S03.E01: Mabel

[ShadowFacts]

27 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

I asked the same thing. Maybe to get the cops out of way sooner? Though, in the end, he just brought more attention to himself.

I agree, I thought the Gene reaction was to get the police eyes off him ASAP, but the Jimmy/Saul reaction bubbled up and thus he warned the kid.  I think he really is terrified of being found, he was scoping out where to sit and eat lunch and he stayed locked in that garbage area last season rather than sound an alarm. 

[LoneHaranguer]

On 4/11/2017 at 0:01 PM, nodorothyparker said:

With Jimmy's confession, Chuck gets confirmation that Ernie lied for him.

No. Ernie could have called Jimmy without having any idea that he was already nearby, and Chuck doesn't know how long it actually took for Jimmy to appear, so he has no reason to think that Ernie would have known something was up.

[knaankos]

Is there any reason why "Gene" must live such a miserable life in Omaha? Him being scared out of his britches 24/7 doesn't seem to add up to his character. I mean eating a pathetic fixed lunch by himself on a bench? Is that really necessary? 

[RealReality]

13 hours ago, Tikichick said:

I have a feeling Chuck's issue with Jimmy has been lifelong.  People inherently like Jimmy for Jimmy.  Chuck's trying to always be "the best" in everything, yet Jimmy simply being himself trumps Chuck every time.  You could see it strongly in the flashback last season when "screwup" Jimmy came to town for a visit and to dinner and charmed Chuck's wife?(cannot remember her name right now), even though she knew the score, was prompted with Chuck's script to disapprove of Jimmy -- and she went completely off script and found Jimmy charming and even laughed at his jokes.  Chuck wasn't having it, not at all.  For Chuck that drove an immovable wedge between them, and is probably responsible for Chuck being alone in that house today.

Chuck can just never see that being "right" doesn't always equal being loved by everyone....or anyone.  His dad seemed to love Jimmy more, even thought Jimmy fucked up.  Mom asked for Jimmy, even though Chuck was the one that was there and went to law school and did everything right.

Chuck is an insufferable prick, but he is always "right."  

The way he talks to Ernesto always makes me want to puke, he is so condescending.  I get that he is a dick to Jimmy, but I kinda understand the long standing resentment there.  But what the hell did Ernesto ever do to him?

[SlackerInc]

15 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

This episode is polarizing in the same way as was the Breaking Bad episode, "The Fly." I appreciated both episodes, probably mostly for the reasons @attica describes above, but I totally get the camp in which @dinkysquid resides too.

Interesting idea, but it doesn't quite map over to me.  "The Fly" is the only Breaking Bad episode I don't like (except for Walt's monologue), whereas I liked this episode of Better Call Saul quite a bit.

11 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

 

11 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Why do you all think Cinnabon Jimmy (Gene) pointed his finger at the kid in the self-photo booth?  Why didn't he just say he's been reading the whole time?

His firm lost a huge client because of Jimmy, so I'd think however complicated Howard's reaction has been to Jimmy, it's safe to say he'd think Jimmy's an asshole at this point.

 

Ugh, I don't know how I managed to get those two quotes nested inside each other, and I can't seem to split them up.

@JudyObscure, I expected the same thing: that he would just say he had been reading and not paying attention.  I don't think he really wanted to "do the right thing", but he was feeling the heat and was torn between doing nothing and dropping the dime, so he slowly and reluctantly just barely summoned the will to do what the cops wanted him to.

@Clanstarling, you may be right...but Howard's reaction ("I don't even know where to begin...") suggested to me that he's not even sure whether he believes the tape.  I'm sure he doesn't think it's doctored or anything, but he may think Jimmy was just humoring his brother to bring him back from total psychological breakdown.

[ShadowFacts]

Thinking more about the Omaha mall scene with Gene and the shoplifter -- they could have just had Gene see the kid darting around and then go in the photo booth, but he sat down and wordlessly looked at Gene.  Was he seeing Slippin' Jimmy?  Or his present self, being frightened and pursued?  Or both? 

8 hours ago, knaankos said:

Is there any reason why "Gene" must live such a miserable life in Omaha? Him being scared out of his britches 24/7 doesn't seem to add up to his character. I mean eating a pathetic fixed lunch by himself on a bench? Is that really necessary? 

