S04.E04: Oathkeeper

[sugarbaker design]

I would have no problem believing the Jaime of Season 1 capable of raping his sister, but the Jaime of Season 4 - who gave the sword and armor and squire to Brienne and who is trying to keep his oath to protect Sansa - not so much.

 

The Jamie of Season 1 and the Jamie of Season 4 are the same person.  He has never expressed any kind of remorse for pushing Bran out of the window or for killing his Lannister cousin.  He's a monster with good looks and a title who is capable of doing nice things for some people.

[TooMuchCoffee]

This episode really opened up some possibilities for more speculation.  I'll head there soon to stay on topic.

 

It's too bad Michelle MacLaren didn't direct last week's septsex.  I think we would have had more clarity.  I'm choosing to accept the director's stated intent and move on.  

 

The poisoning... the characters who play the game well are quite capable of long term planning and have the necessary patience to see it through.  Despite Cersei's wish to see Tyrion dead (she doesn't care if he's guilty or not - she hates him and wants someone to pay and she wants it now), I don't think anything will happen to Tyrion. I think his life will be spared either by the boat and necklace washing ashore or the vote will be to offer him a trip to the Wall or another banishment option.  

 

I love that the humans in King's Landing are all caught up in the Game while completely unaware/ignoring the supernatural threats.  The Starks might be scattered but Winter is still coming.

[scrb]

This show/book has too many moving parts.

 

As if there aren't enough threats from within Westeros, then Dani coming, then Wildlings, now some supernatural ice demons.

 

Martin must have been taking some crazy drugs in his day.

[TooMuchCoffee]

This show/book has too many moving parts.

 

As if there aren't enough threats from within Westeros, then Dani coming, then Wildlings, now some supernatural ice demons.

 

Martin must have been taking some crazy drugs in his day. 

 

Hehe.

GRRM and I are about the same age.  Spring chickens we aren't. The world during our formative years was quite different from the world today.  I wonder how much and in what ways that influenced his story telling. 

Edited April 28, 2014 by TooMuchCoffee

[Constantinople]

Uhm so Margaery just waltzed past Ser Boros on her way into the King's bedroom?

 

... So how are we supposed to guess she... negotiated... that passage?

Theon: How did you get past the guard?

Yara: Anything with a cock is easy to fool

[Subrookie]

Of all the activities that have gone on at Craster's Keep, I don't remember this hearing as much discussion about Craster, incest or that he gave his infant children to the white walkers as we do about 1 scene in last night's episode. I think it's safe to assume those women have had a hard life.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Subrookie

[atomationage]

 

I understand about 75% of what is happening. And some of the scenes were filmed so dark I couldn't tell what was taking place. Great Jaime/Tyrion and Jaimie/Brienne scenes. Love Tommen.

I thought this episode was pretty confusing.  I'm going to have to watch again, because I thought Craster's Keep was the village where Gilly is at.  I liked the scene with Jon getting the Knights Watch to follow him, and all the scenes with Jamie in them.   The rest I didn't like very much.  Burn Gorman should have been cast as one of the living dead.

[Tryangle]

I thought this episode was pretty confusing.  I'm going to have to watch again, because I thought Craster's Keep was the village where Gilly is at.  I liked the scene with Jon getting the Knights Watch to follow him, and all the scenes with Jamie in them.   The rest I didn't like very much.  Burn Gorman should have been cast as one of the living dead.

Craster's is north of The Wall, Gilly was sent to Mole's Town south of the Wall. Indeed, there are a ton of place names mentioned in the show. It's probably at the point where the average viewer will want to get a Westeros atlas or something to keep track.

[terrymct]

So were those deserters basically feeding ghost baby parts? That guy was holdiing a leg when he was teasing Ghost.

 

 

It was a pig's foot/trotter.  Remember that Craster and his wives/daughters raised and ate pigs.

[dramachick]

Oh yeah. What is Burn Gorman's character name?  I'm adding him to my Death Wish List.  Drinking out of Commander Mormount's skull was awful!  I hope Ghost/Summer/Jon/Bran kills him first. 

