Looking - General Discussion

[John M]

Frank and Agustin's relationship was somewhat open but it wasn't that somewhat openness that ultimately did them in either. 

 

Actually that is an issue that has thrown me a bit with this series, it just seems a bit naive about gay relationships. Maybe I just hang out with a lot of sluts but my experience has always been that there are very, very few strictly monogamous gay relationships as like a formal policy. Like maybe 99% monogamous but from what I have seen there is always an understanding that in the right circumstances sleeping with someone else wasn't completely off the table like it is in most heterosexual relationships.

 

When I think of "open" in gay relationships I think like actively seeking out sexual partners but at least in my experience in gay relationships tend to default to the possibility of sleeping with someone else given the right circumstances instead of the heterosexual default to, never, ever, won't even entertain the idea.

[MizStaken]

Did Dom ask Patrick about the time he sucked the condom off someone with his ass cuz if he did, well then I am just confused because I thought he told Richie he hadn't done that before. I'm just going to have to rewatch season 1( got my DVD today) and figure this all out.

Other than that I loved it and the scenes with Kevin and Patrick made me smile. I really like those two together a lot. But Kevin is having his cake and eating it too and that can't bode well for Pat. Ahhhh Russell's ass, been admiring it for a long time now(2009 to be exact),

Can Auggie just go away, why the other two put up with him I'll never know.

[sinkwriter]

 

Did Dom ask Patrick about the time he sucked the condom off someone with his ass cuz if he did, well then I am just confused because I thought he told Richie he hadn't done that before. I'm just going to have to rewatch season 1( got my DVD today) and figure this all out.

 

I can't say for sure, but I thought that Patrick had said he'd tried it maybe once and either was so uptight about it he couldn't enjoy it so he'd never done it again, or he'd not liked it and was afraid of it or embarrassed by it (to which Richie declared that Patrick had 'bottom shame'). But I don't think he'd said he'd never ever done it before, just that he didn't know if he could do it (or he didn't know if he wanted to)? That's my vague recollection. I haven't watched the first season since it first aired.

Edited January 19, 2015 by sinkwriter

[Morbs]

I think that is pretty much what he has said about bottoming.  Remember when he talked about coming out to his parents, he hated the idea of them immediately picturing him getting butt fucked.  I think he may have even says he thinks it hurts.

[Irlandesa]

Actually that is an issue that has thrown me a bit with this series, it just seems a bit naive about gay relationships.

How is it naive about gay relationships?  I think Patrick is a bit naive about gay relationships but I don't think the series is.  I think the series acknowledge the fact that a lot of gay relationships had an element of openness to them when Patrick questioned Agustin & Frank's threesome.  Some relationships are more open about it.  Others know that they'd survive a brief infidelity.  But heck, even a lot of straight relationships weather occasional infidelity.  We don't even know enough about Kevin and John's relationship to know whether or not they intend to be monogamous.  For all we know, they have an open relationship but with rules Kevin is breaking. 

 

I can't say for sure, but I thought that Patrick had said he'd tried it maybe once and either was so uptight about it he couldn't enjoy it so he'd never done it again, or he'd not liked it and was afraid of it or embarrassed by it (to which Richie declared that Patrick had 'bottom shame'). But I don't think he'd said he'd never ever done it before, just that he didn't know if he could do it (or he didn't know if he wanted to)? That's my vague recollection. I haven't watched the first season since it first aired.

Good memory. At first that line stood out for me as well but you're right, he has tried it before.  I think what he told Richie in the planetarium was that he could get it in but then he'd tense up and want it out.

[sinkwriter]

 

Good memory. At first that line stood out for me as well but you're right, he has tried it before.  I think what he told Richie in the planetarium was that he could get it in but then he'd tense up and want it out.

 

Yep, you're right! I just rewatched the date episode (1x05?) and this was part of their exchange about it:

 

RICHIE: [Rachel's] kind of like the boss, which is kind of like the top...

PATRICK: Okay, then I wanna be her.

RICHIE: That's what I thought. Because you wouldn't let me fuck you.

PATRICK: Yeah, well...

RICHIE: That was kind of a surprise, to be honest.

PATRICK: Oh my god... why does everybody think that? What is it about my ass that screams out 'I wanna be fucked'?

RICHIE: You don't need to be ashamed.

PATRICK: I'm not ashamed.

RICHIE: Whatever. It's totally fine if you're not into it.

PATRICK: No, it's not that I'm not into it. I just... I'm not sure I like it very much. I mean, it feels kind of weird.

RICHIE: Weird how?

PATRICK: Well, I can get it in, but pretty much as soon as it's in, I'm like, 'Take it out, take it out, take it out, take it out, take it out."

