S04.E18: The Trouble with the Truth

[Brinny]

Why can't Juliette have nice things? 

Or the viewers. Why can't the viewers have nice things?

Oh, and kudos to the show for finally making me like Luke Wheeler. I guess all it took was him going to bat for Will and doing a solid for Juliette (I mean, doing a solid by grinding up on her in front of an audience of people, but still). Who knew? 

[kismet]

My initial thoughts on the episode without reading above posts, was that is was really awesome and I didn't want it to end. I mean people were making dumb choices for good reasons in pure Nashville style... but I really wanted it to last a little longer. I felt the characters were having some good character beats.

Although I didn't need to relive why Gunnar & Scarlett broke up, that was painful enough the first time and only killed the high I was on after the elevator episode. Glad Juliette is showing growth by letting Avery go and being honest with Layla. It's a nice mirror to Avery who continues to make bad choices, he is just signing on for Juliette v2 with Layla - the only difference is I think Juliette is more mentally stable than Layla (and that is not saying much). Poor Will, I really like what they are doing with his storyline. It doesn't feel too preachy, but I really wish the poor guy could catch a break. Luke seems to be doing better in his mentoring roles, but should have really listened to Will. I like him as a label head, but he needs a Bucky to help him steer the ship. I don't mind that he sung with Juliette, but I hope they don't do a romance with them. I was very glad to see Derek Hough back in the next episode. Juliette needs to try moving on but not with an older guy again and certainly not her boss/touring partner.

What is there to say about Rayna, Deacon & Maddie? It just breaks my heart all around. Knew that the emancipation would happen. I was really hoping they didn't throw Deacon under the bus to make it happen. But knew nothing good was going to come out with Frankie being in court. Seriously can Cash & Frankie just be gone? They are the Drama bringing Duo. I hope the alley has video with recording to help Deacon out. However, I really wish Deacon had just stayed home or had the conversation in a less secluded place. Cash & Frankie do seem to share some deep jealousy and resentment issues. I hope they are not kept on in future seasons. Maddie needs to wise up soon and realize that she got played and in doing so help contribute to the destruction of her family.

I hope the show gets another season. But it felt like they were nicely tying stuff up for a potential cancellation last week and then this week they blew everything up again. So maybe they know something we don't? I love Nashville, I don't want it to end. But if it must, can't it end on happy notes for everyone? I don't see how anyone really gets to a happy place soon enough after this episode :( Which come to think of it is probably why I didn't want this episode to end. Too much needed to be fixed and no quickie conversation was gonna fix it.

[TWP]

On 5/5/2016 at 8:35 PM, madam magpie said:

Ohmygawd! This show is so dumb!! 

Ahem.

I do still love Emily and Glenn, though.

Don't forget Cadence!  She is still likeable....but I'm sure it's only a matter of time before she becomes another evil child ;-).

Edited May 7, 2016 by TWP

[Sandman]

I'm thinking that "What did you think would happen?" should be words for these characters to live by. Mind you, "Lay off the cheap cocaine, writers" might work just as well.

I also begin to think that ultimately these characters aren't allowed to be happy for long because country music tradition of "hurtin' songs" means that misery is their stock in trade. 

[MusicCityFan]

Awful episode like everyone's been saying- and just an awful year as a whole. The fans (and the main six actors) deserve better and the show deserves to be canceled.

Why do the writers think we'd want to see everyone so unhappy all the time? Weekly episodic TV to me anyway has always been about having characters to root for every week. But so many of the characters are inconsistently written and they're put in such hideous circumstances that there is nothing left to root for

Miss the days when we had the main characters' storylines intersecting- like when Deacon would team up with Avery and Gunnar and interact with Scarlett.  Have we even seen a Juliette/Deacon scene? Miss when we actually had humor and real romance and better music performed by the actual main characters.

Does the girl who plays Maddie have just a very good tan? Maggie used to be fairer skinned it seemed. In reading peoples' comments on this board, I am trying to think which have been the absolute WORST storylines on this show, and I think the Maddie/Cash/Frankie one has to be at the top of that list. I think it might even top Juliette's psychotic PPD that resulted in the stupidest death on a show ever about a character that mostly no one cared about. Or maybe not- there are other loser SLs out there - Gunnar's brother and fake child also come to mind. Or maybe Teddy's hooker girlfriend or Teddy's pork blood Peggy... the list is long.

The Scarlett - Gunnar will they/won't they stay together thing is just tiresome. It's like groundhog day every day with them. At this point, even the most loyal S-G shippers may not even care.

