Episode Discussion: TFGH

[testardo]

Sonny and Carly don't have a moral right to slap for lying, not after they unapologetically murdered an unarmed man begging for his life (Sonny) and stole evidence and hid it (Carly). Frankly I would love a scene where Sonny and Carly confront Nik and Nik not only doesn't give a shit, but throws hiding AJ's murder and Carly hiding Spencer's paternity in both of their faces. I just want scene after scene where they tell anyone that will listen how much Liz hurt them with her lies and everyone bringing up the AJ murders, including Michael.

Never going to happen because we all know AJ was fat, and we all know Sonny loves his kids. Liz is a liar, and carley loves with her whole heart. Problem is she loves herself . Sonny and Carly can't be hurt, they have no hearts. Liz didn't kill anyone, steal anyones kid, run the mob etc. She just didn't tell Jason the killer for hire was jake. GMAB

[tvgoddess]

Did Ava and Jordan know that the former hit Jasus, or did the collison so mangle his face that they have no idea who Ava hit?

 

No, Jordan just knew it was Jake Doe, not Jason. I seriously doubt the car accident is ever brought up again, but I've been wrong about this show before.

[HeatLifer]

Liz doesn't know what Robin wanted, other than Jason alive (because he was her friend and she "died" to save him). They didn't have a talk before she left about her motivations for complying with Victor. The only person aware of what Robin was thinking and feeling at that time is/was Patrick.  So her sources of information re: Robin reviving Jason, the clinic explosion, and Robin living in Paris are Patrick, Nikolas and (recently) Helena.  If anything, I think Robin should be angry at Liz because her lies contributed to Patrick creating the situation that resulted in Emma calling Robin, sobbing and heartbroken.

Unfortunately, I don't think Robin will be mad at anyone.

I'm just completely over this entire story arc. I want Liz out of this and away from Jason. The more she's around Jason/Sam, the more her character continues to be trashed and I'm beyond pissed as someone who liked Liz.

[ulkis]

I find it super lame the person Lulu wants to hurt the most in this reveal is Valerie. Seriously!?! How progressive of the writers.

Also, Liz blaming others for mistakes and using her children as shield from the consequences would never not be pathetic.

They (imo) obviously want to even out the playing field so Val and Dante don't look like such giant douches. Why not just not have them act like that in the first place, I don't know.

[HeatLifer]

They (imo) obviously want to even out the playing field so Val and Dante don't look like such giant douches. Why not just not have them act like that in the first place, I don't know.

Then Dante needs to not have Patrick's hair and flannel shirt.

[Darklazr]

Liz doesn't know what Robin wanted, other than Jason alive (because he was her friend and she "died" to save him). They didn't have a talk before she left about her motivations for complying with Victor. The only person aware of what Robin was thinking and feeling at that time is/was Patrick.  So her sources of information re: Robin reviving Jason, the clinic explosion, and Robin living in Paris are Patrick, Nikolas and (recently) Helena.  If anything, I think Robin should be angry at Liz because her lies contributed to Patrick creating the situation that resulted in Emma calling Robin, sobbing and heartbroken.

 

I disagree.  Liz questioned Patrick back in January 2015 if he wanted to get involved romantically with Sam and he said, "Yes." Patrick is the one that asked Sam and Danny to move into his house which is where they continued bonding with Emma, and that was long before the nurses ball.

 

Robin is the daughter of spies and she did not have a key word to let them know she's in trouble?!   

[yowsah1]

I'm just completely over this entire story arc. I want Liz out of this and away from Jason. The more she's around Jason/Sam, the more her character continues to be trashed and I'm beyond pissed as someone who liked Liz.

 

I am still shaking my head in disbelief that the ratings are in such a precarious position yet the writers are going out of their to drive an entire fanbase away from the show.

 

As I predicted, the Liz haters are having a field day with how badly the character is being trashed and slimed.  I don't think I've seen people this happy with the show in months.  The Liz fans, however.... Why should they watch?  What the fucking hell do they have to watch?

[mybabyaidan]

He hired someone to kidnap her newborn son from that same hospital, killed that person, and then took the baby to his mother to raise as her own child. Trashing a room where that psycho works when he has no business ever working there is less than the least of what he deserves.

