S09.E11: The Opening Night Excitation

[DrSpaceman73]

He could have just put on a Star Trek uniform, made it a nondescript Star Trek reference and got the point across.

Choosing to be Spock in particular with the funny ears seemed a bit cartoonish as well.

[vibeology]

The complicated part is that these guys are online every day - there's a huge risk of getting spoiled if you don't see the movie soon after it comes out.

 

Also, I don't understand why it's either/or (spend the day with Amy or go to the movie). Amy knows this means a great deal to Sheldon, he's been waiting for it for YEARS, so why not go together?

I get that because tickets were sold out that Sheldon and Amy couldn't have gone together but I do hate how all three women don't like Star Wars. As others have said, Star Wars isn't some tabletop game or comic book with a niche following. It's Star Wars. It's box office wasn't pulled off by fanboys alone; my theatre was full of men and women, kids, teens, grandparents, people who saw the originals in theatre, people who saw the prequels in theatre and people who were seeing a Star Wars film on the big screen for the first time. Everyone (demographically, not every actual person) likes Star Wars.

As for the big event, I did not like so much of it. I hate Amy as a girlfriend and this did not do anything to change my opinion. She finds out second hand that Sheldon is ready to have sex. She lights her apartment for it and then when he arrives announces, like a greedy child on Christmas morning, that she wants to ignore Sheldon's plans for the night and skip straight to the gift. Okay then. Maybe Sheldon meticulously planned the night out so he'd be comfortable and ready, but Amy just barrels past that to get what she wants. Then when Sheldon starts to explain what his gift is she cuts him off and is all "your gift is sex." Nothing Sheldon has said up to that point makes that clear so now if he had changed his mind or gotten nervous he's in a position where he either has to disappoint her or go along with something he doesn't feel ready for. That's nice. Finally, while Sheldon is all worried about getting consent, Amy is on him like a cat in heat, barely concerned about him.

I know from a writing standpoint we'd already seen Sheldon talk about being ready, but that was with Penny and Bernadette. It was a wonderfully funny scene and it would be redundant to have Sheldon go over it again from a TV point of view, but from a relationship point of view making sure your significant other is ready shouldn't be done through a game of telephone.

Finally, I hate the idea of sex/virginity being something your give as a gift. Normally it's a woman and there are larger cultural issues that make that extra gross, but in general it just bugs me to hear sex talked about that way.

So there were great moments in the episode, but I really hated the central story and the way it was structured. I think Amy continues to the worst girlfriend and am sad that she cared way more about herself than she did Sheldon in that moment when his focus was clearly on her.

 

Edited to add: Just to be clear, I also think Sheldon makes for a pretty crappy boyfriend and I do think you spend your SO's birthday with them unless there is a reason its impossible. (like long-distance, huge work thing, family crisis etc) But where I'm willing to be more forgiving of Sheldon is that when they got together they were basically on the same page when it came to dating/sex/intimacy. Its Amy who keeps moving the goalposts and expecting Sheldon to get on board. He's a horrible boyfriend, (and the examples are too numerous to list) but Amy should move on then and find someone more compatible. Its one thing to expect someone to grow in a relationship; its another thing to demand that someone grow in a certain way.

Edited December 23, 2015 by vibeology

[Good Queen Jane]

He could have just put on a Star Trek uniform, made it a nondescript Star Trek reference and got the point across.

Choosing to be Spock in particular with the funny ears seemed a bit cartoonish as well.

 

I thought of it as a tribute to the late Leonard Nimoy.

[lh25]

Its one thing to expect someone to grow in a relationship; its another thing to demand that someone grow in a certain way

 

 

It's funny how we can see things so differently.  I don't see it as her demanding anything from Sheldon.  She came to the realization that he wasn't what she wanted and left.  He came to her to reconcile.

