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Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes


ArctisTor
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I think the series regular contract across all shows things was bs that TPTB came up with to placate fans of certain actors. Look at Wentworth Miller.

Yeah, I was sure that the WM thing was going to amount to much more than it has.  So I'll eat my words (not my hat - lol) on that one.  JB is the only one who's really done much, and all of that has been on LoT.

I'm not sure how much it has to do with placating fans though.  

Edited by Starfish35
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Barrowman's been the only using that contract, since he did appear on the Arrow part of the crossover, he's on LoT and will be in the Flash/Supergirl musical. Wentworth didn't want to commit to the show, however he has appeared on Flash and LoT. 

I think KC's contract was really an as needed contract and the other shows realized they didn't need her. 

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I think (correct me if my memory's flawed) WM has appeared once on Flash and once (so far) on LoT, and is supposed to be in the last couple of episodes of LoT.  

I'm really surprised that KC isn't (apparently) going to appear at least once on LoT, though, since so much of Sara's emotional arc this season revolved around her.  It seems like they'd bring her in at least once to wrap that up. 

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13 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Yeah, I was sure that the WM thing was going to amount to much more than it has.  So I'll eat my words (not my hat - lol) on that one.  JB is the only one who's really done much, and all of that has been on LoT.

I'm not sure how much it has to do with placating fans though.  

I remember when deadline came out with that interview with Berlanti after Snarts death aired with them saying he'd be a series regular across all the shows. In the same piece where they state he only wanted to do one season of Legends. That just never made sense to me since it was so contradictory. 

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25 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

I'm really surprised that KC isn't (apparently) going to appear at least once on LoT, though, since so much of Sara's emotional arc this season revolved around her.  It seems like they'd bring her in at least once to wrap that up. 

I can see why she might appear on LoT for Sara but I think it's more poignant if Sara's arc revolves around Laurel but Laurel never actually appears.

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I thought the main purpose of having a contract across all shows was simply to establish a rate so that the individual shows didn't have to negotiate each time they wanted to use the actors. Did I dream that? I thought it just got made into a bigger deal in the media than it was ever meant to be.

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22 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

I thought the main purpose of having a contract across all shows was simply to establish a rate so that the individual shows didn't have to negotiate each time they wanted to use the actors. Did I dream that? I thought it just got made into a bigger deal in the media than it was ever meant to be.

That certainly could be.  I'm not sure I ever read that stated anywhere though.  (But then my memory is like Swiss cheese sometimes so...*shrug* ) But it makes sense.

As far as KC, I remember reading that she had said something at a con about filming for both Arrow and Flash, but now I think she must have just been referring to that brief scene filmed on The Flash's pipeline set, that showed up in Arrow 510.

Edited by Starfish35
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6 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

I think (correct me if my memory's flawed) WM has appeared once on Flash and once (so far) on LoT, and is supposed to be in the last couple of episodes of LoT.  

I'm really surprised that KC isn't (apparently) going to appear at least once on LoT, though, since so much of Sara's emotional arc this season revolved around her.  It seems like they'd bring her in at least once to wrap that up. 

There's always next season :p 

Although honestly with new Black Canary if she makes it to regular I could see Arrow bring Black Siren back so they can do a Black Siren vs Black Canary Ep to the thrilling excitement of all. 

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8 hours ago, Proteus said:

Erica Durance for me.

Sorry to go back a page but for me, Erica Durance was the hands down worst Lois Lane of any of them.  For me, she is to Lois Lane what KC's Laurel is to BC.  They both even got the unearned, out of nowhere, still terrible at it, journey (Laurel to the mask and Lois from muffin peddler to reporter)  They had her PROUDLY working at a tabloid, happily letting them fake headlines and using her cousin for a source.  And later when she did land a job at the DP, not only did it come from a Lex Luthor plant, but the whole reason she pursued it was because she wanted the fame.  And not only did her abilities as a reporter continue to be awful, so were her ethics as she slept with her editor and made up stories.  Then suddenly after a summer hiatus, new show runners came in and POOF she was suddenly the best reporter at the Planet - despite never having even finished one year at college.  It was just extra salt in the wounds when they started having her claim stuff like working her way up from the obits and filing when that was actually her COUSIN who had been shown to be a passionate reporter destined for the Daily Planet.

