Sierra Burgess is a Loser (2018)

[starri]

Do we put Netflix movies here?  If not, I apologize profusely.

Anyway, given the flak they got for Insatiable, this looks like...not that at all.

[dkb]

Ohhh, this looks good. Peter Kavinsky from All the Boys I've Loved Before, is in it and so is the new Blue Power Ranger!

Already know that I will cry at some point during this movie too.

[starri]

It does look good, doesn't it?

I don't objectively know what I think of Shannon Purser as an actress, but I do find her incredibly appealing onscreen.  I'm hoping this is as good a part for her as it seems.

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, starri said:

It does look good, doesn't it?

I don't objectively know what I think of Shannon Purser as an actress, but I do find her incredibly appealing onscreen.  I'm hoping this is as good a part for her as it seems.

If this is good, I'm going to be hoping and crossing my fingers that Netflix or something similar will get started on an adaption of Eleanor and Park starring her before she can't pull off high school anymore. Given Hollywood standards for "teen", she should have at least another 5 years but still the clock's ticking. I'm still disappointed that the long-rumored Sweet Valley High movie didn't materialize in time for Sara Paxton to be able to play the Wakefield twins. She would've been perfect. Alas, she got too old.

[Scarlett45]

This looks absolutely charming. I’m here for a twist on the Cyrano story and a plus size teen character. 

Edited September 3, 2018 by Scarlett45

[Mabinogia]

I need to see this!

[twoods]

Movie was decent, but felt it was missing something. The acting was good, but I couldn’t get over the catfishing and the lead being a bitch towards the end. I felt the ending was a little rushed, even though I did get teary eyed.

[biakbiak]

Yeah I didn’t really like this one. I thought the lead got off too easy for her behavior but I did like that there was no transformative makeover at the end! 

Noah is becoming the Molly Ringwald of Netflix teen romcom.

Edited September 7, 2018 by biakbiak

[Rilla-my-Rilla]

2 hours ago, twoods said:

The acting was good, but I couldn’t get over the catfishing and the lead being a bitch towards the end. I felt the ending was a little rushed,

 

42 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

I thought the lead got off too easy for her behavior but I did like that there was no transformative makeover at the end!

Yeah, this is almost exactly how I felt about the movie. The kissing swap in particular bothered me on top the general catfish. I needed something more from Sierra at the end. Or rather, if I was Veronica or Jamey, I would need more from her before I could move on.

[twoods]

Yep. Singing a song at the end doesn’t cut it. She didn’t even formally apologize to Veronica, and the apology to Jamey was half ass as well. I would have liked to see a scene with her (pretending to be deaf of course) and Jamey hanging out or having a conversation before her ridiculous hand waving stunt at the football game. Who calls out a guy’s name after meeting him for two seconds? I’m glad that her friend Dan thought it was pathetic as well. He was actually the bright spot in the movie (along with Jamey being a nice guy and never a jerky jock who became good at the end). 

[biakbiak]

11 minutes ago, twoods said:

She didn’t even formally apologize to Veronica, and the apology to Jamey was half ass as well.

Hell she even made Veronica come over to her at the dance rather than go to her! Also, it doesn’t help that I wasn’t really impressed by her singing so the song fell flat for me. When Veronica first commented on her singing I could barely tell that she was singing.

Edited September 8, 2018 by biakbiak

[Scarlett45]

I’m watching the movie now and the scene where Jamey introduces his little brother cracked me up. 

Okay WUT?!! (Kissing scene in the parking lot) Sierra is aggravating me, she needs to come clean with Jamey. 

 

No Sierra no....no you didn’t post that about Veronica-what the ever loving fuck.  I’m all for each of the characters being well rounded (the “ugly fat girl*” doesn’t need to be saint), but that was so mean spirited. WHY? Veronica did have a point (not that her behavior in the beginning of the film was much better).

 

*the actress playing Sierra is quite pretty IMO, such pretty red hair and clear skin. Why is it that she’s supposed to be hideous because she plus sized? I would’ve prefered her being “normal”, maybe not liking some things about her appearance but not being defined by it (like most people). 

Edited September 8, 2018 by Scarlett45

[Scarlett45]

2 hours ago, biakbiak said:

Yeah I didn’t really like this one. I thought the lead got off too easy for her behavior but I did like that there was no transformative makeover at the end! 

It was cute but I won’t watch it again (compared to “To All the Boys I Loved Before). Sierra got off way too easy IMO. 

