Season 2 Talk

[Last Time Lord]

Yeah, no way in hell would this have been left out of the tapes. 

The relationship is a complete and total retcon, but damn if they weren’t completely adorable together.

Grow up, Clay.  Really says a lot that Justin was the voice of reason in that scene. 

And between the drugs and sex with multiple partners, Justin should probably get tested for... everything. 

[Last Time Lord]

God, I miss Jeff

I... may have cheered when Alex screamed that Bryce was a rapist in a crowded hallway. Put Jessica in an awkward situation, but it was nice to hear a character say it out loud. 

I don't remember the name of the actor that plays Alex, but this has been his season. He has just been killing it!

If Clay did what I think he just did... I’m shocked it didn’t happen sooner. 

23 hours ago, HollyG said:

Please tell me I'm not the only one worried about Tyler. 

I’ve been worried about him since he started hanging around with Cyrus. 

[Last Time Lord]

On 5/20/2018 at 12:08 AM, Lady Calypso said:

It seems like the judge really favours the defense attorney. I've noticed in almost single episode, during the courtroom scenes, the judge has, more often than not, overruled Dennis' objections and sustained the defense attorney's.

Yep. They’re Broadchurch Season Two-ing the trial, and I absolutely hate it. 

[Hellohappylife]

1 hour ago, mrsh said:

I agree with you so much. Watching Tyler get assaulted by that group of assholes left me feeling sick to my stomach. Honestly, U was annoyed all season long by the core group ignoring Tyler and making him seem like a monster. He was definitely wrong for spying on Hannah and taking the photo of her and Courtney but all of then were jerks to her in one way or another and were no better than Tyler. The whole season it hurt me to see him being rejected and abused. Like, did these kids (and adults) learn nothing from what happened with Hannah??? Watching him use his newfound coping skills when confronted with the jocks in the washroom only to be brutally assaulted had me sobbing. I dont know if I will watch season 3, I get its realistic that the jocks and especially Bryce with his money and privilege would walk free but it got too depressing for me.

I totally agree! I hated how horrible the group treated Tyler. Did they learn nothing from Hannah? It was sad to watch them repeat the cycle. But sadly no matter how many kids commit suicide due to bullying it doesn’t stop,kids are always going to bully we can only change how we choose to help kids thru it & taking their feelings serious. 

The Tyler bathroom scene was hard to watch,it kinda came out of nowhere.  

[Tired of Lurking]

First post!
This is definitely not how I expected season two to be told and, though it's even slower-paced than the first season, there are a few things I really dig.

I'm kind of in love with Snarky Ghost Hannah. I think having her be the voice of the audience in teasing Clay about all the annoying things he says and does is a welcome addition. Wish she would have called him out on his dumb "kissing half the school" comment though-- if he's trying to prove himself different than the other boys, that isn't helping. 

I also really enjoy the sense of humor. Between the 'am I racist?' line and Alex's deadpan sarcasm and even the cripple humor, I am definitely enjoying the levity. Wasn't expecting so much in the middle of all the angst from these two seasons.

Justin, ugh man. That's a heartbreaking story if I've ever seen one. However, I'm really happy to see Tyler find a crew of outcasts. Here's to hoping he ditches the guns and isn't the subject of season three.

I still think Marcus is beyond redemption and don't expect him to prove me wrong on the next episode.

Get well, Skye.

[Zima]

I really liked season 1, but after watching S2 E1, Idk. I felt like the magic was missing. I might watch another ep to see if it improves for me. 

[Marley]

Clay was such a stupid asshole this season as well I kind of hate him now.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Yay, Jeff! Although I get that Jeff has shown himself to be a trustworthy person, it bothered me a little that Clay told him that the poem everyone had been talking about was Hannah's. Way to respect her privacy, man.

Clay leaving all these messages for Skye (who has not called him back once) is starting to seem like his version of Hannah's tapes - not that he's specifically calling anyone out, but he seems to be using Skye's voicemail as his own little form of therapy, to put his thoughts out there into the ether when there are real live people who would talk to him in person right now if he would just say these things to him instead of calling a girl who dumped him and is in rehab.

Why didn't Alex just call or text Tyler and tell him to come back after Zach and Jessica told him to leave the arcade? Kids, you have all this technology available at your fingertips so use it!

Clay's jealousy is still annoying me. First it was about anyone who had ever touched Hannah and now he's jealous of Justin too? Dude, what was he supposed to do? Sit in your room by himself while you were at Alex's birthday party? God forbid he watch tv downstairs with your parents like a normal person.

