Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion: How's Your Head?

[HalcyonDays]

The AV Club seems to hate everything, imo. I read i09s review last night. Man, was that demoralizing. Maybe they're just mad that they may be out of a job soon since Hulk Hulgan won Gawker Media in his lawsuit.

 

I just read that i09 review today. I'll be honest - anytime I read an opinion that S3 is worse than S2, well, I side-eye that big time. Because I still remember S2, and how angry it made me. S3 I'm watching and enjoying. It's not the batshit insane yet awesome show that was the first half of season 1, but it is not anywhere near the mess of season 2. So that i09 review means nothing to me, because I plain think they are wrong in their opinion.

[jhlipton]

Yeah, it's a tough crowd out there. I get the hate for season 2, but that's all over now. No one wants to give the show a chance anymore, which is too bad. It's a good season.

 

Maybe not as good as Season 1 (although I think that may be like Saturday Night Live, where the love of the first season is a nostagia thing, and the Hartman-Meyers-Carvey years were actually better), but still awesome (although the first half was better than the second has been).

 

 

IA]nytime I read an opinion that S3 is worse than S2, well, I side-eye that big time.

 

Yeah, that's just dumb!

[spaceghostess]

I just read that i09 review today. I'll be honest - anytime I read an opinion that S3 is worse than S2, well, I side-eye that big time. Because I still remember S2, and how angry it made me. S3 I'm watching and enjoying. It's not the batshit insane yet awesome show that was the first half of season 1, but it is not anywhere near the mess of season 2. So that i09 review means nothing to me, because I plain think they are wrong in their opinion.

(Please feel free to boot this reply to the Media thread if it's better off there.) I know what you mean about the negativity, and I definitely agree that this is a far less painful viewing experience than season 2. How could it not be? I'm of two opinions of the io9 review. On one hand, I agree with a couple of things, especially the colossal mistake it was to take Abbie out of the cop shop and transplant her in a generic FBI setting. As a cop, Abbie knew the locals and that enabled the show to bring in quirky Sleepy Hollow characters like the car dealer guy and Big Ash. I'm still pissed that they squandered such characters by never bringing them back or developing them further. Irish Bar Guy could be one of those, but I doubt we'll ever see him again. Also? Villages don't have FBI offices. End of story. I also agree that separating Abbie and Crane is NEVER a good idea. On the other hand, this reviewer just came out of the woodwork re: Sleepy Hollow. Genevieve Valentine, who used to do the Sleepy Hollow recaps over there, hasn't done one since November. Her opinion, I respect--and, if I recall correctly, she was never on an Ichabbie-hating hobbyhorse. She, like most of us, was invested in seeing a fun show featuring interesting characters and unpredictably crazy--not shitty--writing. I don't know what happened to her recaps (and I pray she's still on staff to do Penny Dreadful) but I find it hard to give credence to the negative opinions of a Johnny-Come-Lately reviewer.

 

ETA: Italics!

Edited March 20, 2016 by spaceghostess

[DJG1122]

It's from a half an hour long interview with Mison, at MCM Comic Con Birmingham. Again, I am just speculating, but there is something about that interview that really makes me think the show is done - besides the hair.

Something else odd: The interviewer asked TM if SH had had a wrap party and he replied "Yes and the less said about that, the better" (???)

[HalcyonDays]

Something else odd: The interviewer asked TM if SH had had a wrap party and he replied "Yes and the less said about that, the better" (???)

 

Hee. I didn't think it was odd - I just thought he was implying there was a lot of drunken misbehavour (I won't say debauchery) going on there. But who knows - maybe it WAS something else.

[Sparkling Beth]

I agree with HalcyonDays--it sounds to me as if Tom was just making a joke about how wild the party got.  Whether it did or not is something we'll probably never know!

[CooperTV]

Villages don't have FBI offices.

 

Well, Sleepy Hollow is not a village because it has over 140,000 people in it, and it's a fairly reasonable for that sort of town to have a small field office there.

[MissAlmond]

Something else odd: The interviewer asked TM if SH had had a wrap party and he replied "Yes and the less said about that, the better" (???)

 

I agree with HalcyonDays and Sparkling Beth.  That comment seems nothing more than a teasing: "What happens at the Wrap Party, stays at the Wrap Party."

 

[DeLurker]

I'd love to know what critics you're reading, Dizzychickstar. Most of the ones I can find are all-negative, all the time. The Vulture reviewer is generally positive, I think... but stay away from A.V. Club and IO9, reviews and comments alike. Very little positivity to be found, and a lot of negativity from posters who haven't even bothered to watch Season 3.

