S04.E04: Honeymoons, Part 1

[nlkm9]

7 hours ago, butterbody said:

Alright folks, I'm gonna have to chime in for all us losers. I live in a medical marijuana state, and am legally licensed to sell marijuana. Florida does have several legal dispensaries in operation as well.  (God bless America!)

While the majority of my clients are children with Epilepsy and the seniors from our local Cancer Center- they are huge advocates for medical marijuana and assist their patients in obtaining a card- I see several hundred marijuana users from all walks of life on a weekly basis. I'm also a very involved PTA mom who volunteers in reading circle every Thursday and  never misses a karate match. And I smoke lots and lots of weed. Medical grade, potent, natural weed and when I meet someone new, I just go ahead and do my thang because it's not a big deal. My husband doesn't care for it himself, but could care less that I do, because I am always happy, calm, and awesome. These comments are hurting my heart. I thought we'd evolved. Nobody bats an eyelash at "wine, wine, wine", Resort drinks aren't strong enough, and you know someone who smokes weed but wouldn't fly with it, therefore Derrick must have brought it in his ass? That's what I call a stretch. I fly a lot. I put it in my checked luggage without incident. 

I hope my post doesn't sound rude or defensive, it's just that we're beating this horse about something that has become pretry mainstream. It's not the devil's lettuce, y'all. If he uses it for anxiety, I'd assume this situation requires a little doubling up on the dose, so to speak. I've no doubt the camera dudes aren't filming him because they are joining him. 

how do you fly with it?? I would be so afraid....or do you fly only through states where it is illegal??

[Evil Queen]

1 hour ago, nlkm9 said:

how do you fly with it?? I would be so afraid....or do you fly only through states where it is illegal??

Really it is against the law to do so since it would be considered federal laws once you hit the airport/plane. From what I see it looks like places its full on legal, at some of the airports they have a place to dispose of it before you get on a flight and other ones do not even want you bringing it to the airport and warn you not to do so. So really it doesn't matter where you are flying from and to when its breaking federal law. So its a risk one would take in doing so in the end. I am going to also say that I can imagine those that get it in legal states or medical legal ones may take vape versions. I could be wrong on that though and some take whatever no matter what because its how they prefer it but either way federal laws make it illegal to do so.

[Paddywagon]

Pot for medical reasons is amazing.  Especially for kids with severe epilepsy and cancer patients. Hopefully it will be legal in all states soon enough.

I'm not against pot at all.  Pot is fun, alcohol is fun. But I don't like being around anything that anyone has to do all day unless it's for medical purposes.  I can't help but feel it's a sorry world when peeps go around on some sort of substance all day long.  It's about the only thing I agree with Heather about cuz I wouldn't want to be with someone who always wants to get high.  It would be way too monotonous for me.  "Give me a few minutes to get high...I gotta go buy some pot...I need to hide this pot in my luggage..."

But to each his own for sure.  After all, I don't like onions but sure don't judge anyone who loves them.

Edited August 22, 2016 by Paddywagon

[crgirl412]

I'm watching part the Honeymoon Part 1 now. 

Nick is looking hotter and hotter, I swear!  I love he and Sonia together! I think that they will stay married. That bus talk has got to stop!  If that's Tom's biggest "flaw," he's literally perfect! 

Tom and Lily are cute!  I think her temperament is perfect for his which I didn't foresee at all.  

Heather and Derek:

I would be pissed if I was matched with someone who said that they only smoked cigarettes occasionally (since that's what Heather said she would be comfortable with) then he smoked two days in a row.  

If I was matched with someone who smoked marijuana (Non-medical only as I'm a very pro-medical marijuana RN) I would be really pissed.  That isn't something that the "experts" should not have asked about.  

*I was getting some flashbacks to when I was in a verbally and emotionally abusive relationship when they were on the balcony and Derek was saying that Heather needs to lower her standards.  I remember those type of arguments and thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't treat me like shit." Very possibly Heather is thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't partake in something that is illegal in 49 states with the consequence of jail."   

*I am not saying he's abusive just that in both of their minds it's that the choices are only Perfect Man (who they know doesn't exist) or we just have to 100% accept any flaw they have. 

Edited August 22, 2016 by crgirl412
Clarity then I Nick and Tom mixed up!

[humbleopinion]

Tom is married to Lily.

Nick is married to Sonia.

Unfortunately for both, Heather remains married to Derek and he to her.

[crgirl412]

53 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

Tom is married to Lily.

