B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[Artsda]

1 hour ago, KerleyQ said:

don't think he's choosing Brooke over his kids. That's two entirely different relationships. His kids with Taylor are full grownass adults with their own kids. He's not walking out on toddlers. He can be married to Brooke (or any woman who isn't Taylor) and still have relationships with Steffy, Thomas, and their kids.

It's not about relationships with them. It's how Brooke hates his son, goes on about it to Taylor and Hope.  Do we see Brooke say things about Thomas to Ridge? 

Or when she ran to Taylor last week to tell her to make grownass Steffy take back her comments to Liam. Why didn't Brooke go to Ridge?  

She has a lot of hate/disdain for Ridges kids and it's either she hides it from him, or he just doesn't care.  Which is choosing Brooke over defending his children from her. 

[KerleyQ]

Taylor looked pissed when Steffy said she wasn't going to be parent trapping anymore. She was totally counting on laying out the "I still love your father" and "I suggested I could go to Rome with all of you" bread crumbs and Steffy picking that trail up and running with it. You could tell by how she tried to downplay the Rome thing "oh, well, I hadn't really made any plans, it was just a thought." She was fully expecting that, in five minutes, Steffy would have her place on the plane secured along with getting her a hotel room that shares a connecting door with Ridge's room. 

19 minutes ago, Artsda said:

She has a lot of hate/disdain for Ridges kids and it's either she hides it from him, or he just doesn't care.  Which is choosing Brooke over defending his children from her. 

The whole reason he was even vulnerable to the parent trap shenanigans last year in the first place was because he was pissed that Brooke wouldn't just get over Thomas's many crimes. He has always gotten bitchy with Brooke over her understandable disdain for Thomas and all he's done to her loved ones. 

And he also certainly never stands up for her or Hope to Taylor, Steffy, and Thomas. He spent months last year sitting around at "family dinners" listening to them drag Brooke. Even when Brooke's daughter and grandson were part of those dinners, he didn't put a stop to it. 

[Anna Yolei]

On 6/6/2023 at 4:02 PM, Rye said:

Somebody went to work, and, in exchange for money, said: “We should do another triangle with Ridge, Taylor, and Brooke!”

And instead of getting fired, they got paid.

All right then. 

Sadly, I suspect this sort of consistency in terrible, repetitive writing isn't coming from the day-to-day writers but from the top down. I've seen this exact similar trajectory as a Star Trek fan in the 2000s as the executive producer to took over TNG after Gene Roddenberry stepped down (& who got the position because Roddenberry's bitterness about his divorce drove away everyone else involved who was vastly more qualified but that's a looooong story) and each series because more bland and repetitive than the last, a curse that's finally been broken when new blood came into the franchise when  Discovery hit P+.

Likewise, Seventh Heaven at its best was ever exactly prestige TV, but when Brenda Hampton took over, the drop in quality was less of a drop as much as a being slingshotted off of Mount Everest at the speed of sound. And she basically recycled those same two plots of sex and people talking about others having sex on her subsequent series,The Secret Life of the American Teenager ie, the only show that hand to God is even more repetitive in its dialogue than modern B&B (Eight. Damn Episodes. of "Does Amy know about the baby". In a 22 episode season 🤦‍♀️)

Which is a lot of words to say that when something is consistent shit or goes off the walls is some truly bizarro way (like, "Somehow, Palatine returned" level batshit, or GoT S8), it's almost always someone at the top driving that. And B&B is fairly unique in that it's only had two EPs in its 36 year history, unlike Y&R that has periods post-WJB where it was bad in unique different ways with each new head writers.

It's no coincidence that the show felt like it shifted considerably after 2002, when Brad Bell took over.

 

9 hours ago, KnightStorm said:

All of Taylor's whining about "mean mean Brooke" was a blatant attempt to get Steffy to start up the parent trap again. I'm surprise she hasn't gone the extra mile...and held a seance to call forth Stephanie's spirit from beyond to reunite Tridge.

I imagine the only reason no one receives visits from beyond the grave by Stephanie is because Susan Flannery made it quite clear that retirement meant retirement and she wasn't going to be John Abbott'd. And after carrying the show for 25 years at that point (especially in the later seasons when nothing BUT her acting was saving the sow at times), that retirement is well deserved.

 

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, Artsda said:

It's not about relationships with them. It's how Brooke hates his son, goes on about it to Taylor and Hope.  Do we see Brooke say things about Thomas to Ridge? 

To be entirely fair to Ridge, he certainly never held his tongue about his opinions on Rick during the Kyle Lauder years either. Rightfully so IMO: it would've been just as ridiculous for Ridge to ignore Rick's rather gross relationship with Phoebe and his subsequent scheming and manipulation to drive a wedge between them, to say nothing of the shit he pulled with Steffy when all that failed, as it would be for Brooke to pretend like the last four years didn't happen. Well, last fifteen if we wanna go ALLLLL the way back to him firebombing Rick's car. 

At any rate, there is no "choosing" with Ridge because he has kids with them both for reasons other posters have beat me to laying out. Plus the lie the Taytots tell themselves about Taylor being dumped for Brooke was nothing but fake news and poison fed to them by their mother and grandmother.

Speaking of poisoning, re: the thing about Taylor and her kids versus Brooke and her family is something I had never considered and while I don't think any of it was intentional, it fits so very well that Taylor's love would have conditions that would be inconceivable with Brooke.

Like, for example, when Rick dated Taylor. She was furious AF about that and shat out enough bricks to build the Empire State Building twice but she never threatened to disown him or cut him off financially or otherwise. Likewise, after Nick fucked off to bang Bridget after seeing her kiss with Ridge, I don't think Brooke ever had a single cross word to say to her about that and I genuinely cannot remember that they ever had more than a one episode conversation about it. Granted, there were probably still enough Bill Bell writers left to tell him son that a blow out fight probably would not have played well, given....all of that mess, but I absolutely could not ever see that if Taylor has a daughter not related to Ridge and the same thing happened. Thank good Jack Marone was born a boy and related to Ridge so we will never find out for certain.