Poor Alex. He feels so alone and so broken and he has so much anger and no one to direct it towards so he's having these outbursts with the people who love him.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I laughed when I saw that some of the bathroom graffiti said "FUCK PORTER." Am I going to hell for that? And that was before Clay leaked the tapes so clearly everyone knew that he was doing a shit job.

Hannah's dad is an idiot. They live in a pretty small city and he's just kissing his girlfriend in public thinking that no one will see and recognize him as the pharmacist on Main Street? I don't know if it would be worse for Hannah or Olivia to see it or for someone else to see it and tell one of them.

Man, if Skye managed to get that much clarity in the week or two that she's been in rehab, then maybe Clay needs to go too. I mean, seriously, she is like a completely different person now - calm, emotionally mature, rational, etc.

I'm glad that Jessica went to Hannah's mom. I think they could both really benefit from each other's company.

Oh, poor Justin. He felt bad enough about the trouble he was causing at Clay's house that he went back to Meth Seth's house? I was really afraid he was going to OD when Alex found him. I know he couldn't stay at Clay's forever, but going back to the house where his mom's abusive boyfriend knows he stole $1000 is not going to end well for him, especially before he's had a chance to testify.

Bryce is a typical privileged spoiled brat who hides behind daddy's money. Listen, jackass, just because you got lucky in the birth lottery doesn't mean that you're better than anyone else. And never forget that it's daddy's money, not yours. But as soon as Justin confronted him, Bryce resorted to "my daddy is richer than your daddy." He is the epitome of a rich dickwad.

[sacrebleu]

The most frustrating thing about season 2 was that the school didn't seem to be doing much to address the issue of bullying. I mean, there was basically a riot in the hallway-- and nobody gets suspended/expelled/detention? (the 'skills' class was basically a joke). Although I suppose you could argue that they couldn't seem to be changing too much-- because it would lend strength to the Baker's suit-- that their protocol - or lack thereof -- was at fault.

I was (sadly) not at all surprised to see that the show took the Brock Turner route with Bryce's trial--  a judge not wanting to ruin the life of a 'promising' young man. He lost his baseball scholarships and gets probation (the scholarships-- not much of a loss, as his folks can pay tuition anywhere).

Also -- maddingly realistic that Justin fared worse-- because he doesn't have family/money. I think that's why Clay's folks were so quick to adopt-- he was staying in the system unless someone claimed him, so they claimed him.

[memememe76]

There was the scene where Jessica did feel better for reporting the crime, regardless of the outcome. I think that is an important thing too. 

Sheri spent 5 months in juvie for hitting a stop sign and not reporting it. And Clay still treats her like crap, while is he now brothers with Justin. That is the injustice!

Edited May 21, 2018 by memememe76

[mledawn]

On 5/20/2018 at 1:36 PM, Last Time Lord said:

I’ve mixed them up so often I’ve been second guessing myself if they’re two different characters or not. 

Oh man, SAME

[mledawn]

I also didn't understand why Alex didn't override Zach and Jessica. Alex seemed totally fine with Tyler coming when they saw him in the pharmacy. CONTRIVANCE.

[Negritude]

On 5/19/2018 at 5:01 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Tony has a glorious head of hair. I just wish he didn't slick it back so often. It looks so much better when it's just loose.

I think that to myself every time he's on screen lol. 

Those "street" kids in Oakland <face palm> nope and nope. I know the "Town" is more gentrified as of late but damn! This was so off it was laughable. And a show about a high school set in NorCal (and I'm guessing the bay area) where the word "hella" is not even uttered once in 2 seasons. That kind of stuff takes me out. But its rare that a show really gets it right with area specific slang and authentic portrayals of how teenagers actually speak so they're not alone.

[Negritude]

So how old is Tony's boyfriend supposed to be? I mean how many attractive, sweet, kind, loving grown men are trying to be serious with a high school kid unless they're up to some R. Kelly shenanigans or are a recent graduate and they knew each other before. That's the thing about having grown ass adults playing teenage characters, they look similar in age because the actors probably are, hell Tony looks older than him, so the difference isn't as glaring as it could be in real life.

But we're supposed to think its cute. If it was an older guy with one of the girls, it would be yet another melodramatic plot point.

[truthaboutluv]

So I'm slowly making my way through the season because much as I loved the first season, I regretted bingeing through it in a day and a half because it was way too heavy to absorb that quickly. So I'm choosing to take my time with this season, even though I am loving it as much as Season 1 so far. I'm also having to work hard to avoid spoilers. I swear that stuff just pops up on my social media timeline. 