Nick is married to Sonia.

Unfortunately for both, Heather remains married to Derek and he to her.

Oooops!!  Thanks!!! 

Right??  Poor Derek and Heather!!! 

[Snarklepuss]

14 hours ago, Evil Queen said:

Nowhere, No squinty eyes doesn't but he has been in a few scenes he is not at all squinty eyed either. Yet he has a look on his face that says it all. I've been around enough people to know that face to well. Many friends in high school would use it. That on in adult life I had a few that did as well. Heck I have a neighbor a couple doors over that does it and we can smell it. He has that same look on his face. While I know the cigarettes don't full over the smell of pot because of how that smell is but there are many that will smoke one to cover what they are doing. Yet I don't believe what is going on is at all about cigarettes. As others pointed out no one ever says that people say alcohol is worse than cigarettes...as Derek tried to argue. Yet some will say that when talking about weed.

I agree with you.  I know that look well too having come of age in the 1970s and having a pot smoking boyfriend.  Derek reminds me so much of him.  It's hard to explain - His body language, his facial expression, so many things are similar it's blowing my mind! 

[Snarklepuss]

2 hours ago, crgirl412 said:

*I was getting some flashbacks to when I was in a verbally and emotionally abusive relationship when they were on the balcony and Derek was saying that Heather needs to lower her standards.  I remember those type of arguments and thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't treat me like shit." Very possibly Heather is thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't partake in something that is illegal in 49 states with the consequence of jail."  

Good point - I forgot about that line he used.  You're right that it sounded like the wording of an abusive type.  I don't think her standards are too high just because she frowns upon smoking or pot smoking.  Those are her values and not ones I would consider stuck up or too rigid especially given the legality issue.  I still don't like it that she told him in effect that he was low class because of it, though.  That was a low blow. 

[ctbabe]

2 hours ago, Snarklepuss said:

Good point - I forgot about that line he used.  You're right that it sounded like the wording of an abusive type.  I don't think her standards are too high just because she frowns upon smoking or pot smoking.  Those are her values and not ones I would consider stuck up or too rigid especially given the legality issue.  I still don't like it that she told him in effect that he was low class because of it, though.  That was a low blow. 

I really didn't think he wanted her to lower her standard. I actually felt he was ready to compromise. Her style of arguing just puts him on the defensive. I have a feeling their argument was longer than shown.. 

[Neurochick]

9 hours ago, crgirl412 said:

*I was getting some flashbacks to when I was in a verbally and emotionally abusive relationship when they were on the balcony and Derek was saying that Heather needs to lower her standards.  I remember those type of arguments and thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't treat me like shit." Very possibly Heather is thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't partake in something that is illegal in 49 states with the consequence of jail."   

Question, why is it abuse when someone, a man, speaks the truth?  If your standards are way high, you will end up alone.  Derek didn't tell Heather to lower her standards, what I heard was compromise.

[ctbabe]

35 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

Question, why is it abuse when someone, a man, speaks the truth?  If your standards are way high, you will end up alone.  Derek didn't tell Heather to lower her standards, what I heard was compromise.

I swear sometimes I feel like I am watching a different show. I have read jaw dropping comments. From some comments, I get the vibe that man is suppose to be god. A man shouldn't feel disappointed, blindsided, hurt and jealous since he has a penis.

Derek said he is willing to do anything to make this marriage work and we still say he wasn't ready to compromise. Geezzzz

[henrysmom]

Honestly I don't think Heather cares if Derek smokes, or what he smokes.  When I rewatched the brunch she went to the day after the wedding, all I could think was that she didn't care.  Now, I'm old so maybe the younger people on the board can correct me as to how people behave now, but when I was young and you were dating somebody new that you liked, you tried to make an impression.  I'd take time over my hair, put makeup on carefully instead of going without or just using a little lipstick.  Dress nicely--I don't mean like I was meeting the Queen of England but nice/flattering clothes.

And instead of doing anything like that Heather didn't even put her contacts in, pulled her hair back in a messy bun, used little or no makeup and wore unflattering clothes.

Unless times have changed (have they?--Really, I want to know) she just doesn't care about Derek. So if he smokes pot or cigarettes, it doesn't matter.  She's done, and doesn't care what she thinks.  She's just looking for a way out so she doesn't have to fall back on "it's not you, it's me".  Or do people not use that one anymore either :)

[lazylou]

I wonder if opinions would differ if Derek and Heather had honeymooned in Colorado, where pot is legal?  

