Season 2 Discussion

[dubbel zout]

Bump for Sunday's season premiere. Yay!

[attica]

After W&P and Happy Valley, I feel like it's been a very Norton March! 

[magdalene]

One thing watching both Happy Valley and Grantchester has taught me is that Norton has a lot of range as an actor. 

[attica]

Well, he certainly spends a lot of time in both being sad, drinking, and looking off into the middle distance. HV just intercuts that with more violence. :)

[Pogojoco]

I'm putting this behind the wall of spoiler but 

I'm yelling a season long SHUT UP, AMANDA into the universe. God, she's a spoiled brat.

[sinycalone]

I'm putting this behind the wall of spoiler but 

I'm yelling a season long SHUT UP, AMANDA into the universe. God, she's a spoiled brat.

I'll be shouting right along with you.

[whatsatool]

Is Amanda the same actress in season two?

[Pogojoco]

It's just such a jerk move.

You can't marry someone else and go back to the dude who you didn't choose when your marriage is sad.

 

It's cruel. And I don't know whether the show runners want us to cheer for them as end game, but every time he got mopey about her last season and this one, I just want to smack him. Dude, you have remarkably good abs for a vicar. I suggest you use them. 

Is Amanda the same actress in season two?

Yes. Morven Christie. 

[whatsatool]

Thanks I couldn't tell.

Wasn't it expecting the swimming scene.

Edited March 28, 2016 by whatsatool

[magdalene]

Oh, they are going to dangle the Amanda carrot in front of hottie vicar for the entire run of the series I guess.  I know we are supposed to find them "romantic" and "true love" but I find him pathetic in his pining for her and don't get me started on what I think of her behavior. 

 

I would have vastly preferred they follow the books in which 

Sidney married Hildegarde and there wasn't all this soap opera drama

[JudyObscure]

So the message of the show was women ask men for help, therefore Amanda's letters were a cry for help and he should help her? No, just no. I've been trying to ignore his un-vicar-like approach to things -- it's ironic that the man who called him on his breach of confidentiality was the bad priest -- but for the  Amanda situation he really needs to remember his religion at least long enough for the, "whosoever God has joined together let no man put asunder," part. 

 

I thought Amanda looked better without her bangs, but I still don't like her.

 

Were we to suspect that Mrs. Maguire had a wild girlhood herself?

 

 I liked the swimming scene.  Dickens looked gorgeous all wet and shiny.

[Cranston]

i was a little disappointed in this second season opening episode.  One of the joys of last year was the banter and friendship of the two leads, the humor and warmth of many scenes.  This time...not so much.  If they're going to go all serious on me and if I have to watch Amanda (ugh) often, well, I'll continue to be disappointed. I do agree with you, JudyObscure, Dickens did look gorgeous, all wet and shiny.....

[dargosmydaddy]

Oh, Leonard. I think I missed you most of all...

[attica]

Ugh. What a terrible case. First of all, a rape allegation made in the fashion depicted wouldn't get police attention now, let along in post-war England. Even had Abigail made it herself, she'd be denounced as a liar, with absolutely nobody taking her side, (Here's a super interesting article on how False Rape Accusations are part of our mythology, quite in contrast to how it actually works in real life.)

 

But all right, I'm willing to (begrudgingly) put that aside as a McGuffin to get the show going. I don't even think that the discovery of a teenager's pregnancy would have moved the establishment to her defense either. She'd be dismissed as a slut, done and dusted, who got what she deserved, not defended as An Innocent Wronged and investigated to the case's end. Even Mrs. Maguire's reaction about abortion methods was not in keeping with her judgy persona (which, weirdly, was shown perfectly by her denunciation of the girl as a liar earlier in the ep).

 

But all right, let's put that aside too. That the church hierarchy supported the transfer of the offending priest is completely within tradition (however rage inducing). That the popo objected to how the church handled it? Not so much. Establishment supports establishment, Which is why newspapers got huge scoops in the 90s and 00s by uncovering past priestly misdeeds -- they were brushed under the carpet by everybody, not just the churches.

 

Very dissatisfying bit of tee vee. At least Norton's dye job and abs were on point. And a happy swimming doggie!

[magdalene]

The case was very upsetting but what made the episode such a downer and so unrelentingly grim was that everything in it was dark and depressing and negative. I want Sidney and Geordie to get along and not to be at odds and I am so sick of the Sidney/Amanda relationship. I have no sympathy for Amanda in her current domestic dissatisfaction, she shouldn't have married a man she clearly did not love.