And that was only on the professional side.  One the personal side she was the worst since she spent 4 years treating Clark like a dumb little brother only to start lusting for him while he was still hung up on Lana and Smallville's version of the great Lois and Clark love story was to again over a summer hiatus just retcon it that Clark was now desperately in love with her.  (Again, there was a change in show runners)  

And then even once she was dating Clark, we got it spelled out that Clark Kent wasn't enough to for her if she didn't also have adventures with the Blur to provide excitement (which ouch, sorry Clark, she doesn't really love you that much), but when she found out Clark was the Blur, she suddenly refused to question anything he did, (she told him he didn't have to include her or tell her what was going on in that part of his life - some partner) thought he was some kind of a god, and that he shouldn't waste his time on a relationship.  Oh and the only reason Clark ever told her his secret was because he was told she was his destiny.  WORST ROMANCE EVER. Seven years after the finale and a busted up wedding, they STILL hadn't gotten married and were then pretending not to even know each other at work!  

And that's not even taking in account the first six years where she was written as strident, grating, demanding and arrogant without having earned any reason for thinking she was the best.  Season ten, the final season when they weren't having her gush over Clark like he was a god, they finally wrote for her better and toned down most of her worst characteristics but by then, I was not interested in yet another retcon.  

Sorry.  Very sore subject.  Nearly ruined one of my ultimate favorite characters for me. 

Edited by BkWurm1
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4 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Sorry to go back a page but for me, Erica Durance was the hands down worst Lois Lane of any of them.  For me, she is to Lois Lane what KC's Laurel is to BC.  They both even got the unearned, out of nowhere, still terrible at it, journey (Laurel to the mask and Lois from muffin peddler to reporter)  They had her PROUDLY working at a tabloid, happily letting them fake headlines and using her cousin for a source.  And later when she did land a job at the DP, not only did it come from a Lex Luthor plant, but the whole reason she pursued it was because she wanted the fame.  And not only did her abilities as a reporter continue to be awful, so were her ethics as she slept with her editor and made up stories.  Then suddenly after a summer hiatus, new show runners came in and POOF she was suddenly the best reporter at the Planet - despite never having even finished one year at college.  It was just extra salt in the wounds when they started having her claim stuff like working her way up from the classifieds when that was actually her COUSIN who had been shown to be a passionate reporter destined for the Daily Planet.

And that was only on the professional side.  One the personal side she was the worst since she spent 4 years treating Clark like a dumb little brother only to start lusting for him while he was still hung up on Lana and Smallville's version of the great Lois and Clark love story was to again over a summer hiatus just retcon it that Clark was now desperately in love with her.  (Again, there was a change in show runners)  

And then even once she was dating Clark, we got it spelled out that Clark Kent wasn't enough to for her if she didn't also have adventures with the Blur to provide excitement (which ouch, sorry Clark, she doesn't really love you that much), but when she found out Clark was the Blur, she suddenly refused to question anything he did, (she told him he didn't have to include her or tell her what was going on in that part of his life - some partner) thought he was some kind of a god, and that he shouldn't waste his time on a relationship.  Oh and the only reason Clark ever told her his secret was because he was told she was his destiny.  WORST ROMANCE EVER. Seven years after the finale and a busted up wedding, they STILL hadn't gotten married and were then pretending not to even know each other at work!  

And that's not even taking in account the first six years where she was written as strident, grating, demanding and arrogant without having earned any reason for thinking she was the best.  Season ten, the final season when they weren't having her gush over Clark like he was a god, they finally wrote for her better and toned down most of her worst characteristics but by then, I was not interested in yet another retcon.  