RICHIE: You think you'd be embarrassed if your parents thought you were a bottom?

PATRICK: No. (thinks about it some more) Mmm... no.

RICHIE: Okay.

PATRICK: Okay, maybe a little bit.

RICHIE: I thought so. (chuckles) You have bottom shame.

PATRICK: Oh my god, I think you're right.

RICHIE: I think so.

PATRICK: Why? What are you?

RICHIE: Those terms are for people on websites. How do you know what you're into with a guy sexually until you're with them? 

PATRICK: Really?

RICHIE: Yeah. You gotta be adaptable, otherwise you're gonna miss out.

PATRICK: I do hate to miss out.

RICHIE: That being said... I probably usually am Rachel.

PATRICK: Oh, I knew it. You Rachel. Wait - which one is that again? Oh right, she's the boss, she's the top, she's the top. Right. (pauses, looking at Richie thoughtfully) Good to know. 

 

I haven't seen this episode since it first aired. I forgot how much I enjoyed it. There was just such a lovely dynamic between Richie and Patrick during this whole episode, the way they joked with one another and got to know one another and shared things and just had this day-long beautiful date. And Richie wasn't judgmental about Patrick's fears and bottom shame, he just talked about it with Patrick and said things that seemed to put Patrick at ease. It was really a terrific episode, and they were so great together in it. Which makes me all the sadder that he said he wasn't ready yet, only to bottom for his boss, who seems to care about Patrick but hasn't ended things with his actual boyfriend and wants to hide what he has with Patrick. So I don't know... it just seems like giving something to Kevin that wasn't earned. It seemed like a really big deal to Patrick, and then... it wasn't. And that made me sad for him (and for Richie, who I think would have treated Patrick much better than Kevin did or has).

[shrewd.buddha]

Patrick is annoying with his denial about the state of his affair and his different versions when he is talking to either his friends or Richie. But it is entertaining, so it must remind me of things that actually do happen.

 

When Richie and Patrick put Augustine to bed, Augustine said some things to Richie in Spanish. Does anyone know if it was about Patrick or his affair with his boss? It seemed as if one of the stories of the episode was how their secret affair was slowly but surely making itself more exposed. 

 

I guess Augustine is gong down the road to drug problems. I just hope they manage to avoid most of the cliches -- and I especially hope they don't try to resolve it in one very special episode where Augustine goes too far, immediately snaps to, then is mostly back to normal the next episode. Maybe that's the most egregious cliche of drug problems on tv shows.

 

As to whether the writers are naive or knowledgeable about relationships : if they were truly experts, they should be writing best selling how-to books since no one has  managed to figure how these things work. It's probably a combination of what they have observed and whatever issues they have dealt with in the past  (or present?).  

I would also like Frank to make a reappearance. There usually seems to be few rounds of "did we give up too soon?" before a long term couple calls it quits for good. 

 

And how about a bit of levity and the possibility of a happier tomorrow? It seems as if the show has a gray cloud over everyone's head with the impending atmosphere of "..and then everything will turn to shit..". 

Edited January 20, 2015 by shrewd.buddha

[sugarbaker design]

There usually seems to be few rounds of "did we give up too soon?" before a long term couple calls it quits for good.

 

 

That's on The L Word, not Looking, especially not for Frankie and Augustin.

 

Does anyone know if it was about Patrick or his affair with his boss?

 

 

I don't know much Spanish, but I do know Augustin and I could easily picture him telling Richie 'since you left Paddy's been doing bad, he's banging his boss'.

 

I would also like Frank to make a reappearance.

 

 

I would too, I love the actor and the character, I would love Frankie to show up with a guy that really appreciates and loves him.

Edited January 20, 2015 by sugarbaker design

[Kat From Jersey]

Fuck. I like Kevin. FUUCK!

I forgot how fucking likable Russell Tovey is, damn him.

Me too, dammit!  I didn't want to like him, and up till now he's just been kind of arrogant and unreadable.  But he and Patrick were friggin adorable together.  It helps that Patrick is such an adorable goofball, and Jon Groff is so charming.

 

eta, ooh, Tanner Cohen/Scotty made a reappearance.  He looks really, really good with that scruff!

Edited January 20, 2015 by Kat From Jersey

[fastiller]

Everything Everyone Did Wrong on Last Night's Looking.

