S04.E18: The Trouble with the Truth

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I just can't with these characters. It's like everyone has had a lobotomy to remove all traces of intelligence, ability to make decisions, and positive personality traits.

Maddie is a selfish, hurtful child for letting the lawyer use ANY of that information about Deacon in court. It was manipulative enough of her to let the lawyer use the recent events, knowing that he was grieving for Beverly the first time and protecting Maddie and Rayna the second time (I'll leave the third one out of the discussion since there was so much debate about it when it happened). But to let that lawyer bring up shit that happened 20+ years ago? Sorry, that is crossing the line into unforgivable. She knew how much it would hurt Deacon and she did it to further her stupid agenda.

Deacon is an idiot. After listening to the lawyer list all these past acts of violence and having to admit to them, his reaction is to go to the bar to confront Frankie? Like Rayna said, WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN? I mean, seriously. Did Deacon think Frankie would say, "So sorry, old chap. That was a shitty thing to do. Can you ever forgive me? Let's hug it out!"? And then he totally fell for the oldest trick in the book. Frankie was totally baiting him because he wanted Deacon to punch him, knowing that it would mean Maddie winning her case. If you know that you have impulse control problems, remove yourself from the situation. In other words, if you know you are going to want to punch someone the night before your daughter's custody case is decided DON'T CONFRONT SAID PERSON. Like seriously, Deacon couldn't wait a whole day to go punch Frankie?

Luke is an idiot. I realize that he was trying to do the right thing by going on that homophobic bigot's show, but he played right into her hands. Despite that, he could have easily fixed it. He is a superstar so he could have called a press conference and told everyone what he said following the "technical difficulties." Hell, he could have recorded a quick video on his phone and uploaded while he was still in the damn parking lot so that everyone would know the rest of what he said.

I love Will and I understand that he doesn't want to have to defend himself over and over, but burying his head in the sand whenever this comes up is not going to make the issue go away. I'm not saying he needs to become a huge activist, but he needs to accept the fact that things like this are going to happen and staying silent doesn't make things better.

I loved how excited he was when he heard his song on the radio, but when he jumped out of the shower, I thought I don't think your roommates are going to be happy about you running around the house naked. Then I remembered Avery and Gunnar were on the road and it made me sad that he had no one to celebrate that big moment with! The first time you hear yourself on the radio should be celebrated thusly:

[Kathemy]

I can't wait to see the ratings of the next episode.

[deepfriedcake]

I did not sign up to watch this steaming pile of crap.

There is not one happy thing left on this show. Why in the world should I keep watching it?

Maybe that brat Maddie is on to something. Maybe we all need to sue for emancipation from this ridiculous show.

[WhosThatGirl]

It is sad to watch what this show has become. I feel an obligation to watch at this point. I feel like, if I make it to 2 seasons of a show and it keeps going, I'm there for the long haul. Plus, I don't know. For me, it's always the 2nd season with tv that pulls me, something major happens in almost every 2nd season of a show I watch (the exception to that being Dawson's Creek, which in the 2nd season I was kind of meh on but I liked enough of the characters so I kept watching and then the 3rd season sucked me in with Joey and Pacey and then I stayed. Oh and also The OC but that's only because The OC had me sucked in by episode 2. But those 2 are my only expectations).

I just don't understand what the writers are doing. Or how they are getting paid for this. I mean, I just would like to know if they think that there are actual viewers who were rooting for Maddie and were happy she won her emancipation? If this show was geared towards teens, I would get it, sort of. But I don't think many teens are watching Nashville. I could be wrong, I guess. But yeah. It's such a ridiculous story.

[candall]

You know that thing about how the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference?

I guess I've emancipated myself from this show because I just laughed and laughed.  Of course Deacon RACES to initiate a confrontation where he's helpless to control his rage.  That's his daughter!  Of course sad sack Gunnar stretches like a rubber band to turn a Scarlett remark into a betrayal and their love is fatally blighted.  Again.  Of course Maddie's influenced by evil outsiders to human-sacrifice her parents.  She knows in her heart it's wrong!  Poor Maddie.  Poor everyone.  So sad. [sarcasm font]

Okay, whatever, show.  Hey, that Rayna character sure has great hair.

