S03.E04: Episode 4

[maraleia]

Jenny and Sister Winifred help an agoraphobic who hasn't left her flat in 12 years; Alec invites Jenny to Brighton for the weekend; and Shelagh helps bring back to life a local choir.

 

[Tara Ariano]

Here's my post on the episode! Sniffle.

[maraleia]

This show makes me cry every week and appreciate the good things that life has to offer. I love these women and the men too especially the way that they all support each other.

[kat165]

Tara, thank you for your post on the episode.

Not enough Chummy!

The sister who was reluctant to do the midwifing, I forget her name, when she smiles it lights up her entire face & makes her look beautiful.

Very sad about Jenny's boyfriend, but with the I love you last week I didn't think he was long for this world. And I wish I had something of more substance to post!

[LittleIggy]

This episode really got to me since my father died of a pulmonary embolism. He was in the hospital for phlebitis and they had put a stent in that was supposed to catch any blood clots. Like Jenny, I went home after a visit, thinking my dad would be fine. Later that day my mother called and said I needed to come to the hospital. By the time I got there, my father was dead. He was only 57.

[MaryHedwig]

This show makes me cry every week and appreciate the good things that life has to offer.

Yes.  This show is like therapy to me.  When I land back in my life (after delivering a baby with Sister Winifred), the challenges in my own life seem almost like a sacred joy to conquer.

The sister who was reluctant to do the midwifing, I forget her name, when she smiles it lights up her entire face & makes her look beautiful.

That's Sister Winifred.  She is transcendent.  But I still have a feeling there is more to her story than we know.  If I were a guy in Poplar, I would be knocking at her door...

This episode really got to me since my father died of a pulmonary embolism.

I am so sorry to hear about the loss of your father.  My heart goes out to you.  I hope the episode provided some catharsis for you.

[Charlotte Vale]

I love how they gave My Briddishe Mama every stock Yiddish word in the book: bubbelah, meshuga, schmata. "Someone check the script--has she said oy vey or mishegos yet?"

And yes, even though they too-handily wrote out Boring Boyfriend, I did weep copiously at the funeral.

[MaryHedwig]

I love how they gave My Briddishe Mama every stock Yiddish word in the book

How can a show that cuts two umbilical chords an hour be bad but I did find myself more critical of the writer than usual last night.

1.  More Chummy!  If Miranda Hart is busy, work everything else around her schedule.  If Young Sir is teething, Shelagh will be happy help you out.

2.  Let Shelagh work as a midwife. or at least have her work as a nurse alongside Dr. Turner.  Why should she be relegated to the reception at the clinic just because she is married.  Marriage is not stopping Chummy.

3.  Why is Shelagh smoking.  And her line, "I always want one, you don't always offer" to her husband was too period 50's oppression of women for my 21st centruy ears.

4.  Too convenient having dead boyfriend's parents in Ceylon.  What was the plot point of that?

5.   Our prison pastor officiated the funeral.  I don't think we have seen the last of him.

6.  Cynthia seemed less afraid of her own shadow last night.  A relief.  Her mousiness is painful to watch.

7.  I agree with the above poster that the Yiddish was a little heavy handed, especially since her daughter did not talk that way.  In fact I wondered if that whole subplot should have been run by a Jewish consultant- touching but the whole story didn't quite hand true to me.  Including, why does she want to say goodbye to Jenny, who she had never met before?

[Embron]

I really enjoyed the Jewish Mamme and daughter. The yiddish I thought made sense because the mamme hadn't left the house in so long (and it brought back some wonderful memories of my grandparent's and their friends' accents.)  The phrases they used went beyond what has become commonplace in our vernacular. 

I thought it might be a little too Good Will Hunting that a woman so scarred by horrible experiences could be "cured" so quickly, but (grand)parenthood can do that. 

It was so interesting to see the nuns interact with a Jewish family - I would love to know more about that dynamic in '50s England. I know what the US experience is from my own family, but there were probably many refugees and survivors in the UK who have fascinating stories. And that Sister Winifred knew about Shavuos is amazing.  Most Jews today wouldn't know about Shavuos. 

I love this show.

[jaytee1812]

 

2.  Let Shelagh work as a midwife. or at least have her work as a nurse alongside Dr. Turner.  Why should she be relegated to the reception at the clinic just because she is married.  Marriage is not stopping Chummy.

 

But it would stop Shelagh, not least because she is married to a doctor. Chummy and Peter (despite her upbringing) are essentially working class. In those days it wasn't uncommon for working class women to work part-time, mostly because they needed the money. A middle class doctor's wife just wouldn't work in those days. 

