S23.E13: Week 10

[RedFiat]

I’m still Team Stop and Go, I think James has had to overcome quite a bit this season, including dancing with another partner for two weeks. For me that is huge. Changing partners for non-dancers is probably the biggest psychological and physical adjustment they have to make. And for this week, even though dance order doesn’t mean a lot at this point, it still allowed the judges to leave room for “what was coming next” so I think it hurt James' anticipated return and that extraordinary AT a little. Unless you are a ballroom dancer I don't think people realize how difficult it was for James to lead.  They are always back led by the pro,  and of course it is rehearsed, but he had to ensure that she was in exact position on the chair for two passes, and the first lift told me this blindfold thing was legit difficult. Normally Sharna would have just moved into the lift in one solid motion, but without the use of eyesight, there was her doing a centre spot then go lift, she put a helluva lot of trust in James - a non-dancer to pull that off. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[CED9]

10 hours ago, Callaphera said:

There's something about Jenna that bugs me. When Sharna is dancing and looks at the camera, she tends to give this cat eye, smouldering, sexy look that works for her. But when Jenna does it (and she seems to do it frequently), it comes across as desperate. "I'm sooo hot, guys. Like, totally. Just look at me. Don't you think I'm sooo hot?"

The end was interesting. Calvin had a smile on his face, completely unworried about the result, and Terra was already grimacing and looking down. Almost like they already knew...

I call bullshit on about half the scores tonight.

Just from behind the scenes social media stuff this season, I have a feeling that if James and Sharna didn't feel so obligated to pick Jenna, Emma would've been their trio partner.

[RedFiat]

5 hours ago, Morrigan said:

Gleb is a sloppy dancer. In his season in the UK, he dropped three different partners, and one of them was unable to appear on the tour because of it. I think he's also leading whatsername on because showmances are the key to making it on these crappy shows.

Wow  I am surprised that he is even on as pro.  Good looks should never trump stupidity when you can seriously hurt a contestant.  I'm glad he wasn't blindfolded, he'd do more than slip.  Truth is, when you are a ballroom dancer solely, you haven't had much training in lifts, because lifts are a no no in competition. We know he's only a ballroom dancer by his jazz choreography. Cross trained pros have a lot more comfort with lifts.  

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[Primetimer]

The judges love the trio dances so much, they award perfect 30s to each couple, but one duo still has to go home before next week's finals.

View the full article

[MerBearHou]

I'm reading that Val knew 2 days before Laurie did about her grandmother's death and he was one of the ones to tell her.  What??  Her DWTS partner??  Just bizarre, IMO.  

Glen and Jana creep me out.  Every time she looks at him with "I'm so into you" eyes and when she cries with stupid tears running down her cheek without wiping them off (major pet peeve of mine), she seems quite manipulative.  I hate showmances, and especially when one is married and one has a documented bad history of relationships.  These two creep me out and I wish they were long gone from the show.

My wish:  James and Sharna for the win.

[RedFiat]

43 minutes ago, MerBearHou said:

I'm reading that Val knew 2 days before Laurie did about her grandmother's death and he was one of the ones to tell her.  What??  Her DWTS partner??  Just bizarre, IMO.  

Now THAT Reeks of manipulation.  http://people.com/tv/laurie-hernandez-grandmother-death-secret/

If Laurie had of found out when her FAMILY did,  then maybe just maybe she could have had a bit more time to process her feelings. Instead exploit a kid crying on national television, The sick thing is I bet  the show filmed her talking about her Grandma hoping to see her again when  she probably already died.  Lauries Grandma passed away a day after the interview? Seriously ?Grandma dying came out of the blue but how convenient for the show to have a package about Grandma all tied up in a little bow. Ugh..  Val Chmerkovskiy knowing before her? Is this the Russian gymnastics team or a dance show?  I don't blame Laurie, but I sure as hell think Val made a decision that had nothing to do with Laurie and everything to do with winning. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[McManda]

The recap had this to say about Terra's trio with Artem (and how her dress should have had more vibrancy): "I keep losing her and watching Artem instead."

Me too, recapper. Me too.

Edited November 15, 2016 by McManda

[vavera4ka]

My first reaction is to give people benefit of the doubt. We all see how protective and caring Val is of Laurie. I can see that decision not to tell her coming from that place to let her focus on the task instead of falling apart too early. They also were able to  just come up with a beautiful dance that was just that: beautiful dance. Instead of "pearly gates" stuff Sasha came up with for dead father... It was a dedication to Grandmother, but not about her.

Family agreed to it apparently. THEY chose to tell Val first.

[Michel]

11 hours ago, gimmeegimmeegim said:

J and G, sitting in the back row,

Just can't get them off the show.

Go, go , go, go , go, go , go.

Please don't show yo faces no mo!

You know what?  For this alone, I am glad they made it.  I've liked Jana from the beginning and have been okay with Gleb, and if this is the reaction they're gonna keep getting?  I hope they keep frustrating those who watch them till the very end.  They won't win -- it's obvious that either Laurie & Val or James & Sharna will take this -- but I'd love them to get past next Monday's elimination.

They're here fair and square.  The object of the game is to get the fans' votes.  They did that.  They've done that week in and week out, so they deserve to be here.  Plain.  And.  Simple.