 

.

Edited May 5, 2016 by candall

[smiley13]

Poor ole Deacon.  He fell for Frankie's set up hook, line and sinker.  Of course if he swung at Deacon, he was going to fight back, especially after what he said about Rayna.

I do think we have a clue to Cash's madness though.  Frankie thinks Cash has a career when she doesn't.  She is trying to latch on to Maddie to live vicariously through her due to her own past failures.  Frankie is a piece of dirt for using Deacon's confidential information against him.  What a scumbag.  This may spell the end for The Beverly.  I don't think Deacon will ever forgive this betrayal.

[Kathemy]

Truth here. Cash and Frankie need to die. Death is the only thing they deserve. I can't stand watching them on the screen. They've outstayed their welcome on the show. Forever. They're irredeemable.

Side note it's a bit funny how they decide to air the absolutely worst episodes of the entire series right before the deadline for the cancel/renew announcements.

Edited May 5, 2016 by Telepath
ETA

[PattyorSelma]

The happiest character on this show is Teddy in jail.

And possibly the missing homeless waitress, who may be lying in a ditch.

[scra22]

I honestly can't think of one really happy moment that occurred in this episode. Avery claimed to be happy, but let's be real. The brief hand-holding between G/S was cute, but Lord knows we couldn't have that last more than 10 seconds. Every couple that has more than 9 fans is messed up. The Maddie storyline is probably one of the worst things this show has done. Poor Will must be wishing he had never been born. The only good thing I can say about this episode was it basically focused on the main characters and not on "Riff" or "Vita" or "Markus." That's all I got. 

[Soup333]

10 hours ago, DeLurker said:

Emily -

Please grab Cadence and Will and all 3 of you go to a different show. 

DeLurker

Don't leave Daphne!

Well, at least I got to laugh at y'all's comments. That was the best part of this episode. 

[Tikichick]

Question for the Judge, bit of clarified thinking for the writers:  Why would you approve a plan for emancipation wholesale to remove a mother's rights to parent, including parental oversight of the child's participation in the notoriously tough entertainment industry when the child's stated plan is to put her career under the management of a 20-something with no credentials of management and no real successful personal experience in the industry herself?  We'll leave aside the elephant in the room that said 20-something harbored the teenager's flight from home, in fact helped engineer the flight and the altercation that led to it, an altercation in a club where alcohol is served and now the 20-something stands to profit handsomely from the emancipation -- and is arguably in control of the profit machine at this time.

The production and writing staff needs a serious overhaul or the plug needs to be pulled.  It's sad when you have a variety of talented and capable cast and cannot manage to give anyone some decent material to work with.

[Kathemy]

Just to add one simple thing here.

The way Gunnar reacted in this episode was completely unbelievable and once again shows how Nashville has absolutely zero problem having their mains go ridiculously out of character to stir up drama. Gunnar has been jonesing to get back together with Scarlett for three years. There is absolutely no way, no way, that he would throw the relationship all away based on some stupid interview, without fighting for her.

This is seriously making me sick. The only thing they could do to aggravate this mess would be for Gunnar to sleep with Autumn. If that happens, his relationship with Scarlett is impossible to salvage.

[Soup333]

Yeah, I was thinking about that too. I can't believe that Gunnar, who was incredibly patient and understanding when Zoey was worried about telling Scarlett that they were together, would react this way to Scarlett right now over their history. It was just plot driven junk just like everything else.

[Kathemy]

1 minute ago, Soup333 said:

Yeah, I was thinking about that too. I can't believe that Gunnar, who was incredibly patient and understanding when Zoey was worried about telling Scarlett that they were together, would react this way to Scarlett right now over their history. It was just plot driven junk just like everything else.

Exactly. If we're to take anything from this episode it would be that Gunnar's relationship with Scarlett does not matter to him and is not valuable, but we have seen him obsess about it for the entire run of the show.

Any person in his situation, with that much at stake - his band, his career, the freaking love of his life - would be "let's sit down and talk about this." 