I'd like to know how long he's been there.  It is so far off the beam of anything Jimmy/Saul could tolerate for very long that I think he will either bust out of that or end up totally cracking up. 

[Clanstarling]

5 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

@Clanstarling, you may be right...but Howard's reaction ("I don't even know where to begin...") suggested to me that he's not even sure whether he believes the tape.  I'm sure he doesn't think it's doctored or anything, but he may think Jimmy was just humoring his brother to bring him back from total psychological breakdown.

That's a valid interpretation. It's hard to tell with Howard, which is what's so wonderful about both the performance and the writing. I think his reaction still tracks even if he believes the tape - because he's looking at a hot mess of crazy and needs to figure out how to talk Chuck down so that he doesn't inadvertently destroy the firm in his quest for vengeance.

[Ohwell]

7 hours ago, RealReality said:

The way he talks to Ernesto always makes me want to puke, he is so condescending.  I get that he is a dick to Jimmy, but I kinda understand the long standing resentment there.  But what the hell did Ernesto ever do to him?

Exactly.  

Now I'm wondering if he was condescending even to his own wife, and that's why she left him.  I remember a scene last season when they invited Jimmy to dinner and while she was preparing the food, Chuck was standing over her, giving instructions like she was a five year old. 

[peeayebee]

10 hours ago, knaankos said:

Is there any reason why "Gene" must live such a miserable life in Omaha? Him being scared out of his britches 24/7 doesn't seem to add up to his character. I mean eating a pathetic fixed lunch by himself on a bench? Is that really necessary? 

Did you see Breaking Bad? That should answer your 'scared' question.

The main thing here is that he's trying to keep a low profile. He doesn't want any attention, esp from law enforcement. 

[SlackerInc]

40 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

That's a valid interpretation. It's hard to tell with Howard, which is what's so wonderful about both the performance and the writing. I think his reaction still tracks even if he believes the tape - because he's looking at a hot mess of crazy and needs to figure out how to talk Chuck down so that he doesn't inadvertently destroy the firm in his quest for vengeance.

This is true!  And that I think is my main point: his primary reaction was not, I think, "Damn that Jimmy for sabotaging us" but rather that this is, as you say, a "hot mess of crazy" and he's just trying to think of the most diplomatic thing to say, regardless of what the truth may or may not be.

2 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

The main thing here is that he's trying to keep a low profile. He doesn't want any attention, esp from law enforcement. 

Sure, I think we all understand this.  But there are plenty of ways to have fun, without attracting the police's attention but also not turning into a pathetic milquetoast.  It's already been made clear that he didn't have to do like Walt in "Granite State" and hole up in a cabin.  He has to see members of the public all day in his job, so there's no reason he can't go out on the town in his off hours (as long as he stays away from bars that attract lowlifes and 911 calls).  Or at least go eat at nice restaurants.

[Tikichick]

9 hours ago, RealReality said:

Chuck can just never see that being "right" doesn't always equal being loved by everyone....or anyone.  His dad seemed to love Jimmy more, even thought Jimmy fucked up.  Mom asked for Jimmy, even though Chuck was the one that was there and went to law school and did everything right.

Chuck is an insufferable prick, but he is always "right."  

The way he talks to Ernesto always makes me want to puke, he is so condescending.  I get that he is a dick to Jimmy, but I kinda understand the long standing resentment there.  But what the hell did Ernesto ever do to him?

First of all, Ernesto is "beneath" Chuck.  Of course in Chuck's mind I think everyone ultimately is beneath Chuck.  Secondly, Ernesto is genuinely fond of Jimmy, so much so that he will lie to cover up for him.

 

Underneath it all I think Chuck's belief he's superior and smarter than everyone may in fact be threatened by Chuck's fear that in fact Jimmy may actually be smarter than he is as well.  That's probably another huge reason he cannot stand the fact Jimmy has become a lawyer and he has done everything in his power to cut off Jimmy from becoming successful and potentially being revealed as smarter and more successful, along with more likable. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Tikichick
Added detail

[Tikichick]

For all of the complaints about the "slowness" of this episode and nothing happening I would have to say this is one of those rare shows where the writing is so dense and rich that even the "slow" and "boring" parts where "nothing is happening", there's actually plenty happening.  It's nice to have something written for the screen in such a way that it leaves room for the viewer to watch and take in details and allow us to participate in what's happening on screen as if we're reading a beautiful narrative on the page and engage our imaginations in the deep potential of the storyline.  For most people a well written piece of material will always trump even a superbly filmed screen adaptation because it's such a high bar to reach the level of detail on screen that's possible on the page.  This episode is an example of seeing on screen that level of detail, even without splashy dramatic action taking place.