I wanted to comment on one thing so far after seeing the first two episodes. Okay this may be a bit harsh but honestly, I am not here for the Clay/Skye pairing. In fairness, I wasn't a fan since last season, even though I knew that's where they were going to go in the second season, especially seeing her in the car with him, Tony and Tony's boyfriend at the end of the last season. 

I just think Clay is so obviously transferring his savior complex to Skye in a "she's damaged like Hannah was and I couldn't save Hannah but I can still save Skye". And the fact is, that's not how mental illness works, especially when we're talking about characters so young. Skye is a cutter. That's clearly rooted in some deep-seated emotional and psychological issues and Clay cannot love her enough to fix that. Especially when Clay has his own mental illness issues that I hope the season will eventually address. 

I know there is a tendency sometimes, especially in Young Adult stories to romanticize two damaged people finding each other but that doesn't really work in the real world. I don't know, I just find Skye so broken and sad, more so than Hannah ever was to be honest. Hannah was actually pretty happy and vivacious, until all the crap started happening to her and it was pile on upon pile on that eventually culminated in the rape by Bryce and that being the final straw. I just find Clay and Skye awkward and painful together to be honest. 

[memememe76]

While I get the point of the Skye and Clay storyline, it does not help that they are just too incompatible (even though I appreciate something like street art, I don't need Clay to do it), and the actors have very little chemistry. I also didn't think the actress is that great. The actress who plays Alex's mom played a character with mental issues on Dawson's Creek, and she was so great. 

[memememe76]

I was initially annoyed Alex did not invite Tyler in the first place, but when I saw the party where only 4 non-family members were present, I sort of forgave him. Only his closest friends came. Would kids their age still like a party at the arcade? I think a simple dinner at Olive Garden could have sufficed. 

[amazinglybored]

I went into season 2 expecting to hatewatch it. This is the most furious I’ve ever been with a TV show.

 

Nina the rape victim burning those pictures and taking away the choice from other girls. Killing any potential cases that could have stemmed from the pictures.

Clay talking down a school shooter and then helping him escape. That message should never be sent.

Clay’s ignored hallucinations.

Clay’s problems with Hannah not being his image of her and how he applied that.

Chloe being pregnant with her rapist’s/boyfriend’s baby.

Showing that scene where Tyler got raped. Look, I was never going to forgive the character after the peeping tom stuff and the pictures but that didn’t need to be shown. 

The humanization of and attempts to gain sympathy for a school shooter.

Bryce getting off and Justin getting a worse sentence wasn’t unrealistic but I can’t say I wanted to see it or think it should have been the path they took because of the place the show has taken for some people.

[truthaboutluv]

19 minutes ago, memememe76 said:

The actress who plays Alex's mom played a character with mental issues on Dawson's Creek, and she was so great. 

Oh yes, Pacey and Andie. My true love Dawson's Creek ship (yes, come at me Pacey/Joey shippers). It's why I quit Dawson's Creek in Season 3 because I was forever bitter with how they crapped on that pairing to facilitate the Pacey/Joey pairing. Sorry, off topic, moving on...

 

21 minutes ago, memememe76 said:

and the actors have very little chemistry.

This so much. I definitely think the pairing could have survived all the issues I have with it, if the actors had amazing chemistry together. I mean I would still have the same criticisms and issues but I think I'd be a bit more receptive if there was at least great chemistry. But there isn't. And the problem isn't Dylan Minnette in my opinion because I thought Clay and Hannah had good chemistry and even him and Sherry last season. 

[reggiejax]

Quote

Season 2 has technically only taken place over a span of two weeks, until this episode skipped a month ahead (hence the April 18-20 time period indicated...although they said April 20th was a Saturday when it was actually a Friday last month). Hannah died six months ago, in the middle of October

I think what made the timeline unclear was adding on Bryce's trial. We only saw the end of it, as Bryce's "sentence" was being rendered. And I get that TV shows will condense timelines, but even by "TV time" Bryce's trial happened incredibly quickly. Not to mention they made it seem as if Justin was locked up for 6 months. Or maybe he was only given a 6 month sentence, I am not really clear on that. Nor am I clear on just what he was locked up for. It got confusing to say the least. 

[imakicola]

I can’t believe how much chemistry Zach and Hannah had in this episode. Like, I did NOT expect that, even with the hint of it last season!

[memememe76]

OMG, Pacey and Andie forever!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, memememe76 said:

Would kids their age still like a party at the arcade?