[olivia1]

Including, why does she want to say goodbye to Jenny, who she had never met before?

 

Wasn't Jenny helping with the delivery of the Jewish lady's grandbaby when she got the call to go back to the hospital about Alec? That's when the nun who was scared of deliveries had to go it alone. 

[Jordan Baker]

 

This show is like therapy to me

Same here. What really got to me was Sister Monica Joan's poem recitation. Oh, and the moment when Jenny sees the note about the hotel reservations (two rooms) for Gene Kelly and Debbie Reynolds. <sniff>

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm just not getting the same feeling with these new episodes for some reason. They either don't ring true, are too saccharin filled or overly tragic.  What's going on?

Why did Jenny's boyfriend have to be killed? Since Jenny was leaving, why not have her get married and move away with him?  Why all the misery and pain for Jenny?  

I must have missed Chummy at the funeral.  It seems she was not really around much and due to the horrible state Jenny was in, I would think that would be a big thing for her.  

The doctor's wife who thinks she's infertile scenes didn't appeal to me.  The early ones were overly indulgent and then the last one was heavenly. It just doesn't have the touch of previous seasons to me.  I guess adoption is out of the question, since two infants have passed through their lives and they seemed to not have the slightest interest in them.  Perhaps, the choir work is best for her.

[LittleIggy]

I assume Jenny's boyfriend died because it happened in real life. Jenny isn't leaving for good. The show is based on her memoirs. She was taking compassionate leave.

I like Chummy but in small doses. Some of her upper-crust slang sounds like something out of A Monty Python sketch.

Wasn't Jenny helping with the delivery of the Jewish lady's grandbaby when she got the call to go back to the hospital about Alec? That's when the nun who was scared of deliveries had to go it alone.

Yep, she sure was. Jenny had probably made home visits, too.

[Ohwell]

Jenny's boyfriend was so nice and earnest and in love with her, that I wasn't at all surprised that he died. *sniff*  And while Sister Monica Joan's poem to Jenny was nice, she was bordering on creepy when she was holding Jenny's hands.  I know she's got dementia, but still...

I did enjoy the Jewish family though.

[Portia]

I found the Jewish shorthand heavy-handed, too, and not just in the scenes with the mother. When the bespectacled husband was first talking about the job opportunity, I expected a little counter to appear in the corner of the screen to keep track of the "just-in-case-you-didn't-realize-they-were-Jewish" references. "Then I saw my friend Abe, the jeweler, coming out of the temple wearing a new yarmulke..."

I wish I weren't such a cynical SOB, but I couldn't help shouting, "Boom! Agoraphobia CURED" near the end.

[MaryHedwig]

I found the Jewish shorthand heavy-handed, too,

So did I but I guess it worked for other people (one of the reasons I love boards like these- to get other people's reactions).  I thought they needed to run the Jewish scenes by a consultant to check for authenticity and to de-trite them.  Those scenes felt like vaudeville to me (as you nicely pointed out with the deli example).

I wish I weren't such a cynical SOB, but I couldn't help shouting, "Boom! Agoraphobia CURED" near the end.

That also did not ring true, did it?  I do know a thing or two about agoraphobia and it can be cure quickly with the perfect set of circumstances (as can many simple phobias) but the story here just didn't hang together right.  By the way, don't those apartment houses have only common bathrooms?  So for twelve years she used a chamber pot and her daughter...you can see, one more brush was needed for that entire subplot.

And while Sister Monica Joan's poem to Jenny was nice, she was bordering on creepy when she was holding Jenny's hands.

Was that a real poem she was reciting?  It sounded good enough to be one but I came up with nothing when I googled it.  Yes, the midwives and sisters tolerate more pawing than I can (and I am a hugger).  They also tolerate more odors than I bet I can.  I think this is one of the reasons I love this show, I depicts women being what I only aspire to be.

Why did Jenny's boyfriend have to be killed?

Why was he standing on that rickety staircase without a belay?  He is an architect and should have known better- he was probably working on that building because it was deemed unsafe.  And why were they having that heated discussion when he was in such a precarious position?  His partner is also an architect and should have known better.  That is the kind of accident that happens to two 15-year-olds deciding to sneak in to make a fort- not to professionals.

Wasn't Jenny helping with the delivery of the Jewish lady's grandbaby when she got the call to go back to the hospital about Alec.

Thanks, I missed all that.  My eyes are partially closed during the crowning so my brain does not always record exactly which midwife is in the room (see my above comments of the midwives further evolved than I).