She didn't care about Helena, why should she care about Franco?

 

I don't care if Carly is a huge hypocrite, everything she said to Liz was spot on.    And did Liz REALLY say for the 800000 time that she and Jason ALSO HAVE A SON!!!????  Someone needs to throw together a video of every time she has said that.  I actually thought Carly was very understated today, and that surprised me.  I expected a lot more.  

 

Olivia was a huge pain the ass today.  Alexis should have smacked her silly.  She really is pretty useless.

[TwistedandBored]

They (imo) obviously want to even out the playing field so Val and Dante don't look like such giant douches. Why not just not have them act like that in the first place, I don't know.

 

The only thing it is doing is just making this story worse. No one is going to think Lulu is as bad as those two just that she needs help after the few months she has had. 

Only thing that would have made this story awesome is if Lulu went after Dante and she played around with Valerie for kicks when she was done with him first. What a waste of good storyline. 

[Bringonthedrama]

She didn't care about Helena, why should she care about Franco?

 

.

Not sure what you're referring to, as Helena doesn't work in the hospital and have a space there for Liz to tear apart. Liz did care about what Franco did to Aiden; there was at least one scene when she was in the hospital after giving birth to Aiden that she expressed fear for her child, and anger at Franco for doing the kidnapping. There have been times that Liz and Helena clashed at the hospital and Shadybrooke because Helena was being threatening, though. 

[P3pp3rb1rd]

C'mon...Liz didn't tell that Jason was Jake, but the most impact that had was on Sam and Danny, because they were his previous family. Liz did not kill anyone, like the SERIAL KILLER Franco; she did not hang anyone on a meathook and force them to sign away parental status and rights. She didn't shoot anyone through the head as they gave birth, or murder anyone in cold blood. But the Show has to make Liz seem Heinous, Batshit crazy, etc because Show must keep all attention focused on their pet character Jason, giving him scenes to question himself, other people, and Fate. If Show had let Liz and Jason live happily ever after (even with Sam and Danny knowing his identity) as a couple in Port Charles, Show would have had to focus GASP!!! elsewhere than on pet character Jason the hitman.

 

Show's writers would have had to invest mental effort on new storylines and/or characters that could interest us.

 

I for one am not interested in a show whose main focus is on a mentally damaged mob hitman who rides a motorcycle.

[jsbt]

 

If Show had let Liz and Jason live happily ever after (even with Sam and Danny knowing his identity) as a couple in Port Charles, Show would have had to focus GASP!!! elsewhere than on pet character Jason the hitman.

 

I for one am not interested in a show whose main focus is on a mentally damaged mob hitman who rides a motorcycle.

 

Do you think most of us are? I walked away from this show for the better part of a decade because of Jason and co. I despised Steve Burton's Jason with every fiber of my being. But there are a million other ways to get to a show not focused around Jason without making Liz a demented bitch who took away his choice and consent and then letting her swan off. I'm sure you know that, but for the sake of clarity let's underline it.

 

Liz's behavior was morally repugnant and beneath her character. While it may not quite sink to the level of both Jason and Franco's own everyday crimes, it is not a contest. She was still beyond wrong and needs to pay for it if her longstanding heroic character is ever to be viable again.

 

BTW, maybe it's just me but all of a sudden the reply fields auto-scroll me to the bottom of the page any time I try to click and drag in this thing and it drives me fuckin' nuts.

Edited December 16, 2015 by jsbt

[Ambrosefolly]

C'mon...Liz didn't tell that Jason was Jake, but the most impact that had was on Sam and Danny, because they were his previous family. Liz did not kill anyone, like the SERIAL KILLER Franco; she did not hang anyone on a meathook and force them to sign away parental status and rights. She didn't shoot anyone through the head as they gave birth, or murder anyone in cold blood. But the Show has to make Liz seem Heinous, Batshit crazy, etc because Show must keep all attention focused on their pet character Jason, giving him scenes to question himself, other people, and Fate. If Show had let Liz and Jason live happily ever after (even with Sam and Danny knowing his identity) as a couple in Port Charles, Show would have had to focus GASP!!! elsewhere than on pet character Jason the hitman.

