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Rhondinella

By Rhondinella
in 48 Hours

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psychoticstate
psychoticstate

Did anyone watch last night's episode on the Texas case of Bill Hall, Frances Hall and Bonnie Contreras?   I am floored at how Frances, the wife, could be charged with murder and yet no charges f

ridethemaverick
ridethemaverick

I don't think Bill deserved what happened to him. That said, you have to be a real low down piece of shit to allow your mistress to harass your wife. Wtf. I was totally on Francis's side as it re

walnutqueen
walnutqueen

Get ready for Big Brother to attain your DNA profile from anywhere it deems "necessary", and for all your civil rights (except your "right" to bear arms) to be abrogated.  And then gird your loins for

LakeGal

LakeGal

I watched this.  I wondered if the dead woman's girlfriend had also moved down to Tennessee.  They were friends that went to school together in Pennsylvania.  The one girl got married and moved to Tenn because her husband's family lived there.  The way the girlfriend talked she was close with her.  But did they still live near each other?  That part confused me. 

He was definitely the bad boy.  Charming at first.  Then when he got the girl hooked he showed his true bad side and got violent.  He also had a type.  Both victims looked alike. 

  • Love 3
ari333

ari333

3 minutes ago, Fable said:

Did I hear correctly that Tyler Mook was never formally interviewed by law enforcement?  How does that even happen?  I would certainly like to know why.  

All I heard was the deposition in which Tyler keep claiming the 5th. He did answer that one question about having sex with her. That sounded more like an eff you to the current bf.

Good for the brother (and I admit I was a little surprised) that the brother jumped in the water and saved the girl and then also testified.

Throwing someone in water (if they can swim) may be construed a playful  in some cases. Holding them under the water is quite different.

  • Love 2
ChristmasJones

ChristmasJones

(edited)

I was thankful Tyler Mook got convicted and is serving time. He seems like a scary individual. Had he gotten away with his second attempt at murder, I have no doubt he would go on to kill more women.  I am glad that other boat was there. I wonder if that influenced the brother to get in the water and do something, and then also testify - he knew they were witnesses.  Tyler looked totally pissed off when he was standing up to get shackled and taken out of the courtroom. That was fun to watch.

Edited by ChristmasJones
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LakeGal

LakeGal

I suspect that the brother was also influenced by the fact his girlfriend was on the boat and witnessed what his brother did.  It is not as easy to excuse your sibling when you have a witness outside the family watching. 

Tyler's lawyer was grasping at straws when he said that Tyler didn't throw her on the rocks.  Maybe there were not any rocks there.  He threw her in the water and jumped in after to drown her.  That is pretty telling right there. 

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biakbiak

biakbiak

52 minutes ago, LakeGal said:

I suspect that the brother was also influenced by the fact his girlfriend was on the boat and witnessed what his brother did.  It is not as easy to excuse your sibling when you have a witness outside the family watching. 

Tyler's lawyer was grasping at straws when he said that Tyler didn't throw her on the rocks.  Maybe there were not any rocks there.  He threw her in the water and jumped in after to drown her.  That is pretty telling right there. 

Yeah his lawyer argument appeared to be that they would be other more successful ways to kill her so this wasn't attempted murder! 

I was also surprised that the boyfriend testified. I wonder if he and the girlfriend are still together she looked completely different when she testified versus the photo they showed of her.

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biakbiak

biakbiak

19 minutes ago, Court said:

I got the feeling the brother didn't want to testify. I wonder if that incident made the brother think Tyler did kill Shelly. 

I also wonder if the family has protected Tyler his entire life. I doubt these two women were his first victims.

They brother testified that he didn't want to testify but was subpoenae.

  • Love 2
stillhere1900

stillhere1900

On 10/30/2016 at 5:28 PM, ari333 said:

All I heard was the deposition in which Tyler keep claiming the 5th. He did answer that one question about having sex with her. That sounded more like an eff you to the current bf.

Good for the brother (and I admit I was a little surprised) that the brother jumped in the water and saved the girl and then also testified.