Edited April 22, 2014 by MaryHedwig

[JudyObscure]

"Jenny Kiss'd Me" by Leigh Hunt

Jenny kiss'd me when we met,

Jumping from the chair she sat in;

Time, you thief, who love to get

Sweets into your list, put that in!

Say I'm weary, say I'm sad,

Say that health and wealth have miss'd me,

Say I'm growing old, but add,

Jenny kiss'd me.

It's a favorite of mine. I love how the show makes Sister Monica Jones's random literary references sort of fit, in an odd way.

Edited April 22, 2014 by JudyObscure

[Libby96]

Well, good-bye, Alec. We hardly knew you. He certainly was a tremendously sweet, yet boring, character, wasn't he? What is it about Jenny Lee that inspires such devotion in her suitors? She is quite pretty, but she really is cold and stand-offish with the men in her life. Maybe we are supposed to think she's hesitant due to the relationship with the married doctor she had had in the past.

That being said, I do hope the actress is remaining on the show. I enjoy the friendships on the show and would hate to see that broken up. I don't want to know whether she's leaving or not, though. I'd like to watch the rest of the season unspoiled.

[LittleIggy]

As noted, the series is based on the real life Jenny's memoirs, so how could Jenny leave the series.

[barbedwire]

I too hope they go by her memories and bring Jenny back.

Does Shelagh always seem to be out of breath when she talks?  Yes, more Chummy!!  I adore Cynthia and she is cute when one side of her hair is pulled back a little.  Makes a difference.  I agree that we are probably going to see more of prison pastor.  I like gruff Sister Evangaline (sp?) and telling Jenny to eat 3 meals a day, as she leaves.  Like she was at a loss of what to say.

[Tim McD]

Sister Monica Joan's tearful recital of Jenny Kiss'd Me was one of the most poignant things I've ever seen on TV. Her dementia prohibits her from expressing her sympathy properly so she reaches back into her love of literature and poetry.

[MaryHedwig]

Does Shelagh always seem to be out of breath when she talks?

Something like that... Shelagh just does not seem comfortable in her own skin.  Laura Main (who plays Shelagh) has an incredible singing voice so they must be instructing her to talk that way.  Chummy's husband needs to have a quiet word with Dr. Turner, let your wife spread her wings more- she should not have to ask you for a cigarette (I know, I have posted about this before but I can't let that go...)

Edited April 24, 2014 by MaryHedwig

[Portia]

It's not like Shelagh and Dr. T. need any more problems, but I get the sinking feeling that someone's going to get diagnosed with emphysema or lung cancer or something. The show really wants us to notice their smoking, lately.

[JeanneH]

I had a morbid thought after watching this episode. As we all know, Vanessa Redgrave is the narrator as the voice of older Jenny. Events in this episode were driven by an ultimately fatal fall. And Vanessa Redgrave's real life daughter, Natasha Richardson, died after a fall (hit her head when she fell while skiing, sort of like F1 driver Michael Schumacher).  I know VR is an actress acting a part, but I wonder 1) if she reads the script for the episode, or just her lines for the narration, and 2) what she might have thought to see a script with events rather close to home.

 

Like I said, morbid thoughts.

[Swedish Chef]

My reading of the cigarette thing was more a) Shelagh always wants one, but tries not to smoke too often (see their interchange in Season Two) and/or b) Dr. Turner doesn't think she wants one or doesn't think she should have them. (She did have TB, after all.). He seems extremely supportive of her and kind to her, really, singing in her choir and not compounding her disappointment about her infertility with his own disappointment.

[MaryHedwig]

My reading of the cigarette thing was more a) Shelagh always wants one, but tries not to smoke too often (see their interchange in Season Two) and/or b) Dr. Turner doesn't think she wants one or doesn't think she should have them. (She did have TB, after all.). He seems extremely supportive of her and kind to her, really, singing in her choir and not compounding her disappointment about her infertility with his own disappointment.

Love your interpretation (A or B).  Thanks to you I can finally let this go. Really, I appreciate the free therapy!

[LittleIggy]

About the "agoraphobia," remember that Dr. Turner thought she might have Ménière's disease and medication could help. Maybe if her vertigo was put under control, the old lady wasn't scared to go out and possibly fall anymore.

[lucindabelle]

Your words to G-d's ear re. Jewish consultant. Sooooo many things were wrong. My mom and I just laughed when she touched the mezuzah on the way OUT. NO. red string aroung the baby's wrist! NO! Unless they are from the Middle East. Which we know they are NOT.

Not to mention having dark hair does not give you a Jewish look- she's supposed to be a German Jew! No freaking way!