If the show starts putting Deacon (who they made into a complete moron by going to the Beverly- and again I am throwing up a little in my mouth just by typing 'the Beverly' ) -  at odds with Rayna to create some contrived drama/marital tension-- that will be yet another insult to the fans.

Disagree with those who have said Avery's being a jerk to Juliette. He's actually been pretty decent to her given all that he's been through- though he needs to stop whining- just like Deacon needs to stop being an idiot. Because even thought Juliette was ill (with this psycho PPD that the writers have lazily now just put away like it was nothing) - he did get abandoned a few times (as well as his child). But I think the problem is that many of the fans so love Juliette (me included) - and the writers have put her through SO MUCH ridiculousness- that it's hard to not want her these days getting what she wants- and of course most of us want Javery back. Layla and Avery together bore me. But Layla has always bored me. Hopefully despite how badly the writers have written the Javery drama they aren't done yet. Don't think they will go the Juliette /Luke route-- looks like she hooks up with the actor (from the movie). Will be glad when the movie/Oscar storyline is done-- it may have gone longer than Juliette's pregnancy.

IF anybody's got any spoilers/reasons for us to look forward to the season finale -like maybe something good actually happens for a change-   please share in one of the other threads.

As a loyal fan who still wants to believe in the show, looking for a reason to watch and enjoy it again. Because right now the trouble with the truth is the truth is Nashville just isn't very good anymore.

Sorry for all the negativity- still hoping it gets better.

[kismet]

I keep on reading here that there are new Showrunners and perhaps writers coming for Nashville if it does make it to s5... is this true? And when did the current team find that out?

I only really wonder because 418 really felt like they decided to tear down all of the storylines they just sorta set on the road for closure in 416/7. Will is getting respect from Luke and then on the radio. S/G reunited. Javery on the mends. Still had the emancipation crapola, but the verdict from the judge could have tied it up for a happy finale. Then 418 happened and now it's all a mess again only with more collateral damage like Deacon/Rayna tension & drama now. About the only storyline that still seemed to be on the smooth road to finishing happy was Luke, but that's only because he has become the cheerleader/mentor of lost souls.

It's almost like the writers/showrunners knew they were headed for cancellation, started to clean up some storylines to end on a good note. But then they got the notice of eviction and decided to torch everything to leave nothing for the new people. Because as much as I love the show, they have really run it into the ground this season especially on the Rayna/Deacon front which is the heart of the show. That whole Frankie betraying Deacon by betraying his AA pledge was a line too far to cross in my opinion. What purpose does it serve the show to have Deacon in jail again?

[CreamedPeas]

I don't get why some are saying that Avery' s been an asshole. Juliette was a psycho and a missing parent for quite awhile. Part of the reason she was like that was PPD. But she's been a pain in the ass in their relationship almost the entire time. I also don't hate Layla as much as some others do. Yes, I eventually would like to see Avery and Juliette back together, but Avery has absolutely NO reason to "crawl" back to her. He was the one raising their daughter and trying to make money while Juliette was gone. 

I like the show and its been pretty dark here lately but if everyone was running around in perfect relationships singing at concerts and meeting for Shirley Temple happy hours, people would bitch then that the show was lame and boring. 

I,for one, hope the show is renewed. 

[LJonEarth]

On 5/7/2016 at 9:09 PM, Attatude said:

Maddie's behavior is totally predictable.  She has terrible parents. Reyna is always gone and the girls were left first with their criminal father, then Reyna's anxious sister, and finally Deacon.  His behavior has been out of control for years. Then they dumped Maddie on Cash because the parents couldn't bother to parent her, without knowing anything about Cash except who her father is.  Yes, she's being a spoiled brat but that is who they raised. She's doing what they allowed her to do.  I have no sympathy for Reyna, who went from married, to Luke, to Deacon in a short amount of time instead of being a mom to her girls. They need her more than all these self centered men do.  She should have waited to get involved until the girls were out of the house.

This is how I've always felt about Reyna and Deacon. I've always felt like that was the minority view. If they had written Maddie as being really hurt and confused and reactionary to her circumstances, it would have been fine. But, I'm not even sure how she became this awful because they didn't really write her turn as directly coming from her parents' drama. It's all just weird.

[EyesGlazed]

I must be watching a different show from most of you, because I'm into it!!  At the start of the season I would have been mildly sad if Nashville had been canceled, but now I've been drawn in again by the soapy, soapy plots and I'm happy that it looks like it will be renewed.  Maddie is the worst and I can't wait for her to discover that it's hard out here for a pimp.  Cash and Frankie are the second worst and they're going to let Maddie down big time.  I actually like Avery and Layla together and the love triangle with Juliette is compelling.  Poor Rayna and Deacon: I want them to get through this.  Luke:  you're a good guy dealing with everyone's problems and you deserve a break.  Scarlett and Gunnar:  Yeah I'm a bit tired of the back and forth but I'll still watch you sing any time.  Will: I want to see you succeed, finally, in the next season.  