[CountryGirl]

Thomas gaslit a grieving Hope for months. He kept her from her child (Brooke's grandchild) for months, time and those little milestone moments that can never be gotten back. He used his child as a ploy to get into her pants and when that didn't work, he arranged for Vinny to give him some date-rape drugs (which this part no one but Thomas knows about at this point), but Brooke and Hope know all the rest and he also tried to kidnap her to prevent her from finding out Beth was alive. He's not a child, he's an adult, and AFAIC, Brooke can say whatever she wants to about the man who hurt her daughter over and over again, especially when it's clear he hasn't changed one bit.

As for Steffy, she has long made it her mission for more than a decade to go after the Logans - Brooke, Katie, and Hope, again, as a grown-ass woman, most recently with the parent-trapping, declaring open war on Brooke and Ridge's marriage in favor of her mother reuniting with Ridge. Thomas and Ridge, himself, share in the blame of the last demise of Bridge, but Steffy shares in it, too. Thomas got all the blowback for that, which I can't care about since he's the one who faked the CPS call that was the final straw, but still, Brooke is far nicer to Steffy than I would be. 

Thomas and Steffy being Ridge's kids don't exempt them from being held accountable for their actions towards Brooke and Hope. Sharing DNA does not automatically entitle one to a relationship. It's how you treat people that matters most.  

[sugarbaker design]

22 hours ago, CharlizeCat said:

I forgot to mention that Steffy was back to channeling her Valley of the Dolls look yesterday. 

VOD was just on TCM, I recorded it.  It's a lot like B&B:  campy, crude and comical!

[Chatty Cake]

I can’t stand Taylor.

Why are these people so obsessed if Thomas and Hope hook up? Who cares at this point? I know I don’t!

[KnightStorm]

Why exactly was Taylor in that meeting? I'm just going to headcanon that Taylor had her license revoked years ago,and just has an office to keep up appearances. She has to sleep in it because she gambled away all her money like her daddy.

[Rye]

Can somebody explain to me why a trained mental health professional would tell a man with years of history of stalking, threatening, and abusing a woman that that woman might have feelings for him?

I just don’t. Understand. Why you would ever do that.

Okay.

It’s not okay at all.

[KerleyQ]

1 hour ago, Rye said:

Can somebody explain to me why a trained mental health professional would tell a man with years of history of stalking, threatening, and abusing a woman that that woman might have feelings for him?

I just don’t. Understand. Why you would ever do that.

Okay.

It’s not okay at all.

I haven't watched today's show yet, but, Jesus, it was bad enough when Steffy tried to drop a hint about it to him in yesterday's show (or maybe the day before, they all blend together).  Even if Taylor and Steffy fully believe, with no hesitation, that he's "all better now," he'd still be rather freshly recovered, by anyone's standards. Why would you dangle that in front of him? It would be like handing a fresh out of rehab alcoholic a bottle of whiskey. 

If they're genuinely concerned that Hope might try something with him, they would do something about him working long hours, one on one with her. Steffy would invite Liam on the trip to Rome so Hope's husband is there to distract her from any potential feelings she might have for Thomas. 

Instead, it's like "hey, we're taking you two on a trip where she'll be away from her husband and kids, and the two of you will be thrown together a lot, so, before we head out, let's tell you that we think she has feelings for you." No way that could derail his so called recovery, right? 

Related note - if Steffy had walked in on them going over the dress design, when Thomas had his hand on top of Hope's, would that have been all about Hope having feelings for Thomas, or would Steffy actually acknowledge that her brother was being inappropriate? (Yeah, we all know the answer to that. That "Logan woman" Hope must have slid her hand right under his and forced him to remain like that somehow.) 

[Waldo13]

First of all, if it wasn’t for being a pseudo Forester and working for his father and sister, Lurch would just be the designer for HFTF. Liam is 100% correct in saying it’s Hope’s line and Lurch really doesn’t have to be there.  It’s HFTF and not FC presents HFTF nor HFTF a line by FC. 

What the fuck Taylor and Ridge?  You just had to tell Lurch that Hope has “feelings” for you and in their pea brains that doesn’t mean admiration but sexual feelings.  Wouldn’t they trust Lurch to make sure he doesn’t act on Hope’s “feelings”.  

 

[CountryGirl]

What in the House of Sequined Floozies was Taylor wearing today?

[KerleyQ]

Is the entire Marrone branch of the Forrester family a bunch of middle schoolers?  Ridge might as well have said "well, I heard that your mother heard that Steffy says Hope likes you. Like, she like likes you." 

[Artsda]

What did Hope design and draw for this fashion show. I still don't know what she does.   Liam said it's not Thomas's line,  it very much is. 

 

[Angeleyes]

In real life just because a line has a person’s name it doesn’t mean they are the sole designer or that they even do any designs themselves (even if they started out doing so). A line normally has several designers with one head designer who helps to make sure everything coordinates for that season. The person with the name on the label may just handle the business design and/or they may help with the curation of the overall idea for the line for each season (color, fabric choices, etc). In B&B world Hope has the name on the label and Thomas is the lead designer. 
 

ETA: Real life example is that Wes Gordon is the lead designer for the Carolina Herrera line 

Edited June 9, 2023 by Angeleyes

[Anna Yolei]

13 hours ago, Artsda said:

What did Hope design and draw for this fashion show. I still don't know what she does.   Liam said it's not Thomas's line,  it very much is. 

 

Hope sees to work more as a curator who goes over branding and image than a direct designer, not unlike her mother Brooke....who has never picked up a pencil to draw either, but whose lingerie and men's line in the 90s made FC a pretty penny and who no one has desputed ownership of.

 

[Rye]

The end of the show was preempted on the east coast. I assume nothing of consequence happened.

Man, time was if they preempted a Friday show I would have been livid. Now, my reaction was literally, “you know what? Good. Shut up, Show.”

[Waldo13]

Liam keep this 💩 up with Lurch and you’re pushing Hope into Lurch’s arms. 

Liam I have a great idea. If you are not going to Rome, have the reporter from Eye on Fashion not only represent the magazine but keep an eye on Lurch.  I’m guessing that Brooke will take care of that. 

Brooke has more business being in Rome than Taylor. Brooke is part of FC and Taylor is not. 