[peeayebee]

2 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

Sure, I think we all understand this.  But there are plenty of ways to have fun, without attracting the police's attention but also not turning into a pathetic milquetoast.  It's already been made clear that he didn't have to do like Walt in "Granite State" and hole up in a cabin.  He has to see members of the public all day in his job, so there's no reason he can't go out on the town in his off hours (as long as he stays away from bars that attract lowlifes and 911 calls).  Or at least go eat at nice restaurants.

One can say that we just haven't seen Gene doing fun stuff. We've seen only a few scenes from his life in Omaha, and there's no reason for BCS to show us anything superfluous. Speaking for myself, I can imagine him just being quiet and dull not only because he wants to avoid attention, but because he's practically in depression dwelling on everything he threw away and all the mistakes he's made. Anyway, I have no trouble seeing Gene as he's being presented to us.

[LoneHaranguer]

11 hours ago, RealReality said:

Mom asked for Jimmy, even though Chuck was the one that was there and went to law school and did everything right.

What's so incomprehensible to him about Mom wanting to see both of her sons? She just asked for Jimmy; she didn't tell Chuck to get lost.

[ShadowFacts]

4 hours ago, peeayebee said:

One can say that we just haven't seen Gene doing fun stuff. We've seen only a few scenes from his life in Omaha, and there's no reason for BCS to show us anything superfluous. Speaking for myself, I can imagine him just being quiet and dull not only because he wants to avoid attention, but because he's practically in depression dwelling on everything he threw away and all the mistakes he's made. Anyway, I have no trouble seeing Gene as he's being presented to us.

What they have chosen to show us is him going home to drink alone while watching old tapes of Saul commercials.  If that's what he does only once in awhile that's one thing, but the way he looks furtively around the mall in this episode, and has done in the past, makes me think he doesn't go out much.  Which is a stark contrast with the sociable, everybody-loves-Jimmy and the flashy Saul.  To me, it's an extreme picture of what Jimmy/Saul did to himself and it will be interesting to see in the end what becomes of Gene. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by ShadowFacts
spelling

[Tikichick]

4 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

What they have chosen to show us is him going home to drink alone while watching old tapes of Saul commercials.  If that's what he does only once in awhile that's one thing, but the way he looks furtively around the mall in this episode, and has done in the past, makes me think he doesn't go out much.  Which is a start contrast with the sociable, everybody-loves-Jimmy and the flashy Saul.  To me, it's an extreme picture of what Jimmy/Saul did to himself and it will be interesting to see in the end what becomes of Gene. 

What you've said here kind of clarified for me what I think may be going on with Gene in this episode.  Gene may be keeping things extremely buttoned up because he knows Jimmy given any kind of opening will be likely to go looking for fun, and that spells trouble.  After all, Gene knows better than anyone what Jimmy is capable of.

I could not reconcile Gene's behavior in this episode until I read your comment, suddenly it makes sense to me.

[RealReality]

1 hour ago, LoneHaranguer said:

What's so incomprehensible to him about Mom wanting to see both of her sons? She just asked for Jimmy; she didn't tell Chuck to get lost.

Because for Chuck to win...jimmy has to lose.  There is no other way.  His parents should only love perfect chuck  and hate bad Jimmy.  

[Tikichick]

Anybody wondering if Gene may be flying extremely low under the radar because Jimmy eventually comes to the acceptance Chuck in fact has a hatred for him and would unmask Gene if he locates him?

[LoneHaranguer]

29 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Because for Chuck to win...jimmy has to lose.  There is no other way.  His parents should only love perfect chuck  and hate bad Jimmy.

But, Mom was on her death bed. The best Chuck could have hoped for was for her to tell Jimmy off and suggest he be more like Chuck, but she was too nice and too weak, even if she really was that disappointed with him.

[knaankos]

58 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Anybody wondering if Gene may be flying extremely low under the radar because Jimmy eventually comes to the acceptance Chuck in fact has a hatred for him and would unmask Gene if he locates him?