[RedFiat]

I just think of all the 16-17 year olds on this show. None of them have ever had family information with held from them so that they could get votes.  Clearly the show was exploiting Grandma  anyway because of the stock video they had of Laurie visiting her.  There is nothing protective or caring about that. Nor was there anything protective or caring about putting a dead Grandma in the video package before you're about to dance. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[saber5055]

That was a good show last night, mainly because I never watch the judges or listen to their BS. It greatly improves my enjoyment of the packages and the dances. I have a mad crush on James, WOW to just everything about him. Man of my dreams. And that first dance ... zowie. Terra was hilarious flirting with Artem, and I totally agree with the recap ... her trio was Artem-centric for me. So thanks for that, show, and sorry to see Terra leave before Jana, whose appeal I just can't. Laurie's trio with Maks was cool in that it was a realistic story within a dance. What fun. Hated the grandmother announcement on national tv (RIP). I also did not like James dancing first and Laurie in that "p" position. Still, a better show than most. And oh yeah, Calvin was too funny with the two "Dumb and Dumber" dancers. He is the first footballer I like.

[laredhead]

I am rooting for James and Sharna.  After Carrie Ann gave them a 9 on the first dance, I rewatched it 4 times(!) and I never did see a wobble.  Maybe there was something she saw from her angle that the camera did not catch, but I could not detect any mistakes.  James has been such a surprise this season because he has never had dancing, acting, or gymnastics training and his performances have been great.  Gleb and Jana are my least favorite couples of the remaining four.      

[Vinyasa]

Finally Terra is gone.  Long over due.

[RedFiat]

2 minutes ago, laredhead said:

I am rooting for James and Sharna.  After Carrie Ann gave them a 9 on the first dance, I rewatched it 4 times(!) and I never did see a wobble.  Maybe there was something she saw from her angle that the camera did not catch, but I could not detect any mistakes.  James has been such a surprise this season because he has never had dancing, acting, or gymnastics training and his performances have been great.  Gleb and Jana are my least favorite couples of the remaining four.      

I agree that first dance was downplayed and I the only reason I could see is they are trying to make some other couples happen. 

[Matryoshka]

I don't get anything from that article but Val being part of the decision making process about when to tell Laurie, not that it was ultimately only his decision or that he was the one to tell her.  It sounds to me like it was her family's decision, not one I think I'd make, but not some grand manipulative conspiracy either. YMMV.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Matryoshka

[RedFiat]

YMMV  of course the family is to blame for allowing a woman who is dying of a disease where she has no capacity to consent to be on camera. And it's just damn creepy for your dance teacher to tell you Grandma died. He doesn't know Grandma, he never even met Grandma. But I mainly fault the show for having the audacity to think that it is normal that a dance show had any right to exploit a very personal family tragedy on a 16 year old.  Perhaps if she was older she would never have allowed her family or the show to manipulate her like this.  No wonder young people in the spot light from an early age so often get emancipated from their family. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[McManda]

41 minutes ago, Michel said:

They're here fair and square.  The object of the game is to get the fans' votes.  They did that.  They've done that week in and week out, so they deserve to be here.  Plain.  And.  Simple.

Sort of. I'd agree that the object of the game is to get fan votes and I guess they've done that (though we don't know for sure because they'll never release those numbers), but the judges have been propping Jana up hard core. Like last night, a perfect 30 for a dance that had wobbles and slips (mostly from Gleb, but it wouldn't be the first time a celeb dancer has points deducted for something out of their control) and a lift that Carrie Anne didn't even so much as comment on, which should have been an automatic point deduction.

Compare that to James, who had "some wobbles" that no one else can see ... and he gets a nine? 

The powers that be want Jana in the finals, and sure, she's not an awful dancer so they could have done worse. Personally I think she's just uninspiring and I find I'm bored by her dancing and she got stuck with an unfortunate partner. I'm still wondering why they brought Gleb back. 

[janerazor]

Terra flirting with Artem was hilarious, and although I did like her dances this week, I wasn't sorry to see her go. I started out the season thinking I'd hate her, but she grew on me.

I hated the arms-in-the-wall thing in Calvin's dance. I thought it was visually creepy, and not in a good way. But I still love Calvin, though I don't think he's the best dancer left.

James's AT was sexy and clever and somehow remarkably honest and artistic. I loved it. I wasn't overly fond of his trio, but then again, sometimes it feels like trios get so bunched-up looking, as if the dancers are about to bump into each other. But that's a critique of all the trios, not just his.

Well, all the trios except for Laurie's because the story line let the three space themselves out more. That dance was my favorite of the night.

So did Gleb mess up in his and Jana's first dance? I'm left feeling a bit bad for her. I don't dislike her as a dancer or a person, but even now I can barely remember that she's on the show.

Tom was so kind with Laurie after her first dance. I'm not totally naive with an expectation that celebrities are exactly as awesome they present themselves. But if I ever find out that Tom is actually a horrible person, I will be utterly heartbroken. He seems like such a caring, kind man. It feels very genuine coming off of my TV screen, so I hope that is how he really is.

