S05.E20: Underneath

[BkWurm1]

20 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Upon my rewatch, I couldn't help but think, "wow, it looks like the ban on touching has finally really been lifted in the present." 

Also, as others have noted, that shot of the B team outside Diggle's apartment was a very good choice. And there was something about the three of them sitting on the couch together that had me thinking, "hey, this could really work." (I honestly could not tell you why that particular visual led to that, but it did.) I think they've figured out how to use the B team and I kind of like them all now? (But I still miss Rory. And Curtis needs to never go back to his annoying self.)

And I'm picturing Curtis trying to get everyone to join him in playing matchmaker with Oliver and Felicity after Felicity went off to see Oliver at the end there. 

Yeah, somehow Dinah's sanity is the perfect counterpoint that makes Curtis and Rene work.  She knows they're nuts but shrugs it off.  Even enjoys it.

Edited May 4, 2017 by BkWurm1

[AudienceofOne]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

LEGIT LOLing here.

I just watched that again recently, like a few weeks ago. What a delight. 

I feel like someone should have been shouting "I have ONE JOB. It's stupid, but I'm gonna do it. OKAY??"

WHAT'S MY LAST NAME?

8 hours ago, immortalfrieza said:

I guess I just value privacy, integrity, honor, and honesty too much.

For only one person in a relationship apparently

[Mellowyellow]

After he gives the demonstration on Sally, just before he helps Felicity get on Sally, Oliver has the cutest expression like he's thinking or pondering how adorable and funny Felicity is. 

Gawd it's stuff like that which makes their chemistry off the charts and makes me adore Oliver when he's with her. He's not like that with anyone else. You can see him THINKING how cute he thinks she is. 

Arrghhhhhh

It may be weeks before I recover from this. 

I loved the sex scene in 520. 320 always made me a little uncomfortable like I was spying on them. I have no idea why! 520 was perfect!

Edited May 4, 2017 by Mellowyellow

[Guest]

Can I ask why they felt the need to have the scene where Felicity tells Oliver she's not saying "Never" and Oliver says he's not going anywhere? Because technically that suggests she was leaving the door open for their relationship and yet when Oliver asked if she was in 505 (which he should've known already, based purely on that flashback), she said no. Once again it frustrates me because she just goes on to date Mayo Bread. Grrrr.

IDK. The whole thing is messy. I definitely would have preferred the flashbacks without that final scene. It just doesn't add up with what came in 505.

[apinknightmare]

1 hour ago, BkWurm1 said:

Not a really good one though at one point I thought I saw something but it could have just as easily been a shadow or a make up smudge.  What I was really curious about was what kind of new scars she has from being shot up in the limo.  She took more than one bullet in her torso, right?  Apparently none though that left a mark from the belly button down, lol.  Either that or she had a FANTASTIC plastic surgeon.  

She has them, and I know this because I had the misfortune of having my eyes open and pointed at the TV while she and tiny hands were getting dressed after their nooner. 

[AudienceofOne]

6 hours ago, Angel12d said:

I'm still not happy about Felicity's apology tbh. Or should I say, I'm not happy that she apologized about the whole William part. I accept her saying sorry for walking away because while I do think she had every right to walk at that moment, I also think they should have talked about their relationship (and William). But I really could've done without her saying she was a hypocrite and that she understood why he lied about William. They basically put the blame for the break-up entirely on her shoulders and that just isn't fair. HE STILL LIED. No matter the intentions, he lied to the woman he planned to marry about having a child. You just don't do that. 

I had a problem with this as well. I was actually typing my 'apology' post when that scene happened. I decided not to let that one poorly-worded (I hope) scene ruin my enjoyment of this episode. Basically, everything I complained about in last week's episode was dealt with until then.

I think I have to look at this from a relationship rather than philosophical perspective though. If two people want to continue having a relationship - romantic or otherwise - there's a point at which they both have to go, "we both made mistakes, let's put those behind us". And I think that's what Felicity was doing. 