 

Show's writers would have had to invest mental effort on new storylines and/or characters that could interest us.

 

I for one am not interested in a show whose main focus is on a mentally damaged mob hitman who rides a motorcycle.

I never agree with you when it comes to Lulu/Dante/Valerie,but I want move this post into my house with my 3 young sons, keeps its identity from it for seven months while we plan out wedding and insist it divorces its current wife to marry me then smell its clothes while I look out the window when it leaves when it finds out the truth.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Ambrosefolly

[Bringonthedrama]

I disagree.  Liz questioned Patrick back in January 2015 if he wanted to get involved romantically with Sam and he said, "Yes." Patrick is the one that asked Sam and Danny to move into his house which is where they continued bonding with Emma, and that was long before the nurses ball.

I agree with you - I remember that. I was attempting to say that the Liz-lying-to-Jason-and-Sam-is-a-betrayal-of-Robin's-friendship idea seems like a huge leap to me.  It would make much more sense that Robin might feel Liz betrayed her friendship by encouraging Patrick to get engaged to Sam, all the while knowing Jake was Jason and that Emma -Robin's beloved little girl- was pretty much guaranteed to get hurt by the truth about Jason inevitably coming out. (I'm putting aside Liz's disregard for her own kids because it's not related to Robin.)

[Turtle]

It's not even the worst thing that anyone in that town has done this year.

Or this month.

I adored Johnny's "What seems to be the problem?" Yes, he's a sociopathic reprobate with a warped sense of morality, and I sure as hell wouldn't want to know him if he was a real person, but he amuses the shit out of me, always has.

[Lillybee]

At least I get to see my Robin,tomorrow.

[Lillybee]

I am so tired of Scummy Corruptus (I stole this from another board) always winning and being treated at the true hero of Port Charles.

[HeatLifer]

She was still beyond wrong and needs to pay for it if her longstanding heroic character is ever to be viable again.

And she needs to feel BAD about what she's done. That's the least they can do for her character after the BS OOC crap she's been handed.

I am still shaking my head in disbelief that the ratings are in such a precarious position yet the writers are going out of their to drive an entire fanbase away from the show.

 

As I predicted, the Liz haters are having a field day with how badly the character is being trashed and slimed.  I don't think I've seen people this happy with the show in months.  The Liz fans, however.... Why should they watch?  What the fucking hell do they have to watch?

Trust me, I understand. I've been a fan of hated/trashed characters on various different shows and it's not fun.

Edited December 16, 2015 by HeatLifer

[Badsamaritan]

There's a very vocal contingent of Liez fans on social media who still believe this is a Jiz love story.

I'm glad it's been pointed out what Freako did to Liez, but she doesn't seem to give a damn. Just like she didn't bother to rip Helena a new one for keeping Jake, she apparently doesn't care what happened to Aiden at the hands of her new bestie. Yes, she gave him some attitude but she should've called him a freak, told him to get bent, and never speak to her again. She didn't do any of that. She didn't seem to mind being alone in a room with him. She should've thrown his art stuff at him. But this is the same chick who declared to Nic that she'd 'lost everything' just because she doesn't get to ride Jason peen anymore. What about your kids, you delusional fuckwit?

I didn't used to hate Liez. I was basically indifferent to her, like wallpaper. Now all I see is she's yet to have iota of remorse for what she did, only that she got caught. So every time she throws attitude I want someone to grab the powder and pimp slap her ass.

Until she takes responsibility for fucking with her life, her children's lives, and the lives of Sam & Danny, she can stroll her happy ass straight to Shadybrooke and get the fuck out my face.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Badsamaritan

[P3pp3rb1rd]

L'enfer, c'est les autres" [ "Hell is other people"]. In Jean-Paul Sartre's existential play, No Exit, three damned souls are locked in a room to punish each other by being themselves for all eternity. Port Charles doesn't seem to have any exit either--even death isn't final (the jury is still out on Dewq, despite the ashes). And all the people in town seem to end up punishing each other by being themselves, in ever-changing relationship permutations.

