S01.E10: So Far

[formerlyfreedom]

Charlie searches for a new mill; and realizes that there's more to the story of the land than originally thought. In other events, Hollywood again tries to mend his relationship with Aunt Violet.

[wanderingstar]

Good episode.

The Bordelon-Landry family history hit me hard - especially today. 

Glad that Violet got the manager gig at the High Yella (that name still kills me).

[Dee]

Micah and Kiki remain adorable. He blushes so much around her he's liable to turn into a tomato.

Hollywood still has no concept of boundaries. He's lucky Violet is in the midst of a semi mid-life crisis after losing Ernest, because she was far more patient with his pushiness than she should've been given the circumstances.

I love Charley but she's a snob. She's lucky Auntie Vi had bigger fish to fry because I would've backhanded her for looking down her nose at me.

I'm so glad Chantal called Nova out on her hypocrisy and that she and Nova were able to part fairly amicably.

It seems the Bordelon sisters kitchen throwdown brought them both a long overdue bit of humility and self awareness.

Henry Sanders and Tina Lifford were pitch perfect re-telling the Bordelon family's horrific history.

I'm tired of Ralph Angel's pity party. I definitely understand it, but I'm tired of it all the same.

That said, I LOVED Ralph Angel calling Violet out about his treatment of him (and Darla) relative to her feelings about Davis.

The Landry-Boudreaux family circling the Bordelons like vultures continues to be really gross. And way too true to real life.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Dee

[rozen]

Ugh, I can't with Aunt Vi staying in Charley's wallet and parenting choices. Yes, continue criticizing the only Bordelon child with the actual freaking means to keep this farm afloat and fighting against the Landrys for wanting to pass on that advantage to her son. I have no patience for insecure family members who don't want future generations to outgrow them. Charley is surprisingly uncouth with her own family, but she was correct. What has Aunt Vi accomplished that allows her to overrule Charley over what school is best for Micah? Vi knows well and good that she's stewing in her own failed potential, and good on her for taking the High Yella owner for all he's worth to fix that. But how many decades did it take her to get here? 

Chantal was already daydreaming how she and Nova were going to be written up as the Woke Black Powercouple of 2016 in the history books. Her bulldozer-style was doomed to turn Nova off at the start. Though Nova could have at least tried to redirect her and still take advantage of what Chantal was offering. Having a team of activists with PR experience helping you draft talking points for an interview is a good thing. Nova got thrown very easily in her first radio appearance on her articles, it's clearly something that doesn't come naturally to her. But Nova always wants to be the shining star, she doesn't share.

Ralph Angel can take those delicious tears somewhere else. He's screwed up just about every day since he's been out, he knows he has no business having custody of Blue. What if that convenience store clerk sees him? He's one ID away from going to lockup, and then where will Blue end up? And who knows how long it would take Vi to get custody of him again?  I know he feels emasculated between Blue, his parole, and his inability to support the farm. But he needs to start somewhere else, that won't endanger his own child. Pretty privilege is the shit, because is that actor was not as fine as he is, I would hate Ra so much more than I do.

Micah is so easily lead, lol. I wonder how interested she will be after she has a few instagram pictures showing him off, and the resulting upshot in popularity. She seems like she'd turn her nose up as his corniness if he was anyone but Davis's son.

That last scene was deep. Yes, you all better come together and fight! Open your own mill, Charley! Though her family will probably stay in her damn pockets about that too. 

Edited November 10, 2016 by rozen

[Arcadiasw]

Micah is a follower not a leader. He’s easily led by Nova and Kiki, people he really doesn’t know. Micah is so inexperience in dealing with a girl like Kiki can’t see it. I have to wonder if this relationship with Kiki doesn’t work out, is he gonna want to leave like he left L.A. when things got too hot with his Dad issues and his school or will he stick it out?

Ralph Angel can just shut up with his whining and feeling emasculated. Too bad Aunt Vi gave in and signed off on the custody because it will blow up in his face. He hasn’t done anything to prove he’s capable to have full custody of Blue: the robbery in the first episode, buying bad cane (how can you spend 30K on cane without checking it and not knowing what to check to make sure it’s not bad), taking the stolen phones and selling them, needing his Aunt Vi to get rid of the phones so he doesn’t go back to jail for a longer sentence.

Aunt Vi needs to let Charley spend her money how she wants. Charley is a smart business woman. She knows how to use her money wisely. So far, her only errors have been allowing her siblings access to that money and not listening to others (Prosper and Remy) when investing in something she knows little about.

Not surprised the workers didn’t come back. After they mourned their friends, they probably started thinking how this could’ve been avoided and right or wrong laid blame to Charley for keeping them instead of letting them go before the hurricane.

