S37: Spoilers and Speculation

[MissEwa]

4 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I have been thinking Nick has more of a winner's edit than Christian, but it is worrisome that they aren't really showing his big plays. The info that he spearheaded the John vote out was kept to a secret scene. I would understand them not showing it in the ep because they wanted the surprise, but the fact that they didn't show that secret scene in the next ep makes me wonder. 

Yeah, for me, this is a huge point against his winning. A quick confessional spelling it out at the beginning of the next episode would have been enough, but it wasn't even mentioned. 

On the surface, Christian is getting more of a (good-natured) comic relief edit than a winners edit. But we do get info about how other people like him and see him as a threat, and - god, I hate to say it - Fabio also got a comic relief edit with random info about how other people liked him, so. 

[Jextella]

What are the characteristics of "winners edit"?   

[MissEwa]

It depends on the season, but there's a thread here which gets into a lot of the common characteristics: 

Spoilers for past seasons, obviously. 

[peachmangosteen]

8 hours ago, Jextella said:

Reading Nick's interview indicates that how things were played the last two times was a joint effort between himself and Davie (John) and himself, Davie, and Carl (Dan).   

 

I see that, but I still don't think Nick/Christian are really all the close to/loyal to Davie/Carl and vice versa. Like I could easily see them all happily turning on each other soon. And with the spoilers we know that's almost certainly going to happen.

I see either Nick turning on Davie/Carl as well as Christian and then winning or Christian turning on Davie/Carl/Nick and winning. Carl is definitely not winning and I don't think Davie is either because of him being invisible for a couple eps pre-idol play.

This season's editing is quite different than we've seen lately though, so who knows.

Edited November 25, 2018 by peachmangosteen

[Jextella]

On 11/20/2018 at 5:43 PM, LanceM said:

Ok we have a new soiler/clue from Reddit from the same poster who gave us the Pat medevac and the F3 spoilers we have been discussing.  It has to do with one of the final 3 contestants and is as follows:

....shares their name with a Billboard 100 Top 5 hit from the 1980’s. (Albeit one letter lost.) The song was sung by an artist who was notorious for being quite a Dick.

 

The speculation is that this is Angelina based on the fact that Richard Marx who had a hit single "Angelia" that peaked at #4 in 1989.  And given the fact that he capitalized the "d" in Dick that part of the clue is actually a nod to the singers first name Richard.

I buy it and I have seen no one else on that thread come up with any other possibilities that fit that clue.  Apparently we can expect more spoilers from this source in the next few days.

...never mind.

Edited November 26, 2018 by Jextella

[TVFan1]

I wonder how the vote would have went down had Pat stayed. Not sure how many votes Nick would have gotten, but who knows, he could have shifted the target away from himself onto somebody else. I'm just glad that he managed to get as far as he has now.

[Jextella]

There is a theory floating around Reddit that the Mike, Nick, and Angelina are F3 and that the girls work together at the end and throw their votes to Angelina - along with the Goliaths on the jury.  The theory goes on to say that this probably explains why Jeff hasn't been hyping up the great David moves because the audience will feel that Angelina isn't worthy - making a very unpopular outcome.  There is also mention of the Goliaths not liking being referred to as Goliaths ... as if it set them up to be the big, bad guy from the beginning.   Something like that.

I have to say, this theory makes a lot of sense.  

[loki567]

No way. While female winners typically get under-edited or the season becomes more about how so-and-so lost rather than how the female winner won, the editors will not make their winner look like a joke. Angelina's two big scenes right now are Natalie and the jacket (Natalie? Natalie, please?) and the entire merged tribe laughing at her about how obvious her game was during the first merged Tribal council. 

I feel pretty certain it's a David, considering how the two tribes are presented. The Davids are definitely getting that plucky underdog role while three of the five Goliaths are severely under-edited. The other two are Angelina and Mike. And Mike doesn't scream winner to me and more as a FTC loser.

Assuming the spoilers are true, I'd guess a David, Mike, Angelina F3. The David (my guess would be Nick) slips through and wins due to a David-majority jury. 

[ProfCrash]

Angelina had better do something pretty damn amazing the next couple of weeks otherwise an Angelina win is going to win an amazing season. There is time for her to actually do something and change my mind but right now she has been a great goat. I am hoping that the votes cast for her by the other Goliaths will kick her in the ass and actually see her try and work with the Davids and play the game. Massive attitude adjustment is needed, just because you have the numbers and you want something doesn't mean that you get what you want.

Angelina's third big scene was asking Dan to play the idol and then asking if he played it for her.

Mike lost my interest, well, Mike never had my interest. I have no clue why he is a Goliath. He never seemed to be playing a particularly great game. Mike's move to oust Natalie was more personality then great strategic move. He flipped on his new alliance at the merge for no real reason. And then there was last weeks "botches" scene where he implied that by voting outside the block made the Goliaths bitches. Yeah, that ended any sense of like for Mike. He lacks strategic understanding of the game and I strongly dislike people who equate weak anything with being a "girl" or "bitches". Mike can suck it.