[candall]

2 hours ago, smiley13 said:

This may spell the end for The Beverly.

No way!  They'll be prying The Beverly from Deacon's cold dead fingers.  That bar is a tribute to his sainted sister, don'tchaknow.

[Kathemy]

At this point I would be okay with Deacon hiring an assassin to get rid of Cash and Frankie. Really, anything to get those bastards off the screen.

[DeLurker]

11 hours ago, jay741982 said:

Same I know Deacon ain't prefect but all these writers do is beat him down among other people as well. 

Charles Esten and Jonathon Jackson have the same problem - a fuming Deacon or sad, hurt almost crying Deacon (or Avery) is too much catnip for the writers to let be happy for more than one scene per season.

11 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

I wanted to add that I like Emily, but why doesn't she have any kind of life? She seems to be with Juliette or the baby 24 hours a day. Does she not have friends, family, dates, hobbies, anything?

In this case she is on call 24/7 because Juliette asked her to go on tour with Avery to keep an eye on him.  But a very valid question in general.

11 hours ago, Sandman said:

ETA: The Trouble with the episode is that it feels like things are moving backward, for the sake of ... what? Ramping up the angst until the finale? Will, Luke, and Deacon are all in the same places they've been in earlier arcs in the show, not to mention this Ground Hog Day: The Musical! that Scarlett and Gunnar appear to be trapped in.

Well, a Musical sans the music.

11 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Will's shampoo moment was the only other thing I liked in the episode. Unfortunately, this show has a hard time of letting things go and we have homophobia crap again. I get that it might be realistic, things aren't ever fixed overnight but the writing on this show is such a drag.  It's not compelling.

I should have stopped watching this ep after Will heard his song on the radio.  I bailed about 1/2 way through (when it became clear Frankie had spilled the beans from what he heard Deacon say in AA meetings).  I came here to see if I should bother watching the back half and the Magic 8 Ball says "My Sources say No".

I don't particular like Gunnar and Scarlett, but that shite storyline has been played and replayed and replayed with them.

Frankie, Cash, Maddie, and Layla need to be in the Beverly when it goes up in flames.

[NorthstarATL]

12 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

 

I hate the storyline with Will. I understand that homophobia exists in country music, but things are changing in the right direction and the show should reflect that. No one in 2016 would host a talk show and say things like we can't listen to a song without thinking about gay men having sex. Something like that would be all over social media and the woman's show would be over. I get it that the show is trying to show support, but sometimes it feels like its doing the opposite. How about just having Will be another singer/songwriter trying to make it and his sex life doesn't matter to people?

I wonder if the writers realize that this is actually 2016 and there are gay people in every industry and most genres of music, with country being more accepting than some. They are denigrating the very people who should comprise the show's audience, and it is insulting. Then, again, looking at how the show treats its straight characters, at least Will is being placed opposite caricatures, rather than established characters who had to be retconned in order to be adversarial.

[Primetimer]

Will it cost him and Rayna custody of Maddie?

View the full article

[Clemgo3165]

58 minutes ago, DeLurker said:

Charles Esten and Jonathon Jackson have the same problem - a fuming Deacon or sad, hurt almost crying Deacon (or Avery) is too much catnip for the writers to let be happy for more than one scene per season.

But Chip has the cutest smile and he's funny too. And JJ's pretty hot when Avery's happy. What a waste this season has been.

[marceline]

As someone with friends and family in recovery, the idea that Frankie would break Deacon's confidentiality left me fuming so much I couldn't pay attention to anything else. Granted, 12 Step sponsors don't have the same legal protection of a doctor, lawyer or priest but it's generally acknowledged that the only good reason to break confidentiality is if you feel that the person is a current threat to themselves or someone else. The very nature of addiction means that people in recovery have often done heinous, criminal things. For Frankie to just hand all that over to a lawyer for Maddie's fucking emancipation hearing is unconscionable and he should be reported to the local AA district office because he's proven that he will violate anonymity if it serves his purposes. That makes him a threat to everyone in the room with him.

