S08.E10: Trouble On The Family Tree

[Yours Truly]

 

In this case, I do believe Lauren is milking the "I'm pregnant, I can't do stand up on the red carpet." Please believe if she had a regular job, she'd be at that office collecting the packages and not talking about "why can't I stay home? I'm 4 months pregnant!" Girl, bye. I'm gonna need to hear you're having a troubled pregnancy, are sick off your ass, you can't get up, before I'm going to sympathize. Otherwise, my having 3 kids under five, taking 6 week of maternity leave the first time, 2 weeks the next, walking two kids to daycare at while kicking 200lbs in the sumo-looking 8 month's pregnant ass before catching a train for 45 minutes to get to work by 8am EVERY DAY is not even trying to hear it.  I'm just sayin', you do what you gotta do.

 

  

 

Sad thing is I'm not sure why we as women are so accepting of that whole "you do what you gotta do" mentality and allow our pregnancies to be compromised because what? It's okay for employers to be dismissive of a women with child? I get it is what it is but I just can't get on board with it being NOT OKAY to want to take it easy when you're pregnant. I know that in this day and age we keep on trucking but what I find offensive is that anyone OTHER than the pregnant person is in a position to judge how much harder they should be working. And on the flip side I really resent Kandi acting all offended at the idea that she should be mindful about her workload during her highrisk pregnancy. That she's rolling her eyes and wanting to prove something isn't to be commended cause nothings worth that much that you have to put your pregnancy on the back burner. That child is your main priority not showing the world that you can still burn the candle at both ends. Completely ridiculous.

 

In this case, I do believe Lauren is milking the "I'm pregnant, I can't do stand up on the red carpet." Please believe if she had a regular job, she'd be at that office collecting the packages and not talking about "why can't I stay home? I'm 4 months pregnant!" Girl, bye. I'm gonna need to hear you're having a troubled pregnancy, are sick off your ass, you can't get up, before I'm going to sympathize. Otherwise, my having 3 kids under five, taking 6 week of maternity leave the first time, 2 weeks the next, walking two kids to daycare at while kicking 200lbs in the sumo-looking 8 month's pregnant ass before catching a train for 45 minutes to get to work by 8am EVERY DAY is not even trying to hear it.  I'm just sayin', you do what you gotta do.

 

  

 

Sad thing is I'm not sure why we as women are so accepting of that whole "you do what you gotta do" mentality and allow our pregnancies to be compromised because what? It's okay for employers to be dismissive of a women with child? I get it is what it is but I just can't get on board with it being NOT OKAY to want to take it easy when you're pregnant. I know that in this day and age we keep on trucking but what I find offensive is that anyone OTHER than the pregnant person is in a position to judge how much harder they should be working. And on the flip side I really resent Kandi acting all offended at the idea that she should be mindful about her workload during her highrisk pregnancy. That she's rolling her eyes and wanting to prove something isn't to be commended cause nothings worth that much that you have to put your pregnancy on the back burner. That child is your main priority not showing the world that you can still burn the candle at both ends. Completely ridiculous.

[ZaldamoWilder]

So basically if she were to humor Kenya then she can be off the hook? I think there's something so very wrong with this sentiment. Basically we are asking this woman to put on a show even if it doesn't come from within and we are also condemning this woman because it doesn't come from within but she isn't going through the motions society deems she should go through for Kenya's sake. Too me the facts of the matter are very sad and very unfortunate but that's where it ends. What isn't necessary is drawing out the pain, the history, the wounds, the scars and all the new byproducts that are coming out of these very sad circumstances. The Renewing this script of wrongs that will never end is what I find very off putting. That every act there after is a new slight, is a new inflicted wound, that it is a continuous chamber of torture when in reality decisions have been made long ago and the time has come for everyone to live out the rest of their lives without conjuring up more pain due to this decades old family strife. Kenya has means to heal as well and yet the path she chooses isn't the healthiest. It's time for her to productively tackle these demons and not just use it for ratings. Just saying.

 

But that's just it though, this is exactly how emotional pain works.   The feelings and sadness can't go away because the circumstance, 4 days old or 40 years old were never addressed.  There's no new slight, she's dealing with 1970's original slight.   Everybody's got a story to tell (or not to) so I sincerely hope this one isn't for ratings but she's already decided that ignoring her history is the least healthy path for her.   The sound of the deadbolt should be her answer, I just don't think it's enough. 

[MerryMary]

The main thing I got out of this episode was that Mama Joyce had broken up with her boyfriend.  You know... the one who stripped all of the bathroom fixtures out of Kandi's old house under the guise of remodeling.  Good riddance.

 

Kenya's family storyline is awkward.  I'd rather see her fighting with building contractors. I think the Kandi/Todd/Phaedra money woes is just a fake storyline.  Everyone gets along IRL. 

[lezlers]

Honestly, what came through for me more was some passive-aggressive resentment from Lauren towards Porsha.  Porsha may be self-absorbed, but IMO she was absolutely correct to ask Lauren if she wanted to be there, given that Lauren kept slipping in these little side comments like about having to fly coach, and complaining that the first thing that she has to do in the morning is answer questions about Porsha.  Isn't that what an assistant is supposed to do?  

 

Especially when "first thing in the morning" was 10:00 a.m according to Lauren.  That one got some SERIOUS side-eye from me.  Almost as much side-eye as watching Porsha "work out" in full hair and make-up.

[Petunia13]

I find it curious Kim each episode was expressing her judgement and disdain of the ladies &/or in crying spells. Then had 2 episodes ago was more lively and on a sudden attitude adjustment. Now is gone entirely. Next NeNe is back.

I think the producers realized what I did. Kim's a dud.

[Mountainair]

Sad thing is I'm not sure why we as women are so accepting of that whole "you do what you gotta do" mentality and allow our pregnancies to be compromised because what? It's okay for employers to be dismissive of a women with child? I get it is what it is but I just can't get on board with it being NOT OKAY to want to take it easy when you're pregnant. I know that in this day and age we keep on trucking but what I find offensive is that anyone OTHER than the pregnant person is in a position to judge how much harder they should be working. And on the flip side I really resent Kandi acting all offended at the idea that she should be mindful about her workload during her highrisk pregnancy. That she's rolling her eyes and wanting to prove something isn't to be commended cause nothings worth that much that you have to put your pregnancy on the back burner. That child is your main priority not showing the world that you can still burn the candle at both ends. Completely ridiculous.

Sad thing is I'm not sure why we as women are so accepting of that whole "you do what you gotta do" mentality and allow our pregnancies to be compromised because what? It's okay for employers to be dismissive of a women with child? I get it is what it is but I just can't get on board with it being NOT OKAY to want to take it easy when you're pregnant. I know that in this day and age we keep on trucking but what I find offensive is that anyone OTHER than the pregnant person is in a position to judge how much harder they should be working. And on the flip side I really resent Kandi acting all offended at the idea that she should be mindful about her workload during her highrisk pregnancy. That she's rolling her eyes and wanting to prove something isn't to be commended cause nothings worth that much that you have to put your pregnancy on the back burner. That child is your main priority not showing the world that you can still burn the candle at both ends. Completely ridiculous.