[TooMuchCoffee]

I just love Burn Gorman and the way he chews the scenery.  He completely cracked me up in Pacific Rim.  

 

(So am I the only one that thought of Handles, the cyberman head, when Grey Worm picked up his helmet in the first scene?  I have no idea why that image popped into my head.)

 

 

[Lady S.]

My first thought was that the garden has ears.  Haven't they made a lot of references over the seasons to spies being everywhere?

Yeah, that was weird. Implying the king is a sadist is dangerous but implying you helped kill him is not? Whatever, Granny. I guess the writers thought we needed to hear from the QoT herself to be sure she was in on it, since Littlefinger's word means shit.

 

Oh yeah. What is Burn Gorman's character name? I'm adding him to my Death Wish List. Drinking out of Commander Mormount's skull was awful! I hope Ghost/Summer/Jon/Bran kills him first.

His name is Karl. He and Rast are surely dead meat, I only wonder if Ghost is going to get to kill Rast as Jon threatened in s1.

[SourK]

I like the way they handled Joffrey's murder. You had an opportunity to notice the clues as it happened (I totally didn't notice them, but I know other people did), and then they strongly implied a lot of it last week, and then this week they came out and told us how it happened. I think that was the right way of doing it, so that there's a little bit of mystery, but it doesn't become the dominating question this season. Also, because they put the clues there, and because they introduce the solution gradually over the next two episodes, it all makes sense when you hear about it, and you feel ready to accept the answer. Pretty deft writing, there.

 

The awesome thing is that Jamie gave his sword to Brienne.  She at least is honorable enough to wield what was once Ice.  Wonder if Tywin will notice?

 

I wonder WTF Jaime's telling people about her at all. We kind of glossed over the part where he explained that, even though she was working for their enemies and taking him to King's Landing as a hostage, they are now somehow friends and she should just be allowed to hang around the castle. I have no idea what he's going to say now that he gave her the family sword and wished her well on her trip to help Sansa. I mean, I guess he could say, "She went home and, unrelatedly, I lost my sword," but someone's gonna put the two together. Especially if they start hearing about a really big woman with a really big sword asking people if they've seen a little redhead girl.

 

The Jamie of Season 1 and the Jamie of Season 4 are the same person.  He has never expressed any kind of remorse for pushing Bran out of the window or for killing his Lannister cousin.  He's a monster with good looks and a title who is capable of doing nice things for some people.

 

This is probably a good way of looking at it. What's weird for me is that I feel like, especially with the direction SNAFU last week, the way the character's coming across on screen is different from what's probably intended (I have no outside info about him, and haven't read the books). I think we're supposed to see him as mostly a good guy (especially since the show has worked so hard to make us think he was doing a pubilc service by killing The Mad King, and that he's been unfairly maligned over that). This week, he's buying all this armour for Brienne and exchanging meaningful looks with her, sort of like the Westeros Knight version of Pretty Woman, and I get that there's supposed to be tension between Brienne bringing out the best in him and Cersei bringing out the worst, but... the characterization is not the best.

[Catherinewriter]

Sour K: Love this: 'I mean, I guess he could say, "She went home and, unrelatedly, I lost my sword," but someone's gonna put the two together.'

Okay, so we now know who poisoned Joff, but do we know how or when? I read an interview with one of the showrunners who said that it's all there, you just have to watch carefully. Well, I did, and I missed it.

Be careful, Sansa. Be very, very careful.

[Gudzilla]

 

"Joffrey didn't like him. He threatened to skin him alive. Mix his inners up in my food so I wouldn't know I was eating him."

I love that even though he's dead we still get little reminders of what a dick Joffrey was.

[ajsnaves]

Well next time you see a map store let me know and I'll buy you one.

 

 

I recently found this map of the Game of Thrones world.  It allows you track the movements of people, and where everything is.  It allows you to track things by book chapter or show episode.