[boyznkatz]

24 minutes ago, RedFiat said:

YMMV  of course the family is to blame for allowing a woman who is dying of a disease where she has no capacity to consent to be on camera. And it's just damn creepy for your dance teacher to tell you Grandma died. He doesn't know Grandma, he never even met Grandma. But I mainly fault the show for having the audacity to think that it is normal that a dance show had any right to exploit a very personal family tragedy on a 16 year old.  Perhaps if she was older she would never have allowed her family or the show to manipulate her like this.  No wonder young people in the spot light from an early age so often get emancipated from their family. 

Well you have to wonder about any family who even allows their child to be on a show like this and allow him/her to dance with someone the age of their mom/dad. I'm not saying that Val or any other dancer on the show has ever done anything inappropriate, but I wouldn't want my teenagers doing sexy dances with some 30 year old woman no matter how nice she was. And seeing poor Willow Shields bawl when she was eliminated was enough for the show to have the common sense to say "enough already" to child contestants who aren't ready for this.

Edited November 15, 2016 by boyznkatz

[RedFiat]

Agreed. If the show is going to go there, then it's fine if Jana wants to talk about her failed marriages and whatever, it's okay for James to talk about his accident, but it just isn't okay for a show to deliberately get a child to cry on camera because she's grieving.  There is a complete lack respect no matter how well meaning family?  and it's because she's young and others including the show that really doesn't care are making bad decisions for her. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[LadyMustang65]

When I saw what the dances were going to be this week, I was they wanted Terra to go because I thought a rumba would be very hard for her, and a trio tango rarely works well.  I was right about Terra leaving, but boy was I wrong about the dances.  I didn't think her rumba was all that - she did better than I expected, but the praise and the perfect score was over-the-top for me.  I would have given her the 26 that Calvin got.  But mad props to Sasha and Artem for that tango.  Holy cow!  I loved the way the two guys danced around her - whoever said they were framing her was right.  I kept getting pulled towards Artem - man I love to watch him dance, but I thought that tango was excellent. 

I thought the 26 for Calvin on his first dance was low.  I know there was a mess-up, but they recovered well and didn't miss a beat.  And it was otherwise very well done.  Carrie Ann went overboard with the 8.  They didn't deserve that.

I thought it was interesting that it was Gleb who messed up twice in their first dance.  But I had to go back and check what they did before I remembered it.  Jana dances well, but by the end of the night, I've forgotten she's there, and I rarely remember any of her dances. I don't know why, but it happens every week.  Every after the Flashdance rip-off - you'd think I'd have remembered the shower, but the next morning, I didn't.

As much as I love James, I have to admit I did not care for that AT much.  The blindfold didn't seem to serve any real purpose, and it's been done a couple of times before.  I kind of understood what CAI was saying - I mentioned to my dh during the number that it felt "off" somehow - a bit constrained maybe?  Not as confident and almost careful.  And the handstand at the end, while cool, seemed very odd and out of place in an AT.  For me it was good but not great. 

His jive was awesome, though.  I thoroughly enjoyed that.  I loved Laurie's trio as well.  Laurie was amazing, Val was amazing, Maks is still the smoothest dancer ever - he just glides over the floor like silk over glass.  Loved it.  Absolutely loved it.  I've already mentioned Terra's tango.  That choreography was amazing, and oh how I've missed Artem.  He's another one I love watching move across the floor.  I just can't (but in a good way) with Calvin and the amazing lifts.  Yes, he's strong, but it takes way more than just strength to be able to do them so effortlessly.  It takes a great amount of coordination as well.  Another fun fun dance.  Jana's paso trio was probably my least favorite, but it was still well done.

This has turned out to be a really great season.  Not really any celebs to hate, all of them acquitted themselves fairly well - even the weaker dancers didn't suck, only a couple of 4th wheel judges who have no idea what they're talking about.  I've thoroughly enjoyed this season.  We're down to a final four where, while I have my favorites in Laurie first and James second, I could still enjoy a Calvin win and feel that Jana, while she never really stood out, would be a deserving winner.  So, Yay!! 

I am so looking forward to the freestyles next week.  I am expecting some awesome and creative things. 

[penbrat]

My two favorite dances of the night were the James and Sharna AT and Val/Laurie/Maks trio dance.   Carrie Ann, as usual, was tripping for some of the scores she gave but she is just being herself.    Cannot wait for Len to come back.  

I really enjoyed the Val/Laurie/Maks dance.  I thought it was fun.  But I am hoping for a James upset of Laurie for the winner, as I just love his attitude and his partnership with Sharna.  But I am perfectly fine with a Laurie win (or if Calvin would sneak into the top 2, which I don't see happening, I would be fine with that also).    Calvin has a great attitude and Laurie seems like a sweet young lady.

Jana v. Terra - eh.  I am not really interested in either one.  I think I might like Jana more if she would have been paired with  Mark or someone who could bring a little more personality out of her.  Gleb as a pro I am not digging.   Terra has done well, and I liked her more than I thought I might, but that is mostly because of Sasha.  He has shined for me this season with his partnership with Terra.  He is a sweetheart.   I think I might have liked Terra more if I had not seen some clips of her on her "reality show".  She is awful on there.  If this is real her on DWTS (and I hope it is) then she is a really good actress on her show.

And only because it cannot be said enough - Tom is the heart and soul of this show and I adore him.   Erin?  Please shut up.  And please quit talking about your partnership with Maks and your time on the show which seems like a million years ago.