Yes, Oliver was completely wrong in the William situation and he was wrong in a way that he had been consistently wrong throughout the relationship. He shut Felicity out of his decisions about their life. He didn't treat her as a partner and that's what she had an issue with. I thought it was a little reductive to frame that as a 'trust' issue but this is a TV show and trust is as good a way as any to quantify the underlying problem. 

I think I agree with people who were saying that Felicity meant that she understood why a man as damaged as him had done what he did. What she was apologising for was walking out without talking about it, not for walking out per se. For me, at the time, I felt like she'd been talking to him perpetually about this issue for months. Is there any point dissecting a last straw? But if an apology will get two people back to equilibrium then it's worth making, for the sake of the relationship if nothing else.

[Mellowyellow]

8 minutes ago, AudienceofOne said:

 

I think I agree with people who were saying that Felicity meant that she understood why a man as damaged as him had done what he did. What she was apologising for was walking out without talking about it, not for walking out per se. For me, at the time, I felt like she'd been talking to him perpetually about this issue for months. Is there any point dissecting a last straw? But if an apology will get two people back to equilibrium then it's worth making, for the sake of the relationship if nothing else.

Love this!

The apology didn't bother me for reasons I've already listed but I also feel that with her revelation of what he told her about his time with Chase and with everything that he's been through, she wanted to make that apology to give him a sign that they could start over. He certainly didn't look like he was expecting it or needed it from her. He looked like he thought she had nothing to apologise about but that he appreciated her words. It was her being a bigger person because that's who Felicity Smoak is. 

I felt like they both came off very well.

[KenyaJ]

51 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

Gawd it's stuff like that which makes their chemistry off the charts and makes me adore Oliver when he's with her. He's not like that with anyone else. You can see him THINKING how cute he thinks she is. 

And it's been that way since their very first scene together. I'm sure Stephen puts actual effort into that dynamic, but from the beginning, it's appeared so natural and effortless, which is why these two idiots had me from their first scene together.

On another note, I'm still laughing at the adrenaline scene. Lyla and Curtis's reactions are hysterical, and Oliver's "Okay!" "Good!" crack me up every time I watch the scene. So much fun!

[calliope1975]

1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

After he gives the demonstration on Sally, just before he helps Felicity get on Sally, Oliver has the cutest expression like he's thinking or pondering how adorable and funny Felicity is. 

I loved the, "I believe in you," line. It was perfectly dorky.

 

1 hour ago, apinknightmare said:

She has them, and I know this because I had the misfortune of having my eyes open and pointed at the TV while she and tiny hands were getting dressed after their nooner. 

I will take your word for it because I will not be fact checking that scene. :(

[Mellowyellow]

OMG his gentle Felicity voice in the flashbacks is killing me!

Yup shamelessly have the episode running in a loop right now!

ETA: And the "Felicity I'm soooo in love with you" voice is back again in the last scene. 

He sounded so different when they were stuck in the bunker trading barbs.

*sigh*

Gawd I ship them so hard!!!!!!

Edited May 5, 2017 by Mellowyellow

[BunsenBurner]

Watched it with my brother today.

My brother and I really liked this.

I can't write most of the stuff he said because we were laughing so hard, but 3 things stood out to both of us. 

1. OQ did not shoot that arrow at a 45 degree angle.

2. When FS slid down OQ's arm in the OTP hold in the air shaft he yelled out.  "He's stronger than Mighty Mouse." 

3. Shouldn't OQ have been lying on his stomach since he just had back surgery or on some special pillow? Why was he wearing a T-shirt? I wanted to see his chest.

 

When they were laying on the floor post sex in the FB didn't you think that SA looked uncomfortable or awkward? As in they had him lay a certain way for the camera.

Edited May 5, 2017 by BunsenBurner
Wanted to ask the question at the end.

[SmallScreenDiva]

He needed a pillow. Should have rolled a shirt or blanket under his neck/head. Felicity on the other hand looked very comfy.