I'm really disappointed in the show just using this as a plot point without addressing the seriousness of the violation. I shudder to think what someone who might be considering going into recovery would think having watched this episode.

Edited May 5, 2016 by marceline

[AnnaRose]

8 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I just can't with these characters. It's like everyone has had a lobotomy to remove all traces of intelligence, ability to make decisions, and positive personality traits.

Maddie is a selfish, hurtful child for letting the lawyer use ANY of that information about Deacon in court. It was manipulative enough of her to let the lawyer use the recent events, knowing that he was grieving for Beverly the first time and protecting Maddie and Rayna the second time (I'll leave the third one out of the discussion since there was so much debate about it when it happened). But to let that lawyer bring up shit that happened 20+ years ago? Sorry, that is crossing the line into unforgivable. She knew how much it would hurt Deacon and she did it to further her stupid agenda.

Deacon is an idiot. After listening to the lawyer list all these past acts of violence and having to admit to them, his reaction is to go to the bar to confront Frankie? Like Rayna said, WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN? I mean, seriously. Did Deacon think Frankie would say, "So sorry, old chap. That was a shitty thing to do. Can you ever forgive me? Let's hug it out!"? And then he totally fell for the oldest trick in the book. Frankie was totally baiting him because he wanted Deacon to punch him, knowing that it would mean Maddie winning her case. If you know that you have impulse control problems, remove yourself from the situation. In other words, if you know you are going to want to punch someone the night before your daughter's custody case is decided DON'T CONFRONT SAID PERSON. Like seriously, Deacon couldn't wait a whole day to go punch Frankie?

Thank you for saying that so much better than I could have. 

1 hour ago, DeLurker said:

Frankie, Cash, Maddie, and Layla need to be in the Beverly when it goes up in flames.

Ooh, that's even better than my hopes for a fiery car crash.   Then we could be free of reminders of Saint Beverly too.

[scra22]

11 minutes ago, marceline said:

As someone with friends and family in recovery, the idea that Frankie would break the Deacon's confidentiality left me fuming so much I couldn't pay attention to anything else. Granted 12 Step sponsors don't have the same legal protection of a doctor, lawyer or priest but it's generally acknowledged that the only good reason to break confidentiality is if you feel that the person is a current threat. The very nature of addiction means that people in recovery have often done heinous, criminal things. For Frankie, to just hand all that over to a lawyer for Maddie's fucking emancipation hearing is unconscionable and he should be reported to the local AA district office because he's proven that he will violate anonymity if it serves his purposes. That makes him a threat to everyone in the room with him.

I'm really disappointed in the show just using this as a plot point without addressing the seriousness of the violation. I shudder to think what someone who might be considering going into recovery would think having watched this episode.

This show has a habit of sending bad messages about certain causes. Thinking about donating an organ to a loved one? Don't watch the episode where Beverly dies. Suffering from postpartum depression and want to get help? Hope you didn't lose your husband, who shows you no sympathy, to your worst enemy first. 

[DeLurker]

24 minutes ago, marceline said:

As someone with friends and family in recovery, the idea that Frankie would break the Deacon's confidentiality left me fuming so much I couldn't pay attention to anything else. Granted 12 Step sponsors don't have the same legal protection of a doctor, lawyer or priest but it's generally acknowledged that the only good reason to break confidentiality is if you feel that the person is a current threat. The very nature of addiction means that people in recovery have often done heinous, criminal things. For Frankie, to just hand all that over to a lawyer for Maddie's fucking emancipation hearing is unconscionable and he should be reported to the local AA district office because he's proven that he will violate anonymity if it serves his purposes. That makes him a threat to everyone in the room with him.

I'm really disappointed in the show just using this as a plot point without addressing the seriousness of the violation. I shudder to think what someone who might be considering going into recovery would think having watched this episode.

Thank you!  I only know about AA and NA from a distance, but I was sure that disclosing what was shared in a meaning or as a sponsor was a serious matter that was only done under extreme circumstances.

And what's Frankie's dog in this fight?  Why does he give a damn about whether or not Maddie gets emancipated?