Edited November 15, 2016 by penbrat

[RedFiat]

The blindfold has never been done all the way through the dance by the Pro.  The blindfold of Bindi or Erin or Nyle was done for maybe 20 seconds and they are the celebrities, and need to be led .  But here,  James was leading this dance, and the blindfold proved it. This Argentine Tango was the most authentic I've seen in a long time, it's not supposed to be some sort of aggressive attack, it's supposed to be a romantic dance that is improvisational in feel.  What Val does on this show is a disservice to authentic Argentine.  It's too staccato, too aggressive like a paso doble, and it was never intended to be that way. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[CED9]

41 minutes ago, McManda said:

The powers that be want Jana in the finals, and sure, she's not an awful dancer so they could have done worse. Personally I think she's just uninspiring and I find I'm bored by her dancing and she got stuck with an unfortunate partner. I'm still wondering why they brought Gleb back. 

It's Gleb that they want to make happen, not Jana. With Maks out, and possibly Derek and Mark, too, they want him to stick around as long as possible.

[SophiaPehawkins]

5 hours ago, vibeology said:

Small point, but you don't immigrate from Puerto Rico, just like you don't immigrate from Oregon or Maine. It's part of the United States.

I get the technicality, but I think the comparison lacks as PR is a territory with a different language and culture. I guess my larger point is that one has to assimilate into a new country/territory.

[katha]

Tough decisions needed to be made regarding Laurie this week and there weren't going to be easy solutions. They probably told her Friday because she was back home in NJ on Friday, so that was better than telling her when she's isolated (apart from her mom, who seems to be around all the time?) in LA. I haven't seen anywhere that Val was the one to tell her or that he made unilateral decisions, just that he and the family decided it was better to wait till Friday until she was in NJ (and probably also to get the press obligations they had in NY out of the way).

Her whole package was going to be about family, her roots, her grandma and Alzheimer anyway. That was planned beforehand, hence also the costumes in purple. Then her grandma sadly died a few days before this was aired, so they needed to add that. They couldn't very well pretend that she hadn't died.

I'm sure her family (and Val) made the decision they thought was best for Laurie's well-being, and since no one knows any kind of circumstances or context, I'd say it's impossible to judge if it was the "right" one. In such sad circumstances there probably isn't a right decision anyway.

Edited November 15, 2016 by katha

[Callaphera]

3 minutes ago, katha said:

Her whole package was going to be about family, her roots, her grandma and Alzheimer anyway. That was planned beforehand, hence also the costumes in purple. Then her grandma sadly died a few days before this was aired, so they needed to add that. They couldn't very well pretend that she hadn't died.

No, they really couldn't. But what they could have done was edited that package differently. You could tell when watching it that they had a package ready to go, no mention of the death, and then the black screen comes up abruptly and the message about her grandmother passing away. Then it goes it that shot of her sobbing on Val... and then we're back to smiles and dancing and talking about how awesome Laurie is... and then a final "I'm so proud of you" message from Grandma. 

They didn't need to drop that black screen in the three quarter mark of the package and have that shot of her crying before continuing on. The package would have been just as good if they had continued on as it was supposed to, then drop the black screen in there and the "I'm so proud of you" message at the very end. No crying shot, nothing like that. Then maybe I wouldn't have felt that familiar "Are they trying to manipulate me into having *gasp* feelings?".

That crying shot was unnecessary, kind of exploitative, and (for me at least) where that manipulation kind of comes from. Without the shot of her sobbing, I think the package would have been all right and I don't think I would feel that way. But come on, Dancing with the Stars. We all know death is horrible - although sometimes welcome in cases of long suffering and disease - and death is sad, but we understand that without having a teenage girl who seems emotionally younger than her physical age, crying on her dance partner/teacher. 

[katha]

Well, yes, but DWTS has always been a sadistic mess that doesn't have much scruples about producing "drama" out of vulnerabilities and tragedies. Agree that the black screen and cut to Laurie crying was unnecessary, but I liked the rest of the package and they have done way worse (I'm still getting rage blackouts thinking about Sadie's rumba package). But her family and Val? They probably did what they thought was best in a very difficult situation and I certainly won't judge them for it, I don't know the circumstances and what considerations went into doing it that way.

[Vinyasa]

Quote

Well you have to wonder about any family who even allows their child to be on a show like this and allow him/her to dance with someone the age of their mom/dad. I'm not saying that Val or any other dancer on the show has ever done anything inappropriate, but I wouldn't want my teenagers doing sexy dances with some 30 year old woman no matter how nice she was.

Exactly! I know this show wants a young audience to also watch but 16 is too young to be on this show. I couldn't help but think that during the dance with James, Sharna and what's her name. All these outfits are too much on this show and the show knows it. 

These dances all seem like free styles and the classic ballroom dancing is a thing of the past.

[thefog]

Val?  His priority is his own ego to win - and he will do whatever it takes.  He's no life coach for Laurie as he claims.   She's sadly been manipulated her whole life.  It's all about competing and putting on a game face.  While sacrificing growing up, getting an education.  Sorry, DWTS is not the prom.  And I agree that the crying shot was exploitation.