[DollEyes]

  Loved this episode, but not everybody in it. First, Patrick, who's not only still sleeping with Kevin, he's rationalizing it and expects-no, demands-that Dom & Agustin be supportive and expects them to be discreet.  However, since Dom has told Doris and Lynn about it, the latter ship has sailed. In situations like this, I believe that real friends should judge. Real friends would tell you what you need to hear, not what you think you want to hear. If one of my friends was about to leap off the edge of a cliff without a parachute, I'm not just going to stand there and wave bye-bye-I'd at least try to stop them.  Patrick's excuses for still hooking up with Kevin are about as lame as his lie to Owen about going to a Showgirls revival, hence his returning to work late. Patrick's claims that he doesn't care about Kevin & John's problems and that he's not having the affair were equally insulting. Contrary to Patrick's opinion, he's not an innocent bystander by a long shot. News flash, Patrick: you are not only one of Kevin and John's biggest problems, if not the biggest, John probably doesn't even know it. BTW, Patty, just because you're not in a serious relationship, that doesn't give you the right to trash someone else's. Then again, that's to be expected from a guy who's so desperate that he turned to Agustin-another trainwreck-for help. 

 

Patrick was right to get tested, but that rash probably came from one of the millions of bedbugs infesting the mattresses at the no-tell motel where he and Kevin have been fucking.  Since Kevin's a billionaire, one would think that he would spring for a five-star hotel, but he probably doesn't want to risk getting caught, or at least seen, by somebody that he-or John-knows.  About Kevin's migraines, it serves him right. Kevin's still a liar, a cheat and a shitty boyfriend and I still hate him, no matter how cute he or his ass are. 

 

  Dom and Lynn are still cute together. Despite the open relationship, I think that Dom seems like he wants to settle down, or is at least thinking about it. Doris' new friend is a cutie and they have nice chemistry. Agustin just keeps getting worse. His life is even more fucked-up than Patrick's. If Agustin's still doing drugs to the point of passing out on the sidewalk, then he needs serious help. Thank Heaven for Richie. When it comes to compassion, Richie went above and beyond. He not only came to Agustin's rescue when he didn't have to, he's still as hot as ever and Patrick's still hot for him. Patrick may like Kevin, but he loves Richie and is clearly not over him nor does he deserve him, for that matter. Richie deserves a grown-up and Patrick's not even close, whether he's with Kevin or not.

Edited January 21, 2015 by DollEyes

[resonance]

Ratings are way down for season premiere. Looking for cancellation.

 

This show was fortunate to have a second season. Everything that is wrong with this series can be pretty much be summed by comparing it to Please Like Me.

Edited January 20, 2015 by resonance

[bunnywithanaxe]

Me too, dammit!  I didn't want to like him, and up till now he's just been kind of arrogant and unreadable

Yes! Exactly! 

[Garnett7]

ITA with those who don't find Patrick the most likable character. I don't hate him, but I can't seem to like him either. Way too neurotic for my tastes. I admit to being a bit baffled at the TeamKevin vs TeamRichie debates because all I can think is "Why would you want either of them to be stuck with him?".

 

I love Russell Tovey but the jury is out on Kevin. I'm not a big fan of lying cheaters so . . .

 

Richie is made of win. I adore him. A truly decent guy there. I'd much rather the show be about him and Dom and Lynn, maybe toss in Kevin if he gets his act together, than Patrick and Augustin and "Who will Patrick date".

 

Dom and Lynn are my absolute favorite couple. I want more of them and more coupley moments with them. If I have to sit through the blinding whiteness of Kevin/Patrick's asses each week, can't I at least get one kiss between the couple I actually like?

 

For those who wondered what Augustin said to Richie in the bedroom. It was along the lines of:

 

A -- Dear Richie, how do you do it?

R -- How do I do what?

A -- (Looking at Patrick) Our favorite little angel. (To Richie) Do you miss your little angel?

R -- Shut up.

[txhorns79]

ITA with those who don't find Patrick the most likable character. I don't hate him, but I can't seem to like him either. Way too neurotic for my tastes. I admit to being a bit baffled at the TeamKevin vs TeamRichie debates because all I can think is "Why would you want either of them to be stuck with him?".

 

I agree.  To me, Patrick is just kind of meh.  I don't find his storyline all that interesting, but maybe it's because Patrick isn't all that interesting. 

[DollEyes]

  Translation of Agustin & Richie's conversation after Richie brings Agustin to Patrick's place:

 

 Agustin to Richie: "How do you do it?"

Richie: "How do I do what?"

Agustin (looking at Patrick): "Our favorite little angel. Do you miss your little angel?"

Richie: "Shut up, dude."

[DollEyes]

  Here's the thread to discuss the Looking cast (lead, supporting or guest stars) in other acting roles, such as Jonathan Groff in American Sniper, which is currently the Number One movie in the country and has gotten several Oscar nominations, including Best Picture.