[Mierin]

Thanks for that explanation - I also spent most of the episode wondering if, legally, it was ok that  Frankie would just divulge everything that Deacon had told him as a sponsor.  Then I got super pissed off with the whole storyline.

I've tried to be patient with Maddie, but she is just the worst.  

[marceline]

On a more shallow note, it's time to start dressing Juliette differently on stage. That flesh-colored sparkly thing did Hayden no favors but even more importantly, Juliette isn't the Taylor Swift wannabe she was when the show premiered. The character has evolved and her style needs to evolve with her. She can still be youthful, bright and sexy without being jammed into what looked like a sequined condom. I've always had issues with Juliette's dresses because I keep imagining what it's like for the people in the front rows to be giving Juliette a visual pap smear but now she looks like someone who is trying too hard and I don't think that's what they mean to convey.

[Kathemy]

51 minutes ago, marceline said:

As someone with friends and family in recovery, the idea that Frankie would break the Deacon's confidentiality left me fuming so much I couldn't pay attention to anything else. Granted 12 Step sponsors don't have the same legal protection of a doctor, lawyer or priest but it's generally acknowledged that the only good reason to break confidentiality is if you feel that the person is a current threat. The very nature of addiction means that people in recovery have often done heinous, criminal things. For Frankie, to just hand all that over to a lawyer for Maddie's fucking emancipation hearing is unconscionable and he should be reported to the local AA district office because he's proven that he will violate anonymity if it serves his purposes. That makes him a threat to everyone in the room with him.

I'm really disappointed in the show just using this as a plot point without addressing the seriousness of the violation. I shudder to think what someone who might be considering going into recovery would think having watched this episode.

This is the best post in the thread.

Edited May 5, 2016 by Telepath
Do Not Engage.

[Kathemy]

30 minutes ago, marceline said:

On a more shallow note, it's time to start dressing Juliette differently on stage. That flesh-colored sparkly thing did Hayden no favors but even more importantly, Juliette isn't the Taylor Swift wannabe she was when the show premiered. The character has evolved and her style needs to evolve with her. She can still be youthful, bright and sexy without being jammed into what looked like a sequined condom. I've always had issues with Juliette's dresses because I keep imagining what it's like for the people in the front rows to be giving Juliette a visual pap smear but now she looks like someone who is trying too hard and I don't think that's what they mean to convey.

I agree. The dresses they have Juliette in aren't flattering at all for her build. She's a short, rather voluptuous woman and that style makes her look fat, which she is not, and yes - Juliette made a point of getting away from teenybop diva. A wardrobe change would be among the first things she'd bother with.

By the way, why do some posts condense and others don't? I was assuming this one would merge with my last one, as they often do. Sorry for double-posting.

Edited May 5, 2016 by Telepath
Q

[politichick]

Given how strongly many of you have reacted to the show, maybe you don't hate it as much as you think. That said, i still love it and would appreciate it if you wouldn't wish for its cancellation! :)

I'm starting to wonder if maybe Deacon, who was a complete ass to go to The Beverly is, unbeknownst to him, Chance's biological father. That wold explain some of Frankie's pure hate for him--talented, gorgeous, and fucked his wife and Chance's strange desire to wrangle Maddie away from her family because she has everything Chance wishes she'd had when she was growing up. Either way, the two are pure evil and I want them to die, too, but not my show.

I like Gunnar and Scarlet together, but I need them stop acting like junior high students.

While many people have grown more accepting of the LGBT community, there are absolutely people like that newscaster and other homophobes we've seen on the show out there. Poor Will, though. He needs to pull his head out of the stand and man up for the gays!

I like seeing Juliette showing growth and hope she doesn't make any huge stumbles Avery's going to find out about Juliette's involvement in Jeff's demise and that Crayla found out about it and put it all together. Then she will be cooked.

[GaT]

8 minutes ago, Telepath said:

By the way, why do some posts condense and others don't? I was assuming this one would merge with my last one, as they often do. Sorry for double-posting.