I feel fairly safe in saying that most 17 year old kids would not want a birthday party like that, but the arcade was his dad’s idea and I think Alex didn’t want to hurt his dad’s feelings by saying he had no interest in doing that for his birthday. He  clearly feels a tremendous amount of guilt and feels that he has let his parents down so I think he was just humoring them. It helps that he knows that Jessica and Zach are supportive friends who won’t gove him shit for having a birthday party that’s better suited to a 7 year old. 

[dlyn]

1 hour ago, reggiejax said:

I think what made the timeline unclear was adding on Bryce's trial. We only saw the end of it, as Bryce's "sentence" was being rendered. And I get that TV shows will condense timelines, but even by "TV time" Bryce's trial happened incredibly quickly. Not to mention they made it seem as if Justin was locked up for 6 months. Or maybe he was only given a 6 month sentence, I am not really clear on that. Nor am I clear on just what he was locked up for. It got confusing to say the least. 

I also got completely lost in the timeline with Bryce’s trial. From what Zach said at the wake, I think Justin got six months probation (for being an accessory to sexual assault), while Bryce got three. Justin wasn’t in jail for any more than a month tops and was only in that long because they couldn’t release him to a guardian. 

[ClareWalks]

The whole courtroom testimony that Hannah was sexting annoyed the shit out of me. I was waiting for the prosecutors to say "objection, that's speculation" but no. The kid saw her take a cleavage selfie. He has no clue if she actually took it, let alone if she sent it to anyone, let alone if she sent it to a guy, let alone the fact that he acted like Hannah was cheating on him by doing it even though *they never dated ever.*

[Last Time Lord]

5 hours ago, memememe76 said:

I was initially annoyed Alex did not invite Tyler in the first place, but when I saw the party where only 4 non-family members were present, I sort of forgave him. Only his closest friends came. Would kids their age still like a party at the arcade? I think a simple dinner at Olive Garden could have sufficed. 

I got the impression the party was more for Alex’s parents than for Alex. 

Something they probably thought they would never experience again, tried to recreate a happy memory, and just sort of overdid it

[starri]

22 hours ago, Hope said:

That fight scene was epic. Probably one of the most enjoyable scenes in the series so far because the "loners" and "freaks" finally stood up for themselves against the jocks. 

Alex using his cane to whale on Montgomery and/or Scott was to date the highlight of the season.

With Courtney pulling the fire alarm being a close second.

[truthaboutluv]

Quote

Tyler's stuff with his new friend Cyrus and I guess Cyrus' sister isn't horrible. Hopefully, the storyline continues to lead somewhere more positive, rather than taking a dark turn.

Yeah sadly, I don't see that being the case. I thought it was clear that the guy was building some type of home-made bomb when his sister came in and the way he spoke to her, totally getting underlying psycho vibes. I wish this would be a heartwarming story of Tyler finally finding friends and a place were he feels he belongs but yeah, not getting a good vibe at all.

[Last Time Lord]

2 hours ago, starri said:

Alex using his cane to whale on Montgomery and/or Scott was to date the highlight of the season.

I giggled way too hard at this. I wonder if they’re aware how interchangeable those two are. (It was Montgomery, BTW)

So... this episode. Holy shit, this episode.

You know you’re in for a fun time when there’s a content warning for sexual assault at the start of the episode!

Alex has his memory back, but it’s a real be careful what you wish for thing. 

[truthaboutluv]

On 5/19/2018 at 7:35 PM, Lady Calypso said:

Clay is very....selfish, isn't he? He thinks that he's in charge of all of this, that he's the only one that can avenge Hannah's death, or something. I really don't like when he fantasizes about Hannah in situations with other guys. The shot of her with Bryce in this episode, in particular, reflected worse on Clay. And he consistently does this too. His obsession with Hannah is more unhealthy than Tyler's, at this point. Though, can someone find him talking to "Hannah" soon?

I really didn't get that scene. Even if Clay was wondering if Marcus was telling the truth about Hannah saying she was interested in Bryce, he still knows for a fact that Bryce raped Hannah because Bryce fucking admitted it as he, Clay himself, keeps mentioning over and over. So that scene just seemed random and unnecessary in my opinion. 

But yes, Clay is still annoying and selfish in many ways. He means well but he can be frustratingly close minded in that pursuit. Though in fairness about  Alex and the tapes, Alex is the one who kept asking and demanding that Clay give them to him. I'm more annoyed at Clay's attitude towards Sherri. 

Yes, her accidentally running down the stop sign may have inadvertently caused the accident that killed Jeff but for fuck's sake it's not like she did it on purpose. And the fact is there aren't many teenagers who wouldn't just walk away from the scene of that accident if like Sherri, they were already in trouble with their parents over a previous accident and in their mind, no one got hurt other than a sign.

