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Spoiler Discussion Thread: The Sequel


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'Arrow': How Emily Bett Rickards' Final Episode Will Honor Olicity, OTA and Felicity Smoak's Legacy

By Leanne Aguilera‍, May 13, 2019

https://www.etonline.com/arrow-how-emily-bett-rickards-final-episode-will-honor-olicity-ota-and-felicity-smoaks-legacy

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When you were approaching this episode -- knowing it was going to be the last one for Felicity -- did Emily have any last wishes or Easter eggs that she wanted to make sure were included?

I don't think so. I think that we were on the same page as for her exit from the show. I know that Stephen had some. It was really important to him, and we had a lot of conversations about her ending as well. So between the three of us, I think we were all very happy with the outcome.

This is part of a much longer article/interview with Beth, but I just wanted to highlight this part because it makes me happy that The Captain and Felicity's #1 superfan had thoughts about how he wanted Felicity's time on the show to end. I've grown so apathetic about the show in these last few episodes, but I'm nevertheless ready for Stephen and Emily to rip my heart out tonight.

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Really liking Bronze Tiger in this clip:

 
Does "one of the last" mean one of the last photos or (hopefully) one of the last scenes -- as in there'll be more next season?
 
Edited by Trisha
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Arrow Showrunner Says She Approached "You Have Saved This City" Like A Series Finale
By RUSS BURLINGAME - May 13, 2019 
https://comicbook.com/dc/2019/05/13/arrow-showrunner-says-she-approached-you-have-saved-this-city-li/ 

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From an ominous tease in the flash-forwards to the final appearance of at least one major character tonight, Arrow is ready for a major change in approach that may essentially reset the show once again going into the eighth and final season in the fall. You can see more of how Schwartz is approaching all of that in our full interview later today, but before then,we asked her about how much tonight's episode, titled "You Have Saved This City," felt like a real ending.

"We actually did approach it that way in terms of, 'This might be the last time we see this,'" Schwartz told ComicBook.com in an inteview on Friday. "So we definitely had that in mind when we were breaking the episode, because Emily's leaving and, yeah, next season is a little different, so we definitely did approach it in that way."

There has been no word yet on whether Rickards might return for an appearance in the finale next season; her post-Arrow plans so far include some stage work and the upcoming indie film We Need To Talk. It was, as far as anybody can tell, Rickards's decision to leave and not driven by Arrow's story. Schwartz has said that Rickards is welcome back for the final season if she wants to come close out the show with her co-stars.

Edited by tv echo
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Arrow stars and boss preview 'humongous', 'beautiful' season 7 finale
By Chancellor Agard May 13, 2019
https://ew.com/tv/2019/05/13/arrow-season-7-preview-emily-bett-rickards-last-episode/ 

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“I think it’s a very different ending for Oliver versus a big bad than we’ve seen before,” Arrow showrunner Beth Schwartz tells EW.
*  *  *
According to star David Ramsey, this triple whammy of family-focused material gives the finale a unique “emotional resonance.”

“There are emotional family dynamics that we haven’t really dealt with before,” says Ramsey in the latest issue of Entertainment Weekly, on stands now. “This finale is all about family, right? What happens with Felicity, family. What happens with Emiko, family. And I think that hits in a way that the other finale didn’t hit. So yes, you still have the explosions, you still have a lot of big action scenes, that’s part of Arrow. But emotionally, there are things happening in this finale that you haven’t seen before.”

Because this is Arrow, we also know several surprises await us, too. In fact, Dinah actor Juliana Harkavy definitely didn’t see the season’s ending coming.

“I was very surprised. We knew that a lot of changes were happening, but we didn’t know all of them at the beginning of the season. So, there were things in there we could never have imagined were going to happen,” says Harkavy. “Ultimately, I’m really happy with how it ended. I think it’s beautiful. It’s starting to paint a picture of how the whole series will wrap next year, because we only have 10 episodes to tell the rest of the story.”
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ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: How does this season’s finale compare to previous ones? 
BETH SCHWARTZ:
It’s pretty humongous, because not only are we telling our finale story in the present day, but we’re also having a huge finale in our future storyline. So, it’s kind of a double finale in one.