So, a friend who stopped during the early part of the season and who is just starting to come back had a very important question she texted: "Do you think SA smells nice? Because Emily is right there tucked under his armpit." I couldn't respond since I've never been close enough to SA for a whiff :P I hear David smells great during cons. Don't know about SA, LOL!

[BkWurm1]

3 hours ago, KenyaJ said:

.

On another note, I'm still laughing at the adrenaline scene. Lyla and Curtis's reactions are hysterical, and Oliver's "Okay!" "Good!" crack me up every time I watch the scene. So much fun!

I loved that moment.  It's not the kind of beat that Arrow really does normally, but it was incredibly effective.  I really wonder if it was scripted or the director.  I mean, I'm sure the adrenaline dose was scripted, but how he reacted, I'm not sure you could script that, lol.  

19 minutes ago, BunsenBurner said:

 

 

When they were laying on the floor post sex in the FB didn't you think that SA looked uncomfortable or awkward? As in they had him lay a certain way for the camera.

I rewound that scene a few times (science!) and I think he looked comfortable enough.  More than anything, he looked like he wanted to just go to sleep but had to wake up to talk to Felicity.  

2 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

He needed a pillow. Should have rolled a shirt or blanket under his neck/head. Felicity on the other hand looked very comfy.

So, a friend who stopped during the early part of the season and who is just starting to come back had a very important question she texted: "Do you think SA smells nice? Because Emily is right there tucked under his armpit." I couldn't respond since I've never been close enough to SA for a whiff :P I hear David smells great during cons. Don't know about SA, LOL!

One would hope that when doing that kind of scene smelling nice would just be the proper etiquette and SA is known as a considerate host on set.   

[Mellowyellow]

I wonder if that flip was to unbutton the top and we've all got dirty minds or did they want us to think what we all thought. 

I need to stop watching this episode in a loop!

[BkWurm1]

21 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I wonder if that flip was to unbutton the top and we've all got dirty minds or did they want us to think what we all thought. 

I need to stop watching this episode in a loop!

Bless them either way.  :D  

[tv echo]

Another 520-related post at https://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/ on May 4...

almondblossomme asked:
I know you said you don't write based on ratings.. But fanboys are really shallow I work with a lot of them. The number one observation about 5x20 was that Felicity looked super hot with no glasses and her hair down and why couldn't she look like that all the time!
I don’t disagree with them, but we’ve established a certain look for Felicity.
Fun fact:  Felicity was scripted to be wearing glasses in that scene.

[bijoux]

I think I would really have liked having the glasses in that scene, although I imagine they were left out because of practical issues, like working out with them and where do they toss them when they get going.

[MaggieG]

Really enjoyed this episode! The sex scene was unexpected to me and when it started I was all "WHOA YES" to my tv.

Diggle watching Dinah, Rene and Curtis through the peephole was funny

[SmallScreenDiva]

The controlled way Felicity brought herself down and the lack of strain in her voice when she was babbling about "chinning and upping" tells me Emily is really strong and I totally believe that she can handle the salmon ladder just fine (I need outtakes for the DVD, though). 

Also just noticed how Oliver swallowed hard here. You can almost hear it in the no music version that someone had already uploaded on YouTube. 

And this is rapidly going up my list of Oliver Queen at his cutest.

It took awhile to wrap my head around this episode because I on a high, and thankfully not on methane gas. This episode was just so entertaining, so much fun to watch. Even when Oliver & Felicity were fighting, especially when they were bickering. It was like "finally!" But beyond all the great Olicity stuff (maybe not so much that apology at the end, though I can fan wank the meaning of it in my head largely because of how vulnerable Oliver looked in that hospital bed) — beyond all the shippy stuff, the episode got me leaning forward just before the commercial breaks. The hooks were so good with the escalating stakes. The action was topnotch. (And don't tell anyone but I actually didn't mind the newbies too much in this episode, though I still want to pour ice cold water on Tinah whenever she's around Digg). 

I know there's no way Arrow can be like this every episode, but it should be like this! Deftly mixing romance, action, humor, conflict/drama.