Was there no question during the screening about lifestyles...minimalist vs. posh?  

So what if Sonia is 10 lbs overweight?

[Neurochick]

I musts be old and blind but I don't see Sonia as overweight.  Then again I didn't grow up believing that a 00 was a normal size, shit, when I was a 00 in the 1980's, people thought I was too skinny and often asked if something was wrong with me, today I'd be a normal size.

[Koda1969]

33 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I musts be old and blind but I don't see Sonia as overweight.  Then again I didn't grow up believing that a 00 was a normal size, shit, when I was a 00 in the 1980's, people thought I was too skinny and often asked if something was wrong with me, today I'd be a normal size.

So true! Although, I will confess that towards the late 80's where I grew up, the premise of being much skinnier became popular. I'm only 5' tall and had a body of a gymnast (muscular legs) but unfortunately inherited..umm (cough) a chest not unlike my other Italian ancestors. In school I was constantly ridiculed as fat and it stuck with me for a long time. Heck, even nearing 50 years old, I feel self conscious. In the long run, my opinion is that it only matters how YOU feel and if you have a partner, if they LOVE you. Two weeks ago my hubby and I were doing some major work around the house...my hair is long thick and frizzy and it was a wreck..and by the end of the day I truly smelled from all the sweat. You know what, he didn't give a rat's butt. We fell into bed exhausted and snuggled all night!

[lh25]

Quote

"I swear sometimes I feel like I am watching a different show"

I agree, but I didn't see Derek offering a compromise, as in "I'll smoke less".  I saw him basically telling her to get over herself.  I may have to re-watch the balcony scene again. 

[Momof3]

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

I musts be old and blind but I don't see Sonia as overweight.  Then again I didn't grow up believing that a 00 was a normal size, shit, when I was a 00 in the 1980's, people thought I was too skinny and often asked if something was wrong with me, today I'd be a normal size.

I agree 100%. She is healthy and every man I've ever dated would prefer a woman with a woman's body. Not 00. Not that there's anything wrong with a 00-at all. I'm 41 and live in GA so maybe it's a different standard. I think her body is beautiful. Finding her 'chubby' in *my* opinion is proof of a distorted sense of what a healthy woman's body looks like.  

3 hours ago, henrysmom said:

Honestly I don't think Heather cares if Derek smokes, or what he smokes.  When I rewatched the brunch she went to the day after the wedding, all I could think was that she didn't care.  Now, I'm old so maybe the younger people on the board can correct me as to how people behave now, but when I was young and you were dating somebody new that you liked, you tried to make an impression.  I'd take time over my hair, put makeup on carefully instead of going without or just using a little lipstick.  Dress nicely--I don't mean like I was meeting the Queen of England but nice/flattering clothes.

And instead of doing anything like that Heather didn't even put her contacts in, pulled her hair back in a messy bun, used little or no makeup and wore unflattering clothes.

Unless times have changed (have they?--Really, I want to know) she just doesn't care about Derek. So if he smokes pot or cigarettes, it doesn't matter.  She's done, and doesn't care what she thinks.  She's just looking for a way out so she doesn't have to fall back on "it's not you, it's me".  Or do people not use that one anymore either :)

I agree re:her not caring what she looks like. She is dressed just like she would be in college studying for finals home sick with the flu. 

[Empress1]

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

I musts be old and blind but I don't see Sonia as overweight.  Then again I didn't grow up believing that a 00 was a normal size, shit, when I was a 00 in the 1980's, people thought I was too skinny and often asked if something was wrong with me, today I'd be a normal size.

Me neither. She's not a waif but I don't think she's overweight. There are lots of steps between thin and overweight. (And the camera really does add ten pounds, as they say. I've seen a number of people who have been on TV in person and every single one of them was smaller in person than they appeared on TV - sometimes jarringly so. I used to work in the same building as Wilhelmina Models and "model thin" is really, really thin in person.) I'd guess she might feel big in Miami where the standard of beauty and tropical climate means she's likely exposed to very thin women in bikinis all day, but in my opinion she really has nothing to worry about.

Also, even if she IS chubby (and again, I don't think she is), so what? She's not less deserving of love because of it. Chubby people meet and marry every single day. Sometimes they even marry people who aren't chubby! 

[Momof3]

I'll just say it-were I Heather, I'd be finding a way out too. He is SO NOT ATTRACTIVE inside or out to me. And since I wouldn't want to tell him that b/c that'd be a shitty thing to hear ever let alone on national tv-I'd lie and say it was the smoking. 