[possibilities]

When you love someone, it often inspires you to things you wouldn't have considered otherwise. That's been true for me, and it has nothing to do with anyone trying to make me change anything. It was just that I gained an appreciation of things by seeing them through the other person's eyes. I think Sheldon has shown in more than enough ways that it's ironclad, that he is not easily swayed, does what he wants, and does not bend to anyone's will. The entire show revolves around his habits and demands, and everyone on it lets him run the group and the relationships they have with him. He's the one with the contracts and the rules. If anything, he's trying to bend other people to his will, not vice versa.

 

Amy was enthusiastic, but did not force Sheldon to follow through on the "physical intimacy." When did getting excited about getting what you've wanted and asked for but had previously been denied become a violation? Even after she kissed him, Sheldon was still double checking that SHE gave consent.

 

The man is not a pushover. And she has been more patient and yielding, and let him be in charge of their relationship and its milestones, more than anyone else looking for an equal partnership would.

 

I know what it's like to see an iconic character veer off the path I've seen them as being on, but I don't think that the show had Sheldon do that because he was forced by Amy, or even pressured. Maybe the writers bowed to peer pressure in deciding to make Sheldon sexually active, but I think Sheldon as a character was shown to have agency while doing it.

[Chaos Theory]

For the record I am a girl and the first time I saw Star Wars I hated it and I am a bit of a sci fi nerd. I think because there was little to no female presence on the show (Not counting Leia). It was only years later that I was able to enjoy the movies for what they are.

[vibeology]

It's funny how we can see things so differently.  I don't see it as her demanding anything from Sheldon.  She came to the realization that he wasn't what she wanted and left.  He came to her to reconcile.

 

Well, first she came to him and tried to get back together despite Sheldon not really changing a bit from their breakup. Amy loves him and wants to be with him and that is admirable, but nothing changed between the breakup and her attempt to get back together with him. He was a good friend to her, but I think any of his friends would say the same despite wanting to throttle him some/most of the time. I just remember Amy sitting Sheldon down for dinner and telling him she had a four year plan to wear him down. That's what I meant when I said she's been pushing him to change the way she wants. I don't think that makes for a good girlfriend. (While not ignoring his flaws because he's a crappy boyfriend. I think because neither of them really every dated before they are very immature romantically and it really shows.)

 

When you love someone, it often inspires you to things you wouldn't have considered otherwise. That's been true for me, and it has nothing to do with anyone trying to make me change anything. It was just that I gained an appreciation of things by seeing them through the other person's eyes. I think Sheldon has shown in more than enough ways that it's ironclad, that he is not easily swayed, does what he wants, and does not bend to anyone's will. The entire show revolves around his habits and demands, and everyone on it lets him run the group and the relationships they have with him. He's the one with the contracts and the rules. If anything, he's trying to bend other people to his will, not vice versa.

 

Amy was enthusiastic, but did not force Sheldon to follow through on the "physical intimacy." When did getting excited about getting what you've wanted and asked for but had previously been denied become a violation? Even after she kissed him, Sheldon was still double checking that SHE gave consent.

 

The man is not a pushover. And she has been more patient and yielding, and let him be in charge of their relationship and its milestones, more than anyone else looking for an equal partnership would.

 

I know what it's like to see an iconic character veer off the path I've seen them as being on, but I don't think that the show had Sheldon do that because he was forced by Amy, or even pressured. Maybe the writers bowed to peer pressure in deciding to make Sheldon sexually active, but I think Sheldon as a character was shown to have agency while doing it.

 

I mostly liked the way Sheldon handled them getting intimate. I thought he was very honest with Amy, was nicely concerned about consent and I liked that he didn't hop out of bed right afterwards to try to buy Star Wars tickets or something. What I didn't like was Amy. When it comes to being intimate with someone there is no such thing as "more than patient." If Amy doesn't want to wait, move on, and actually move on. Don't call Sheldon up and be like "want to get back together?"