Taking over to media....

[AD55]

Well, Sleepy Hollow is not a village because it has over 140,000 people in it, and it's a fairly reasonable for that sort of town to have a small field office there.

Charlottesville, VA, population just over 44,000, has an FBI office. I know someone who works there.

 

Still totally agree with those who wish Abbie were not in the FBI. As has already been said, it's absurd that Crane gets to follow her to the crime scenes and that Daniel is already in a position of authority.

[spaceghostess]

Well, Sleepy Hollow is not a village because it has over 140,000 people in it, and it's a fairly reasonable for that sort of town to have a small field office there.

Actually, Sleepy Hollow proper has a population of about 10,000. Sleepy Hollow was incorporated from the portion once known as North Tarrytown in the mid-1990s, but even if you add the population of 11,277 (source: 2010 census) from Tarrytown, you're still well under 30,000 people. Sorry for nerding out, but I grew up in a town bordering Yonkers, so I'm fairly familiar with southern Westchester County and its Hudson River towns and villages. The "Welcome to Sleepy Hollow; pop: 140,000" is a complete fiction, as far as I can tell.  

 

New York State has no limit to the population that constitutes a village, as the "village" designation is based on the fact that the land lies within the jurisdiction of one or more towns as opposed to being independent of a town (as a city would be). I grew up in a city that's smaller, land-wise, than many villages, but has a large population. In any event, the highest population village in New York State has a population of 55,000. My point was that it wouldn't make sense to have an FBI office in a sparsely populated village that's not even particularly close to the nearest major metro area (NYC). It's only about 25-30 minutes from Manhattan, 15-20 minutes, max, from the Bronx, but still: as much as I'm willing to fanwank for this show, the presence of a swanky FBI office in Sleepy Hollow alway rubs me the wrong way.

 

[Edited to correct wayward apostrophe; edited further to apologize to the Mod from straying from "spoilers." Any further responses I make re: this topic, I'll move to the appropriate thread. :-)]

Edited March 22, 2016 by spaceghostess

[CooperTV]

The "Welcome to Sleepy Hollow; pop: 140,000" is a complete fiction, as far as I can tell. 

 

Well, the fictional Sleepy Hollow is not a real Sleepy Hollow, hence it has 140,000 population, several Starbucks' and a FBI filed office. The show's world-building made Sleepy hollow into big town. I'm just saying.

[spaceghostess]

Moving my reply to "Small Talk" thread. :-)

[cynic]

...On the other hand, this reviewer just came out of the woodwork re: Sleepy Hollow. Genevieve Valentine, who used to do the Sleepy Hollow recaps over there, hasn't done one since November. Her opinion, I respect--and, if I recall correctly, she was never on an Ichabbie-hating hobbyhorse. She, like most of us, was invested in seeing a fun show featuring interesting characters and unpredictably crazy--not shitty--writing. I don't know what happened to her recaps (and I pray she's still on staff to do Penny Dreadful) but I find it hard to give credence to the negative opinions of a Johnny-Come-Lately reviewer.

ETA: Italics!

I think io9 stopped doing normal recaps when they combined with Gizmodo. They'll do some here and there, but that's mostly gone.

Taking the rest to Media.

[Enero]

On a different note, I just have to say I love how totally thirsty the Ichabbie fandom is. Pix from the final ep of the season have been released (nothing too spoilery) and this particular one is giving everyone palpitations. I can't lie, I am totally up there with the "What does this even mean?" group. LOL

eta: link http://www.screenspy.com/articles/tv/sleepy-hollow-3x18-ragnarok-photos/nggallery/image/sh-s3_318-sc23-tr_0692_hires1/#gallery

I think it might mean something. Abbie has never been one to touch Crane casually, especially not like that. Yes they've hugged, held hands etc. but that's usually during moments of great peril and/or high emotion. I think the only time she casually touched him was when she was helping him get ready for a date he had with Katrina. So if this scene is as casual as it appears, I think this might be Abbie finally starting to show signs of feeling more than friendship for Crane.

Another interesting thing about those pictures is that there are none of Joe. He and Jenny have been inseparable almost the entire season. I wonder if he's missing because he's in trouble? In one of the pics Jenny appeared to be upset, but that could be due to Papa Mills.