 

A wet vicar and a swimming doggie are not enough to take the foul taste of the episode out of my mouth.

[dubbel zout]

Ugh, Amanda. It's so hard to be married to a wealthy man. Does she not have volunteer opportunities? Among her class there was a definite noblesse oblige, but perhaps she didn't get the gene.

 

The CoW was awkward, to say the least. As attica pointed out, there's no way it would have been handled they way it was. Show was trying to have it both ways, bringing in contemporary attitudes and outrage, and it didn't work. What I thought did work was how differently Geordie and Sydney saw the boy who ended up killing Abigail.

 

Loved seeing Dickens, but I wish we'd gotten at least one more episode where he was still a puppy.

[alias1]

I didn't enjoy this episode either.  I guess we're going back to the Sidney/Amanda drama (ugh).  I'm not happy that they've totally abandoned the books on which this is based. And now it looks like we're going to get Geordie drama as well.  I agree with others who have said that their relationship was part of the charm of this series and we didn't see any of it in this first episode.  

 

I wonder if there is more to the story of the girl who was killed.  It does seem to be a fact that she was afraid of her father (the chair against the door) despite his self righteous pontificating.

 

I was appalled that Geordie let that policeman torture the kid who was the murder suspect.  I hope future episodes get better

[zxy556575]

Grim, tortured Geordie and wracked, unhappy Sidney. How fun. Annoying Amanda is the cherry on top of the heaping pile.

 

I don't expect this to be a cozy English country series, but a bit of relief from the unrelenting dreariness would be nice.

[roomtorome]

I find it pathetic they had to throw in the swimming scene to show off their lead's body - just ugh.  And, the entire conversation was daft.  

 

I didn't care for this at all - I hated the scene where they were doing a version of waterboarding to the kid; I guess even these quaint BBC shows now feel a need to ramp up the torture porn along with the rest of television - sigh.

[AllAboutMBTV]

On the plus side, maybe Leonard has a new friend. Or "friend."

Honestly, I largely watch Grantchester for the scenery -- Norton, Green, Cambridge -- and the costumes and art direction (would I rather live at the vicarage or Amanda's?). The mystery is the least of it. I could have watched an hour of the opening picnic/swimming scene with the characters just sitting around talking (and Leonard snarking).

 

Hey, PBS: Where's Life In Squares and/or Lady Chatterley's Lover? Because, what with War and Peace, Happy Valley and Grantchester, James Norton hasn't been in my living room nearly enough lately (an impossibility, to be sure).

Edited March 28, 2016 by AllAboutMBTV

[sinycalone]

I think Geordie's reaction to the treatment of the victim and finding out who the "killer" was -- was realistic for a father.  OTT....but understandable..  A little anachronistic.

 

Sidney's reaction to the lack of real punishment for the priest...and sympathy for the boy/killer were believable.  He felt betrayed by the priest who was a friend, guilty about not helping the victim when came to him, and did not think a harsh penalty for the boy was justified.  

 

My problem was with the behavior of a lot of the villagers...including the police other than Georeie.  Inconsistent and probably not realistic for the times.

[tootsie]

O, yes & yes in agreement with those who found S2 ep1 unlikeable. I didn't enjoy it one bit...well, except for Dickens & all that vast expanse of English green. The countryside is so lovely. But in the intro didn't Alan Cumming say that Geordie was "unravelling" (or some such term)? (Or was that on the PBS FB page?) Anyway, I thought his curiously impassive response to the brutal interrogation and his equally curious final scene staring into space in his own kitchen with his family around him were hints of the future. I hope not. Mock little Miss Marple all you want, I usually enjoy a good murder (so to speak) with its red herrings & limited suspects more when it's low on angst.

[LaChavalina]

I didn't think it was all that bad, but starting the season on what was effectively a pedophilia case was an odd choice. 

 

As for Sidney's romantic life, 

I'm sorry Amanda came back, but I'm also happy to see they didn't follow the books. Hildegarde seemed so mis-cast to me. I never wanted them to end up together.

[dcalley]

The Easter egg in the PBS credits: Poor Folk. Was that what Leonard was reading in the scene where he hinted at the photographer's sexuality?

[AnnaMayWong]

The plotline was sad, the cultivation of it was somewhat weak, and the exploration of The Mystery was superficial.

I'm sorry(not), but the lovelorn angst betwixt Sidney and Amanda is tiresome in its' isolated role storyline and bewildering as to its' benefit for the overall storyline.