[Rye]

I’m not sure why these people are acting like they can’t buy a ticket to Rome. Just go if you want to go, why are all these wealthy people with apparently nothing else in the world to do begging to be allowed to travel somewhere?

[Gam2]

Liam? If your bowels are in such an uproar, buy a damn ticket to Rome!! 

[bluvelvet]

Liam had me chuckling today. I actually rewound the scene. When he said “1 Thomas 2 Thomas etc etc..”.  😆 

Yeah he can just buy a ticket. 

Edited June 10, 2023 by bluvelvet
She to he

[Waldo13]

2 hours ago, bluvelvet said:

Liam had me chuckling today. I actually rewound the scene. When she said “1 Thomas 2 Thomas etc etc..”.  😆 

Yeah he can just buy a ticket. 

Instead of buying a ticket, isn’t there a corporate jet with his name on it?  

[ybrik]

Okay don’t usually post but these recent events and how they are playing out made me want to post some thoughts.

Kind of annoyed that the show is treating the friendship of Brooke and Taylor as the reason they weren’t going back to Ridge instead of a byproduct of them both realizing that they had to put an end to the never ending triangle. While the show is very obviously wanting to make Taylor be responsible for the end of the friendship, they sure had Brooke basically acting like the friendship was holding her back from having the life she really wanted.

I know this will never happen but I wish this Thomas/Hope thing would eventually be about Hope realizing she no longer wants/desires Liam like she used to or that she is feeling sexually repressed. Have her and Thomas stop before crossing the line and maybe even have Thomas help her see that this has more to do with her than actually desiring Thomas. Have her explore her wild side with other men and hell maybe even women. Have Thomas really move on and find love with someone else. Then in the future maybe they can try Thomas and Hope. Maybe in a long time from now.

[Anna Yolei]

On 6/9/2023 at 5:28 PM, Gam2 said:

Liam? If your bowels are in such an uproar, buy a damn ticket to Rome!! 

This story is highlighting exactly why Liam is the most hated character on the show besides Brooke with many people. You'd think that for all that he correctly identifies Thomas as a danger and a predator that **THIS** would finally snap him out his perpetual Shounen Anime Love Interest mode to do... literally anything besides bitch and moan and be an active participant in the events unfolding around him for fucking once.

But no, because we can't have nice things, TIIC have him sticking to this same nonsense he's been doing for *checks watch* thirteen years. It made some sense when he was a young, horny 20-something but even then it grew old fast. What's the excuse for this now?

[CocoaGoddess]

On 6/7/2023 at 7:32 PM, Artsda said:

It's not about relationships with them. It's how Brooke hates his son, goes on about it to Taylor and Hope.  Do we see Brooke say things about Thomas to Ridge? 

Or when she ran to Taylor last week to tell her to make grownass Steffy take back her comments to Liam. Why didn't Brooke go to Ridge?  

She has a lot of hate/disdain for Ridges kids and it's either she hides it from him, or he just doesn't care.  Which is choosing Brooke over defending his children from her. 

Ridge absolutely does not care, he will always choose his erection first and foremost. 

[Anna Yolei]

On 6/10/2023 at 8:59 PM, CocoaGoddess said:

Ridge absolutely does not care, he will always choose his erection first and foremost. 

He definitely doesn't or else he would've made sure Flo was buried under the jail for deceiving Steffy (since he no longer even pretends to like Hope anymore) instead of springing her to bone Shauna.

Ridge Forrester's priority has always been Ridge and pleasing his mother. And he's all out of mothers.

Edited June 13, 2023 by Anna Yolei

[Cool Breeze]

On 6/8/2023 at 5:31 AM, CountryGirl said:

Thomas gaslit a grieving Hope for months. He kept her from her child (Brooke's grandchild) for months, time and those little milestone moments that can never be gotten back. He used his child as a ploy to get into her pants and when that didn't work, he arranged for Vinny to give him some date-rape drugs (which this part no one but Thomas knows about at this point), but Brooke and Hope know all the rest and he also tried to kidnap her to prevent her from finding out Beth was alive. He's not a child, he's an adult, and AFAIC, Brooke can say whatever she wants to about the man who hurt her daughter over and over again, especially when it's clear he hasn't changed one bit.

Exactly.  Thomas has done horrible, unforgiveable things.  With moments of "change" between them to fool people into thinking there'd been a shift in his behavior.  And that's why Liam is exactly right in not trusting Hope.  Each and every time Thomas has changed, Hope has fallen for it.  And hard.  I don't think there's a character who has her head more up her own ass than Hope.  She is always beyond certain that she knows what's right and will die on every hill.  She whines that Liam doesn't trust her?  He shouldn't.  Because her judgement absolutely sucks.

 

On 6/8/2023 at 7:56 PM, Angeleyes said:

In real life just because a line has a person’s name it doesn’t mean they are the sole designer or that they even do any designs themselves (even if they started out doing so). A line normally has several designers with one head designer who helps to make sure everything coordinates for that season. The person with the name on the label may just handle the business design and/or they may help with the curation of the overall idea for the line for each season (color, fabric choices, etc). In B&B world Hope has the name on the label and Thomas is the lead designer. 
 

ETA: Real life example is that Wes Gordon is the lead designer for the Carolina Herrera line 

Wes Gordon is a trained designer though.  Eventually people like that become Creative Directors but they have a background in design.  Hope is a "socialite" with her name on a line.  Like Jessica Simpson or Kim Kardashian.  She "approves" the items but has no design skill or training.  Thomas is the creative force. 

[KerleyQ]

Hope absolutely has a mile wide blind spot for Thomas, and Liam has the same for Steffy.  The best thing that could ever happen for their relationship is to move far away from the Forrester siblings. But, of course, they each share a child with their blind spots, so this crap will never end. 

[Waldo13]

Because Stuffy is relating to herself, that’s why she’s attributing Hope saying everything is under control, to her brother. Control only has one meaning for Stuffy. Control, for all Stuffy knows that could mean Liam.  I would be so happy that Hope would tell Stuffy to STFU and kick we in her balls. Stuffy doesn’t really trust Lurch from backsliding because she’s lecturing Hope more than she’s lecturing her brother.  Stuffy can’t be sure that if Hope makes the first move that Lurch would push her away.  Stuffy being hypocritical because I don’t remember her pushing Liam away and for that matter Bill. 