The future storyline has been a bit of a slow burn this season. What do you hope people take away from the flash-forwards by the time the season ends? 
In the finale, especially at the end of the episode, we’re gonna going to connect the present-day story and the future story. So, it’ll become clear.

Before the show returned, you said this season’s theme was about redemption. What do you hope this finale says about that theme? 
It will definitely be prevalent in the finale in terms of Emiko and Oliver holding out thinking that she still is redeemable, and that will obviously be a struggle because she does a lot of bad stuff.

New photos revealed Black Siren and Bronze Tiger are in the mix, too. What role do they play in the finale? 
That also tied with our redemption arc, in terms of those were two characters who, at the beginning, were villains. By the finale, because of Oliver and the team, they’re now fighting alongside the heroes, so we really loved that idea.
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I know this finale will mark the end of Emily’s run as Felicity. In sending Felicity off, what was the most important thing you wanted to hit in this finale? 
A bunch of things. She’s obviously a crucial part of the show, and we’re all super sad to see both Emily and Felicity go, so we just wanted to make sure that we honor her character in terms of her relationship with Oliver, in terms of her being a hero in her own right, as well as her relationship with Mia [Katherine McNamara] in the future. We have a lot to tie up.

How drastically did Emily’s departure affect how you ended the season? 
It definitely affected a lot because ending such an important character on a show is such a big responsibility, and so we wanted to give her the send-off she deserves. We spend a lot of time with her.

We’re also heading into the final season. Does this finale setup Oliver’s arc for season 8, or will this be a bit more closed off? 
It definitely sets up next season. I can’t talk too much about season 8 yet, but it’ll definitely launch you into season 8.

What’s the significance of calling the episode “You Have Saved This City”? 
It sort of talks about his entire journey of the series. He basically starts season 1 trying to save the city, and this will bookend it in a nice way.
*  *  *
One of the interesting things about this season has been the tension between the present-day and future storylines. In 2019, Oliver and Felicity are endeavouring to create a safe world for their children, but the flash-forwards reveal that they failed. Can we expect some kind of resolution to that tension? 
Not this season, no.

So, is this the end of the flash-forwards? 
No.

I’ve heard The Flash will include its own tease for the next crossover, “Crisis on Infinite Earths.” Can we expect Arrow to include something like that in its finale? 
It’s definitely possible.

Edited by tv echo
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ARROW'S SHOWRUNNER PREVIEWS THE SEASON FINALE AND FELICITY'S DEPARTURE
Bryan Cairns   May 13, 2019
https://www.syfy.com/syfywire/arrows-showrunner-previews-the-season-finale-and-felicitys-departure 

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Showrunner Beth Schwartz recently spoke with SYFY WIRE about Oliver versus Emiko, Roy’s road to redemption, saying goodbye to Felicity, and her thoughts on next season’s epic crossover, "Crisis on Infinite Earths."

What can you preview about the showdown between Oliver and his half-sister, Emiko?
It’s definitely going to be emotional for Oliver going against his sister. It will be a different kind of fight than we’ve seen in the past.

For Oliver, it’s always been about family. What kind of toll will this take on him?
What we crafted this season is this cycle that was brought to him by his father. By meeting Emiko, he sees he wasn’t the only one affected. In his mind, the two of them are the only people who can break this cycle of violence for their future generations.
*  *  *
Roy murdered two innocent police officers in this blood rage. How will he come back from that?
We will answer that a little bit in the finale. But we will get into it more next season. Roy has been through a lot on our series. We wanted to reveal what he’s been struggling with, and what his own adventure has been with Thea and Nyssa and going after the Lazarus Pits.

Laurel Lance, aka Black Siren, returns to pitch in. How has Laurel changed since she’s been away from the team?
After Episode 18, when Laurel had all the support of her fellow women on the show, she took that to heart. She will come back on the right side of things and on the side of the heroes.

This season has been split into present-day events and flashfowards. In what way will the future impact the present-day characters?
The finale is going to feel like a double finale. We are wrapping up what’s happening in our present storyline, but also our future storyline. There will definitely be a connection between the two stories.