The last scene was powerful. The only nitpick I have is that the Bordelon children weren’t told this sooner. Things would’ve been so much different and better for the farm if they were told.  Of course we wouldn’t have the show if that had happened. For me, it kinda of hit close to home in that the older family members have the tendency to withhold information from the younger generation. On my Mom’s side, her mother, her aunts and uncles inherited land from their Dad. There’s always been whispers of how my family got that land. Unfortunately my Mom, her siblings and the younger generations were never told how. The only ones who know are dead, dying or very old and still won’t talk. I’m glad Aunt Vi told them their family’s history but I don’t like Ernest didn’t want his children to know until they asked or wanted them to come into the farm on their own. It took his death for them to do that. If Boudreaux hadn’t made Charley the four million dollar offer, she wouldn’t have questioned why and investigated the land’s history which led to Prosper and Vi telling them the true story. If the Bordelon children were offered four million in the beginning there’s a good chance they would’ve accepted the offer and sold the land back without knowing the truth. Aunt Vi might’ve taken the secret to her grave or told the Bordelon children after the sale was made. Imagine how horrible they would’ve felt if they sold the land without knowing.

[Dee]

I loved Vi taking charge of the High Yellow.

When she strode in with her perky attitude and armful of cleaning products, Roberta was all kind of salty.

[Clanstarling]

7 hours ago, rozen said:

But Nova always wants to be the shining star, she doesn't share.

That wasn't my take on it. Me, personally? I think Chantal crossed a line. I'd be pretty put off if a new relationship decided to stick their nose in my business without me asking or discussing it with them. Even if we shared similar values, and even if they had valuable input. 

The history of the Bordelon land is a powerful one, and choked me up. It seems odd to me to keep that information from them, when the land was so hard fought for by so many Bordelons. I can understand maybe not wanting your kids to inherit the burden of history, but it seems like that's a choice they should make with full understanding of that burden. And prepare them for the types of challenges they would face. Not knowing this history, they nearly gave that awful family an easy victory.

[Joimiaroxeu]

During the scene when the mill owner explained to Charley that he and his family now owned all the land surrounding her family's, I halfway expected him to proclaim, "I drink your milkshake!"

I like budding romance between Micah and Keke but am holding my breath until one of the Bordelons refer to her as "fast". Micah's led a fairly sheltered life and probably isn't ready for a girl who recognizes it and may or may not be willing to exploit it.

Quote

The Landry-Boudreaux family circling the Bordelons like vultures continues to be really gross. And way too true to real life.

Yep. I wonder how many similar stories have played out across the South, especially when many descendants of slaves share part the same gene pool with the descendants of the former slave owners. (But I hope that's not a card Queen Sugar is going to play.)

[ribboninthesky1]

3 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

The last scene was powerful. The only nitpick I have is that the Bordelon children weren’t told this sooner. Things would’ve been so much different and better for the farm if they were told.  Of course we wouldn’t have the show if that had happened. For me, it kinda of hit close to home in that the older family members have the tendency to withhold information from the younger generation.

I can relate.  It also bothered me that the only reason this story came out was because Charley (the one who "runs" according to her siblings) started asking questions.  Charley may have been able to help the farm a lot sooner if Ernest (who has managed to annoy me beyond the grave) would have been forthcoming.  Still, the secrecy felt authentic, sad to say.     

The drama of the scene was well-played, but it may have had the opposite of the intended effect on me: it made me ponder how much time (and money) has been wasted because of family pride and secrets. I feel like there's an element of shame within southern black families when, in most circumstances, there's nothing for US to be ashamed of.  White supremacy and bigotry wasn't created or perpetuated by us.  Is that shame why the truth was only recently revealed? I wonder how much we cripple ourselves within our families and neighborhoods, economically in particular, because our elders won't talk about the past. Or because we commonly ostracize the very family who can improve quality of life. 

In any case, this show has me curious about the book.  I realize the show has to pad the writing with all the other drama, but thus far, the stuff surrounding the farm has held the most interest for me.  Maybe the book delves more deeply into that aspect.

I did enjoy Vi strategizing her way into management.  Perhaps the next step will be business ownership.  

Hat tip to Salli Richardson-Whitfield for directing the episode!

[Dee]

1 hour ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I like budding romance between Micah and Keke but am holding my breath until one of the Bordelons refer to her as "fast". Micah's led a fairly sheltered life and probably isn't ready for a girl who recognizes it and may or may not be willing to exploit it.

Kiki encouraging Micah to think for himself, and assert his own opinions, is not going to sit well with his mom.

Charley is going to eat that poor girl for lunch.

[NorthstarATL]

6 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

Ralph Angel can just shut up with his whining and feeling emasculated. Too bad Aunt Vi gave in and signed off on the custody because it will blow up in his face. He hasn’t done anything to prove he’s capable to have full custody of Blue: the robbery in the first episode, buying bad cane (how can you spend 30K on cane without checking it and not knowing what to check to make sure it’s not bad), taking the stolen phones and selling them, needing his Aunt Vi to get rid of the phones so he doesn’t go back to jail for a longer sentence.