I hate Brooks dress. It makes her look like she has double E boobs. 

Fuck you with a rusty pipe Lurch. Do you have shit in your ears?  Didn’t Carter just tell her that she belongs there and they are asking if Brooke will be there?  In fact he will be setting up interviews for her. Why is Carter, as COO, doing Katie’s job. Isn’t Katie the head of public relations?  Is Taylor going to go so she can shrink all the heads of buyers and reporters. As we played as children, which one doesn’t belong. 

Wyatt should know all about Hope as they were once married and Hope was pregnant with Wyatt as the father. With all the attributes Wyatt listed about Hope, he didn’t say anything about about Hope being kind of bland in bed. That is until Hope was fantasizing about Lurch while making love to Liam. Liam did mention that Hope was “doing” things more passionately lately. 

I said that Lurch could fuck himself with a rusty pole. As for Stuffy, she can fuck herself with a termite ridden telephone pole. She’s a big CU Next Tuesday so I’m sure it will fit. 

I get suck a kick out of Wyatt. He loves to rile Liam up just so he can bring them down.  

After watching Hope fantasizing about having sex with Lurch, I needed a whole bottle of eye bleach but I can’t find any brain bleach 🤢🤢🤮. 

[Gam2]

One story line, one plot, two people and their parents. Wow. This is riveting and enthralling and mesmerizing! ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz.

[Angeleyes]

3 hours ago, Cool Breeze said:

 

Wes Gordon is a trained designer though.  Eventually people like that become Creative Directors but they have a background in design.  Hope is a "socialite" with her name on a line.  Like Jessica Simpson or Kim Kardashian.  She "approves" the items but has no design skill or training.  Thomas is the creative force. 

Exactly, and I gave that example because Carolina Herrera no longer does any design work even though the line retains her name and her ownership. It’s still her line, but Wes is the lead designer and creative director. 
Plus, at this point Hope has been the head of this line for over a decade. She learned her business acumen by roaming the halls of Forrester as a kid and watching her mom and Ridge and even Eric just as much as Thomas and Steffy can lay claim to that type of training. Let’s face it, they are all nepo babies. Hope’s online popularity as an influencer and her messaging were what prompted the line, but she has taken that opportunity and turned it into something more. It is her line no matter which designer is working for her. 

[Artsda]

Why is everyone acting like Thomas and Hope are "jetting off to Rome" for a romantic trip just the 2 of them when they are all going too for this work trip. 

Steffy is acting like she also isn't going. 

[bluvelvet]

10 minutes ago, Artsda said:

Why is everyone acting like Thomas and Hope are "jetting off to Rome" for a romantic trip just the 2 of them when they are all going too for this work trip. 

Steffy is acting like she also isn't going. 

That’s what I’ve been saying. It’s a group activity. Do they think Hope and Thomas are going to sneak off or something ??

Also why are people micromanaging two grown adults. 

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by bluvelvet

[Gam2]

4 minutes ago, bluvelvet said:

That’s what I’ve been saying. It’s a group activity. Do they think Hope and Thomas are going to sneak off or something ??

Good heavens, I wish they would and put us all out of our misery!!!

[KerleyQ]

I love how Wyatt goes to trying to stop the trip from happening or trying to keep Thomas from going instead of just saying "hey, why don't you just go with her and coordinate our coverage of the show?" 

I'd pay good money to see Hope tell Steffy that she's creating a hostile work environment. First she basically tells Hope "work long hours, very closely, with the guy who is pathologically obsessed with you and has committed numerous crimes against your family or else your line is getting killed off."  And now she spends every single day asking Hope if everything she does means she's thinking about banging Thomas. "You were making eye contact while talking to him about the line, does that mean you want to fuck him?"  "You didn't respond instantly when I came to your door. Is that because you were thinking about my brother?" "You dropped your pencil, was that because you were thinking about Thomas's dick?" That kind of feels like it would be a slam dunk case. Yes, Hope is having feelings about Thomas, but that still doesn't make a single thing about how Steffy has handled all of this remotely OK coming from the CEO of a company to an employee. 

And, I mean, speaking of the nepo baby thing, did the family just decide to make Steffy CEO because she didn't inherit any design talent? Wasn't her main achievement to recommend her for the job the time that she got shares back from Bill by almost fucking him and then threatening to tell his wife? (I wasn't watching then, but I could swear that was what I saw was going on when reading SOD back then). And what does she actually do now as CEO? As far as I can tell she hangs out in the CEO office gossiping with her mother and making out with her husband (neither of whom work there). 

3 hours ago, Waldo13 said:

With all the attributes Wyatt listed about Hope, he didn’t say anything about about Hope being kind of bland in bed.

Well, to be fair, the Hope/Wyatt sex scenes weren't that bland. Wyatt and KM's Hope had some pretty steamy chemistry, and she wasn't having the same hang-ups about sex with him as she had with Liam back then. 

When Wyatt was going on about how great she was, I had the thought of how hilarious it would be if she ditches Liam and Thomas both and ends up with Wyatt. 

[methodwriter85]

On 6/8/2023 at 12:03 PM, sugarbaker design said:

VOD was just on TCM, I recorded it.  It's a lot like B&B:  campy, crude and comical!

And curiously absent of gay men in an industry where there are usually many of them.

Edited June 13, 2023 by methodwriter85

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, KerleyQ said:

I mean, speaking of the nepo baby thing, did the family just decide to make Steffy CEO because she didn't inherit any design talent? Wasn't her main achievement to recommend her for the job the time that she got shares back from Bill by almost fucking him and then threatening to tell his wife? (I wasn't watching then, but I could swear that was what I saw was going on when reading SOD back then

She got a huge portion of Taylor's stocks for her efforts there, but shecs current co-CEO because Quinn wanted to buy her acceptance into the family after she married Eric and he gave her full power of attorney shortly after they got married. But it had nothing to do with any of her inate talent any more than Katie gifting Hope HFTF to spite Steffy had to do with her.