If you want to take it easy during pregnancy then you plan that accordingly. Why should the pregnant lady get to stroll into the office an hour late everyday when I'm expected to be there on time? Just because she's knocked up isn't a viable reason IMO. I agree that maternity leave in this country leaves a lot to be desired but as a working female you should be held to the same standards as everyone else. Pregnant or not.

I'm on my third pregnancy and this is the first one I've been a stay at home mom for. In a lot of instances going to work was lot easier than staying at home. At work I usually had a team of people that could cover for me if I had a dr. Appointment, or was puking in the company bathroom. A lot of days I didn't even have that and kept my puke bag at the desk or scheduled appointments for the most inconvenient time ever. My husband can't be home every day I don't feel good or have a dr. Appointment so I have two "bosses" that don't compromise worth a shit in my children. They need to eat regardless of if I feel like cooking or not. They need a ride to school, on time, regardless of how I feel.

Pregnancy is not a get out of work free card.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Mountainair

[LIMOM]

In my profession, there way too many Patricias out there and there are even more Kenyas as well.  Jesus fix it.

Thanks, this was so helpful.

Haha moment and all.

[selhars]

Pregnancy is not a get out of work free card.

 

I don't' think anyone said it was. Nor do I think Lauren has said she doesn't want to work at all.

But each woman and pregnancy is different and pregnant women DO ask for light duty as all kinds of jobs and companies. Sometimes it's granted sometimes it isn't. it depends on the company and whether an employer wants to get into a possible legal fight. Why can't Porsha hires help for Lauren, or let Lauren work from home? Because Porsha is selfish, and doesn't' appreciate how tiring being pregnant can be for some women.

 

The problem with Porsha and Lauren is the Porsha is to DUMB to realize all that Lauren does to keep Porsha's brand going. And I don't' think missing one package is the end of the world. People do worse at work every day and don't get fired. So Porsha needs to NOT act like that was the end of the world. (And with most packages, I think there are multiple delivery attempts.)

 

That said, I DO think what Porsha does is "work." The constant 'hustle" that many "celebrities" do can be exhausting. Constantly being "on" can be draining. Imagine having to ALWAYS be on, ALWAYS having full make up and hair done, ALWAYS be surrounded by people pulling and tugging on you, telling you go this way, do that. Long days of filming or recording or rehearsals. That 's why some celebrities break down from exhaustion. Plenty of celebrities have melting down from their schedule alone. So I DO think what Porsha does is work. I just  don't' think she appreciates the what Lauren does is JUST AS MUCH work., just a different kind of work. While Porsha is getting her hair done, Lauren is on phone calls. While Porsha is filming, Lauren is handling logistics for an appearance.

 

It's Porsha who I don't think has the a understanding of all Lauren does, NOT the other way around. And IF Porsha showed that she gets the Lauren IS equal in keeping the train going I think that's what Lauren would appreciate. And yes as DUMB as Porsha is -- she DOES need a family member to handle her business. I could she shelters from a mile around taking advantage of her stupid ass. She could end up as broke as MC Hammer! She better give Lauren the help she needs, If she knows what's good for her. But we all know she's to stupid to get all that.

 

ETA: I do think it is cold for Porsha to fly first class and have Lauren in coach. Sure she's your assistance, but she IS your sister. WHy NOT have her sit with you in first class? Everything celebs do and pay for it a tax right or or biz expense anyway So just let her sit  with you?  I don't think Lauren IS asking for everything Porsha has. But if P is in first class and L is squeezed in coach. I think that's deep. Although I must wonder, WHO made those travel arrangements in the first place. Lord knows I can't imagine it was nitwit Porsha. If I got on a plane and went to first class and my sister went back to coach I'd wonder, "Why aren't you up here with me? You should be up here with me" And if a promoter would only pay for my first class ticket then certainly I could pay for my sister's ticket. Damn Porsha, it's an expense. Just write it off for goodness sake.  But do we know -- did Lauren put herself in coach or did Porsha say, "Oh,  YOU fly coach."

Edited January 11, 2016 by selhars

[freeradical]

The story of Kenya and her birth mother has me sad and maybe just a bit confused. Multiple people in the family made poorly thought out decisions thinking that giving Kenya up to the paternal family wouldn't end up in pain and confusion for both Kenya and her birth mother. Sometimes you just know you can't be a mom and the only way to cope with giving the child up is to put it out of your mind forever. Ideally that would have been a closed adoption to strangers. If she had done that it would have been considered a brave and selfless act of love.

[Jezebel97]

I can see both Patricia's & Kenya's sides but I can't see any reason to bringing a camera crew & van load of people for a forced reconciliation.  

As much empathy that I have for Kenya, I just have to side-eye a bit for her motive in this particular "scene" to the Kenya Moore narrative

 

This is a 1993 article which sheds a little bit more light

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20110475,00.html

 

 

[Yours Truly]

If you want to take it easy during pregnancy then you plan that accordingly. Why should the pregnant lady get to stroll into the office an hour late everyday when I'm expected to be there on time? Just because she's knocked up isn't a viable reason IMO. I agree that maternity leave in this country leaves a lot to be desired but as a working female you should be held to the same standards as everyone else. Pregnant or not.

I'm on my third pregnancy and this is the first one I've been a stay at home mom for. In a lot of instances going to work was lot easier than staying at home. At work I usually had a team of people that could cover for me if I had a dr. Appointment, or was puking in the company bathroom. A lot of days I didn't even have that and kept my puke bag at the desk or scheduled appointments for the most inconvenient time ever. My husband can't be home every day I don't feel good or have a dr. Appointment so I have two "bosses" that don't compromise worth a shit in my children. They need to eat regardless of if I feel like cooking or not. They need a ride to school, on time, regardless of how I feel.

Pregnancy is not a get out of work free card.

Very sad that people condone such brutal perimeters. I for one am not going to allow such reckless ideas about pregnant women in the workforce compromise my pregnancy OR my job security OR my means to support my family. It shouldn't be either or. And sometimes people just get pregnant. The nerve!  All I know that there are accommodations made for all sorts of things in the workplace and for various circumstances but for some reason expecting them because of something as "frivolous" as pregnancy is an outrage. SMH. That is all sorts of crazy to me and society buys into it.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Yours Truly

[Yours Truly]

The story of Kenya and her birth mother has me sad and maybe just a bit confused. Multiple people in the family made poorly thought out decisions thinking that giving Kenya up to the paternal family wouldn't end up in pain and confusion for both Kenya and her birth mother. Sometimes you just know you can't be a mom and the only way to cope with giving the child up is to put it out of your mind forever. Ideally that would have been a closed adoption to strangers. If she had done that it would have been considered a brave and selfless act of love.