 

Sheldon was considering having sex with her but just because he told Penny and Bernadette that was his plan doesn't mean he wasn't allowed to change his mind. Amy, however, skipped over dinner (that OCD-like Sheldon might have built into his mental preparations of the night) and cut him off when he was trying to tell her about the gift, assuming that he hadn't changed his mind.

 

I absolutely agree that getting physical was Sheldon's choice, but just imagine if he'd gotten nervous on the way over (I'm guessing by bus since the guys were at Star Wars and Penny and Bernadette were hanging out at the apartment) and ordered Wool Festival tickets on his phone. Now Amy jumps at him and says "your gift is sleeping with me." She's not putting him in the best position if he needs to back out and say no, especially since they've just gotten back together and everyone in his life and in his brain have been telling him that he needs to show her that she's important to him. The fact that she was so pushy that she couldn't wait the extra few seconds to let Sheldon tell her in his own way bugged me. Its one thing added to a list of many things Amy has done that make me think she's as bad a girlfriend as he is a boyfriend.

[hnygrl]

I honestly couldn't bring myself to watch this episode and I don't know if I ever will. I just believe, considering Sheldon's upbringing, that some things would be better left to the imagination. I would have loved it if they hadn't shown anything. But cut to the next day at work and Sheldon/Amy are all secret looks and shy smiles and everybody just KNOWS..YOU DID IT DIDN"T YOU!!!! That would've been better (in my opinion) than the lowering of the morals of an incredibly moral man.

 

I dunno...I just may be done with TBBT. I fear a How I Met Your Mother level disappointing ending in our futures.

[shapeshifter]

I thought of it as a tribute to the late Leonard Nimoy.

Except that in the script it was done to piss off the Star Wars fans who had filled the theater, and from everything I know about Leonard Nimoy, that's not his way.

[anna0852]

I honestly couldn't bring myself to watch this episode and I don't know if I ever will. I just believe, considering Sheldon's upbringing, that some things would be better left to the imagination. I would have loved it if they hadn't shown anything. But cut to the next day at work and Sheldon/Amy are all secret looks and shy smiles and everybody just KNOWS..YOU DID IT DIDN"T YOU!!!! That would've been better (in my opinion) than the lowering of the morals of an incredibly moral man.

 

I dunno...I just may be done with TBBT. I fear a How I Met Your Mother level disappointing ending in our futures.

Sheldon's issues with sex have never been about morals. It's been a combination of touch/germ issues and seeing sex as a distraction from his work and not worthy of his time. He's done plenty of amoral things on this show, including but not limited to mixing dead insects into Leonard's food.

[sinkwriter]

 

Sheldon's issues with sex have never been about morals.

 

Agreed. If anything, it's Sheldon's mother who would have issue with him having sex (before marriage). I'm surprised he didn't comment about that at some point.

[possibilities]

What they showed was not very risque, if that's what you are worried about. One kiss and then they cut away. Then afterwards, I think they next to each other in bed but the only touching in that scene was I think they might have been holding hands. It was not sensationalized at all.

 

I'm not sure, though, why it would be more moral to DO IT and have everybody see that you'd DONE IT without telling anyone you were planning to. He told Penny and Bernadette beforehand because he wanted advice, not because he was bragging.

[Homily]

Agreed. If anything, it's Sheldon's mother who would have issue with him having sex (before marriage). I'm surprised he didn't comment about that at some point.

 

Given what happened when Sheldon last visited her though she's not really in any position to have issues with her 35 yr old son having a sexual relationship with his long time girlfriend.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Homily

[Sarnia]

that some things would be better left to the imagination

Well things were pretty much left to the imagination here (and it was handled very well). And I don't get how Sheldon's morals would be lowered by being intimate with his girlfriend of several years?

[Jediknight]

Regarding the guys and costumes. A lot of theaters are putting bans on costumes for safety reasons.