 

By and large I thought this was a good episode.  I hope we get to see Brienne's and Podrick's adventures through Westeros. I loved the scene between Margery and Tommen, and of course the delightful Ser Ponce.  And I can't wait to see more of Margery's manipulations, and Cersei's reactions.  Sorry to see Lady Oleana go, but it may be fun to see Margery sink or swim in the great big soap opera that is King's Landing.

[bravelittletoaster]

Jaime and Brienne are my BrOTP1 on this show but they could get edged out by the Hound and Arya if they're not careful.  Still, I loved their scenes together.  

 

I will stop watching if anymore Direwolves are hurt or killed.

I literally said out loud when we saw Ghost in that cage, "If this show kills off another fucking Direwolf that's it!  I'm done!"  Of course it's mostly bluster, but I really am going to be pissed off.  As for Ser Pounce, if anything terrible befalls him, God help you, show.  The North may not forget, but neither does the internet.  Which is particularly fond of cats.

 

Not surprised Dany is taking the "not merciful" approach, with the former slave owners.  But it was done in a way where they are making it look like she is going down a dangerous path.  Not sure what exactly, but it just felt that way.

Yeah, that was my read on it, too.  Regardless of how justified one feels Dany was, I was getting some strong tonal indications from the show that she could be heading down the wrong path.  Which makes me sad.  She was my original pick to sit on the Iron Throne, but lately I've been feeling she's not getting the winner's edit, and this was one of those moments.

 

Overall I liked a lot of the episode, but I lost patience and got disgusted with the scene at Craster's Keep.  I get exhausted by this show’s penchant for torture porn sometimes.  The gang-rape scene was a bridge too far for me.  Made more disturbing by my presumption that some viewers get off on that shit.  Just because you’re on HBO and you can doesn’t always mean you should, show.  Allusion is your friend.  I’d like to go a couple of weeks without having someone raped and my nose rubbed in it, thanks.  It's disgusting and disturbing.  I know it's fiction, but going to that well a little too often is character-revealing, IMO.

 

It was really difficult to watch and listen to that infant cry in distress, but I gotta say, considering I thought all this time the White Walkers were eating them, I actually found the ending less disturbing.  It's hard to be more disturbing than snacking on babies.  Also completely geeked out when The Atlantic pointed out that the White Walker at the end who transformed the baby was played by Mark Metcalf, aka the Master on Buffy.  

[LittleIggy]

My favorite line was Bronn re: Tyrion and Joffery: "He hated the little twat. Who didn't?" ::rimshot::

[CletusMusashi]

 Interesting. Mark Metcalf also played the Maestro on Seinfeld. 

As far as I'm concerned, his name until otherwise revealed is FreezeMaestro.

[spiderling]

He was the Master, the Maestro, now he just needs to be a Maester.

[Mz Anthrope]

I am over Cersi.  I understand a woman needs to grieve her son's death, etc., but she's just been one caustic bitch and it's wearing thin watching her.   The actress playing her does a wonderful job, but I am done with the vile contempt she has. 

 

I liked Bron (again) and thought the discussion about how he and Tyrion met was fantastic.  "So, why aren't you helping him now?"  Effing beautiful!

 

Here's hoping Sansa snaps out of this doe-eyed, wounded dove bullshit and starts getting something of a spine.  \

 

There can be beauty, vulnerability, and softness even in the bravest of women - look at Brienne.  LOVED the exchange between herself and Jamie.  His getting her an armor, giving her his sword (Tywin's going to shit half his left lung with that - unless that was Joffrey's), and the goodbye... nice :-)

 

Was watching the Mentalist and thought "Pike looks SO familiar" ... and lo' and behold - our randy lad Oberyn!   Would have liked to have seen he and Tywin interacting again.  Valarian tongues 

 

Count me in on those tired of the gratuitous sex, naked woman, and vulgar rape scenes.  HBO could utilize its ability to show skin tastefully and with a heck of a lot more creativity than they have been this entire series, really.  And to whomever made the comment about the direction to the guy set in the foreground "just keep humping her while they're talking" - hilarious!