Throwing someone in water (if they can swim) may be construed a playful  in some cases. Holding them under the water is quite different.

And clearly only a psychopath would actually do that with other people watching him.

  • Love 1
ari333

ari333

18 minutes ago, stillhere1900 said:

And clearly only a psychopath would actually do that with other people watching him.

Agreed, If he does that in front of others what on earth is he capable of otherwise? **shudder** He may have counted on his brother not jumping in and that the other witnesses would not want to get involved. He was wrong.

walnutqueen

walnutqueen

25 minutes ago, starri said:

A WOMAN REPORTS A RAPE AND THE COPS CHARGE HER WITH FILING A FALSE REPORT?!?!?!?!

The fuck!?!?!

Fuck those cops.  This is why women (and men) don't report.

Yes, that 18 year old was terrorized by a vicious rapist and then by vicious cops.  Apologies, expunging her conviction, refunding her fine, and paying a $150K judgement won't ever make her world right.

  • Love 7
starri

starri

What happened to all the women he raped is horrific beyond imagination, but what happened to that poor woman has me sick to my stomach.  She gets violated and then violated again by the people who are supposed to protect her.

Those cops, and the prosecutor, should have lost their jobs, but I know they didn't because it's just "a few bad apples."  It's always a few goddamn bad apples.  Those people should be fucking ashamed of themselves, but the one thing I didn't see from the one guy they interviewed was shame.

Thank god for those two female detectives and the FBI agent.  Honestly, in my darker moments, I think the good cops are the exception and not the rule.

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ari333

ari333

Do you guys think anyone else was involved?  sort of wondered if Marc were protecting someone.

How can NO ONE get into that hard drive?

The worst part , as mentioned, was what happened to that poor 18 year old. And people bitch and moan and wonder why women (and men) don't report rape "fast enough,"  immediately, or AT ALL. The, "if you fail the polygraph we're going to take you to jail." made me sick.  There should have been consequences for that, no just a lecture and "training." Jesus. And $150,000 was not nearly enough

  • Love 7
ari333

ari333

Did you guys see the one about that teen Sophie and that dot, violent bf who almost killed several times. AND SHE WENT BACK TO HM? After they moved to a new place . She told him where she lived. I'll never understand these things. I was 14 once and did some stupid stuff, but someone with a knife on me? Anyway, glad she's alive. She was a lucky one. I'm not quite finished watching yet, but had to chime in I was so outraged. 

I may have missed a bit. After he pulled the knife on her the first time etc, why the heck he didn't stay in jail? He was sent to a different school and to stay with other folks 30 WHOLE MILES away? [/sarcasm] Why was he still out "walking the streets?" [/George Carlin]

(as a bit of levity, Carlin used to say, "Why do we say that they're out, 'walking the streets?' They're not always, 'walkin' the streets;' Sometimes they're home bangin' the babysitter." )

starri

starri

3 minutes ago, ari333 said:

Did you guys see the one about that teen Sophie and that dot, violent bf who almost killed several times. AND SHE WENT BACK TO HM? After they moved to a new place . She told him where she lived. I'll never understand these things. I was 14 once and did some stupid stuff, but someone with a knife on me? Anyway, glad she's alive. She was a lucky one. I'm not quite finished watching yet, but had to chime in I was so outraged. 

I don't usually watch the Live to Tell episodes because they're less interesting to me, but I did watch this one.  The fact that I'm not raging about the judge in that case is only because of what we saw in the Marc episode.

ari333

ari333

I understand domestic violence. I understand why a female who lives with the abuser cannot get away. Not enough money, no where to go, no family, isolated, no friends. etc. But she GOT AWAY. She had her mom. She had a new home that he didn't know about until she told him the location. I'm not blaming her. I'm just saying that one knife incident would have scared me so badly I'd be out of Dodge and looing over my shoulder, terrified, but that's me .  

Thank God the judge finally sentenced him to 29 yrs and I *do* believe the uproar over her ruling had weight in the sentencing.