Emily Bett Rickards is sadly leaving the show. What kind of send-off did you want to give Felicity Smoak?
It was very sad, I’m still sad about it, but I wanted to honor Felicity both in the present day and in the future stories we’ve told all year. All I can say is that the last 10 minutes, I’m in tears every time I watch it.

How would you describe the state of Team Arrow by the end of the finale?
They end in a good place.

You’ve been guarded about spoilers this season. How tough has that been when promoting the show?
In the beginning of this season, we had so many cards to turn over in terms of no one knew we were going to jump to the future. I know as a fan of television myself, how much I love to be surprised. If I read it somewhere, I don’t like to be spoiled. It was definitely challenging to keep a lot of those secrets, especially Mia being Oliver and Felicity’s child. That was also another big spoiler I’m very happy didn’t get out.

It’s a little early to be talking about next season, but we know an epic crossover is coming. What does "Crisis on Infinite Earths" mean to you?
It’s going to affect our next season greatly. That’s all I can say. It’s going to be insane. 

Edited by tv echo
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2 hours ago, tv echo said:

There has been no word yet on whether Rickards might return for an appearance in the finale next season; her post-Arrow plans so far include some stage work and the upcoming indie film We Need To Talk. It was, as far as anybody can tell, Rickards's decision to leave and not driven by Arrow's story. Schwartz has said that Rickards is welcome back for the final season if she wants to come close out the show with her co-stars.

So not dead then?  Although she could return in flashbacks but that would be too infuriating.

(As I watched the rage over GoT last night, I crossed my fingers that I won't feel the same way after this episode of Arrow.)

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1 hour ago, tv echo said:

Laurel Lance, aka Black Siren, returns to pitch in. How has Laurel changed since she’s been away from the team?
After Episode 18, when Laurel had all the support of her fellow women on the show, she took that to heart. She will come back on the right side of things and on the side of the heroes.

Glad that 90 seconds really stuck with her. 

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19 minutes ago, Mary0360 said:

Lol at Beth thinking Mia being the Olicity child didn’t get out. Honey, one of your actors blabbed that before the season had even begun.

To be fair, even with that info a bunch people didn't believe it until it happened and they went out of their way show and promo-wise to make it look like it wasn't the case, so it's not like the double wedding where there were actual pictures.

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I'm really at a loss as to what to expect from Season 8 and anyone's involvement in it. I mean, I guess we can see how Diggle forms his agency, Rene becomes mayor and Dinah eventually loses her job at the SCPD, but I just don't care? Wondering if we'll hear anything this week or have to wait until closer to SDCC.

I'm going to be watching Season 8 — not sure as a priority though — but I have zero idea what I'm going to be watching. 

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Since the city was saved by the end of 722, the only thing left to do in season 8 is to show how it all went to shit and why vigilantes became hated. Not exactly compelling reasons to tune in, even before factoring in the absence of Felicity, Olicity, and presumably Oliver tripping around the universe.

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So do we think it’s three timelines/storylines in S8: Dinah and crew messing up the present, Oliver jumping around the multiverse, and the flash forwards? Cause one of those could be dropped pretty easily (with the future including explanations of how things got so bad). 

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4 minutes ago, Trisha said:

So do we think it’s three timelines/storylines in S8: Dinah and crew messing up the present, Oliver jumping around the multiverse, and the flash forwards? Cause one of those could be dropped pretty easily (with the future including explanations of how things got so bad). 

It could but if it means Rene and Dinah aren't travelling the multiverse with him I'm ok with that, easier to skip, apart from Dig getting stuck with them. Unfortunately Oliver will get blamed for whatever they get up to even if he isn't there for a lot of it.

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12 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

It could but if it means Rene and Dinah aren't travelling the multiverse with him

Are we sure that they’re signed on for next season? I remember when it came out that EBR wasn’t coming back there was chatter that JH would also have a reduced role. And RG’s social posts during the wrap party made it sound like he was saying goodbye.

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The best thing about the ending is WE DON'T HAVE TO CARE what happens to the dead weight!!!!

Our OTP are roaming the multiverse.