See, THIS right here. Considering the catch 22 this woman is dealing with I wouldn't be surprised if she were thinking that she would have been better off getting an abortion which is what many woman decide to do because they can't bear the thought of sacrificing to that extent. Because carrying and bearing the child, to giving it up, to live with the child possibly trying to find them and stirring up stuff. I'm telling you woman make these "selffish" decisions all the time when deciding to abort and yet there is more of a support system for the act of abortion than there is for the path this woman went on. I fear that this actually makes woman think twice about deciding adoption over abortion. Now I'm not ProLife, ProChoice nothing. I do lean in one direction more but there's only one person doing the judging in this life and I'm not him however I'm not shy to admit that if an abortion can be avoided I'm all for it so seeing how the decision to keep a child but give the child up can result in this really has me frightened about how those trying to make such a decision are receiving this message. I'm with aging goth, FIX IT JESUS!

Edited January 11, 2016 by Yours Truly

[LIMOM]

From the article posted above:

"Today Moore is wiser about her choice in men. "If there is any sign of their being insecure, I won't get involved," she says. One admirer is Arsenio Hall, on whose show Moore appeared and who subsequently took her to a Lakers game and then dinner at L.A.'s ultrahip restaurant the Ivy. When her pageant days are over, she hopes to begin understanding that sad early chapter of her life by enrolling at UCLA to study child psychology, "it's a way for me to help other kids avoid growing up miserable and bitter," she says. Meanwhile, an apology is an absolute requisite for real mending. But as Kenya prepares for her final pageant. Patricia offers only a blessing from afar. "I'm praying for her," says Patricia. "I wish her all the luck and success in the world."

Too much hurt, IMO.

[ZaldamoWilder]

I can see both Patricia's & Kenya's sides but I can't see any reason to bringing a camera crew & van load of people for a forced reconciliation.  

As much empathy that I have for Kenya, I just have to side-eye a bit for her motive in this particular "scene" to the Kenya Moore narrative

 

This is a 1993 article which sheds a little bit more light

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20110475,00.html

 

"Meanwhile, an apology is an absolute requisite for real mending."

 

I can't tell if the author wrote this or Kenya said it but #facts.

 

See I'm sitting here thinking she wants any kind of dialogue, an explanation any words.  But the minute you say we can't talk until you apologize to somebody who refuses to acknowledge that they did you wrong, it's a wrap and you need to g'awn and bury em in your heart.

[LIMOM]

I can't tell if the author wrote this or Kenya said it but #facts.

 

See I'm sitting here thinking she wants any kind of dialogue, an explanation any words.  But the minute you say we can't talk until you apologize to somebody who refuses to acknowledge that they did you wrong, it's a wrap and you need to g'awn and bury em in your heart.

Which to me, shows that Patricia is either delusional or plain mean.

Why not ask for forgiveness or give an apology in order to give peace and closure to a fellow human being?

[Aging Goth]

For those who wonder how the Williams sisters are getting along, this is what Lauren wrote on instagram and pretty much was reiterated by Porsha as well

 

“My sister Porsha is my partner, my BFF, my favorite MUA, my drinking/party buddy & my 2nd mom. Sometimes we fight and yell, kiss and hug, talk all night, laugh and cry. There is no other person that I would want to have by my side. We’ve had many amazing years of working, succeeding, failing, laughing, crying, and traveling. I’m going to miss the 4am mornings in different cities, states and countries! I’m going to miss the long press days kinda….. Lol but I’ll never be too far. I love my sister beyond words and my new plus one is so blessed to have Auntie Porsha. We’re sisters, we’re best friends, we will get over ANYTHING we go through. Enjoy the show!!! xx”

[Aging Goth]

I can't tell if the author wrote this or Kenya said it but #facts.

 

See I'm sitting here thinking she wants any kind of dialogue, an explanation any words.  But the minute you say we can't talk until you apologize to somebody who refuses to acknowledge that they did you wrong, it's a wrap and you need to g'awn and bury em in your heart.

that quote was written more than two decades ago when her mother did contact her to congratulate her win but she rejected her mother because she wouldn't apologize for abandoning her.  To be technical, Patricia didn't abandon Kenya she gave Kenya to her paternal grandmother to raise and Kenya appeared to have a loving family there.  It was Kenya's choice at 12 to leave that family and pursue the family she would never really be accepted in.

[LIMOM]

that quote was written more than two decades ago when her mother did contact her to congratulate her win but she rejected her mother because she wouldn't apologize for abandoning her.  To be technical, Patricia didn't abandon Kenya she gave Kenya to her paternal grandmother to raise and Kenya appeared to have a loving family there.  It was Kenya's choice at 12 to leave that family and pursue the family she would never really be accepted in.

I thought that she stayed with Doris ( paternal grandmother), lived with her dad for a short while and then moved back with her grandmother.

Did she try to live with the Moore..

[Jezebel97]

Which to me, shows that Patricia is either delusional or plain mean.

Why not ask for forgiveness or give an apology in order to give peace and closure to a fellow human being?

It is Kenya that is asking for an apology

 

"She said she just wanted to congratulate me," recalls Moore, at her Westwood, Calif., apartment. "But I didn't want to talk to her. I'm a very forgiving person. But I'll only forgive her if she asks for my forgiveness."

I can't tell if the author wrote this or Kenya said it but #facts.

 

See I'm sitting here thinking she wants any kind of dialogue, an explanation any words.  But the minute you say we can't talk until you apologize to somebody who refuses to acknowledge that they did you wrong, it's a wrap and you need to g'awn and bury em in your heart.

The author quoted Kenya

 

"She said she just wanted to congratulate me," recalls Moore, at her Westwood, Calif., apartment. "But I didn't want to talk to her. I'm a very forgiving person. But I'll only forgive her if she asks for my forgiveness."

[LIMOM]

It is Kenya that is asking for an apology

 

"She said she just wanted to congratulate me," recalls Moore, at her Westwood, Calif., apartment. "But I didn't want to talk to her. I'm a very forgiving person. But I'll only forgive her if she asks for my forgiveness."

I understand that but what I don"t get is her bio mother resistance in offering her apology or asking for forgiveness.

Does it make sense.

[islandgal140]

She didn't express it quite as articulately as you have lol.  I think she said something like who else is gonna work for you for free and not steal your cash.  Which made me think that before we get really pissed at Lauren's sense of entitlement can we find out if the girl even draws a salary?  I mean if you're only working for perks and then the perks suck, yeah there's going to be a problem.

to her. 

 

No way do I believe Lauren is working for free. That would mean she either had to have a 2nd real job, which I think she wouldn't hesitate to mention during the argument; someone is fronting her modest lifestyle, which I see no indication of but who knows; or she is independent wealthy, which I also see no signs of. The gist I got from it is that as the front line and main contact re: Porsha's 'empire' that she felt like she should have a stake in the business(es), a % or be more of a partner as opposed to an employee since she manages Porsha's businesses. If Lauren is acting more like an agent/manager (actively trying to book her work; evaluating opportunities; negotiating deals) than I can see her argument in getting a percentage any typical manager would get. Does Porsha have management?

 

This is why I would hate working with family. If Lauren is truly not feeling well, having a difficult pregnancy and wants to put parameters on her job, she should go to the doctor and get a doctor's note asking for special accommodations due to her pregnancy. End of story. I think coming in and just telling Porsha or any employer what exactly you are and aren't gonna do whether due to pregnancy or any 'condition' is unprofessional. Get a damn receipt. Otherwise, your ass can come to work like everyone else.