To back that up, my theater banned masks and toy weapons.  So there was really nobody you could go as, and I'd imagine the masks ban would extend to X-Wing helmets, so you couldn't dress as Poe.  So it's 100% realistic that the guys wouldn't dress up, and would just wear Star Wars shirts instead.

[CleoCaesar]

Sheldon's issues with sex have never been about morals. It's been a combination of touch/germ issues and seeing sex as a distraction from his work and not worthy of his time.

 

Plus his total lack of interest it. He's never mentioned finding someone sexy, or expressed a desire to flirt or touch, have sex, or even masturbate. By the age of 35, he's never expressed those feelings.

 

Sheldon, up until this episode, was unambiguously asexual (excluding one comment in the pilot). Nothing wrong with that. It's who he is. Or was, I suppose. Calling his having sex with Amy character growth and "progress" is more or less the same as saying a gay man sleeping with a woman is "progress".

[Chaos Theory]

Plus his total lack of interest it. He's never mentioned finding someone sexy, or expressed a desire to flirt or touch, have sex, or even masturbate. By the age of 35, he's never expressed those feelings.

Sheldon, up until this episode, was unambiguously asexual (excluding one comment in the pilot). Nothing wrong with that. It's who he is. Or was, I suppose. Calling his having sex with Amy character growth and "progress" is more or less the same as saying a gay man sleeping with a woman is "progress".

That is not true and an unfair and quite wrong comparison. For one thing Sheldon has never said he was gay or Asexual. Is progression has been in a more or less steady trajectory since he met Amy. First she was just a friend who was a girl then she was a girl friend. They have periodically touched and even kissed. He has never shown interest in sex for several reasons none of which bare any comparisons to a gay man suddenly becoming straight. If you think that then you are watching a completely different show then I am.

[BookWoman56]

I don't consider Sheldon choosing to have sex as "growth" in the sense of a change from being asexual to being sexual (or from being sexually inactive to sexually active) somehow magically constituting character growth. However, I'm not sure that Sheldon was really asexual in the classic sense; he seemed to just be someone who had a fairly low libido and had been culturally programmed to regard sex outside of marriage as morally wrong. I've thought for a long time that Sheldon shows many symptoms of schizoid personality disorder, which would explain him not wanting to be emotionally close and/or physically intimate with many people. But I also despise the TV trope that character growth means learning to put somebody else's needs above your own. Having consideration for someone else's feelings, fine. But I'd be very uncomfortable with the idea of Sheldon, or any other character, choosing to engage in an activity he or she actively disliked or found abhorrent just to maintain a relationship.

 

For me, the growth that Sheldon has exhibited was being able to decide for himself that he wanted to maintain the relationship with Amy, figuring out that doing so meant he needed to make her feel valued, deciding that having sex was a good way to indicate the strength of his feelings for her, and carrying through with his plan in a calm, rational way. He was able to balance his own emotions and desire to go to the movie premiere with the desire to maintain the relationship, and come to a decision that worked for him and with which he was comfortable. He showed enough self-awareness to discern that he was nervous about having sex for the first time, but also enough confidence in the strength of the relationship to feel that even though both of them might be nervous, it would work out.

 

Overall, I thought the scenes with him and Amy were done very well and in a way that made sense for both characters.

Edited December 27, 2015 by BookWoman56

[CleoCaesar]

For one thing Sheldon has never said he was gay or Asexual.

 

So? The show has never said he was on the autism spectrum, but anyone who's seen a few episodes can tell that he is. Same thing for asexuality. If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. Not everything has to be spelled out for viewers.

[Chaos Theory]

So? The show has never said he was on the autism spectrum, but anyone who's seen a few episodes can tell that he is. Same thing for asexuality. If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. Not everything has to be spelled out for viewers.