 

  Then there's Murray Bartlett, who used to be on Guiding Light and also did a guest spot in an episode of Sex & the City, in which he both played a gay and used his own Australian accent.

 

And of course, there's Scott Bakula, who not only starred in Quantum Leap and stars in NCIS: New Orleans,  he's done tons of theater  (dramatic and musical) and was in American Beauty, among numerous other things and looking great in all of them.

[romantic idiot]

I haven't seen this episode since it first aired. I forgot how much I enjoyed it. There was just such a lovely dynamic between Richie and Patrick during this whole episode, the way they joked with one another and got to know one another and shared things and just had this day-long beautiful date. And Richie wasn't judgmental about Patrick's fears and bottom shame, he just talked about it with Patrick and said things that seemed to put Patrick at ease. It was really a terrific episode, and they were so great together in it. 

 

I'm not really sure about this. I loved the episode when it aired and do think it deserves all the kudos it gets. But watching it in the context of the whole season, I do see glimpses of Richie being a little defensive and quick to judge. Patrick seemed to open up to Richie, talking about his insecurities and his feelings. Richie on the other hand was quick to diagnose bottom shame and there was another bit where he snapped at Paddy - when they went to that palmist? witchy? female. Anyway, things that seemed okay to me during the episode didn't seem that way once I watched the rest of the season. 

 

And Patrick being so quick to bottom for Kevin does make me think that Richie was not entirely correct in diagnosing Patrick's bottom shame.

 

ETA: I also forgot the line about Kevin's foreskin. It's interesting that Paddy didn't think about it in Richie's case, he got all excited about it and then it was a bone of contention, well okay, a weird making moment when Richie turned out to be circumcised after all. Yet, Kevin's the one to bring Paddy that experience. I wonder if it was deliberate on the part of the writers (and if so, what that means), or if they just went for an easy line. 

Edited January 22, 2015 by romantic idiot

[romantic idiot]

One of the reasons I was sad Boss was cancelled because I felt they had a lot of story left to tell with Jon and Grammar's characters. I got into the show because I heard Jon was going to be in it, and I love the show. 

 

Apart from Glee & Frozen, I also loved Jon in his episode of The Good Wife (3.15). That's another show I finally bit the bullet on because he was going to be on it. 

 

I also adored Tovey on Doctor Who and Being Human. 

 

I guess that does it for the usual suspects?

[DollEyes]

   Two guest stars who've played gay before were Daniel Franzese, aka "Eddie" in Mean Girls and Tanner Cohen, aka "Scotty," the guy whom Agustin met at the club in last week's episode, in Were the World Mine.

[Primetimer]

Dom's hot shower gets hit with cold water.

Read the story

[vixenbynight]

Being reminded that he's a side piece obviously complicates Patrick's plan to dreamily replay every detail of this perfect night over and over in his head.

Kevin will never willingly leave Jon.

He told Patrick that his Visa is up in two years time.

Notice how quick Patrick's eyes opened, once Kevin snuck out from his bed (to call his current boyfriend back)? He probably didn't even get 30 minutes of sleep after having sex with Kevin, due to his mind going over what he had said to his friends, denying that there was anything more between them.

I wonder if the folks, who insisted that Looking, was the gay version of Girls, have noticed the similarities between Marnie and Patrick's stories, in the last two episodes?

I cannot believe, how relatively sane and not self destructive Agustin was in this episode.

He also really hates Kevin...I love it.

Edited January 26, 2015 by vixenbynight

[HunterHunted]

I thought this episode did a fantastic job of showing that Kevin sucks. In his conversations with Patrick, Kevin is telling Patrick the sorts of details that Patrick should have learned way earlier in the "relationship." I think Kevin bottomed only because he got the call from John and realized that he's messing up his real relationship and status in this country for a dude he won't even let top him. I think this was where we saw Kevin delusionally try to make this more than what it is because he's put so much in jeopardy.

I love Lynn so much, but he was so wrong. Dom is growing up (slowly), but to suggest that Dom work as a manager without first discussing it with Dom feels like Lynn doesn't trust Dom to be a grow up and to think about things in an adult way. That hit Dom took was killer.

I love how giddy Doris is about her guy. It's so clear that she's trying to play cool, but that she's really into him.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Inside the episode:

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On an excursion to San Leandro, Patrick gets to see where Richie grew up, and finally has a chance to apologize for the way things ended. Agustín decides to pay a visit to Eddie after hearing he’s sick at home. Meanwhile, wrought over the situation with Patrick, Kevin considers what to do next.

Promo:

[Irlandesa]

Kevin will never willingly leave Jon.