Nick would be a great winner. He has played a solid game but I suspect that how he turns on the other Davids is going to hurt him. I actually think that any David who votes out a David before all the Goliaths are gone would be in trouble. The Davids have clearly formed some tight bonds. It is easy to say that "this is a game" and talk the talk but walking the walk is far harder. Carl has already demonstrated that he carries grudges for a good amount of time. Christian is logical but I suspect having the people he has worked so tightly with turn on him is going to sting. Gabby will be a mess because, well, Gabby is already insecure and will see votes from Davids as a sign that she is not liked instead of part of game play.

[peachmangosteen]

7 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

I wonder how the vote would have went down had Pat stayed. Not sure how many votes Nick would have gotten, but who knows, he could have shifted the target away from himself onto somebody else.

Yea, exactly. We know that Nick was the initial target, but there's no way to know if he would have actually been booted if Pat hadn't been medevacced. Nick has demonstrated he's pretty good strategically, so I wouldn't count him out on being able to turn that first vote around. In any case, it's all completely speculative since it didn't happen, so it's irrelevant terms of his game imo.

I don't know, I am kinda intrigued by the possibility that Angelina wins. If it does happen on some kind of 'all the women vote for her' type thing it would kind of make sense since they've been having her talk about how women don't find idols and how women's ideas aren't listened to, etc. Also, we know from exit interviews that Angelina is actually pretty likable in the game. I hope if she does win that they start giving her a better edit and she's not another female winner that's badly/under edited.

Edited November 26, 2018 by peachmangosteen

[Lamb18]

On 11/23/2018 at 4:55 AM, loki567 said:

Somebody pointed it over at Survivor Sucks, John's jacket that was used in Davie's "I just took out the mayor of Slamtown!" confessional was seen in Dan's Ponderosa video. That along with the preview clip with the Davids sans Davie having a strategic convo, is leading people into thinking Davie might be the next boot. 

I wonder if Angelina asks for the jacket when he leaves tribal council.

[nutty1]

I belong to a private FB group. The guy usually gets some decent spoilers. His MO is to usually post a random picture as his Facebook cover of the final 3. He has just changed his cover picture to Nick, Angelina and Mike. 

Oh please let Nick win!

You know if those are really the F3, Christian will be back on another season. 

[LadyChatts]

If Angelina doesn't have a big break out episode in the next couple of weeks, then I'm going to believe Nick wins.  So far, he's the only one of the final 3 that seems like he could win.

[Jextella]

12 hours ago, Jextella said:

There is a theory floating around Reddit that the Mike, Nick, and Angelina are F3 and that the girls work together at the end and throw their votes to Angelina - along with the Goliaths on the jury.  The theory goes on to say that this probably explains why Jeff hasn't been hyping up the great David moves because the audience will feel that Angelina isn't worthy - making a very unpopular outcome.  There is also mention of the Goliaths not liking being referred to as Goliaths ... as if it set them up to be the big, bad guy from the beginning.   Something like that.

I have to say, this theory makes a lot of sense.  

 

4 hours ago, nutty1 said:

I belong to a private FB group. The guy usually gets some decent spoilers. His MO is to usually post a random picture as his Facebook cover of the final 3. He has just changed his cover picture to Nick, Angelina and Mike. 

Oh please let Nick win!

You know if those are really the F3, Christian will be back on another season. 

@Nutty1....any thoughts on the theory about a female alliance and Angelina winning?   The theory makes a lot of sense.  If Nick burns Gabby - or any of the remaining David's -  I could see Angelina taking this thing.

Edited November 26, 2018 by Jextella

[Special K]

There seem to be a lot of shoe-ins to be returnees from this season.  Which gives me comfort since only one of my favorites (Nick, Christian, Davey) can win.

I agree that the way they are editing it at this point, a David wins. 

[Silver Raven]

Would they really make Angelina look so unlikeable in the very first minute of the very first episode if she's the eventual winner?

[Nashville]

7 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

Would they really make Angelina look so unlikeable in the very first minute of the very first episode if she's the eventual winner?

Only if they have some really mind-blowingly huge redemptive arc in the works.

...and at this point, we’re talking Blues Brothers “I SEE THE LIGHT!!!” kind of huge.  ;)

https://youtu.be/7ATBbrfmzc0

[ProfCrash]

I don’t think Angelina is all that awful. She is annoying but not mean or a bully or anyone who I strongly dislike. She is a “villian” only because the people this season are pretty decent human beings. Kind of like Chrissy a few seasons back. Really, Angelina has acted like an entitled Princess a bit but for the most part she has not been awful. 

Hopefully, she turns things around a bit and makes some decent moves and earns the win. Right now I think she is a goat and if she wins it feels like it would be a bitter jury. 

She has been trying to play the game but has not been playing well. 

[nutty1]

2 hours ago, Jextella said:

 

@Nutty1....any thoughts on the theory about a female alliance and Angelina winning?   The theory makes a lot of sense.  If Nick burns Gabby - or any of the remaining David's -  I could see Angelina taking this thing.

I feel like Angelina is not a favorite amongst the contestants. And I do not know if the girls are that tight. Of course, that could all be wishful thinking on my part, as I really wanted a Nick or Christian win. 