Maybe (If Chuck is even alive by that time) but why wouldn't he be worried about that all of Breaking Bad? Even at the end of Breaking Bad when he knows he must run away he is still his old self personality wise. But once he gets to Omaha it's like he changes personality completely. 

[Tikichick]

Just now, knaankos said:

Maybe (If Chuck is even alive by that time) but why wouldn't he be worried about that all of Breaking Bad? Even at the end of Breaking Bad when he knows he must run away he is still his old self personality wise. But once he gets to Omaha it's like he changes personality completely. 

Saul in Breaking Bad is a licensed, practicing attorney.  Not yet knowing what prompts the transformation we can surmise that, while Chuck would absolutely know Saul Goodman is Jimmy McGill, he may not have the ability to inflict any legal or meaningful damage upon Saul.

Going out on a limb to suggest the events in BB that led to Saul disappearing didn't go unnoticed by Chuck and my feeling is he will do his best to exact revenge by locating and unmasking him.  I doubt whether that means legal consequences or the reprisals of other interested parties is important to Chuck.  Chuck strikes me as an individual who will take payment any way he can get it if he feels he is owed a debt.  And I firmly believe Chuck feels life owes him a debt for inflicting him with Jimmy as a brother. 

[ghoulina]

22 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

I asked the same thing. Maybe to get the cops out of way sooner? Though, in the end, he just brought more attention to himself.

That's what I was thinking. His instinct right now is to get the cops away and stay on their good side. But then his inner Saul came out and he couldn't help himself. 

 

4 hours ago, Tikichick said:

Underneath it all I think Chuck's belief he's superior and smarter than everyone may in fact be threatened by Chuck's fear that in fact Jimmy may actually be smarter than he is as well. 

I think you may be on to something. While Chuck may have more knowledge of the law, Jimmy is "smarter" in ways Chuck will never be. He is very clever and quick on his feet, very good at persuading people. I could see Chuck being envious of those traits. 

 

1 hour ago, Tikichick said:

What you've said here kind of clarified for me what I think may be going on with Gene in this episode.  Gene may be keeping things extremely buttoned up because he knows Jimmy given any kind of opening will be likely to go looking for fun, and that spells trouble.  After all, Gene knows better than anyone what Jimmy is capable of.

Yup. It's like being a recovering addict/alcoholic. If he even has one "Jimmy/Saul" moment, he's afraid his old self will come out in full force. So he better keep Gene up 24-7. 

[Tikichick]

4 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

That's what I was thinking. His instinct right now is to get the cops away and stay on their good side. But then his inner Saul came out and he couldn't help himself. 

 

I think you may be on to something. While Chuck may have more knowledge of the law, Jimmy is "smarter" in ways Chuck will never be. He is very clever and quick on his feet, very good at persuading people. I could see Chuck being envious of those traits. 

 

Yup. It's like being a recovering addict/alcoholic. If he even has one "Jimmy/Saul" moment, he's afraid his old self will come out in full force. So he better keep Gene up 24-7. 

Chuck, for all his intelligence, legal skills, diligence and attention to detail could never have uncovered the Sandpiper scheme Jimmy did.  Chuck had the ability and skills that should point to him sniffing that out in short order.

It's not the Slippin' Jimmy factor that led to the scheme being uncovered either.  Chuck realizes it too.  It was the fact that people gravitate to Jimmy, and vice versa -- something Chuck can never achieve with any amount of effort he applies.  That eats at Chuck's very essence.

[Clanstarling]

3 hours ago, LoneHaranguer said:

What's so incomprehensible to him about Mom wanting to see both of her sons? She just asked for Jimmy; she didn't tell Chuck to get lost.

I think it's likely she didn't call for Chuck because she knew he'd be there, because that's his nature. Jimmy, though much loved, wasn't particularly reliable. This exact scenario played out at my mother's deathbed, but because I never begrudged my brother's close relationship with our mother, it didn't bother me. Well, maybe a smidge. But not enough to begrudge them.

28 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Chuck, for all his intelligence, legal skills, diligence and attention to detail could never have uncovered the Sandpiper scheme Jimmy did.  Chuck had the ability and skills that should point to him sniffing that out in short order.

It's not the Slippin' Jimmy factor that led to the scheme being uncovered either.  Chuck realizes it too.  It was the fact that people gravitate to Jimmy, and vice versa -- something Chuck can never achieve with any amount of effort he applies.  That eats at Chuck's very essence.