Vi made a point similar to this before, and I wish they had had her stick to THAT argument, because it is valid. To make it about Darla, and then compare that to what she said about Davis just negates the very real problem. If RA really DOES put Blue first, he'll swallow his pride and allow the stable Vi to continue doing what she has no real obligation to do. He should be kissing her ass, not giving her attitude!

 And WHY has Charley NOT gone after Micah's ex to prove that those pics WERE of Micah. Unless she's afraid that MIcah's claim that they weren't turns out the way Davis' similar claims of innocence did? Why isn't HE wanting to prove himself right? The incident is ruining his life, and he should be mad as heck.

[FoxyBrown]

3 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Yep. I wonder how many similar stories have played out across the South, especially when many descendants of slaves share part the same gene pool with the descendants of the former slave owners. (But I hope that's not a card Queen Sugar is going to play.)

 

Speaking of shared gene pools, we haven't yet seen or heard much about Charley's mother. Based on the visuals, it's possible she's white and based on things that have been said, she seems to be well off. Could she be another connection to the Landry-Boudreaux family?

[Dee]

1 hour ago, NorthstarATL said:

Vi made a point similar to this before, and I wish they had had her stick to THAT argument, because it is valid. To make it about Darla, and then compare that to what she said about Davis just negates the very real problem. If RA really DOES put Blue first, he'll swallow his pride and allow the stable Vi to continue doing what she has no real obligation to do. He should be kissing her ass, not giving her attitude!

Exactly! Violet has a strong argument for remaining Blue's guardian, but she lets Ralph Angel's crocodile tears sway her every time, when he's just as guilty of making Blue's custody a zero sum game as much as she does.

For whatever reason, Vi seems utterly unable to hold RA responsible for anything, and Hollywood is terrible for pressuring her about signing over custody when he, himself, feels she's ultimately right.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Dee

[DearEvette]

14 hours ago, rozen said:

Chantal was already daydreaming how she and Nova were going to be written up as the Woke Black Powercouple of 2016 in the history books. Her bulldozer-style was doomed to turn Nova off at the start. Though Nova could have at least tried to redirect her and still take advantage of what Chantal was offering. Having a team of activists with PR experience helping you draft talking points for an interview is a good thing. Nova got thrown very easily in her first radio appearance on her articles, it's clearly something that doesn't come naturally to her. But Nova always wants to be the shining star, she doesn't share.

Ha! to the "woke black Powercouple of 2016" but I do have to say I was side-eying Chantal even before Nova started giving her the squirrely eye.  It felt like she was trying to control the narrative even before Nova had a chance to give some thought about what she wanted to say.  I do think it is one thing to help her clarify Nova's own points, but the sistah-girl meeting taking place without Nova felt almost like Chantal wanted Nova to be her mouthpiece.  It was an overstep imo and then she had to turn Nova's relationship with Calvin political and shame her about it.  It was a punk move and is wasn't her place to do so because she has no idea what Nova's relationship was all about.

 

4 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I can relate.  It also bothered me that the only reason this story came out was because Charley (the one who "runs" according to her siblings) started asking questions.  Charley may have been able to help the farm a lot sooner if Ernest (who has managed to annoy me beyond the grave) would have been forthcoming.  Still, the secrecy felt authentic, sad to say.    

Yeah, these are shameful secrets.  I could easily understand why they kept it hidden.  Also i kinda get why Ernest needed them to want the land on it's own not just because they felt compelled through some sense family justice/revenge.  I mean given what we knew of them when we first met them, the Bordelon siblings weren't exactly committed to the farm and who knows how they would have reacted if they hadn't had a chance to want to do. 

Man the Bourdreaux guy was all up in Charly's personal space  Dude, boundaries!

Ths feels like a turning point and I am really stoked to see next week.

[rozen]

4 hours ago, DearEvette said:

Ha! to the "woke black Powercouple of 2016" but I do have to say I was side-eying Chantal even before Nova started giving her the squirrely eye.  It felt like she was trying to control the narrative even before Nova had a chance to give some thought about what she wanted to say.  I do think it is one thing to help her clarify Nova's own points, but the sistah-girl meeting taking place without Nova felt almost like Chantal wanted Nova to be her mouthpiece.  It was an overstep imo and then she had to turn Nova's relationship with Calvin political and shame her about it.  It was a punk move and is wasn't her place to do so because she has no idea what Nova's relationship was all about.

I dunno, I couldn't even be mad. The interview is set, and has been announced in the newspaper. It's a big deal, and probably coming soon if it's on the front page. And Nova didn't give Chantal any indication that she was preparing, or even had a plan. Imo, Chantal is a "doer" and immediately brought all her apparatus to bear to get her girl together. Now, maybe Nova does has a plan for staying on point as compared to her last radio interview, but that's not what she told Chantal. She just told her to back down and that Nova would do things "her own way." Her own way was a debacle the first time, and that response would drive someone with a clear mission and drive crazy. Chantal didn't need to be doing all of that, but Nova didn't need to go throw it all out either. 