[methodwriter85]

I don't know, I enjoyed it. It definitely evoked John Hughes pretty well and I liked that Jamey and Veronica weren't cardboard cutout popular kids. It was cool seeing Lea Thompson, because I thought Veronica's arc was very similar to Amanda's in Some Kind of Wonderful- a popular girl who follows the crowd and her role until she decides not to.

4 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

*the actress playing Sierra is quite pretty IMO, such pretty red hair and clear skin. Why is it that she’s supposed to be hideous because she plus sized? I would’ve prefered her being “normal”, maybe not liking some things about her appearance but not being defined by it (like most people). 

The only one who was really nasty to Sierra about her weight seemed to be Veronica, and we learned that's because we learn she reminds her of her mother. I don't think Sierra's weight was defining her, but in terms of trying to attract guys and dating, it's going to come up, especially if you're trying to hook up with guys that look like Noah Centineo. And yeah, as a stocky gay dude, I've been told I'm not someone's type or had someone abruptly end a conversation online when I sent a picture. It's just a reality, and I understand Sierra's apprehension. One time I tried sending a dude I was talking to a picture of a 5'10" looking frat boy jock, but I couldn't go through with being dishonest about it. I get it, though. I remember being 17 and feeling bad that I didn't look like an Abercrombie and Fitch model. But then I look at pictures of myself when I was 17 from the vantage of 32, and I think, "Wow, I actually looked pretty good. I miss how thick my hair was!" So that part of the story really resonated with me.

Speaking of Veronica's mother, I got a kick out of seeing Chrissy Metz playing a more hygenic Mama June. LOL.

6 hours ago, biakbiak said:

Noah is becoming the Molly Ringwald of Netflix teen romcom.

He's currently trending at 1 on IMDB. Good for him!

His next romcom is the Stand In, where he plays a college guy that poses as stand-in boyfriends for girls. Aww. The story seems similar to this service.

Edited September 8, 2018 by methodwriter85

[emjohnson03]

I enjoyed this on a rainy Friday afternoon.

It really felt like another John Hughes, especially the film score. I really enjoyed the background music. 

I will say All The Boys was better, as I think the story was more cohesive and it had a little more magic. 

I enjoyed the Sierra and Veronica friendship the most, and I think that's what most people latched on to as they reviewed the film.

I did miss an actual apology from Sierra as Veronica really did some amazing things for her at the end. 

And I admit, Noah is adorable as all! He could fit in nicely with the Brat Pack of the 80s. Wonder if another one will come around!

It's fun to see these movies on Netflix and not have to pay to go the theater. It's great!

And goodness Alan Ruck is old! Did love him and Lea Thompson playing the parents, another nice ode to their participation in the 80s rule of teenage movies.

Keep these coming Netflix!

[Scarlett45]

12 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

It was cool seeing Lea Thompson, because I thought Veronica's arc was very similar to Amanda's in Some Kind of Wonderful- a popular girl who follows the crowd and her role until she decides not to.

I hadn’t thought about that- but you’re very right!

12 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I don't think Sierra's weight was defining her, but in terms of trying to attract guys and dating, it's going to come up, especially if you're trying to hook up with guys that look like Noah Centineo. And yeah, as a stocky gay dude, I've been told I'm not someone's type or had someone abruptly end a conversation online when I sent a picture. It's just a reality, and I understand Sierra's apprehension. One time I tried sending a dude I was talking to a picture of a 5'10" looking frat boy jock, but I couldn't go through with being dishonest about it. I get it, though. I remember being 17 and feeling bad that I didn't look like an Abercrombie and Fitch model. But then I look at pictures of myself when I was 17 from the vantage of 32, and I think, "Wow, I actually looked pretty good. I miss how thick my hair was!" So that part of the story really resonated with me.

I understand what you’re saying. And I very much respect your opinion living life as a gay man.  I’m sure you’re still cute at 32! 

Trust I’ve been plus sized my entire life (one of the reasons I was excited to see a plus size teen character), and while weight/appearance most certainly effects if someone is attracted to you or not in a dating situation, I was 1. Very happy not to have a dramatic weight loss/makeover at the end (the notion that the female character finds happiness once she is thin), 2. A tad disappointed in the “you don’t know what it’s like to be a teenage girl that looks like this!”- seemed to me that she was lamenting as if she was deformed or something or her weight was the cause of all her problems.

I don’t doubt being heavier can be hard on guys (especially if you’re young and gay) but I think the social pressure is harder on women that if you don’t look xyz way you’re not as valuable. I would like to see ONE teen character that doesn’t buy into the hype that the thin conventionally attractive people automatically have it easier etc. 