Head canon dictates Mia and William will be trying all sheets of crazy things to get their parents back but I love that non of the other junk matters and affects my OTP.

Squeeeeeee

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54 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Are we sure that they’re signed on for next season? I remember when it came out that EBR wasn’t coming back there was chatter that JH would also have a reduced role. And RG’s social posts during the wrap party made it sound like he was saying goodbye.

You're right, we don't know anything for sure I was just working on the theory we're not getting rid of Not!TA because they've had a lot of screen time with SA getting more time off and their roles in the FFs. But that doesn't mean they are there for every ep or even as regulars. Kid of just assumed that JH would still be around when everyone else had gone home. I wonder if they'll up KMcN for the final few?

Edited by Featherhat
Stupid auto correct
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Didn't Dinah also plan to go into hiding in the future?  I thought that was the deal that Overwatch, Black Canary and Arsenal took the blame for blowing up the wall and went on the run leaving Rene and the kids to rebuild everything. 

So while Dinah could show up in the future again, as of now, she's not written as coming back. So even if she's around next season, I think she'll only be in the present day Star City stuff. Mia said rumors put the blame on Dinah for what happened to Star City so she's got to get going on mucking it up.   

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She’s always posting motivational IG stories so who knows if it means anything but today JH posted about recognizing when a “phase, job or relationship” is over and learning how to let it go. 

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Hmm. Well that could mean anything or nothing, heh. If it is related to Arrow the cast are probably considering the next step even if they expect to appear in the majority of the final 10. I hope there is as little as possible and most of that is them messing it up without Oliver and Felicity. Though I don't want Dig to be used as a pod person again like he so often is and hopefully some good Lyla stuff.

Edited by Featherhat
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8 hours ago, Featherhat said:

You're right, we don't know anything for sure I was just working on the theory we're not getting rid of Not!TA because they've had a lot of screen time with SA getting more time off and their roles in the FFs. But that doesn't mean they are there for every ep or even as regulars. Kid of just assumed that JH would still be around when everyone else had gone home. I wonder if they'll up KMcN for the final few?

I'm willing to bet Kat, Andrea, Ben, and Joseph are regulars for next season. And there was a unconfirmed rumor back when EBR Announced her departure that Juliana will only be in 5 Episodes and there would be a lot more Flashforwards. 

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I'm here for the Flashforwards.  Last night I realized I didn't care a whit about the team in the present taking down Emiko but did a lot about cleaning up the misused Archer tech and the fallout from that.  And the future OTA area pleasure to watch.  I don't think I'll have to struggle to watch them next season.  Which is a relief.  But not sure getting my weekly dose of Diggle will be worth sitting through unrelieved Rene and Dinah.  Maybe they will seem less awful if they no longer have Oliver to be awful to?  

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I guess Diggle is going to build his security company next season. I wonder if Lyla will be around much.

DR said that Diggle is alive in the future so maybe he'll finally be seen in the future forwards. CH is also back next season although that could be in flashbacks explaining what happened to Roy.

IMO, the only thing worse than too much Rene and Dinah is a Connor/Mia/JJ triangle.

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58 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

I guess Diggle is going to build his security company next season. I wonder if Lyla will be around much.

DR said that Diggle is alive in the future so maybe he'll finally be seen in the future forwards. CH is also back next season although that could be in flashbacks explaining what happened to Roy.

IMO, the only thing worse than too much Rene and Dinah is a Connor/Mia/JJ triangle.

I hope Lyla is around, she'd probably have to be if there's Connor and JJ stories and Single doing his own private security. Please God no love triangle good brother vs "bad boy" brother. It's never a great story for me and Arrow in particular should be careful about that from the several times they've tried to do it before. It wouldn't surprise me though since the other storylines will probably have limited romance in them, especially if they are still harbouring a few hopes of a spin off.

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2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I guess Diggle is going to build his security company next season. I wonder if Lyla will be around much.

DR said that Diggle is alive in the future so maybe he'll finally be seen in the future forwards. CH is also back next season although that could be in flashbacks explaining what happened to Roy.

IMO, the only thing worse than too much Rene and Dinah is a Connor/Mia/JJ triangle.