[Guest]

EBR is so strong. She held herself there for ages. I'd be like "MY ARMS. THEY BURN! HALP!" Haha.

[Aeryn13]

The flashback scenes were really cute and adorable. So Oliver and Felicity weren`t in a bad place after their break-up, still had fun chemistry and hearteyes, why then the "nothing to see here" vibe of Season 5 for the longest time. I get they were broken up and she, then he had new romantic partners but that`s no reason to act as if they hadn`t been the primary romance for Seasons now. Just because something is no longer happening onscreen doesn`t mean one has to act like it never happened. Well, glad, that seems to be changing.

I`m happy Diggle and Lyla worked things out but did she basically accuse him of treating Oliver like the better wife? Kind of?       

[Carrie Ann]

I've had a few days to stew over this episode, and it's still kind of hard to talk about. Because my emotions are wayyyyy up here, and my rational thoughts are way down here, and I can't make them reconcile. If the episode were completely devoid of context, or even if I just paid no attention to interviews or comments from the cast and EPs, I would probably feel more satisfied by it on the non-emotional level. But as it is, the episode had, say, five agenda items I expected it to accomplish, and here's how I would grade it on each:

1) Explain the, in Stephen's Amell's words, "very deliberate almost robotic feeling or temperature to their relationship this year." Grade: D

Their "robotic" behavior with each other and dating other people actually makes even less sense now. I would be very interested to hear what Stephen thinks the explanation was. Where they left off in the flashbacks, it seemed very much like they were just in a holding pattern until Felicity felt ready to talk, so her relationship with Billy (and its retconned importance) and Oliver's non-reaction to it don't follow, and their "regimented" attitudes with each other before and after that reveal don't either. The only glimmer of an explanation I can see is that they stayed far away from each other physically and emotionally because they can't control their feelings and they'd just end up screwing on all surfaces. Like...was that actually it, though???

2) Reveal more about the reasons for their breakup, on which MG basically admitted they dropped the ball in S4. Grade: C

I didn't feel like we really got much that was new about their breakup, except for Felicity apologizing for just walking away without talking. Which I didn't personally hate, but would have much preferred it be balanced by more insight and remorse on Oliver's side. Marc suggested in his response to a Tumblr ask that Oliver would address "his train of thought about the son situation or talk about the circumstances around it like the Barry telling him what happened in the other time line thing." That did not happen. The one other useful piece of information we got was when Felicity homed in on the trust thing, and said that Oliver couldn't trust anyone and she didn't understand why, but maybe if she did... 

3) Show Felicity and Oliver coming to understand something about each other, which would resolve certain things re: their breakup and Helix. Grade C-

So, presumably, Felicity's new understanding of Oliver is about why he can't trust people, then? And that's related to the way that he actually can't trust himself? And her understanding somehow has something to do with Billy's death? And Helix? And her being willing to do whatever it takes no matter what to get payback? I...yeah, I don't follow. But, more importantly, even if that connection was clear, trust really had nothing to do with why he didn't tell her about William. If the show wanted to complicate that now by having Oliver reveal that actually what Barry told him did make him of terrified of losing her, and that he feels like everyone who is really a part of his life gets hurt and he kind of subconsciously agreed with Samantha that keeping William separate from his life was a good idea, then okay, I would still think it was a retcon, but I would have accepted it. But they didn't bother doing that, they just sort of had Felicity say "I understand, I get it now" and neither the Thing She Got nor the Reason She Got It hang together under any scrutiny. Also, I'm left to guess at what new understanding Oliver reached about Felicity. 

4) Leave Oliver with some sort of question that relates to his relationship with Felicity but also drives his journey toward the finale. Grade: B+

I thought this was pretty good. The question that Oliver needs to answer for himself, and what he needs to do, was pretty clearly stated--figure out what kind of person you are. It's a little late in the season and it's repetitive as hell, but it's an action item for Oliver, w/r/t his relationship with Felicity and his fight against Chase and in general. He needs to believe once and for all that he's a good man who deserves good things, and that he can trust himself so that he will trust others too, and then Felicity will be willing to be in a relationship with him again. Which is great, because, see #5.