Great observation!

Edited April 13, 2017 by Clanstarling

[ByTor]

On 4/11/2017 at 1:08 PM, MaryPatShelby said:

You must be more mechanically inclined than me, and maybe some of the earlier commenters, because I had no clue what Mike was doing.  I'm not convinced that I do now but I've appreciated the explanations. 

Haha right?  I even said to myself while watching that maybe if I knew what the hell Mike was doing I might enjoy his scenes.  I wondered how long it would take before the "this was so obvious" drum would be beaten.

[ShadowFacts]

47 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Chuck, for all his intelligence, legal skills, diligence and attention to detail could never have uncovered the Sandpiper scheme Jimmy did.  Chuck had the ability and skills that should point to him sniffing that out in short order.

It's not the Slippin' Jimmy factor that led to the scheme being uncovered either.  Chuck realizes it too.  It was the fact that people gravitate to Jimmy, and vice versa -- something Chuck can never achieve with any amount of effort he applies.  That eats at Chuck's very essence.

Chuck can only be okay with Jimmy in a subordinate position.  He was pretty happy to collaborate with him on figuring out what Sandpiper was doing wrong, and I believe Chuck came up with the interstate aspect of it.  And he was eager to help Jimmy with his wills for his elderly clients.  But he can't countenance him being an equal (nor doing embarrassing stunts). 

[Bryce Lynch]

8 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

This is true!  And that I think is my main point: his primary reaction was not, I think, "Damn that Jimmy for sabotaging us" but rather that this is, as you say, a "hot mess of crazy" and he's just trying to think of the most diplomatic thing to say, regardless of what the truth may or may not be.

Sure, I think we all understand this.  But there are plenty of ways to have fun, without attracting the police's attention but also not turning into a pathetic milquetoast.  It's already been made clear that he didn't have to do like Walt in "Granite State" and hole up in a cabin.  He has to see members of the public all day in his job, so there's no reason he can't go out on the town in his off hours (as long as he stays away from bars that attract lowlifes and 911 calls).  Or at least go eat at nice restaurants.

We don't know how much money Saul was able to take with him when he went into hiding.  He had to leave town in a hurry, the disappearer was expensive and he didn't have a barrel of money with him, like Walt.

The fact that he is working a fairly menial job suggests that he needs the money.

[SoSueMe]

I wonder if Chuck debated to himself what would hurt Jimmy more. Not telling him that their mom called for him or laying on the guilt of telling him she called and Jimmy missed it.

[Bryce Lynch]

42 minutes ago, SoSueMe said:

I wonder if Chuck debated to himself what would hurt Jimmy more. Not telling him that their mom called for him or laying on the guilt of telling him she called and Jimmy missed it.

I thought is was a combination of Chuck not wanting to hurt Jimmy by letting him know Mom had cried out for him and he wasn't there and Chuck not wanting Jimmy to have the satisfaction of knowing "Mom loved him best".   Chuck seems to specialize in mixed motives; good ones and bad ones simultaneously 

[ByTor]

On 4/11/2017 at 3:41 PM, Bryce Lynch said:

Plus, when Chuck says, "You do realize that you just confessed to a felony." Jimmy replies, "I guess, but you feel better, right?"  That would fit in perfectly with his "concerned brother going along with whatever crazy Chuck said" story.  

Which is exactly what I thought Howard was going to say...but of course did not!

[MaryPatShelby]

Chuck keeps the tape recorder and/or tape (can't remember if it's both) in a locked drawer in his desk.  He apparently keeps the key in his pocket, because we saw him use it twice; in fact it seemed to almost jingle like most people's keys do.  But...it's a KEY.  Doesn't everyone who visits Chuck have to leave their keys in the mailbox? Is this the first time we've seen a possibility that Chuck's "illness" is not real to him, but some kind of long con?

Edited April 14, 2017 by MaryPatShelby

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, MaryPatShelby said:

Chuck keeps the tape recorder and/or tape (can't remember if it's both) in a locked drawer in his desk.  He apparently keeps the key in his pocket, because we saw him use it twice; in fact it seemed to almost jingle like most people's keys do.  But...it's a KEY.  Doesn't everyone who visits Chuck have to leave their keys in the mailbox? Is this the first time we've seen a possibility that Chuck's "illness" is not real to him, but some kind of long con?