The poor girl did feel guilty and tried to make amends any way she could and eventually told the truth. But Clay is treating her like she's some monster. I was glad he got over himself long enough to say thank you to her for taking care of Justin, like a half-way decent human being. I am also curious where she was and why. By the way she spoke about her two roommates being addicts, I'd guess juvie but damn, they gave the girl juvie for a first offense and simply not reporting that she ran down the stop sign?

Finally, I guess it'd be too obvious for the guy who keeps looking at Clay to be the one sending the Polaroids but I also get a Jeff like vibe from him, like maybe he and Jeff were close and he knows how close Jeff was to Clay and so this is him trying to help in some way and do what he thinks Jeff would have done. 

Oh and so much for that redemption of Marcus that some were hoping. Kid is scum - an arrogant and manipulative little shit.

Edited May 22, 2018 by truthaboutluv

[Last Time Lord]

Well, okay. They went halfway Broadchurch Season Two. It sucks that the suit failed, but there’s still some semblance of possibility of justice with Bryce getting arrested for Jessica’s rape.   

[Last Time Lord]

Visual representation of me right now:

https://giphy.com/gifs/poldark-masterpiece-classic-HqfuApBtoE6ze

[tennisgurl]

It really is so weird looking at the flashbacks, where everyone is kind of an asshole, and the current story, where everyone is more miserable, but are generally nicer. Well, most everyone. Some people are dicks in both timelines, or alright in both timelines. It is always impressive how the show makes me want to smack the characters upside the head one minute, and give them a hug the next. Except Bryce, of course. Screw that guy. 

Whats become of Justin is so sad, but probably realistic, being a homeless teenager from an abusive home. Its even more striking seeing him in the flashback, as compared to how he is now. Justin can be such an asshole, but at this point, I cant even be mad at him. Its like kicking a dog that bit me once, but is now living in the street with two broken legs and fleas. 

Clay and snarky ghost Hannah are a fun pair, especially as snarky ghost Hannah is quick to call Clay out for his crap. His whole "did you kiss half the school?" thing is just so petty, especially as he tries to prove that he is better than the many sexist asshole guys at their school. Dude, Hannah kissed, like, three people that you've heard of. I think that Clays mental picture of Hannah, a super sweet and innocent tragic figure who he idealized, is starting to get a bit dirtier, at least to him. Really, Hannah can kiss (or whatever) as many people as she wants and it doesn't make her any less of a a good person, but it might not fit in as well with Clays version of her. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

6 hours ago, ClareWalks said:

The kid saw her take a cleavage selfie. He has no clue if she actually took it, let alone if she sent it to anyone, let alone if she sent it to a guy, let alone the fact that he acted like Hannah was cheating on him by doing it even though *they never dated ever.*

ITA - and for all he knows she took a selfie and deleted it or she was just using the front facing camera to look at herself (because haven’t we all used the fromt camera for non-selfie reasons at least once or twice?). He couldn’t even see her screen so for all he knows, she just unbuttoned her shirt while she was checking her text messages or reading something online. I will admit that sometimes I’m looking at stuff on my phone when I get undressed after work but that doesn’t mean I’m sexting. 

Unless they subpoena her phone records and show me a photo that’s date stamped with the time that Tyler was lurking outside her window AND a text that she sent to someone at the same time, then whatever. I mean, yes, it’s totally possible that she sent a picture of herself with her work shirt unbuttoned but Tyler can’t know that for sure, and Ricky Vasquez should have objected! 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

13 hours ago, Negritude said:

Those "street" kids in Oakland <face palm> nope and nope. I know the "Town" is more gentrified as of late but damn! This was so off it was laughable. And a show about a high school set in NorCal (and I'm guessing the bay area) where the word "hella" is not even uttered once in 2 seasons. That kind of stuff takes me out. But its rare that a show really gets it right with area specific slang and authentic portrayals of how teenagers actually speak so they're not alone.

The show was filmed in Vallejo. San Rafael, Sebastopol, and Mare Island and they’ve used locations that make it obvious to NorCal people that the show is set here (unlike some other shows that try to pass off one location for another and deliberately don’t show recognizable spots or landmarks). There are some links on the first page of the media thread with specific shootng locations if you’re interested in checking them out!

I live in Berkeley and although hella is still around, it’s a lot less pervasive than it was 10-20 years ago. But the reason I buy the lack of hella on this show is that with a few exceptions (mainly Justin) the main characters are very suburban trenagers (heh, although you could argue at this point, suburban teenagers are more likely to use slang like hella!). Even though Oakland and SF aren’t that far away, these kids might as well be living in any suburban neighborhood in America because they are so untouched by SF and Oakland.