I do not want get into this debate because it is unfair. I have a friend who didn't have sex until they were 38 not because they were unattractive but because they were uninterested. 6 months later that person was married. Sometimes it comes down to finding a person who is worth it. My point is since the story began it is about Sheldon becoming a real boy. Again not a fair or accurate comparison but finding a friend and then a group of friends and the a friend who is a girl and then a girl friend. He is probably somewhere on the Asperger scale but the show didn't want to say the words because they would be forced to write him as realistic as possible instead of just annoying and weird. He has shown signs of aspergers but never signs of being asexual only signs of not being particularly interested in sex because he had other things on his mind.

Edited December 26, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[Homily]

I think they've shown time and again that Sheldon stopped growing emotionally when he was about 12 - couple that with his sincerely held belief that the best person to emulate in Mr Spock and it's not surprising that Sheldon took as long as he did to warm up to the idea of having a girlfriend and then having any kind of sexual relationship. 

[Dobian]

Late to the party.  This show has gotten kind of stale the past couple of seasons, but this episode shows they can still knock one out of the park.  The Star Wars opening, Bob Newhart, Will Wheaton parodying the rivalry between Star Wars and Star Trek, and the way they associated Sheldon and Amy's big night with the boys going to the Star Wars premier was all fantastic.  And of course, Sheldon finally "giving it" to Amy while staying classically Sheldon in his post-remarks.  Hilarious.

 

And having watched Sheldon for seven seasons, it's apparent to me has has some form of asperger's or social autism.  There's no point analyzing it, it's just a sitcom and not something they would ever divulge in detail.  He's just Sheldon, you can't really put a label on him.

Edited December 28, 2015 by Dobian

[betsyboo]

Popping in to this thread to say this was one of the best episodes of TV i saw this year. Hilarious and heartfelt. The juxtaposition between Shamy's evening and the guys at the movie had me howling (as predictable as it was). I rewound Penny snapping her wine glass two or three times. I just loved the whole ep, start to finish.

[Big Mother]

As a mother of an autistic child, let me tell you that Sheldon clearly exhibits many of the clear signs of high functioning autism / asperger's. Even though his mother 'had him tested and he isnt crazy' - there werent that many good tests for asperger's when he was growing up. and maybe he only had  a psych eval. He clearly has undiagnosed HFA, or at least, social skills and sensory issues.

[anna0852]

I've always liked that the producers are clear that they have no plans at all to introduce some diagnosis for Sheldon. Because one they do, the debate starts about how that diagnosis is being portrayed. 

 

Sheldon is just Sheldon. 

[SmithW6079]

My point is since the story began it is about Sheldon becoming a real boy.

 

Sex is not a requirement to be a "real boy."

[Homily]

Sex isn't a requirement, no, but human emotion certainly is and watching Sheldon grow to care about others has been part of his journey into being a fully developed human being and it's been handled pretty well for the most part. 

Edited December 30, 2015 by Homily

[Miss Dee]

I think that's why I like this development so much. It's not that he had sex - if he'd announced he had a one-night stand just to have a sexual experience, it might have been funny depending on the set up but I wouldn't have found it as moving as Sheldon deciding he loved his girlfriend enough to want to express it physically even if it wasn't necessarily his cup of tea.

[TV Anonymous]

If our geeks are that fanatical with Star Wars, why are they willing to watch the movie only in 2-D?

[Mom x 3]

I genuinely despise 3D, but that's probably from flashbacks to Jaws 3.  

[vibeology]

It wasn't filmed in 3D, it was converted, so maybe they consider that the purer way to see it.

 

But its also possible based on plot that because the tickets went on sale before they were ready, 2D was all they could get. Or its just better to film your actors without 3D glasses.

[Homily]

I'd suspect the writers never gave it a moment's thought but if the goal was to watch the film as soon as it came out I doubt they'd have waited for 3D if that meant, for some reason, that they couldn't get into the first showing.

[yb125]

Also a lot of people, like my self wanted to see it in 2D first then in 3D next, less distracting that way. These are guys who will see it several times so it's not big deal which you do first.