Even if he had wanted to "only" commit suicide(judges words) (which I'm not buying that for a minute) let's say he did. His wanting her to watch him die is SICK and would fuck her up in the head more than he already fucked her up   

Her young age made her extra vulnerable. So glad she survived it all.

On a personal note, I can see why young females don't say anything. When I was a teen, I had broken up with a dude who had been good to me in every way except one. He fucked someone else. We were not having sex, (I wasn't ready even after two years with him dating, I was still a young teen) so he decided to go elsewhere. I was heartbroken, "in love" and angry. I dumped him.  He showed up at my porch in the late night with a gun and said he would kill himself. He didn't threaten me or point it at me. I was not afraid of him and I didn't believe he'd kill himself. In retrospect I should have told someone. I did not resume the relationship. He went on with his life. I went on with mine. I was lucky... looking back now.  Any more war stories I will take to small talk thread.

  • Love 3
Lizzing

Lizzing

15 hours ago, starri said:

A WOMAN REPORTS A RAPE AND THE COPS CHARGE HER WITH FILING A FALSE REPORT?!?!?!?!

The fuck!?!?!

Fuck those cops.  This is why women (and men) don't report.

If you're a fan of  long form journalism and aren't at risk of a rage stroke, I heartily recommend the ProPublica article on the case from a year ago.  https://www.propublica.org/article/false-rape-accusations-an-unbelievable-story

The mom of the perp in the Live To Tell episode pissed me off.  After last week's episode, mothers of criminals need to steer clear of 48 Hours, because they aren't helping anyone.

  • Love 10
ari333

ari333

2 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I would think a gynelogical exam could still find DNA after rape, even after a forced bath.  Especially if he's not watching.   It sounds gross, but slyly swipe some of his DNA against a door or wall as your getting into the tub.  These cops just weren't looking hard enough, IMO.   

I thought the same thing. Stick a finger in there as if you're washing and wipe the wall.

Another tip scream in fake delight and dig your nails into the skin of his back... get some skin cells.

Sorry that's graphic.

  • Love 3
UsernameFatigue

UsernameFatigue

(edited)

Does it make me a bad person that I didn't like Sophie or her mother? At all. Not so say that Adam would not have tried to contact Sophie, but SHE is the one who kept talking to their mutual friend asking about him after he goes to live with his grandparents. Who responded to his fake Facebook account, knowing that they are to have no contact via the conditions of his sentencing.  And who then for more than a year kept seeing Adam, going to motels with him and friends homes.

And WTF was up with her mother? The most shocking thing to me was that this woman is a social worker, specializing in childhood trauma. But she had no idea that her daughter was lying to her for a year and sneaking around with Adam. You would think that someone with her background would be more attuned to her daughter, and after her daughter being assaulted once would be vigilant in making sure that she stays safe. Check her computer? Her phone once in awhile? Nope. Sophie is the perfect kid and can do no wrong. Adam's mother was a tad delusional, but so was Sophie's in my opinion. And for Sophie, when the second time Adam breaks into her room, has the chance twice when her brother and mother both call out to her, STILL doesn't want her mother to know and wants to meet him outside? WTF??

To continue to call this domestic violence was ridiculous. They were NOT domestic partners. She did not have children she was protecting. She did not live with him. And she purposely contacted him against court orders. She does share in some of the blame, like it or not. She did not have to in any way, shape or form have to go back to him in the first place.

I also did not have a problem with the judge's ruling. Even the prosecutor was worried that they did not have enough evidence to prove intent to kill. The important thing to me was that the judge got the sentencing right. And no, I don't think it had anything to do with public pressure. She obviously knew he was unbalanced, and made sure that he goes away for a long time.

Edited by UsernameFatigue
  • Love 2
Court

Court

Dating violence then but it absolutely was just that. Pretty much the same as domestic abuse. Just a different name.

That's a lot of victim blaming there. This is why women don't report abuse or rape. They're questioned, harassed, blamed and ridiculed. They stay for a variety of reasons. Again, he was emotionally abusing her, gas lighting, manipulating and assaulting her. He also contacted her hundreds of times. This is in no way her fault.