But then we wouldn’t have had a Cyrano story would we? ??

[starri]

13 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I thought Veronica's arc was very similar to Amanda's in Some Kind of Wonderful- a popular girl who follows the crowd and her role until she decides not to.

Veronica telling the rest of the Fashion Club that she realized Sierra was cool was the high point of the movie for me.  They could have made Veronica into a complete cartoon, but they didn't.  From the jump, we knew she had her own insecurities.

I dunno.  Ultimately, it was a fairly generic teen movie, but the utterly charming cast sold the hell out of it.  I probably won't rewatch it, but I'm definitely glad I watched it the first time.

[methodwriter85]

1 minute ago, starri said:

I dunno.  Ultimately, it was a fairly generic teen movie, but the utterly charming cast sold the hell out of it.  I probably won't rewatch it, but I'm definitely glad I watched it the first time

Noah Centineo reminds me in a good way of the cute high school/college boys I had crushes on when I was that age.

Quote

Veronica telling the rest of the Fashion Club that she realized Sierra was cool was the high point of the movie for me.  They could have made Veronica into a complete cartoon, but they didn't.  From the jump, we knew she had her own insecurities.

That was the big failing for the Duff for me, which is otherwise an enjoyable movie. The mean girl was just too much of a cartoon. Of course, it doesn't help that I think Bella Thorne is a charmless wench, but whatever.

[Wiendish Fitch]

Eh, the only interesting thing about this movie is that I keep mistaking the title for Sierra Boggess is a Loser. I happen to adore Ms. Boggess, by the way, and I wonder if others have made this faux pas.

[biakbiak]

At the end of the day I didn’t really like Sierra so thought Jaime, Veronica and Dan all deserved better! 

[Scarlett45]

5 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Noah Centineo reminds me in a good way of the cute high school/college boys I had crushes on when I was that age.

He’s most certainly attractive- but in a youthful way (he is only 22 and has a baby face). He doesn’t look like an overly muscled hyper sexual adult male, he looks like an attractive young guy that you’d see in real life. And he has a charming smile, a hint of vulnerability IMO which is even more endearing. I liked him on The Fosters, he’s doing so well he shouldn’t be hurt he wasn’t offered a role in the spin off.  

Edited September 9, 2018 by Scarlett45
A spin off isn’t a reboot.

[EyewatchTV211]

I agree with others that the ending was rushed and undeserved on Sierra's part. The level of catfishing was terrible and what she did to Veronica was terrible. I might have forgiven the former more easily, but I think the movie didn't give us enough deeper bonding between Sienna and Jamey to help me buy their supposedly amazing connection. I guess we can assume better conversations occurred off screen if we want to, but the ones on-screen were typical superficial get-to-know-you stuff. This was one of the areas where To All the Boys I Loved Before did a better job. I guess it helped that those characters could relate due to parent circumstances, but they really dug a bit deeper there and really listened to each other and gave good advice. Maybe this movie was hurt somewhat by splitting time developing Sienna/Jamey and Sienna/Veronica. Sienna/Veronica was a bit more successful, which is why it sucked that Sienna was so quick to get revenge. I didn't feel like we got to know Jamey much besides the forced examples of what a great guy he was, and I didn't get to know Sienna much either besides her being very smart. 

Edited September 8, 2018 by VMepicgrl

[methodwriter85]

Yeah, like I said, I could picture myself hanging out with him at a lax party and doing a kegstand with him when I was 20.

I tried to give the Fosters a chance, but frankly I found the Brandon/Callie "Oooh, it's an adopted sibling finding another sibling hot!" storyline really tedious and borderline creepy, and it didn't look like it was going to go away even by the third season or so of the series.

Edited September 8, 2018 by methodwriter85

[Lady Calypso]

I agree with some points made about this movie feeling very John Hughes-esque with the music....but I guess also with the story and the messages behind it. John Hughes was a brilliant director and made some pretty great films, but all of this films had a lot of issues with what messages they were sending to its viewership. 

I think the movie was cute and I did find myself enjoying certain aspects. I think the main issue was the love story and the wrong message it ultimately delivered at the end. I think the movie could have thrived on Sierra and Veronica being the main plot. I adore Noah Centineo and thought Jamey was relatively decent, but he wasn't developed enough. Jamey was too perfect so it made him a little less believable. Noah only made him a 3D character through his acting, rather than through the writing. 

I think Shannon Purser is a great actress and I enjoyed seeing what she gave to Sierra as a character but the writing for the character made her seem like the biggest jerk of all that it was hard to root for her. Having only Veronica and her two friends be bullies to Sierra wasn't enough to justify some of Sierra's insecurities, along with that one random track tryout scene.