[LadyChatts]

From a game play stand point, I don't think Angelina has been very impressive, and she doesn't seem to like not being in control.  I also wonder if what happened with Elizabeth will come back to bite her.  Clearly that was pure jury management, and I don't know why she would be surprised that Elizabeth would be scrambling to save herself or call her out.  When she's put on the spot I don't think she handles it well.  In addition, in the first episode she was making fun of the Davids as they climbed aboard the boat.  It was in a TH, but a weird thing to showcase a winner saying.  I honestly just don't think she can pull a win off based on her edit so far, because I don't think she's been portrayed in the best light.  Again, there's still time, but not much.  The way it has been going this season who knows.  I find her annoying and conceited, but comedic at the same time because of her bad gameplay and perceptions of everything going on that is wrong (plus having to beg for stuff at TC).  Mike really has nothing going for him, and I really don't think he can change his game around in time.

Nick can argue that he was supposed to be the first one gone, and due to unforeseen circumstances managed to survive and get a second chance in the game.  He's clearly made strong social bonds, as he had multiple people telling him about the vote for Christian (which in turn helped save Christian), he successfully played his advantage, and has made strong alliances.  I don't think he's backstabbed anyone so far.  The one thing that might hurt him is when Jessica was voted off, and he was saying it was Gabby's decision, should that come up.  In addition, we didn't see all the Goliaths telling him about Christian, so that might hurt his case a little in terms of showing he's got a good social game.  For Nick, I hope he doesn't lose to a bitter jury or a Goliath strong mentality on the jury.  He hasn't been cocky or obnoxious to anyone in the game, and didn't gloat about his advantage.  

Edited November 27, 2018 by LadyChatts

[ProfCrash]

2 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Nick can argue that he was supposed to be the first one gone, and due to unforeseen circumstances managed to survive and get a second chance in the game.  He's clearly made strong social bonds, as he had multiple people telling him about the vote for Christian (which in turn helped save Christian), he successfully played his advantage, and has made strong alliances.  I don't think he's backstabbed anyone so far.  The one thing that might hurt him is when Jessica was voted off, and he was saying it was Gabby's decision, should that come up.  In addition, we didn't see all the Goliaths telling him about Christian, so that might hurt his case a little in terms of showing he's got a good social game.  For Nick, I hope he doesn't lose to a bitter jury or a Goliath strong mentality on the jury.  He hasn't been cocky or obnoxious to anyone in the game, and didn't gloat about his advantage.  

I am sure Mike would argue that Nick backstabbed him when Nick helped to plan the John vote. Yes, Mike was also going against his alliance by voting for Christian but Nick’s plan work and Mike’s didn’t which might leave Mike feeling upset. 

I cannot see Nick making the final three with Mike and Angelina without stabbing the Davids in the back. Either Nick goes on an impressive immunity run as the Davids are wiped out or Nick votes for some of the Davids. And the Davids are aware of Nick’s strategic thinking so they will know that Nick played a role in voting them out.

It is easy for us to say at home, and agree with Davey, that Survivor is a game and people shouldn’t be upset when an alliance mate stabs them in the back but I think that is harder to do in the actual game. Your ally, someone who you shared your advantages and idols with, whom you plotted with orchestrated you demise. Cost you a shot to win one million dollars.

I can see where it would be easier for John and Dan to be okish with being voted out. They were out played by the minority tribe (John) or removed due to a new twist that no one saw coming (Dan). The game got them. They expected the Davids to target them. So no hard feelings. I can even see Elizabeth being pretty clinical about it. It was a unanimous vote. The Davids were trying to show good faith that they would help advance them in the game. 

But Nick orchestrating or participating in taking out Carl, Christian, Davey or Gabby is going to be something different. The five of them sat on the beach bonding over how arrogant and awful the Goliaths were. They sat unified in tribal hoping that the joint bag of tricks that they were using would work. They celebrated the demise of the Goliaths together. And then Nick voted them out. 

Yes, it was better for his game. Yes he brought along the two Goliaths that were most goat worthy (so far). But he stabbed his compatriots in the back. Carl holds a grudge pretty hard core. Carl and Davey are good friends and I suspect Carl will pass along his grudge. Gabby is a walking ball of anxiety and insecurity who is pretty smart but still emotionally irrational when she gets upset. I can easily see the three of them voting for someone other then Nick because they are upset because two of the three have already shown us who they are as people. I doubt Davey changes any of that. 

So yeah, I think is in trouble in a final with any two Goliaths. 

[LadyChatts]

It's hard to say who will and won't be bitter, and whether they are told to play it up.  I can see Carl being bitter, but I believe Christian and Gabby will respect Nick's game play.  I mean, Gabby is super emotional, but I'd like to think she'll put that aside. 