Maybe I am just easily entertained.

[TWP]

14 hours ago, CreamedPeas said:

I don't get why some are saying that Avery' s been an asshole. Juliette was a psycho and a missing parent for quite awhile. Part of the reason she was like that was PPD. But she's been a pain in the ass in their relationship almost the entire time. I also don't hate Layla as much as some others do. Yes, I eventually would like to see Avery and Juliette back together, but Avery has absolutely NO reason to "crawl" back to her. He was the one raising their daughter and trying to make money while Juliette was gone. 

I like the show and its been pretty dark here lately but if everyone was running around in perfect relationships singing at concerts and meeting for Shirley Temple happy hours, people would bitch then that the show was lame and boring. 

I,for one, hope the show is renewed. 

They wrote Avery as an absentee parent for a couple of episodes with him assuming that Juliette should stay home with the baby (without her input on the decision). Then she said ho wait a minute, I'm the one with the bigger career, at which point she became the absentee parent (and then the postpartum depression arose). Neither are jerks. Both like to go off on their own in the decision-making. They need way more communication and diplomacy in their relationship.  I feel sorriest for Cadence

[panthergirl13]

I think all the writers have quit and have been replaced by 3 old ladies using Mad Libs.

"Gloria, you can't keep using 'fight' as your verb! Think of another one and it can't be "drink" either!"

Edited May 8, 2016 by panthergirl13

[Guest]

I don't know what's wrong with the writing but it's just failing.  I don't care about any of these characters.   I actually found myself hoping they find Deacon hanging in his cell, just to put the poor character out of his misery.  Rayna could then spend 3 episodes in black dresses before hopping into bed with the next guy, like Layla did.   

How old is Maddie?  17?  Who cares if she moves out and gets off Rayna's free ride a year or two early?  Maybe she'll grow up a little.  I hope she spends the rest of her life waitressing in dive bars, wishing she had back what she lost.  Watching Daphne's solo career eclipse Taylor Swift's.  Visiting dead dad's grave, knowing she put him there.  Maybe she could wind up living in a car with those other lost girls.  Now that season I'd watch.  

[Kathemy]

<The original post was full of shit. Removing.>

Edited May 8, 2016 by Telepath

[AnnaRose]

6 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I don't know what's wrong with the writing but it's just failing.  I don't care about any of these characters.   I actually found myself hoping they find Deacon hanging in his cell, just to put the poor character out of his misery.  Rayna could then spend 3 episodes in black dresses before hopping into bed with the next guy, like Layla did.   

How old is Maddie?  17?  Who cares if she moves out and gets off Rayna's free ride a year or two early?  Maybe she'll grow up a little.  I hope she spends the rest of her life waitressing in dive bars, wishing she had back what she lost.  Watching Daphne's solo career eclipse Taylor Swift's.  Visiting dead dad's grave, knowing she put him there.  Maybe she could wind up living in a car with those other lost girls.  Now that season I'd watch.  

Sign me up for that season also!  That would redeem Nashville for me.

ETA: I also need Cash and Frankie to meet painful deaths.  I despise them more than anything and want them off my screen.

Edited May 8, 2016 by AnnaRose

[pattycat]

Wishing Deacon Dead?....

There are no words for how far off my Christmas you are @^@

[pattycat]

On May 7, 2016 at 7:09 PM, Attatude said:

!,

Maddie's behavior is totally predictable.  She has terrible parents. Reyna is always gone and the girls were left first with their criminal father, then Reyna's anxious sister, and finally Deacon.  His behavior has been out of control for years. Then they dumped Maddie on Cash because the parents couldn't bother to parent her, without knowing anything about Cash except who her father is.  Yes, she's being a spoiled brat but that is who they raised. She's doing what they allowed her to do.  I have no sympathy for Reyna, who went from married, to Luke, to Deacon in a short amount of time instead of being a mom to her girls. They need her more than all these self centered men do.  She should have waited to get involved until the girls were out of the house.

Why does Avery get involved with emotionally stunted lunatic women?  He's another one who should parent his baby and stop dating.  

I won't be disappointed if they end this show.  It's become a soapy farce.  I just want to hear the singers sing.