[jsbt]

That's also the plot for Saw II, which is where I'm sure Sartre got it from.

And she needs to feel BAD about what she's done. That's the least they can do for her character after the BS OOC crap she's been handed.

 

I'd still have her drummed out of the damn hospital and have Laura given the kids for awhile (and maybe fight Jason for Jake). I haven't finished yesterday's show yet but I was deeply annoyed to see her at work. She should have a public meltdown about it and get canned. Or Jason and Sam can do what actual people would do, and report it.

 

I had to laugh when Julexis were sooo relieved to finally make some time for each other. "I had an opening in my schedule" - no comment! These two can't get enough of their shared fumes and their entire story is banging each other to try and make at least one moderately-sized fanbase happy with this disaster zone of a show. I go back and forth on tolerating them despite the actors' BTS nonsense but regardless it's insane that these two, of all people, seem to be the show's concession to "the vet couple".

Edited December 16, 2015 by jsbt

[peachmangosteen]

Liz's behavior was morally repugnant and beneath her character. While it may not quite sink to the level of both Jason and Franco's own everyday crimes, it is not a contest. She was still beyond wrong and needs to pay for it if her longstanding heroic character is ever to be viable again.

 

+1.

 

And she needs to feel BAD about what she's done. That's the least they can do for her character after the BS OOC crap she's been handed.

 

How do the writers not see that this is a very simple thing that would actually go a long way in making Liz viable again? They're so stupid, I can't.

[yowsah1]

How do the writers not see that this is a very simple thing that would actually go a long way in making Liz viable again?

Because the writers have no interest in making Liz viable. She, and her fans, have been written off.

It's useful to compare what's happening to Liz now with what happened to Sonny & Carly, when their big secret came out last year. With them, not even one episode passed before they were comforted by loyal friends and family, who assured them that they were in their corner and commiserated with them about what a horrible thing had happened to them (I.e., the truth coming out and Michael being mad at them). How many people besides Michael yelled at them for the horrible things they did? None. Within a week, Michael was being lectured and hectored to "let go of his terrible anger" and get over it.

How many people have we seen comforting Liz without judgement? How many people have urged Jason to let go of his anger and move on? Hell, during her confrontation with Carly, Liz wasn't even allowed to bring up Carly's heinous actions of about a year ago (not to mention the whole Michael thing), because God forbid Liz be allowed to defend herself in any meaningful way.

It's shitty, slanted, unfair writing that screams out to Liz fans: "Your viewership is worthless to us. We have no interest in keeping you as a fan of this show. Get lost."

[peachmangosteen]

Taking my thoughts to the Liz thread!

[Badsamaritan]

I think just about any fan of a character can make that claim. WTF am I still even being subjected to Liez's loony face? Where is Sam? When is Danny actually gonna spend more than 5 minutes with his dad? Will Jason ever mention all the flashes he had of Sam? For me, this story has been all about Liez, Jason and Sam have been supporting players in their own damn story. I wish Liez's ass would be benched til after the holidays but I'm not gonna get it. No, she'll be front and center at the ball, prolly throwing bitchface left and right at every woman while being all 'poor me' around the men. When do I get a fucking break from her pathetic, remorseless ass?

[mybabyaidan]

Not sure what you're referring to, as Helena doesn't work in the hospital and have a space there for Liz to tear apart. Liz did care about what Franco did to Aiden; there was at least one scene when she was in the hospital after giving birth to Aiden that she expressed fear for her child, and anger at Franco for doing the kidnapping. There have been times that Liz and Helena clashed at the hospital and Shadybrooke because Helena was being threatening, though. 

 

I meant she doesn't seem to care that Helena kidnapped her son for 5 years, so why should she care what Franco did years ago to....what's his name.....Adrian?

[JaneDigby]

I get that many viewers find the public shaming of Liz (where's the bell?) is annoying and hypocritical. I'm not a fan of Carly getting on her high horse with anyone. But I'm coming at this from a different place and all I'm seeing is boring. Boring as hell. Everyone lining up to take a shot at Liz is boring because the stakes are so low. Sam giving Liz hell over this? Drama, even if it is the 1,000th time these two have gone at it. Even for someone like me who is not a fan of any Jason-pairing and can take or leave Sam. I get the stakes here.