I know there'll be comparisons to Noah's other rom-com since that one just came out as well, but I do think these are two totally different movies. Sure, they're both the epitome of teenagers learning how to grow up and get through high school, but they deliver different messages. To All The Boys was cute in its own way, for sure, and I do think I enjoyed it more; plus, I think it had much better writing. This movie had a specific type of dialogue with the witty humour from time to time, again in a very John Hughes-esque way. And I got more nostalgic to see this particular cast. Seeing Alan Ruck and Lea Thompson, in particular, was fantastic. 

The ending was rough to get through and think it did bring down the movie. However, I do think I liked the movie better than the critics have, as the acting was really, really strong. And some of the dialogue was decent, I think (or maybe the delivery was just on point for me). I think the details added to the movie made it stronger than it would have been. 

[Mabinogia]

It's very easy for Sierra to tell herself no one likes her because she's "ugly" but I think it's just because she's kind of a bitch. 

I actually really liked Veronica and the generic love interest and was rooting for them to get together. The catfishing, while terrible, I could understand how she kind of got caught up in it, but posting that photo of Veronica and airing her private business was HORRIBLE and didn't deserve forgiveness that quickly. 

It was interesting to see the Cyrano story played out in the mobile phone age. I loved the retelling in the movie Roxanna and bought into the love story then. But this one, I was not rooting for Sierra at all. She really is a loser. It's interesting because I actually love the actress who plays Sierra but I couldn't stand the character. Meanwhile I felt a lot of sympathy for Veronica as soon as we got to see the real her. 

Not a great movie, though very good cast. 

[starri]

7 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I actually really liked Veronica and the generic love interest and was rooting for them to get together. The catfishing, while terrible, I could understand how she kind of got caught up in it, but posting that photo of Veronica and airing her private business was HORRIBLE and didn't deserve forgiveness that quickly. 

That Veronica forgave her to the point that she was willing to use her new Socratic debate skills to encourage Jamey to forgive as well kind of makes Veronica the hero of the story, doesn't it?  Aside from the scenes of the developing friendship between Sierra and Ronnie, the scene of Ronnie standing up to her mother was probably my favorite in the movie.

I do wonder if the posting of the photo was supposed to make Sierra completely unsympathetic, because two scenes before, we'd seen that Ronnie worried about ditching Sierra at the party, and going to her, and not the Fashion Club, for comfort after Spence did his horribleness.

[Scarlett45]

8 minutes ago, starri said:

I do wonder if the posting of the photo was supposed to make Sierra completely unsympathetic, because two scenes before, we'd seen that Ronnie worried about ditching Sierra at the party, and going to her, and not the Fashion Club, for comfort after Spence did his horribleness.

Yes- I think the posting of the photo was supposed to be a step too far. Born out of unfounded jealousy, insecurity and mean spiritedness when Veronica and Sierra had developed an intimacy. 

[Mabinogia]

18 minutes ago, starri said:

the scene of Ronnie standing up to her mother was probably my favorite in the movie.

That was the big Hell Yeah moment of the movie for me. That was the happy ending I needed. 

I agree that Veronica was the hero of the story. She was my hero at least, and I followed the film as a movie about her growth from an insecure mean girl from a home she's embarrassed of to a girl comfortable enough in who she is that she can go out without the warpaint (makeup) and can make her own friends (rather than staying with the "cool kids"), and who finally had the guts to stand up to her mother and save her family from itself. Sierra was just the mean girl who pulled all of this out of her. Probably not what they were going for, but the only way I found the movie enjoyable. 

[Lady Calypso]

5 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

That was the big Hell Yeah moment of the movie for me. That was the happy ending I needed. 

I agree that Veronica was the hero of the story. She was my hero at least, and I followed the film as a movie about her growth from an insecure mean girl from a home she's embarrassed of to a girl comfortable enough in who she is that she can go out without the warpaint (makeup) and can make her own friends (rather than staying with the "cool kids"), and who finally had the guts to stand up to her mother and save her family from itself. Sierra was just the mean girl who pulled all of this out of her. Probably not what they were going for, but the only way I found the movie enjoyable. 