He seems goofy and like a slacker. NOT b/c he may smoke pot. When I was dating I only considered getting serious with a guy who I could see eventually wanting to be in the delivery room. I just can't see wanting that guy in any serious situation with me. It also bugs me that he is a very "here, now" guy-doesn't consider the future. He couldn't be thinking of the future IMHO when he got those tattoos. They are goofy, clearly no meaning and in very public spots. UNLESS he's in love with his job/profession and has no plans to pursue anything else and that's acceptable in said profession. i.e. if he is a tattoo artist. It's not fair that people judge a book by it's cover, but the reality is they do and it'd be crappy if a tattoo that you got in your youth kept you from it. Like what if he got involved in local government-which a lot of people do when they have kids-and wanted to run for school superintendent or city council? Where I live at least =those tattoos would make getting either of those positions so much harder to get if not impossible. 

[Jellybeans]

14 hours ago, crgirl412 said:

I'm watching part the Honeymoon Part 1 now. 

Nick is looking hotter and hotter, I swear!  I love he and Sonia together! I think that they will stay married. That bus talk has got to stop!  If that's Tom's biggest "flaw," he's literally perfect! 

Tom and Lily are cute!  I think her temperament is perfect for his which I didn't foresee at all.  

Heather and Derek:

I would be pissed if I was matched with someone who said that they only smoked cigarettes occasionally (since that's what Heather said she would be comfortable with) then he smoked two days in a row.  

If I was matched with someone who smoked marijuana (Non-medical only as I'm a very pro-medical marijuana RN) I would be really pissed.  That isn't something that the "experts" should not have asked about.  

*I was getting some flashbacks to when I was in a verbally and emotionally abusive relationship when they were on the balcony and Derek was saying that Heather needs to lower her standards.  I remember those type of arguments and thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't treat me like shit." Very possibly Heather is thinking, "No,I don't want someone perfect just one who doesn't partake in something that is illegal in 49 states with the consequence of jail."   

*I am not saying he's abusive just that in both of their minds it's that the choices are only Perfect Man (who they know doesn't exist) or we just have to 100% accept any flaw they have. 

FYI...it is legal in 25 states plus DC as of June, 2016 and on the ballot this November in several more.

[Jack Sampson]

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I musts be old and blind but I don't see Sonia as overweight.  Then again I didn't grow up believing that a 00 was a normal size, shit, when I was a 00 in the 1980's, people thought I was too skinny and often asked if something was wrong with me, today I'd be a normal size.

It doesn't have to be one or the other.  Just because I don't prefer a chubby girl like Sonia doesn't automatically mean I prefer a skinny 00.  Emily Ratajkowski is a skinny girl with larger boobs and she's not a 00.  Kate Upton is nowhere near 00 and most men still find her attractive.  Hell, Heather and Lily aren't 00s, but if you stood them next to Sonia, all in bikinis, you'd see a considerable weight difference.

If it was me, I'd have a problem with her weight.  But, unlike Heather, if I was married to her I wouldn't use it as an excuse to bail, I'd help her get in shape and give her some time to do it.

[wovenloaf]

The idea that Derek is rolling blunts every morning in front of this random woman he just married and an entire camera crew, with weed he either would have had to bring on a plane with him or have purchased from some dude on the beach or street corner or wherever in Puerto Rico (while either being filmed or having eluded said camera crew) seriously strains credulity to me.

I think the dude just smokes cigarettes sometimes -  maybe more often than he originally let on, but he is on vacation and is probably drinking more than normal, and it's certainly not weird for people to smoke more when they're drinking more. I feel like Derek could have done anything at all and Heather would have picked out some thing (or many things) about him that made her "uncomfortable" and/or "turned off." His smoking was just the most convenient thing to blame it on. 

Edited August 22, 2016 by wovenloaf

[Neurochick]

2 minutes ago, Jack Sampson said:

It doesn't have to be one or the other.  Just because I don't prefer a chubby girl like Sonia doesn't automatically mean I prefer a skinny 00.  Emily Ratajkowski is a skinny girl with larger boobs and she's not a 00.  Kate Upton is nowhere near 00 and most men still find her attractive.  Hell, Heather and Lily aren't 00s, but if you stood them next to Sonia, all in bikinis, you'd see a considerable weight difference.

If it was me, I'd have a problem with her weight.  But, unlike Heather, if I was married to her I wouldn't use it as an excuse to bail, I'd help her get in shape and give her some time to do it.