 

 

[JTMacc99]

Here's hoping Sansa snaps out of this doe-eyed, wounded dove bullshit and starts getting something of a spine.  \

I can see it coming any time now. She's a Stark, the Gryffindor of Westeros. I've been assuming for that it is only a matter of time until she acts like it.

 

Although, it is taking longer than I thought it would. Maybe being removed from the high life will be the jump start she needs.

[sugarbaker design]

The Jamie of Season 1 and the Jamie of Season 4 are the same person.  He has never expressed any kind of remorse for pushing Bran out of the window or for killing his Lannister cousin.  He's a monster with good looks and a title who is capable of doing nice things for some people.

 

 

I think we're supposed to see him as mostly a good guy

 

 

I see the character of Jamie Lannister the same way as the character of Tony Soprano.  The writers portray him as one of the most despicable characters ever, but the TV audience, because of the character's charm, looks or some other quality, see him as someone who's redeemed.  Has Jamie ever mentioned that he regrets pushing Bran out the window?  Has he ever regretted banging his own sister?  Killing his cousin?

[NoWillToResist]

 

This is my official request for Olenna and Margaery to go all Fuck Da Police and take the Iron Throne for themselves, ruling Westeros with their collective awesomeness.

 

Right? Love them. Cunning but not evil.

 

I don't see a big disconnect between Jaime's actions in the last ep with Cersei and this ep's nice Jaime with Bronn, Tyrion and Brienne. He's all fucked up where Cersei is concerned, so it brings out the worst in him, IMO.

 

Can I say that I have rape fatigue when it comes to this show? Like, seriously. I FUCKING GET IT. Can I get a reprieve? Jesus.

 

My heart grew three times bigger when both Tyrion and Sansa immediately rejected the idea that the other was responsible for Joffrey's murder. No evidence or anything...they just said it wasn't in their nature. AWWWW. They could have worked their marriage out, dammit! Fuck, I ship it now. I am so screwed.  :)

 

Everything with Brienne was awesome. She's just so...quietly decent and earnest and stoic. No wonder Jaime was giving her the 'heart eyes'. Yeah Jaime, she may not have beautifully arranged hair and stylish gowns, but that's what an awesome woman looks like. Put your loyalties there instead of in your twin sister's vicious lady garden.

 

At least Jaime showed SOME signs of pulling away from his obsession with Cersei. He's finally catching on to what an irrationally vengeful bitch she is. He won't kill Tyrion and he won't hunt down Sansa. Hell, he even gave Brienne his rare sword, a new suit of armour and sent the one utterly incorruptible person in all of Westeros to find and protect Sansa.

 

The dungeon scene between Jaime and Tyrion kicked so much ass. I love those two.

 

I honestly don't care about Dany's storyline. Speechify, slaves free themselves, sit on high and smile smugly while hundreds shower you with gratitude. Lather, rinse, repeat. Bored now.

 

The Frost Giants...uh, sorry, White Walkers...were terrifying. I can only presume that the babies grow super-fast into adult zombies. That there is a ceremonial altar is a little disturbing though. I kept expecting some evil god spectre to turn up to accept the offering, to show that the WW are only soldiers of an even bigger threat.

 

The assholes at Crasters are too villainous to be interesting. There is literally nothing redeeming about them.

 

For a brief moment, I thought Bronn was joining Brienne and Podrick and I got really excited. The snark and eye rolling that would have resulted would have been epic. I love the name she gave her sword. So...her.

 

So, I guess Arya, the Hound, Littlefinger and Sansa will all converge upon the Eyrie? I hope Brienne decides to start her search there...

Edited April 29, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[Mya Stone]

.

It was really difficult to watch and listen to that infant cry in distress, but I gotta say, considering I thought all this time the White Walkers were eating them, I actually found the ending less disturbing.  It's hard to be more disturbing than snacking on babies.  Also completely geeked out when The Atlantic pointed out that the White Walker at the end who transformed the baby was played by Mark Metcalf, aka the Master on Buffy.

We can only hope he monologues half as awesome as The Master!