 

1.  Maddie most definitely does Not have terrible Parents. She has three Parents who love, and have always tried to protect her. She's been spoiled, yes, maybe a bit too sheltered.  She has a beautiful home, devoid of any type of abuse, all the food and creature comforts she could possibly want, and again, Parents who would do just about anything for her.

2.  Rayna is Not always gone. But, she is a music superstar. Her hard work has given her family a life of privilege. Of course she had to travel, so do millions of Parents.  Teddy for his mistakes, was a loving, attentive, devote Father.  Not like he was running the Nashville Mafiosa, out of the kitchen.  The girls adored him. He and Rayna gave them a safe stable life.  Rayna's Sister, is their beloved Aunt.  They're crazy about her and loved spending time with her.  Deacon has a temper and makes his mistakes, but, he too adores the girls, would do anything to keep them safe. He certainly has Not been out of control for years.  On the contrary, we've seen him grow ans show real character growth, over the seasons  

3.  Saying Rayna should have put her life on hold, till  the girls were grown, and out of the house,is, IMO, total nonsense.  A Martyr doesn't make the best Parent! In fact, they may make an angry resentful,Parent. The best mom's and dad's that I know, are happy, well adjusted people, living well rounded, satisfying lives.  Lives their kids are a big part of, but certainly not the only part. 

So Rayna waits for years, to have a personal life, just focusing on the kids.  The kids are grown and ready to move out,into their own lives, now what? She's alone and lonely.  Her busy kids pop in now and then, but, theyre wrapped up in a jillion things and wonder why Mom doesn't (Have a life) of her own!

[scra22]

On 5/7/2016 at 5:43 PM, CreamedPeas said:

I don't get why some are saying that Avery' s been an asshole. Juliette was a psycho and a missing parent for quite awhile. Part of the reason she was like that was PPD. But she's been a pain in the ass in their relationship almost the entire time. I also don't hate Layla as much as some others do. Yes, I eventually would like to see Avery and Juliette back together, but Avery has absolutely NO reason to "crawl" back to her. He was the one raising their daughter and trying to make money while Juliette was gone. 

Juliette's only real transgression in their dating relationship was the hate-sex with Jeff. Before that, they had a good relationship. After Avery forgave her and they got married, they went back to having a good relationship until she had the baby and the PPD set in. So I don't see her as being a nightmare the entire time when it comes to Avery - she was usually at her sanest and most calm with him. The way I see it is, Avery forgave her for Jeff. He married her. So I don't think it's fair of him to turn around and lump that time of pain in with her PPD-induced actions as if she is just continually trying to hurt him. If she had never gotten postpartum depression, she wouldn't have left. She wouldn't have hired Jeff to be her manager again. She wouldn't have gone on drinking and drug benders. That was all supposed to be because of the PPD making her run away from being a mother and numbing the pain, so the fact that Avery is not addressing that, showing no concern for that, and being outright hostile to her, makes him seem like an asshole to me. It's not even about him not taking her back  - I don't blame him for not being ready, and I don't think they're ready. I just don't see any sensitivity from him regarding what she went through - it's all about him and how he felt. He definitely had a tough go of it, but ultimately Juliette had it worse. She was suffering mentally, she was basically alone, and she almost killed herself (but I guess he doesn't know about that). So while I think he definitely has reason not to take her back, he could certainly be more sensitive with her. Starting with not sending the baby to her so that he can go have forget-about-Juliette-sex with Layla. 

[gryphon]

Quote

Give me an hour of Will in the shower.  You owe  me, show; you owe us all.   

And that grin that he had when "MY SONG IS ON THE RADIO!"  Loved that. 

Also loved Luke and Juliette on stage together.  When did I somehow start liking Luke?  

[CreamedPeas]

I think if Hayden wasn't going through PPD in real life, scar22, that that storyline wouldn't have rang as true to some that the Juliette character was suffering so badly from it. I think her real life struggle and having that storyline on the show has blurred lines. She's never been a saint from day one. It's my opinion that they didn't even show the PPD as much of a problem as her wanting to get away and drinking and drugging with PPD as an undertone to the story. 

 

I like Juliettes character for the most part. She's not as predictable as a lot of the others. But as far as her and Avery' s relationship being messed up, I put the majority of the blame on her. 

[kismet]

Avery & Juliette's relationship was always chaotic. I don't have the details off the top of my head right now. But when she found out she was pregnant, it was implied that she was going to terminate it without telling the father. There also was the potential that she was going to give it up for adoption, I think. So with that background, and then PPD on top of the escapism behavior - it probably has been hard for Avery to know how invested Juliette is in Cadence and in him.