 

Carly and Sonny getting in on it? Boring. Carly was deprived of "her best friend" might work if I'd ever seen any real friendship at work. What I saw was Carly constantly leaning on Jason, constantly expecting him to solve her problems, etc. I never, ever saw a sign that Jason cared for Carly. I saw him feeling sorry for her and I saw him feeling responsible for her. Special relationship my ass. Sonny employed Jason. Jason did whatever Sonny told him to do. They traded bed partners. WTFever. 

 

I'm also not feeling the Robin return. Suddenly-interested-in-Robin-Patrick needs to take a stadium full of seats. I sincerely hope all the Robin & Patrick fans out there get a reunion worthy of your years of fandom but I'm sitting here hoping Robin cooked up a gastrointestinal bug that she can plant in Patrick and Anna's food. For humanitarian reasons. These two have bit full of shit for months on the Sam/Patrick front.

[TeeVee329]

Carly and Sonny getting in on it? Boring. Carly was deprived of "her best friend" might work if I'd ever seen any real friendship at work. What I saw was Carly constantly leaning on Jason, constantly expecting him to solve her problems, etc.

 

And what's kinda (and I mean kinda) interesting is that, before she knew he was Jason, the friendship between Carly and Jake was much more normal and balanced.  Sure, he had to listen to her boring problems, but it seemed more reciprocal. 

 

But as soon as she found out Jake was Jason, it flipped to, "OMG, Jason, you belong to us.  Solve mine and Sonny's problems now Now NOW!".

[truthaboutluv]

I think just about any fan of a character can make that claim. WTF am I still even being subjected to Liez's loony face? Where is Sam? When is Danny actually gonna spend more than 5 minutes with his dad? Will Jason ever mention all the flashes he had of Sam? For me, this story has been all about Liez, Jason and Sam have been supporting players in their own damn story. I wish Liez's ass would be benched til after the holidays but I'm not gonna get it. No, she'll be front and center at the ball, prolly throwing bitchface left and right at every woman while being all 'poor me' around the men. When do I get a fucking break from her pathetic, remorseless ass?

 

It is really strange how there has been zero reaction and scenes of Sam since Elizabeth admitted the truth to Jason, even if she is the one who figured it out and told him her suspicions. Like we still don't even know if she even know the truth has come out.  It's like someone said before, that for whatever reason, the writers seem determined to keep Jason and Sam away from each other. The big reveal that dragged on for a year happens and they only get one emotional scene, while Jason has countless with Elizabeth and Carly.

 

It's why I can understand why some believed that despite the reveal of her lie and the backlash (and being completely batshit crazy), this story is more about Liz and Jason's relationship. Because it sure hasn't seemed like the writers and more appropriately Jason gives a shit abut Sam since the reveal. And the not remembering her is a bullshit excuse because again, they were friends. But it's like as soon as he found out who he really was, he almost resented her. 

 

I guess I can fanwank and say it was self-preservation on his part because he didn't remember her or his life with her and he figured being around her would be very awkward because he could no longer just think of her as his friend. Memories or no memories, when he looks at her he now knows she's technically his wife. But the writing on this show is way too shitty and Billy Miller hasn't been doing enough to deliver that level of nuance. Instead it just looks like Jason found out who he was, didn't give a shit and yeah he's pissed right now because Elizabeth essentially played him but he still doesn't give a shit about the family and loved ones he had because well, he doesn't remember them so "oh well..."

Edited December 16, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[LeftPhalange]

I meant she doesn't seem to care that Helena kidnapped her son for 5 years, so why should she care what Franco did years ago to....what's his name.....Adrian?

 

I think his name is Austin. 

[TeeVee329]

Maybe Adrian/Austin is spending time off-screen with his daddy's cousin...Larry?  Lars?

[dubbel zout]

I find it super lame the person Lulu wants to hurt the most in this reveal is Valerie. Seriously!?! How progressive of the writers.

