S01.E04: Hurricane on the Horizon

[OnceSane]

Quote

In the aftermath of Lyle's revelation that Ashley works as a baggage handler, Ashley hears a juicy rumor about Catherine and Lyle. Meanwhile, Happy urges her mother to support her marriage to Azam, and Hannah finds some unexpected opposition as she attempts to start a dress line. Later, as Hurricane Matthew nears Savannah, Catherine hosts a dinner party that quickly becomes a storm of its own. 

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, OnceSane said:

Lyle's revelation that Ashley works as a baggage handler, Ashley hears a juicy rumor about Catherine and Lyle.

How are "I know where you work" and "your longtime girlfriend is cheating on you," remotely equivalent? The fact that this Ashley baggage handler thing is going to be a story is beyond ridiculous and illustrates the show is crazy lame. Is it shameful because she has to have a blue collar job that isn't cool? And if it's not true why would anyone start such a random ass rumor?

[Sun-Bun]

Lord...these people were quite insanely self-impressed with their sad little "So Savannah" dinner party. They were just gushing and preening and gasping with self-importance like they were at the Met Gala. Which tells me that they obviously don't get out to very many fancy dinner parties all that much.

Also, Lyle is a gross snob. Who cares if Ashley works a random side hustle at Delta? Good for her; why does she even need to mention one of her extra gigs to anyone? She said she was busy "working"---that's more than enough info for anyone she's just met to know, so he can get over his nasty balding self already. And take his nasty drunk cheater of a girlfriend who isn't even into him along for the ride.

[breezy424]

I'm not even sure if I'm in the right episode thread.  These people are so boring I still don't have all the names straight.  I did get Hannah (Wait, is it Hannah?)  and Happy down last week.  And yeah, Ashley and Catherine.  The guys...I'm still at a lost.

Ok.  I'm on the other side of pool because these people are so ridiculous and I have to go with team Ashley.  Yeah, it's that bad.  That guy Lyle (?) is a total douche.  But heck, is Catherine (sorry, not sure of the spelling) cheating on him?  Better be careful of who you go after if your own house isn't in order.

And with Happy...if a couple marries from different faiths, shouldn't both compromise.  No cross?  What if 'she' wants a cross?  Unless, she converts, I think the marriage is doomed to fail if they decide to have children.  It's gonna get very sticky. 

Edited May 30, 2017 by breezy424

[Thumper]

I was embarrassed for Catherine (? Don't know all the names either) oohing and aahing over Mr. Muscle's muscles at the beach.  Ugh.  I guess I thought she was half-way "promised" to the other guy (Lyle?)?

But then I'm not into muscle-men.  Seems too self-absorbed to me.

[AttackTurtle]

I actually like the long haired guy (Daniel?), and the girl who Ashley tangled with over strip golf is okay. I am happy that he's addressing the Jewish slur to what's his name (Cooper?).   

i totally want to know if I work ten hours a week if I fly for free.  I would take that gig in a heart beat.

I don't foresee myself ever liking this group as much as the original charmers; however Savannah is one of my favorite cities so I'll hang in there.

[Michichick]

Lyle's fucking stupid smirk at dinner made me stabby. I hate that guy.

@AttackTurtle, I'm with you, I'd gladly take that part-time job if it let me fly free. Why are these people so judgy about Ashley having a real job? Everyone can't be a fake Congressman, after all.

[KBrownie]

I don't like any of these people, but I'm totally on Team Ashley just due to the fact that the others are all so, so awful.  As has already been mentioned, who cares if Ashley works at Delta?!  They claim that they aren't judging for it, but then why care so much that she didn't tell you?  Maybe she was afraid, that you know, you might judge her for it.  They judge her for everything else.  I admit, I've come into this late and have only seen the past three episodes, counting the latest one, but does Ashley really deserve the gang up?

And Hannah and the other brunette were just the picture of catty mean girls with their comment while at the beach about Ashley liking to take off her clothes in front of their boyfriends.  Like, how dare she, take off her cover-up to go swimming.  In the ocean.  STFU.  And her swimsuit was fairly modest I thought.  What was she supposed to do that would have been appropriate for them?  Swim in a bodysuit?  Not show any skin at all?  They were ridiculous.  Nothing Ashley does can or will ever be good enough for them.  They all are just looking for a reason to bash her.  Ashley isn't my cup of tea at all, but I'm not seeing any justification for how they act towards her.