I think it is the electronic key fobs that Chuck is afraid of, not the keys themselves.  I don't think Chuck's electricity phobia is a con.  He is genuinely nuts.

[JudyObscure]

7 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

 I don't think Chuck's electricity phobia is a con.  He is genuinely nuts.

  When he tossed that battery in the air and caught it right after making poor beleaguered Ernesto come and change them for him, I once again wondered what the story was.  I don't think it's a long con -- too much trouble for too little reward -- but I wonder if Chuck is getting better all the time and not telling people.

Thinking of Chuck putting all that foil on the walls, Kim up half the night for months doing the grit work for the firm, Mike spending the morning in the desert trying to assassinate Salamanca, the afternoon and evening taking a car apart, then sitting up until 3:30 waiting for someone to come and change the bug in his car.  They all make me feel so lazy.

[ShadowFacts]

17 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

  When he tossed that battery in the air and caught it right after making poor beleaguered Ernesto come and change them for him, I once again wondered what the story was.  I don't think it's a long con -- too much trouble for too little reward -- but I wonder if Chuck is getting better all the time and not telling people.

Thinking of Chuck putting all that foil on the walls, Kim up half the night for months doing the grit work for the firm, Mike spending the morning in the desert trying to assassinate Salamanca, the afternoon and evening taking a car apart, then sitting up until 3:30 waiting for someone to come and change the bug in his car.  They all make me feel so lazy.

I think Chuck has been getting better, was going to the office with his foil-lined suit, went to the regulatory hearing, etc.  He had a major problem in the copy shop of course, but he's recovering fast from that.  His "therapy" is that he has something that is removing his focus from himself -- bringing Jimmy down.  Now that you mention it, Kim and Mike likewise have strong focuses that energize them. 

[TedisnotTed2]

It makes no sense for Gene to have talked to the cops. What if he is called as a witness if this kid claims police brutality? He should have just told the cops he didn't see the kid. That's what you do when you're on the lam! I don't see how his do it yourself witness protection can be very successful. I guess he has a fake social security number or the number of someone who died as a child, but isn't it easy for any government agency to run that number and see what contributions you've made to social security? It seems like the Gene personna would fall apart pretty fast. Wouldn't it make more sense to get out of the country? I have to confess, I don't know what Chuck is up to. Clearly he wants to blackmail or humiliate Jimmy. Is this how he gets him to change his name? And if he so badly wants to disassociate himself from Jimmy, why not insist he move to another city or state? Neither of them is from New Mexico. Also, having served many years in "prestigious" large NYC law firms, I love they way they are able to pretend that Albequerque is some kind of legal hot bed. Bring back Dennis Boustikaris and his Moscow Mule!

[LoneHaranguer]

45 minutes ago, TedisnotTed2 said:

I guess he has a fake social security number or the number of someone who died as a child, but isn't it easy for any government agency to run that number and see what contributions you've made to social security?

There was a brief uproar during the GW Bush years when it came out that the Social Security Administration was aware of millions of illegal aliens using someone else's SSN; some numbers were being used by at least 100 people. They don't pursue it because they'd rather have that extra money coming in. With the right fake number, Gene is safe; all anybody will see is a hopeless mess.

[Tikichick]

1 hour ago, TedisnotTed2 said:

It makes no sense for Gene to have talked to the cops. What if he is called as a witness if this kid claims police brutality? He should have just told the cops he didn't see the kid. That's what you do when you're on the lam! I don't see how his do it yourself witness protection can be very successful. I guess he has a fake social security number or the number of someone who died as a child, but isn't it easy for any government agency to run that number and see what contributions you've made to social security? It seems like the Gene personna would fall apart pretty fast. Wouldn't it make more sense to get out of the country? I have to confess, I don't know what Chuck is up to. Clearly he wants to blackmail or humiliate Jimmy. Is this how he gets him to change his name? And if he so badly wants to disassociate himself from Jimmy, why not insist he move to another city or state? Neither of them is from New Mexico. Also, having served many years in "prestigious" large NYC law firms, I love they way they are able to pretend that Albequerque is some kind of legal hot bed. Bring back Dennis Boustikaris and his Moscow Mule!