[peach]

1 hour ago, RedFiat said:

The blindfold has never been done all the way through the dance by the Pro.  The blindfold of Bindi or Erin or Nyle was done for maybe 20 seconds and they are the celebrities, and need to be led .  But here,  James was leading this dance, and the blindfold proved it. This Argentine Tango was the most authentic I've seen in a long time, it's not supposed to be some sort of aggressive attack, it's supposed to be a romantic dance that is improvisational in feel.  What Val does on this show is a disservice to authentic Argentine.  It's too staccato, too aggressive like a paso doble, and it was never intended to be that way. 

This is why I think James deserves to win.  None of the other contestants could lead their own dances, IMO.  Laurie's dancing is very, very good, but she's still young and in Val's hands, so to speak.  James comes across as more of an equal with his partner compared to the others.  James and Sharna always seem like a true couple, true partners, instead of two people dancing well at the same time.

[RedFiat]

26 minutes ago, katha said:

Well, yes, but DWTS has always been a sadistic mess that doesn't have much scruples about producing "drama" out of vulnerabilities and tragedies. Agree that the black screen and cut to Laurie crying was unnecessary, but I liked the rest of the package and they have done way worse (I'm still getting rage blackouts thinking about Sadie's rumba package). But her family and Val? They probably did what they thought was best in a very difficult situation and I certainly won't judge them for it, I don't know the circumstances and what considerations went into doing it that way.

 I am going to judge them for it.  Whose idea was it to put a dying Alzheimer's patient on camera?  We know that woman would have had no capacity to consent being on camera.   Any decent producer should have gone with a completely different package.  They chose manipulation instead.  

[St. Claire]

I will confess to blubbering like a fool at Laurie's package, since I just lost my father-in-law to Alzheimer's last month. But the idea that she didn't find out until days later, and from Val?! Ugh. 

I was ready for Terra to go (although I would have been fine with Jana going instead), I do appreciate that the trio dance gave us a chance to have Artem back on the floor. I do greatly enjoy watching that man dance. 

[gohawks]

4 hours ago, RedFiat said:

Now THAT Reeks of manipulation.  http://people.com/tv/laurie-hernandez-grandmother-death-secret/

If Laurie had of found out when her FAMILY did,  then maybe just maybe she could have had a bit more time to process her feelings. Instead exploit a kid crying on national television, The sick thing is I bet  the show filmed her talking about her Grandma hoping to see her again when they damn well knew she died.  Lauries Grandma passed away a day after the interview? My ass. Grandma dying came out of the blue but how convenient for the show to have a package about Grandma all tied up in a little bow. Ugh..  Val Chmerkovskiy knowing before her? Is this the Russian gymnastics team or a dance show? This show is disgusting.  I don't blame Laurie, but I sure as hell think Val made a fucked up decision, and if he didn't have in the back of his mind this opportunity to get votes, then I'm a monkey's uncle.

5 hours ago, RedFiat said:

Wow  I am surprised that he is even on as pro.  Good looks should never trump stupidity when you can seriously hurt a contestant.  I'm glad he wasn't blindfolded, he'd do more than slip.  Truth is, when you are a ballroom dancer solely, you haven't had much training in lifts, because lifts are a no no in competition. We know he's only a ballroom dancer by his jazz choreography. Cross trained pros have a lot more comfort with lifts.  

 

4 hours ago, RedFiat said:

Now THAT Reeks of manipulation.  http://people.com/tv/laurie-hernandez-grandmother-death-secret/

If Laurie had of found out when her FAMILY did,  then maybe just maybe she could have had a bit more time to process her feelings. Instead exploit a kid crying on national television, The sick thing is I bet  the show filmed her talking about her Grandma hoping to see her again when they damn well knew she died.  Lauries Grandma passed away a day after the interview? My ass. Grandma dying came out of the blue but how convenient for the show to have a package about Grandma all tied up in a little bow. Ugh..  Val Chmerkovskiy knowing before her? Is this the Russian gymnastics team or a dance show? This show is disgusting.  I don't blame Laurie, but I sure as hell think Val made a fucked up decision, and if he didn't have in the back of his mind this opportunity to get votes, then I'm a monkey's uncle.

It has highly unlikely Val made the decision about when to tell Laurie about her Grandma.  The article does not say hewas the one who told her. Red Herring. It was more than likely her family's decision.

Laurie is a sweet seemingly well adjusted kid. she has a strong support system in her family and I will defer to their opinions.  I stopped being overly judgemental about how other people parent their kids when I had a kid of my own.

Edited November 15, 2016 by gohawks

[mrsmit7]

No where in any article does it say Val was the one to tell Laurie her Grandma died, that's just silly he's not her family, just like there's no way Val could hide the fact that her grandmother died IF her family wanted her to know, theyre her family. From articles I read, it sounds like the family initially might have wanted to withhold the news from Laurie, so she could focus on the competition, and Val played a small part in a discussion with the family that it might not be best to withhold that information. Yes, its terrible that her grandmother passed, and its worse that it happened during the competition while she's away from home, but it would have been the ABSOLUTE worst if they would have waited until the competition ended, so she could focus, to tell her that her grandmother passed an entire 2 weeks ago. So I cannot fault Val or her family in how they handled it, they did the best the could, its tuff all around.

TPTB on the other hand will be what they always have been, eager to capitalize on any drama, this is nothing new for them.