What caught my ear was that when Tony and Clay were talking about going to look for Justin in Oakland, they kept referring to it as the city. Up here, the city always means SF. In local newspapers, SF is often referred to in print as The City. Even people who live way out in the burbs like Walnut Creek or Livermore (and for whom Oakland is closer) know that terminology and call SF “the city.” No one ever refers to Oakland as the city. I’m guessing this was the show’s attempt to make the show seem a little more generic/less location specific and they intended it to come off as “we live in this little town and Justin is in The Big Scary City” but they kind of ruined that by specifically telling us that he was in Oakland. 

Realistically, I think that the show is trying to be presented as more timeless so that it won’t be one of those shows/movies that ages badly, but I agree that if you live within 100 miles of NorCal, these little things are noticeable. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

3 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

By the way she spoke about her two roommates being addicts, I'd guess juvie but damn, they gave the girl juvie for a first offense and simply not reporting that she ran down the stop sign?

I wondered about that too because she’s in high school so why would she have roommates? And then I briefly wondered if she was older than the other kids and had started college, but then I remembered that this season begins five months after Hannah’s death, so even if Sheri left for college the day after Hannah died, she moved in with two addicts and then became an expert in detox which she then casually informed Clay about (even though they seem not to have become closer since S1 ended) so that he knew to contact her and ask her to come home from college to help Juston detox in his bedroom? Seems unlikely. But in a later episode we see Sheri at school with everyone else so she definitely isn’t in college, so I’m back to wondering when she had two addict roommates.

A brief stint in juvie seems like the most likely answer although I agree that it seems like a harsh punishment for hitting a street sign. I know a teenager who hit a street sign with her car (or maybe it was a lamp post?) on her way to school. She knocked it over and then just left the scene. She had to pay for the sign or lamp post to be fixed and I think she got one point on her driving record. That was it. No court case, no record, no juvie. 

[truthaboutluv]

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I wondered about that too because she’s in high school so why would she have roommates? And then I briefly wondered if she was older than the other kids and had started college, but then I remembered that this season begins five months after Hannah’s death, so even if Sheri left for college the day after Hannah died, she moved in with two addicts and then became an expert in detox which she then casually informed Clay about (even though they seem not to have become closer since S1 ended) so that he knew to contact her and ask her to come home from college to help Juston detox in his bedroom? Seems unlikely. But in a later episode we see Sheri at school with everyone else so she definitely isn’t in college, so I’m back to wondering when she had two addict roommates.

Clay didn't contact Sherri, Tony did and Clay was actually annoyed that Tony didn't ask him first since it's clear he wasn't too happy to see her. Also, we see Sheri talking to the guidance counselor in episode two and his discussing what she would have to do to catch up and graduate on time. So yeah, my guess is she was sent to some type of juvenile facility since it doesn't seem like she had any substance abuse issues or was struggling with mental illness.  At least not from what I remember of her last season. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Clay's dad has not been a huge part of the story, but I think that in general he's a nice guy so I had to laugh when he showed a bit of realistic cynicism after Clay said some people online called him a murderer because he was on the tapes and his dad's response was basically "Don't you know better than to read the comments on the internet?"

I find it interesting that Bryce's mom is the one who believes her son is guilty of the accusations.

Aww, watching Tyler and Mackenzie stealthily move to hold hands at the movie theater was cute. No matter how old you were the first time you went on a movie date and tried to figure out how to casually get the other person to hold your hand, you always remember that! But what was up with the very explicit instructions to only put butter on the popcorn that was on the left side of the container?

The entire time that Bryce and Chloe were talking about Hannah, I was like NOOOOOOO, don't believe anything that lying liar says to you!

Zach can be coward, but he has a good heart. He was very sweet to check on Chloe. If only she hadn't assumed that he was only asking because Bryce asked him to check up on her, maybe she would have told him how she really felt.

Seeing that Mr. Porter has genuine heartfelt regret did a lot to help improve my opinion of him from last season. Hell, even from earlier this season. He has gone from trying to protect his own ass to realizing that he could have done more and that he needs to admit it, even if it means losing his job and possibly never being hired as a high school counselor again. The kids are more protected since they're underage, but he is an adult so his name will be in the papers for everyone to see.

It's been nice to see Jessica smile this season. But her dad needs to STFU. He doesn't understand why she's "putting herself out there" by kissing a boy? He should be glad that she feels okay enough to kiss a boy again.