Yeah, Veronica was definitely the shining star in this movie. I mean, she was the bigger person at the end, forgave Sierra just because she posted one really cheesy song, and then convinced Jamey to go see Sierra. Sierra didn't make any moves to truly apologize to the people that she hurt. She kind of apologized to Dan, but in a teen movie way, where it was more: "Haha, I messed up but I totally need you in my life because life sucks, am I right?". Then, she records one song with metaphors over flowers and about her feelings about being hurt and that gets Veronica to forgive her and gets Jamey to go over and say "Well, you messed up....BUT I like you so...we cool." Meanwhile, Sierra put in some effort, but not enough for me to buy this forgiveness since she didn't initiate it in person with either Veronica or Jamey, who needed the apologies the most. 

I think that's what bugged me the most about the movie, because I genuinely did like everything else to varying degrees. 

[Mabinogia]

They should have ended it with Sierra going to the dance alone, maybe in the hopes of seeing the people she hurt because they'd been ignoring her and at the dance she thought they wouldn't be able to and she could face them. Going up to Veronica and actually apologizing, in person, not some song she texted to her which seemed more for Sierra than for Veronica anyway (Sierra finally embraces her talent! Yay her). Veronica says it will take time but thanks for the apology. 

Then she sees Jamey. She explains how everything got so out of hand and she never meant for any of it to happen. It could end with a dance. A promise to the audience that they will make it, but it is going to take time. 

With that kind of ending, hopeful but not fully resolved with a self serving song, I would have liked the movie a lot more. I just hate that everyone forgave her so easily just because she was the lead in the movie. 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Mabinogia

[JessePinkman]

I think calling Sierra this horrible person is a step too far. Let’s not forget that Veronica was downright cruel to Sierra repeatedly for no good reason. The girl was just existing and Veronica was mean to her.

Was Sierra did was perhaps unforgivable but I could at least understand WHY she did it and that it was done in a moment of haste. And I’m sure it was born out of a lot of built up animosity toward Veronica for being mean to her for so long, then opening up to her and still having her betray her by doing the one thing she asked her not to do in kissing Noah.

Speaking of kissing Noah, that scene where Sierra stepped in for Veronica and kissed him was not cute. Know your audience movie, consent is a huge issue right now and what might have worked in 1985 doesn’t work now.

[tribeca]

I really wanted to like this movie but didn’t.   I found the texts hard to read.  Didn’t think Jamie and Sierra had such a connection on the phone.   Did not find her hiding under the car or the switchkiss cute.   Really hated when she pretended to be deaf.  

Prefer @JessePinkman ending  

[biakbiak]

2 hours ago, JessePinkman said:

then opening up to her and still having her betray her by doing the one thing she asked her not to do in kissing Noah.

Veronica didn’t kiss Jamey, he kissed her and they wouldn’t have been in that situation if he didn’t think they had already kissed and sort of dating. 

[Empress1]

Dan, the best friend, played Earl in Me and Earl and the Dying Girl, a movie I liked based on a book I adored. I was glad to see him. I laughed out loud during the hurdle scene.

I'm with y'all that Sierra was kind of terrible and it was hard to root for her. The posting the picture of Veronica, the cat fishing, the swapped kissing (in this age where we're so rightfully focused on consent?). She was just kind of a jerk. I initially had the thought that I liked that she didn't change that much about herself (it's one of the things I liked most about To All the Boys I've Loved Before, that Lara Jean didn't change her appearance or her friends or anything - he fell for her as she was), and I still like that they didn't have her change her appearance ... but her behavior needed some work.

(I also didn't think Veronica was particularly attractive, but I can see why people would.)

[Irlandesa]

This movie was a tale of two movies about body positivity.  It started out being a good movie about body positivity.  It was relatable.  Sierra is bigger than most of the teens we see in these movies but while we saw some people judge her for her size, overall it didn't seem like it defined her.  She had friends.  She wasn't the target of everyone's ridicule--mostly just Veronica & Gang.  She did well in school.

Because of that, the middle section faltered a bit when the love story moved from one about a simple miscommunication to outright catfishing and ignoring that even hot guys have the right to consent.

And when it started to all fall apart for Sierra, it turned into a horrible movie about body positivity because her size went from one characteristic about her to outright justification for every awful thing she did.  In the end, she didn't do much to atone for catfishing Jamey and Instagram shaming* Veronica.  The movie turned her size into a bigger burden and expected it to do a lot of work in earning sympathy back for her.

*Yes, Veronica was awful and cruel to Sierra in the past.  Sierra actually handled the bullying maturely so I don't know that there was a lot of frustration towards Veronica there. What made the Instagram thing kind of awful is that Sierra knew that Veronica had just been negged by a college guy into performing sexual acts with him only to be dumped the next day.  Then Sierra hacked into her account to mock her for that.  All because of a split second which she didn't even ask Veronica about. 