Why do you assume Sonia's out of shape?   Just because someone isn't 00 doesn't make them out of shape. 

BTW, if a woman is thin with large boobs, there is a possibility that the boobs have been enhanced. 

My point here is that people today really don't know what healthy looks like; we've been taught very well that 00 is healthy, that 00 is normal and attainable for everybody.  Serena Williams is not 00 but I bet she's heather than a lot of women who are 00; Michelle Carter who who the woman's shot put at the Olympics, she's not a 00 but I don't believe she's unhealthy.  Many women on the US swim team aren't waif-like either. 

And by the time you hit forty, waif-like doesn't cut it.

[Jack Sampson]

9 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

Why do you assume Sonia's out of shape?   Just because someone isn't 00 doesn't make them out of shape. 

BTW, if a woman is thin with large boobs, there is a possibility that the boobs have been enhanced. 

My point here is that people today really don't know what healthy looks like; we've been taught very well that 00 is healthy, that 00 is normal and attainable for everybody.  Serena Williams is not 00 but I bet she's heather than a lot of women who are 00; Michelle Carter who who the woman's shot put at the Olympics, she's not a 00 but I don't believe she's unhealthy.  Many women on the US swim team aren't waif-like either. 

And by the time you hit forty, waif-like doesn't cut it.

You're presenting a false dichotomy...and a modified straw man.  I've never said that not being 00 automatically makes a woman overweight.  In fact, I gave examples to the contrary. 

But, if you don't think Michelle Carter is fat, we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Vinyasa]

I watched this episode again after all the great posts here.

Nick is really sporting those "Section 8" t-shirts. Sonia is even wearing one during the "pillow talk". So what gives that they are allowed to wear these shirts? Gosh, I hope we're not in for five more weeks of them? The "Hubby/Wifey" shirt company must be paying some  cash to be on the show,  but we have no idea what company that is so why pay?

And if I hear Lilly say "me and Tom" one more time, I'm going to send her a grammar book. Really I am!

Nick is looking better and better. I think he is probably one of the best looking guys on any season so far. Tres  looked good  and Jason was cute, but I think that is about it. Any other thoughts??

[henrysmom]

Quote

I feel like Derek could have done anything at all and Heather would have picked out some thing (or many things) about him that made her "uncomfortable" and/or "turned off." His smoking was just the most convenient thing to blame it on.

This is what I think.  Derek could have been Mr. Perfect with no vices whatsoever, no drinking, no smoking of anything, no drugs.  He could have been without tattoos or any other deal breakers.  But it still wouldn't have mattered because Heather just isn't into him.  I think her comment about how he never would have gotten a second date is telling--somewhere along the line she just made up her mind and said "nope" and that was that.  Now she's just looking for excuses to kick him to the curb so she doesn't come off as the bad one.  The smoking issue is the same red herring as last year's "you messaged a girl, you fiend", when it was clear from day one that Ashley was just counting the minutes until she could get rid of David.

 

Quote

Nick is looking better and better. I think he is probably one of the best looking guys on any season so far. Tres  looked good  and Jason was cute, but I think that is about it. Any other thoughts??

I think all the men this year are good looking, Nick especially though Tom is a pretty close second.  Last year only Tres.  I didn't watch much of the first two seasons but from what I saw I didn't think any of the men were particularly physically attractive.  Personality wise I thought Neal came off really well last season, very charming.  

[humbleopinion]

Let's go way back to the wedding of the Bickersons.

In a TH, Heather expressed surprise she allowed Derek to kiss her at the ceremony.

Then she got irritated when he kissed down her clavicle for the wedding photos.

She was not having any part of Derek.

She had her Mrs. Prissy High Horse face from then on.

The honeymoon is just a fault finding expedition for Heather to condemn Derek.

Heather to Derek..."You are not my enemy."

Derek to Heather..."You are not my enemy."

No more couple building exercises...please!

[Enero]

47 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

Why do you assume Sonia's out of shape?   Just because someone isn't 00 doesn't make them out of shape. 

 

What's great about Sonia is that she's curvy and toned. I've not seen even a hint of cellulite on her arms or thighs (when she was in her bathing suit). 