It is also possible that he simply aligns with Christian/Gabby/Mike/Angelina (because clearly Nick plus the other rumored final 3 aren't going to get there by themselves).  They make it to the final 5/6, and maybe Angelina or Mike finds an idol or advantage or goes on an immunity run.  Or if there's another Goliath in the mix, it might come down to the Goliaths taking out the Davids in the alliance, and Nick goes on an immunity run/finds an idol.  It could come down to 2 Davids/2 Goliaths in the final 4, and one or both Davids have to make fire to earn their spot in the final 3.  It's hard to say right now what exactly is going to transpire.  Maybe Davey and Carl try to turn on Nick first and that sets in motion him turning on them.  In reality, the Davids banded together because they had to.  Had it not been for Mike bailing on Strike Force, thus making Alison and Alec bail on that alliance, we might not have seen the past two episodes play out the way they did.  I do think this week might be telling as to how the remainder of the season goes.

I think there's several possibilities where Nick can make it to the end and not look like the bad guy, or at least not a total bad guy.  I've been surprised by juries before, and again, the only one I can see being bitter is Carl.  Dan might be, depending, and Davey could if he goes out in spectacular fashion.  It's hard to say!  

[loki567]

I'm not sure. The Davids seem like a pretty savvy group of players and they all voted Elizabeth out because they knew there was no options. In the event that the Goliaths get the upper hand again and start taking out Davids, I don't think Christian, Gabby, or Davie are the type to hold it against Nick if he does what he has to do to make to the F3. 

[LanceM]

Here is some more support that the spoiler of Angelina being in the F3 is true and it comes from none other than Jeff Probst himself who "randomly" brought up the idea of Angelina possibly winning the game in an interview after the John boot.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/survivor-david-goliath-jeff-probst-john-hennigan-blindside-david-tribe-comeback-live-reunion-preview-1162491

" Angelina is smart enough to get to the end, and I think her chances of winning would be heavily weighted one way or another based on who she was sitting next to at the final three. If I could whisper in her ear, I'd probably say, "Hey, maybe you could back off just a little bit… let the game come to you a little more." But she wouldn't listen anyway! Because, you should never listen to me."

I think we can all agree that sitting next to Mike definitely is good for her chances so it will come down to her the third person is sitting with them

Edited November 27, 2018 by LanceM

[LadyChatts]

It’s been such a good season but Angelina winning?  Yeah, I’ll pass.

I do agree with Probst that no one should ever listen to him.  He’s a fan of Angelina, so I’m honestly not surprised to hear him say that.

Edited November 27, 2018 by LadyChatts

[MisterBluxom]

I hope this is the right forum for me to ask about info in the previews from last week. But to be safe, I'm going to ask a question about the preview in a spoiler box.

The preview shown at the end of Ep 9 shows Gabby in tears asking (paraphrasing) "Who does he think he is? The Godfather or something?" Then Christian says words to the effect that "Gabby and Carl are on a collision course".

I want to ask if anyone can explain why Gabby and Carl may be on a collision course. I have no idea why there would be some serious conflict between Gabby and Carl. Can anyone speculate why such a conflict would have arisen?

The only thing that I can guess owing to Carl's past behavior is that he holds a grudge against people who have voted against one of his friends or allies. I have no recollection of Gabby ever having done that. Can anyone speculate just what the reason would be for this problem between Carl and Gabby?

It makes me plenty nervous since both Carl and Gabby are in the same alliance. I don't know they have ever both formally agreed to both support each other because they were orginally in the David tribe. But that's my starting point. Does that make sense? If so, does anyone know or can anyone guess what is it that may have happened to cause a rift between them?

[MisterBluxom]

4 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

It’s been such a good season but Angelina winning?  Yeah, I’ll pass.

I do agree with Probst that no one should ever listen to him.  He’s a fan of Angelina, so I’m honestly not surprised to hear him say that.

Angelina winning? OMG! Even the concept of her making it to the FTC sets my eyes to burning. Have you ever been gassed with Tear Gas? Well, thinking about Angelina making it to FTC feels like that to me. Some people have speculated that she is not liked and so would make a good so-called "goat" to bring to the FTC. But how many times do people get the notion that most anything is possible and bringing someone to FTC is real dangerous. Dangerous insofar as it's possible that something could happen late in the game so that there may be a tie between the two leading candidates in the FTC and Angelina could actually win if she got a single vote. This is starting to feel like that old TV Soap (it was an imaginary Soap called "As the Stomach Turns".

Oh Lord! Please hear my prayer. Don't let this possibility get even close to reality. Please? Please? Please?  I'm begging. It would be something like Josh winning that crap season of that crap show BB. Oh no. If Angelina was ever to get close to winning this season, I would cry me a river - for sure. How could something like that ever happen? How? Oh, Please say it ain't so? Please? Please? Please? 

[Ellee]

LOL @ Please say it ain’t so. Please? Please? Please?

[ProfCrash]

1 hour ago, MissBluxom said:

The preview shown at the end of Ep 9 shows Gabby in tears asking (paraphrasing) "Who does he think he is? The Godfather or something?" Then Christian says words to the effect that "Gabby and Carl are on a collision course".

I want to ask if anyone can explain why Gabby and Carl may be on a collision course. I have no idea why there would be some serious conflict between Gabby and Carl. Can anyone speculate why such a conflict would have arisen?

The only thing that I can guess owing to Carl's past behavior is that he holds a grudge against people who have voted against one of his friends or allies. I have no recollection of Gabby ever having done that. Can anyone speculate just what the reason would be for this problem between Carl and Gabby?