[bravelittletoaster]

I don't really get romantic vibes between Jaime and Brienne [regardless of whether or not she's supposed to, she seems pretty gay to me], but I really like their friendship. And I always wish we got more male/female friendship on tv sans the treacly obnoxious will they or won't they dance. Not that I think Jaime and Brienne are going to see each other again any time soon.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Dougal
Remove accidental double-post.

[Catherinewriter]

Re Jamie: I think the murder of his cousin was the worst. He pushed Bran in the heat of the moment, but he thought out the plan to set up his cousin, who wasn't in any way a bad guy. Really betrayed him. I hated him then and am still really wary of Brienne's feelings for him.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Catherinewriter

[terrymct]

So, I guess Arya, the Hound, Littlefinger and Sansa will all converge upon the Eyrie? I hope Brienne decides to start her search there...

 

Anyone with half a brain would start their search there.  Sansa has two known living adult relatives:  Crazy Auntie Lyssa and Jon Snow.   Of the two, it makes more sense that she's run to her Aunt.  It's a shorter trip and it's not a fortress full of men who think women have cooties.

[Fisher King]

I thought I was done with Jaime last week after his raping Cersei. Boy, was this week a turnaround. Was last week just poor direction? Writing? Seems from some the replies here that that was the case. Thanks to Michelle MacLaren for another solid episode.

 

Could have done without the rapes/beatings/drinking-out-of-skulls at Craster's. I do hope Hodor and the Direwolves won't be slaughtered. I'm not really worried about Bran.

 

There are mean-ass bastards all over the place this season. The White Walkers are scary but I want to like them. I was so glad that Ol' Blue Eyes on the horse didn't eat that pitiful, squawling baby. But I must say it's good to see Edgar Winter's still alive and getting a prime gig .  ;)

 

[Mz Anthrope]

. But I must say it's good to see Edgar Winter's still alive and getting a prime gig .  ;)

 

 

BAM!   This was effing awesome!  Thank you for the jaw drop and hand pounding desk.  Beautiful!

[Fisher King]

*Blush*, Mz Anthrope.  Wasn't sure if anyone would pick up on

! Edited April 29, 2014 by Fisher King

[Mz Anthrope]

*Blush*, Mz Anthrope.  Wasn't sure if anyone would pick up on

!

My friend... I am old enough, yessir :-)  And it was awesome! 

[PatsyandEddie]

^^^^^Ahhhh, yes it was!! ;)

[Constantinople]

What They Said
Sansa: What do you want?
Littlefinger: Everything.

 

What We Heard
Sansa: Well, what's coming to you?
Littlefinger: The world, Chico, and everything in it

[NoWillToResist]

 

The White Walkers are scary but I want to like them.

 

Cersei had a bunch of babies killed.

 

In comparison, the White Walkers have taken in God only knows how many abandoned male babies and have apparently incorporated them into their community, so really now, how bad can they be? ;)

[Lady S.]

Here's hoping Sansa snaps out of this doe-eyed, wounded dove bullshit and starts getting something of a spine.

That's what you call recognizing Littlefinger's bullshit and calling him on Joffrey's murder before he admitted it? Short of jumping off the boat and trying to swim to safety, there's not much more she can do there. With this show's heavy-handed foreshadowing "Sansa's not a killer...yet." is a very promising line.

 

Anyone with half a brain would start their search there.  Sansa has two known living adult relatives:  Crazy Auntie Lyssa and Jon Snow.   Of the two, it makes more sense that she's run to her Aunt.  It's a shorter trip and it's not a fortress full of men who think women have cooties.

Yes, Lysa is the only real option, which is why Arya's also headed there. But Edmure and the Blackfish are still alive, it's the one being a prisoner and the other a fellow fugitive from the crown that makes them not viable options. Uncle Benjen is obviously not an option either, but he technically could still be alive.

 

In comparison, the White Walkers have taken in God only knows how many abandoned male babies and have apparently incorporated them into their community, so really now, how bad can they be? ;)

 

(Or Randyll Tarly or Balon Greyjoy or Craster himself.)

