacy right on the cusp. 

if you're not top 36, if you're on the bubble, I just don't think oyu should make it simply because of who your mother was when every other girl, whose daughter's would be legacies have to earn it. even Dayton, the legacy in question, said she didn't want that. I had such respect for her in that moment, a young woman who wanted to make her own way in the organisation, even if her mother had been a DCC. she wanted to earn it, not have it given to her.  if your mother had to earn it, why should you be allowed to coast in simply because of your relation? if you get to coast through TC and have every consideration, how do you ever know you made it on your own or because your mom essentially bought you the postion. it cheapen the whole thing and makes a mockery of it being the 'world-class'.  it makes it 'world-class and a few legacies that we didn't want to cut because theey weren't really good enough but hey their mom was a DCC once so we kept them'.  look at the audience (ie us) reaction to VK getting this 'special consideration' look how well it's being received. its not fair to the girl, its not fair to the other TCCs and it cheapens the organisation

[hathorlive]

2 hours ago, PrincessLeia said:

My problem with the Dayton cut is there are girls who should’ve been cut before Dayton. I agree that she was struggling.... but an ELEVEN POUND WEIGHT GAIN from Victoria should’ve been an immediate see ya later. Kristin is a mess. Malena is a mess. Why Dayton? Why now? And for crying out loud call Shelly and tell her. You owe her that.... it’s different for Dayton and Victoria. I also think the sobbing was looped and played over and over. 

I think the crying was real and visceral.  I feel for the legacy girls because it's so much a part of how they were raised.  I do think VK has gotten the soft glove treatment while Dayton was punched around a lot.  I do think both girls could make the team if they can work on their issues.  It's no different from Brennan being cut so many times. It takes guts to come back and fight for it. I hope Dayton comes back next year.  She'll have a wealth of knowledge to apply to the process and she's a beautiful girl.

I'm really shocked Shelly wasn't given a heads up.  No one needs to drive home like that.   I hope Dayton has a great time doing her gig.  I don't think Kelli and Judy are heartless.  I think life just gets messy some times.  Many girls have to audition more than once to get on the team. 

[MyFavShows]

20 minutes ago, Jazzmom said:

There are a lot of retired DCC right now having babies!  Looking forward to those auditions!  

Haha!  “DCC Making The Team: Season 32” is going to be lit!!!

[blairwaldorf]

The issue I have with the Dayton cut is that I don't think they did give her a fair chance to earn it. They cut her just as she was really starting to improve. And I do think when a legacy is cut, their mother is owed at the very least the courtesy of a heads up. And preferably, if she wants it, an explanation as to why... and it needs to be a better explanation than just, "She wasn't top 36 that particular week and it was a cut night, so we decided to cut her even though there were other girls who were weaker."

[hathorlive]

1 hour ago, JohnGalt said:

Cruise ship performing varies from person to person. I have a lot of friends who have done it and loved it, and a couple who did it and hated it. It’s more of a stepping stone than a long term plan (for most). A good friend of mine was scouted on a cruise ship and landed himself a spot on the national tour of “American Idiot.” Consequently he has been on Broadway. One thing can lead to another.

Good to know!  I hope the experience helps her grow in many ways and clarifies what she wants to do next.  At least she'll be out there, doing what she loves.

Love your name, btw.