They were totally out for blood with Nelson too for some reason.  Although it seems like he's told some real whoppers in his time.  But why not address it one on one?  Why wait for the pile on?  It makes ALL of them look just so mean, nasty, and hateful.  I feel like Daniel tries to play peacemaker and above it all, but he's just as shitty as the rest.  

Edited May 30, 2017 by KBrownie
Forgot about the weirdness with Nelson

[bichonblitz]

Ashley is so full of shit. No way 5 hrs. a week at the airport is going to get you the perk of flying anywhere for free.  And her nasty house makes me itch. I can't stand her and her shiny face! And what is with her standing up at the head of the dinner table like she's some queen bee? Sit your ass down, Ashley. 

7 hours ago, breezy424 said:

And with Happy...if a couple marries from different faiths, shouldn't both compromise.  No cross?  What if 'she' wants a cross?  Unless, she converts, I think the marriage is doomed to fail if they decide to have children.  It's gonna get very sticky.

She was rude to her mother. Where were her proper southern Savannah manners? Spoiled brat. I loved it when her mom got up and walked away from her.  Her boyfriend/Fiancee', is he not allowed to speak?  I haven't heard a word out of his mouth but he's always with Happy, except when she was at mommies being a bitch. 

Edited May 30, 2017 by bichonblitz

[Giselle]

Ashley is a mess and her house physically shows it. SHIT IS PILED EVERYEHERE! She is just this side of being a hoarder, does she ever throw anything out?  There is crap piled on crap, piled on crap on every surface. Crap piled on the floor, barely any space on the kitchen counters, crap hanging off the cabinets and closet doorss, not and empty space on the walls, crap hanging from the ceiling, stinky old shoes lined up the staircase on each step and also piled in a basket on the entryway. Not a clear space anywhere. Don't get me started on the damn goldfish bowl.

 It's not eclectic it's filthy. You can't have that much crap strewn about and keep it all clean. I would bet she had someone come in and clean it before the cameras rolled, or she took time off to clean and now it has gone back to it's normal dust covered cobwebbed existence. How do you let cameras in your house when it looks like that?

As far as her working two jobs or at Delta I don't care. I think she's doing it to pay the bills and the freebies if any are few and far between. She can fly around the world for free now for 10 hours of working for Delta? Please. I find it interesting that there is a  distance between her and most everyone around her including her family and so called friends.

Just don't like her....nor the rest of the cast. They aren't attractive inside nor on the outside.

Can they just shut up so we can look at the houses.

When the previews showed Shep saying "Savannah the ugly stepchild of Charleston." he wasn't lying if he was talking about their respective shows. If they don't have a reunion I won't feel a loss.

Train wreck TV at it's worst.

Edited May 30, 2017 by Giselle

[MrsWitter]

The best part of this episode (and the show thus far, IMO) was the scene with Happy's mom's dog and the crab.  I watched the short bit a few times and told SO I finally found something I liked about the show! That dog was adorable.

[jumper sage]

13 hours ago, Giselle said:

Can they just shut up so we can look at the houses.

When the previews showed Shep saying "Savannah the ugly stepchild of Charleston." he wasn't lying if he was talking about their respective shows. If they don't have a reunion I won't feel a loss.

Yes, yes, yes on the architecture!  Oh a dual city crossover?  I am so in.  These people are nuts.

[NoJustNo]

I am embarrassed to say I even watched this. OMGawd these people are gawd awful. Ashley is so just trying to keep the show on the air. They've got to come up with some sort of drama. Yes, who cares that she works at Delta! Good grief. Although why can't she just own it-Savannah is not where you go if $ is your only interest. Unless you come from it. I just can't see how that population can support any real stylist population. SCAD (Savannah College of Art & Design) is still there but they opened a campus in ATL about 10years ago and it's now bigger than the one in Savannah for related reasons.  

I wouldn't claim to be an expert on all things Southern. But I grew up in Atlanta and live here now. (Went to Az for undrgrad/NYC for grad). And my family is from here. My Grandmother had a very proper Southern accent-one of those that is so proper that she almost sounded English. My husband works for an ATL nonprofit and we have to go to charity galas, etc.  So, I'm around the 'haves' plenty and many at formal events. Let me promise you I've never once seen fur coats- not in the dead of winter  (in GA that means 40 degrees lol)  let alone in the summer on the coast. We do not swim in swamps. We do not golf in our underwear. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's a crime. 