[NoWillToResist]

Heh. I think I love you for posting that gif... :)

[dr pepper]

The fuck? What good is a baby ice zombie, white walkers?

 

It's not a zombie, it's still alive and can grow up. It's obvious that the demon king and his followers have sentience, whereas the once that we've been calling white walkers are true undead. Both categories have blue eyes, but that's the only commonality.

[dr pepper]

tension between Brienne bringing out the best in him and Cersei bringing out the worst

 

That's some pair of shoulder angels!

[Ace]

 

 

QUOTE

The White Walkers are scary but I want to like them.

Cersei had a bunch of babies killed.

In comparison, the White Walkers have taken in God only knows how many abandoned male babies and have apparently incorporated them into their community, so really now, how bad can they be? ;)

 

99% of the Westeros is filled with nasty, evil people who  betray, kill and assault one another.  On the other hand, this White Walker (WW) group take in abandoned babies and care for them, giving them powers which allow them to survive in a harsh environment.  Supposedly, train them, give them transport and positions of managerial responsibility in their organisation (WWs riding horses and directing armies of zombie humans).  

 

Looks like Craster's babies are much better off beyond the wall than the one in Hole Town. 

 

Also, the water freezing in front of ghost's cage when the WW came for the baby, shows that cold is coming from the WW's. The more WW's there are the colder its gonna get. This makes me wonder if the Wall was created by the WW group to keep the nasty, evil Westerons out. But somehow they've got beyond the wall and multiplied.  We saw last week what despicable creatures the Wildings are. And this week the Night Watch deserters were equally despicable.

 

Maybe the WW's are just trying to drive the evil creatures out of there territory. That's why they haven't got to the wall yet. They are basically. herding the Wildings south, forcing them over and beyond the wall.

 

Looks like we've been supporting the wrong team. The good guys may no look nice. but they don't kill, assault, eat, harm  or mistreat their own people.

[NoWillToResist]

 

Looks like we've been supporting the wrong team. The good guys may no look nice. but they don't kill, assault, eat, harm  or mistreat their own people.

 

Wouldn't that be a helluva twist? The narrative is told from the Westeros perspective and the WW are vilified in that. Does make you wonder how the story/history books would be different if told from the WW perspective!

 

 

Also, the water freezing in front of ghost's cage when the WW came for the baby, shows that cold is coming from the WW's. The more WW's there are the colder its gonna get.

 

Masses of crows also lose their shit. It happened here and also last season (?) when Sam encountered one, IIRC.

 

I feel like the relationship between the WW and the cold could be a chicken and the egg type scenario. When they say 'winter is coming', does that mean that a WW invasion is coming or is it actually nature that makes it cold and snowy and the WW merely take advantage of that to move around more since they clearly thrive in the cold?

 

I'd still like to know how this whole Craster/WW arrangement started. Did he initially put his sons out to die of exposure so that they couldn't later challenge him and he just happened to notice that the WWs picked the kid up? Or was such an exchange somehow agreed upon between them?

Edited April 30, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[TooMuchCoffee]

I love these ideas about the White Walkers!  

Would this discussion be better in the No Book Talk Speculation thread?  I have a feeling it will span multiple episodes.

 

[beedub]

Also not thrilled with all the in-your-face raping at Craster's Keep (nor was my wife sitting next to me) – I agree that it could have been implied rather than paraded. Especially disheartening considering the director was female (choices, people)!

 

Now that I think of it, out of all the (countless) sex scenes throughout this entire series, there have been maybe two instances of a couple expressing genuinely loving, affectionate physical interaction (not including three, four and five-ways). The overwhelming majority involve either prostitutes or non-consensual sex. I'm not rushing to judge, but at this point you have to wonder whether GRRM, following the maxim, "writes what he knows".

[CeeBeeGee]

Can someone please explain the difference between the White Walkers and those...reanimated corpse-things they showed in the pilot? I haven't read the books and that's terribly confusing.