[RedFiat]

 Gee it feels awful weird that we have a dead Grandma video package.and somehow her dance coach who she only met a couple of months ago knows about her beloved grandma's death 2 days before she does. There is no reason why Laurie could not have learned of this on Wednesday and dealt with it. So  Why? The show  knows why , because the show has to make all the slicing and dicing they are doing with this package to make it look authentic.  Manipulative as all get for votes.  I still think it is beyond decency to put a dying Alzheimers patient on camera someone who is relying on others for consent in such matters . If the family is okay with that, I'm not okay with the family.

Edited November 15, 2016 by RedFiat

[iMonrey]

I think either Calvin or Terra could have gone home tonight. Calvin sort of peaked a few weeks ago and isn't going to get any better. Terra has her own limitations for obvious reasons.

Jana is a good dancer but she has the least compelling "story" this season. Her parents divorced when she was in high school, then she got into a bad relationship. Um, okay . . . so? And, who is she really, anyway? A singer? Has anyone ever heard of one of her songs before? Does she perform in her own concerts? Or is she the opening act for someone else?

I think I figured out what's missing from Laurie's dances: they're all really, really aggressive. She attacks each of them like a floor routine. They're all sharp and precise and difficult but they're all fast and manic and they lack softness. The foxtrot, in particular needed to be a little more elegant and graceful and not as sharp and manic. 

I'd have pegged Laurie as the winner from Day 1 but now I'm not so sure. James might take it from her. I doubt the show used her recent loss to prop her, she probably doesn't need that, but yeah - the show is definitely not above milking a tragedy just for the sake of the drama. Like the judges could give her anything but 10s after that, y'know?

[katha]

3 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I think either Calvin or Terra could have gone home tonight. Calvin sort of peaked a few weeks ago and isn't going to get any better. Terra has her own limitations for obvious reasons.

I think I figured out what's missing from Laurie's dances: they're all really, really aggressive. She attacks each of them like a floor routine. They're all sharp and precise and difficult but they're all fast and manic and they lack softness. The foxtrot, in particular needed to be a little more elegant and graceful and not as sharp and manic.

Calvin has sort of reached his limit, hasn't he? Though what he does well he does really well, like the salsa. I thought that was a highlight of the night, perhaps not the most technically accurate, but it sure was fun. In that sense, I think he's more compelling than Jana. Jana's always good, but I seldom find her the standout, even when she gets perfect scores.

I don't mind Laurie's sharpness and don't agree that it's all she does, but yeah, it's kinda their style. But I'd argue that it's not only Laurie, this is Val's aesthetic in general. His best partners usually perform in a sharp, fast, precise way. You had it with Zendaya, with Rumer, with Tamar to a degree, and now with Laurie. So it's probably a mix of her heading in that direction on her own anyway and Val's own preferences.

[boyznkatz]

I'd be surprised if Laurie lost. She has both the charisma and skill. Calvin is exciting, but he is probably the worst dancer left. James and Jana are good, but they are boring to me personality-wise. The four left are the ones I would have picked for the final, though. It should be good.

[RedFiat]

20 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I think I figured out what's missing from Laurie's dances: they're all really, really aggressive. She attacks each of them like a floor routine. They're all sharp and precise and difficult but they're all fast and manic and they lack softness. The foxtrot, in particular needed to be a little more elegant and graceful and not as sharp and manic. 

 

Excellent observation. That dance did not feel like a foxtrot, partly because Val does pretty aggressive Foxtrots and I agree they are very sharp and exacting. I also don't like his Argentine Tangos for the very same reason. He has this notion that Argentine is ballroom tango, and it isn't. But he never danced Argentine Tango before season 16.  He never danced it professionally or in competition but it's his ballroom training that comes through.  

But Val can do a soft Foxtrot when he wants to, he just finds that in Laurie he will exploit her  exacting gymnastics dance background instead of really giving us a Foxtrot.  In season 16 we got a lovely flowy Foxtrot from that other 16 year- old, Zendaya  

[vibeology]

32 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Jana is a good dancer but she has the least compelling "story" this season. Her parents divorced when she was in high school, then she got into a bad relationship. Um, okay . . . so? And, who is she really, anyway? A singer? Has anyone ever heard of one of her songs before? Does she perform in her own concerts? Or is she the opening act for someone else?

Jana isn't my favourite but she's a country singer, sort of a mid-level one. She opens at big venues or is the headliner at smaller venues. I saw her a few years back open for Blake Shelton. Her biggest his is probably "Why Ya Wanna" which is the first song I think of when I think of her. It was a top ten country hit, charted on the Billboard Hot 100 and won her an ACA or a CMA.

One thing I'll say about Jana is that she majorly downplayed a potential sob story last night. Her first marriage wasn't just a bad relationship; it was downright terrifying. That first husband ended up in prison for attempted murder. I get why she might not want to make that a part of her story to get votes and win a mirrorball trophy.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I hated the arms-in-the-wall thing in Calvin's dance. I thought it was visually creepy, and not in a good way.

Oh yeah - I wanted to mention that too. I kept waiting for one of those hands to grab him in just the wrong spot.