He told Patrick that his Visa is up in two years time.

That Visa thing just seemed weird.  I'm assuming he got his initial Visa for work related purposes.  If he's working, then his current employer is likely sponsoring his work Visa.  One would assume if they managed to get it once for him, they could get it renewed for him.  And a marriage Visa/green card is different than a work Visa. 

 

I'm trying to figure out if this is Looking going down some path they know nothing about or if it's Kevin's way of convincing Patrick this is why he must remain with Jon.

 

I love Lynn so much, but he was so wrong. Dom is growing up (slowly), but to suggest that Dom work as a manager without first discussing it with Dom feels like Lynn doesn't trust Dom to be a grow up and to think about things in an adult way.

Lynn was wrong but he was simultaneously very right.  He should have been honest with Dom about what Jack was after. But Lynn was also right in thinking that managing one of Jack's restaurants would be a good next step for Dom.  Dom thinks he's managing his expectations by coming down from a restaurant idea to a window idea but he has no way of getting the money for even that. It's still somewhat of a far fetched dream. What Lynn was slyly trying to tell him without outright lecturing him is that Jack has a lot of money.  If the moneyman sees you do well as a manager, he may be willing to invest in your dream a few years later.

 

I only hope that Dom standing up for himself will be good in the long run for their relationship instead of destroying it. 

 

I surprise myself but I think Agustin was the MVP in this episode.  I loved how he told Eddie about Patrick and his boss's upcoming "fuckfest."  It's probably poor manners to share that "secret" but since Patrick and Kevin left holding hands, they're not doing a great job of hiding it themselves. 

 

There was too little Richie. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

While I agree that Agustin shouldn't have told Eddie (because it's not Agustin's secret to share and Patrick specifically asked his friends not to tell anyone), I agree that Patrick and Kevin weren't exactly being stealthy at the rugby game. They made out in public where anyone could have seen them so that doesn't exactly scream "trying to keep this relationship a big secret."

 

So far I really like the addition of Eddie and Malik to the group. They are funny and friendly so they can stay for now. And even more surprising is that Agustin wasn't a jerk at all this entire episode. I couldn't believe that by the end of the episode, I hadn't been annoyed with him once this week. Well, one demerit for telling Eddie about Kevin and Patrick but considering that Eddie assumed Kevin and Patrick were a couple as soon as he saw them together, it wasn't a huge leap for Agustin to admit it to him.

 

I love that Lynn is totally fine with Doris wandering into Dom's room wrapped in a sheet and then getting into bed with them to talk about her new man. It's like Meredith/Cristina/Derek in bed together on Grey's Anatomy but way less dysfunctional and without Derek's eye rolling or complaints.

[Corgi-ears]

Oh my god, Agustin and Richie are totally going to Do Sex, aren't they?

[Irlandesa]

No.  I really don't think so.  Not this season, anyway.  I think Agustin has done an about face from last season.  Last season he was undermining Patrick's relationship with Richie and almost encouraging Patrick to go for it with his taken boss.  This season he realizes that an affair with his boss isn't the best thing for Patrick and Richie was probably good for him.

 

His apologizing to Richie for doing damage to his relationship with Patrick, even if he wasn't ultimately responsible for its end, and encouraging Patrick to get in touch with Richie makes me pretty sure he's trying to push them back together. Nowhere do I get the sense that he wants to sleep with Richie himself.  I definitely don't see Richie falling in the lust with Agustin either.  For no other reason than he has another type.

 

But this discussion reminds me of another moment that made me think Agustin was the MVP of the ep.  I absolutely loved his reaction when Richie asked him if he was in love with Patrick.  "What? No.  Eww.....No offense."

Edited January 26, 2015 by Irlandesa

[shrewd.buddha]

I was somewhat disappointed that Eddie turned out to be stereotypical in several gay ways. Suddenly he became Cam from Modern Family, with the dishy zingers and whatnot. It was okay, but I wouldn't mind if they turned down his volume a bit. 

 

I appreciated the nudity and stuff - thanks HBO - it's part of the appeal (a la Girls) . But I did find myself wondering if scenes like the one with Patrick and the enema bottle can make for casting hurdles for the actor. I actually do appreciate that they 'go there' when it comes to revealing the unsexy aspects of sex.

 

I'm not sure which part of Patrick and Kevin's lying is worse : their work lie or their lie in relation to Kevin's boyfriend. Having an affair with your boss would cause all types of work problems, almost creating a hostile work environment. Patrick is immature, but hopefully he will learn to avoid situations that involve so much lying in the future. ...or how exhausting such situations are. 