I will say that I think Juliette is trying. I have always loved her and admired her perseverance through the struggles. But she has in many ways laid the seeds of being someone that is not easy to trust. Even before the baby, she had a tendency to run or self-destruct. Avery helped her through that, which was amazing. However, at some point you have to recognize your bad behavior and be willing to change. Juliette was slow to recognize her bad behavior and make amends. Then she got pregnant and had legitimate mental illness, which was bad timing.

I totally get where Avery is coming from. Just like I totally get where Juliette is coming from. I can only hope they keep an open communication with each other, because that is how I see them eventually making their way back to each other. Avery is DUMB as BRICKs for pursuing Layla, but he has always made dumb decisions and honestly looking at his history he tends to like to take on a little crazy. I just think Crayla is going to be the one that breaks Avery.

Sidebar- I know its a soap opera, but I really wish there was a way to keep Layla on the show without her needing to be in a romantic relationship with another main character. She was finally finding her groove on the show as just an artist, but once again they have to throw her in a romance that is only going to make her look bad. It's just an annoying choice be the writers.

Edited May 9, 2016 by kismet

[Clanstarling]

I could stomach Layla more if they stuck with the conniving to get Avery to hurt Juliette path they initiated the Avery/Layla storyline with. Then they sucked her into poor me, I need someone to love mode. I'd rather have her fiery and getting payback than pathetic. They change her personality to suit the needs of that week's plot. But then, it's what they're doing to everyone. I'm getting tired of sighing and rolling my eyes through most of the show.

As for Deacon, while I absolutely think it was terrible that any of his AA stuff got into the court record and there should be some kind of dispensation for that (and punishment for whats his face), he's been enough of a physically violent hothead sober that considering it is not without merit, though overblown by Maddie. I do not consider hurting furniture a strike against him, especially since he thought he was alone. If he'd known she was present, that's different.

Having been raised by a less loveable hothead, Deacon's choice to go have it out with what's his face rang absolutely true to me. Absolutely the kind of choice a rage-a-holic will make while telling themselves they just want a rational discussion.

[smartymarty]

I never thought that Layla was conniving. Not sure where that's coming from for people. And this episode confirmed it for me. I've felt that the writers redeemed the character post-Jeff's death.

[smartymarty]

I could stomach Layla more if they stuck with the conniving to get Avery to hurt Juliette path they initiated the Avery/Layla storyline with. Then they sucked her into poor me, I need someone to love mode. I'd rather have her fiery and getting payback than pathetic. They change her personality to suit the needs of that week's plot. But then, it's what they're doing to everyone. I'm getting tired of sighing and rolling my eyes through most of the show.

As for Deacon, while I absolutely think it was terrible that any of his AA stuff got into the court record and there should be some kind of dispensation for that (and punishment for whats his face), he's been enough of a physically violent hothead sober that considering it is not without merit, though overblown by Maddie. I do not consider hurting furniture a strike against him, especially since he thought he was alone. If he'd known she was present, that's different.

Having been raised by a less loveable hothead, Deacon's choice to go have it out with what's his face rang absolutely true to me. Absolutely the kind of choice a rage-a-holic will make while telling themselves they just want a rational discussion.

Because it's TV, he had to go see him, instead of IRL calling him on the phone.

[Attatude]

On May 8, 2016 at 7:53 PM, LJonEarth said:

This is how I've always felt about Reyna and Deacon. I've always felt like that was the minority view. If they had written Maddie as being really hurt and confused and reactionary to her circumstances, it would have been fine. But, I'm not even sure how she became this awful because they didn't really write her turn as directly coming from her parents' drama. It's all just weird.

A parent's job is to raise children to become competent, resourceful adults.  The children must feel like they are as important as her career and more important than finding a new husband. Reyna screwed up by getting pregnant with a drunk as the father, but she tried to make it right by marrying Teddy. It didn't fall apart until they needed a story for Deacon and her.  When we say her career and her love life are more important than her children, we are writing off the kids to raise themselves. I don't think that is right, fiction or not. Maddie is essentially raising herself. When Reyna is around, she is busy cleaning up fires with her business or her men.  

I miss Maddie and Daphne singing duets. That is the heart of the show.  I could not be less interested in Scarlett or Gunnar. Ever since she cut her hair, she has lost her personality as well.  Instead of maturing, they are getting younger and more idiotic.

It's too late for Will to have a decent story if the show ends. If it doesn't, a tip for the show runner. Give him an awesome story arc where he is a successful musician and stop dropping the poor guy into senseless relationships with men he will never get along with or hitting on straight guys. Please have some respect for him.