I also agree with the recap that it felt like Maks and Val "cheated" a little bit with the trio dance because Maks completely stepped out of it for huge chunks where it was just Laurie and Val dancing. The number was tons of fun but not as much of a "trio" as the other ones were.

Also, I agreed that Calvin could have done more actual dancing in his trio number and less lifting tricks. The bit of dancing he did at the end was fantastic, and it's the kind of thing he really excels at like when he did the jive a couple weeks ago. I wish I could have seen more of it.

[realdancemom]

50 minutes ago, mrsmit7 said:

No where in any article does it say Val was the one to tell Laurie her Grandma died, that's just silly he's not her family, just like there's no way Val could hide the fact that her grandmother died IF her family wanted her to know, theyre her family. From articles I read, it sounds like the family initially might have wanted to withhold the news from Laurie, so she could focus on the competition, and Val played a small part in a discussion with the family that it might not be best to withhold that information. Yes, its terrible that her grandmother passed, and its worse that it happened during the competition while she's away from home, but it would have been the ABSOLUTE worst if they would have waited until the competition ended, so she could focus, to tell her that her grandmother passed an entire 2 weeks ago. So I cannot fault Val or her family in how they handled it, they did the best the could, its tuff all around.

TPTB on the other hand will be what they always have been, eager to capitalize on any drama, this is nothing new for them.

ITA.  The article does not state that Val was the one to tell Laurie that her grandma died.  Both he and the family decided when to tell her the news.  That's it.

I only watch each dance once and don't replay them.  So I didn't see any wobbles in James and Sharna's AT.  However, I thought the blindfold was a gimmick that didn't add anything to the dance.  Instead both of them danced more timidly than they normally would have.  I also didn't see the purpose of the handstand at the end even though it did show a lot of strength and looked cool.  It didn't fit the mood of an AT just like Calvin/Lindsey's cartwheel lift which looked cool but didn't match the AT mood.

Sasha has done so well choreographing for Terra's limitations.  I also thought it would be difficult to choreograph the rumba but he did a good job. 

Gleb did slip twice and it looked messy.  I didn't even realize that there was a story about shoes until Tom mentioned it.  That means that his choreography did not stick out to me.

I think Calvin and Lindsay sometimes look frantic because of his height.  Lindsay doesn't choregraph frantic routines like Allison.  But his legs are so long that Lindsay really needs to move fast and wide to keep up.  I think that's part of the reason why there was a mess-up.  It started to look too fast before that.

I'm glad Val was covering up Laurie's ears during her package.  I was wondering how she would be able to dance after that.   I did see her tear and it's amazing that she didn't lose count when she did that.  She's very strong mentally for her age but that makes sense with her Olympic background.  She does dance very precise and aggressive.   I mentioned that last week.  It fit perfectly with her AT but not so much with contemporary where you have to dance with abandon and loosen up.  Val also does tend to like staccato choreography.

This was the first season where all the trio dances were great.  There wasn't a star left where the choreography had to be dumb down or looked awkward.  I think James/Sharna/Jenna was the best especially the way he transitioned between them..  I also liked Laurie and Val but for the samba elements not necessarily the choreography since Maks was out of a lot of it.

[boyznkatz]

17 minutes ago, vibeology said:

 

One thing I'll say about Jana is that she majorly downplayed a potential sob story last night. Her first marriage wasn't just a bad relationship; it was downright terrifying. That first husband ended up in prison for attempted murder. I get why she might not want to make that a part of her story to get votes and win a mirrorball trophy.

Yes, she was in People magazine and talked about her ex. I'm not really a fan of hers, but I do have to admire her for getting out there on a show like this after he tried to kill her. For some reason, I'm seeing her a lot lately. She does advertisements for Colgate as well.

[Mondayeve]

I feel like Val is getting coaching from Maks because to me much of his choreo has the moves from the dances Maks did with Meryl.  Big brother knows best. 

Last week in his blog Maks said that Laurie and Calvin would the final two standing.  I am not so sure he is 100% right on everything.   I think the final 2 will be Hinch and Laurie and come down to choreography for the freestyle and how well they execute it so I think either one of them could take it.   Alfonso R. said it best last night on All Access "it is the way a dancer makes you feel how you vote" and it will come down to that when they are both dancing well and getting similar scores.

Then again I could be surprised by Jana or Calvin being one of the two last standing.  As someone said they all have their strengths.  I just don't know how much fan support they are getting.  Laurie will will be one of the two, I just can't see her any other way.  The fanbase is too strong and passionate.

James also has a strong fanbase that he has earned throughout the season with each and every dance coming in as a virtual unknown and hopefully they are voting strong. 

To me when the competition is tough it makes the victory sweeter and it is a well earned win whoever takes this. 

[gohawks]

5 hours ago, realdancemom said:

ITA.  The article does not state that Val was the one to tell Laurie that her grandma died.  Both he and the family decided when to tell her the news.  That's it.

I only watch each dance once and don't replay them.  So I didn't see any wobbles in James and Sharna's AT.  However, I thought the blindfold was a gimmick that didn't add anything to the dance.  Instead both of them danced more timidly than they normally would have.  I also didn't see the purpose of the handstand at the end even though it did show a lot of strength and looked cool.  It didn't fit the mood of an AT just like Calvin/Lindsey's cartwheel lift which looked cool but didn't match the AT mood.