Edited November 11, 2016 by rozen

[ribboninthesky1]

51 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

Yeah, these are shameful secrets.  I could easily understand why they kept it hidden.  Also i kinda get why Ernest needed them to want the land on it's own not just because they felt compelled through some sense family justice/revenge.  I mean given what we knew of them when we first met them, the Bordelon siblings weren't exactly committed to the farm and who knows how they would have reacted if they hadn't had a chance to want to do. 

Thing is, Charley (and likely Nova) still didn't want the land.  They agreed to keep it to see if it could turn a profit for a season or two, and then sell the land later for a presumably better price.  I assume that's primarily why Charley was so interested in hearing Boudreaux's offer.  Even Ralph Angel was hyped about that $4 million offer (so much for wanting to keep the farm). And frankly, if it wasn't for Charley, if it was on Nova and Ralph Angel, they probably would have just taken the money, and Vi and Prosper would have just observed, looking worried and knowing the truth, because of some misguided promise to Ernest.   

So, ultimately, I read it pretty much as you just expressed: in that final scene, they're digging in their heels, ready to fight, out of a sense of justice, not because they truly wanted the land before they learned the history.  Guess I'm not seeing the difference. Mileage varies, but, IMO, righteous vengeance can be a healthy motivator.  Given all of the challenges they had, they needed a reason to want to keep the land - knowing the history did just that.  Imagine if they knew of that story before Ernest died, or at least, right after.  I imagine different business decisions would have been made as well, since they'd know they would largely have to do business outside of the parish whenever possible to get that farm up and running again.  Knowledge combined with wisdom is power, especially economic power.    

Besides, that farm was left in shambles because Ernest never told anyone how bad off it was. I can easily imagine how hard-pressed anyone, let alone adult offspring who apparently knew nothing about farming, would be to want that land. Maybe if Ernest, while alive, had told Charley what was going on, she could have provided financial assistance and saved money in the long run. I can't help but think how much more money she's spending because of Ernest's secrets and pride. And that's not counting her money-foolish siblings.  

ETA:

We do agree on this, @DearEvette: it's definitely a turning point, and I want to see what happens next.  

Edited November 10, 2016 by ribboninthesky1

[ribboninthesky1]

Reflecting further, I'd really like to see Vi more involved in farm business.  She obviously has a head for operations, and she clearly knows some thangs (ex: the Landry-Boudreaux history and mill monopoly). Let Vi and Charley put their heads together and show that parish how things get done.   

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

Speaking of shared gene pools, we haven't yet seen or heard much about Charley's mother. Based on the visuals, it's possible she's white and based on things that have been said, she seems to be well off. Could she be another connection to the Landry-Boudreaux family?

Yep, I wondered that but didn't want to say it. I'm hoping this show doesn't go there unless in the end it's going to benefit the Bordelons.

Quote

Man the Bourdreaux guy was all up in Charly's personal space  Dude, boundaries!

Right? Hope that was just because he called himself being extra friendly or an aggressive salesman and not because he knows there's a biological connection.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Joimiaroxeu

[Arcadiasw]

2 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

Thing is, Charley (and likely Nova) still didn't want the land.  They agreed to keep it to see if it could turn a profit for a season or two, and then sell the land later for a presumably better price.  I assume that's primarily why Charley was so interested in hearing Boudreaux's offer.  Even Ralph Angel was hyped about that $4 million offer (so much for wanting to keep the farm). And frankly, if it wasn't for Charley, if it was on Nova and Ralph Angel, they probably would have just taken the money, and Vi and Prosper would have just observed, looking worried and knowing the truth, because of some misguided promise to Ernest.   

 

 

Ralph Angel comes across as someone who wants things but doesn’t want to work too hard for it. Case in point, getting custody of Blue. He pressed hard on keeping the farm but didn’t know anything on how to maintain it. So I’m not surprised he jumped at the idea of selling the farm for four million. He didn’t pick up something was off when Charley showed them the two maps.

Ernest wanted his kids to want the farm but so far we haven’t seen anything to imply that Ernest taught his children anything about the farm as kids that would encourage them to want it as adults. Not even chores working in the fields as kids. I don’t know if Ernest tried to teach them as kids and they weren’t interest or if he tried at all. I excuse Charley since she only visited the farm in the summer but Nova and Ralph Angel not knowing is really hard to excuse. They grew up there.

I agree Ernest keeping this secret from them did more harm than good and a lot of money could've been saved.

I wonder if the money Charley is spending will ever come into play. Charley and Davis have money but it's not Lebron James money. Charley hasn’t divorced Davis yet. What Davis did was horrible but he could still say something about the money and how the divorce is settled could affect how Charley finances the farm. On top of all of that, she still has a job in L.A. she has to get back to.

[Happytobehere]

22 hours ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Good episode.

The Bordelon-Landry family history hit me hard - especially today. 