I can't stand Layla.  Every time she has a small success, she manages to turn it into a mess.  Why does Juliette feel her happiness lies only in having a relationship?  She needs to bond with her daughter and enjoy her Oscar nomination, and most important, stay sober.  I think Avery should date the nanny. She is the only stable woman in his life.

We are supposed to hate Cash and Frankie and we do. She seems like a stalker.  Maybe they could do something illegal and go to jail. He has already prodded Deacon into a fight. Why should Frankie get away with it?

The writers can't be parents.  They need to start looking out for the welfare of the children first, not the parents.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Attatude

[izabella]

On 5/8/2016 at 8:02 AM, TWP said:

They wrote Avery as an absentee parent for a couple of episodes with him assuming that Juliette should stay home with the baby (without her input on the decision). Then she said ho wait a minute, I'm the one with the bigger career, at which point she became the absentee parent (and then the postpartum depression arose). Neither are jerks. Both like to go off on their own in the decision-making. They need way more communication and diplomacy in their relationship.  I feel sorriest for Cadence

I think that was just after Juliette had given birth, so there was no reason for Avery to think Juliette shouldn't or wouldn't be home with the baby then.  But Juliette couldn't stand her career being sidelined by caring for a newborn and was barely paying any attention to her.  I get that was her PPD talking, but I don't blame Avery for not realizing she wouldn't want to be home with her newborn and not understanding Juliette's screaming need to get back on stage again right after giving birth.

Edited May 9, 2016 by izabella

[Guest]

I have trouble excusing Juliette entirely.  I've known a lot of women with PPD but none who just walked away from their baby like she did.  And she had the resources to hire all the domestic help she needed and get all the sleep and medical care she needed.  But the show presented it like she needed to be home alone, barefoot, nursing 24/7 or out on the road performing 24/7.   

A part of me wonders if Panettiere read the original scripts for Juliette and called her agent in a huff and said, "I don't care what you do, get me out of this shit show and it's awful depiction of new motherhood."  And the agent or publicist said, "Sorry, you're locked into a contract.  But you're a little depressed, right?  Let's say you needed a break from the show for your own PPD.  That way you get out of half the awful scenes and the show gets a little shot of reality imitating fiction to help it out.  And we can suggest to the network brass that if they don't get some decent writers your health might continue downward.  Because this show is truly depressing so we don't even really have to lie.  I want to slit my own wrists when I realize what it's doing to your resume."

Edited May 9, 2016 by Guest

[Attatude]

They had to do something while Hayden was on maternity leave.  I have no problem with them using her absence to screw up her relationship to make the story fit her time schedule. Now it's their problem to sort it out.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Attatude

[Guest]

I think this was filmed nearly a year after HP gave birth (not on maternity leave), and that she was written out of several episodes on the fly because Hayden decided to enter treatment for PPD herself.

[pattycat]

"I miss Maddie and Daphne singing duets. That is the heart of the show."

______________

I've really enjoyed the wonderful talent of the girls, but I don't, remotely see them as the heart of the show. That's no reflection on them. They're kids, and this is an adult drama. 

Deacon, Juliette, Scarlett, all had nightmarish childhoods!  Maddie doesn't have a clue, what that kind of a life is like, and, of course, I'd never wish it on her. 

I suspect she may find out, just how good she had it.  Were her parents perfect?  Of course not.  No such an animal.  

[vibeology]

I was way late getting around to this episode, which probably says something about how I feel about the show at this point. I laughed when Deacon did what Deacon always does and made an awful decision, got violent and screwed up a whole bunch of lives. People talk about how hard Deacon works or how much he's grown, but that's not really what we've seen over the course of this show. Deacon is an angry man who lets that anger rule him far too often. Maddie tried to warn Rayna and Rayna thought caveman Deacon was sexy so now its time to deal with the consequences. Maddie is an idiot who has no idea what she's getting herself into, but that doesn't change the fact that Deacon has serious problems and always will as long as he refuses to acknowledge it and work on it. Going to AA meetings clearly hasn't ever been enough because while it stopped the drinking, it didn't heal his anger that caused the drinking in the first place. He need therapy to work through these serious issues and I do hope if the show comes back next year they show Deacon seeking out help and actually growing.

I think it's very clear that Cash plans on managing Maddie, using Maddie to make contacts of her own and robbing her blind. She's pure ambition. Frankie is looking to take something Deacon loves away from him the way Deacon "took" the bar from Frankie. Instead of going there, Deacon should have sent a lawyer with a big, fat check to buy Frankie out. After all, Frankie certainly can't afford to buy Deacon out. That would have been the right way to clap back after Frankie betrayed him.

