Season 8: Speculation and Spoilers Discussion

[Stallion12]

Since there's detail missing, maybe only part of the summary is real? Like the wildlife move up north, but John doesn't take the black? I guess it depends if bran talks about the night king or not returning. Honestly if the very end is true in skipping the prequels.

[Oscirus]

16 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

Missandei should have been Dany's Hand all along.  Tyrion hasn't given her good advice once since he became her adviser.  If these spoilers are true, even his advice to trust Jon Snow was bad.  But smug white dude who talks like he knows everything trumps the savvy brown slave who understood immediately that the "peace" with the Meereen slavers was hollow.

Tyrion was the only reason why she got out of Mereen  in the first place. Fools a diplomat not a war general.   Now yea her relying her invasion plan on tyrion instead of any of actual war generals was dumb and Jon distracting her from her original goal didn't help matters either.

My real problem is wtf did Dany do to be treated like this? At this point I have to imagine that Emilia Clark was a bitch on the set to everybody and the writers wanted to punish dany because holy shit

[anamika]

9 minutes ago, GraceK said:

So tell me, in what universe is Daenarys not allowed to flip her shit and finally rain down fire and blood? How much more saintly can she be? How are her actions not justified?

Tyrion kills lots of people with Wildfire. Including Davos' son. Davos brushes it aside.

Dany executes two traitors with Dragonfire.

Tyrion: OMG, how awful. This is mad queen behavior. Sam: Dany is a psychopathic killer

Jon charges madly after Ramsay kills Rickon, leads many of his men into the trap and gets them killed.

Dany gets enraged at Cersei killing Missandei and attacks KL - Jon urges restraint and then kills her.

Arya wipes out the entire Frey family for them killing her family. YAY!

Dany wants to kill the Lannisters for what they did to hers? Kill the mad queen!

[Affogato]

50 minutes ago, raven said:

I'm annoyed that apparently Tyrion, who has been frankly terrible at everything after killing Tywin and Shae, survives.  

It always takes a while to o ercome years of abuse. He will get there. 

[Stallion12]

10 minutes ago, anamika said:

We don't need the last 3 episodes for that. Why should anyone be interested in watching the Long Night if the baddies are losers who get defeated in one episode by a little ninja assassin?  Cersei has killed more protagonists, done more damage and is more deadly than the NK and his army. Why should anyone care or watch about the NK after episode 3?

His stealth ships constantly appearing out of nowhere is equally annoying.  The writing on this show is soooo terrible. Damn.

You want the good writing, but you need the bad subversion.

And we thought Dorne was bad.

Like real life then.

Good point, how easily they are defeated does hamper the buildup, though I enjoyed how the nk went down.

[Bannon]

Makes me wish Mel Brooks was 40 years old again. "Game of the Stoned" could be better than "Young Frankenstein".

[ShellsandCheese]

This just makes me respect writers who know how to end their tv shows in a way that does not insult the viewers intelligence and respects the storytelling and characterization that happened throughout the course of the show - even if the ending isn’t happy.

That’s why I can rewatch Breaking Bad over and over again but not Buffy. The former being a great example of getting it right; the latter being a great example of not. 

I cannot believe that writers still have not figured out that a bad or ridiculous ending to what was a good or great tv show just taints the overall view of the show. 

Edited May 5, 2019 by ShellsandCheese

[GraceK]

What dream of spring? These are bitter as hell. There is no sweet in any of these.

Edited May 5, 2019 by GraceK

[JennyMominFL]

I always assumed there would be no Iron Throne at the end, so I assumed Dany would die too.

Edited May 5, 2019 by JennyMominFL

[Oscirus]

1 minute ago, ShellsandCheese said:

This just makes me respect writers who know how to end their tv shows in a way that don’t insult the viewers intelligence and respects the storytelling and characterization that happened throughout the course of the show - even if the ending isn’t happy. That’s why I can rewatch Breaking Bad over and over again but not Buffy. The former being a great example of getting it right; the latter being a great example of not. 

Breaking bad is one of maybe two or three shows in my lifetime that stuck the landing with their ending. That shit's hard. That being said, this wrecked the landing.  Arya and Sansa might be the only two characters that come out of this not completely wrecked character wise. Which might be impressive given this is an ensemble cast.

[shireenbamfatheon]

According to an episode summary, Missandei and Grey Worm travel by ship, Jon and Davos by horse, and Dany by dragon. Missandei's taken when their ships are attacked and Tyrion tries to negotiate with Cersei afterward. So no, he's not being unreasonable. 