Edited March 23, 2016 by Enero

[LeeLeePanda]

I think it might mean something. Abbie has never been one to touch Crane casually, especially not like that. Yes they've hugged, held hands etc. but that's usually during moments of great peril and/or high emotion. I think the only time she casually touched him was when she was helping him get ready for a date he had with Katrina. So if this scene is as casual as it appears, I think this might be Abbie finally starting to show signs of feeling more than friendship for Crane.

Another interesting thing about those pictures is that there are none of Joe. He and Jenny have been inseparable almost the entire season. I wonder if he's missing because he's in trouble? In one of the pics Jenny appeared to be upset, but that could be due to Papa Mills.

I was just about to post about this! That picture definitely pings my shipper sense. I think Joe might not make it through this episode, based on the pictures Abbie hugging Jenny. I'm also curious about the picture of Crane with flowers in the graveyard. Is he placing them on someone's grave? Or is it something less sinister?

[HalcyonDays]

I think the only time she casually touched him was when she was helping him get ready for a date he had with Katrina.

 

She tweeked his coat when teasing him about his expenses, in the episode that had Abbie voting in season 2. She's put her hand on his shoulder again, somewhere in season 2.

 

TBH, I'm not putting much stock in it. I hope you are right and we get a season 4 for relationship exploration, but I'm wavering on losing hope since otherwise it would be the last episode of the series. A label flick isn't going to help my shipper heart at all.

 

I know, I know, be positive, you say !! So hard though...

 

Another interesting thing about those pictures is that there are none of Joe. He and Jenny have been inseparable almost the entire season. I wonder if he's missing because he's in trouble?

 

Ah. Guessing that explains the grave pictures....

[spaceghostess]

I want to go to there. TM--Tina Fey

 

ETA: Hmmm. I can't see the picture. Do you have a link to the photos?

 

Ah, there she is: my Inner Liz Lemon!

 

My shippy little heart will be well and truly shattered if Abbie's just helping Crane out with the removal of a stray piece of dryer lint.

 

ETA: dramatic phrase

Edited March 23, 2016 by spaceghostess

[MissAlmond]

Another interesting thing about those pictures is that there are none of Joe. He and Jenny have been inseparable almost the entire season. I wonder if he's missing because he's in trouble? In one of the pics Jenny appeared to be upset, but that could be due to Papa Mills.

 

 

Yes, maybe Papa Mills makes the ultimate sacrifice for his daughters and Joe is simply in the wendingo wing of the hospital healing.

 

 

My shippy little heart will be well and truly shattered if Abbie's just helping Crane out with the removal of a stray piece of dryer lint.

 

I've decided to stop speculating and simply let the last 3 episodes wash over me.  But in case nonsense like this ^^^ or Danabbiezzzz happens, I still have Mr. Neeson on speed dial.

Edited March 23, 2016 by MissAlmond

[FierceAfroChick]

Could Crane be visiting Betsy Ross' grave?  I'd have no problem with that because it would mean she's definitely staying in the past.

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Abbie is distracted by Crane's chest hair in that one pic. 

[roseslg]

Would a new grave be so old?  I was thinking he was visiting Katrina's grave to say goodbye and that he's found love with Abbie.. *shrug*  A girl can hope. 

[HalcyonDays]

Could Crane be visiting Betsy Ross' grave?  I'd have no problem with that because it would mean she's definitely staying in the past.

 

Gravestone looks too new/modern to be hers (though the original could have been damaged and replaced - the ones behind it are much older). In real life, she's buried in the garden of her house in Philly (now a museum that I visited a couple years ago)

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Abbie is distracted by Crane's chest hair in that one pic.

My shippy little heart will be well and truly shattered if Abbie's just helping Crane out with the removal of a stray piece of dryer lint.

 

Both of these made me laugh. Maybe he has some symbol on the button that she's examining, or admiring his sewing skills?

 

I see Crane's back in a navy blue coat for the finale. Appropriate. I still miss the original military coat.

 

 

[spaceghostess]

 

I see Crane's back in a navy blue coat for the finale. Appropriate. I still miss the original military coat.

 

Me, too! Whatever happened to it? Was it destroyed, and I just didn't notice, or was its disappearance just another mystifying wardrobe decision?

[FierceAfroChick]

Gravestone looks too new/modern to be hers (though the original could have been damaged and replaced - the ones behind it are much older). In real life, she's buried in the garden of her house in Philly (now a museum that I visited a couple years ago)

 

 

Both of these made me laugh. Maybe he has some symbol on the button that she's examining, or admiring his sewing skills?