I appreciate and enjoy character and relationship development in my programs, however, I would appreciate and enjoy a cozier, more expansive murder mystery aspect to The Show as well.

I think James Norton to be generally good-looking, but not particularly attractive.

Also, hopefully, his 'acting nuances' will improve with experience from his, apparently, in demand opportunities. On the other hand, Robson Green as actor and male specimen is talented and appealing.

I luv British Murder Mysteries of this ilk and others--Midsomer Murder, Rosemary and Thyme, Miss Marple,...Endeavour, Inspector Lewis,...

Therefore, I will continue to view GRANTCHESTER despite a wee bit of disappointment.

...

ETA: *(just began and completed viewing Season 1 three days ago.)

Edited March 29, 2016 by BookElitist

[Merneith]

The Easter egg in the PBS credits: Poor Folk. Was that what Leonard was reading in the scene where he hinted at the photographer's sexuality?

 

It was - good catch! I like Leonard so much. I'd hate to see him get hurt. OTOH, I'd hate for them to whitewash his problems. Poor guy was trying so hard, with the kids. Kids are the worst.

 

Like everyone else on the planet except Sidney and apparently the producers, I'm all the way over Amanda.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Merneith

[treeofdreams]

 

I luv British Murder Mysteries of this ilk and others--Midsomer Murder, Rosemary and Thyme, Miss Marple,...Endeavour, Inspector Lewis,...

 

...Murder in Paradise (love all the characters, and the humor of it), Cadfael (wonderful medieval setting), Miss Fisher's Murder Mysteries (sizzling interaction between leads, and oh! the 1920s fashions!)...

Edited March 29, 2016 by treeofdreams

[HoodlumSheep]

Watched the ep!

Glad I didn't watch this on Easter. It was a heavy episode. Kinda dreary.

I wonder what's up with Geordie??? Depression? Something else?

Leonard is still a sweetheart. Dickens is still adorable.

You could definitely tell they were trying to incorporate modern (? Don't know if that's the best word to describe it) views concerning some of the issues they tackled. They were trying to be relevant, and it seemed a bit forced.

Hopefully it picks up.

Go.Away.Amanda.

I don't feel sorry for her at all. Shouldn't have ever married the guy. She knew she was going to be miserable. The "well back in the 50s..." Excuse doesn't fly with me either. She doomed herself.

Sidney and Amanda remind me of Alice and what's-his-face (was it Aafrin?) from Indian Summers. No chemistry but they keep getting shoved together.

So-so episode.

[AnnaMayWong]

To emphasize my previous thought(s) about Amanda+Sydney= Boring and Irritating, Sidney needs to back-off, also. He, too, is at fault for fostering this mess.

Amanda should focus on her marriage and sundry activities, jobs,... without associating with Sidney. And, Sidney needs to focus on his job, HIS SLEUTHING and MYSTERY SOLVING, and other relationships(fraternal, romantic, platonic,...), BUT emotionally and physically remove himself from Amanda.

(Hey, GRANTCHESTER Creative Staff ! Get that !)

[beadgirl]

Hey, TV, not everything has to be grim'n'gritty.  I really hope the next few episodes are lighter in tone.

 

 

Go.Away.Amanda.
I don't feel sorry for her at all. Shouldn't have ever married the guy. She knew she was going to be miserable. The "well back in the 50s..." Excuse doesn't fly with me either. She doomed herself.

No kidding.  First of all, yes it was the 50s but there were women who broke convention and expectations to achieve what they wanted; it was hard but it could have been done.  Second, she's a wealthy wife with no responsibilities (not even children yet); she could be doing so much more to find fulfillment -- studying, reading lots of books, creating art, setting up charities or civic groups, traveling, helping other people.  The last one in particular is quite good for getting your head out of your ass and recognizing the good things in your life.  Third, if she really wanted to she could divorce the guy (just like she could have not married him). Sure she'd lose her inheritance and piss off her father, but it's not like she'd end up homeless with her only option to turn tricks.  She needs to do *something* meaningful with her life, preferably off-screen and away from Sidney.

 

Is Hildegarde coming back in any capacity?  I liked her.

[proserpina65]

I agree with others who have said that their relationship was part of the charm of this series and we didn't see any of it in this first episode.

 

Actually we did, in the first five minutes before the other policeman showed up to arrest Sydney.  (We also got wet and still tasty Robson Green - what can I say, I like dad bods.)  Then the pretty much unrelenting misery started.  And, yes, enough of Amanda already; you made your bed, now lie in it.