Parents or family usually have a blind spot when it comes to their own flesh and blood. 

Sophie didn't call out because she was scared and trying to protect her family. Lighting youself on fire and holding them with a knife is intent to kill. Plus, her brother and mom could have likely been killed as well. 

  • Love 11
UsernameFatigue

UsernameFatigue

(edited)

Yes, there are many reasons why someone stays. Or in this case returns, since Adam was sent away and Sophie moved to another home. Just as something(s) in Adam's past *may* have caused him to turn out as he did, somethings in Sophie's past *may* have contributed to why she returned to Adam. It has nothing to do with victim blaming. Nothing is black and white, and to paint things that way is naive. As a poster upthread said, she would never have let Adam back into her life after the first time he broke into her home. Neither would I. But for whatever reason Sophie did.

As far as parents having a blind spot to their own children, Sophie's mother was very clear on Sophie's past. She stated that Sophie entered high school somewhat lost and depressed. She went to councilling. The mother went on to say that she didn't understand how some of that would shift to Sophie's obsession with Adam. As a trained social worker specializing in childhood trauma she had way more tools that most to recognize that. Sophie even tried to commit suicide the first time she was with Adam. So for her mother to say that "I would have done anything to protect her and I wasn't able to" was mind boggling to me. There is no indication that she monitored Sophie at all, even though Sophie lied to her the first time she was with Adam and did not tell her of the abuse in their relationship.

Sophie's mother was also quick to allude to Adam's "pain from his childhood". His parents divorced, but his father was still in his life. I thought it odd that nothing was mentioned about Sophie's father. He obviously did not live with them. Is he deceased? Never has been in the picture? Maybe whatever the situation was with Sophie's father contributed to her obsession with Adam, and even her going back to him regardless of what he had done in the past. Again, has nothing to do with victim blaming but may help explain Sophie's actions. And may help prevent other women/girls (and men/boys who are also the victim of abuse) from going down the same path.

Edited by UsernameFatigue
  • Love 1
CaughtOnTape

CaughtOnTape

On 11/20/2016 at 9:21 AM, ari333 said:

I understand domestic violence. I understand why a female who lives with the abuser cannot get away. Not enough money, no where to go, no family, isolated, no friends. etc. But she GOT AWAY. She had her mom. She had a new home that he didn't know about until she told him the location. I'm not blaming her. I'm just saying that one knife incident would have scared me so badly I'd be out of Dodge and looing over my shoulder, terrified, but that's me .  

Thank God the judge finally sentenced him to 29 yrs and I *do* believe the uproar over her ruling had weight in the sentencing.

Even if he had wanted to "only" commit suicide(judges words) (which I'm not buying that for a minute) let's say he did. His wanting her to watch him die is SICK and would fuck her up in the head more than he already fucked her up   

Her young age made her extra vulnerable. So glad she survived it all.

On a personal note, I can see why young females don't say anything. When I was a teen, I had broken up with a dude who had been good to me in every way except one. He fucked someone else. We were not having sex, (I wasn't ready even after two years with him dating, I was still a young teen) so he decided to go elsewhere. I was heartbroken, "in love" and angry. I dumped him.  He showed up at my porch in the late night with a gun and said he would kill himself. He didn't threaten me or point it at me. I was not afraid of him and I didn't believe he'd kill himself. In retrospect I should have told someone. I did not resume the relationship. He went on with his life. I went on with mine. I was lucky... looking back now.  Any more war stories I will take to small talk thread.

I don't think people realize something about young girls nowadays.

They are conditioned into believing they are nothing unless a boy wants them.  The amount of young girls I see with this belief is staggering.  So many girls wondering what they'll do if they aren't pretty enough or thin enough for a boy to like them.  Sure, her mother was a social worker and therefore should have seen it, but I'm pretty sure she fell into some complacency there.  She was raising her daughter with all the right tools so some stupid boy should never have been able to get into Sophie's head that way...but that's the scary part...it happens quicker and easier than people realize.  Girls aren't told to brush it off if a boy doesn't like them nowadays.  "Hey, just because ONE boy doesn't like you doesn't mean ALL boys will feel that way." could do SO MUCH to help them.  But it never happens.  Instead it's...."Well he doesn't want me so I am worthless."