Yeah that would be awful. I can't see Mia being into an evil Human Being. Just have Connor be her True love. And bring on a decent fellow for William 

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1 hour ago, Featherhat said:

I hope Lyla is around, she'd probably have to be if there's Connor and JJ stories and Single doing his own private security. Please God no love triangle good brother vs "bad boy" brother. It's never a great story for me and Arrow in particular should be careful about that from the several times they've tried to do it before. It wouldn't surprise me though since the other storylines will probably have limited romance in them, especially if they are still harbouring a few hopes of a spin off.

Love Triangles involving Siblings/Family Members are just Awful. If they have to have a love triangle bring on some new guy OR make Mia and Zoe Bi and do that 

Edited by jay741982
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3 hours ago, statsgirl said:

CH is also back next season although that could be in flashbacks explaining what happened to Roy.

I haven't been paying attention.  Did they confirm CH was back next season?  They wrote him out of both the 2019 and 2040 storlines

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29 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I haven't been paying attention.  Did they confirm CH was back next season?  They wrote him out of both the 2019 and 2040 storlines

Beth mentioned in an interview that they would go more into Roy dealing with his blood lust and the fact that he killed 2 cops in s8

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From Beth's Syfy interview (posted above)...

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Roy murdered two innocent police officers in this blood rage. How will he come back from that?
We will answer that a little bit in the finale. But we will get into it more next season. Roy has been through a lot on our series. We wanted to reveal what he’s been struggling with, and what his own adventure has been with Thea and Nyssa and going after the Lazarus Pits.

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34 minutes ago, way2interested said:

Beth mentioned in an interview that they would go more into Roy dealing with his blood lust and the fact that he killed 2 cops in s8

Interesting, thanks. I thought 723 was his exit with everything they setup

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36 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Maybe it was supposed to be and they signed him late.

It read so much like a series finale, I don’t understand how they are coming back. 

I don't understand why they're coming back, even less than how!

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12 hours ago, tv echo said:

Full ComicBook interview with Beth...

Arrow Showrunner Beth Schwartz On Tonight's Season 7 Finale
By RUSS BURLINGAME - May 13, 2019 
https://comicbook.com/2019/05/13/arrow-showrunner-beth-schwartz-on-tonights-season-7-finale/ 

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I asked Juliana Harkavy about this earlier in the season, but did you worry at any point that showing things in such a state of disarray 20 years down the line would undermine what Team Arrow is trying to accomplish in the present day?

Not really. I mean, I know the outcome of things, and that was a story that we were telling this season for many different reasons, in terms of Mia's arc and what happened to some of our characters. It will become clearer, I think, possibly by the finale and definitely in the next season.

If she didn't know it was a mistake when she set it up, she must have realized it by now. So many complaints that such a depressing future means the present storyline feels hopeless too.

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But this year, I feel like you guys did. Starting with the jail and going to being deputized, it felt like this show was wildly different this year than it was 365 days ago. Was that a matter of you guys knowing the end was coming and checking things off your bucket list?

We didn't know the end was coming when we started, but I think it was just about wanting to do something different.

So they didn't know that this was going to be the last season? I wonder when SA told them that he was out.

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Sometime before the announcement of a short final S8 for crossover purposes? It's also highly possible they knew SA was likely out ala EBR sooner rather than later and it was a question of whether the show could go on with the Legacies or the Noobs (or both) minus SA. The Legacy Trio have been decently received despite so many people hating the apocalyptic FFs so it's not surprising they're getting more focus next season and maybe a spin off still pitched.

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7 hours ago, Featherhat said:

Sometime before the announcement of a short final S8 for crossover purposes? It's also highly possible they knew SA was likely out ala EBR sooner rather than later and it was a question of whether the show could go on with the Legacies or the Noobs (or both) minus SA. The Legacy Trio have been decently received despite so many people hating the apocalyptic FFs so it's not surprising they're getting more focus next season and maybe a spin off still pitched.