[Empress1]

I define out of shape as not able to do things physically. I had a friend who smoked a pack a day, drank nothing but soda, booze and lots of coffee (she had terrible breath; my brother once pulled me aside and was like, "for real, you have to say something to her"), dipped her junk food in ranch dressing, and the only exercise she got was walking to her car. She was out of shape because she got winded going up three stairs and her doctors were always reading her the riot act, but people looked at her and thought she was healthy because she's tall and thin. She was tall and thin because her father (who also took poor care of himself) was tall and thin, but she was perhaps the most out of shape person I've known. Conversely, I have another friend who is chubby but does 1.5-mile open water swims and is an avid hiker - she's taken international hiking trips, etc. She's in great shape and health.

Sonia looks fine to me and Nick hasn't expressed that he has an issue with her looks, but I'll probably think he's a dick if he tells her she needs to lose weight, get in shape, etc. You can't change people and if Sonia's good with the way she looks, I say good for her. If she were to go to Nick and say "I'd like to start working out more, will you go to the gym with me?" that's one thing, but if Nick were to be like "You need to lose weight" apropos of nothing? Nah. Not cool.

Edited August 22, 2016 by Empress1

[Vinyasa]

Quote

In a TH, Heather expressed surprise she allowed Derek to kiss her at the ceremony.

Then she got irritated when he kissed down her clavicle for the wedding photos.

I'll  bet money, the producers were telling him to do the kissing on her shoulders.

Edited August 22, 2016 by Vinyasa

[ctbabe]

4 minutes ago, Vinyasa said:

I'll  bet money, the producers were telling him to do the kissing on her shoulders.

Absolutely. . Jaime said on her blog that the camera man gave the instruction. 

[StayingAfterSunday]

1 hour ago, ctbabe said:

Absolutely. . Jaime said on her blog that the camera man gave the instruction. 

The wedding photographer was most definitely instructing both of them how to pose.  If by "camera man" Jamie was referring to the wedding photographer then she is right; he was most definitely instructing the couple how to pose, and seemed to promote the PDA.

1 hour ago, Enero said:

What's great about Sonia is that she's curvy and toned. I've not seen even a hint of cellulite on her arms or thighs (when she was in her bathing suit). 

 I'm thinking Nick probably specified on his application that he preferred a curvy, "busty" woman.   Whatever happened to the camera adding ten pounds? Or does that not hold true these days?  Because, if so, I do not exactly see Sonia as a girl with a weight problem, but I do see her as someone who will need to watch her weight as she grows older. She doesn't appear to be very tall, and she is not a naturally thin type of girl.  Then again, what do we know of Nick with respect to weight?  We see him as fit and good looking, however, I wonder if his weight fluctuates or if he has a tendency to gain weight. He and she both said that Nick has a penchant for eating sweets in the middle of the night, not that this alone is enough to base any assumption on his weight.

Edited August 22, 2016 by StayingAfterSunday

[Enero]

3 hours ago, StayingAfterSunday said:

Then again, what do we know of Nick with respect to weight?  We see him as fit and good looking, however, I wonder if his weight fluctuates or if he has a tendency to gain weight. He and she both said that Nick has a penchant for eating sweets in the middle of the night, not that this alone is enough to base any assumption on his weight.

Good point. If you watched the selection episode it's obvious that Nick was heavier before the show started filming. Some might even argue that he was bordering on being the Pillsbury Dough Boy. He definitely lost weight between the filming of the selection process and filming of the weddings/marriage etc.

[Christi]

Well this episode I learned that hispanic women are fun and sexy, while Caucasian women are uptight assholes

[Nowhere]

^^^Eh...okay... I don't think Caucasian women all voted for Heather to be the spokesperson for an entire race of females.

[Neurochick]

10 hours ago, Christi said:

Well this episode I learned that hispanic women are fun and sexy, while Caucasian women are uptight assholes

I don't think so. 

Though, this reminds me of watching Phil Donahue's show many decades ago.  He had white men on the show who said they preferred to be with women from South America because they weren't "sour" and were "more traditional" than white, American women.

To me that's a HUGE generalization.  I think Heather's deal is her age and life experience, not so her race. 

[BunnySlippers]

18 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Let's go way back to the wedding of the Bickersons.

In a TH, Heather expressed surprise she allowed Derek to kiss her at the ceremony.

Then she got irritated when he kissed down her clavicle for the wedding photos.

She was not having any part of Derek.

She had her Mrs. Prissy High Horse face from then on.

My impression was that she got irritated because the photographer kept pushing them to kiss. I think she would have been fine with one or two kisses, but I don't blame her for getting annoyed when it was more than that. She'd just met the guy, and they didn't have that instant chemistry that other people had (Tom and Lilly, Davina and Sean, Jessica and Ryan).