Sorry.  Very sore subject.  Nearly ruined one of my ultimate favorite characters for me. 

THIS!!! Times a gazillion!  What made it worse was that the "new" show runners had been with the show, as writers, producers since the second season. So they don't have any excuses for how Lois was portrayed before they became the runners because they were responsible for the obnoxious, arrogant, belittling, she's the greatest thing ever, grating character to have come across my screen. 

Bitter? Who, me?

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1 minute ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

THIS!!! Times a gazillion!  What made it worse was that the "new" show runners had been with the show, as writers, producers since the second season. So they don't have any excuses for how Lois was portrayed before they became the runners because they were responsible for the obnoxious, arrogant, belittling, she's the greatest thing ever, grating character to have come across my screen. 

Bitter? Who, me?

I really try to come off as a sane, rational person, but my Post Traumatic Smallville Disorder flares up and I'm one step away from raving loon.  Laurel never came close to how much I couldn't stand what that show did to Lois.  

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Like, I find Tom Welling to be the worst actor I've willingly watched in my entire life. Seriously, I can't think of anyone else that made me feel so much secondhand embarrassment, and made me grit my teeth so much through so. many. episodes. of television. I didn't think he had chemistry with anyone... except Erica Durance. And I was never ever invested in Clark/Lois, I didn't ship them [I was busy obsessively shipping elsewhere], and I barely even paid that much attention to their storyline... but even from a distance, I thought Durance made Tom Welling shine, so I'm forever and ever grateful for her, because the more scenes they had together, the less my teeth suffered.

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30 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Like, I find Tom Welling to be the worst actor I've willingly watched in my entire life. Seriously, I can't think of anyone else that made me feel so much secondhand embarrassment, and made me grit my teeth so much through so. many. episodes. of television. I didn't think he had chemistry with anyone... except Erica Durance. And I was never ever invested in Clark/Lois, I didn't ship them [I was busy obsessively shipping elsewhere], and I barely even paid that much attention to their storyline... but even from a distance, I thought Durance made Tom Welling shine, so I'm forever and ever grateful for her, because the more scenes they had together, the less my teeth suffered.

I see it sort of similar to Stephen and Emily in a way that Tom looked like he was having more fun when in scenes with Erica because usually their scenes weren't tied down by mopey man pain alien angst like many of his other interactions.

I mean I wouldn't say he was NOTP constipated Amell face bad with his other love interests but I agree that he and Erica stood out in scenes together.

I mean I could see how Chloe and Clark could have worked- I mean Chloe could have slipped into Lois role in season 8- but after Clark spent seven seasons turning Chloe down and friend zoning her because of Lana I think her character deserved better then being the second choice because Lana wasn't in the picture.

And Oliver really was the better choice for Chloe because he actually respected her and was an equal to her  and a grown ass man. They had the right temperament for each other just like Lois had the right temprement for Clark.

And I think the Smallville writers didn't have as much of a love hate relationship with canon as the Arrow writers nor could they get away with big canon break away like the Arrow writers. Clark and Lois are just one of those things you don't mess with. 

I mean the outrage when they messed with Clark and Lois in New 52 came not just from comic people but people who'd never read comics in their life. 

I do think Erica was not the greatest actress though but she had enough charm and humor for me to enjoy her and she really grew into the role by the end. 

Edited by LeighAn
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14 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

And Oliver really was the better choice for Chloe because he actually respected her and was an equal to her  and a grown ass man. They had the right temperament for each other just like Lois had the right temprement for Clark.

This. I'm biased because Chloe/Ollie really is my #1 most favorite ever 'ship of all time, possibly also occupying #2 #3 #4 and #5 of my top five favorite 'ships... but I always felt like whenever Clark was anywhere near Chloe, she became a teenager again. And that bugged the fuck out of me. Oliver being a grown ass man who saw Chloe as a grown ass woman spoke to me like nothing else in that show.