I think it has to do with timing. Before the upgrade, any posts in the same thread that you posted within 5 minutes of each other condensed into one. It's probably still the same.

[evilmindatwork]

4 minutes ago, politichick said:

I like Gunnar and Scarlet together, but I need them stop acting like junior high students.

 

Yes! This pair like many of the original pairings (Juliette - Avery, Deacon-Rayna) are better together than apart but they need to stop putting them in false conflicts. 

 

4 minutes ago, politichick said:

I'm starting to wonder if maybe Deacon, who was a complete ass to go to The Beverly is, unbeknownst to him, Chance's biological father. That wold explain some of Frankie's pure hate for him--talented, gorgeous, and fucked his wife and Chance's strange desire to wrangle Maddie away from her family because she has everything Chance wishes she'd had when she was growing up. Either way, the two are pure evil and I want them to die, too, but not my show.

 

These writers probably would go there. I just don't see why Frankie hates Deacon all of a sudden, and I don't think his jealousy over the bar is a good explanation. If he valued his independence so much he would have said no to the partnership in the first place. 

[grannygeek]

Ah gee, I read the posts here and a recap on another forum and I'm just sad, not even mad anymore. Working towards indifference, I guess. And guess won't go check out the drivel after all.

Nashville used to be must-see TV for me along with several others that lately I just don't care enough about. I recently cut the cord, got a rooftop antenna, Hauppauge PVR stick and between that and Hulu, Amazon and PlayOn am getting my TV fix differently. Quit Netflix - bored with that too after so many years with them. I have to think a little bit more about what I'm gonna watch rather than mindlessly bringing up the dvr programming grid and click, click - record, then dump half the shows later.

I find when I have to think about them there just aren't that many shows worth the bother anymore.

[Kathemy]

6 minutes ago, politichick said:

While many people have grown more accepting of the LGBT community, there are absolutely people like that newscaster and other homophobes we've seen on the show out there. Poor Will, though. He needs to pull his head out of the stand and man up for the gays!

Yes, there  absolutely are a lot of assholes out there. That's not in dispute. My problem with the way this story is written is that from what we see on the show, the only people who are ever shown to be accepting of Will are his personal friends and other homosexuals. It creates a character "under siege" and to an extent it just tells people in the closet "don't ever come out, there'll be hell to pay" with absurd overexaggerations. The other problem is that at this stage Will is more and more driven into the Token Gay character role. His entire story is Being Gay. A cat is defined as being a cat. Even if the cat was gay, the cat would still be defined as a cat. A human is defined as being human. Gay people are also humans.

[NYGirl]

Every time Juliette is on the screen I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop.  It's not like her not to be a force to be reckoned with.  Mark my words she'll be her old self soon.

i love Will and I can't believe the country music community is like they say it is about gays.

god I hate Frankie and Cash.

i was so happy for Scarlett and Gunnar last week. Now I'm sad again :(

[Fisher King]

2 hours ago, NorthstarATL said:

I wonder if the writers realize that this is actually 2016 and there are gay people in every industry and most genres of music, with country being more accepting than some. They are denigrating the very people who should comprise the show's audience, and it is insulting. Then, again, looking at how the show treats its straight characters, at least Will is being placed opposite caricatures, rather than established characters who had to be retconned in order to be adversarial.

Well stated! This show is an equal opportunity offender. No one, no issue is safe. It's like their MO is to form a 5 second heartfelt, awww moment and then see how quickly they can destroy it. Everyone in Will's circle accepts him, as it should be. But nooooo. Let's bring on the Ann Coulter wannabe to blow that all to hell & let the haters breathe a sigh of relief. Same with the AA and addiction storyline. Real issues need some kind of respect.

Yes, this is just a TV show. Meant to entertain, not teach life lessons, but dang. I like discussing events in TV shows but it's very hard to seriously discuss the rationale in this show when its producers don't give a shit.

Quote

ETA: The Trouble with the episode is that it feels like things are moving backward, for the sake of ... what? Ramping up the angst until the finale? Will, Luke, and Deacon are all in the same places they've been in earlier arcs in the show, not to mention this Ground Hog Day: The Musical! that Scarlett and Gunnar appear to be trapped in.