I was actually surprised (and a little annoyed) that this photographer (or all the photographers if they were different for the different weddings) kept making these new couples, who'd just met, kiss. At least, that's how I remember the weddings. It just seemed there was more kissing at the wedding pictures than on previous seasons. If the couples already like each other, that's fine, but if they are still not sure about each other, I think it just gets too awkward.

[cardigirl]

22 hours ago, Momof3 said:

I'll just say it-were I Heather, I'd be finding a way out too. He is SO NOT ATTRACTIVE inside or out to me. And since I wouldn't want to tell him that b/c that'd be a shitty thing to hear ever let alone on national tv-I'd lie and say it was the smoking. 

He seems goofy and like a slacker. NOT b/c he may smoke pot. When I was dating I only considered getting serious with a guy who I could see eventually wanting to be in the delivery room. I just can't see wanting that guy in any serious situation with me. It also bugs me that he is a very "here, now" guy-doesn't consider the future. He couldn't be thinking of the future IMHO when he got those tattoos. They are goofy, clearly no meaning and in very public spots. UNLESS he's in love with his job/profession and has no plans to pursue anything else and that's acceptable in said profession. i.e. if he is a tattoo artist. It's not fair that people judge a book by it's cover, but the reality is they do and it'd be crappy if a tattoo that you got in your youth kept you from it. Like what if he got involved in local government-which a lot of people do when they have kids-and wanted to run for school superintendent or city council? Where I live at least =those tattoos would make getting either of those positions so much harder to get if not impossible. 

There are ways to hide tattoos and even get rid of them, if need be.  I understand that once upon a time they may have been seen as undesirable, but I think they are so much more accepted today that many might suppose.  I have many friends with full sleeves of tattoos, who are ambitious and hard-working and definitely are able to provide for themselves, and their tattoos do not present stumbling blocks in their careers.  It may be less true in more conservative parts of the world  but where I live a lot of tattoos is not apropos of anything other than enjoying ink. 

As for being a "here, now" type of person, I think that his having been in the military may have led to him learning to try and be "in the moment" as a means of coping, and it's not a bad way to live.  At all. Very Zen.  I would prefer a partner who was able to enjoy where he was to its fullest rather than stressing all the time about the future.  Actually, being in the moment allows for focus on what is truly important in life rather than constantly trying to make sure things are perfect all the time.  (As in, we chose the PERFECT house, the PERFECT vacation, our children are PERFECT, etc. )

Edited August 23, 2016 by cardigirl

[Empress1]

3 hours ago, BunnySlippers said:

My impression was that she got irritated because the photographer kept pushing them to kiss. I think she would have been fine with one or two kisses, but I don't blame her for getting annoyed when it was more than that. She'd just met the guy, and they didn't have that instant chemistry that other people had (Tom and Lilly, Davina and Sean, Jessica and Ryan).

I was actually surprised (and a little annoyed) that this photographer (or all the photographers if they were different for the different weddings) kept making these new couples, who'd just met, kiss. At least, that's how I remember the weddings. It just seemed there was more kissing at the wedding pictures than on previous seasons. If the couples already like each other, that's fine, but if they are still not sure about each other, I think it just gets too awkward.

Also kissing down the clavicle is pretty intimate. That's one of my sweet spots. It's not the same as kissing on the cheek. Definitely not something I'd be cool doing with a stranger.

[ioniancat21]

All the points have been covered by others, but my guess is that like last year, this "experiment" won't go very well and if we're lucky, one couple will make it past the show, the rest, finished. I just don't like how they match people up, all their psych-talk hasn't helped. I always like this show for the train wreck in the end....

[Happyfatchick]