I think Gene lost control and Jimmy, Saul or Jimmy/Saul if you will, slipped out.   What I couldn't put together was Gene pointing out the guy to the cops in the first place until Shadowfacts' comments above made it crystallize for me.  Gene was firmly in control, observing the events taking place.  I was waiting for him to give the guy some kind of signal of what he should do, yet instead Gene wound up pointing that finger -- for the cops.  Pretty sure my mouth fell open at that point.  I just didn't get it.

Jimmy, Saul or Jimmy/Saul obviously didn't get it either and were as nonplussed as I was, maybe moreso.  That's why the blurting of the legal advice, which probably led to lots more internal drama and Gene's collapse. 

Claim of police brutality is out of question for me.  Too many witnesses, too many cameras.  Even if Gene were questioned by the police in the event of a claim being made, there's no reason for him to worry about being uncovered simply for being questioned.  He's not a suspect.

[Tikichick]

5 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

I think Chuck has been getting better, was going to the office with his foil-lined suit, went to the regulatory hearing, etc.  He had a major problem in the copy shop of course, but he's recovering fast from that.  His "therapy" is that he has something that is removing his focus from himself -- bringing Jimmy down.  Now that you mention it, Kim and Mike likewise have strong focuses that energize them. 

I feel Chuck's "illness" is entirely his psyche punishing him, a self driven malady.  That's precisely why when the distraction of raining down destruction on Jimmy's head comes along there are revelations he's not in fact organically mentally ill.  Instead he's simply fighting a battle of all consuming hatred of his brother versus underlying guilt.  His illness is the acknowledgement in his own mind that he's not in fact the saint to Jimmy's sinner he likes to hold out for the world to see.  

[Bryce Lynch]

8 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

  When he tossed that battery in the air and caught it right after making poor beleaguered Ernesto come and change them for him, I once again wondered what the story was.  I don't think it's a long con -- too much trouble for too little reward -- but I wonder if Chuck is getting better all the time and not telling people.

Thinking of Chuck putting all that foil on the walls, Kim up half the night for months doing the grit work for the firm, Mike spending the morning in the desert trying to assassinate Salamanca, the afternoon and evening taking a car apart, then sitting up until 3:30 waiting for someone to come and change the bug in his car.  They all make me feel so lazy.

Since his problem is purely psychological, Chuck can get "better" or worse depending upon his emotions and how motivated he is to deal with being bombarded with toxic EM waves.  

He seems to tolerate electricity best, when he needs to do it to bust or undermine Jimmy (whether directly or by undermining KIm). A few examples:

1) He showed up at the Sandpiper status meeting at HHM to "bear witness" and try to nail Jimmy for soliciting.

2) He went to the meeting with Mesa Verde (with full electricity) to steal them back from Kim.

3) He went to the banking board meeting for Mesa Verde and even passed through a metal detector, to keep Mesa Verde happy, though it didn't work out so well for him.

4) He went to the copy machine place, with all the electrical equipment running to try to bust Jimmy for his cut and paste scheme.

5) He operated the tape recorder to bust Jimmy.

Still, it seems clear that he thinks his affliction is real.  He wears the space blanket liner under his suit jacket, used tongs to pick up the tape recorder, cringed going through the metal detector, etc. 

[SlackerInc]

On 4/13/2017 at 1:31 PM, ShadowFacts said:

What they have chosen to show us is him going home to drink alone while watching old tapes of Saul commercials.  If that's what he does only once in awhile that's one thing, but the way he looks furtively around the mall in this episode, and has done in the past, makes me think he doesn't go out much.  Which is a stark contrast with the sociable, everybody-loves-Jimmy and the flashy Saul.

Yeah, the way he furtively holes up in his apartment would make a lot more sense for a guy who works in a role that doesn't involve much contact with the public, at least in terms of seeing his face: a nighttime cleaner, a telemarketer or CSR for something involving the elderly would be great for him.  But they felt hemmed in by the "best case" comment in Breaking Bad.  When actually, having him actually be a manager of a Cinnabon in Omaha doesn't make a lot of sense.  It was clearly meant as a sarcastic line, and there's no way he was going to tell Walt where exactly to find him!  That was just pure fanservice, and I kind of wish they had resisted the temptation, honestly.

8 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

  When he tossed that battery in the air and caught it right after making poor beleaguered Ernesto come and change them for him, I once again wondered what the story was.  I don't think it's a long con -- too much trouble for too little reward -- but I wonder if Chuck is getting better all the time and not telling people.