[SimoneS]

Another positive, Gendry seems to survive. He gets legitimized and made the Lord of Storm's End. The Baratheons' restored and through him and a few others the Targaryens line will continue.

[Bannon]

7 minutes ago, ShellsandCheese said:

This just makes me respect writers who know how to end their tv shows in a way that don’t insult the viewers intelligence and respects the storytelling and characterization that happened throughout the course of the show - even if the ending isn’t happy. That’s why I can rewatch Breaking Bad over and over again but not Buffy. The former being a great example of getting it right; the latter being a great example of not. 

Similarly,  David Milch can end a story, without consciously trying to, better than the two mediocrities can on purpose.

[Affogato]

49 minutes ago, nikma said:

No, but no pont in this discussion apparently. I love it  I love tragedies and I am happy the show won't have conventional ending. 

Story that started with Ned's death should end this way. And I am happy GRRM and D&D stayed true to themselves.

It is what makes him one of my favorite writers. 

[Brn2bwild]

If the spoilers are true, it makes me sick.  While Dany definitely has flaws, they are no worse than anyone else's, and I have been rooting for her all along to succeed and learn from her mistakes.  Her being killed for being justifiably angry is a fuck you to her and to much of the audience.

Oh, and fuck Tyrion and a giant fuck you to Bronn, a character who should have been killed or retired seasons ago. 

[Bannon]

6 minutes ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

According to an episode summary, Missandei and Grey Worm travel by ship, Jon and Davos by horse, and Dany by dragon. Missandei's taken when their ships are attacked and Tyrion tries to negotiate with Cersei afterward. So no, he's not being unreasonable. 

God, that is so, so, so, dumb. Really dumb. D.U.M.B..*

*absolutely dumb

[Chaser]

There is an epilogue right? Now of these leaks sounds like it would work for that. Are these only for 4/5?

[shireenbamfatheon]

Also, Dany tells Jon not to tell anyone about his claim because it trumps hers lmao. So she'd rather everyone believe Rhaegar was a rapist who kidnapped an innocent young girl than reveal the truth.  

[anamika]

6 minutes ago, GraceK said:

What dream of spring? These are bitter as hell. There is no sweet in any of these.

Hey, at least Stark stans will be happy. They are already celebrating Missandei's death over on Tumblr because she dared to 'put Sansa in her place' last episode.

Time for wolves and all that.

[Oscirus]

5 minutes ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

According to an episode summary, Missandei and Grey Worm travel by ship, Jon and Davos by horse, and Dany by dragon. Missandei's taken when their ships are attacked and Tyrion tries to negotiate with Cersei afterward. So no, he's not being unreasonable. 

BY horse? the fuck?

[Meredith Quill]

43 minutes ago, Edith said:

Again fans reaching...it was a goodbye party for the crew members..

Yes, that could be an explanation. For the record, I wasn't reaching, I was genuinely confused about it. You've provided a possible explanation, so thanks for that.

[Minneapple]

2 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

Another positive, Gendry seems to survive. He gets legitimized and made the Lord of Storm's End. The Baratheons' restored and through him and a few others the Targaryens line will continue.

Well, that sounds great to me. I know I said this is not a shippy show but I do kinda wish he and Arya would stay together and be Lord and Lady of Storm's End. 

2 minutes ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

Also, Dany tells Jon not to tell anyone about his claim because it trumps hers lmao. So she'd rather everyone believe Rhaegar was a rapist who kidnapped an innocent young girl than reveal the truth.  

What the fuck, Dany?

[shireenbamfatheon]

1 minute ago, Minneapple said:

Well, that sounds great to me. I know I said this is not a shippy show but I do kinda wish he and Arya would stay together and be Lord and Lady of Storm's End. 

What the fuck, Dany?

Explains why he's no longer riding Rhaegal. 

[LadyChaos]

You all are assuming that the spoilers are real.  We don't know that they are.

[ElizaD]

1 minute ago, Minneapple said:

Well, that sounds great to me. I know I said this is not a shippy show but I do kinda wish he and Arya would stay together and be Lord and Lady of Storm's End.

There's absolutely going to be post-canon fic of Arya returning from her wanderings and telling Gendry he can propose to her again. Almost every other ship will go down in flames, so this is pretty good for Gendrya.

[Bannon]

16 minutes ago, Oscirus said:

BY horse? the fuck?

Really, just for the hell of it, why not have Meera Reed drag Jon down to KL on a tarp?