^^^I SOOO agree with your analysis @ioniancat21.  For all the tests and interviews, and interviews with family, I still do the doggie tilt head "huh?" every single season.   Sam and Neal last year...OMG, train wreck from the first minute.  (She CRIED at the wedding, and when they were packing for the honeymoon, she told him she wasn't attracted to him at all - and he informed her "well, you're no prize either, soo...").  I love Sonia and Nick and I think they may accidentally hang in there - but at the very first, WHY did these experts think it might be good to pair an awkward shy man with a perky girl who laughs from the gut and can be silly?  (Life experience tells me that this can cause problems later when she's all like huggy, needing affection and reinforcement, and he's all like "what???").  Opposites can grow into fondness and even dependence on one another - but that's the sort of relationship that can take years to develop.  The kind where they've been besties for 10 years when one of them suddenly realizes they have real, actual feelings going on.  (I'd think amazingly unlikely for them to "get" each other in 6 weeks!   6 weeks is about long enough for one of them to wipe the sweat from their brow and say, "Gawd, is is too much like WORK!"  Obviously that's life experience too).  Additionally, I would think Blond-Ashley/Heather would have been easily identifiable as someone who needed a guy with sophistication.  Derek's voice reminds me of Dustin Hoffman in Rainman, and he doesn't seem particularly refined (regardless of what he's smoking).  If I were one of the experts, I would have skipped Blond Ashley altogether.  There's no pleasing her.  And I still wish she'd been paired with a guy who lived in a bus.  

[izabella]

16 minutes ago, Happyfatchick said:

 I love Sonia and Nick and I think they may accidentally hang in there - but at the very first, WHY did these experts think it might be good to pair an awkward shy man with a perky girl who laughs from the gut and can be silly?

Nick is shy and awkward, and Sonia is a nervous-nelly and awkward.  I think they can work IF they both learn better communication skills and to understand each other better. 

Edited August 23, 2016 by izabella

[Nowhere]

Am I remembering correctly that Nick told Sonia he does not want to consummate yet?

[humbleopinion]

He wasn't quite so direct but talked around the subject with the 5/30 Day speech.

[Nowhere]

It did seem like a blow off when he was talking about it. Sonia wasn't pressuring him so why did he even bring it up? 

[Momof3]

6 hours ago, cardigirl said:

There are ways to hide tattoos and even get rid of them, if need be.  I understand that once upon a time they may have been seen as undesirable, but I think they are so much more accepted today that many might suppose.  I have many friends with full sleeves of tattoos, who are ambitious and hard-working and definitely are able to provide for themselves, and their tattoos do not present stumbling blocks in their careers.  It may be less true in more conservative parts of the world  but where I live a lot of tattoos is not apropos of anything other than enjoying ink. 

As for being a "here, now" type of person, I think that his having been in the military may have led to him learning to try and be "in the moment" as a means of coping, and it's not a bad way to live.  At all. Very Zen.  I would prefer a partner who was able to enjoy where he was to its fullest rather than stressing all the time about the future.  Actually, being in the moment allows for focus on what is truly important in life rather than constantly trying to make sure things are perfect all the time.  (As in, we chose the PERFECT house, the PERFECT vacation, our children are PERFECT, etc. )

You're right about the tattoos-but not here in GA-imho. I couldn't care less. Im a very here now person too. I meditate everyday, etc. That's not what I meant-no need to be worried about the future or the past. But that doesn't mean you ignore things-like retirement, etc.

[humbleopinion]

Guessing the producers were pressuring Nick and Sonia to emote about their marriage so birth of the 5/30 day Spectrum of Like.

Nick probably regrets his now infamous 5/30 day speech.

Cameras and producers make people say things they normally wouldn't...and then we would have nothing to snark about.

Edited August 23, 2016 by humbleopinion
more nonsense

[love2lovebadtv]

On 8/17/2016 at 11:07 AM, SaucyMommy said:

I agree with all of this. I hate when they throw around "Stranger".  A stranger is someone you haven't had a conversation with - after 5 days of solid time together - you don't know everything about one another - but you are no longer strangers.

I agree with all of this,  too.  Heather keeps saying stranger as if to reinforce the distance between them. Nick & Sonia are a nice couple. I think because they're going into it with their eyes wide open they're less likely that each other on a pedestal and set themselves up for disappointment. They're leaving romantic to fall in love. They're the most mature couple this season. Tom & lilly make me think they were selected for entertainment value. The bus shock,  the speculation about what will happen,  the big buildup. Was all that butt rubbing necessary? Ugh. 

[nutella fitzgerald]

On August 22, 2016 at 2:09 PM, Neurochick said:

And by the time you hit forty, waif-like doesn't cut it.

A 40-year-old woman?! Gross!!!

On August 22, 2016 at 2:21 PM, Vinyasa said:

Nick is really sporting those "Section 8" t-shirts. Sonia is even wearing one during the "pillow talk". So what gives that they are allowed to wear these shirts?

Isn't Sonia a social worker? I assumed he dressed like that for the casting calls and the experts recognized his interest in the Housing Act of 1937 as a sign they were meant to be.

Edited August 27, 2016 by nutella fitzgerald
hit post too soon