 

Porsha was also unprofessional in how she is reacting to Lauren. 

 

I don't believe what Porsha does on a day to day business is hard. I mean she is basically following the Kardashian model of business with the exception that she doesn't have Satan's concubine as her manager taking a percentage. However, I can believe that what she does is time consuming, if superficial and somewhat stupid. Between Dish Nation, this show and IG, I am sure a great portion of her day is spent in the makeup chair being contoured into infinity and having half the Malaysian populations hair attached to her scalp all at once (could've hidden a small child in her workout hair), but so goes the life of an IG thot trying to make a few dimes! 

 

I'm so nosy. I want to know who Lauren's baby daddy is. Is he even in the picture?

 

Why does Phaedra act like Todd is working on contingency? Nothing he does is dependent on whether the video is released or not. With all her 'jobs' how would she like it if clients only paid if they won their cases or got the highly specific outcome they desired and only paid if they got it? 

 

That Mama Joyce scene seemed so scripted from jump. So, you mean to tell me that the male receptionist dresses in a suit and tie every damn day and walks into Phaedra's office to announce each visitor? 

 

Kenya's dad has been such an odd person to me since he appeared and so has his interactions with his daughter but it is good to see some moments of true feeling and humanity in him. 

 

We have our issues but I can't even imagine what kind of person I would've turned out to be if my own mother ignored my existence. I just can't even wrap my head around such a scenario. That is just the stuff of nightmare fuel. I mean it is great to have grandparents, uncles, aunties and other extended family who love you but there is something about the love and support of your mother and father that just buoys you through life and not having that? Mmmm.... that has a fundamental effect on a person. So I find myself completely sympathetic to Kenya in this regard. I don't even care that Patricia is being exposed on tv. I can't get over the disconnect between her treatment of her daughter and being a social worker. 

Edited January 11, 2016 by islandgal140

[Yours Truly]

 

This is why I would hate working with family. If Lauren is truly not feeling well, having a difficult pregnancy and wants to put parameters on her job, she should go to the doctor and get a doctor's note asking for special accommodations due to her pregnancy. End of story. I think coming in and just telling Porsha or any employer what exactly you are and aren't gonna do whether due to pregnancy or any 'condition' is unprofessional. Get a damn receipt. Otherwise, your ass can come to work like everyone else.

I asked my Dr. for a note for my office when I was pregnant. She said no. I think it's rather offensive that as pregnant women we should need to jump threw so many hoops in order to be allowed to take it easy during pregnancy. I think the outrage comes from the fact that I can't determine that I'm not feeling strong enough to do what I've always done without it being scrutinized, picked apart and analyzed mulled over and then decided on as if a woman carrying a child ain't no thang. It just seems very offensive and the matter of fact mentality that's out there that it's No Big Deal further fuels my anger. I get that it happens everyday but there is also a frailty and fragileness to the whole process.  Care and concern over a person's pregnancy shouldn't be considered a burden or an imposition. Like damn. Gotta say I was all about Don Juans protectiveness over Kandi's pregnancy. It's seems that society has taken for granted what a serious and important thing childbearing is. Good Lord.

[ZaldamoWilder]

Which to me, shows that Patricia is either delusional or plain mean.

Why not ask for forgiveness or give an apology in order to give peace and closure to a fellow human being?

 

Because she doesn't believe she did anything to apologize for.   And I'm referring to her current behavior.

 

that quote was written more than two decades ago when her mother did contact her to congratulate her win but she rejected her mother because she wouldn't apologize for abandoning her. 

 

Yeah, that's what I said, I was adding my current sentiment that then, now, when you want (or rather, demand) an apology that is not forthcoming and/or make it the condition of relationship, from a person who feels they don't owe it, be willing to forget the relationship.

 

To be technical, Patricia didn't abandon Kenya she gave Kenya to her paternal grandmother to raise and Kenya appeared to have a loving family there.  It was Kenya's choice at 12 to leave that family and pursue the family she would never really be accepted in.

 

She's abandoning her now.    I have to struggle to remember not to refer to her as Kenya's mother, she a mother something but not Kenya's mother.

Edited January 11, 2016 by ZaldamoWilder

[drivethroo]

 

Why can't Porsha hires help for Lauren, or let Lauren work from home? Because Porsha is selfish, and doesn't' appreciate how tiring being pregnant can be for some women.

 

But here's the thing, which is why I said Lauren was trying to have it both ways:

 

Whenever Porsha would bring up hiring a new assistant, Lauren would guilt trip her by saying SHE (Lauren) would be the only assistant to look out for her and not rip her off.  If packages are being delivered to the office, somebody needs to be at the office, unless Porsha has all her deliveries diverted to Lauren's home.  But then she'd complain about that.

 

If you can't work, you can't. But don't tell me you can't work but I can't hire a replacement for you.

 

Imagine this: you're pregnant and you tell your boss you can't work 9-5, Monday through Friday anymore because you're pregnant and tired.  You can only work from 10-2 on Wednesday and Thursday.  Your boss says fine, but I need to also hire someone who's going to be here 9-5, Monday through Friday.

 

And you tell him/her, but you can't do that! What other worker is going to look out for you?

 

Nope, wouldn't happen.

 

If Lauren is tired & needs reduced hours, fine.  But don't tell Porsha she can't hire full time help, either.

Edited January 11, 2016 by drivethroo

[Bronzedog]

Just for the record, I have no problem with grocery store flowers. Paying more doesn't keep them alive longer. I'll show myself out now.

[freeradical]

I don't know what Patricia is supposed to ask forgiveness for.

For getting pregnant?

For NOT getting an abortion?

For knowing she would be a shitty parent which probably would have made Kenya's life worse? Well, then she would have have had to ask forgiveness for that!

I hope, at the very least she worked until the day she gave birth!

Patricia could maybe ask for forgiveness for not writing a clear, concise letter when Kenya was born explaining that she didn't want a child and made the choice to allow her family to raise her and forgiveness for not moving the hell away from Detroit to avoid any further confusion.

Edited January 11, 2016 by freeradical

[islandgal140]

I asked my Dr. for a note for my office when I was pregnant. She said no. I think it's rather offensive that as pregnant women we should need to jump threw so many hoops in order to be allowed to take it easy during pregnancy. I think the outrage comes from the fact that I can't determine that I'm not feeling strong enough to do what I've always done without it being scrutinized, picked apart and analyzed mulled over and then decided on as if a woman carrying a child ain't no thang. It just seems very offensive and the matter of fact mentality that's out there that it's No Big Deal further fuels my anger. I get that it happens everyday but there is also a frailty and fragileness to the whole process.  Care and concern over a person's pregnancy shouldn't be considered a burden or an imposition. Like damn. Gotta say I was all about Don Juans protectiveness over Kandi's pregnancy. It's seems that society has taken for granted what a serious and important thing childbearing is. Good Lord.