Loved Will and Luke's plot so much. It's depressing in a way because of the challenges Megyn Kelly presented but I think its very realistic and I loved hearing Luke and Will talk about how you should respond for these sorts of attacks. I don't think there's a right answer and I understood both perspectives. I think it's just a fascinating look at the country music scene because while I do think Will could find an audience, he won't ever be Luke Wheeler big and will always struggle against a vocal minority who try to boycott him and those who support him.

Hated the Scarlet/Gunner stuff. Why even bother putting them back together just to rip them apart one episode later. They could have still had the awkward interview without them being together the night before. It's just pointless the way they go back and forth. I know they're endgame so I don't see why they need to yo-yo over and over again.

The Avery/Layla/Juliette triangle doesn't but me as much because at least it seemed like all three ended the episode acting like mature adults. Juliette struggled but decided that actually putting Avery's needs and happiness first for once might be the right thing to do. As for "Crayla," I just don't get the criticism. Yes the show has rebooted her character several times but at least her rebooted character has been consistent. She's still grieving and in a lot of pain. She's attached herself to Avery because she's lonely but she does genuinely like him and she enjoys working with him. Her "evil plan" has been to be nice to him over and over, putting his needs first. I can't look at that and think poorly of her.

[izabella]

4 minutes ago, vibeology said:

I think it's just a fascinating look at the country music scene because while I do think Will could find an audience, he won't ever be Luke Wheeler big and will always struggle against a vocal minority who try to boycott him and those who support him.

That's the question I have - are the vocal homophobic minority really a minority?  Or are they a majority?  Because it doesn't seem like Will is really getting much support from anyone other than Luke.

[vibeology]

8 minutes ago, izabella said:

That's the question I have - are the vocal homophobic minority really a minority?  Or are they a majority?  Because it doesn't seem like Will is really getting much support from anyone other than Luke.

It's always hard to say because people who are okay with something rarely protest. Certainly, the radio DJ played his song and mentioned getting many requests, which means there are Will fans out there. We'll get a better sense of how Will is doing if they ever talk sales numbers but I don't think its surprising that people who don't know Will and have careers of their own are keeping their distance until they see how this plays out. All of Will's friends are on the road right now so it's no surprise Will is on his own, save Luke. There's a reason there aren't many country singers who are out and I can't think of one in the bro-country genre who actually is a success (though my memory could be failing me), which is where Will would be marketed. I think the show is doing a pretty good job predicting what it would be like for an artist like Will to find a space in the market.

[LJonEarth]

11 hours ago, izabella said:

That's the question I have - are the vocal homophobic minority really a minority?  Or are they a majority?  Because it doesn't seem like Will is really getting much support from anyone other than Luke.

What I get from Nashville (the city) is there seems to be a lot of apathy. There are the people who will stick their neck out to give support. And there's a silent majority that falls somewhere in between "I'm just not there yet and it doesn't really matter to me anyway" and "as long as I'm entertained, I'll keep listening to you." So, that host - depending on how big her platform was - might get in trouble. But if she were on a smaller station, she might anger some but others would just say that it's her right to express her feelings, I'm not protesting either way.

If Luke had a really catchy single, I don't see much keeping him from finding a place. Now country music isn't just played on country stations. Carrie Underwood shows up on pop stations. Country and folk singers show up on our alternative station. This show could show so much more about Nashville than just the Bluebird and the Ryman.

[STOPSHOUTING]

Not that this show is even remotely reasonable or realistic at ANY point, but that's not how emancipation works. That's not how any of this works. Legal emancipation is not done to ALLOW teens to be actors or musicians (when talking about high profile emancipated minors), it's done to PREVENT physical abuse or, more often, halt ongoing monetary siphoning, where the parents are draining their working child's nest egg.

There is also always an independent advocate set up by the courts to make sure the minor ISN'T just being manipulated by a new person, meaning the very fact that Cash is sitting next to her in court, would eliminate her as Maddie's possible manager, and her taking meetings all over town on Maddie's behalf would be not just a huge legal red flag, but likely void Maddie's emancipation claim altogether.

It's terrible that the two most consistently infuriating characters (three, if you count Gunnar's hair as a character) are also it's best singers: whiney, woe-is-me Scarlett, and the Maddie half of the real-life Lennon sisters. Several seasons ago when stupid Scarlett befriended that homeless person at the publishing company, I hoped he'd choke her to death with her own hair extensions. Now, I'm wishing Rayna would lace Maddie and Cash's bronzer with poison, which will kill them both off lickity split, given that Maddie is clearly bathing in the stuff.