It makes me plenty nervous since both Carl and Gabby are in the same alliance. I don't know they have ever both formally agreed to both support each other because they were orginally in the David tribe. But that's my starting point. Does that make sense? If so, does anyone know or can anyone guess what is it that may have happened to cause a rift between them?

Previews can be discussed in the Spoiler topic.

Gabby was the person that Nick and Christian blamed for the Jessica vote. The same vote that led Carl to be willing to sacrifice Elizabeth over. Carl, Davie, and Bi were blindsided when Jessica went home and Carl holds a grudge.

I think Davey holds more of a grudge then other people do. Davey was pretty cold to Elizabeth in their merge tribe. He was willing to work to get rid of a Goliath, because numbers are important, but Davie and Carl were pretty cold, if not hostile, when Elizabeth wanted to fix the bed. Davey was throwing away Elizabeth's work after she split and place new bamboo and Carl was bitching about her efforts to fix the bed ruining his nap.  

I can fully see Carl being an ass towards Gabby. I can also see Carl giving Gabby weird looks and Gabby interpreting them as being something awful. Essentially, two of the more emotional members of the Davids appear to be going at each other. Carl gives that appearance of not giving a damn but I am reasonably certain he is one of those people who swallows his feelings and lets them fester. His comments about Elizabeth don't match with anything that we have been shown, not that we are shown the full picture, or the Elizabeth that we have heard people comment about in exit interviews. Or the Elizabeth we have seen at Ponderosa. Then again, we have seen Gabby's emotions run over when she feels overwhelmed and it could be that is happening as the tensions on the beach are going to be higher right now because of all the blindsides and number drawing even.

[MisterBluxom]

Just now, ProfCrash said:

Previews can be discussed in the Spoiler topic.

<snip>

Thank you very much for your answer. It was most helpful and insightful. I guess that I just don't pay enough attention to things that I don't consider important at the time and so I had completely failed to realize these bad feelings were so prevelant.

I would like to say something towards all the people who complain (and complain) about Gabby crying. Why do so few people fail to understand the therapeutic value of releasing bad feelings (primarily through crying) instead of bottling them up (remember Elizabeth's "I HATE STUPID PEOPLE"?)

Seems to me it's like the way our planet stores up heat energy from the sun. That energy has to go somewhere and (to the best of my knowledge), the result is erupting volcanoes. When people erupt, like Elizabeth did, the result is often harmful to them. People think they are unstable. But Gabby has a healthy release for her fear and anger. She cries. The result is that when it comes time to make important decisions (I'm paraphrasing Nashville now), Gabby - IMHO - is a killer. She has done her crying. She is then ready to make excellent game decisions.

I know that I'm prejudiced. I love Gabby. Very strange to love someone who I've never met and is young enough to be my Granddaughter. But I think she is just wonderful for many reasons. One of the best is the healthy way she deals with her emotions and the way that leaves her ready and able to make clear decisions that aren't tainted by bad emotions. Again, IMHO, Gabby is a model human being in many ways. Forgive me for making this generalization. But I think people in general would be much healthier (emotionally healthy) if they did a lot more crying than they do.

All this is just my opinion. But it really disturbs me (can you tell?) when I see page after page of people shitting on Gabby for crying too much. I frequent other message boards and the complaining about Gabby crying is truly massive.

I am confident that what PROFCRASH has said about Carl and Davie is quite true and if it is true, I hope they will both taste the sting of her lash when she defends herself with clear cool logic uncluttered by festering bad feelings she has bottled up.

[ProfCrash]

I am fine with Gabby and I don't have a problem with her tears. I do think that she has a good number if insecurities that leads to those tears and could interfere with good game play. For good or bad, tears are seen as weak. I find that ridiculous, they are a natural reaction to certain situations. There are very few people who would say I am weak but I cry when I get frustrated and upset. I have gotten better, it normally takes 30 minutes or so of a continued situation before I lose it but I have cried at work when people have had hard conversations, some justified some not. I actually do better when I think the criticism is justified and well thought out, not a big fan of being stuck in the middle of power struggles and people who fail to lead and then blame me. But tears are seen as weak.

Elizabeth vented in her own way in her confessional. Like Gabby, we did not see that side of Elizabeth in the game. It is possible that her feelings seeped out and were well known but we have not seen evidence of that in interviews or Ponderosa. I think Elizabeth was surprised by how much Carl disliked her. Elizabeth's private rant, and possibly even just flat out saying something confrontational, are seen as strong. People are sucking it up and trying to deal with the situation. They are not whining and complaining. They are frustrated and venting. Far better then tears (eye roll)

Carl is another person who bottles up his feelings and he acts on those bottled up feelings. I know that there are Carl fans who enjoyed the scene with the bamboo and Elizabeth, that Carl just batted it away, unphased. I saw that differently. I saw Carl watching someone work, ignore what they are doing, and looking pissed that the bamboo hit him. Based on what Carl has said, I suspect that he was angry and seething and not unphased.