Sasha has done so well choreographing for Terra's limitations.  I also thought it would be difficult to choreograph the rumba but he did a good job. 

Gleb did slip twice and it looked messy.  I didn't even realize that there was a story about shoes until Tom mentioned it.  That means that his choreography did not stick out to me.

I think Calvin and Lindsay sometimes look frantic because of his height.  Lindsay doesn't choregraph frantic routines like Allison.  But his legs are so long that Lindsay really needs to move fast and wide to keep up.  I think that's part of the reason why there was a mess-up.  It started to look too fast before that.

I'm glad Val was covering up Laurie's ears during her package.  I was wondering how she would be able to dance after that.   I did see her tear and it's amazing that she didn't lose count when she did that.  She's very strong mentally for her age but that makes sense with her Olympic background.  She does dance very precise and aggressive.   I mentioned that last week.  It fit perfectly with her AT but not so much with contemporary where you have to dance with abandon and loosen up.  Val also does tend to like staccato choreography.

This was the first season where all the trio dances were great.  There wasn't a star left where the choreography had to be dumb down or looked awkward.  I think James/Sharna/Jenna was the best especially the way he transitioned between them..  I also liked Laurie and Val but for the samba elements not necessarily the choreography since Maks was out of a lot of it.

 

5 hours ago, realdancemom said:

ITA.  The article does not state that Val was the one to tell Laurie that her grandma died.  Both he and the family decided when to tell her the news.  That's it.

I only watch each dance once and don't replay them.  So I didn't see any wobbles in James and Sharna's AT.  However, I thought the blindfold was a gimmick that didn't add anything to the dance.  Instead both of them danced more timidly than they normally would have.  I also didn't see the purpose of the handstand at the end even though it did show a lot of strength and looked cool.  It didn't fit the mood of an AT just like Calvin/Lindsey's cartwheel lift which looked cool but didn't match the AT mood.

Sasha has done so well choreographing for Terra's limitations.  I also thought it would be difficult to choreograph the rumba but he did a good job. 

Gleb did slip twice and it looked messy.  I didn't even realize that there was a story about shoes until Tom mentioned it.  That means that his choreography did not stick out to me.

I think Calvin and Lindsay sometimes look frantic because of his height.  Lindsay doesn't choregraph frantic routines like Allison.  But his legs are so long that Lindsay really needs to move fast and wide to keep up.  I think that's part of the reason why there was a mess-up.  It started to look too fast before that.

I'm glad Val was covering up Laurie's ears during her package.  I was wondering how she would be able to dance after that.   I did see her tear and it's amazing that she didn't lose count when she did that.  She's very strong mentally for her age but that makes sense with her Olympic background.  She does dance very precise and aggressive.   I mentioned that last week.  It fit perfectly with her AT but not so much with contemporary where you have to dance with abandon and loosen up.  Val also does tend to like staccato choreography.

This was the first season where all the trio dances were great.  There wasn't a star left where the choreography had to be dumb down or looked awkward.  I think James/Sharna/Jenna was the best especially the way he transitioned between them..  I also liked Laurie and Val but for the samba elements not necessarily the choreography since Maks was out of a lot of it.

 Trio dances are some BS made up by TPTB. There are no rules just expectations. I like that they played with the idea of what a trio dance looks like.

Edited November 16, 2016 by gohawks

[gohawks]

I can't get on the James bandwagon. He is a good dancer but he has not proven his ability for Latin dance.  Questionable rhythm and musicality and no hips. He is very good with the ballroom but his Latin dancing is MIA.

[Mondayeve]

I think the blindfold thing was to show that James could lead the dance and remember where he was at all times and not depend on Sharna.  So I understand what she was trying to do.  But I feel realdancemom has a point in that it may have been better without the blindfold in the sense that they could have had eye contact and connection because I actually loved the simple intimate choreo Sharna did.   

Do you get the sense because the show has been on for 23 seasons the pros feel they have to up the ante for every dance.  Sometimes a well done dance that is true to the structure of the dance that captures the mood is better than all the bells and whistles. 

Edited November 15, 2016 by Mondayeve

[realdancemom]

20 minutes ago, gohawks said:

 

 Trio dances are some made up BS by TPTB. There are no rules just expectations. I like that they played with the idea of what a trio dance looks like.

My post was not to state that there were rules for the trio dances.  I just think that by Maks leaving for a good portion of the dance, Laurie didn't have to coordinate between Val and Maks as much as the other trio dances.

[crowceilidh]

I thought that ending pose for James and Sharna's AT was very tango-like in its symbolism and structure.  But I know SFA about AT the dance, other than what i have seen on DWTS and SYTYCD.  So, to the semi-informed nonspecialist, I thought it was a great choice.  If you showed me that ending pose and gave me a list of dances it potentially went with, AT would be at the top of my guesses.  Sharna's pose was both strong and submissive (which strikes me as the woman's tango tone) and vaguely yonic and James's pose was hyper masculine and strong and phallic - they are not tangled around each other BUT the pose requires both of them there to balance it.  If James had collapsed out of it forward, they would "assume the position" which the heat of tango always persuades me is its point regardless of its balancing coldness.  I thought it suited the dance perfectly (with the caveat that I don't know what I am talking about<G>).