[sasha206]

Ashley's sexless marriage seems to be the result of her husband being gay.  Some serious gaydar ping.

[sasha206]

I feel like this show should be called, "Southern Charm:  Trailer Park in the Outskirts of Savannah."  Ugly people who are not even remotely interesting.

[Atlanta]

2 hours ago, NoJustNo said:

I am embarrassed to say I even watched this. OMGawd these people are gawd awful. Ashley is so just trying to keep the show on the air. They've got to come up with some sort of drama. Yes, who cares that she works at Delta! Good grief. Although why can't she just own it-Savannah is not where you go if $ is your only interest. Unless you come from it. I just can't see how that population can support any real stylist population. SCAD (Savannah College of Art & Design) is still there but they opened a campus in ATL about 10years ago and it's now bigger than the one in Savannah for related reasons.  

I wouldn't claim to be an expert on all things Southern. But I grew up in Atlanta and live here now. (Went to Az for undrgrad/NYC for grad). And my family is from here. My Grandmother had a very proper Southern accent-one of those that is so proper that she almost sounded English. My husband works for an ATL nonprofit and we have to go to charity galas, etc.  So, I'm around the 'haves' plenty and many at formal events. Let me promise you I've never once seen fur coats- not in the dead of winter  (in GA that means 40 degrees lol)  let alone in the summer on the coast. We do not swim in swamps. We do not golf in our underwear. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's a crime. 

This ^^^^ so much. I obviously live in Atlanta (hence my screen name--LOL) and no way on earth the posh women in Atlanta wear fur. I've been to charity galas and nary a fur is to be seen. The only person you may see wear one are the little old ladies, but even that is pushing it. Savannah is a beautiful city (been there several times), but a stylist would do better in Atlanta. There's plenty of old money, new money, professional athlete money, etc. There's also a HUGE movie industry here. 

Ew on swimming in a swamp. If you want to swim, go to Tybee Island.

I'm pretty sure part time airline employees don't get to fly for free.

Edited May 31, 2017 by Atlanta

[Darva6]

1 hour ago, Atlanta said:

I'm pretty sure part time airline employees don't get to fly for free.

Actually, they do (after paying a yearly $50 fee). They fly stand by but it's still free!

Full & part time employees also get full health benefits. 

[gunderda]

On 5/30/2017 at 5:51 AM, bichonblitz said:

Ashley is so full of shit. No way 5 hrs. a week at the airport is going to get you the perk of flying anywhere for free.

I think it's more like 10 because she kept saying 5 hours, 2 times a week.

An employees do get to fly for free, its generally standby though which can't be easy to get because planes are packed to the max now.

[bichonblitz]

Just now, gunderda said:

I think it's more like 10 because she kept saying 5 hours, 2 times a week.

An employees do get to fly for free, its generally standby though which can't be easy to get because planes are packed to the max now.

Well, I'll be darned! Thanks for the correction. I have been looking for a part time job.....

[gunderda]

7 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

Well, I'll be darned! Thanks for the correction. I have been looking for a part time job.....

Just remember you'll have to work in all weather conditions lol 

[psychoticstate]

I'm totally Team Ashley on this one - - and I didn't even like her at the beginning of this dull show.  Who cares where she's working?  She has a legit job and as she says, at least she's not living off Daddy.  CATHERINE.  

Catherine is certainly not one to talk.  And never mind the potential cheating.  She's what?  30?  Just over 30?  And she has no job or jobs.  She's still trying to figure it out?  Girl, please.  You don't want to work.  You want to sit around and drink and let Daddy pay the bills. So you certainly shouldn't say shit to anyone.  Your boyfriend, or whatever he is, is a pompous douchebag who will end up with a drinking problem, a mistress and some scandal if you two ever get married. 

Happy isn't terrible and I like her fiance.  I'm also confused by the "she can't have a cross in her home."  Huh?  Why can't she, if she wants, and he have whatever symbols of religion he would like?  

Ashley's home life makes me feel sad for her.  I'm sure a lot of people stay in marriages for the kid(s)' sake but it's really unfair for all at the end of the day. 