 

I see Crane's back in a navy blue coat for the finale. Appropriate. I still miss the original military coat.

 

 

 

I googled the grave and it looks pretty well kept:   http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/d8/cb/f4/gravesite.jpg

 

I know that scene is probably pretty innocent, but I can hope. 

Edited March 23, 2016 by FierceAfroChick

[HalcyonDays]

I googled the grave and it looks pretty well kept:   http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/d8/cb/f4/gravesite.jpg

 

I know that scene is probably pretty innocent, but I can hope. 

 

Ross was originally buried in a Quaker church, before they moved her remains were moved to the house in 1975, so the newer stone makes sense. Wonder if they kept the old stone if it was intact?

 

When I was wandering through Christ Church graveyard in Philly, a lot of the older stones dating from the 1700's and 1800's were in bad shape - some so weather you couldn't read any of the engraved words at all. Conditions varied.

 

Maybe is it Mama Mills that the family + Crane are visiting?

[roseslg]

Ross was originally buried in a Quaker church, before they moved her remains were moved to the house in 1975, so the newer stone makes sense. Wonder if they kept the old stone if it was intact?

 

When I was wandering through Christ Church graveyard in Philly, a lot of the older stones dating from the 1700's and 1800's were in bad shape - some so weather you couldn't read any of the engraved words at all. Conditions varied.

 

Maybe is it Mama Mills that the family + Crane are visiting?

 

Asking for Abbie's hand in marriage? Strictly for immigration purposes though. 

[blixie]

 

I know, I know, be positive, you say !! So hard though...

 

The CW renewed every single show it had, so I'm feeling optimistic about Fox, I feel like their in similar situations, where the bulk of what's on isn't doing so hot, the most successful thing they aired this season was 20 year old rebooted X Files, that everyone agrees was painfully bad creatively. I'm sure I'll pay for this optimism.

[Miss Dee]

Joe?! NOOOO! Say it ain't so!!

Whose arms am I going to ogle now?! *weeps*

[MissAlmond]

I was an early supporter of S3 and have indeed, been following the breadcrumbs. But, damn, waiting for these last three episodes is about to drive me back to Sleepy Hollow Therapy! I've already prepared self medication with three bottles of wine marked "Dawn's Early Light", "Delaware", and "Ragnarok".

Edited March 23, 2016 by MissAlmond

[HalcyonDays]

I've already prepared self medication with three bottles of wine marked "Dawn's Early Light", "Delaware", and "Ragnarok".

 

You too, eh? ;')

[FierceAfroChick]

Are they no longer releasing sneak peeks?

[Miss Dee]

Ausiello is reporting that a network series is killing off its lead character come the season finale. Putting together that with the Mison interview up above, and yeah, I might not be long for this series. The draw for me here is Abbie and Ichabod. AND. Remove one of them, and what makes this show watchable to me is gone.

I'm going to be a complete coward around the finale; I won't be able to watch it until I find out if we're losing Ichabod or Abbie. I'll gladly lose anyone else...even Joe, as much as I'll miss the arm candy.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Miss Dee

[LeeLeePanda]

Ausiello is reporting that a network series is killing off its lead character come the season finale. Putting together that with the Mison interview up above, and yeah, I might not be long for this series. The draw for me here is Abbie and Ichabod. AND. Remove one of them, and what makes this show watchable to me is gone.

I'm going to be a complete coward around the finale; I won't be able to watch it until I find out if we're losing Ichabod or Abbie. I'll gladly lose anyone else...even Joe, as much as I'll miss the arm candy.

On one hand, it could be any show on the 5 networks. I also hope tptb wouldn't give us that type of cliffhanger/ending after Abbie going into the tree. On the other hand, I'm not sure TPTB have the sense they were born with. I watch the show because of Abbie and Crane. I'm a shipper, and I'd love to see Ichabbie happen. But I'd still watch even if it never did, because I love to watch the 2 characters interact with each other. I feel like many viewers are just like me, and that's one of the many reasons people dropped the show last season.

[Enero]

I think if Abbie or Crane has a true death this show will be as good as cancelled. With it already struggling with ratings I can't imagine FOX would be willing to go another season after killing one of the leads. The only reason why the show is surviving at this point is mainly due to the shippers. IMHO. If there's no chance of Ichabbie setting sail there will be no viewers and no show.

[Julia]

Oh, I would have guessed Castle. Nathan Fillion has been fighting to bro it up for a dog's years, and ABC renewed it this year without getting Stana Katic on board first.