Although I've been slightly wary of Cyrus, so far the things that he and Tyler have done have been less awful than the things Bryce and some of the others on the tapes have done. Marcus getting a pink explosion in the face? That's barely above a practical joke. Blackmailing Marcus into calling Bryce a rapist at the baseball field ceremony? Embarrassing for Marcus but it was still true. Catfishing Ryan? Not nice but pretty mild since to the rest of the world, it just looked like he was sitting at the coffee shop which is not exactly next level embarrasment. Vandalizing the baseball field? I mean, yeah, that's an actual crime but still no lies. Bryce and his goons beating Clay up in the locker room was far worse than any of those things. The meanest thing that Tyler and Cyrus have done so far is leaving the creepy stalker pictures of his sister in his locker (although I guess if we believe Tyler, he wasn't responsible for that).

On 5/20/2018 at 4:57 PM, mledawn said:

Bryce can eat shit but when he said "Jesus, chew your fucking food" to that jackwad teammate, I laughed out loud.

That cracked me up too. He might be a bully and a rapist, but even he has table manners! Like seriously, guys. Chew your food with your mouths closed.

Edited May 22, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Loved that Hannah made Tony get a manicure with her.

I was totally cracking up when Justin revealed that their grand plan to break into the clubhouse was bolt cutters and Sheri just rolled her eyes at them.

[Last Time Lord]

40 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Loved that Hannah made Tony get a manicure with her.

I was totally cracking up when Justin revealed that their grand plan to break into the clubhouse was bolt cutters and Sheri just rolled her eyes at them.

Best part of that was Sheri going “why don’t you just break the door down?” And Justin replying with “Because then the door would be broken” in the most “Well, duh” tone ever before Sheri made it clear that was her point. 

[Empress1]

One thing I can't get over on this show is the way the kids curse at and in front of their parents. The way they speak to each other doesn't faze me at all; kids curse. But there's no code switching! If I yelled at my mother that she'd "ruined my fucking life," she would have beaten me to death.* Actually, going back and forth like that the way Clay did with his mother ("well, you told me you weren't working on the case," etc.) would NEVER have flown in my parents' house growing up. My mother would never have justified her decisions, especially her professional decisions, to me. I don't curse in front of my mother NOW, and I'm an adult (I do curse in front of my dad though now that I'm grown; he doesn't care).

So Andy WAS seeing the woman before everything happened. Figures. And kissing her in public, in what appears to be a small town? Genius.

Bryce is almost cartoonish in his villainy, isn't he?

*Hyperbole. There was no hitting. But speaking to my parents that way Was Not Done.

[Racj82]

On 5/19/2018 at 3:26 PM, Asha124 said:

Well, that happened. Don't really know how I feel about this season. That scene with Tyler and Montgomery was one of the most disturbing things I have ever seen on TV. I feel like they did it only for the shock value.

Overall thoughts about the season:

The bad:

- Hannah as a ghost (I felt like she didn't add anything of value to the narrative. I get that they wanted to keep the actress but she was in all the flashbacks so I don't get why she needed to be a ghost as well)

- Justin's drug addiction

- Jessica cheating on Alex in the end

- Chloe and the pregnancy

- The Tyler thing

- Skye's and Clay's relationship. They just weren't believable. At all.

The good:

- I really liked Mr. Porter. His testimony made me tear up.

- Justin's and Clay's reluctant friendship (Justin lounging around Clay's house always eating something made me crak up every time)

- Zach's and Alex's friendship

- The group sticking together at the end

- Bryce's mom (she saw right throught him) and Clay's dad (one of the coolest dad on TV)

The things I don't understand:

- Why would anyone in their right mind send their kid to a school like Liberty High?

- Why would the Jensens adopt Justin? I get that they want to do something nice for him but why jump right to adoption? Why don't they try fostering first?

- Why did Nina burn the pictures?

- Where did Justin get the drugs? Didn't he just return from the juvie? And why was he arrested in the first place?

- Zach's and Hannah's relationship. Like where did that come from?

Disagree with the notion that the attack on Tyler was just for shock value.

It was a deliberate form of sexual assault on a male. One that happens more than reported. 

It also plays into this odd inner workings of homophobic people. Gang up on, assaulting, sexually assaulting a guy for being gay or doing it as a insult. Why are you so worried about that guy being gay? Why are you concerned with physically being all over them?

[Empress1]

I cracked up when Bryce's father was telling Bryce that a woman who loves you should be respected and Bryce's mother (who is a "hey, it's that actress") looked at him like "Bitch since when?"

Derek Luke was fantastic.

Jessica's dad barely looks older than he did when he played Martin Kendall on The Cosby Show. "Is that a serious question?"