Because of their past and how well the movie built up Sierra and Veronica's friendship, I could believe a reconciliation would be possible with an apology from Sierra.  I don't think a song does it.  Certainly not enough to make her go over to Jamey's and be brilliant enough to convince him to forgive Sierra. 

Ultimately, it was this weird reverse standard where of course Sierra deserves to be loved by the hot guy in school she catfished because bigger girls deserve love too.  Well yeah, they do and sometimes even from the hot guys but neither the story or chemistry told the story well enough to justify the ending.

Edited September 10, 2018 by Irlandesa

[biakbiak]

4 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

Well yeah, they do and sometimes even from the hot guys but neither the story or chemistry told the story well enough to justify the ending.

Yeah I think the biggest failing is the Sierra/Jamey connection there conversations seemed like normal casual get to know you talk not some deep connection on either one of their parts and it seemed that Sierra was mostly into him because he was hot.

[Mabinogia]

1 minute ago, biakbiak said:

and it seemed that Sierra was mostly into him because he was hot.

And there lies the great irony. He's not allowed to like Veronica for her looks but Sierra is allowed to like him for his looks. When you don't know someone, all you have to go on is how they look. Jamey thought Vanessa was cute so he asked for her number. Vanessa wasn't interested and as a cruel joke gave him Sierra's number. Mean, yes, but more in a harmless prank kind of way because she probably assumed Jamey would call, Sierra would tell him he had the wrong number, he'd know Vanessa wasn't into him and it would end there. Sierra, apparently so excited to be talking to a cute boy, pretended to be V which, if it had just been for that phone call, would have been okay. But then she disregarded everyone else and lied to get what she wanted. 

Her little justification speech about how she's not as smart as her dad or as pretty as her mom was eye rolling to me. Vanessa's dad walked out on his family and her mother is off the deep end and Sierra still thinks having great, successful, pretty parents to live up to justifies hurting people she cares about. I will admit, though, her mom was annoying as fuck with all her self help crap. 

[Silver Raven]

Dylan Is In Trouble's review.  He was not thrilled at a lot of it.

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, Silver Raven said:

Dylan Is In Trouble's review.  He was not thrilled at a lot of it.

He is basically me. I loved how pissed off he is about the football scene!

[methodwriter85]

On 9/8/2018 at 8:26 PM, Lady Calypso said:

This movie had a specific type of dialogue with the witty humour from time to time, again in a very John Hughes-esque way. And I got more nostalgic to see this particular cast. Seeing Alan Ruck and Lea Thompson, in particular, was fantastic. 

I thought the scene where everybody's getting ready for the football game while semi-ominous techno music plays was sooooo Johh Hughes it gave me chills. Like I almost expected to see James Spader sneering against his car for a second, or a young Lea Thompson running away crying as she realizes she's lost her social standing.

Dylan made a really good point that they should have used the footage Sierra's friend took of Veronica bullying. That's something that actually has happened, where bitchy mean girls get their bitchy moments blasted and they're taken down as a result, best example being Insane Sorority Letter. That would have made a lot more sense than just railing on Veronica for getting dumped. It also would have complimented Veronica's character arc, which is honestly the best thing about this movie. I do think at some point Veronica looked at her mother, and then at herself, and realized that the mean bitchy things she likes to say to people aren't coming from nowhere.

I also realized that Dylan probably had to have been one of those odd quirky jocks in high school since he does seem like he understands the game and the lingo. I enjoyed him ripping on the total lack of understanding of sports this movie has. Especially the end that apparently Jamey is Bruins-caliber. Which...come on, really? If he were someone that a school like UCLA would consider, he'd have an insane amount of attention on him. He wouldn't be a kid bumbling around in a diner with his two Regular Joe friends or hoping the pretty girl he got the number of will text him. Jamey would have a gaggle of best bros and jersey chasers riding his jock. He seemed more like the kind of kid that might get considered for a DII or DIII-tier school.

Edited September 10, 2018 by methodwriter85

[Mabinogia]

6 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Dylan made a really good point that they should have used the footage Sierra's friend took of Veronica bullying. That's something that actually has happened, where bitchy mean girls get their bitchy moments blasted and they're taken down as a result, best example being Insane Sorority Letter. That would have made a lot more sense than just railing on Veronica for getting dumped. It also would have complimented Veronica's character arc, which is honestly the best thing about this movie. I do think at some point Veronica looked at her mother, and then at herself, and realized that the mean bitchy things she likes to say to people aren't coming from nowhere.