Glad that Violet got the manager gig at the High Yella (that name still kills me).

Always wonder if it references the color you had to be to eat and possibly even waitress there not so long ago.

[ribboninthesky1]

I wonder how much Calvin was meant to be featured in this season.  I vaguely recall seeing RTs from the show's Twitter account that hinted about him and Nova/Calvin as a couple, presumably to lure shippers into watching the show. Makes me wonder if they changed the writing after the first few episodes.  

48 minutes ago, Arcadiasw said:

I agree Ernest keeping this secret from them did more harm than good and a lot of money could've been saved.

In addition to saving, perhaps the farm could be turning a profit.  If memory serves, several episodes ago, Prosper said that Ernest hadn't planted anything in two years. I might be wrong on that - maybe it had been two years since there was a decent harvest. 

That said, I agree with you about Charley's spending. I wondered about that early on, after the 2nd or 3rd episode. Maybe she's invested well, and they have capital beyond Davis' salary. The show hasn't addressed it.  

Side note: Bianca Lawson is a vampire.  How the hell does she manage to look barely out of high school? And younger than Siriboe?  Chile...

[mrsbagnet]

When the family's history of the farm was told, my first thought was that they should go ahead and sell it. Ask for much more money, but still sell. I get the impulse to dig in their hills and to avenge their ancestors, but frankly, I think forcing the Boudreaux family to buy back the land is revenge enough. Are they going to work and/or stress themselves to death when none of them *really* wants this farm? That plan of action didn't work so well for their father. They all have other options, and that money will give them even more options.

Edited November 11, 2016 by mrsbagnet

[Neurochick]

22 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

The history of the Bordelon land is a powerful one, and choked me up. It seems odd to me to keep that information from them, when the land was so hard fought for by so many Bordelons. I can understand maybe not wanting your kids to inherit the burden of history, but it seems like that's a choice they should make with full understanding of that burden. And prepare them for the types of challenges they would face. Not knowing this history, they nearly gave that awful family an easy victory.

That last scene was very heartbreaking and it reminded me of something a man once told me years ago.  He said white people should be glad that black people were pretty good natured back then, because at one time every upscale white family had black people cooking their food, raising their children, etc. What would have happened if every single black "help" decided to murder their "employers?" especially at a time before TV and forensics even existed. 

9 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

When the family's history of the farm was told, my first thought was that they should go ahead and sell it. Ask for much more money, but still sell. I get the impulse to dig in their hills and to avenge their ancestors, but frankly, I think forcing the Boudreaux family to buy back the land is revenge enough. Are they going to work and/or stress themselves to death when none of them *really* wants this farm? That plan of action didn't work so well for their father. They all have other options, and that money will give them even more options.

My first thought was, "sell it to the Saudis, or someone like Trump for 400 million" for them to put someone other than a farm there.

[Clanstarling]

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

, because at one time every upscale white family had black people cooking their food, raising their children, etc. What would have happened if every single black "help" decided to murder their "employers?" especially at a time before TV and forensics even existed. 

This has always baffled me. But especially that the children raised by black people would grow up and still, somehow, be racists.

Then again, I'm a person who won't make a huge fuss at a restaurant, because I don't trust that the staff might get a little revenge.

Edited November 11, 2016 by Clanstarling

[ribboninthesky1]

18 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

When the family's history of the farm was told, my first thought was that they should go ahead and sell it. Ask for much more money, but still sell. I get the impulse to dig in their hills and to avenge their ancestors, but frankly, I think forcing the Boudreaux family to buy back the land is revenge enough. Are they going to work and/or stress themselves to death when none of them *really* wants this farm? That plan of action didn't work so well for their father. They all have other options, and that money will give them even more options.

I can't deny it would be easier to sell the land and take the money.  Still, I understand why they want to fight, and why they might want to have something tangible to leave for future generations.  As someone mentioned early on, black landowners are rare.

[dirtypop90]

I love this show!!!  Another powerful episode. I legit have one problem....

Ralph Angel is so nice to look at but I honestly can't stand him. He reminds me of so many young men I know who act like the world is against them because they were punished for sh*t they did. I literally want to reach through the screen and shake him sometimes. re the guardianship papers, this was the one time I wanted Vi to be stubborn. She should not have signed them papers. RALPH ANGEL, WHAT ABOUT ALL THE ILLEGAL THINGS YOU HAVE DONE SINCE YOU HAVE BEEN OUT???!!!! Did he forget he robbed a store and the clerk saw his face? Vi doesnt know about that but of course she knows about his other bad deed because she saved his butt.  Signed over blue because ralph angel's is hurt he can't sign some field trip papers?! Are you serious?! Signing over blue, knowing if ralph angel went away again, there is a chance his mama could get custody?! I don't get the problem with Aunt Vi remaining the guardian for at least a couple more years while ralph angel and the mama fully got on their feet because they are not stable yet IMO.