 

Lynn seems to realize Dom has a lot of growing up to do : dating-wise, career-wise and lifestyle-wise. But it would probably have worked better if he had just been honest with him instead of the manipulation. But they both decided to mix work and a relationship, so ...

 

After this episode, we talked about how watching these characters make obviously bad decisions is frustrating to watch. But we also agreed that there is not much market for shows about well adjusted gay men who work steady jobs and come home to  fulfilling, peaceful families. And since the show is call Looking, I'm guessing we are going to be dealing with the messy dating period of life. 

Edited January 26, 2015 by shrewd.buddha

[DollEyes]

 Good episode. I would consider Patrick's overnighter with Kevin sweet, if it wasn't for Kevin's having a boyfriend and Kevin being Patrick's boss, that is. Those elephants will always be in the room where their affair is concerned and the harder they try to run from them, the closer they get, in one way or another. When it comes to Kevin, Patrick's little head does most, if not all, the thinking. Their indiscretion's not helping either, especially at Dom's rugby game, whether it was Patrick's death glare at Eddie for flirting with Patrick, Patrick and Kevin leaving hand-in-hand or their make out session. John's calling Kevin at the end of his & Patrick's latest fuckfest was a much-needed reality check for Patrick, not that he'll pay attention for long.

 

  I can't believe I'm saying this, but kudos to the new, improved Agustin. He actually looked, sounded and acted like an adult in this episode. Hopefully, this Agustin will stay. His apology to Richie was long overdue.  I don't think that Agustin and Richie would even think of hooking up, much less do it. Agustin's telling Eddie about Kevin and Patrick was a big mistake. Reminds me of the old shampoo commercial, "You'll tell two friends about it, and they'll tell two friends, and so on, and so on, and so on...."

 

 Re Eddie and Malik, so far, so good. They're both adorable. They're smart, funny and cuddly-and in Malik's case, also well-hung (two words: "Scooby -Dong."). Malik seems to be good for Doris, who's as inappropriate as ever, as proven by her barging into Dom's room while he and Lynn were in bed. Eddie is just as amazing, from his love for Romy & Michelle's High School Reunion to his doing the Tootsie Roll.

 

  About Dom & Lynn, I see both sides. While Lynn was wrong to go behind Dom's back (no pun intended) re the restaurant job, he's right to want Dom to be practical and plan for his future. Starting a new restaurant in this economy, despite its improvement, without the proper contacts or experience is a pipe dream and Dom is going to need a back up plan. Lynn went about it in the wrong way, but at least his heart was in the right place.

[BooBear]

I appreciated the nudity and stuff - thanks HBO - it's part of the appeal (a la Girls) . But I did find myself wondering if scenes like the one with Patrick and the enema bottle can make for casting hurdles for the actor. I actually do appreciate that they 'go there' when it comes to revealing the unsexy aspects of sex.

This show makes me so glad I am not a gay man. And it sometimes depresses me with its frank depiction but I did appreciate them going there.  Coming soon, Disney's Christoff's enemas.

 

I

[MizStaken]

I hope that they give us some insight on Kevin's and John's relationship because he seems so into patrick that it makes no sense for him to continue to be in said relationship. I have to wonder what he's getting from Patrick and not at home.

I realize john is a doctor with a cool job but there has to be something else to keep them together. I must admit I do like the two of them together but know that basing a relationship on lies and cheating is never the way to go.

I thought it looked like Patrick was getting a bit teaey eyed there at the end. Would be tough to have this amazing sexual experience and then your partner gets up to talk to his boyfriend.

I think Dom is being a big too priggish about the job thing. Why not manage a nice resfaurant fora bit, make some more contacts and then give it a go?

I almost liked Augustine this week until he went and told eddie about pat and kev.

[Ffiferoo]

I think Dom is being a big too priggish about the job thing. Why not manage a nice resfaurant fora bit, make some more contacts and then give it a go?

 

Probably a little bit of it is him being stubborn, which is immature but also influenced by his age - he may feel like he's too old and has been in the industry too long to be a manager, or at least not want to admit that that's the logical next step for him rather than jumping straight to owner.

 

The real issue, though, is that Lynn wasn't honest with him and went over his head to try and convince him to take a management job, rather than talking with him about it as equals.  Lynn is already older and more successful than Dom, so it's already setting Dom up to compare himself and feel bad that he hasn't reached his goal, and then to have Lynn step in and try to manipulate the situation (however well-intentioned), put him very much on the defensive.  Unfortunately, even though it likely is the best option for him, now that this has happened, his pride is so hurt that it's doubtful that he'll even consider it.  Lynn should probably have known better.

[sinkwriter]

Oh, Patrick... he's not going to leave his boyfriend for you.