All of this! If Sierra had blasted an email of Veronica being mean and bitchy I would have been more supportive of that because it is something Veronica chose to do, not something that was done to her. Even exposing the kiss between V and J (though no one would have cared) would again be more about feeling betrayed by Veronica. Instead Sierra chose to stoop to an even lower level than the mean girl and rub salt in the wound. It is a small thing that makes a huge difference in who we perceive Sierra. Sierra showing what a bully Veronica could be would be more impowering, more "she's not going to take it anymore", more confronting the real issue she has faced all her life. Sierra telling the world Veronica was dumped in a totally humiliating way is just mean and spiteful.

Veronica's growth and understanding of where her behavior was coming from was great. That story I really enjoyed. The fact she forgave Sierra so easily shows that the growth is sticking, it's not just for show. I really came to like Veronica's character slowly through the movie because her storyline was very well told.

[absnow54]

On 9/9/2018 at 7:40 PM, Irlandesa said:

And when it started to all fall apart for Sierra, it turned into a horrible movie about body positivity because her size went from one characteristic about her to outright justification for every awful thing she did.  In the end, she didn't do much to atone for catfishing Jamey and Instagram shaming* Veronica.  The movie turned her size into a bigger burden and expected it to do a lot of work in earning sympathy back for her

This is how I felt as well. It felt like the screenwriter ran out of time and just lazily tacked on an ending with the message “you can treat people however you want so long as you’re insecure.” I wish they allowed Jamey to hear and understand Sierra’s side of things before he forgave her instead of just taking her back with barely an apology. What she did to him was really weird, and he had every right to never speak with her again. 

I’m on the fence about Shannon Purser. There were moments where she demonstrates clear talent, but there were just as many scenes where she made really bizarre choices. Like her “clever clap backs” all landed flat because of her delivery, and sometimes she’d just kind of smirk instead of emote. I thought the rest of the young cast were fantastic, which only highlighted purser’s weaknesses. 

Edited September 12, 2018 by absnow54

[festivus]

I really hated this movie. I guess I'm past the age where I think kissing a boy who doesn't know who he is kissing is cute. I would have liked the movie better if the end was about Sierra  apologizing to Veronica for what she did, realizing that not just "pretty girls" can be horrible and Jamey walking away from the whole thing. As it was I think he must have football brain damage to forgive her so fast. I watched this because I did like "To All The Boys" and I thought this one would be cute too. Nope.

[IWantCandy71]

I think my biggest problem with the movie was that I wanted something that would make me laugh, and except for mild amusement at the track scene, I can't recall a single time it came close to being truly funny.

Best part of the movie was when the track coach said he had to allow them to try out or he would be sued, and by the end, he didn't care if he got sued. More people should be like that, especially in America. Far too many people these days are offended about being offended. And I say this as someone who has born my share of humiliation and bullying. I developed a sense of humor early on-I had to learn to laugh at myself and not take other people's horribleness to heart.  That, and prayer and my God helped me through. I would not have made it past 16 years old, otherwise.

But then, there are things you have to stand up for. You have to pick your battles. I do LOVE that Sierra stood up to Veronica. That was a good message to send. The "good messages" ended there, though. Oh, wait. She cared about school/her education. That, too. Nothing else was really positive. It wasn't even a movie about body positivity, because she was so insecure, she couldn't kiss the guy as  herself until the end. And had a meltdown about "what I look like".  But in the defense of the filmmakers, I don't think we were supposed to see that  first kissing scene as anything other than pathetic and sad. Because that is absolutely what it was. Nothing good about it.

 I would have been happier if Jamie told Sierra they could maybe be friends in time, and she and Veronica made up at the very end (after a time flash to graduation, or something, IDK). I agree she was forgiven too quickly-but then again, Veronica never apologized for all her bullying, so I didn't feel sorry for her. Or the fact that she set the whole thing in motion by giving Jamie Sierra's phone number.One of  the extras had a line at the football game "bout time she got taken down a peg". I agree with that. You can't treat people the way Veronica did, and suffer no consequences. But then, Sierra really didn't suffer, either. And she should have. The movie as a whole was unrealistic and sends the wrong message in that you can treat people like that and they'll just forgive you because you're just that GREAT. (as others have already said).

IDK. I am not sure how I feel about it. I think the only other good part was also the most unrealistic part-the bully and the victim being friends. Yes, it happens(I know of a story where it even happened IRL). But still. I don't know if it's a good message or not ?  Overall, would give the movie a 5 out of 10 for the cast chemistry. And that's about the only recommendation I can give it.