 

It's super aggravating, but at least they've given her something of a POV: She still loves Dante and feels connected to him, he's Rocco's dad, etc. It doesn't make targeting Valerie any less disappointing, but at least we got some explanation.

 

I get the stakes here.

 

I don't, considering Jason hasn't cared about who he is except for the last five minutes. I understand him being mad at being lied to, but seeing as he did not even do the bare minimum to figure out who he was, I just don't care. The show has completely botched this whole story, from not giving him any significant memory flashes to dragging the whole thing out way too long, and then when the reveal finally happens, Carly is the one who gives Liz the most grief? 

 

I absolutely don't want Liz to have her kids taken from her. That NEVER happens when the men do terrible things. Carly might have had Sonny sign away his rights to Morgan and change his last name, but Sonny was in contact with Morgan the whole time. 

Edited December 16, 2015 by dubbel zout

[tvgoddess]

I am still shaking my head in disbelief that the ratings are in such a precarious position yet the writers are going out of their to drive an entire fanbase away from the show.

 

As I predicted, the Liz haters are having a field day with how badly the character is being trashed and slimed.  I don't think I've seen people this happy with the show in months.  The Liz fans, however.... Why should they watch?  What the fucking hell do they have to watch?

 

If I were to classify myself as a Liz hater (I can't stand her, but I'd still rather get rid of a good 5 or 6 people before her), I'm not happy at all. I don't think she gets it at all. She isn't accepting responsibility for what she's done, and although she is doing the basics of parenting, I'm not getting that she cares about her kids at all, no matter how many times she mentions THE BOYZZZZZZZZZZZZZ. 

 

I wouldn't expect Liz fans to be happy, but I think there are several losers in this storyline. And I don't think the fans of Liz got as screwed over as the fans of Dante, but that's just me.

 

EDIT: Way too many "at all" in this post, please just ignore them because I'm too lazy to change it.

Edited December 16, 2015 by tvgoddess

[JaneDigby]

It's super aggravating, but at least they've given her something of a POV: She still loves Dante and feels connected to him, he's Rocco's dad, etc. It doesn't make targeting Valerie any less disappointing, but at least we got some explanation.

 

 

I don't, considering Jason hasn't cared about who he is except for the last five minutes. I understand him being mad at being lied to, but seeing as he did not even do the bare minimum to figure out who he was, I just don't care. The show has completely botched this whole story, from not giving him any significant memory flashes to dragging the whole thing out way too long, and then when the reveal finally happens, Carly is the one who gives Liz the most grief? 

 

I absolutely don't want Liz to have her kids taken from her. That NEVER happens when the men do terrible things. Carly might have had Sonny sign away his rights to Morgan and change his last name, but Sonny was in contact with Morgan the whole time. 

 

 

I get the stakes between Sam and Liz. I get the stakes where Monica is concerned. The rest? Pfft.

 

I also don't want Liz to lose her kids. I hate that shit.

 

I can't believe I forgot! Thanks, show, for giving me more reasons to hate Alexis and Julian. Tax crime is a fraud, Alexis. Creating a business loss for the sole purpose of reducing one's tax burden is tax fraud. It's also a violation of federal bankruptcy laws. And, dumb ass, a past tax debt is not reduced by a future tax loss. Dumbasses. Also, Alexis, if you could think about your daughter BEFORE you think about playing yet another round of hide the salami with Julian it would be a refreshing change. 

[LeftPhalange]

I wouldn't expect Liz fans to be happy, but I think there are several losers in this storyline. And I don't think the fans of Liz got as screwed over as the fans of Dante, but that's just me.

 

I don't think Liez fans are being singled out and persecuted. Ron and these new people have given practically every fan base something to be pissed off about. 

[jsbt]

I don't want Liz to lose her kids forever. I think there's real value in the character and certainly in the actress. I just think there's no way she can work at the hospital after pulling this kind of shit on the same man (and same hospital patient) twice in five years, and I don't think she's currently qualified to look after a houseplant. I think there's a great story to be told in putting her (and her family) back together. That's a story Ron kept claiming he was getting ready to tell with Liz, but his only strategy was to stall for years while waiting for Nashville to be cancelled and digging her in even deeper. Liz is a woman who gave up her dreams when she got pregnant - that is a very real story and it happens everyday, and you don't see it very often on soaps. Everything she's done since the affair has been her trying to recapture something for her own happiness, and often (when it comes to Jason) trying to recapture her dreams in all the wrong ways.