But the worst, and the one that is deeply deeply offensive to people like my mother old enough to have lived through WWII were the paraphernalia, the family pictures, as if Jews escaped the Holocaust with suitcases of stuff. nazi ghettos?? Um DEATH CAMPS PEOPLE!!!! Nobody would say Nazi ghetto.m mr there was just one ghetto, it was in Warsaw, and that's not these people. And you did not have family pictures in sepia tones in silver frames.

So. Offended. Not to mention that they. Eat pickles and talk deli and use Yiddish words around people who wouldn't know the,.

So. Wrong.

Eta: don't think you should speak for "most Jews."Shavuot is still celebrated in every conservative and reform synagogue in the us, not to mention Orthodox. It's still taught in. Hebrew schools. I'm Conservative but also worked as religion editor for a local weekly so saw a lot of reform and reconstructionist up close. Shavuot involved all night study Sessions at all kinds of denominations. It you mean most Jews who don't join any synagogue and are completely secular, then agreed,they may not know the holiday, but. Jews who belong to one certainly know about it.

Edited April 24, 2014 by lucindabelle

[zoey1996]

How does having dark hair mean you can't look like a Jew from Germany (or Poland)?  I know dark-haired people of Jewish heritage whose parents were from Germany.  I will say, I thought the woman who was pregnant looked a bit Italian before I knew more about her, but I believed her as Jewish when the evidence pointed that way.  I didn't notice the red string on the baby's wrist.  I have read that Jews may touch the mezuzah whether entering or leaving the room.

 

This is the first episode that I have gotten more than a little teary-eyed over.  The loss of any young person is incredibly sad.  Jenny felt so bad that her last encounter with Alec was a fight, then he was recovering so nicely and they had mended the relationship, before suddenly he died.

 

It was nice to see Sister Winifred begin to experience the joy in helping a mother deliver her baby.  I'm sure there is more backstory there, and I'm interested in learning more.  It looks like another midwife arrives next week.  I'd think it may be difficult for the new one to fit in, as no one could easily replace Jenny, but instead will have to find her own way.

Edited April 24, 2014 by zoey1996

[lucindabelle]

I'm just saying she did not look like a Jewish woman from Poland or from Germany. It felt to me like the casting directors thought dark hair = Jewish.I'm not saying that you can't have dark hair from Germany or Poland.

I amJewish, and know many people of German and Polish descent. Half of my family, in fact, and many people in my shul.  The mother looked like she could be from Germany or Poland but the daughter did not. I don't know if Orion Ben who played the role is Jewish or not, but she didn't look like an Ashkenazi Jew, to me. When I first saw her I thought she was Indian. But that's the least of it.

I'd even accept that for some reason these German Jews (possibly Polish) from a very assimilated community do this weird thing of touching the mezzuzah when they go out. Never seen it, but OK. But the red string? No, no, no, no no. No.

And the photographs. That's just beyond.  I've met many survivors. Nobody has photographs. And if we're meant to believe they somehow saved family portraits in the cellar, or that they were waiting when they got back, that's beyond ridiculous. The camera lingered on them too, as if to say, "time to leave the past behind!" it was heavy-handed, but also, made no sense.

Edited April 24, 2014 by lucindabelle

[anna0852]

The Jewish woman and her mother were in a ghetto, from which they escaped and remained hidden until the end of the war. It is entirely possible that a family friend held their photographs for them (as Miep Gies did for the Frank family, including Anne's diary after the arrest). And ghettos existed in more cities in Warsaw. Warsaw is simply the most well known. Just about every major Polish city ended with ghettos. While they mostly held Eastern European Jews, some Western European Jews spend time in them as well before being sent to the camps.

[Gyproselee]

About the "agoraphobia," remember that Dr. Turner thought she might have Ménière's disease and medication could help. Maybe if her vertigo was put under control, the old lady wasn't scared to go out and possibly fall anymore.

I am not sure they had a cure then.My husband stuffers from Meniere's disease and they only recently found something to help him and only helps about 50% .

[Badger]

Something kind of interesting about the woman who played Mrs. Rubin in the show.  I was watching the 10th Anniversary Les Mis Concert earlier and I decided to check out who played some of the minor characters in the show.  Anyway, it turns out she was in the show.  She played the woman who bought Fantine's hair.