 

I think there is a difference between taking it easy during pregnancy vs a change that has a material effect on the ability to carry out the job. I don't think a woman should need a note from her doctor to tell her boss she shouldn't be lifting boxes, excessively on her feet, needs longer or more breaks or can't work excessive hours. However, if your job requires you to be in the office and there is no other support staff and now you want to work from home for the next XX months and there is no coverage ... that to me is a different animal. YMMV.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

So basically if she were to humor Kenya then she can be off the hook? I think there's something so very wrong with this sentiment. Basically we are asking this woman to put on a show even if it doesn't come from within and we are also condemning this woman because it doesn't come from within but she isn't going through the motions society deems she should go through for Kenya's sake. Too me the facts of the matter are very sad and very unfortunate but that's where it ends. What isn't necessary is drawing out the pain, the history, the wounds, the scars and all the new byproducts that are coming out of these very sad circumstances. The Renewing this script of wrongs that will never end is what I find very off putting. That every act there after is a new slight, is a new inflicted wound, that it is a continuous chamber of torture when in reality decisions have been made long ago and the time has come for everyone to live out the rest of their lives without conjuring up more pain due to this decades old family strife. Kenya has means to heal as well and yet the path she chooses isn't the healthiest. It's time for her to productively tackle these demons and not just use it for ratings. Just saying.

 

Humor her? I'll humor a friendly dog asking to be pet. Kenya is not a dog and the woman shouldn't put up any show.  What she should do is acknowledge the existence of the child she brought into the world since the child yearns for it so much.  To deny Kenya that, at any age is heartless. I would consider any human being who has a heart, who does that to another human a cold heartless witch no matter the relation.

 

Have you been in a room full of people and be the only one ignored? The rejection hurts no matter what the relation is. Kenya has had to live with that feeling all her life. Try shutting it off. 

 

It is neat and uncomplicated to say that is where it ends. For you. Ending is impossible to Kenya because 1. there is no closure and 2. they are connected through family. It appears that Kenya is closest to her aunt Lori who appears to have a relation to Kenya's sister.  Imagine a simple dinner conversation between them if/when the is sister unintentionally brought up. Kenya should what? In an effort to to "end it" Kenya should unhear she was never mentioned and continue her dinner as if nothing happened?

 

This is what Kenya has to go through with her family all her life. It'll never end. Every single day that this woman has locked her out, Kenya have had to deal with the rejection. Kenya might have moved on if she wasn't a large physical presence in her life by virtue of other family members. 

 

But poor woman, society expects too much from her. Being a decent person shouldn't be enforced by society apparently.

Edited January 12, 2016 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[ToukieSmith]

I did not see an issue between Porsha and Lauren.  That is sister stuff.  I took none of it seriously.  My sister and I fight all of the time.  Water is wet. 

 

Kenya is right to pursue whatever it is that she is trying to get from her mother.  Patricia was very young when she made her decision about giving Kenya away.  I think it was the right decision; however, I think she owes her child some words.  She may not be equipped to provide those words, but they are due to Kenya all the same.  I think she should woman up to do the work she needs to do so that she can ease her child's mind somewhat.  I think its chicken shit for her to bury her head in the sand.  There are no villains here, but Kenya is the primary victim, not Patricia.  She has more access to resources that can help her family's situation than most; I have higher expectations of her.

 

 

We have our issues but I can't even imagine what kind of person I would've turned out to be if my own mother ignored my existence. I just can't even wrap my head around such a scenario. That is just the stuff of nightmare fuel. I mean it is great to have grandparents, uncles, aunties and other extended family who love you but there is something about the love and support of your mother and father that just buoys you through life and not having that?

 

Amen.  My parents and I have our issues, but their combined wisdom and hard work have been to my benefit.  On New Year's Eve, my Dad mentioned that he may be dead in five years during a conversation he was having with my Aunt and I have not been right since.  Friends of my parents have been passing away as of late so its been on my mind that they are of that age that something could happen to them, but for my Dad to say it out loud really has messed with me.

 

I guess we will learn whats up with Nene next week.  Oh joy, cant' wait....not.

I did not see an issue between Porsha and Lauren.  That is sister stuff.  I took none of it seriously.  My sister and I fight all of the time.  Water is wet. 

 

Kenya is right to pursue whatever it is that she is trying to get from her mother.  Patricia was very young when she made her decision about giving Kenya away.  I think it was the right decision; however, I think she owes her child some words.  She may not be equipped to provide those words, but they are due to Kenya all the same.  I think she should woman up to do the work she needs to do so that she can ease her child's mind somewhat.  I think its chicken shit for her to bury her head in the sand.  There are no villains here, but Kenya is the primary victim, not Patricia.  She has more access to resources that can help her family's situation than most; I have higher expectations of her.

 

 

We have our issues but I can't even imagine what kind of person I would've turned out to be if my own mother ignored my existence. I just can't even wrap my head around such a scenario. That is just the stuff of nightmare fuel. I mean it is great to have grandparents, uncles, aunties and other extended family who love you but there is something about the love and support of your mother and father that just buoys you through life and not having that?

 

Amen.  My parents and I have our issues, but their combined wisdom and hard work have been to my benefit.  On New Year's Eve, my Dad mentioned that he may be dead in five years during a conversation he was having with my Aunt and I have not been right since.  Friends of my parents have been passing away as of late so its been on my mind that they are of that age that something could happen to them, but for my Dad to say it out loud really has messed with me.

 

I guess we will learn whats up with Nene next week.  Oh joy, cant' wait....not.

[After7Only]

Lauren/Porsha - Trying to read between the lines of their arguments, it seems to me that Lauren is a lot more than just an assistant to Porsha, and she wants to be treated and compensated as such.  She seems to actually function more as her business partner/manager,   An assistant runs your errands and keeps your calendar.  It sounds like Lauren is doing a lot more than that.  Porsha is the brand and the personality, but it is Lauren who is running the businesses and making sure the that Porsha is not getting ripped off.  She's similar to a Don Juan.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but he has an actual title with Kandi's company.  He's not just her assistant.   

 

Kenya - So much has already been said that has been on point.  It kills me that people try to make up a backstory for her mother.  It's pretty clear from numerous reports, that this was no adoption scenario.  It sounds like neither Kenya, her Dad, or her Aunt Lori would categorize it as such, so we shouldn't either.  Kenya's mother agreed to let the paternal grandparent raise her.  Her mother also chose to stay in the same city as Kenya, and attend family functions where Kenya would be (and proceed to ignore her existence).  This was in the 20s/30s not as a teen.  Demon's or not, there's no excuse.  She was educated in social servcies and education, so she knew better.  She knew exactly the damage she was inflicting to her child.   That being said, hurt people, hurt people.  And I have no doubt her mother has some serious damage from her childhood as well.    

Edited January 11, 2016 by After7Only

[Smacky55]

LAUREN & PORSHA: While Porsha may be insensitive, oversensitive and a wee bit jealous, Lauren is trying to have it both ways: She wants to be able to slack off because she's pregnant but whenever Porsha brings up the suggestion of replacing her, she throws a guilt trip over "who's gonna be there for you & not rip you off?"

Lauren, you can't have it both ways. Either you work ...or you don't. It's just that simple. Millions of pregnant women get up and go to work every day and they are tired, and ill, and vomity, and sluggish but they go to work because they know if they don't, they won't have a job anymore. The job won't fire them for being pregnant, because that's illegal. But if they just aren't doing their job?