I’m still so curious about the timeline. SA made it seem like he warned them last season that he was out so I think you’re right about them thinking they’d go on without him (and presumably EBR, since her character’s story is so tied to his), but when did they know next season would be 10 and done? Because I’m actually quite impressed by the way they wrote out EBR, and it feels like they had a lot of time to set that up. 

The CW has a full slate (they renewed every show for the first time ever and picked up three new ones) so if there’s a spin-off it probably won’t fit next year mid-season, but in the fall. So at least they have some more time to see if the next 10 eps prove the kids can carry a show. I love the characters but am not convinced by the current set up.

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From some tweets from people that got to watch the finale a day early with SA, I got the impression that he is the one responsible for Felicity leaving with the monitor though it's possible i misinterpreted what was said about him insisting on that scene at the end with Felicity .

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19 hours ago, Chaser said:

Maybe it was supposed to be and they signed him late.

It read so much like a series finale, I don’t understand how they are coming back. 

I think it was.  I think whatever comes back in S8 isn't really going to be Arrow.  Just part setup for COIE and part setup for a possible 2040 NTA Spin-off

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3 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I think it was.  I think whatever comes back in S8 isn't really going to be Arrow.  Just part setup for COIE and part setup for a possible 2040 NTA Spin-off

Also to close some storylines for Diggle, Dinah and Rene so they check off all the things mentioned in FF. The Connor thing, Knight watch, Canary network.

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29 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

Also to close some storylines for Diggle, Dinah and Rene so they check off all the things mentioned in FF. The Connor thing, Knight watch, Canary network.

Yep, i'm now wondering if anyone will get a 10 episode contract?  Like maybe they go like The Walking Dead where each episode focuses on a specific group.

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3 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

From some tweets from people that got to watch the finale a day early with SA, I got the impression that he is the one responsible for Felicity leaving with the monitor though it's possible i misinterpreted what was said about him insisting on that scene at the end with Felicity .

I'm kind of confused on that too. I think the Monitor being there is too big of an ending to be a tack on at an actor's request. My thought is that there was supposed to be a reunion after the portal but SA thought it would be better for EBR's last scene to just be Felicity. If that's the case, I agree with him. The promise of a reunion was beautiful and if we got it so close to the good-bye I think it wouldn't have had the same impact.

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4 hours ago, Chaser said:

I'm kind of confused on that too. I think the Monitor being there is too big of an ending to be a tack on at an actor's request. My thought is that there was supposed to be a reunion after the portal but SA thought it would be better for EBR's last scene to just be Felicity. If that's the case, I agree with him. The promise of a reunion was beautiful and if we got it so close to the good-bye I think it wouldn't have had the same impact.

So maybe he was just vocal about when the scene came in the episode?

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4 hours ago, Chaser said:

I'm kind of confused on that too. I think the Monitor being there is too big of an ending to be a tack on at an actor's request. My thought is that there was supposed to be a reunion after the portal but SA thought it would be better for EBR's last scene to just be Felicity. If that's the case, I agree with him. The promise of a reunion was beautiful and if we got it so close to the good-bye I think it wouldn't have had the same impact.

I'm okay with only insofar as I can assume the reunion has already been filmed and is now just being saved for later. 

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Maybe it originally ended with Felicity, Mia and William at Oliver’s grave and that was the last image (his grave)? Sort of a, no, they don’t prevent Oliver’s death like people would probably think after the Monitor says he dies? So the Monitor would have been around anyway? And we could’ve been left to only assume Felicity’s own mission was Oliver-related?

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12 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

From some tweets from people that got to watch the finale a day early with SA, I got the impression that he is the one responsible for Felicity leaving with the monitor though it's possible i misinterpreted what was said about him insisting on that scene at the end with Felicity .

From what I’ve read it sounded like he pushed for Felicity to have the last scene by herself for her last ep. He also seemed to console the people who were upset and told them Felicity and Oliver were together, but I didn’t get the impression he was responsible for that part.

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A reunion scene might have been filmed. IIRC, on April 9 there was a BTS picture with a guy holding the baby.  I thought the guy might be SA’s double.  He had on a green jacket like GA’s and his hair was really long, similar to what I imagine GA’s might look like if it hadn’t been cut in years.  Was it cut or will it be used in S8?

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