Wasn't it the tongs he tossed, rather than the battery?

4 hours ago, TedisnotTed2 said:

It seems like the Gene personna would fall apart pretty fast. Wouldn't it make more sense to get out of the country?

You're right--but as I said upthread, they felt they had to fanservice the flippant "Cinnabon in Omaha" comment.  They could have still included a different kind of fanservice and sent him to Belize.

[Ohwell]

15 minutes ago, SlackerInc said:

They could have still included a different kind of fanservice and sent him to Belize.

I really wish they had done this, but literally. : ) 

[ketose]

One can assume that "New Mexico school teacher becomes meth kingpin" is a story that got national attention. I wouldn't be surprised if some true crime show didn't make an episode out of Saul Goodman and where he went. Cinnabon Gene's withdrawal from the world might be what he needs to do to keep from getting the wrong attention. Look at Jimmy. He tries to go straight, hit a road block, does something a little shady and gets rewarded. Then he does things that are a LOT shady and gets in trouble. Fun Jimmy eventually becomes Slippin' Jimmy.

I'd actually like to see how Chuck developed this electricity phobia. It apparently happened after Jimmy told him about passing the bar. Was it related to crushing Jimmy in secret? Was it about Chuck's marriage?

[JudyObscure]

14 minutes ago, SlackerInc said:

Wasn't it the tongs he tossed, rather than the battery?

Well, now that you say that ... I think I "saw" a battery because, to me, it makes more sense in the scene.  I watched that twice.  My brain is not all that trustworthy.

[ghoulina]

9 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

When he tossed that battery in the air and caught it right after making poor beleaguered Ernesto come and change them for him, I once again wondered what the story was.  I don't think it's a long con -- too much trouble for too little reward -- but I wonder if Chuck is getting better all the time and not telling people.

I thought it was the tongs he was using to handle the battery that he tossed in the air? Either way, I do think Chuck has a legitimate problem - one HE believes he has. But I do think there have been times where he has used it or exaggerated it to his advantage. 

[ShadowFacts]

21 minutes ago, ketose said:

I'd actually like to see how Chuck developed this electricity phobia. It apparently happened after Jimmy told him about passing the bar. Was it related to crushing Jimmy in secret? Was it about Chuck's marriage?

I don't think we know yet when the phobia started.  He was in the midst of it when the series started and we see Jimmy putting his phone in the mailbox and going in the house, and that was before Jimmy got the news that he passed the bar.  We know that Chuck was OK when he and his wife had Jimmy to dinner, so it began sometime in the intervening years. 

[ghoulina]

I think timeline wise we do. It's been referenced several times on the show - or at least how long he was gone from the firm for. Trouble is, I can't remember it! But I know they've talked about it several times. Although, it's possible that it started, slowly, before he actually left. And yes, we definitely don't know the exact circumstances that brought it on. 

[ShadowFacts]

I might be mixed up on the timeline.  Jimmy passing the bar was probably shown in flashback and Chuck was OK then, so Jimmy becoming a lawyer might have been the major precipitating event.  I have a hard time remembering things when seasons are a year apart and I don't usually re-watch episodes. 

[ghoulina]

I know what you mean. The gap was longer this time too. I intentionally rewatched on Netflix prior to the premiere, because this show IS very complex. And even after doing that, I still forget a lot!

[ItsHelloPattiagain]

Quote

Is there any reason why "Gene" must live such a miserable life in Omaha? Him being scared out of his britches 24/7 doesn't seem to add up to his character. I mean eating a pathetic fixed lunch by himself on a bench? Is that really necessary? 

Post traumatic stress. Plain and simple. Think back to the end of BB and all the fallout with the characters - Jimmy/Saul just ran away and became invisible. What happened didn't have to happen to him to cause such fear - just the escalation and trying to outrun the Walt Machine would have freaked him out enough to run like the wind and hide. (I had PTSD years ago and it sounds like a joke, but I would get "triggered" by seeing handwriting on a letter or a certain brand of car driving by - crazy things would cause me to hyperventilate). I imagine Jimmy/Saul wouldn't really want to go into therapy to open up and share why he wants to be Mr. Invisible. 

[JudyObscure]

2 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I thought it was the tongs he was using to handle the battery that he tossed in the air?

Yes, it was the tongs.