[lucindabelle]

It is not entirely possible that a family friend hid photos for them. But f that were the case there needed to be lines about it because it's so unlikely. The frank situation was in a different country. Do you know any Polish or German survivors that have a room full of family photographs? I don't. And I do know many (well some have since died). What's more were given lines in the show about how they went back and found everyone dead. I'm sorry but I found this representation offensive. It suggests that the Holocaust had ghettos, not death camps, that said ghettoes could be escaped merely by hiding... By a woman and a Young baby, that people recovered memorabilia and then somehow kept it through refugee camps and immigration. I find that beyond insulting. I don't think people really understand how completely bereft survivors were and this makes it seem like a relatively easy thing, they just waited it out. Then came upstairs. On top of he hat there's the mezuzah kissing on the way out, the baby's red string.... It felt like sheer tokenism to this Jewish girl and her 80- something mother.

Obviously YMMV but as. Jews we were offended by the "exotic color" for this show, and really, nobody can argue me out of that reaction. My 80- something mother first laughed and then was irritated. A few people wished they had run it by a. Jewish consultant. So do I.

I'll shut up about it now though. Unfortunately this has been the case too often with Jewish characters on British shows... Full of cliche and pointing at it.

(Imagine if. Dawn on. Mad Men sang spirituals on her break, ate soul food, had a souvenir from Africa and talked about the new funk records. Yeah, she's not a character then, she's evidence of How We Put A Black Character On The Show. Well that's how we felt about tis "Jewish" family. It's all there... Religion, Holocaust, symbols, the food.... And doing it wrong.

Edited April 25, 2014 by lucindabelle

[HerLadyship]

I am not sure they had a cure then.My husband stuffers from Meniere's disease and they only recently found something to help him and only helps about 50% .

It drives me nuts when they do stuff like this.  I love the show and I think the NHS is probably a good thing (though, not having experienced the service personally).  However, the existence of the NHS didn't magically solve all health problems in the UK.  Last week it was, "Oh, cystic fibrosis?  We can fix that now, thanks to modern medicine."  Now it's, "Oh, Meniere's disease?  We can fix that now, thanks to modern medicine."  

 

Uh show, we can't fix those problems now.

[lucindabelle]

No there was no other family. The family were all killed. Hence the not getting to say goodbye. People who escaped ghettos and death camps didn't have suitcases of possessions and memorabilia. If they'd left before the war it would be plausible but were expressly told they did not but lived in a basement. I know I said I'd stop but that question needed an answer as it demonstrated to me the harm this misrepresentation does... It's just as if you supposed Africans sold into slavery made it through with a few souvenirs of the old country that got handed down. This is exactly why I'm upset. It really waters down what happened.

Edited April 25, 2014 by lucindabelle

[Tara Ariano]

I think the speculation is that mother and daughter left before the rest of the family moved into a ghetto? Regardless: different viewers have had different interpretations of this plot point, so let's move on.

[Badger]

Where in the episode regarding the two children with cystic fibrosis did anyone say they were going to be cured?  I always thought the relief was about the fact that they finally knew what was wrong with them.  

[HerLadyship]

Not explicitly, but it was strongly implied that their parents could just given them enzymes and they would be just fine.  There was no discussion of the decreased life expectancy (though I understand that the parents were just happy that the children would be alive for the moment) or the difficulties in raising children with CF.  I would think that it would have been a very difficult diagnosis to hear.  Maybe the parents were just happy that they could put a name on what was wrong.  And that's fine.  But it would have been nice for the voiceover to have better acknowledge the seriousness of the condition.  

 

Similarly with Meriere's, it was treated like the mother could treat the condition and be just dandy.  I'm sure that she felt much better after receiving treatment.  However, it would have been nice for the show to acknowledge that is was something that the woman would have to learn to live with an manage.  

 

I don't know.  Maybe I'm reading too much into things.  But it seems to me that the patent cases have been treated a bit more like everything is just going to be rainbows and sunshine than in earlier seasons where Old Jenny was a bit more frank about long-term consequences (e.g., the brother diagnosed with cancer who dies, the women with eclampsia who loses her baby and then dies).   

[lucindabelle]

Thanks HerLadyship, the show does seem to be optimistic about what medicine can do. I agree that more complexity about a lot of things, particularly the medicine, would be helpful to the viewer just to fill things in.

[lucindabelle]

I would be willing to slow it down by a line or two, to understand that cystic fibrosis isn't easily cured, and meniere's isn't either. I find the holding back a little patronizing. It could be accomplished with just a bit of dialogue and would be much more fair to people who know something about those conditions.

[proserpina65]

Recently did a rewatch of Season 3 with someone who is new to the series, and I had the following thought about the family photographs: maybe there were the husband's family?  And it made the pregnant woman's mother sad because she had none of her own family?  It didn't strike me that the dialogue specified them being her photos.