Edited May 5, 2019 by Bannon

[ShellsandCheese]

3 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

Well, that sounds great to me. I know I said this is not a shippy show but I do kinda wish he and Arya would stay together and be Lord and Lady of Storm's End. 

What the fuck, Dany?

This is also contradictory though. By legitimizing Gendry, he too, could have a claim to the throne by virtue of the fact that he is the last surviving son of King Robert Baratheon. So it’s yet another plot point that makes no sense and isn’t consistent. 

But what I find most laughable is that Cersei is ruling Westeros to begin with. She has no claim to the throne, none. It’s unbelievable that so many people would have supported her and been okay with it. With Dany, Jon, and a potentially legitimate Gendry its obvious who the usurper is. 

[Stallion12]

1 minute ago, LadyChaos said:

You all are assuming that the spoilers are real.  We don't know that they are.

True, but with how bad the writing is its believable. We do know the mountain beheaded melisendra. Unless that's a fake scene. It's on youtube.

[aprilbabe]

53 minutes ago, GraceK said:

He wasn’t wrong 😂

Yep and there is another interview where they ask him to describe the finale in one word and he says "disappointing" He then backtracked and said "epic" but no, he meant what he said the first time.

[cambridgeguy]

So...., are GRRM and/or D&D fans of The Killing Joke? Because they sure as hell seem to be putting Dany through her one bad day period, just stretched out over a week(?) or so.  Euron certainly seems to have taken up the Ramsey Bolton mantle of invincible supervillain, at least.

I will say this about Missandei's death - having her head chopped off is actually pretty merciful for Cersei.  That seems less painful than just shoving her off the edge, having the Mountain crush her head, burning her, etc.

This also begs the question of whether or not Dany left anyone behind to hold Dragonstone when she headed north.  That's the most obvious place to set a trap, especially if you have a strong navy.

Edited May 5, 2019 by cambridgeguy

[Brn2bwild]

4 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

You all are assuming that the spoilers are real.  We don't know that they are.

I'm clinging to the hope that the biggest ones are not.  I'm not surprised we'd have at least one terrible character death (Missandei), but I'm hoping Dany doesn't get killed.  We spent months thinking Tyrion would get executed for trapping Kings Landing residents and letting them die by fire rather than be turned into wights, and it looks like that won't happen.  

Then again, these are the people who thought Confederate was a good idea.  Fuck.

Edited May 5, 2019 by Brn2bwild

[chrisvee]

3 hours ago, aprilbabe said:

I wonder if she doesn't realize they are there. It looks like they are just arriving at dragonstone and Euron fleet is hidden. Poor Rhaegal.

It does look likes she’s ambushed. 

Spoiler

There is also a screenshot of Brienne and Jaime having sex.

OAS, the leaks seem to indicate that Bran may be sharing the NK/wights aren’t just ‘gone.’ I’m putting that together with the Qyburn info about having his own game and thinking that he is going to do a CotF and beget the next NK so that the battle always continues. But that’s my wild and crazy spec.

[LadyChaos]

2 minutes ago, Stallion12 said:

True, but with how bad the writing is its believable. We do know the mountain beheaded melisendra. Unless that's a fake scene. It's on youtube.

You mean Missendei?  Because Melissandre is already dead.

[nikma]

And those who named their children Khaleesi...... lol

[Nightingale]

Welp. I sure am glad I believed the leaks the second I saw them. I spent the week getting over it and now I'm sort of laughing at the whole thing. It's so BAD. 

Only question right now is what was the point of the Jon and Dany romance? To make us feel bad for Jon when he has to kill Dany?

Because right now I don't. The relationship had 2 scenes. That's it. A silent love scene and a cheesy dragon montage. No talk of feelings, no plans for the future, no nothing. For all I know they broke up off screen and he doesn't even care. And I'm told they only have one scene this episode talking about his claim. So no, I don't feel bad that he has to kill someone he barely seems to care about.

Everything that happened in season 7 was such a weird waste of time...

[anamika]

So did Rhaegar run away with Lyanna to have another child who would kill his sister? Was that the whole point of Rhaegar's story and the prophecies he was reading about? To save frigging KL?

Edited May 5, 2019 by anamika

[LadyChaos]

2 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

I'm clinging to the hope that the biggest ones are not.  I'm not surprised we'd have at least one terrible character death (Missandei), but I'm hoping Dany doesn't get killed.  We spent months thinking Tyrion would get executed for trapping Kings Landing residents and letting them die by fire rather than be turned into wights, and it looks like that won't happen.  