Rayna: "But, judge, you can't let my daughter go with her; she's turned her into an Ooompa Lupa!" Judge: "You're right, Miss Rayna James, case dismissed" [crowd cheers; Maddie glowers while glowing orangely] <<<<-----There, fixed it for you Nashville writers.

Seriously, though, this show has been ridiculous since Rayna, literally, drove it off into a ditch way back in the Season One finale. At this point, it's not even a soap, it's more self-parody with occasional record sales. Oh and, given the appearance of both Jessy Schram and Alicia Witt in recent episodes, I'm assuming this season's cliffhanger is a will-she or won't-she regarding Rayna filming that Hallmark Christmas movie she was offered with Candace Cameron.

[Guest]

That bronze complexion paired with the blazing whiteness of her teeth just makes her toothy mouth shape look doubly odd.  I kept staring at those two big white front teeth that show under her lip.  Maybe they plumped her lips or something, too.  

[aradia22]

The writers can't really believe we want to see Avery with Layla can they? I mean, they did inexplicably try to sell us on Layla and Jeff so maybe? It's terrible. I never fast forward and I'm getting close to skipping their scenes.

The only good thing about Scarlett and Gunnar going over their stupid past was that it proves that the writers remember it. Aha, gotcha!

Deacon in court was rough. Frankie is the worst. I want Coleman back. And again, we're missing our one black person right now. That fight outside the Beverly was so nasty. Do they not a vetting process? How does such a hateful person become a sponsor? Surely you don't get to be one just because you overcome your own alcoholism. Of course I knew that Deacon was going to be set up with a fight or outburst as soon as he went into the bar. I'm only happy the writers didn't have him just get angry and at least had Frankie attack him first. I want to give them more credit but it's difficult.

Quote

I hate the storyline with Will. I understand that homophobia exists in country music, but things are changing in the right direction and the show should reflect that. No one in 2016 would host a talk show and say things like we can't listen to a song without thinking about gay men having sex. Something like that would be all over social media and the woman's show would be over. I get it that the show is trying to show support, but sometimes it feels like its doing the opposite. How about just having Will be another singer/songwriter trying to make it and his sex life doesn't matter to people?

My opinion is usually that selective realism is a bad argument. Why do we have to make sure to include sexism and racism and homophobia and a lack of diversity for realism? Now Nashville is not as much of a fantasy world as Lord of the Rings but it is a fantasy. Tons of things happen in this nonsense world that aren't realistic. So why do we keep the awful things? If you want to acknowledge Will being gay fine. Why don't you try and show the path forward? Maybe show him having a massive swelling of support but then feeling conflicted and wondering (as he did with the one record company) if he's getting the support because of his sexuality or because of his music. Hey, why not give him a boyfriend again and have him deal with that instead of making us shuffle through the same straight couples on this show over and over again. TV is not real life. The world is full of joy and love as well and sometimes telling those stories well is harder but more worthwhile.

No, no, Juliette. You're right to hate Layla. In spite of her voice and a couple of good moments (mostly Will related) Layla is awful. And I do not like Juliette taking responsibility for Jeff finally growing a conscience and trying to be a hero. Wasn't Jeff the one who ignored Juliette when she was floundering with her substance abuse and then locked her in a room or something? Good God. "Jeff has a bigger heart than anyone knew." Give me a break. You can't pull this St. Jeff stuff just because he died, Nashville writers. Juliette doesn't need to come clean like she did something. Sure, it's good that she told Layla the truth but she didn't kill Jeff. The writers killed Jeff. (Thanks, btw.)

Rubble doesn't fit Scarlett's voice. Personality wise, it seems more like Crazy Tonight which we were told wasn't a Scarlett kind of song. It's much more of a Juliette song. 

[aradia22]

Giving it some thought, it was still real stupid and fits more with this new broken Deacon who flies off the handle at every possible opportunity but I kind of get why he went to see Frankie. I can't imagine Deacon as the kind of person who sends a text or makes a phone call. He's always been the kind of guy who hashes things out in person. But Rayna was right. He couldn't have believed this was going to end differently than it did and it was dumb to go over there.

Speaking of season 1 Deacon, I feel like they did a personality transplant and gave a lot of his good qualities to Luke. The way Luke is supporting Will and Juliette? That's something Deacon would have done if he wasn't bogged down with all these nonsense plotlines.

I know that we were supposed to find all the gay slurs on Will's car very dramatic so is it wrong that I laughed? It's like some intern just googled gay slurs/slang. Will is not a twink.