Davie was more willing to confront Elizabeth at camp but did so in a way that I thought was inappropriate. He could have offered to help or stacked the cut bamboo up instead of tossing it into the woods. That way it was easy for Elizabeth to add all the bamboo at once. Not that Elizabeth handled it the best, she could have split the bamboo and made a stack instead of replacing things before all the bamboo was split. She was clearly frustrated and did not make the best decisions but Davie and Carl's reaction were unnecessary.

There are many ways to deal with frustration and stress. I am tired of people labeling people who cry as weak. Tears are normal and natural and fine. The more we label natural reactions as weak, the more we cause people to hide their pain and feelings, the more problems we have with mental health. How about we all chill and let people express themselves as they do. I am far more comfortable with Gabby's tears and Elizabeth's venting then I am Carl's cold shoulder and passive aggressive glares and huffs. I don't see that as strong or funny, I see it as someone swallowing emotions and a dangerous way of handling stress. 

I tend to think that people are uncomfortable with tears should be asking why they are uncomfortable with tears instead of being annoyed that someone is crying. Christian has been perfect, he understood (ok so it took a second or two) that Gabby was upset, he listened to her worries, he tried to help her address her concerns and he didn't ell her to buck up. John has said that he thought that Gabby was just fine in a secret scene and her tears have not stopped her from working around camp or performing in challenges. She rocked her role in those tribal challenges.

Edited November 27, 2018 by ProfCrash

[Special K]

If Christian can hold on until the end (though I guess spoilers say he won't) he would have an great argument to make that he was repeatedly on the chopping block but somehow convinced his alliance to keep saving him. 

[peachmangosteen]

Either Christian or Davie will be finding another idol at some point, right? Wasn't there a spoiler about two people (one obviously being Dan) finding multiple idols?

ETA: Had to get Davie's name right. I know it's an 'ie' but I put 'ey' at first every single time because that's how everyone is spelling it lol.

Edited November 27, 2018 by peachmangosteen

[ProfCrash]

6 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

Either Christian or Davie will be finding another idol at some point, right? Wasn't there a spoiler about two people (one obviously being Dan) finding multiple idols?

ETA: Had to get Davie's name right. I know it's an 'ie' but I put 'ey' at first every single time because that's how everyone is spelling it lol.

Yeah, I know it is Davie but so many folks are spelling it with the ey that I question myself every time I post.

[Special K]

1 minute ago, ProfCrash said:

Yeah, I know it is Davie but so many folks are spelling it with the ey that I question myself every time I post.

I wonder if he really is just "David" IRL, but they made him adopt a nickname so as not to be confused with the Tribe of Davids.  Stranger things have happened.

[Jextella]

On 11/26/2018 at 12:46 AM, Jextella said:

There is a theory floating around Reddit that the Mike, Nick, and Angelina are F3 and that the girls work together at the end and throw their votes to Angelina - along with the Goliaths on the jury.  The theory goes on to say that this probably explains why Jeff hasn't been hyping up the great David moves because the audience will feel that Angelina isn't worthy - making a very unpopular outcome.  There is also mention of the Goliaths not liking being referred to as Goliaths ... as if it set them up to be the big, bad guy from the beginning.   Something like that.

I have to say, this theory makes a lot of sense.  

 

On 11/26/2018 at 1:51 AM, loki567 said:

No way. While female winners typically get under-edited or the season becomes more about how so-and-so lost rather than how the female winner won, the editors will not make their winner look like a joke. Angelina's two big scenes right now are Natalie and the jacket (Natalie? Natalie, please?) and the entire merged tribe laughing at her about how obvious her game was during the first merged Tribal council. 

1

This is a good point @loki567.  It makes complete sense that the editors would prop at least 2 of the final 3 up as being worthy of their seats.  

Although Angelina does have things she can tack onto her resume.  She took out Elizabeth and got Dan to play his idol for her. 

And, there is plenty more  gameplay to go.  My biggest fear is Nick has to take out a David or two and burns bridges. 

Edited November 27, 2018 by Jextella

[LadyChatts]

1 hour ago, Jextella said:

 

This is a good point @loki567.  It makes complete sense that the editors would prop at least 2 of the final 3 up as being worthy of their seats.  

Although Angelina does have things she can tack onto her resume.  She took out Elizabeth and got Dan to play his idol for her. 

And, there is plenty more  gameplay to go.  My biggest fear is Nick has to take out a David or two and burns bridges. 

 

But she had to practically beg Dan to play the idol for her (or at least that's how it came across), and I can't say her getting rid of Elizabeth is anything to write home about.  She almost got herself booted.  I just think her edit has been condescending, comedic, controlling, and, again, she gave shades of a mean girl in the premiere when she saw the David tribe for the first time.  I'm not 100% ruling her win out if the final 3 is Nick/Mike/Angelina, but so far I don't think she has much to stand on.  If Christian is in the final 3 then she doesn't have a chance, unless they are doing a Michele/Aubry edit with them, but Probst likes Angelina so I don't think he'd set her up like that.

Quote

 

Either Christian or Davie will be finding another idol at some point, right? Wasn't there a spoiler about two people (one obviously being Dan) finding multiple idols?