Either step your game up or get a temporary assistant for Porsha while you're out on pregnancy leave. Porsha needs to nip this in the bud NOW because after the baby is born the excuse will be she can't do this or that because of the baby. At a certain point she's not going to be able to fly with Porsha anyway, whether it's coach or 1st class so Porsha really needs to be thinking about hiring a replacement for Lauren. Doesn't need to be permanent but a temporary reliable replacement.

KENYA:

If Kenya's dad/parents didn't consent to the adoption, then Kenya's mom couldn't have given her up for adoption. If he didn't know about that, that would be one thing, but he DID know about the pregnancy and he/his parents didn't consent.

Kenya's granddaddy was running the show and he made the choice crystal clear for her mom: Reject the baby or we will reject YOU. No child wants to be rejected by their parents (ironic) so she did what she had to do.

I think the mistake was probably allowing Kenya to get near ANY member of her mom's family (including Aunt Lori) before she reached adulthood. Kenya had to be repeatedly, publically rejected by the mom to not be rejected by her parents.

But the mom had no problem claiming her when she won Miss USA. Girl, bye.

The cycle of rejection started with Kenya's granddaddy and no matter how much love she got from her dad's side or if she was put up for adoption or not, I think Kenya would've felt in the womb a sense of rejection transmitted from her mother and she probably would've turned out the same way.

[Yours Truly]

I don't know what Patricia is supposed to ask forgiveness for.

For getting pregnant?

For NOT getting an abortion?

For knowing she would be a shitty parent which probably would have made Kenya's life worse? Well, then she would have have had to ask forgiveness for that!

I hope, at the very least she worked until the day she gave birth!

Patricia could maybe ask for forgiveness for not writing a clear, concise letter when Kenya was born explaining that she didn't want a child and made the choice to allow her family to raise her and forgiveness for not moving the hell away from Detroit to avoid any further confusion.

LOVEEEEEEEEEEE THHHHHIIIISSSSSS!!!!!

[Smacky55]

Managing Porsha's businesses AND being her assistant sounds like a lot of work is she's doing both those things herself.

I definitely understand that if she's at work she needs to do her job, pregnant or not, but there are concessions that can be made.

When I was pregnant I managed the same number of patients as the other people on the team, but they just let me have the ones who were on the closer wards and not the ones where I'd have to walk halfway across the hospital. Similarly, Lauren doesn't NEED to go to the awards show with Porsha, she can be home doing other stuff. I was sooooo tired at nights even in my first trimester that I couldn't imagine working all day then doing something at night as well.

Sounds like the biggest problem is that there is likely no official contract between Lauren and her sister detailing what her responsibilities are and likely has nothing about leave or maternity leave and seems like not even salary either.

[Yours Truly]

I think there is a difference between taking it easy during pregnancy vs a change that has a material effect on the ability to carry out the job. I don't think a woman should need a note from her doctor to tell her boss she shouldn't be lifting boxes, excessively on her feet, needs longer or more breaks or can't work excessive hours. However, if your job requires you to be in the office and there is no other support staff and now you want to work from home for the next XX months and there is no coverage ... that to me is a different animal. YMMV.

True. It's the way it's playing out in an edited show that has my pregnancy induced permanent sciatica in a knot.. LOL!

[Yours Truly]

Humor her? I'll humor a friendly dog asking to be pet. Kenya is not a dog and the woman shouldn't put up any show.  What she should do is acknowledge the existence of the child she brought into the world since the child yearns for it so much.  To deny Kenya that, at any age is heartless. I would consider any human being who has a heart, who does that to another human a cold heartless witch no matter the relation.

 

Have you been in a room full of people and be the only one ignored? The rejection hurst no matter what the relation is. Kenya has had to live with that feeling all her life. Try shutting it off. 

 

It is neat and uncomplicated to say that that is where it ends. For you. Ending is impossible to Kenya because 1. there is no closure and 2. they are connected through family. It appears that Kenya is closest to her aunt Lori who appears to have a relation to Kenya's sister.  Imagine a simple dinner conversation between them if/when the sister unintentionally is brought up. Kenya should what? In an effort to to "end it" Kenya should unhear she was never mentioned and continue her dinner as if nothing happened?

 

This is what Kenya has to go through with her family all her life. It'll never end. Every single day that this woman has locked her out, Kenya have had to deal with the rejection. Kenya might have moved on if she wasn't a large physical presence in her life by virtue of other family members. 

 

But poor woman, society expects too much from her. Being a decent person shouldn't be enforced by society apparently.

My point is Kenya's unfortunate circumstances doesn't magically cancel out Patricia's unfortunate circumstances. Demanding something that is obviously not easy for Patricia to do in order to appease Kenya is the same as demanding Kenya stop yearning for a connection in order to appease Patricia.  At this point they are both grown women and they are at an impasse. To rate one woman's demons as more deserving relief than another's just seems ridiculous to me. There are no winners, there are no monsters, there are just two people living with some heartbreaking circumstance in a world that could have turned out a whole lot worse than what's their realities. I think it's sad that there is all this effort being made to keep such gloom alive. Being a decent woman isn't something that the masses should be able to determine about a person after only seeing a portion of someone else's life. I think we owe it to society to go a little deeper before determining the humanity of someone else. That's a big responsibility and isn't to be taken lightly. Emotion AND Reason should play a part. 

[Carolina Girl]

While I can sympathize with Kenya's situation  vis-a-vis her mother, what sympathy I had for her went out the window when she and her buddy decided to snot about Walter one last time, first making fun of his profession, then his looks, and then calling him a liar for saying he and Kenya weren't dating.  He's said that from the get-go, and there was nothing in his body english, his words or anything else that indicated to me he had the slightest bit of affection for her.  And not only that, he's no longer a part of the show so she can snot and smear to her heart's content and her entourage will back it up.

 

Peter and Todd, at least, know the truth of it.  

[Bluethcs24]

I feel bad for Kenya.  Her mom is no different from a deadbeat dad that gets a girl pregnant and leaves her family to raise the child while he goes on about his business.  The least she could've done was acknowledge Kenya when they were in mixed family company.  What a cold hearted bitch.

 

 

[Sheenieb]

 

 

I don't know what Patricia is supposed to ask forgiveness for.

 

For treating Kenya as if she's a figment of her imagination, for starters. I don't think anyone is asking nor expecting for them to be close. But acknowledgment goes a long way. Even if she bluntly told Kenya that she doesn't want to have a relationship and she doesn't regret what she did, it'll still hurt like a bitch, but at least she'll acknowledge that Kenya is real. I don't know how she's living with herself. There's nothing that can be done about the past, but to be 60 whatever years old and not reflect on how fucked up the situation is is appalling. But I guess the moral of this story is sometimes you never get closure. Shitty things happen and you'll never find out why.

[Sugarbaker]

I get what all of you are saying about hoping she's able to just disregard her the way she's been disregarded and move on but I can't imagine it being that simple.  It's her whole life's mystery, I don't see how she can ever stop wanting an answer, even if Patricia's answer is I don't know why I can't talk to you I just can't.  