Except for Ashley, these folks are pretty boring.  And they drink a ton.

[biakbiak]

3 hours ago, Darva6 said:

Actually, they do (after paying a yearly $50 fee). They fly stand by but it's still free!

Full & part time employees also get full health benefits. 

Depends she is probably part of Deltas Ready Reserve program that gets travel benefits but not health benefits.

[allicatexp]

How many hours of footage had to be shot at that dinner party to get the 37 different conversations we saw? That was really all over the place.

[NoJustNo]

Ashley is just trying to keep the show going I think. She keeps pushing this "things are so different in the SOUTH" business. As if no one has any idea about what goes on the South likes it's a foreign country. As if we've never seen other shows set in the South-like, I dunno, Southern Charm or RHOA or that we live in the same country.  That whole fight/dinner thing was so producer driven and makes me think they must have known ratings were going to be low? Def. not organic.

[sasha206]

The preview in which the guy who lies all the time (can't even be bothered to remember his name) says "Aw hell damn no."  I want to fucking slug him!

Edited June 3, 2017 by sasha206

[ProudMary]

9 hours ago, Atlanta said:

Ew on swimming in a swamp. If you want to swim, go to Tybee Island.

Well, a marsh.  Slightly better.  Still not something I'd want to do though!

7 hours ago, psychoticstate said:

I'm totally Team Ashley on this one - - and I didn't even like her at the beginning of this dull show.  Who cares where she's working?  She has a legit job and as she says, at least she's not living off Daddy.  CATHERINE.  

Catherine is certainly not one to talk.  And never mind the potential cheating.  She's what?  30?  Just over 30?  And she has no job or jobs.  She's still trying to figure it out?  Girl, please.  You don't want to work.  You want to sit around and drink and let Daddy pay the bills. So you certainly shouldn't say shit to anyone.  Your boyfriend, or whatever he is, is a pompous douchebag who will end up with a drinking problem, a mistress and some scandal if you two ever get married. 

I just realized that about 70% of what you've said here could also apply to Landon from the original Southern Charm!  

[NoJustNo]

9 hours ago, Atlanta said:

This ^^^^ so much. I obviously live in Atlanta (hence my screen name--LOL) and no way on earth the posh women in Atlanta wear fur. I've been to charity galas and nary a fur is to be seen. The only person you may see wear one are the little old ladies, but even that is pushing it. Savannah is a beautiful city (been there several times), but a stylist would do better in Atlanta. There's plenty of old money, new money, professional athlete money, etc. There's also a HUGE movie industry here. 

Ew on swimming in a swamp. If you want to swim, go to Tybee Island.

I'm pretty sure part time airline employees don't get to fly for free.

You're so right re: no one but little old ladies wear fur here. It's so weird to me because, to me at least, they're not really old money or new money. Other than Happy. Maybe money two generations ago. Does anyone know how many people actually live in in Savannah full time other than those who work in the hospitality industry?

When Ashley stripped down and swam and what seemed to be, to me at least, a swamp? I think Ashley wanted Savannah to seem more paradise than it is.  

[smores]

Nelson and Catherine's parent's house are both on the islands, which are marsh islands.  I guess people could swim in the marsh, but, it's not generally something you see.  Tybee Island is the one that has beaches and is actually open to the ocean for lack of a better phrase.

Savannah does have other industries besides hospitality, there's a large Gulfstream plant there, as well as other manufacturing.  A lot of movies are shot there too.  

[JenE4]

I guess I'm the only one who got a bit excited that they sort of ripped off the T-Rav's Life Lessons about Bevarage-Cart Girls in Glass Menageries fancy dinner party?! I mean, obviously it was no where as good as the original, but everyone took notes and came at the ready for the Airing of Grievances and judgments/accusations on life choices. I live for Bravo petty fighting at dinner parties! The more ridiculous the perceived slights or shortcomings, the better! Ooh, how many times can one possibly say "5 hours, two days a week at Delta"? Why not just say 10 hours a week? One of life's unanswerable mysteries!

Guys, I can now tell Happy and Hannah apart! "Happy" is the biggest misnomer since a hooker named Chastity. That is the most miserable person for apparently no reason whatsoever. I mean, I get why she sulked with mom, but all she did at that dinner party was chime in that dinner party like Debbie Downer. I think she was sad that no one cared enough to even try to dig up any dirt on her.