5) Remind the audience why we should bother to root for O/F by focusing on them in flashbacks and isolating them in present day, and letting the SA/EBR chemistry do its work. Grade: A+++++++++++++++++

The thing about #5 is...it makes everything else just seem sort of unimportant. Like, oh, are these writers still hacks who can't seem to follow their own narrative threads? Must be Wednesday. It just does not matter in the face of this:

What will it take to get more of that??? If the answer is to accept the vague motivations and nonsensical explanations for their behavior, then fine! I accept! Just end this nonsense and let these precious people interact again. I need those hearteyes in my life every week. (Also the dimples and the abs and the butts, pls.)

[AudienceofOne]

7 minutes ago, Carrie Ann said:

5) Remind the audience why we should bother to root for O/F by focusing on them in flashbacks and isolating them in present day, and letting the SA/EBR chemistry do its work. Grade: A+++++++++++++++++

The thing about #5 is...it makes everything else just seem sort of unimportant. Like, oh, are these writers still hacks who can't seem to follow their own narrative threads? Must be Wednesday. It just does not matter in the face of this:

What will it take to get more of that??? If the answer is to accept the vague motivations and nonsensical explanations for their behavior, then fine! I accept! Just end this nonsense and let these precious people interact again. I need those hearteyes in my life every week. (Also the dimples and the abs and the butts, pls.)

Hahaha. I loved this because I was reading your list going "yes, yes, yes, that's all true but I don't think I care."

#5 Oh, THAT's why I don't care. 

[leopardprint]

@Carrie Ann, I was actually going to write a very lengthy post similar to yours about whether this episode sufficiently answered all the questions created by this season, but you said everything I wanted to say but better! ?

I think as a standalone episode or maybe an homage to five years of Olicity, all the good and bad, it succeeded. As an episode that was supposed to fit within the context of S5 and especially 5A it didn't really work for me.

Edited May 5, 2017 by leopardprint

[SmallScreenDiva]

18 minutes ago, Carrie Ann said:

What will it take to get more of that??? If the answer is to accept the vague motivations and nonsensical explanations for their behavior, then fine! I accept! Just end this nonsense and let these precious people interact again. I need those hearteyes in my life every week. (Also the dimples and the abs and the butts, pls.)

This is where I am at, I'm willing to ignore everything that doesn't make sense about what's happened in the past several months as long as Oliver & Felicity get to move forward now, as long as we don't go back to the idiotic "writing away" from them, as long as there are no more stalls. Because you're right @Carrie Ann a lot of it doesn't make sense at all. Billy, Susan, Oliver not being able to tell Felicity about the coloring kid because of "lack of trust"?!? It's ridiculous. But I am willing to move forward, if the show is, and we can both forget about the mess that was S4 and S5.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Arrow Gets Locked In A Small Room

Oliver and Felicity can't escape each other, so they're forced to address their relationship. And also escape the deadly methane.

[Hiveminder]

I agree that while trust is an issue for Oliver, it's difficult to connect that with his decision to keep William a secret. I have to write it all off as Oliver's self hate (of which not trusting himself/anyone else is just a symptom) leading to a general tendency to self sabotage his relationships because he doesn't feel like he deserves happy relationships. It's unsatisfying. 

It would have been better if they had made what Barry told Oliver about the other timeline (Even though Felicity did not react in character in that timeline.) and Oliver's subconscious belief that Samantha was right that Oliver shouldn't be involved in William's life the root causes of Oliver's actions(and made that clear to the viewers) from the very beginning. It would have made more sense, and it would have made the situation more tragic instead of dumb. I think it would have made some people less ragetastic toward Oliver too, if it was shown that his insecurities overpowered his common sense instead of Oliver just being and idiot. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

Great post @Carrie Ann !! ??