[And also, you know, when two pretty people with insane chemistry start blackmailing each other over knowing the other had murdered someone. Because I'm weird and YES I'm gonna 'ship the folks who go "I know you murdered someone" "Well, I know you murdered someone too" "You can't ever tell Clark" "I won't". THAT'S THE BESTEST KIND OF 'SHIP, HELLO. /tangent]

And I had no problem whatsoever with Lois being abrasive. IF I were to 'ship Clark with anyone, it would be definitely with the lady who was always and forever rude to him to his face.

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Professional female reporters have been treated horribly in a lot of superhero entertainment.  Even Iris on The Flash (and I like Iris) went from coffee barista to news reporter with minimal training. Then there's the overused trope of having the female reporter sleep with the superhero (from Iron Man to Arrow).

Edited by tv echo
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6 hours ago, tv echo said:

Professional female reporters have been treated horribly in a lot of superhero entertainment.  Even Iris on The Flash (and I like Iris) went from coffee barista to news reporter with minimal training. Then there's the overused trope of having the female reporter sleep with the superhero (from Iron Man to Arrow).

True. However, Iris did have a college degree and was working on a graduate degree in season 1 -- a plot point that they never mentioned again *SIGH* -- and doing amateur writing about the Flash and metahumans. So it wasn't a completely out of the blue career change. I'm glad the writers realized that she shouldn't have been a barista in the first place, and were able to make the transition relatively quickly.

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In the Flarrowverse, the only BARISTA I know is Kendra. Her Barista job was legendary.

Most times, I forget that IW ever worked at Jitters. And when I remember it, I remember it was just her sidejob to get through school. Now could they do a better job showing IW doing her reporter job, totally. But they could do a better job with IW and just about everything.

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I think Iris should be a TV news reporter. They watch a lot of news reports of The Flash doing stuff, that could all easily be her. She could interview him on TV, etc. I just think it'd be much easier for them to incorporate that into the show more.

Edited by ruby24
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That is a good idea but it relies on the writers actually wanting to incorporate her story more, and I think they just don't. They are content with her being marginalized for most of the season or used in their very narrow characterization of her.

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They could always decide to make the change for the next season. I remember people saying they should have made her a cop from the start, since the show seems to know how to use cops more, and she was used so well on E2 as that. I think if they want to keep her a reporter for canon's sake, then making her a TV one would be most natural for using her when the news stuff comes up, which it does a lot. Maybe they don't even realize that, but if they were to step back and take a quick look, it's an obvious fit.

For example, even in the crossover eps, they had a reporter for Central City talking about what happened on the news. That's when it clicked for me and I realized how often they show and are watching news reports. Make that Iris and you could incorporate all that even more (which would bring in the wider city even more, which they sometimes struggle with on The Flash).

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IMO that isn't such a great idea. At least as a beat reporter (or whatever she is now), she can still be present in whatever limited capacity she is to help Team Flash with whatever villain is terrorizing them. If she was a TV reporter, she'd either be stuck behind a desk reporting on what was going on and unable to help, or off helping instead of reporting - which would make her look like an awful reporter. 

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This. I'm biased because Chloe/Ollie really is my #1 most favorite ever 'ship of all time, possibly also occupying #2 #3 #4 and #5 of my top five favorite 'ships... but I always felt like whenever Clark was anywhere near Chloe, she became a teenager again. And that bugged the fuck out of me. Oliver being a grown ass man who saw Chloe as a grown ass woman spoke to me like nothing else in that show.

[And also, you know, when two pretty people with insane chemistry start blackmailing each other over knowing the other had murdered someone. Because I'm weird and YES I'm gonna 'ship the folks who go "I know you murdered someone" "Well, I know you murdered someone too" "You can't ever tell Clark" "I won't". THAT'S THE BESTEST KIND OF 'SHIP, HELLO. /tangent]

I could watch Oliver and Chloe on a shallow level because the actors really did have great chemistry together but I hated how he treated her in season eight with the accusations of her being a murderer (she had Brainiac taking her mind out for spins) just to justify and cover up what he did, not to mention how he was perfectly fine with letting Clark mess with her brain.  Then in season nine, she kind of saved him by forcing him to face his demons and man up and I liked them at first but right away he was assuming the worst of her motivations with the weapons.