It can’t be that simple, especially with Aunt Lori having always been in the picture and her being Patricia’s big sister, the possibility of having a sit down with both of them (Lori/Pat) has been a real prospect for Kenya that she could never give up on.

 

Something tells me that Kenya put Lori in the middle of this, maybe by getting Patricia's address from her without her knowledge BUT I will wait and see.

Aunt Lori has put herself in the middle of this for over 40 years when she continued to have a relationship with newborn, toddler, child, teen, and adult Kenya. As far as her address, perhaps Carlos King & his crew tracked that down for Kenya.

 

I think the mistake was probably allowing Kenya to get near ANY member of her mom's family (including Aunt Lori) before she reached adulthood.  Kenya had to be repeatedly, publically rejected by the mom to not be rejected by her parents.

Exactly, the muddy waters in this situation formed when Kenya was still in diapers. This wasn’t an adoption, this was a “if we ignore the issues maybe they will go away” situation. Patricia has seemingly had 40+ years of this attitude, & now can’t & won’t break the habit. Lori doesn’t want to rock the boat with either Kenya or Pat, and Kenya rightfully just wants some damn answers. Thankfully her dad did drop her some tidbits about the Moore grandparents, but they just caused more questions than answers.

[Iguessnot]

Lauren barely looks like she ate a burger and she's carrying on like she's heavy with child. And if her job can all be done on the computer, she just needs to head to the store front and use the computer there with a nice cushy chair she can nap in. She can get her work yet be available for on site deliveries.

 

For me, there is always a big gaping hole in Kenya's narrative. If a 12 year old leaves Texas for Detroit, I need to know more. The mother doesn't acknowledge Kenya, but she's not exactly hiding. I'm starting to wonder if "she pretends I don't exist" really equates to she refuses to play the mommy role which Kenya is demanding. I'm not excusing the woman, but she has also never married or had other children so there's a sense that something else catastrophic happened. Aunt Lori maintains contact with her sister and Kenya, so Kenya's constant repetition that she doesn't know why doesn't seem genuine. Let's say her mom had dementia. Yet when complaining to strangers she would complain about the negative effects without accepting what the ailment does.

 

When Kenya loudly asked where was aunt Lori, I noticed the lady whispered all sorts of things. I think I heard, "you know she left". Kenya responded to her in hush tones as though the woman didn't deliver the script properly. I knew Lori's absence had something to do with the mother. We'll see if she shows up later. However Kenya, when you park in front of someone's home in a minibus and claim you have to approach the situation alone, wearing your Bravo mic betrays your motives. I'm also not going to accept her claim of non attendance by the Moore clan at face value.

 

Someone please snatch that weave off of Nicole's head. And while you're at it, drive by the Tucker home and snatch them off the two young ladies living there.

[LIMOM]

I don't know what Patricia is supposed to ask forgiveness for.

For getting pregnant?

For NOT getting an abortion?

For knowing she would be a shitty parent which probably would have made Kenya's life worse? Well, then she would have have had to ask forgiveness for that!

I hope, at the very least she worked until the day she gave birth!

Patricia could maybe ask for forgiveness for not writing a clear, concise letter when Kenya was born explaining that she didn't want a child and made the choice to allow her family to raise her and forgiveness for not moving the hell away from Detroit to avoid any further confusion.

Oh you decided to tone it down and remove the insulting part about the masses.

Great. I can see that it was a passionate post but I doubt that insulting others will make them change their minds.myself included.

[lezlers]

I actually really tried to put myself in Patricia's position to try and understand how she can be so cruel to a child (not only her child but ANY child) and I can't.  I just can't.  This was not a closed adoption.  Patricia knowingly attended family gatherings where her biological child, who she knew was aware of who SHE was, would be and then ignored her.  That is being willfully and intentionally cruel.  Kenya didn't have a choice to attend those gatherings when she was a small child but Patricia DID.  That's not a mother, that's not a woman.  That's a straight up ice cold monster.

[RCharter]

So carrying the child, birthing the child, making sure the child has the opportunity at a loving home. That's not being responsible or accountable for her actions? That's a head scratcher. The woman can't provide something she isn't in possession of and that's a maternal bond I think her mother afforded Kenya all she was able to and to condemn her for not providing something she doesn't have to give. Something that is being demanded from her time and time again. Not being afforded the relief she thought she should received by making the decision to give her up. I mean I don't understand what else there is supposed to be. This whole magical mother child philosophy that so many people want to impose on those who, I'm sorry, just AREN'T born with it cause more trouble than good. Sometimes life is hard and looking for people or things to blame doesn't heal a thing.

If, as other said, carrying and birthing the child were her biggest option in the 70's for a 15 year old girl in the South, she didn't do anything out of the ordinary.  And if she wanted to never even acknowledge her child's existence and make her child suffer either she should have moved or she should have pushed for the out of family adoption.  She did neither.  While her mistakes are understandable, making a child suffer for her mistakes is not understandable, its mean.  No one was asking Patricia for a maternal bond, they were asking her to be a decent human being, sit down, and have a conversation or at least explain to Kenya what the deal was.  

 

In this situation, someone was going to have to suffer from Kenya being born and being raised by Ronald's mother.  It was either going to be Kenya, who is totally blameless, and was going to have to suffer absolute rejection from her mother.  Or, it was going to be Patricia, who was going to have to put up with the shame of having given birth to Kenya as a result of her own decisions at 15.  One of those parties is wholly blameless, the other one made a decision that resulted in the situation. If there is someone that has to bear the brunt, it should be the person who actually made the decisions, and that was Patricia.  Yeah, sometimes life is hard, and sometimes you make a bad decision at 15, but the answer isn't that a blameless child should suffer for the mistake a 15 year old made.

 

Instead, a child was taught that she was less than nothing because her own mother acted as though she never even existed.  Thats an awful thing to do to a child, and you don't get a pass because you made a bad decision at 15.  Because someone in that situation is going to suffer.  Either the 15 year old suffers because they have to face something they are ashamed of, or the child suffers because they are treated like dirt.  In that situation, the person who made a decision should be the one to suffer, not the child.

[freeradical]

Oh you decided to tone it down and remove the insulting part about the masses.

Great. I can see that it was a passionate post but I doubt that insulting others will make them change their minds.myself included.

This is really weird!

I never said anything about "the masses" it's not a word I even use. And I certainly didn't say anything that could be construed as insulting to anyone.

You definitely quoted the wrong post.

Edited January 13, 2016 by freeradical

[RCharter]

That is why I felt Kenya should not have approached her with the camera going.  This should have been a very private situation.  Not saying she would have responded but the camera made certain she would not respond.  It also appears the entire Moore family feels the same way and may be pressuring Patricia to maintain her silence.  Don't quite know what her demons may be.

 

Gotcha.  same reason as above.  The entire family is dysfunctional.

Kenya has made it clear that she has tried to talk to her mother for years and years, without a camera around.  It makes sense to me, that if she wanted this conversation to happen that, in a last ditch effort, she try with cameras.