I think the big problem they couldn't get around is that last year they wrote a story to break them up that didn't make a lot of sense. We were supposed to think Oliver was facing an impossible decision instead the feedback they got was that the fans have a basic understanding of how relationships work and Oliver's choice was between being loyal to his fiancée or to a woman he slept with ten years ago that kept his child from him, so not that hard.

Then they tried to add that he also did it to keep William safe but they screwed that up too. Now we have a new reason that seems to be that Oliver makes questionable decisions because he doesn't trust himself..because what he has been through made it difficult for him to be a true partner. So it works with Felicity's speech about wanting to have a real partner as an issue that they have to solve before being together but alone and so vague it's not a satisfying explanation for me for his behavior last year. If they showed him being afraid of losing her, thinking he had to hide things because he had too many issues already and Felicity was going to leave him if she saw the real him (from his POV, not mine or Felicity's, she would have set him straight in one second) then yes, I could buy that. But that's not what they were doing last year.

They had to make Felicity open the door for them again so she had to be the one to say I understand your POV to move on. And they didn't make her say what exactly she understood because what they wrote last year didn't make sense so it was best to stay vague and let fans guess what makes them happier, LOL.

One good thing is that the lesson seems to be that they both need to learn to be true partners so Oliver won't (hopefully) shut her out in the future. Even if they failed to convince me that Felicity with her "island" was acting like Oliver since she had no problem telling people in the team, when asked, what she was doing and she wanted them involved (on her and Helix's side) so she never seemed to me to share Oliver's mindset.

[leopardprint]

18 minutes ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

They had to make Felicity open the door for them again so she had to be the one to say I understand your POV to move on. And they didn't make her say what exactly she understood because what they wrote last year didn't make sense so it was best to stay vague and let fans guess what makes them happier, LOL.

You are so right! The reconciliation was never going to make sense because the breakup didn't make any sense.

I just don't get why they couldn't have Oliver say, I understand why you walked away and I'm sorry for letting you think I don't trust you, I was afraid to lose William and you, when she was apologizing. Boom! Done! Everyone can move on with their lives 

In regards to 505 though, it really doesn't make sense now because shouldn't Oliver have been mad or expressed disappointment. I mean they basically made it seem like he was waiting around for Felicity and she was secretly dating some rando for totally inexplicable reasons. 

Lastly, please put it on my tombstone, "Felicity Smoak was not a hypocrite in 519!"

Edited May 5, 2017 by leopardprint

[blackwing]

Good episode.  I don't think I heard one "Hoss".  And that makes a good episode.

Loved the "Death Star Interrogation Droid" line, because I thought it as soon as the needle extended.

Noticed that Stephen Amell appears to have finally stopped waxing his chest.  I guess he's in his mid-30s and doesn't care so much anymore?

[Midnight Lullaby]

12 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

You are so right! The reconciliation was never going to make sense because the breakup didn't make any sense.

I just don't get why they couldn't have Oliver say, I understand why you walked away and I'm sorry for letting you think I don't trust you, I was afraid to lose William and you, when she was apologizing. Boom! Done! Everyone can move on with their lives 

In regards to 505 though, it really doesn't make sense now because shouldn't Oliver have been mad or expressed disappointment. I mean they basically made it seem like he was waiting around for Felicity and she was secretly dating some rando for totally inexplicable reasons. 

Lastly, please put it on my tombstone, "Felicity Smoak was not a hypocrite in 519!"

I think Oliver might say something about that when they get back together..or something like him wanting to be the man she needs and sees..he has to say something. Please. LOL

505 makes no sense and imo it's because they didn't plan to explain what happened between them during the summer..I know they say they don't listen to what fans say but first they were trying to convince us that Oliver and Felicity were acting normally, that we were crazy for questioning anything and then suddenly they wanted to explain why they were acting "robotic"..oookay.

Rewatching the last scene (I did it a few times trying to make sense of what they were trying to say, LOL) Felicity calling herself a hypocrite really bothered me because they were making a comparison with two situations that should have never been compared and Oliver had problems with her working with Helix while he worked with worse people but no, he says he isn't a hypocrite and 

Spoiler

He will work with the guy that murdered his mother and tried to kill them all but that's okay. Nothing to see there.