 

I feel like they showed some interesting sides to Kevin in this episode - the charming, funny boss/friend who knows about rugby (and rugby cheers, LOL), the emotionally-closed-off person who only hints at (before brushing off) the pain of his mom leaving when he was a kid, and the two-timing guy who seems wonderful with Patrick but turns around and gives that same love to his actual boyfriend. To hear him on the phone with his boyfriend was so sad to me because there was no difference in tone; he was completely lovey. It pretty much squashes the "we're not working/our relationship is in trouble" message he has given Patrick about his relationship with John. So I hope that Patrick takes that moment we saw and lets it sink in. I hope he realizes that this could end very badly and his assurances to his friends that "I won't get hurt, I'm fine" may not be able to withstand the hurt he'll feel when this affair combusts.

 

I'm conflicted. I enjoy seeing Kevin and Patrick together, they were really funny and charming (and I loved Patrick's admission that he took himself out on a boyfriend date; it's that kind of humor within him that makes me like him as a character). But I don't like what Kevin's doing, and -- regardless of how much he still needs to grow as a person and regardless of how he messed up his relationship with Richie -- I think Patrick deserves better.

[sinkwriter]

Parts that made me laugh a lot:

 

Patrick lying on the floor, ass in the air... *cringe* The maintenance we (whether male or female) have to undergo to be attractive and ready for sexytimes just boggles the mind. I think he and I both said at the exact same time, "Oh yeah, this is sexy." LOL.

 

In the moment after Kevin says it's Patrick's turn to top, Patrick says, "But I'm fresh as a mountain spring!" and Kevin was all confused: "What?" Heee.

 

Doris climbing in bed with Lynn and Dom, talking about being rimmed by her boyfriend and then declaring, "Let's talk more about this over breakfast!" Equal parts horrifying and hilarious, that's Doris. I really do love her dry humor.

[TV Glotzer]

This show has become so incredibly self-conscious.  And confuses vulgarity with brutal honesty. And yeah, my chick roommate is going to crawl into my bed between me and my boyfriend and tell me about her rim job from twenty minutes ago.  Nope.  Not. Gonna. Happen.  

Edited January 27, 2015 by TV Glotzer

[sinkwriter]

It's certainly open in a brutally honest sort of way, conversationally speaking, but sometimes that just shows a closeness and ability to talk about anything. My best friend tells me some pretty honest stuff I never expected he would share, and we've talked about things I never expected to ask about or share myself. I like that about Doris and Dom's relationship (and find it funny rather than vulgar).

 

It is pretty insane that she came in to talk when her boyfriend is still in the next room, though. I'd probably wait until he was gone home, before confiding in my friend about whatever awesomeness I wanted to share. LOL.

[Garnett7]

I'm truly, genuinely despising Kevin right now and not feeling generous towards Patrick either. I hope this little affair does blow up in their faces. Kevin is not leaving John. Despite his clear unhappiness, he's never gonna sack up and walk out. And if Patrick is willing to settle for that then he gets what he deserves. So Kevin can go cry me a river, build a bridge over it and let Patrick jump off it because I just don't care.

 

I don't buy the Visa thing. Kevin is a rich white man who is spending his money to open businesses in the U.S.  I don't see why there would be a problem for him getting his Visa extended.

 

Dom/Lynn are breaking my heart, though. I want them together.

 

Augustin -- Not nearly as irritating this season.

[Irlandesa]

I was somewhat disappointed that Eddie turned out to be stereotypical in several gay ways. Suddenly he became Cam from Modern Family, with the dishy zingers and whatnot. It was okay, but I wouldn't mind if they turned down his volume a bit.

 I didn't think his volume was too high.  Last season they got a lot of criticism over the fact that there were no effeminate gays.  (Along with no main POC...etc.)  I've known gay men exactly like Eddie.  In fact, I've worked with two of them.  One was more reserved at work but then would let it flow outside of work.  The other didn't care and would just be.  So these guys exist. Sassy one-liners (some more successful than others) and all.

Unfortunately, even though it likely is the best option for him, now that this has happened, his pride is so hurt that it's doubtful that he'll even consider it.  Lynn should probably have known better.

Lynn did know better.  Ironically, that's why he went behind Dom's back.  He knew if Dom knew the meeting was about managing a restaurant rather than investing in a restaurant, Dom never would have taken the meeting.  I guess he was hoping that Dom would realize, once he spoke to Jack, what a wonderful opportunity was being presented to him.  Lynn wanted to help but it was a no win situation for him since Dom is so focused on doing his own thing.