[Cindyloowho82]

18 hours ago, dlyn said:

I also got completely lost in the timeline with Bryce’s trial. From what Zach said at the wake, I think Justin got six months probation (for being an accessory to sexual assault), while Bryce got three. Justin wasn’t in jail for any more than a month tops and was only in that long because they couldn’t release him to a guardian. 

I don’t think Bryce had a trial; I think he accepted a plea deal which included him allocating his crime in court which we saw. Then Jessica gave her victim impact statement, and the judge rendered his sentence. That was the impression I got anyway. 

[Bobcatkitten]

I enjoyed it, though I don't think that's the right word. It's full of terrible stuff and no one bad seems to be punished. 

 

It was summed up to me with Bryce leaning against the bar at the school dance just openly chugging from a flask like no care in the world. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ha, so true. I NEVER swore in front of my parents!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

34 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I cracked up when Bryce's father was telling Bryce that a woman who loves you should be respected and Bryce's mother (who is a "hey, it's that actress") looked at him like "Bitch since when?"

Brenda Strong! aka Sue Ellen Mischke on Seinfeld and Mary Alice on Desperate Housewives (among other things, but those are the two I will always remember her for).

But yeah, that look she shot him was like "Uh, seriously?"

[Empress1]

On 5/20/2018 at 9:56 AM, Lady Calypso said:

Yes! Some more backstory on Tony, Tony/Ryan, and Tony/Hannah! Christian Navarro still very much looks his age, but I will say there were moments where he did look like a teenager when asking out Ryan. I like diving into Tony's anger issues and how he's been trying to make up for it. I liked his scene with the other witness of the episode.

Wow, Sheri treading into dangerous territory with the Clubhouse. I legit got terrified for her in her scene in the Clubhouse with Bryce and the other two jocks. But thank god she stood up to Clay about the photos. I mean, sure, I can see why Clay would automatically assume and make those comments, but I'm glad Sheri got to put it into perspective, as a female, for Clay. I think it helped put things in perspective with the earlier scene of Sheri and Bryce and the other boys in the Clubhouse. The environment was chilling to begin with, so I can see why it might seem one way. 

Wow, Zach actually stood up to Bryce. That was surprising. Also, why didn't I expect that it was Zach who sent Clay those three polaroids? In hindsight, it's really really obvious that it had to have been Zach. He's been silently rebelling for a couple of weeks. Also, I was surprised to find out that Justin wasn't actually part of the Clubhouse because it seems like it was just the baseball players, and Justin didn't play baseball.

The Jessica/Nina stuff was hard to watch, because I like the friendship between the two. I can't disagree with Jessica on Nina maybe not being fully over her rape if she still can't talk about it with her boyfriend, but Jessica also has to realize that Nina has to go at her own pace so if she's not ready and Jessica is ready to talk about it, then she has to respect that. Just like Nina needs to realize that she's deflecting from her own pain and trauma and she's taking it out on Jessica.

The Porter/Justin scenes were well done. They've done a good job with trying to redeem Justin. He still has a long way to go and he has a whole lot to make up for, but the fact that he's gone through a lot of shit to start to change is important to recognize. I like that Porter's restrictions from the principal made him reach out to Justin instead. 

So, Tyler's ruined his chance with Mackenzie. It was nice to see Tyler's parents finally finding out about his actions and punishing him, though. 

The twist of Bryce having raped Chloe was completely shocking to me. 

It was the uncertainty. The actor did a great job of conveying teenage nervousness and anxiety through his mannerisms (because he does look like the grown-ass man he is).

Loved Sheri schooling Clay on "guys [making] the situations bad." We really need to change the "don't let a guy do bad things to you" narrative to teaching guys not to do bad things.

[SadieT]

On 5/20/2018 at 11:35 PM, Last Time Lord said:

Yeah, no way in hell would this have been left out of the tapes. 

The relationship is a complete and total retcon, but damn if they weren’t completely adorable together.

Grow up, Clay.  Really says a lot that Justin was the voice of reason in that scene. 

And between the drugs and sex with multiple partners, Justin should probably get tested for... everything. 

Exactly. I loved seeing them together but being some popular boy's "secret girlfriend" is pretty much exactly the type of shit Hannah was talking about on those tapes and it would have been very hurtful for Hannah to have a guy she trusted and cared about be ashamed of his relationship with her. 

They should have had Hannah be the one to decide she didn't want the relationship public for the whole thing to be more believable. If she was worried the people at school would continue to give her shit for "being a slut" or didn't want Clay to find out cause she knew he was into her, that would at least explain why she left it off the tapes. 

And Clay continues to be the worst.