[Meredith Quill]

Can someone please explain the difference between the White Walkers and those...reanimated corpse-things they showed in the pilot? I haven't read the books and that's terribly confusing.

Short answer: We now know that the WW are a 'race' that inhabit the far, far North (I presume), who are sentient beings, the re-animated corpse types are called 'Wights' and they are basically mindless drones created by the WW's to do their bidding. It would also appear that there are at least 2 different 'types' of WW, i.e. the horse rider, shrivelled looking types and the type who changed the baby into a baby WW.

 

In the pilot you see the shrivelled type WW's and the re-animated little girl who is a Wight.

Edited May 1, 2014 by SilverStormm
Spoiler tags removed thanks to constantinople confirming the word wight has been used on the show.

[Gudzilla]

 

Yeah Jaime, she may not have beautifully arranged hair and stylish gowns, but that's what an awesome woman looks like.

You forgot the cheekbones.

 

I'm another one old enough for the Edgar Winter reference.;)

[TooMuchCoffee]

( I heard Edgar Winter's Frankenstein earlier today. They play it all the time on the Music Choice Classic Rock station.)

 

Good point about Michelle MacLaren directing the nasty rapes.  The only difference is at least there is no doubt that the rapists at Craster's are evil subhuman creeps as opposed to "ambiguously" immoral,  exploitive twin brothers.

 

Getting into the heads of the White Walkers and the Ice Meister(s), what compels them to arrange body parts into the lovely collages we've seen?  

Edited May 1, 2014 by TooMuchCoffee

[NoWillToResist]

 

Getting into the heads of the White Walkers and the Ice Meister(s), what compels them to arrange body parts into the lovely collages we've seen?

 

True artists should never have to explain their work... ;)

 

Or perhaps it's some kind of morse code with body parts and it spells out "thanks for the babies!"

Edited May 1, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[Constantinople]

Getting into the heads of the White Walkers and the Ice Meister(s), what compels them to arrange body parts into the lovely collages we've seen?

 

True artists should never have to explain their work... ;)

Good point.

Obviously the Walkers are strongly influenced by Damien Hirst.

Or perhaps it's the other way around.

 

Short answer: We now know that the WW are a 'race' that inhabit the far, far North (I presume), who are sentient beings, the re-animated corpse types are called

'Wights'

and they are basically mindless drones created by the WW's to do their bidding. It would also appear that there are at least 2 different 'types' of WW, i.e. the horse rider, shrivelled looking types and the type who changed the baby into a baby WW.

 

In the pilot you see the shrivelled type WW's and the re-animated little girl who is a

Wight

.

In Ghost of Harrenhal (S2E5), Quorhin Halfhand recommends sending a small group led by him to sneak into the Wildling camp and kill Mance Rayder. Jon Snow asks if he can join, which led to the following exchange

Lord Commander Mormont: You're a steward Snow, not a ranger

Jon Snow: I fought and killed a wight. How many rangers can say that?

 

Jon Snow was referring to the reanimated corpse of a member of the Night's Watch that Jon eventually "killed" by burning him (I think, but I'm not sure, he was a member of Benjen Stark's group that went missing).

[bravelittletoaster]

So basically the reanimated corpses are more or less zombies as we know them, and the White Walkers are kind of their overlords or something?

 

Good point about Michelle MacLaren directing the nasty rapes.  The only difference is at least there is no doubt that the rapists at Craster's are evil subhuman creeps as opposed to "ambiguously" immoral,  exploitive twin brothers.

True, and that surprised me a bit, but the director is still beholden to what's in the script, so it's not really up to the director in this case to be all "let's say this all happens offscreen" if the writer put it there in the scene.  Plus you have that Kurtz figure with the socioeconomic chip on his shoulder yelling over and over "fuck them til they die" or whatever it was.  I'm not a squeamish person at all, but jesus, show, I've had e-fucking-nough of the rape already.  We get it.  Life in Westeros sucks for the womenfolk.  Stop rubbing our faces in it.  There's a thin line between establishing a fact and getting off on it.