[bijoux]

Mission to find the best gifset from the pisode accomplished.

Source

But seriously, is this sped up? I didn't notice it was this intense in the episode.

[Midnight Lullaby]

Just now, bijoux said:

Mission to find the best gifset from the pisode accomplished.

Source

But seriously, is this sped up? I didn't notice it was this intense in the episode.

I died. You just killed me. BYYYYE! Hahahaha

[statsgirl]

1 hour ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Billy, Susan, Oliver not being able to tell Felicity about the coloring kid because of "lack of trust"?!? It's ridiculous. But I am willing to move forward, if the show is, and we can both forget about the mess that was S4 and S5.

Susan doesn't make sense except to keep give the show a reason to keep Oliver and Felicity apart.  Billy makes sense as a plot contrivance because Chase needed someone to kill but not at all in terms of how Felicity went from that flashback sex to dating him.

The only way I can connect the issue of trust is that Oliver didn't trust Felicity with the secret of William's existence. Yes, Samantha told him not to tell but we all said he should have told Felicity and lied to Samantha instead.

[leopardprint]

The fact that Oliver started dating someone post 505 doesn't bother me that much because it makes more sense if he was waiting for Felicity and the he finds out she's supposedly moved on. 

I hate Susan as a character who's just a bunch of sexist tropes and the timing of Oliver going all in on a relationship almost immediately after killing Felicity's boyfriend. She also doesn't make sense as a woman who Oliver would be interested in for many reasons that have been covered. 

Yeah, they really need to address the Samantha of it all because I would have major issues if my partner was always going to do whatever crazy thing his untrustworthy ex requested of him. 

Edited May 5, 2017 by leopardprint

[Hiveminder]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

 

Noticed that Stephen Amell appears to have finally stopped waxing his chest.  I guess he's in his mid-30s and doesn't care so much anymore?

I immediately found some gifs to check for this chest hair, and I'm not ashamed. 

[SmallScreenDiva]

57 minutes ago, Hiveminder said:

I immediately found some gifs to check for this chest hair, and I'm not ashamed. 

And you didn't think to share?!?! Shame! ;)

[Hiveminder]

4 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

And you didn't think to share?!?! Shame! ;)

Apologies, if I wasn't on my phone I would. 

[Mellowyellow]

Those gifs have got to be speeded up surely. I didn't think it was that frenzied in the episode.

Haha oh the fun fandom is having with this episode!

On another note, Felicity is a bundle of adorableness but I don't think she's ever been as cute as when she was saying "I'm chinning and upping" while wiggling her little feet. That is the CUTEST Felicity moment ever for me and it's beaten the time her face popped out of the ATOM suit which was previously my top cute Felicity moment. 

[quarks]

On 5/4/2017 at 3:29 AM, lemotomato said:

As if I didn't already love the episode, it brought back @quarks to us! Welcome back, we missed you! :D

Awwwwww.

I was just mostly gone, and now only partly back. 

[Delphi]

1 hour ago, Hiveminder said:

I immediately found some gifs to check for this chest hair, and I'm not ashamed. 

 

Oh,  gifs,  I just loaded up my queue to watch again for the chest hair... you know.   For science. 

Edited:  http://neffreys.tumblr.com/post/160285328821/i-removed-the-music-from-the-olicity-sex-scene-and

Well I found this,  which yeah,  chest hair,  but also no music,  which I thought some posters would enjoy. 

Edited May 6, 2017 by Delphi

[Guest]

2 hours ago, bijoux said:

Mission to find the best gifset from the pisode accomplished.

Source

But seriously, is this sped up? I didn't notice it was this intense in the episode.

Holy shit. Uh, yeah, that's definitely sped up. Hubba.

I'm all aflutter. Haha.

Edited May 6, 2017 by Guest

[Mellowyellow]

OMG I realise that I FINALLY agree with something WM said in an interview!