And Hannah, lord, now that her beau is the "big-time" sock designer, she's ready to start her own label with those "sketches"?!? I had Fashion Plates growing up, so I know your fashion designs need to have a bit more "style" involved. I mean, I sketch better clothes on stick figures: boxed shirt or pants, triangle skirt. I loved how she thought she could walk into that seamstress and have her bring "her designs" to life! The seamstress waving her out of her shop with the magic wand was almost as good as the eye roll the girl at the fabric shop gave when Hannah said she's there for fabrics for her label. 

[scenicbyway]

On 5/31/2017 at 10:38 AM, sasha206 said:

I feel like this show should be called, "Southern Charm:  Trailer Park in the Outskirts of Savannah."  Ugly people who are not even remotely interesting.

I feel like that's an insult to people who live in a trailer park.  There are some nice ones in the south.

I just can't figure out why Ashley would hang out with these people.  Clearly they are a bunch of snobs who are stuck in high school.  She's actually lived some life, why is she trying to be friends with people who don't like her?

[JenE4]

7 hours ago, scenicbyway said:

 

I just can't figure out why Ashley would hang out with these people.  Clearly they are a bunch of snobs who are stuck in high school.  She's actually lived some life, why is she trying to be friends with people who don't like her?

To be on television.

[VedaPierce]

I know that these people are supposed to be from wealth... But they all just seem so low rent. Their clothes, their haircuts/ hairstyles, makeup, home interiors...I think in the first episode, in Nelson's kitchen, there was this dated grapes border along the ceiling. Catherine's 80s decor little apartment with her cheesy mirror is supposed to look modern or contemporary, but sadly, looks like the Bed Bath and Beyond modern collection.

Hoppy always 'getting offended', Ashely 'feeling ostracized', "I feel! I feel!" aaaaagh, STFU YOU LOSERS! All of them are so stupid!! And OMG, there are so many more reasons to dislike Ashley than the Delta nonsense. They are all so full of self-important bullshit. These people are tacky, tacky, tacky.

as far as shows go, shep is right, Savannah is certainly the ugly step child of Charleston. Sure Charleston is filled with its' own unsavory characters, but they just seem 'glossier'. This crew seems so pedestrian and cheap and yes, I'm gonna say, common. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but does common belong on tv? 

They seem very young and stupid. And not at all fabulous. 

[VedaPierce]

On May 30, 2017 at 0:35 AM, KBrownie said:

I don't like any of these people, but I'm totally on Team Ashley just due to the fact that the others are all so, so awful.  As has already been mentioned, who cares if Ashley works at Delta?!  They claim that they aren't judging for it, but then why care so much that she didn't tell you?  Maybe she was afraid, that you know, you might judge her for it.  They judge her for everything else.  I admit, I've come into this late and have only seen the past three episodes, counting the latest one, but does Ashley really deserve the gang up?

And Hannah and the other brunette were just the picture of catty mean girls with their comment while at the beach about Ashley liking to take off her clothes in front of their boyfriends.  Like, how dare she, take off her cover-up to go swimming.  In the ocean.  STFU.  And her swimsuit was fairly modest I thought.  What was she supposed to do that would have been appropriate for them?  Swim in a bodysuit?  Not show any skin at all?  They were ridiculous.  Nothing Ashley does can or will ever be good enough for them.  They all are just looking for a reason to bash her.  Ashley isn't my cup of tea at all, but I'm not seeing any justification for how they act towards her.

They were totally out for blood with Nelson too for some reason.  Although it seems like he's told some real whoppers in his time.  But why not address it one on one?  Why wait for the pile on?  It makes ALL of them look just so mean, nasty, and hateful.  I feel like Daniel tries to play peacemaker and above it all, but he's just as shitty as the rest.  

Yeah, they are all pretty shitty, I agree. There was nothing wrong with Ashley taking her clothes off at the beach... However... We are at the 5th episode and she has taken her clothes off in 3 of them so far. The first episode was such a thirsty grab at camera time, the second time at the golf course was a total bitch move. If you respect your friend, you do not suggest strip anything while you are alone with your friends' man and another guy. Then get all huffy and defensive when called on it by your friend. Not a good friend thing to do. Ashley stripped down to very revealing lingerie in front of those two guys so that she could incite lust in them. And get camera time. She is hitting on any guy that will give her attention, whether they are in a relationship or not. She sucks. Not a 'girls' girl. -TM luanne. In fact, I bet she doesn't have any girl friends. 