In season ten, Oliver was left behind pining for her and I liked that but then he started saying stuff like the reason she had to leave was because she couldn't handle the burden of keeping his secret when she'd had no problem with hiding the superpowered alien for even longer and then he outed himself to the world, using his own delusions about Chloe to justify it and I realized that he didn't know her at all.  The rest of their relationship all happened on the kind of fast forward that seemed destined not to last and I always felt that apart from deeply misunderstanding why she left, he only got to know her at her lowest, most guarded point in her life.  She was IMO less herself around Oliver. 

I didn't see her as reverting to a teenager around Clark, just owning the feelings she'd had for him since she was a teenager.  I mean by the time Chloe was sixteen, she never actually acted like a teenager again (written more mature than Curtis, Wild Dog, or Rory for sure).  Chlark was the ship that got away.  So much promise never fulfilled.  Yes, by mid season six, it was hard to not to be annoyed by Clark's continued Lana blinders but in my mind, had they gone Chlark, they would have reversed the script and Clark would have realized his feelings for Chloe just as she'd finally put him in her past so he'd be pining for a while after her!  And suddenly the balance of power is restored.  

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11 hours ago, LeighAn said:

I see it sort of similar to Stephen and Emily in a way that Tom looked like he was having more fun when in scenes with Erica because usually their scenes weren't tied down by mopey man pain alien angst like many of his other interactions.

Their sibling vibe was too strong for me to find it flirty.  Clark always seemed annoyed to me and wooden.   I always found those scenes off since she didn't have a clue what was going on (though she always claimed to know everything).   Really, I think that's where ED's Lois really lost me. I can not abide stupid and Lois was pretty dumb.  But then so was Clark.  Maybe it really was a match made in the stars.  

Edited by BkWurm1
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1 hour ago, wonderwall said:

And Wonder Woman pretty please

Eh, maybe?  I'm feeling pretty pessimistic about all of them.  I think there's a good chance that most of the Wonder Woman movie will be good but will have a kind of crappy ending.

Edited by BkWurm1
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'Arrow,' 'The Flash,' 'Supergirl and More WB Shows Get the LEGO Treatment
TV Insider Staff February 06, 2017 3:33 pm
http://www.tvinsider.com/gallery/arrow-the-flash-supergirl-lego-billboards/

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In honor of the Feb. 10th premiere of The LEGO Batman Movie, the crimefighters (and comedies) from Warner Bros. Television Group have undergone an intricate makeover that features the stars of Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, DC's Legends of Tomorrow and Gotham, as well as Mom, Ellen, The Big Bang Theory and The Middle all recreated out of LEGOs.

Made from more than 10,000 bricks, the toy-version of our TV faves are being used in massive billboards outside Warner Bros.' Burbank studios and end-card segments on each of their shows. In addition, LEGO Batman will pop up in super-producer Greg Berlanti's logo at the end of every episode and there will be movie spots showcasing the LEGO mini-figure versions of The Flash, Supergirl, The Atom and Green Arrow, all voiced by the actors who play them on The CW.