ETA: Had to get Davie's name right. I know it's an 'ie' but I put 'ey' at first every single time because that's how everyone is spelling it lol.

 

I only saw the spoiler that mentioned the Goliath male having two idols, another male finds one, and he uses one in a shocking TC.  I know his idol will be re-hidden but not sure who will find it.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that can't keep the spelling of Davie's name right.

Edited November 27, 2018 by LadyChatts

[blackwing]

2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Either Christian or Davie will be finding another idol at some point, right? Wasn't there a spoiler about two people (one obviously being Dan) finding multiple idols?

ETA: Had to get Davie's name right. I know it's an 'ie' but I put 'ey' at first every single time because that's how everyone is spelling it lol.

I don't go on reddit or wherever these spoilers are coming from.  Did we speculate on the source?  Is it Alec?  They seem pretty reliable and accurate so far... I usually am not a big spoiler person, in past seasons were the spoilers so specific?  To the point of describing when and how advantages would be used?

Is it possible that the "two people find two idols" was confusing Davey's idol and Nick's advantage as someone finding two idols?  Or are we trusting this person as reliable since the other spoilers have so far seemed like they are coming true?

[kassandra8286]

1 hour ago, LadyChatts said:

Quote

 

Either Christian or Davie will be finding another idol at some point, right? Wasn't there a spoiler about two people (one obviously being Dan) finding multiple idols?

ETA: Had to get Davie's name right. I know it's an 'ie' but I put 'ey' at first every single time because that's how everyone is spelling it lol.

 

I only saw the spoiler that mentioned the Goliath male having two idols, another male finds one, and he uses one in a shocking TC. 

Yes, if the spoilers are accurate either Christian or Davie will find another idol, or another male could find two more idols.

FTR, all the "official" spoilers for this season are from one source: a redditor called SurvivorOutwitted. The two spoilers about idols are:

Quote

 

A GOLIATH Castaway with TWO immunity idols plays one for his teammate, after another MALE Castaway discovers it while digging through his personal property. This Castaway goes onto the F3.

MULTIPLE Immunity Idols Are.....discovered by TWO MALE Castaways, in S37; each of them finding TWO. One of these is used in the most shocking elimination of the entire season, in corroboration with a twist that has never been seen in Survivor history.

 

Also

2 hours ago, Special K said:

If Christian can hold on until the end (though I guess spoilers say he won't)

He could be! What we know from the spoilers is that Mike, Angelina, and a male David will be in F3. 

[Special K]

25 minutes ago, kassandra8286 said:

He could be! What we know from the spoilers is that Mike, Angelina, and a male David will be in F3. 

Well OK then.  And he might find a second idol!
 

[LadyChatts]

Well so far, it's only been 3 males who've found the idols.  I can totally see Christian finding another idol.  I believe the second part of that spoiler applied to Dan, unless there's some twist we don't know about yet.

Quote

I don't go on reddit or wherever these spoilers are coming from.  Did we speculate on the source?  Is it Alec?  They seem pretty reliable and accurate so far... I usually am not a big spoiler person, in past seasons were the spoilers so specific?  To the point of describing when and how advantages would be used?

Some people on other sites were speculating Alec, and thinking he was bitter over his dis-invite from the reunion.  Of course there was strong speculation Alec was a pre-juror, since he wasn't invited to the reunion, and maybe was bitter about an early exit so he violated the NDA and got himself into that mess as a result.  It's still possible Alec could have a bitter exit, and I won't be surprised if he is blindsided.  Other people though Dan, but I don't know if I believe it was him.  I'd laugh if it was Lynn Spillman who did this out of revenge for getting fired.

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, Special K said:

I wonder if he really is just "David" IRL, but they made him adopt a nickname so as not to be confused with the Tribe of Davids.  Stranger things have happened.

FWIW, Davie lists himself as “Davie Rickenbacker” on his LinkedIn profile as well.  :)

[Jextella]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

FWIW, Davie lists himself as “Davie Rickenbacker” on his LinkedIn profile as well.  :)

I love Davie.  What a great spirit.  Combine him, Nick, and Christian, ok and Dan's physique, and I'd have my perfect companion :)

[Silver Raven]

23 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

I don’t think Angelina is all that awful. She is annoying but not mean or a bully or anyone who I strongly dislike. She is a “villian” only because the people this season are pretty decent human beings. Kind of like Chrissy a few seasons back. Really, Angelina has acted like an entitled Princess a bit but for the most part she has not been awful. 

Hopefully, she turns things around a bit and makes some decent moves and earns the win. Right now I think she is a goat and if she wins it feels like it would be a bitter jury. 

She has been trying to play the game but has not been playing well. 

The first words out of her mouth were sneering at the Davids.

[Special K]

5 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

The first words out of her mouth were sneering at the Davids.

Also a "bless their hearts" hand-to-chest gesture and a facial expression of pity.

[ProfCrash]

I am so screwed if I am deemed to be a villian because of one or two moments on an editted TV show. We have seen far worse behavior from people who many folks would be excited to see play again. I am thinking of Russell who has a large number of supporters in Survivor fandom, never mind the fact that he was an awful bully. Angelina was an ass when the David’s were introduced, pretty much all of the Goliath’s were. That said, she has not been shown to treat people poorly around camp. Entitled, hell yeah, but not a bully or a mean person. 