Moving on....I like Kiki. IMO this little relationship with Micah has made him more likable.  He doesn't mope around her. She's sharp and funny.  I cackled at her reaction the phone situation.  I don't see her as "fast." She is a straight shooter and a flirt but that's it. She made him open the door for her, told him if she came over it wouldnt be no netflix and chill situation. lol So I don't quite get what she has done wrong or get people calling her too fast for Micah. Some of the comments on twitter about fast Kiki and innocent Micah honestly make me cringe.  Sheltered does not equal innocent.  He's shy around Kiki because he didnt grow up around girls like her.  My guess is he is not a virgin (based on his prior situation) and she is.  But we will see. Can't wait for Charlie to hit the roof.

[Neurochick]

22 hours ago, dirtypop90 said:

Signed over blue because ralph angel's is hurt he can't sign some field trip papers?! Are you serious?! Signing over blue, knowing if ralph angel went away again, there is a chance his mama could get custody?! I don't get the problem with Aunt Vi remaining the guardian for at least a couple more years while ralph angel and the mama fully got on their feet because they are not stable yet IMO.

I think Vi should have explained to RA that right now, at that moment, between she, RA and Darla, she, Vi is the most stable one of the trio.  That might change but right now, that's the reality.

 

22 hours ago, dirtypop90 said:

Moving on....I like Kiki. IMO this little relationship with Micah has made him more likable.  He doesn't mope around her. She's sharp and funny.  I cackled at her reaction the phone situation.  I don't see her as "fast." She is a straight shooter and a flirt but that's it. She made him open the door for her, told him if she came over it wouldnt be no netflix and chill situation. lol So I don't quite get what she has done wrong or get people calling her too fast for Micah. Some of the comments on twitter about fast Kiki and innocent Micah honestly make me cringe.  Sheltered does not equal innocent.  He's shy around Kiki because he didnt grow up around girls like her.  My guess is he is not a virgin (based on his prior situation) and she is.  But we will see. Can't wait for Charlie to hit the roof.

I can't imagine how Kiki can be seen as fast.  Micah grew up in the fast lane, wealthy, his father a celebrity.  I would imagine he has has girls throwing themselves at him for a long time, Kiki just seems more mature but as I remember, teenage girls were always more mature than teenage boys IMO.

[LydiaMoon1]

20 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Moving on....I like Kiki. IMO this little relationship with Micah has made him more likable.  He doesn't mope around her. She's sharp and funny.  I cackled at her reaction the phone situation.  I don't see her as "fast."

This characterization of Keke as "fast" on social media irritates me to no end. I am so sick of black folks and their endless demonization and scapegoating of black women and girls.  Regardless of age or circumstance, the girl is ALWAYS to blame in any negative situation involving a black male (whether that male is a teenage boy or a grown azz man).  Just describe the girl as "fast", and Voila!  The guy is instantly absolved of any culpability and all accountability in any and every situation.

It makes me sick. 

Edited November 14, 2016 by LydiaMoon1

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

Ralph Angel is so nice to look at but I honestly can't stand him. He reminds me of so many young men I know who act like the world is against them because they were punished for sh*t they did.

Exactly.

He committed robbery in the opening of this show! Even worse, before I saw Aunt Vi and Hollywood show up on screen and realized he had all this family of good people, I thought he and his precious son were homeless. But no, this brat had multiple warm homes where he could lay his head, where no one would turn him away, and he could get warm meals for he and his son, yet he's robbing folks at gunpoint. Threatening someone else's child for crying out loud with a gun if she didn't hand over the money in the cash register.  For what? Just so he could bring stolen money and give it to his very proud,hardworking father, as a what?  A Contribution,? Yeah, bye RA, just bye. What a spoiled brat.

Quote

This characterization of Keke as "fast" on social media irritates me to no end. I am so sick of black folks and their endless demonization and scapegoating of black women and girls.  Regardless of age or circumstance, the girl is ALWAYS to blame in any negative situation involving a black male (whether that male is a teenage boy or a grown azz man). 

You're speaking my language, been done with all of it. And worse, I believe that most of criticism comes from our fellow females.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[withanaich]

I wouldn't categorize Keke as "fast" because I think demonization of female sexuality, especially black female sexuality, is so, so gross. But I do think the way they're writing this girl, she comes off like she's about 50, and it's pretty exasperating and tiresome. I keep waiting for her to start talking about how she has to get home and put a casserole in the oven, or go pick up her grandbabies.

[Neurochick]

I don't get how Keke is fast.  To me she's a typical teenage girl, thinks she knows it all.  I can't STAND it when black GIRLS are considered "fast," when they're just being fucking normal. 

Though I'm wary of Darla I'm glad she and RA are together.  The teacher can take a seat.  I'm sick of shows showing black men with every type of woman under the sun. 

[biakbiak]

3 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I don't get how Keke is fast.  To me she's a typical teenage girl, thinks she knows it all.  I can't STAND it when black GIRLS are considered "fast," when they're just being fucking normal. 