 

I also wanted Avery dead and still do, so I'm more than happy to spread the appropriate misery around.

 

I also am pretty sure Jason and Sam will be at least superficially reunited by 2016, but I've been wrong before. And until this year I have always vastly preferred Liz to Sam.

Edited December 16, 2015 by jsbt

[dubbel zout]

I don't mind Liz being fired or put on leave, but she shouldn't be stripped of everything. Her crime isn't that bad. Everyone is alive who's affected by the lie.

[HeatLifer]

I don't think Liez fans are being singled out and persecuted. Ron and these new people have given practically every fan base something to be pissed off about.

This is also true. Liz is just one of many characters that are unrecognizable.

[mybabyaidan]

It is really strange how there has been zero reaction and scenes of Sam since Elizabeth admitted the truth to Jason, even if she is the one who figured it out and told him her suspicions. Like we still don't even know if she even know the truth has come out.  It's like someone said before, that for whatever reason, the writers seem determined to keep Jason and Sam away from each other. The big reveal that dragged on for a year happens and they only get one emotional scene, while Jason has countless with Elizabeth and Carly.

 

It's why I can understand why some believed that despite the reveal of her lie and the backlash (and being completely batshit crazy), this story is more about Liz and Jason's relationship. Because it sure hasn't seemed like the writers and more appropriately Jason gives a shit abut Sam since the reveal. And the not remembering her is a bullshit excuse because again, they were friends. But it's like as soon as he found out who he really was, he almost resented her. 

 

I guess I can fanwank and say it was self-preservation on his part because he didn't remember her or his life with her and he figured being around her would be very awkward because he could no longer just think of her as his friend. Memories or no memories, when he looks at her he now knows she's technically his wife. But the writing on this show is way too shitty and Billy Miller hasn't been doing enough to deliver that level of nuance. Instead it just looks like Jason found out who he was, didn't give a shit and yeah he's pissed right now because Elizabeth essentially played him but he still doesn't give a shit about the family and loved ones he had because well, he doesn't remember them so "oh well..."

 

Are you in my brain?  I love everything about this post.

[TeeVee329]

I get what jsbt is saying about Liz showing up for shifts at the hospital like everything's normal, even if she's all sulky, it undercuts what she did in a way.  But I'm not sure how she could be fired.  Nothing she did with this Jake(son) lie really involved the hospital.

 

I still maintain that this would have been the perfect entry point for a strong Lucky recast.  Word reaches him about what Liz and Nikolas got up to and he moves back home to shore things up with the boys and then is horrified as (and I'm speculating) she continues to pursue Jason against all reason.  This would also be the perfect place to SOARS Cameron, to really ramp up that drama.

 

But instead, the writers' next move for Liz is for her...to find solace/an ally in Franco, the SERIAL KILLER.  What?!?!

Edited December 16, 2015 by TeeVee329

[jsbt]

I get what jsbt is saying about Liz showing up for shifts at the hospital like everything's normal, even if she's all sulky, it undercuts what she did in a way.  But I'm not sure how she could be fired.  Nothing she did with this Jake(son) lie really involved the hospital.

 

If I'm Monica (or even Obrecht) I'd find a way! It is worth mentioning, again, that Liz ran both her games on Jason (this year and in 2012) while she was on the clock and while he was either a recent or current patient of GH. She treated Jake Doe on the job, took him in, fucked him and then hid his identity to control his life. That's what made me think she should be fired in the first place.

 

I am slowly thawing to the idea of a potential Lucky recast - I'm not there yet - but I don't think Lucky is the answer. If Liz's character is going to be rehabilitated and really strong again I think a regime is going to have to do what none of them are actually interested in, which is give her a life and purpose (and love interests) outside of Nikolas, Lucky and Jason. Ewen was a nonstarter; Matt never happened; A.J. came and went. You have to give her something wholly her own and take the time to see her learn from her mistakes and fix her life, and after that is when I'd use Lucky. Franco, OTOH - it's like they hate Liz, and the sick thing is I don't think that they do. I think they believe some form of Franco relationship is a great new angle for Liz's character.