And the kid was desired.  Christ, the even show started out with how much all the girls in school wanted him.  And he chose HER to speak to.  He chose HER to bestow his time and attention on.  All he had to do was slip that tiny morsel of "Ya know, if I don't want you...no other guy will either." type of manipulation and BAM!  She was done for.

So it doesn't really matter if she had a support system to fall back on and a mother who should have seen the signs of what was happening to her.  That girl had it coming at her from all sides.  The mother of her idiot boyfriend and the judge, BOTH WOMEN, excused his behavior as nothing more than just a simple case of a boy who was a little too intense and SOPHIE was partly to blame because her feminine wiles surely drove him crazy.

Sad to see women go down that road....especially when a young girl is involved.  I hope Sophie is in some type of therapy because the scars that left probably won't be visible for years and that's if she even notices they're there.

  • Love 6
patty1h

patty1h

(edited)

This is about the episode titled "This Psychiatrist and the Selfie".  

It sickened me how Jake Nolan will not take any responsibility for his part in the crime and wants to lay the burden onto Pamela Buchbinder.  I can't decide if he and Pamela were in a relationship or not but I'm not ready to paint her as a master manipulator, though the reveal about the $1M life insurance is a wee bit suspect.  My belief is that Jake may have developed a protective stance towards the little boy after seeing how his parents were fighting over him and felt he had to do anything for him and that set him on the path to attempt this murder.  I agree with the prosecutor - he seemed capable of knowing right from wrong.

What makes me not have sympathy for Jake is that he had many chances to stop the crime before it happened but he went to Michael Weiss' office with a sledgehammer(?!) and a knife.  I think his mental illness was a convenient out to escape a much harsher jail sentence.  I kinda hated the parents for making excuses for their son.  They seemed to forget their little angel went to try to kill a man who had never done a thing to him.  

Edited by patty1h
  • Love 2
CraftyHazel

CraftyHazel

I can...and do...fully believe that Dr. Buchbinder plotted with Jake to murder Michael Weiss, but Jake gets no sympathy from me despite his depression, ADHD, or anything else.  He claims he could barely lift the sledgehammer, but he carried it the whole way there!  He attacked first, then blames Michael Weiss for fighting back. He claims Pamela manipulated him, but he takes absolutely  zero responsibility for his actions. The tape where he calmly states that he had no problem with killing, but drew the line at torture?  His claims that he just wants to go up to Michael Weiss and give him a hug?    Yeah, I can see some serious issues with the guy, issues that definitely might fall under the definition of mental illness. After all, sociopathy is a mental illness, too, right? 

  • Love 6
patty1h

patty1h

Just thought of another reason to side-eye Jake - how he tried to change the facts by saying Michael attacked him.  That shows he was rational enough to try to lie to save his own ass.  What I don't get is what did Jake plan to do if the murder was successful; I don't remember if he and Pamela had set up any escape plan.  Was Jake gonna do a disappearing act, or give himself up or kill himself?  

  • Love 1
starri

starri

8 hours ago, Marmiarmo said:

After all, sociopathy is a mental illness, too, right? 

No.  Antisocial Personality Disorder is a mental illness, but sociopathy is not a medical term.  And while I concede they just may not have mentioned them, as presented, he didn't have any of the symptoms of ASPD.  The fact that he seemed to have a very close bond with the kid is something that is the very opposite, in fact.

I'm conflicted on this one.  He's culpable, no doubt, but I don't think he would have engaged in the assault/attempted murder had he not been involved with the other shrink.  I'm also doubtful their relationship was sexual, because I spent the entire episode thinking he was gay.  I mean, she clearly wanted it to be, but I couldn't dismiss that voice in the back of my head.