Granted, the OG Forrester kids are definitely nepo babies too, but the writing was such that it was clear that these kids were well trained and knew what they were talking about. Felicia as the baby of the group wasn't just handed her own line just because she sold a few designs in Milan, for example, and despite the 2000s revisionist history about Thorne, Eric definitely valued his input into the company just as much Ridge and Kristen--after all, what good is a design without quality fabric?

Nowadays the Forresters are the living embodiment of Robert Kiyosaki's three generation rule: where wealth in any given wealthy family lasts on average three generations because it stops being an issue by the time the grandkids arrive and they're essential stupid about money. Except instead of cash, it's about a functional way to run a damn business.

 

[CharlizeCat]

Steffy is the worst. Asking Hope baited questions such as was Hope happy Thomas was going to Italy? No answer was correct. Yes would have meant Hope wanted to sleep with Thomas and no meant that Hope was lying and really meant all the awful things she'd said to Brooke about Thomas.

Why is the COO coordinating press interviews and securing venues? That seems like a PR function and part of Katie's duties. SMDH. If these damned writers (well, I guess not now) would ever step foot into an actual business or even do some basic research ... 

Maybe Brooke's hair would look better straight. Those yellow beach waves are so aging on KKL. It's obvious that she loves her long hair, but at least make it look better, please! 

[MajesticMariposa]

On 6/10/2023 at 11:11 AM, ybrik said:

Okay don’t usually post but these recent events and how they are playing out made me want to post some thoughts.

Kind of annoyed that the show is treating the friendship of Brooke and Taylor as the reason they weren’t going back to Ridge instead of a byproduct of them both realizing that they had to put an end to the never ending triangle. While the show is very obviously wanting to make Taylor be responsible for the end of the friendship, they sure had Brooke basically acting like the friendship was holding her back from having the life she really wanted.

I know this will never happen but I wish this Thomas/Hope thing would eventually be about Hope realizing she no longer wants/desires Liam like she used to or that she is feeling sexually repressed. Have her and Thomas stop before crossing the line and maybe even have Thomas help her see that this has more to do with her than actually desiring Thomas. Have her explore her wild side with other men and hell maybe even women. Have Thomas really move on and find love with someone else. Then in the future maybe they can try Thomas and Hope. Maybe in a long time from now.

Same. I usually lurk, but there's been so much wasted potential with the current storylines that I've wanted to get my thoughts out in "public" more.

There was absolutely no reason for Braylor to end, especially when the episodes immediately following the fallout were essentially completely detached from the blowup. There were a million other ways to reunite Bridge that could have left the friendship intact. They clearly went out of their way to give Bridge these flirty, "pact-breaking" moments, so why not just continue that thread? Why not have Taylor develop a relationship with someone else? Why not have her realize that the pact (🙄) was keeping Bridge from fulfilling their "eternal love" (née "destiny")? Brooke could have been contributing to the line/company in some way in an effort to ignore her heart and prioritize the friendship, which would have laid the groundwork for her joining the group in Rome (not that she needs a reason beyond supporting her daughter, but whatever). Taylor could have eventually given her blessing for Bridge and told Brooke to join him in Rome, which would bring us to where we currently are anyway. It's time to settle the grandparent-and-above-aged people and start better developing the younger crowd so that there's actually a chance of the show continuing for another 9,000+ episodes. Foreign popularity can only hold on so long, and most of the other countries are years behind anyway, so it would be a while for them to even feel the effects. There is enough conflict between Thope, Carter and Katie, Batie (which should have been running along this but has been crickets), RJ's return (maybe he could've been involved and paid someone to date Taylor? I'm over parent-trapping but at least it would get him involved), Sheila's pending escape, Thomas rebuilding his life, Liam spiraling, maybe something with Paris (she could've discovered the aforementioned RJ scheme, though admittedly that would have been a repeat of the Quarter thing, but whatever)...the point is that there are other stories going on and the friendship did not need to be sacrificed. If anything, if it must have ended, I would have instead they at least wait until Thope is actually a thing. Between the two options, I would rather see them feuding over their children than over Ridge.

Re: Thope. Yes! Totally agree with everything you said. There is so much potential for a good, nuanced story here that could incorporate so much history and all the things Hope has been forced to hold back all these years. This story may be about Thope but it's not about "Thomas and Hope," it's about Hope and all her pent-up frustration--specifically, her frustration with everyone around her (aside from Thomas, at the moment) treating her as though she is a child unable to make her own judgments and decisions. 

It's weird because Thope is both 'too late" and "too early." On the one hand, I want something big to happen between them in Rome, and on the other, I think it would be better if, like you said, Thomas were to turn Hope down. The last time Hope seemed to have fun was when she was with Wyatt. I can't remember enough of the handful of scenes DB and AN have had to have an opinion on whether they have chemistry, but within this grand narrative of Hope "taking back her power," I think it would have been interesting for her to "take Wyatt away" from the woman who helped orchestrate her baby's kidnapping. After that ended and there was a release of the pain from that time and a release from the need to be perfect in comparison to her mother, then they could move toward Thope once Hope isn't so "clean." 

Idk. I typed a lot, but your post inspired me lol. 

 

[MajesticMariposa]

A separate post about the last few episodes since my other post was so long lol.

Funniest line of the day goes to Brooke (to Thomas, re: the need for Thope to be "ambassadors" to maintain the peace between the two families): "There's no need for that. We're all adults." 😂😂😂Sure, if the definition of adult is strictly being over the age of 18, then sure. You're all adults lol.

Second funniest line of the day goes to Thomas for thanking Hope for "inviting" him to Rome. Um, he's the lead designer. He doesn't have to be "invited" to the fashion preview for the work that he helped create. 🙄What an odd, unnecessary line.