Edited September 12, 2018 by IWantCandy71

[methodwriter85]

[Cranberry]

I was going to link that same video, @methodwriter85! I've watched some of her stuff before and I think she does a great job of pointing out a movie's flaws and explaining how the movie could be improved. I think she's pretty young, too (recently out of high school?), so I'm even more impressed by how insightful she is and how much she knows about movies from the '80s and '90s. Anyway, I did enjoy the movie and I'm not sorry I watched it, but I agree with her.

[Mabinogia]

10 hours ago, Cranberry said:

Anyway, I did enjoy the movie and I'm not sorry I watched it, but I agree with her.

That's where I'm at. I enjoyed it and am glad I watched it, but it could have been better.

[methodwriter85]

11 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

That's where I'm at. I enjoyed it and am glad I watched it, but it could have been better.

Me, too. And that is a disappointment, because other than Ricki Lake and Nikki Blonsky in the two versions Hairspray, I cannot think of a movie led by a teenage female protagonist that wasn't under a size 6. (Hell, for a good while in the 90's and 2000's, they weren't allowed to be over a size 2.)

All they needed to do was show that Sierra was genuinely contrite for what she did, and make an actual attempt to make amends. A song about how she did the mean things she did because she's not a pretty little rose doesn't really cut it. The movie works so well otherwise. The actress playing Veronica especially did her best to sell this movie.

Edited September 18, 2018 by methodwriter85

[aradia22]

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A tad disappointed in the “you don’t know what it’s like to be a teenage girl that looks like this!”- seemed to me that she was lamenting as if she was deformed or something or her weight was the cause of all her problems.

Along the same lines as everyone else, I thought this was a place where the ending was rushed. I think it's totally fine for her to say this. She's a teenage girl having an emotional outburst. But in addition to wanting more from her in earning back Dan, Jamey, Veronica, etc. I wish there had been a scene with her mom where they hashed this out. She really only talked to her dad and Veronica had her own scene with her mom but the movie never really resolved Sierra's issues with her own mom.

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I adore Noah Centineo and thought Jamey was relatively decent, but he wasn't developed enough. Jamey was too perfect so it made him a little less believable. Noah only made him a 3D character through his acting, rather than through the writing. 

Agreed. He definitely falls into the category of perfect wish fulfillment love interests.

Quote

They should have ended it with Sierra going to the dance alone, maybe in the hopes of seeing the people she hurt because they'd been ignoring her and at the dance she thought they wouldn't be able to and she could face them. Going up to Veronica and actually apologizing, in person, not some song she texted to her which seemed more for Sierra than for Veronica anyway (Sierra finally embraces her talent! Yay her). Veronica says it will take time but thanks for the apology. 

Then she sees Jamey. She explains how everything got so out of hand and she never meant for any of it to happen. It could end with a dance. A promise to the audience that they will make it, but it is going to take time. 

With that kind of ending, hopeful but not fully resolved with a self serving song, I would have liked the movie a lot more. I just hate that everyone forgave her so easily just because she was the lead in the movie. 

I was able to hand waive it and enjoy my happy ending but I agree it was rushed and your ending would be more realistic. Reading into the movie, I think we were supposed to find "Sunflower" meaningful as a gesture to Veronica because Sierra was exposing herself and being vulnerable as a writer. The movie is not just about her looks but her difficulty in living in the shadow of her genius father and her writer's block. It's a smaller component but it's there. They keep coming back to it. I think the song would have been more meaningful if it had been slightly more universal and spoken to Veronica as well. Something like this...

Quote

All of this! If Sierra had blasted an email of Veronica being mean and bitchy I would have been more supportive of that because it is something Veronica chose to do, not something that was done to her. Even exposing the kiss between V and J (though no one would have cared) would again be more about feeling betrayed by Veronica. Instead Sierra chose to stoop to an even lower level than the mean girl and rub salt in the wound. It is a small thing that makes a huge difference in who we perceive Sierra.

Maybe my brain is broken from teen movies but I think I was fine with it because in the back of my mind, I knew it could have been worse. Like, when Veronica went with Spence to his car, I was so worried she was going to be assaulted rather than go through with a consensual encounter that she would later regret. And I can easily see how what Sierra posted from her account could have been more slut-shaming and vile. All anyone else knows is that Veronica kissed Spence at some point and then he dumped her over DM. They don't know that he dumped her as soon as she slept with him (or did something sexual... he had a small car). To me that would have been way too dark for this movie and almost impossible to come back from... more like Heathers or Jawbreaker.