Then again, these are the people who thought Confederate was a good idea.  Fuck.

I mean, if the leak that Dany turns crazy is true.....I suppose Missandei getting executed would do it.  Outside of Jorrah whom she just watch die, Missandei is her closest, truest friend. I'm not saying its the path I would choose......but I've said for years that I would be shocked if Missandei and Greyworm survive the series.  

[onyxrose81]

Dany telling Jon not to tell anyone about his claim is so stupid.  Just get married.  It’s just another example of gotdamn useless writing.  

[Brn2bwild]

1 minute ago, Nightingale said:

Welp. I sure am glad I believed the leaks the second I saw them. I spent the week getting over it and now I'm sort of laughing at the whole thing. It's so BAD. 

Only question right now is what was the point of the Jon and Dany romance? To make us feel bad for Jon when he has to kill Dany?

Because right now I don't. The relationship had 2 scenes. That's it. A silent love scene and a cheesy dragon montage. No talk of feelings, no plans for the future, no nothing. For all I know they broke up off screen and he doesn't even care. And I'm told they only have one scene this episode talking about his claim. So no, I don't feel bad that he has to kill someone he barely seems to care about.

Everything that happened in season 7 was such a weird waste of time...

If the spoilers are true, as far as I'm concerned, the show ended at 6:10.

[Bannon]

8 minutes ago, nikma said:

And those who named their children Khaleesi...... lol

Ok, that is really, genuinely, FUNNY!

[SimoneS]

7 minutes ago, aprilbabe said:

Yep and there is another interview where they ask him to describe the finale in one word and he says "disappointing" He then backtracked and said "epic" but no, he meant what he said the first time.

Knowing how the story ends, Kit and Emilia's comments are now understandable. They seem both disappointed with how the story ended, but they did a good job with the PR. 

Edited May 5, 2019 by SimoneS

[BooBear]

6 minutes ago, aprilbabe said:

Yep and there is another interview where they ask him to describe the finale in one word and he says "disappointing" He then backtracked and said "epic" but no, he meant what he said the first time.

I read someplace that when he told Rose Leslie the ending she wouldn't speak to him for 3 hours.

[chrisvee]

2 hours ago, Happy Harpy said:

Rhaegal killed by Euron is now proven, and it's specific enough.

For now, I'm pissed off about Jaime betraying (so only those who die are truly redempted? sigh) and Missandei's death.

During the off-season, I made my peace witht the fact I might not like the ending. I loved 8x02 and 8x03, but well. I just hope they won't also destroy Arya, too, since she's the one I care most about.

my understanding is that there isn’t anything in the leaked footage that confirms a Jaime betrayal or involvement in M’s execution 

[Brn2bwild]

1 minute ago, SimoneS said:

Knowing how the story ends, Kit and Emilia's comments are now understandable. They seem both disappointed with how the story ended, but they did a good job with the PR. 

It would certainly be gutsy of Emilia Clarke to watch the final episode with a fan knowing her character gets killed.

[SimoneS]

Just now, Brn2bwild said:

It would certainly be gutsy of Emilia Clarke to watch the final episode with a fan knowing her character gets killed.

Yep, that was the first thing I posted about when I accepted that the Jon killing Dany leak was real. I just hope the person isn't a Dany fan so they aren't crushed. However, having Emilia there to comfort him or her would be totally worth it.

[Stallion12]

8 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

You mean Missendei?  Because Melissandre is already dead.

Yes. I keep doing that.

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, Bannon said:

Can we not at least have a competently written tragedy?

It is hrd to twll. So far the spoilers, as filtered through this forum, sound character driven enough. Tyrion is a better political strategist than military, dany misses Jorah for that role and for his ability to turn her from acts she will regret. Jon is an outsider who was happiest in the NW. etc. 

[nikma]

4 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Ok, that is really, genuinely, FUNNY!

And it's not? They will feel like idiots.

[anamika]

5 minutes ago, onyxrose81 said:

Dany telling Jon not to tell anyone about his claim is so stupid.  Just get married.  It’s just another example of gotdamn useless writing.   

Jon is the worst thing that ever happened to Daenerys. She lost everything because of him and then she’s going to get killed by him as well.

[Nightingale]

3 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

If the spoilers are true, as far as I'm concerned, the show ended at 6:10.

I wish I could be one of those people but to me it's either I love the entire show or I'm cancelling all of it.

Boy I'm so glad I'm such a cheapskate that I never bought any of these Funkos and all that stuff. It would be thrown in the garbage right about now.