And Ashley, no one cares that you get Botox. No one. It's not a huge reveal now, we're all now living in the world of Botox Parties. 

Edited June 4, 2017 by VedaPierce

[VedaPierce]

Also, was Hannah serious about those sketches? Really? Why in the world does she think she can start an actual business making and selling dresses??? She's like the poor misguided fools on American Idle that can't sing, but think they can, that everyone then laugh at. Dumbass.

[VedaPierce]

On May 30, 2017 at 11:23 AM, Giselle said:

Ashley is a mess and her house physically shows it. SHIT IS PILED EVERYEHERE! She is just this side of being a hoarder, does she ever throw anything out?  There is crap piled on crap, piled on crap on every surface. Crap piled on the floor, barely any space on the kitchen counters, crap hanging off the cabinets and closet doorss, not and empty space on the walls, crap hanging from the ceiling, stinky old shoes lined up the staircase on each step and also piled in a basket on the entryway. Not a clear space anywhere. Don't get me started on the damn goldfish bowl.

 It's not eclectic it's filthy. You can't have that much crap strewn about and keep it all clean. I would bet she had someone come in and clean it before the cameras rolled, or she took time off to clean and now it has gone back to it's normal dust covered cobwebbed existence. How do you let cameras in your house when it looks like that?

As far as her working two jobs or at Delta I don't care. I think she's doing it to pay the bills and the freebies if any are few and far between. She can fly around the world for free now for 10 hours of working for Delta? Please. I find it interesting that there is a  distance between her and most everyone around her including her family and so called friends.

Just don't like her....nor the rest of the cast. They aren't attractive inside nor on the outside.

Can they just shut up so we can look at the houses.

When the previews showed Shep saying "Savannah the ugly stepchild of Charleston." he wasn't lying if he was talking about their respective shows. If they don't have a reunion I won't feel a loss.

Train wreck TV at it's worst.

She's the kind of stylist that piles crap upon crap on the models too, I bet...tons of bracelets over finger-less gloves, knee-high socks, then anklets then granny boots over magenta tights, long floral dresses with crochet duster shawls, chunky plastic turquoise necklaces and a long string of pearls, all topped with a giant slouchy, black velvet hat. With a sunflower. Look at any Mademoiselle issue, circa 1994.  Ugh. Hate that.  

Said same thing about Shep's quote but u said it first. Great minds...etc.

Edited June 4, 2017 by VedaPierce

[VedaPierce]

And they all drink a LOT and are STILL BORING! How can that be?? They're not even good at THAT. Stupid Catherine can't do a confessional without slurring. She also still thinks acting dumb makes her look cute and funny and fun. It's doesn't.

Edited June 4, 2017 by VedaPierce

[LilRedHerring]

In defense of Cat for a second, if I had to be engaged to Lyle in order to look like an adult, I'd be an alcoholic as well. And I do not imbibe.

[Guest]

Happy is a hateful little thing.

Bless her heart.

Edited June 5, 2017 by Swim mom

[Guest]

The girls all look like they bought their clothes from a cheap teen store in a strip mall.

[GoGamecox]

Hannah seems the most reasonable of all of them.  I appreciate that she did try to talk to Ashley about why she would prefer that Ashley not strip down to sheer lingerie in front of her man. Seems pretty reasonable to me. 

Ashley would be super cool if she didn't seem so thirsty for attention. But she does make for good TV. Otherwise, without her, there would be no interest to the show at all. She's reality TV gold. 

Why is Catherine so mumbly? In her interviews, she's always looking at the ground, and when Lyle talks to her she looks at anything other than him most of the time. 

I wonder if part of the reason Southern Charm Charleston works better than Southern Charm Savannah is the age of the cast. The Charleston cast just seems to have more "life experience." 

[biakbiak]

Nelson is revolting. and I hate everyone on this show, except Daniel and Azam, though he is marrying Happy so he might be problematic, and much like the love of Katheryn I will never get the Ashley love. It's boring and these people are disgusting.