On the other hand, Robson Green as actor and male specimen is talented and appealing.

 

Although I do have a better opinion of James Norton than yours, I wholeheartedly agree with this.  And to think, I once complained about there being nothing but Robson on my tv!  You know, many moons ago when he was on PBS and BBC America a lot. 

[dargosmydaddy]

 

Is Hildegarde coming back in any capacity?  I liked her.

Putting this in spoilers only because some people might want to avoid speculation based on the books, but considering Sydney marries her in the books, I'd be kind of surprised if she doesn't pop back up on the show eventually. Of course, book Amanda didn't marry Guy (and her friendship with Sydney was more friendly and less romantic) and Sydney didn't sleep with the jazz singer, so who knows where the show will end up going...

[magdalene]

One thing I really liked about Hildegard was that she came across as an adult. I miss her and if Sidney had ever gotten his head out of his ass and had not sabotaged their relationship she might have made him a fine wife. Then he could have concentrated on being a vicar and on his sideline as a sleuth without all this artificial and tedious angst that I really don't enjoy in any drama, but especially not in a cozy mystery.

Edited April 1, 2016 by magdalene

[HoodlumSheep]

I miss Hildegarde too. Like, I totally understand Hildegarde leaving, and will forever curse Sidney for screwing things up, but I miss her.

I'm not sure what to make of the new secretary lady that seems to be a possible new love interest for Sidney. She seems like a bold one, but I'm not sure if I like her.

I'm also kind of bummed how for the 1st episode back Sidney's ptsd seems to have vanished. I mean, he still drinks and stuff. And I know he had a bit of a breakthrough (? Can it be called that?) in season 1's finale when he opened up about it a little with Geordie...but was that it? No more wartime flashbacks and such? Are we done with that storyline?

???

Edited April 1, 2016 by HoodlumSheep

[chitowngirl]

Why don't you tell your wife to stay away from Sidney!!!

And how did they get down after the hard climb up?

Edited April 4, 2016 by chitowngirl

[sinycalone]

I'm sure he told Amanda to do just that -- once in the car.

 

I like the police secretary...assertive, smart, and if she keeps Amanda off my tv screen....she has my full support.

[photo fox]

Go away, Amanda. Go. Away.

[HoodlumSheep]

Margaret (was that her name?) is okay. I like her more than Amanda, at least. She is very spunky.

Geordie, Geordie, Geordie...slapping that woman was not cool. At all.

So his whole...thing that's going on is some major PTSD then? Or is there still more? Have he and Sidney effectively traded places this season? Last season Sidney was majorly suffering from PTSD and Geordie was the one keeping it together more, and now the roles are basically reversed?

I still don't like how Sidney's ptsd was kind of dropped this season. I liked that about his character. I mean, I'm happy that he seems more at peace now, but you know what I mean? It was an integral part of his character last season. Does that make any sense?

Mrs. Maguire deserves a medal. She has no chill when it comes to Amanda and I love it! Can't stand her.

And what's-his-face (Guy?) punching Sidney was uncalled for. You need to talk to your wife (the one who is actively visiting Sidney) about it.

The spy stuff seemed kind of odd and misplaced.

Edited April 4, 2016 by HoodlumSheep

[whatsatool]

Why don't you tell your wife to stay away from Sidney!!!

And how did they get down after the hard climb up?[/quote

I'm guessing the stairs.

[roomtorome]

Good grief - the whole love life stuff seems like not even high school, but middle school.  They really need to stop with it - it's embarrassing to watch a bunch of so-called adults behaving so immaturely and ridiculous.  

 

The good vicar will find someone at some point - everyone should step off and let it alone; it's stupid.

 

There's just something off this season - for me.  Maybe I am just misremembering it being more entertaining last year - can't quite remember.

Edited April 4, 2016 by roomtorome

[Pyralis]

Without getting into huge spoiler territory, Sidney is more channeling his PTSD, while Geordie's somewhat flailing.

 

Of a more important matter - is that their only option to a pub?  Or is it one that's student-free.  I'm just so used to seeing several different pubs in Morse/Lewis.

 

My impression was that this episode had more Cambridge scenery than other episodes.  Does the film company have more permissions this year?  You'd think the film makers and the City would want to make the most of whatever exposure this show is giving the place overseas.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Pyralis

[Irlandesa]

I suppose Guy hitting Sidney was not appropriate but I find Sidney and Amanda together so unlikable that I was kind of rooting for Guy.

 

I liked the mystery in this episode more than last week.  Maybe it was the scenery.  Or the twist, that I kind of predicted but still...