 

 Agustin's telling Eddie about Kevin and Patrick was a big mistake. Reminds me of the old shampoo commercial, "You'll tell two friends about it, and they'll tell two friends, and so on, and so on, and so on...."

At this point, I don't think it matters that Agustin told Eddie.  He needed a place to stay and Patrick/Kevin weren't being discreet at all.  In fact, I kind of like that about this affair.  I've known people in affairs who were so good at keeping it under wraps.  I've known others who were so-so.  People may have sort of suspected to the point of not being surprised when it was revealed but there was nothing super obvious about it.  Then there are far more that think they're being discreet yet everyone knows because they're terrible at hiding it.  Patrick/Kevin would be the latter.

[blaase]

Just got into this show, Can't get over how at certain angles Patrick looks exactly like Dennis from Always Sunny in Philadelphia.

[blaase]

I don't think Patrick deserves Richie. He was a jerk to him, then went ahead and cheated on him. 

[blaase]

Horrible episode, I liked season one, but this was both boring and dumb.

[blaase]

Patrick is  really unlikable and boring, and I think Richie and Kevin are both too good for him. and man  Jonathan Groff looks a lot older than 29 and looks even more like Dennis from Always Sunny this season.

Best part of the episode was seeing Kevin's cute butt again.

[romantic idiot]

I'm conflicted. I enjoy seeing Kevin and Patrick together, they were really funny and charming (and I loved Patrick's admission that he took himself out on a boyfriend date; it's that kind of humor within him that makes me like him as a character). But I don't like what Kevin's doing, and -- regardless of how much he still needs to grow as a person and regardless of how he messed up his relationship with Richie -- I think Patrick deserves better.

 

My problem is that so far they've been utterly predictable with this. So while i do still root for Kevin and Patrick, I'm beginning to be bored. And I'll be mad at the PTB for ever if they manage to make it so that Jon Groff and Russell Tovey bore me. I am not kidding. 

[txhorns79]

It is pretty insane that she came in to talk when her boyfriend is still in the next room, though. I'd probably wait until he was gone home, before confiding in my friend about whatever awesomeness I wanted to share. LOL.

 

I honestly think this, and Dom's getting upset over Lynn going behind his back, but also telling some hard truths (about Dom's likely needing more experience and contacts before opening a restaurant), show some real immaturity with both Dom and Doris. 

[DollEyes]

 

At this point, I don't think it matters that Agustin told Eddie. He needed a place to stay and Patrick/Kevin weren't being discreet at all. In fact, I kind of like that about this affair. I've known people in affairs who were so good at keeping it under wraps. I've known others who were so-so. People may have sort of suspected to the point of not being surprised when it was revealed but there was nothing super obvious about it. There are far more who think they're being discreet yet everyone knows because they're terrible at hiding it. Patrick/Kevin would be the latter.

 

  That's the problem, re the latter. Both Patrick and Kevin know that they need to be discreet but they're bad at it and are getting worse at work and otherwise, whether it was Patrick's lame lie to Owen in last week's episode about why he was late coming back to work, Patrick's grabbing Kevin's ass at the birthday party for one of the employees, Kevin and Patrick showing up together at Dom's rugby game or their leaving together holding hands. Dom's telling Lynn and Doris and Agustin's telling Eddie about Patrick & Kevin is dangerous enough, but what happens if one of them tells someone else, who, unbeknownst to them, knows John, tells him and all Hell breaks loose because of it? Even one person knowing about Patrick & Kevin is one too many, not that they seem to care.

Edited January 28, 2015 by DollEyes

[sugarbaker design]

When two people in an affair start to act so indiscreetly I always assume they both want to get caught.

[romantic idiot]

They are both so so pretty. 

[mandigirl]

I know it's wrong, but I just find Kevin so freaking adorable! I never saw Russell Tovey on anything before this, but he's a very charming actor. It also doesn't help that Kevin and Patrick have crazy chemistry. The show continues to portray the little moments of falling in love so well. When Patrick was smiling at Kevin at the rugby game, it was so full of genuine joy. It's little moments like that.

 

I'm extremely anti-cheating in real life, so I was stunned that for most of this episode, I was grinning like a fool in la-la land. Well-played show.

 

 

I hope that they give us some insight on Kevin's and John's relationship because he seems so into patrick that it makes no sense for him to continue to be in said relationship.

ITA. Kevin was in lust with Patrick last season, but it doesn't appear that way this season. I wish they would show more of Kevin and John's relationship. I assume we'll be seeing more of that next week.

 

 

When two people in an affair start to act so indiscreetly I always assume they both want to get caught.

Word. 

 

Richie proved again last episode why there can never be too much Richie in any episode. Richie is way too good for Patrick.