Spew! This really is Groundhog Day.

----

I wonder how well the live concert appearances are doing & if that affects the reason why Will & Layla stay on the show with dismal storylines.

[H8Maddy]

I used to really like this show. I got tricked into watching a soap opera. I actually like where a lot of the show is. I think Wills story is working its way through an important subject. Granted I thought they were dragging it out too long but now after this last show, Will should cowboy up. I've always hated the Juliette character but learned to deal with it. I hope they bring back the girl who was living in her car. I wanted to see more of that story. I don't even really mind the Gunner & Scarlet BS but this Maddy/Cash/Frankie stuff has got me thinking about stop watching the show. Its sad for me but more. Its gotten to the point where I created this account to complain about Maddy. I don't think its too late for the show but I can't help but feel that they are about to jump the shark and get cancelled.

[Kathemy]

This show jumped the shark in season one, episode fifteen.

[LotusFlower]

15 hours ago, thegriswolds said:

At this point I am only watching this show to see Maddie get her comeuppance.  

Me too.  I so want Liberated Maddie to crash and burn.  But my fear is that only Cash and Frankie will be portrayed as the bad guys.  Innocent Maddie's only crime was to be manipulated by those with hidden agendas or an ax to grind, and she'll be welcomed back with open arms.  

[madam magpie]

7 hours ago, candall said:

You know that thing about how the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference?

I guess I've emancipated myself from this show because I just laughed and laughed.  Of course Deacon RACES to initiate a confrontation where he's helpless to control his rage.  That's his daughter!  Of course sad sack Gunnar stretches like a rubber band to turn a Scarlett remark into a betrayal and their love is fatally blighted.  Again.  Of course Maddie's influenced by evil outsiders to human-sacrifice her parents.  She knows in her heart it's wrong!  Poor Maddie.  Poor everyone.  So sad. [sarcasm font]

Okay, whatever, show.  Hey, that Rayna character sure has great hair.

 

.

POOR US!

[Kathemy]

16 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

Me too.  I so want Liberated Maddie to crash and burn.  But my fear is that only Cash and Frankie will be portrayed as the bad guys.  Innocent Maddie's only crime was to be manipulated by those with hidden agendas or an ax to grind, and she'll be welcomed back with open arms.  

Poor Innocent Maddie™ will be welcomed back because she was manipulated by Cash and Frankie. Cash will be redeemed because Frankie Did Something Horrible To Her When She Was A Baby™. Frankie will be the one thrown under the bus. It's a pattern for this show.

[A.Ham]

Maddie? Has to be slapped into the stratosphere. That is all.

[Sutton]

Telepath - Did any of these writers (or anyone tell them this is a very sensitive road to travel with AA) do any research before they wrote this scene about someone involved in AA as a sponsor doing what Frankie did giving details of what's suppose to be very sensitive life experiences in alcoholics pasts. Did they ever consider what the consequences would be having Frankie blab out Deacon's problems and what this might cause people to think before going to AA but opting not to go to AA meetings because of this horrendous betrayal . They wrote him as a friend to Deacon in last weeks episode going to the cemetery giving him support telling him he deserved to marry Rayna and in this episode he's Deacons worst enemy. Telling his daughter/lawyer all he knows about Deacon's past. I wish these writers ?? would make up their minds on writing the characters as friends or foes. What a kick in the a_s for those AA people who need help to question if there is a possibility that someone might do just that. This episode was so down in the dumps/hole can they ever climb out of it.

Maddie is one hell of a spoiled brat and I as others would like to see her fall hard thinking she so good and finding out the hard way your so call friend and father are taking advantage of you so they can make money off of you. How many more episodes do we have because I don't think there's enough time to clear what's happened so anyone want to guess what the Cliff Hanger will be if we get a season #5 ???

[candall]

8 minutes ago, Telepath said:

Poor Innocent Maddie™ will be welcomed back because she was manipulated by Cash and Frankie. Cash will be redeemed because Frankie Did Something Horrible To Her When She Was A Baby™. Frankie will be the one thrown under the bus. It's a pattern for this show.