[Miss Dee]

God, I hope you're right! I'm just panicky, I guess.

But if Mison or Beharie wanted off the show in no uncertain terms with absolutely no question that there'd ever be a chance of them coming back for sweeps week...well, what choice would the writers have, really? Could *anybody* who watches this show buy that either Ichabod or Abbie could be in mortal peril in future seasons and the other one somehow wouldn't drop everything and run in hell-bent for leather to save them? If they don't get cancelled and either Mison or Beharie wants out for good, I don't see how else the writers could handle it. The only way Ichabod and Abbie stay away from each other is if one's dead and can't come back.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Miss Dee

[catrox14]

Oh man, given Ausiello's spoiler talks about a cemetery scene...and we have Ichabod with flowers in front of a headstone...

 

I'm....actually worried....

[Badsamaritan]

There's no way in hell Ichabod would be that calm at Abbie's gravesite. Has to be someone else. And looking at the pics again, I don't think he's standing in FRONT of a grave, he's on a path NEXT to it. The same path in the other pic that's a head-on view. I'm thinking he's lagging behind Abbie, maybe Jenny too, and its their dad's service. He's gonna have a heroic moment doing something to save one or both of them and sacrifice his life, bet.

[catrox14]

There's no way in hell Ichabod would be that calm at Abbie's gravesite. Has to be someone else. And looking at the pics again, I don't think he's standing in FRONT of a grave, he's on a path NEXT to it. The same path in the other pic that's a head-on view. I'm thinking he's lagging behind Abbie, maybe Jenny too, and its their dad's service. He's gonna have a heroic moment doing something to save one or both of them and sacrifice his life, bet.

 

Unless he had the meltdown before and this a timejump and he's going back to the grave ?

 

Ack.  Why am I so worried???

[FierceAfroChick]

Finally a sneak peek!  Love how suddenly respectful and serious Crane gets.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAD43zuThNI

[catrox14]

OH MY GODS. Ichabod is such a lovesick puppy. He just turned into 16 year old boy meeting his girl's father...HALP

[CooperTV]

Ausiello is reporting that a network series is killing off its lead character come the season finale.

 

It's probably Arrow. The cemetery scene was shown in the first episode of season 4 in flash-forward.

 

It could be The 100 and Bellamy, of course, though.

Edited March 25, 2016 by CooperTV

[FierceAfroChick]

Another sneak peek.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-wVaQwrOU0&feature=player_embedded

Edited March 25, 2016 by FierceAfroChick

[blixie]

 

It's probably Arrow. The cemetery scene was shown in the first episode of season 4 in flash-forward.

 

Hmm not sure, Arrow

it's pretty certain they are killing off Katie Cassidy's Laurel, who was TECHNICALLY hired as the romantic lead and billing wise still is I guess, but Emily Bett Rickards functionally replaced her mid S2 and I'm not sure Ausellio would try to sell anyone that Katie is still a lead

But, yeah,  I hope that is what he's referring to.

[catrox14]

It's probably Arrow. The cemetery scene was shown in the first episode of season 4 in flash-forward.

 

It could be The 100 and Bellamy, of course, though.

 

The Ausiello article says 'Arrow is not the only show"...I made the same mistake on another forum.

[spaceghostess]

Here's a sneak peek featuring Pandy and Crane (which sounds like a '70's pop duo).

Edited March 25, 2016 by spaceghostess

[Watermelon]

I kind of got the impression it was Benson on SVU.

[DJG1122]

Ausiello is reporting that a network series is killing off its lead character come the season finale.

 

Actually Ausiello reported that a network drama was killing off it's star. Last I checked, SH had 2 stars......Even Goofman wouldn't have killed off Crane and CC& Company aren't stupid enough to kill off either Abbie or Crane.

 

IMHO, either neither or both would be killed off.

Edited March 25, 2016 by DJG1122

[Miss Dee]

I do agree no show runner on Sleepy Hollow would deliberately kill off Ichabod or Abbie no matter what short term gains they could get out of ratings, shock value, etc. My point is that they may not have a choice if one of the actors is adamant about leaving and willing to take whatever penalties they need to in order to break the contract. Because they way things are set up, the audience would never buy the two of them deciding to stay apart.

[spaceghostess]

Zounds! I certainly hope neither of them would pull a Dan Stevens before even finding out if the show was renewed. There'd be absolutely no point in bringing it back without one or the other. SH is Crane and Abbie. Everything else is just noise.