[alias1]

I thought this was a lot better than last week.  I wondered, too, how they got down.  I don't think there are stairs from where they were.

 

If I thought I couldn't hate Amanda more, I was wrong.  I detest her.  And I don't understand what Sidney sees in her, anyway. 

 

I like Margaret a lot.  I think the actress they had for Hildegarde was totally miscast so I hope Margaret stays in the picture.  She's a great foil for Sidney.

[sinycalone]

The spy aspect seemed fairly reasonable to me.  During the 1950s, Soviet spies were in the UK, of course...and I would imagine university towns were logical places to place agents.

[JudyObscure]

I do not watch Masterpiece Mysteries for gruesome torture, pedophilia or flattened corpses!  They can save all that for Masterpiece Contemporary, which I know to avoid. I want cozy crime solving over beer and funny scenes with Leonard and Mrs. Maguire -- and how bad is Amanda that I was cheering Mrs. Maguire's rudeness to her?

[tootsie]

I know I'm in the minority, but I was rooting for Guy. Smack that vicar! Sidney is a spiritual leader in his community and an intelligent person. No way should his married ex girlfriend be spending so much time with him. But Geordie, do NOT smack a woman, who didn't seem all that hysterical to me. I actually gasped at that. Better episode than last week, I agree. I'll suspend disbelief when it comes to the plot (really? The local parson gets to be part of an official police investigation?) because I want to. More clues to Geordie: Burma. Husbands protect wives. (Enjoyed Geordie and wife together...in their attempts to find a woman for S and in their private moments.) But where was Dickens??

[M. Darcy]

 

and I would imagine university towns were logical places to place agents.

Especially Cambridge in 30s. There were a lot of them at Cambridge.  Well, at least 5.

 

I wondered, too, how they got down.  I don't think there are stairs from where they were.

I just looked at the book to see if its says there - they took the stairs both up to the roof and down again.  Not quite as exciting as the show. 

[dubbel zout]

But where was Dickens??

 

He accompanied Sidney helping the lady in the wheelchair (can't remember her name, sorry; she's last week's perp's mother) run errands. 

 

The Amanda stuff is so boring. I have a certain sympathy for her in that her father basically forced her into an unwanted marriage to Guy, but at least he seems to be trying to make it work. I think he'd be okay with her seeing Sidney if her preference for him weren't so blatant. Find another hobby, Amanda.

 

The spy stuff was pretty weak, IMO, especially the meeting at the boathouse. Way to be discreet, everyone. Though the porter being the Tsar was a nice, if improbable, surprise. 

[truther]

I liked it.  I agree with others, JudyObscure especially, that the banter and the Leonard/Mrs. Maguire scenes are this show's strong point.  And this episode had several laugh-out-loud scenes with them.  Leonard tiptoeing around Amanda, and Mrs. Maguire deliberately calling her by her married name, were especially funny.  Likewise the blind date stuff.

 

The plot was also quite believable.  I have no doubt British universities were crawling with espionage agents in the 1950s.  

 

They're going a little overboard with Geordie and his dark past.  Then again, that's how things really were for a lot of people.  The country was full of angry men who self-medicated their wartime traumas with alcohol.  They also hit women.  So while I wasn't pleased, by any stretch of the word, to see him smack the widow I also appreciated that nod to realism.  Note also at the end when she's cradling his hand to her face after he's told a white lie about her dead husband's heroism.  Nice symmetry.  

 

What I don't quite understand is how Sidney still has any parishioners.  Half the town thinks he's a lecherous creep, the other half a degenerate-coddling punk.  It would be nice to see him earn the respect and admiration of his villagers.  Imagine how wonderful it would be to watch an episode centered on, say, a midsummer festival where he's in good spirits and the town has a good time.  

[dargosmydaddy]

 

 

So his whole...thing that's going on is some major PTSD then? Or is there still more? Have he and Sidney effectively traded places this season? Last season Sidney was majorly suffering from PTSD and Geordie was the one keeping it together more, and now the roles are basically reversed?

I still don't like how Sidney's ptsd was kind of dropped this season. I liked that about his character. I mean, I'm happy that he seems more at peace now, but you know what I mean? It was an integral part of his character last season. Does that make any sense?

 

So much this! He's handed the PTSD off to Geordie (who, by the way, also looks physically ill... I'm hoping that's leading somewhere on the show, and is not actually Robson...), and now he's just a conflicted, somewhat pathetic vicar. I liked last season better.