Third place goes to Hope for telling Steffy that Liam doesn't tell her how to run HFTF. Maybe, but it sure hasn't been for lack of trying lol.😂

Runner-up goes to Brooke for her line on Friday to Hope about muses and Greek/Roman mythology and how Thope is going to the birthplace of it all, purely for Hope's WTF look of incredulity.😂

Final thoughts:

• I no longer have the wherewithal to comment on Liam's whining campaign. Someone should remind him that Thomas is the reason he and $Bill got out of jail and that he asked Thomas to look after Hope and the kids when Liam was in jail. Even if it was out of some misplaced guilt about Vinny, he still did it (and ignored every other option at his disposal), which must mean that on some level he does believe there is goodness in Thomas. (Everything Thomas did after this was small potatoes compared to everything he did before.)
• And who does Liam think he is to try to interfere in his wife's moment and try to stop Thomas from attending? Imagine the lead designer Zooming in to Rome.☠️ If you're that worried, hire a bodyguard or a PI or something. (Though I do find it interesting how the dialogue has switched to focus on Hope's fidelity rather than her well-being. Even Brooke was telling her that she needed to "respect your marriage to Liam" instead of the usual "Thomas is a big bad monster and everyone must be shielded from him."
• Within the context of a soap opera, I don't see how anything Thomas has done is unforgivable. Across both sister shows, there are numerous characters who have done far worse who are somehow allowed to walk across the screen and date without backlash. It's one thing to dislike it, but I've seen people on other forums and social media sites have veritable meltdowns over Thope, going so far as to tag actors to spew hate and to email people at CBS and send them nasty letters. Some of the stuff I've seen is actually horrifying. And most of these people claim to have been watching for decades. In that case, where is all this self-righteous morality coming from? They should know by now how this goes. Regardless of whether it's a moment or something more, Thope (if they even do anything) will not be a permanent pairing. I hate saying it, but some of these people really need to touch grass. (Note: I am in no way talking about the people that hate Thope or Thomas, etc. I am strictly referring to the people who have taken their hate to the "real world." The fact that KKL had to write a tweet telling people to calm down about Braylor is embarrassing.) Is it just because it's Hope? Idk.
• I like the creative choice to slowly reveal more of Thomas' face in Hope's fantasy as she allows herself to even more slowly admit the truth to herself. I also like how we clearly see that she is "the boss" of the fantasy, which goes back to my earlier point about Hope being frustrated that people are treating her like a child and not allowing her to make her own decisions in peace.
• I admit that a lot of my love for Thope is because of the chemistry between MA and AN. I doubt this would have worked with PF, but who knows? They are both so talented, but I specifically doubt that MA will stick around much longer. Not only is his talent being wasted, but he just seems so beyond the soap opera genre in general (and I don't mean this as a knock against anyone else, because soap opera acting is difficult, no matter how goofy it might seem sometimes). I hope he gets a chance to expand his career before his window closes. All that is to say that reason Thope is finally being explored may be because they want to "use" that chemistry while it is still available.

Lastly, poor Hope. Everyone just needs to leave her alone and let her have her Hot Girl Summer in Rome. 😭😭😭

[bluvelvet]

5 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

A separate post about the last few episodes since my other post was so long lol.

Funniest line of the day goes to Brooke (to Thomas, re: the need for Thope to be "ambassadors" to maintain the peace between the two families): "There's no need for that. We're all adults." 😂😂😂Sure, if the definition of adult is strictly being over the age of 18, then sure. You're all adults lol.

Second funniest line of the day goes to Thomas for thanking Hope for "inviting" him to Rome. Um, he's the lead designer. He doesn't have to be "invited" to the fashion preview for the work that he helped create. 🙄What an odd, unnecessary line.

Third place goes to Hope for telling Steffy that Liam doesn't tell her how to run HFTF. Maybe, but it sure hasn't been for lack of trying lol.😂

Runner-up goes to Brooke for her line on Friday to Hope about muses and Greek/Roman mythology and how Thope is going to the birthplace of it all, purely for Hope's WTF look of incredulity.😂

Final thoughts:

• I no longer have the wherewithal to comment on Liam's whining campaign. Someone should remind him that Thomas is the reason he and $Bill got out of jail and that he asked Thomas to look after Hope and the kids when Liam was in jail. Even if it was out of some misplaced guilt about Vinny, he still did it (and ignored every other option at his disposal), which must mean that on some level he does believe there is goodness in Thomas. (Everything Thomas did after this was small potatoes compared to everything he did before.)
• And who does Liam think he is to try to interfere in his wife's moment and try to stop Thomas from attending? Imagine the lead designer Zooming in to Rome.☠️ If you're that worried, hire a bodyguard or a PI or something. (Though I do find it interesting how the dialogue has switched to focus on Hope's fidelity rather than her well-being. Even Brooke was telling her that she needed to "respect your marriage to Liam" instead of the usual "Thomas is a big bad monster and everyone must be shielded from him."
• Within the context of a soap opera, I don't see how anything Thomas has done is unforgivable. Across both sister shows, there are numerous characters who have done far worse who are somehow allowed to walk across the screen and date without backlash. It's one thing to dislike it, but I've seen people on other forums and social media sites have veritable meltdowns over Thope, going so far as to tag actors to spew hate and to email people at CBS and send them nasty letters. Some of the stuff I've seen is actually horrifying. And most of these people claim to have been watching for decades. In that case, where is all this self-righteous morality coming from? They should know by now how this goes. Regardless of whether it's a moment or something more, Thope (if they even do anything) will not be a permanent pairing. I hate saying it, but some of these people really need to touch grass. (Note: I am in no way talking about the people that hate Thope or Thomas, etc. I am strictly referring to the people who have taken their hate to the "real world." The fact that KKL had to write a tweet telling people to calm down about Braylor is embarrassing.) Is it just because it's Hope? Idk.
• I like the creative choice to slowly reveal more of Thomas' face in Hope's fantasy as she allows herself to even more slowly admit the truth to herself. I also like how we clearly see that she is "the boss" of the fantasy, which goes back to my earlier point about Hope being frustrated that people are treating her like a child and not allowing her to make her own decisions in peace.
• I admit that a lot of my love for Thope is because of the chemistry between MA and AN. I doubt this would have worked with PF, but who knows? They are both so talented, but I specifically doubt that MA will stick around much longer. Not only is his talent being wasted, but he just seems so beyond the soap opera genre in general (and I don't mean this as a knock against anyone else, because soap opera acting is difficult, no matter how goofy it might seem sometimes). I hope he gets a chance to expand his career before his window closes. All that is to say that reason Thope is finally being explored may be because they want to "use" that chemistry while it is still available.