‘Arrow,’ ‘Flash,’ ‘Supergirl’ and More Meet ‘LEGO Batman’ in New Promo
Kevin Fitzpatrick | Feb. 6, 2017
http://screencrush.com/lego-batman-cw-flash-supergirl-arrow-promo

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The CW and Warner Bros. debuted a brief animated LEGO Batman Movie promotion during this week’s Supergirl, featuring Stephen Amell, Grant Gustin, Melissa Benoist and Brandon Routh voicing their DC counterparts opposite Will Arnett. In addition to the brief promo (and logo bumpers that will follow each show this week), check out official banners of the characters below, including other Warner Bros. series like Gotham, The Big Bang Theory and even Ellen:

a0b21ff6-c2ba-4e14-92a9-fd8be4a7187f.JPG

arrow-the-flash.jpg?w=780

supergirl.jpg?w=780

gotham.jpg?w=780

Edited by tv echo
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MATT RYAN WANTS CONSTANTINE BACK ON LIVE-ACTION TV
Matt McGloin  02/07/2017 - 9:23am
https://www.cosmicbooknews.com/content/matt-ryan-wants-constantine-back-live-action-tv

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Is there any talk of getting back to live TV? We have to get you back on Arrow or even The Flash or Legends of Tomorrow.

Matt Ryan: Fortunately, since I finished doing Arrow last time, I've been really busy. I did a play in New York, and I just finished shooting a TV show in the UK [The Halcyon] where I play a 1940s American journalist who's based loosely on Edward R. Murrow. Very different, you know. Clean shaven, sit back sides. [Different dialect]. Yeah, exactly. So I've been really busy.

I don't know if [live-action] works out. I'm always up for reprising this character because I feel like there was some unfinished business with the TV show. I felt we were really getting somewhere in terms of the tone of it and the storylines we were exploring. So any other opportunity to explore him or flesh him out, I'm game for. 

How about the Spectre for the Constantine animated series?

Matt Ryan: That's the other thing with the live-action as well, that is something we would have fleshed out. Depending on what we do with it, that's a character that would be great and also the relationship with Zed. All the characters that are already in there would be great, but we'll see where we go with it. There are so many great characters in that world. 

Edited by tv echo
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The demo breakdown for CW shows for the week from 30th January till 3rd February) . Also seems obvious Riverdale is gonna get renewed they getting the nice female demo in 18-34

 

“Supergirl” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.5/2
Women 18-49: 0.7/2
Men 18-49: 0.7/3

“Jane the Virgin” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.3/1
Men 18-34: 0.2/1
Women 18-49: 0.4/1
Men 18-49: 0.2/1

“The Flash” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.7/3
Men 18-34: 1.0/5
Women 18-49: 0.9/3
Men 18-49: 1.3/5

“D.C.’s Legends of Tomorrow” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.6/3
Women 18-49: 0.6/2
Men 18-49: 0.8/3

“Arrow” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.6/3
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.7/3

“The 100” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.4/2
Men 18-34: 0.4/2
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.4/1

“Supernatural” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.5/3
Women 18-49: 0.6/2
Men 18-49: 0.6/2

“Riverdale” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.6/3
Men 18-34: 0.3/1
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.3/1

Edited by Velocity23
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7 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

The demo breakdown for CW shows for the week from 30th January till 3rd February) . Also seems obvious Riverdale is gonna get renewed they getting the nice female demo in 18-34

 

“Supergirl” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.5/2
Women 18-49: 0.7/2
Men 18-49: 0.7/3

“Jane the Virgin” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.3/1
Men 18-34: 0.2/1
Women 18-49: 0.4/1
Men 18-49: 0.2/1

“The Flash” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.7/3
Men 18-34: 1.0/5
Women 18-49: 0.9/3
Men 18-49: 1.3/5

“D.C.’s Legends of Tomorrow” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.6/3
Women 18-49: 0.6/2
Men 18-49: 0.8/3

“Arrow” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.6/3
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.7/3

“The 100” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.4/2
Men 18-34: 0.4/2
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.4/1

“Supernatural” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.5/2
Men 18-34: 0.5/3
Women 18-49: 0.6/2
Men 18-49: 0.6/2

“Riverdale” (CW)
Women 18-34: 0.6/3
Men 18-34: 0.3/1
Women 18-49: 0.5/2
Men 18-49: 0.3/1

I'm a 34 year old and I'm digging Riverdale. Hope it does get renewed

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