 

Yeah the ex-girlfriend with dick pics of dudes in her phone is fast, Keke seems to be a normal teenager trying to impress a wealthy kid from LA. 

[copshop]

I wonder if we will get more of Ralph Angel's backstory--I have sort of been giving him the benefit of the doubt 1) because he is so damn pretty (I admit it) but also 2) because maybe it was Darla that got him into trouble. That does not excuse the foolishness from episode 1's robbery or the issues with the coworkers. I hope he has learned his lesson with Vi's help.

I don't think we have seen the last of Calvin (and I hope not--too juicy, and I was happy to see the actor from Days of Our Lives get a meaty role).

To prove Micah's innocence, all they have to do is look who sent the damn photo, no penis comparison necessary!

[Emily Thrace]

On 2016-11-10 at 10:53 AM, Joimiaroxeu said:

During the scene when the mill owner explained to Charley that he and his family now owned all the land surrounding her family's, I halfway expected him to proclaim, "I drink your milkshake!".

Yep. I wonder how many similar stories have played out across the South, especially when many descendants of slaves share part the same gene pool with the descendants of the former slave owners. (But I hope that's not a card Queen Sugar is going to play.)

Yeah I'm remembering Mildred D. Taylor's books which dealt with a black land owning family that had a similar story. I too hope we don't end up finding out there is a blood connection between the Landry's and the Bordelon's. Although if the Bordelons were owned by the Landry's for more than a few generations it almost inevitable.

I still like watching Charlie and RA. Their relationship isn't very dramatic but its interesting in its own right. RA doesn't seem to resent Charlie the way Nova does. They actually work well together. Charlie is one of the few people who actually listens  to RA when he has something to say and he does the same. I loved the face he made when Aunt Vi brought up Davis. 

Speaking of Aunt Vi I like that she gets a little OTT when it comes to things like Micah's school or Darla. I mean its annoying but its nice that she has flaws and isn't always right. It makes her more real and human there are enough Magical Negroes in her age bracket as it is. 

Something interesting about Nova is how much of a lone wolf she is. She is part of the community but the only one who thought to tell her about Too Sweet was her drug dealer buddy. Nova seems like someone who has a lot of acquaintances but doesn't have a lot of real friends. I think she sees herself as an outsider and doesn't really let anybody in.

As Chantal found out. Although Chantal also came off as a self righteous  zealot so that's probably not so bad. I like that this show is parsing the difference between a racist police force doesn't mean every cop isn't necessarily racist.  Its a fine distinction but sometimes its an important one if we ever want to see lasting change. In the end police brutality isn't a problem that will be solved by declaring war on cops. I suspect its deliberate choice by TPTB that Chantal seems to represent some of the issues with the Black Lives Matter movement itself. As has been pointed out elsewhere the lack of focus and workable solutions is why Black Lives Matter has attracted a lot of attention but not a lot of actual change. I really don't see how a relationship with Calvin makes Nova less of an activist and I don't think dividing people like that helps defeat racism.

[Dee]

Nova doesn't resent Charley. In fact, I'd describe them as really close.

Now Ralph Angel? He definitely resents Charley....and sometimes Nova too.

[Emily Thrace]

20 hours ago, Dee said:

Nova doesn't resent Charley. In fact, I'd describe them as really close.

Now Ralph Angel? He definitely resents Charley....and sometimes Nova too.

I don't think Nova is all that close to Charley or vice versa. They don't seem to share much. Good or bad they both seem to call RA or Aunt Vi before they call each other. I think they could be close but its a long rocky road back.  Every single fight Nova brings it back to Charley's money, that's resentment.  Nova was the one trying to shut Charley out of the funeral. Nova felt entitled to take Charley's money. Nova couldn't even be bothered to defend Charley on the radio. I don't even think its all about the money, I think its deeper than that. I think Nova feels like Charley has gotten where she has by luck and charm while she has always had to struggle and that's part of where the resentment comes in.

Ralph Angel resents everyone who tells him when he's being a screw up true, but he doesn't seem to resent Charley specifically in anyway. He doesn't resent her success and he respects her expertise in business. I don't think hes really all that close to Charley any more than Nova is I just think their relationship is less contentious. Ralph Angel and Charley have a common goal right now and actually make a good team. Of course it helps that Ralph Angel is willing to follow Charley's lead most of the time.

[Dee]

Nova and Charley share quite a bit. They fight just as much. But when Charley needs to confide in someone or is emotionally distressed she usually goes to Nova. And when they're together, Nova slowly opens up to Charley about her own personal life.

It's Nova who Charley confides in about Davis exploits, it's Nova who Charley confides in about Melenia really being raped, it's Nova who Charley confides in about her feelings for Remy, it's Nova who Charley confides in about feeling guilty about the migrant workers deaths, it's Nova who Charley smokes weed with to unwind before the farm auction, etc.