Lastly, poor Hope. Everyone just needs to leave her alone and let her have her Hot Girl Summer in Rome. 😭😭😭

I so agree with everything here !! 
Sad to hear the actors are getting real life bashing over a story. That’s terrible 

Agree about Thomas, in real life clearly this is an issue, in soap world I don’t see his deeds as unforgivable.  I always tend to gravitate towards flawed characters anyway, they’re way more interesting especially when played by a good actor. I also will never understand why they would write a legacy characters kid as doing evil deeds. Thomas can be an anti-hero but they’ve made him a straight villain with the obsession story. I think he has changed and isn’t manipulating anything right now. I’m liking nuThomas and hope he stays but maintains some of his edge, I.e be willing to get his hands dirty if necessary. 
 

I would love a nuanced story on what Hope has repressed all these years but I doubt we will get that. I read that Brooke told her she had to forgive Liam for his last infidelity- that must get tired after a while. I never understood why Brooke wants her precious daughter with a waffler. I’m not saying she should want Hope with Thomas just not with Liam.  
 

Hope NEEDS a hot girl summer 😂 
 

 

[hypnotoad]

Quote

Within the context of a soap opera, I don't see how anything Thomas has done is unforgivable.

I would agree in general. However, the writers have to put some effort into redeeming Thomas. Having a bunch of characters say he's so much better is not putting effort in. It's just a lazy short cut. Also, I don't think obsessive Thomas should be rewarded the object of his obsession even if he is redeemed. It's just gross.

Quote

There was absolutely no reason for Braylor to end

Agree 100%. But again this is just an example of lazy writing. Why put any work into the Bridge reunion ... meaning Ridge might have to put in some effort to show Brooke he's 'grown' and realizes the mistakes he made? Pffft nope. Just have Brooke and Taylor's friendship blow up for no real reason and reunite the destiny. 

[CountryGirl]

I'm nodding along to the last several posts.

There is a part of me that wants to say to Hope, "break yourself off a piece of that Kit-Kat bar." Especially with hypocritical Liam wanting to morality police her for deeds she hasn't even done yet as last time I checked, thoughts are not cheating. Feelings are not infidelity. Temptation is not a sin or Jesus Christ himself would have been a sinner. 

So, yes, part of me does want Hope to have her "hot girl summer" and give a big, fat middle finger to Liam (whom she has forgiven for infidelity more times than I care to recall), to Steffy, as this bish has zero leg to stand on, pontificating about Thomas when she had no problem aiding and abetting Liam's infidelity, and even to Brooke as just because she was happy to be a doormat for decades, doesn't mean her daughter doesn't deserve better than the "forgive Liam" pressure. 

That having said, I sill have misgivings about Thomas as even with the lens of the soap world, he's up there with some of the worst offenders with the planning to rape Hope, attempting to kidnap Hope, gaslighting her over her child for months, abusing his son, and killing Emma to say nothing of his similar obsession with Caroline II and the decidedly problematic circumstances of Douglas' conception. He has done absolutely nothing to prove he's changed from the obsessed with Hope psycho he's been for years. He's saying all the right words - for now - but his mind and heart are as fixated as getting into Hope's pants as always. So it does feel icky to me to have Hope cheat with him. It's also not just about Hope betraying Liam, which I honestly care far less about and quite frankly, I want to say he owes her at this point. It's about Hope betraying Hope and sacrificing her own integrity, period, but worse, to scratch a momentary itch and with a psycho who terrorized her for years.

Speaking of Wyatt, TPTB are wasting a golden opportunity to revisit Hott. Annika and Darrin have just as much chemistry as Kim and Darrin had, maybe more, as they've smoldered in the few scenes they've been allowed to have. Flo (whispering) is out of the picture and yes, his involvement with her is problematic, but doesn't even register next to Thomas' crimes and misdeeds. 

[Skarzero]

9 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

Within the context of a soap opera, I don't see how anything Thomas has done is unforgivable. Across both sister shows, there are numerous characters who have done far worse who are somehow allowed to walk across the screen and date without backlash.

Well yes and no. As @hypnotoadmentioned already. Other soaps put more effort into their villains redemption. Bold and the Beautiful did not(well a few years ago they did). It's just that simple. In modern times there is less excuse not to do what writers with less knowledge, resources & technology did back in the day. I've never seen reformed villains get blanket acceptance in the soap or fandom. When/if Thomas is properly redeemed he should not be the exception to that. 

The more I think about it, the more comparing Thomas to other soap villains is kinda funny because if he had to bleed what they bled for their penace, he'd never stop bitching & moaning, and eventually he might crumble in on himself. He would not envy the blood that some of them had to shed before given half a chance. If Thomas ever met any of them, he would not covet their lives at all. He got a much better wrap just by clearing the lowest of bars. 

Brad can't even decide to make Thomas evil or not he rinses & repeats the same arc every 6 months. If viewers, no matter how long they've been watching, don't want to fall for it again, that's a fair prerogative to have imo. As @CountryGirl said the lines Thomas crossed were kinda too far even for a soap but I think it's worth mentioning that Thomas' actions mirror soap villains that stayed unforgivable villains just as much (if not more) as reformed ones. 

9 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

I've seen people on other forums and social media sites have veritable meltdowns over Thope, going so far as to tag actors to spew hate and to email people at CBS and send them nasty letters. Some of the stuff I've seen is actually horrifying. And most of these people claim to have been watching for decades. In that case, where is all this self-righteous morality coming from? They should know by now how this goes.

Times have changed (some) people  have too, and parings where women are treated like rehabilitation centers for abusive men don't hit the same(unless you're just super into that sort of thing). Like it probably wasn't okay in the 80s or 90s but there was no safe space to voice that opinion if you had it. Strides have been made since and the progress so far is still threated by the status quo of old. Whether anyone likes it or not TPTB is contributing to a tired precedence here. But that's typical B&B writing for us.

Also people watching the soaps for decades do in fact, know how it goes, which is precisely why Thomas likely ain't going for some people. There is nothing comparable about a character that had at least 3 rushed, half-assed "redemption" arcs to characters that were pariahs for years, rightfully hated by the people they wronged, or had gleeful attempts on their lives because they eventually fucked with the wrong person. I haven't been watching soaps longer than 15ish years but if I had, I'd probably hate Thomas that much more. Because he's what passes for a reformed bad boy today? Uh....okay.....