  • Love 4
LakeGal

LakeGal

I can't get over that they didn't put Pam on the stand at the trial.  The jury could never get the entire story without hearing from her.  What was her reason for buying the sledgehammer?  Was she planning to knock down a wall?

I do believe Pam used Jake to get rid of a problem named Michael.  But I do believe Jake is guilty too and deserves to be in jail. 

Why would Jake's parents think it was okay for him to have his cousin as his therapist?  Then to have him move in with his therapist.  There were red flags everywhere in this case. 

  • Love 9
ari333

ari333

(edited)

So many red flags.

Cousin as therapist? FLAG

Moving in? FLAG

Photos (or no photos) but being in bed together FLAG

Two psychiatrists being arrested for domestic abuse and or battery? FLAG HUGE FLAG

Charges dropped? Well, isn't that special. [/churchlady voice here] If they were people of color and not shrinks they'd be in jail already. Attacking someone with glass and the person needs stitches and whatever the other incident was. WOW. And these are folks who counsel OTHERS? Yikes.

This chick was totally in on all of it imo and did manipulate this unstable patient.

Edited by ari333
  • Love 11
Lizzing

Lizzing

Does anyone remember if these 2 psychiatrists are still licensed to practice?  In particular, the cousin psychiatrist? (The guy might only be guilty of being a bad judge of whom to procreate with, not bad head shrinking.)  The expert was right; sharing pajama time with your patients is creepy, even if there's no sexual component, because the doc needs to set boundaries with patients, especially in psychiatry.  It's not like she was a podiatrist fixing her cousin's ingrown toenail.

  • Love 6
JaggedLilPill

JaggedLilPill

I don't know how I missed the Melissa Calusinski case first time around, but I watched it tonight and I'm downright pissed. 

I feel awful for both families in this case. Obviously for Ben's parents, but for Melissa and her family as well. I know 99% of us watching would definitely request a lawyer before answering any questions, but not everyone thinks that way. She probably thought asking for a lawyer would make her look guilty or she honestly had no idea that she was going to be considered a suspect. I was following along on twitter as Erin Moriarty was live tweeting and she said Melissa had no idea that she could have walked out of the interrogation room because every time the detectives left, they locked the door behind them.

WTF??? This is why people don't trust the judicial system.

After nine hours of questioning, I'd be delirious. And not only that, but repeating it 70-something times. Not to mention the lower IQ. They wanted to pin it on someone and they did. Awful.

Of course they still won't budge even with people coming forward claiming the pathologist lied under oath and evidence that the X-rays were manipulated and that there were admitted mistakes made during the autopsy, like oh, you know, missing an earlier head injury.

Again, I say WTF?

  • Love 15
Court

Court

I saw this case the first time around and thought the poor girl was innocent. That the jurors just wanted to convict for the parent's sake.

But holy crap, how does the judge not order a new trial? It's not hearsay, there's an actual set of x-rays. Even to me, it's clear that there was no skull fracture! Plus,that the defense never saw them! That county had what 3 cases recently that they effed up? Oh, just brighten those x-rays and you'll see them. We just manipulated that evidence.

I hope someone wakes up and Melissa wins the appeal. 

  • Love 11
RedheadZombie

RedheadZombie

2 hours ago, Court said:

I saw this case the first time around and thought the poor girl was innocent. That the jurors just wanted to convict for the parent's sake.

But holy crap, how does the judge not order a new trial? It's not hearsay, there's an actual set of x-rays. Even to me, it's clear that there was no skull fracture! Plus,that the defense never saw them! That county had what 3 cases recently that they effed up? Oh, just brighten those x-rays and you'll see them. We just manipulated that evidence.

I hope someone wakes up and Melissa wins the appeal. 

And sues the state, prosecutors, and pathologist. 

  • Love 4
biakbiak

biakbiak

3 hours ago, Court said:

I saw this case the first time around and thought the poor girl was innocent. That the jurors just wanted to convict for the parent's sake.

I think this holds true for the cops, the pathologist, the prosecuters, the judge, and the parents, they all thought blame needed to be laid to explain a tragedy.

  • Love 4
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