[blackwing]

13 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

I am so screwed if I am deemed to be a villian because of one or two moments on an editted TV show. We have seen far worse behavior from people who many folks would be excited to see play again. I am thinking of Russell who has a large number of supporters in Survivor fandom, never mind the fact that he was an awful bully. Angelina was an ass when the David’s were introduced, pretty much all of the Goliath’s were. That said, she has not been shown to treat people poorly around camp. Entitled, hell yeah, but not a bully or a mean person. 

She might not be a bully, but I do think she’s a mean person.  And it’s been more than one or two moments. She made the nasty confessional, and the “oh poor losers” gestures in the opening episode.  Since then she’s shown herself to be a fairly controlling person who needs to be in charge. She’s like a female Rupert, someone who thinks they are incredibly awesome and gets angry when people dare to disagree. 

 When she doesn’t get her way she throws a tantrum in her confessional.  She ran and sabotaged her team by telling Elizabeth she was the target because she was pissed off that she didn’t get her way.  

She is a mean, entitled, spoiled princess who is used to things coming so easily to her and always getting what she wants.  When Jerry described the classic Goliath as having things easy in life... that describes her perfectly.  

At this point I’d be very surprised if she wins the game.  I’m hard pressed to remember a winner that was edited so unfavorably.  The best examples I can think of is Jenna Morasca (who didn’t seem well liked by viewers but I can’t remember any specific editing that portrayed her poorly) and Brian Heiduk and his porn star past.  But even those two haven’t been skewered by the editing like Angelina has been.

[LadyChatts]

4 hours ago, blackwing said:

She might not be a bully, but I do think she’s a mean person.  And it’s been more than one or two moments. She made the nasty confessional, and the “oh poor losers” gestures in the opening episode.  Since then she’s shown herself to be a fairly controlling person who needs to be in charge. She’s like a female Rupert, someone who thinks they are incredibly awesome and gets angry when people dare to disagree. 

 When she doesn’t get her way she throws a tantrum in her confessional.  She ran and sabotaged her team by telling Elizabeth she was the target because she was pissed off that she didn’t get her way.  

She is a mean, entitled, spoiled princess who is used to things coming so easily to her and always getting what she wants.  When Jerry described the classic Goliath as having things easy in life... that describes her perfectly.  

At this point I’d be very surprised if she wins the game.  I’m hard pressed to remember a winner that was edited so unfavorably.  The best examples I can think of is Jenna Morasca (who didn’t seem well liked by viewers but I can’t remember any specific editing that portrayed her poorly) and Brian Heiduk and his porn star past.  But even those two haven’t been skewered by the editing like Angelina has been.

Jenna’s edit wasn’t that great, especially when it came to her tribemate Christy, but I recall many people said she was young and immature, and just aligned with the wrong people (namely her Survivor BFF Heidi).  After the season aired, Jenna admitted she didn’t like what she saw and had a lot of growing up to do.  I’m not saying she gained a ton of respect, but some people were willing to cut her a break.  Thailand was just a shit show season that despite Brian being unpopular (I think more for his actions off the show), people seemed to think he at least played a decent game and was the least worst of the final 4.

Your thoughts on Angelina sum up her edit perfectly.  It’s why I’m having a hard time seeing her win, but we’ll see what tomorrow brings.  She backstabs the Goliath’s it might not matter what Nick does, he might get all their votes just because.  I want to see Angelina have a Brad Culpeppe moment when she comes to the realization she’s lost and just turns away from everyone and sulks.  

Edited November 28, 2018 by LadyChatts

[JKL845]

If the final 3 are Nick, Mike & Angelina that is pretty much three Goliaths. From the get go, Nick seemed more like a Goliath than a David. More so than Mike even. Davie seems like a Goliath as well. Really these labels mean nothing. If Angelina makes it to final 3 I think she should win. 

[jay741982]

1 hour ago, LadyChatts said:

Jenna’s edit wasn’t that great, especially when it came to her tribemate Christy, but I recall many people said she was young and immature, and just aligned with the wrong people (namely her Survivor BFF Heidi).  After the season aired, Jenna admitted she didn’t like what she saw and had a lot of growing up to do.  I’m not saying she gained a ton of respect, but some people were willing to cut her a break.  Thailand was just a shit show season thwt despite Brian being unpopular (I think more for his actions off the show), people seemed to think he at least played a decent game and was the least worst of the final 4.

Your thoughts on Angelina sum up her edit perfectly.  It’s why I’m having a hard time seeing her win, but we’ll see what tomorrow brings.  She backstabs the Goliath’s it might not matter what Nick does, he might get all their votes just because.  I want to see Angelina have a Brad Culpeppe moment when she comes to the realization she’s lost and just turns away from everyone and sulks.  

How is she backstabbing Goliaths when they have made it clear shes on the bottom? Alec and Kara seem comfortable being on Bottom of Davids. Guess she should let them just take her out