Save for this forum, B&B is easily one of the more hostile soap fandoms left. Second only to Carly Corinthos stans but alot of them are the same people anyway. KM's Hope got a shitton of death threats. I don't think anyone in the B&B cast has surpassed her yet, except maybe the actress that played Flo not 100% sure though. Also Twitter stans were angry at AN'sHope for crying over dead child after 2 weeks. I honestly take the mass spurning of Thrope(& Flo when it happened) as a sign of healing in B&B discourse. Not condoning threats, but if show is getting a visceral reaction from both sides of an otherwise polarized fanbase then maybe, just maybe said polarized fanbase is onto something. 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Skarzero

[Crashcourse]

RJ is...weird.  😶

[Cool Breeze]

11 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

Second funniest line of the day goes to Thomas for thanking Hope for "inviting" him to Rome. Um, he's the lead designer. He doesn't have to be "invited" to the fashion preview for the work that he helped create. 🙄What an odd, unnecessary line.

That's one of the things that really bugs about HFTF.  In addition to its supremely vague "message".  People who design lines for the Kardashians or Jessica Simpson are unknowns.  Under those circumstances, sure, genuflecting to the person whose name is on the line is appropriate.  Thanking them for "inviting" them to a preview?  Yeah.  She's your boss.  You wouldn't have a job without her. 

But Thomas (as Hope has rightly pointed out recently) is a Forrester.  His name is on the building.  He is the scion of one of the premier fashion houses in the world.  There is no way, ever, that he would not go to a preview.  And he wouldn't have to be invited by the socialite whose name adorns the line.  If Jennifer Lopez had a line at Ralph Lauren's company with her name on it designed by Ralph Lauren's son or grandson?  He'd be at every event, without a doubt.  The whole endeavor would be seen as a joint effort between the "muse" and the designer.

This dumb show.

[CharlizeCat]

Has HFTF ever updated its messaging? I remember when it was launched, KM Hope's platform was based on "values," including that a woman should remain a virgin until after she's married. The slogans were all but "Why buy the cow when you can have the milk for free?" which propelled horny young Liam straight into Steffy's waiting bed. Woefully outdated these days. 

So, I guess now the theme is "explore your wildest fantasies -- murdering psychopaths and marriage vows be damned!" And remember, this whole stupid vanity line was created by Katie spiting Steffy for coming on to Bill, which heifer rightly deserved, but still ... IIRC, Hope was either still a senior in high school or had just graduated, (which was celebrated by the infamous Brooke/Oliver "wall boink.")

In other words, W-A-A-Y too young to be in charge of a new brand at a major fashion house.

Anyway, I am way off topic, but while I hate the idea of a 30-something needing a helicopter parent, in this case, Hope needs one. Her history of making piss-poor decisions and exercising bad judgment warrant Brooke's presence in Rome. Especially when it comes to Thomas.

I am just bored by and frustrated with this idiotic SL. 

Edited June 13, 2023 by CharlizeCat

[Waldo13]

How many days have they been talking about Hope and Lurch being together in Rome?  It’s now about the same amount of time that they are asking Liam if he’s ok with it.  I have a daily reminder on my phone if I need to know what’s in-store for my day. I don’t need daily reminders, from the monkeys with a keyboard, about Hope, Liam, and Lurch drama. 

Taylor, you insufferable ass hat, Brooke is going for FC business and Ridge will be there for the same reason. 

Hope is in love with Liam but Hope is in lust with Lurch. Hope’s lust for Lurch is manufactured in Hope’s mind out of gratitude for “saving her line”. This was actually one of Stuffy’s manipulations, by blackmailing Hope, to take Lurch back.  

I know I’ve said this before but I have to say it again. Jealousy is a sign of ownership, not a sign of love.  I’ve learned this a long long time ago. 

[Gam2]

Someone mentioned on another soap site that it seemed the hairdressers had gone on strike along with the writers. After seeing Brooke, Steffy and especially NuTay today, I would have to agree. NuTay looked like a witch today!

[Anna Yolei]

On 6/12/2023 at 8:33 PM, CharlizeCat said:

Why is the COO coordinating press interviews and securing venues? That seems like a PR function and part of Katie's duties.

I genuinely forgot Katie worked at FC. (where HAS she been, anyway?)

On 6/12/2023 at 11:51 PM, MajesticMariposa said:

I admit that a lot of my love for Thope is because of the chemistry between MA and AN. I doubt this would have worked with PF, but who knows?

I don't think they would have attempted this at all with Fode, whose version of Thomas didn't know Hope existed and was grossly obsessed with Caroline II for the longest time.

Even if TIIC decided not to put MA with Sally, I'm still salty that they pushed a hard reset on all the personal growth the character had made after deciding to let Caroline go. Besides everything else, this is why many of us have not bought into the idea of Hope being his one true destiny. But also, it's okay that characters change and grow. Jill Abbot of 2023 is not the Jill Foster of 1973. Hell, even Adam is being allowed  to grow beyond blaming Daddy for all his problems.

22 hours ago, Skarzero said:

Not condoning threats, but if show is getting a visceral reaction from both sides of an otherwise polarized fanbase then maybe, just maybe said polarized fanbase is onto something. 

Hand to God, even Ridge and Bridget had more support in the fandom than Thope does and that was so unpopular that both the studio AND Lee Philips Bell had words with Brad to end that foolishness. 

It the words of James T Kirk: "Let them die."

17 hours ago, CharlizeCat said:

Has HFTF ever updated its messaging? I remember when it was launched, KM Hope's platform was based on "values," including that a woman should remain a virgin until after she's married. The slogans were all but "Why buy the cow when you can have the milk for free?" which propelled horny young Liam straight into Steffy's waiting bed. Woefully outdated these days. 

It was woefully outdated back in 2010. For a number of reasons, teens are less sexually active than their parents were (ie, better sex education, the acknowledgement of asexuality being a thing) but B&B went with the most tired, played out way of doing a story about waiting.

And it would have been sooooo easy not to, given all of Hope's history, but instead it was all about Liam and doing another Brooke versus Taylor not. Yawn.

Edited June 14, 2023 by Anna Yolei