Nova stops discussing how Charley handles her money after Ernest is buried. They have the fight about Nova taking the funds to bail Two Sweet out but Nova apologizes. Not artfully, as Charley points out repeatedly, but she does. And Nova refers to Charley as bourgie during their argument during the hurricane. But that's less about Charley's money and more about the heirs Charley puts on, because of, said money.

It's not Nova's job to defend Charley. Least of all during a radio interview that's supposed to be about Nova's acclaimed articles. When the radio interview happens, Nova spends the majority of the time refusing to answer questions about her sisters personal life and stressing that she's there to discuss her writing. She does, at one point during the radio interview give her honest opinion about how sex workers are unfairly judged, but that has nothing to do with Charley and everything to do with how society in general, and the radio dj's who were interviewing Nova at the time, treats rape victims.

Neither Bordelon sister is inclined to open up to Ralph Angel, beyond the fairly casual, which makes sense given the age, gender and temperament differences.

However, if Ralph Angel is closer to either sister, it's Nova. She's the one he guilt trips about not visiting him when he was locked up and it's him who she makes a concerted effort to seek forgiveness from, when she realizes just how much her absence has thoroughly affected him.

Charley works with Ralph Angel only to get the farm up and running, but they never share any personal info, since by that point Charley and Micah have moved back to St. Joe on a semi-permanent basis, until the Bordelon's farm's first harvest is over. And they only work together as long as they both agree to stick to the initial plan. As soon as either one deviates from the plans, neither seems remotely willing to work with, or listen to the other. Despite the fact that Nova vociferously praises the merits of both their plans, during their family business meeting.

Ralph Angel thoroughly resents Charley. It's RA who nastily excoriates Charley telling her that their father's farm "hasn't ever been her home" and that she only viewed the farm "as a place she was forced to visit every summer as a kid." The excoriation is so personal, Nova has to step, bodily, in between the two on a devastated Charley's behalf. Only for Ralph Angel to turn his venomous rage onto her, his full blood sister, for being eager to leave the farm as soon as she turned eighteen. RA's toxic tantrum only ceases, because the siblings attention is directed to Ernest tractor being repossessed.

Both girls have similar relationships with Aunt Vi except Violet expects Nova to be slightly more mature (in certain situations) and is slightly little more stern with Charley for her classism and unnecessary paranoia.

Edited December 2, 2016 by Dee

[talktoomuch]

This ^^^^ @Dee. I never realized until your post just how much Nova is the center of this family. I have been dutifully worshipping at the altar of Boss Charley, but I failed to realize how truly awesome Nova's position is in this family. She is the referee, peacemaker, nurturer, shepherdess, healer, counselor...hell, she's their missing Mother, not Aunt Vi. She even nurtured and counseled Aunt Vi. Charley and Nova are two of the most completely realized black female characters on tv. Nice, Ms. Duvernay!

[TVForever]

On 11/22/2016 at 3:35 PM, copshop said:

To prove Micah's innocence, all they have to do is look who sent the damn photo, no penis comparison necessary!

Amen! I was thinking that from the moment that happened. And, given what we now know about what Charley is capable of, it doesn't make sense that she wouldn't have made a bigger fuss on her son's behalf. If only to prove his innocence on their way out the door. To the girlfriend's mother, as well as to the school.

As far as Kiki being fast, I do think the character is being written that way, unfortunately. Not so much in her first scene, but maybe that's because she was with her father. But I liked that Kiki. When she and Micah are alone however, I feel like she's going to eat Micah alive. And it doesn't help that Micah's being portrayed as an innocent lamb who's never seen a girl before, let alone talked to one. I appreciated the scene where they were having a study group, and actually studying. I want to see Kiki the good student, the dutiful daughter, the nice young lady. Maybe that would give some balance to most of what we've been given so far. I like Kiki and hope we get to see more of her.

[jhlipton]

On 11/10/2016 at 3:18 PM, NorthstarATL said:

Vi made a point similar to this before, and I wish they had had her stick to THAT argument, because it is valid. To make it about Darla,

Vi is so awful to Darla.  Darla went far, far off the rails -- as she said, she was in Hell.  But she is trying to clean up her act, and she doesn't ask for anything, even Vi's respect.  Vi needs to realize that she's hurting Darla by pushing her away.

On 11/10/2016 at 4:14 PM, Dee said:

Vi seems utterly unable to hold RA responsible for anything

Because Darla is responsible for everything!

On 11/10/2016 at 10:11 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

Side note: Bianca Lawson is a vampire.  How the hell does she manage to look barely out of high school? And younger than Siriboe?  Chile...

Maybe she was turned by Spike in this universe?

On 11/11/2016 at 8:25 AM, Neurochick said:

My first thought was, "sell it to the Saudis, or someone like Trump for 400 million" for them to put someone other than a farm there.

If they're going to sell, 300 acres is 4 Disneylands or 3 Magic Kingdoms.  Put a huge amusement park on the land and let the Landrys fight with a multinational corporation.