 

I'd still SORAS Cam with that kid who played Young Luke. I don't remember his name. He'd stay with Laura and spurn his mother for months and months. (BTW, Laura needs her own place - maybe the old Spencer house. Staying with Nikolas in the Cassadine den of sin is over.)

Edited December 16, 2015 by jsbt

[tricknasty]

I still maintain that this would have been the perfect entry point for a strong Lucky recast.  Word reaches him about what Liz and Nikolas got up to and he moves back home to shore things up with the boys and then is horrified as (and I'm speculating) she continues to pursue Jason against all reason.  This would also be the perfect place to SOARS Cameron, to really ramp up that drama.

 

But instead, the writers' next move for Liz is for her...to find solace/an ally in Franco, the SERIAL KILLER.  What?!?!

Lucky found out about Jason on his last trip to town. He left again anyway...

[Francie]

If I'm Monica (or even Obrecht) I'd find a way! It is worth mentioning, again, that Liz ran both her games on Jason (this year and in 2012) while she was on the clock and while he was either a recent or current patient of GH. She treated Jake Doe on the job, took him in, fucked him and then hid his identity to control his life. That's what made me think she should be fired in the first place.

 

I saw this with great authority. And without having any horse in this race.

 

Do NOT mess with nurses' unions.  You will come out the loser. Every time.

[KerleyQ]

If I'm Monica (or even Obrecht) I'd find a way!

 

 

I wouldn't blame Monica for wanting to find a way to take her job as a way to lash out at her, but fuck Obrecht.  That bitch has no leg to stand on here, for so many reasons:  1) She hired her buddy the serial killer to work at the hospital. 2) She fucking shot Liz in her living room.  3) Oh, yeah, she's a criminal whackjob who is far more complicit in what went down at Crichton Clark than Liz could ever be.  She definitely does not get to try on any shade of indignant at Liz's deceit. 

[dubbel zout]

I think they believe some form of Franco relationship is a great new angle for Liz's character.

They'll never stop trying to make Franco happen. Sigh.

 

Lucky found out about Jason on his last trip to town. He left again anyway...

 

Only because of JJ's limited schedule. A recast would ostensibly be around more.

[JaneDigby]

I'll never get the Franco thing. I wasn't around for his reign of terror (or stupidity) so I don't have visceral feelings about the character. I'm just not a fan of stupid. Sure, fine, brain tumor. It's been done before. (Didn't they explain away a serial killer on AMC with a brain tumor?) And, yes, sure, this is Port Charles and murderers like Jason and Sonny roam free. 

 

But Franco isn't a character. He's Todd with Franco's backstory. I didn't watch OLTL. I never got the whole Blair/Todd thing. I never got the Todd-thing, either. 

[TeeVee329]

Lucky found out about Jason on his last trip to town. He left again anyway...

 

I didn't think Nikolas told Lucky that Liz knew, did he?

I wouldn't blame Monica for wanting to find a way to take her job as a way to lash out at her, but fuck Obrecht.  That bitch has no leg to stand on here, for so many reasons:  1) She hired her buddy the serial killer to work at the hospital. 2) She fucking shot Liz in her living room.  3) Oh, yeah, she's a criminal whackjob who is far more complicit in what went down at Crichton Clark than Liz could ever be.  She definitely does not get to try on any shade of indignant at Liz's deceit. 

 

I was thinking more that Dr. O, you know, doesn't care for Nurse Webber and would use any excuse to give her the axe, not that she would be necessarily be indignant re: Liz's deceit.

[KerleyQ]

I didn't think Nikolas told Lucky that Liz knew, did he?

 

I'm almost positive Lucky knows that Liz knows. 

[ulkis]

I'm almost positive Lucky knows that Liz knows. 

 

He does know she knows. 

[dubbel zout]

Lucky leaving was one of the reasons Nik told him, I think, so Lucky could leave guilt-free, or whatever.