 

And maybe Patricia will read the comments, see the episode and realize just how terrible comes off.  But if Kenya wanted a different result, she had to try a different tactic.

 

So basically if she were to humor Kenya then she can be off the hook? I think there's something so very wrong with this sentiment. Basically we are asking this woman to put on a show even if it doesn't come from within and we are also condemning this woman because it doesn't come from within but she isn't going through the motions society deems she should go through for Kenya's sake. Too me the facts of the matter are very sad and very unfortunate but that's where it ends. What isn't necessary is drawing out the pain, the history, the wounds, the scars and all the new byproducts that are coming out of these very sad circumstances. The Renewing this script of wrongs that will never end is what I find very off putting. That every act there after is a new slight, is a new inflicted wound, that it is a continuous chamber of torture when in reality decisions have been made long ago and the time has come for everyone to live out the rest of their lives without conjuring up more pain due to this decades old family strife. Kenya has means to heal as well and yet the path she chooses isn't the healthiest. It's time for her to productively tackle these demons and not just use it for ratings. Just saying.

 

I actually think thats exactly it.  For Patricia to even "humor" Kenya would mean so much to her, and while it would make Patricia uncomfortable, it should be Patricia that has to be uncomfortable and not Kenya.  I don't see anything wrong with humoring someone, or making yourself uncomfortable for a few hours to make someone who has been summarily rejected by you for over 40 years and treated as though she didn't even exist feel a little better.  Especially when that person was absolutely blameless in the situation.

 

Patricia is either going to sit down and have the conversation, or she isn't.  One of those decisions protects Patricia, and hurts Kenya.  One of the decisions helps Kenya, but makes Patricia uncomfortable.  

 

And if one person has to be uncomfortable in the situation, its Patricia, not Kenya.

 

Its funny to me that we would suggest that Kenya should just "forget about it" and "move on" even though she was a baby when she had to go through this rejection and still suffers from the rejection.  Yet, Patricia should get a pass because "she is suffering" and "she can't get over the pain"  Say what?  

 

If the expectation is that Kenya "get over" 40 years of rejection, why can't Patricia "get over" whatever made her reject Kenya in the first place enough to allow her to have a human conversation with Kenya?  Or do we only expect a person who was born into rejection to "get over it," but someone who made the decision that resulted in the situation in the first place gets a pass?

Kenya can't let go, IMO.

Doing on camera was self serving but a part of me wonders if she Kenya thought that somehow this would force her mom's hand to speak with her.

She even said: "I need to go alone"

Kenya still hopes against all hopes.

I think this is exactly it.  Kenya has tried for years to get her mother to acknowledge her without cameras.  I guess she figured she would try with cameras since she couldn't convince her mother without them.  I see it as a way to hopefully get her mother to even talk to her.

[represent]

 

One of those parties is wholly blameless, the other one made a decision that resulted in the situation. If there is someone that has to bear the brunt, it should be the person who actually made the decisions, and that was Patricia.

This is where I am especially if it is fact that the Patricia the 15 year old teenager did not want to keep the child. Do we know if this is the case? Based on the way she's behaved, I can't see her not crying out that she didn't want to keep the baby.

 

The only problem is the father because he wanted the baby correct?

 

So instead of fighting an embarrassing custody fight they let the father and his family have their way. 

 

The only problem is her choosing to attend family events with the child there. But if she wanted to be around her family she had to put up with seeing the child she never wanted. 

 

Anyway, this is one hell of a sad story.  I can't imagine reacting that way to a child I gave birth to unless I was raped, but even then I'd feel compelled to give them an explanation later on in life. Still, can't see this woman as evil incarnate. I just feel like I'm still missing pieces of the story. I also believe her family took away her power when they decided to keep her unwanted child in the family because at fifteen she wasn't allowed to make the final decision. I personally, would just once, look that child in the eye and tell them where I truly stood, wish them well and that would have to be the end of it. But I could not imagine leaving another human being who came from me, just twisting in the wind without an explanation. 

 

Like I don't understand not being able at some point in your adulthood to have enough empathy for the child you birthed to just give them a little piece of mind, some truth directly from you.

 

I mean did I just read in a link posted above that she's a teacher? And a Special Ed. teacher no less?  That really makes it hard for me to believe that she can't give her kid a moment after all these years. Even if she wrote her a letter, understanding that she still can't look her in the eye. 

But something, from one human being to another.

[RCharter]

This is where I am especially if it is fact that the Patricia the 15 year old teenager did not want to keep the child. Do we know if this is the case? Based on the way she's behaved, I can't see her not crying out that she didn't want to keep the baby.

 

The only problem is the father because he wanted the baby correct?

 

So instead of fighting an embarrassing custody fight they let the father and his family have their way. 

Ronald...or someone, said that they called Patricia and begged her to let them keep the baby.  To me, if they were begging Patricia, its because she had the power, and they couldn't gain much in a court battle.  In the 70's I doubt it would have been a long, protracted court battle since Patricia was the mother and a teen mother at that.  If she indicated she wanted to give the baby up for adoption I think it would have happened.  Even in states today, the concept of a fathers right in a situation of teen pregnancy is almost a fairy tale.  The fact that they begged Patricia and not Patricia's father or Patricia's family makes me think that Patricia had at least some of the power or else they would have completely bypassed her and spoken to her parents.

[represent]

Ronald...or someone, said that they called Patricia and begged her to let them keep the baby.  To me, if they were begging Patricia, its because she had the power, and they couldn't gain much in a court battle.  In the 70's I doubt it would have been a long, protracted court battle since Patricia was the mother and a teen mother at that.  If she indicated she wanted to give the baby up for adoption I think it would have happened.  Even in states today, the concept of a fathers right in a situation of teen pregnancy is almost a fairy tale.  The fact that they begged Patricia and not Patricia's father or Patricia's family makes me think that Patricia had at least some of the power or else they would have completely bypassed her and spoken to her parents.

 

 

 

Then they probably should have told her that her mother was dead. As a matter a fact, they should have lied to Kenya about that entire side of her lineage, like a damn plague came and took them all out. But no, aunt Lori and the rest wanted to be part of her life, so she had someone to run away to when she left her father in Texas at the age of twelve. At the very least it would have saved her the pain of rejection through her primary and adolescent years. She might have been stronger to deal with the rejection when the truth came out, cause it always does....once she reached adulthood.  But to go to family functions as a kid and know that's your mother who is shunning you....watching kids in your family get loving hugs from their mothers, watching kids at school with their mothers, no, just no.

 

I'm surprised that the only damage Kenya does is stir up shit with all her "tea", yell at people through bullhorns and twirl. Now that I think about her background, it could be worse, a hell of a lot worse.  

[Aging Goth]

Patricia attended MOORE family events. The Grant family was supposed to be in Texas. No one expected Kenya to run to Detroit at 12. Only her aunt appears to have wanted contact. And Lorie might've just wanted a child to raise.

[Bronzedog]

It's strange to me that Patricia is a social worker but has such a dysfunctional, non relationship with someone she gave birth to. Ronald also seems to have some kind of a neurological thing going on. There's something strange about him too.