It was indeed a champagne bottle episode Wendy!!!!!!!

[AudienceofOne]

2 hours ago, leopardprint said:

I hate Susan as a character who's just a bunch of sexist tropes and the timing of Oliver going all in on a relationship almost immediately after killing Felicity's boyfriend. She also doesn't make sense as a woman who Oliver would be interested in for many reasons that have been covered.

Also, she's supposed to be a journalist in the mayoral press gallery but has now completely disappeared even though having an ally in the press corp might actually be a good thing right about now?

[BkWurm1]

4 hours ago, leopardprint said:

 

Lastly, please put it on my tombstone, "Felicity Smoak was not a hypocrite in 519!"

I've been trying to work that one out as well. She's still perfectly fine with her choices to work with Helix and to free Cayden James even after her bio tracker from Helix gets fried and Chase traps them.  And she's adamant that Oliver not wanting her to be like him is still not at all an acceptable excuse for him not backing her play.  It's not until after Oliver bares his soul and says it's not her that he didn't trust, but himself and that everything he'd done and the man she'd fallen in love with was based on a lie that she changed her mind and decided she'd been a hypocrite.  So what was it about his confession that made her look at her choices with new eyes?  

I still don't believe that Felicity regrets her actual choice, but I think she regrets embracing the "whatever it takes" attitude since while she loves Oliver for always doing the right thing even if it's hard, his "whatever it takes" attitude frequently led him to making some really crappy choices (like not telling the team of his plan to defeat Ra's which included his death or that time when his solution was to let Slade kill him).  I think that is what she was calling herself a hypocrite over, that she realized she'd been endorsing something that she knew led to mistakes and poor judgement. So even if Helix was the right choice (and that's still a grey area), the thought process behind why she'd thought it was right really wasn't sound.  

 

I think Oliver and his "whatever it takes" attitude was supposed to have come into the William thing as well, though it's more confusing. I still believe Felicity (and Oliver) know he was wrong about not telling her about William, but I think his attitude was how he justified not telling her.  That he was doing that extreme "whatever it takes" thing.  

I'm fuzzy on how exactly since I don't believe not telling Felicity works on a "whatever it takes" list, (either to see his son or keep him safe) but if we accept that Oliver believed he was doing a whatever it takes and that was why he didn't tell her about William, then even if she understood why he did it, it would be hypocritical of her to use something that she thought a lot of the time was the wrong attitude to justify her actions as right.    

Edited May 6, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Mellowyellow]

I love that during the episode there were parts when they were bickering and you could tell Oliver looked SO frustrated with Felicity but he never looked like he smelled dead fish or have stank face!

Has he ever used that Felicity voice before or is it a new thing? Methinks it's a new thing in this episode. It was so obvious when he was using it.

I can't stop raving about how awesome the plot has been for EBR's range. Yes she is a cutie pie who excels at being adorable but I loved the more hardened and damaged woman in 519 and the irritated wife in early 520 when she was telling him "I told you so"

They were both heartbreaking in his confession scene!

[BkWurm1]

Quote

Has he ever used that Felicity voice before or is it a new thing? Methinks it's a new thing in this episode. It was so obvious when he was using it.

Which Felicity voice, lol?  He has so many just for her.  :D  

[leopardprint]

@bijoux, everytime I scroll by, those gifs make me blush....*fans self*

[Mellowyellow]

1 minute ago, BkWurm1 said:

Which Felicity voice, lol?  He has so many just for her.  :D  

The really gentle melty one! I swear I haven't heard that one! He used it during the sex flashback, the post coital flashback and when she walked to him at the end when he was in hospital and he said "You're walking." It's such a mushy "I'm so in love with you" voice. 

I agree he has many Felicity voices but I think this is a new one! Hehe happy to be proved wrong though cuz I'll just go and watch other clips then. For research! 

[lemotomato]

6 hours ago, bijoux said:

Mission to find the best gifset from the pisode accomplished.

It took me way too long to realize that it's the same clip, just flipped