Hee, IKR?  Rayna was still sobbing in the courtroom and I could already SEE the scene where she folds a tearful contrite Maddie into her warm embrace.

[Kathemy]

9 minutes ago, Sutton said:

Maddie is one hell of a spoiled brat and I as others would like to see her fall hard thinking she so good and finding out the hard way your so call friend and father are taking advantage of you so they can make money off of you. How many more episodes do we have because I don't think there's enough time to clear what's happened so anyone want to guess what the Cliff Hanger will be if we get a season #5 ???

I can't guess the cliffhanger, I know what the cliffhanger will be.

[WhosThatGirl]

Just a note to the recap writer: There was a brief mention of Daphne, Rayna said to Deacon when they came home she would call the person whose house Daphne was staying at(I forget the name but it was said) and then Rayna said she couldn't because she was exhausted and couldn't speak to anyone.

[Ava]

I'm much too practical to be watching this show.  My first thought after seeing Will's vehicle being vandalized is "How the hell did they know where he lives!"  Will lives with Gunnar and Avery in Gunnar's house.  Do random people just know that?

[Kathemy]

3 minutes ago, Ava said:

I'm much too practical to be watching this show.  My first thought after seeing Will's vehicle being vandalized is "How the hell did they know where he lives!"  Will lives with Gunnar and Avery in Gunnar's house.  Do random people just know that?

They must have an excellent gaydar.

[MisterS]

15 hours ago, Sandman said:

I don't think he was drinking; I just think the show changed its mind about him, and now that it needs him to be a skeezy, selfish douchebag, his makeover is completed by having him preen around the Beverly like he's the cock of the walk.

Was there a reason for this? Originally Frankie seemed like an ok dude but for some reason there's been a total turnaround. It's preposterous and I just don't buy the premise that he is so jealous of Deacon that he would go to all this trouble. Same with Cash - what the hell is her motivation? 

The Scarlett and Gunnar dynamic is so boring. 

These showrunners treat their audience like idiots.

[pattycat]

  3 hours ago, marceline said:

As someone with friends and family in recovery, the idea that Frankie would break the Deacon's confidentiality left me fuming so much I couldn't pay attention to anything else. Granted 12 Step sponsors don't have the same legal protection of a doctor, lawyer or priest but it's generally acknowledged that the only good reason to break confidentiality is if you feel that the person is a current threat. The very nature of addiction means that people in recovery have often done heinous, criminal things. For Frankie, to just hand all that over to a lawyer for Maddie's fucking emancipation hearing is unconscionable and he should be reported to the local AA district office because he's proven that he will violate anonymity if it serves his purposes. That makes him a threat to everyone in the room with him.

I'm really disappointed in the show just using this as a plot point without addressing the seriousness of the violation. I shudder to think what someone who might be considering going into recovery would think having watched this episode.

This is the best post in the thread.

So, so true, about the seriousness of Frankie violating AA confidentiality. We're still clueless, about what is motivating Frankie. This isn't just jealousy. Good grief, the man is pushing Senior citizen status. It's not like he's some impetuous kid.

Just a couple episodes back, Deacon saw him thru a relapse. And this is how Frankie responds? Is the man mentally ill? It's like he has suddenly developed a new personality!

And Rayna's attorney; did he do or attempt to do, anything to counter the attack on Deacon? I never saw him interrogating Deacon, giving him a chance, to, at least explain the examples that Maddie brought up. And he also didn't seem to go after Maddie, quizzing her about the circumstances, of the examples she gave. All I saw, was him asking Maddie, if Deacon ever hit her.

Deacon's choice to go to the bar, without telling Rayna, was, indeed foolish. I can certainly understand the impulse, and he did try to avoid a fight, but it was a bad choice. It's also, a choice that I don't think, the Deacon that we've seen evolve, over 4 Seasons, would have made. Another plot point, written just for drama, regardless of how much it hurts the character.

[MisterS]

8 hours ago, smiley13 said:

 This may spell the end for The Beverly. 

We can only hope.