Episode Discussion: TFGH

[dubbel zout]

He's been on the show for 3 decades, now. Bipolar Disorder has been a fact of Sonny's characterization for almost that long

 

Not really. Yes, Sonny has ostensibly had BPD for as long as he's been on the show, but it wasn't diagnosed until 2006. That's 23 years since his first appearance. And it only comes up when the show needs it as a plot point. Sonny should be in talk therapy of some sort as well as taking meds, but they probably think that makes him look weak. It could be sort of interesting to watch Sonny try to justify all his crap to someone who's trained not to take any, and not let him off the hook for his actions. It'll never happen, though.

[WendyCR72]

Not really. Yes, Sonny has ostensibly had BPD for as long as he's been on the show, but it wasn't diagnosed until 2006. That's 23 years since his first appearance. And it only comes up when the show needs it as a plot point. Sonny should be in talk therapy of some sort as well as taking meds, but they probably think that makes him look weak. It could be sort of interesting to watch Sonny try to justify all his crap to someone who's trained not to take any, and not let him off the hook for his actions. It'll never happen, though.

 

Well, didn't SJB's Carly once try to calm his ass down once with a glass of OJ? The show wants it both ways: Sonny is a "good man" (puke!) whose disease makes him do bad things, yet he is glorified as a powerful mobster that the hacks still try to paint as noble and good. It's just gross.

[kristabell]

 

 

 

 

Bipolar Disorder does not make you violent or hateful, but speaking as a person who was once involved with someone with Bipolar Disorder, my experience is that BP can exacerbate whatever other illnesses/baggage/issues a person has. That's true for any mental illness. So, you can treat the main pathology, but treatment isn't going to produce a perfectly well person. Life doesn't happen in a vacuum. I can understand how Sonny could blame his flaws on BP, even if the BP didn't cause it, because I can believe Sonny has that shallow of an understanding of his own psyche, you know? (By the way, I'm not abbreviating Bipolar Disorder as BPD, because, in my understanding, BPD is the abbreviation for Borderline Personality Disorder.)

 

 

I am bi-polar which is why I have a real problem with the way this show has always presented the illness. And, as I said, it pisses me off even more that MB, who also has been diagnosed, continues to act like the writing on this show is actually beneficial for representations of mental illness. This show has nothing close to an accurate depiction of what it is to be bi-polar; and the fact that the entire audience reacts with "the stupid bi-polar excuse for yet another of Sonny's/Morgan's actions" makes it clear to me that they are doing nothing more than peddling myths about mental illness that have real world consequences. Soaps should never touch a mental illness storyline if they can't do it justice (and it's clear that they can't, or won't), just like they should steer clear of sexual violence storylines since they can't commit to telling those with any decency either.

[General Days]

Not really. Yes, Sonny has ostensibly had BPD for as long as he's been on the show, but it wasn't diagnosed until 2006. That's 23 years since his first appearance. And it only comes up when the show needs it as a plot point. Sonny should be in talk therapy of some sort as well as taking meds, but they probably think that makes him look weak. It could be sort of interesting to watch Sonny try to justify all his crap to someone who's trained not to take any, and not let him off the hook for his actions. It'll never happen, though.

 

I am not doubting you, at all. I'm just surprised. I thought we'd at least put up with Sonny's mental illness for 20 years. But 9? Nine years? How does this b.s. feel like it went on so long?

Edited August 31, 2015 by General Days

[dubbel zout]

I thought we'd at least put up with Sonny's mental illness for 20 years. But 9? Nine years? How does this b.s. feel like it went on so long?

 

Because we've had to put up with Sonny's claustrophobia for at least 20 years. You know, the reason he can't be put in jail. Never mind that he's a killer, illegal-gummi-bear smuggler, etc. The claustrophobia is the deal breaker.

 

If everyone just acknowledged that Sonny was an asshole and a bad guy, it would make things a whole lot easier.

Edited August 31, 2015 by dubbel zout

[Box305]

I am bi-polar which is why I have a real problem with the way this show has always presented the illness. And, as I said, it pisses me off even more that MB, who also has been diagnosed, continues to act like the writing on this show is actually beneficial for representations of mental illness. This show has nothing close to an accurate depiction of what it is to be bi-polar; and the fact that the entire audience reacts with "the stupid bi-polar excuse for yet another of Sonny's/Morgan's actions" makes it clear to me that they are doing nothing more than peddling myths about mental illness that have real world consequences. Soaps should never touch a mental illness storyline if they can't do it justice (and it's clear that they can't, or won't), just like they should steer clear of sexual violence storylines since they can't commit to telling those with any decency either.

 

Same. I was diagnosed in 2007 and I am also disappointed that they're being so careless with Sonny's Bipolar. Especially since MB is Bipolar himself. 

[tvgoddess]

MB has already acknowledged on Twitter that he has no control over the writing with the portrayal of BPD in regards to some of the details since ultimately, it comes down to "entertainment". I would go and find the exact quote, but I don't follow that asshole. Yes, I don't like the actor as well as the character.

[TeeVee329]

Because we've had to put up with Sonny's claustrophobia for at least 20 years. You know, the reason he can't be put in jail. Never mind that he's a killer, illegal-gummi-bear smuggler, etc. The claustrophobia is the deal breaker.

 

And that's no longer an excuse considering how not a problem the claustrophobia was during his brief stint in prison.

[testardo]

And that's no longer an excuse considering how not a problem the claustrophobia was during his brief stint in prison.

 

 

The best thing I ever saw on this show was the scenes with Scummy in a jail cell climbing the bars screaming let me out. That was the best laugh the show ever gave me and I am claustrophobic. .they could lock him in a elevator ,the show doesn't want us to know he is an evil mob boss killer. Just have him stuck and sweating and crying. Imagine how many hits they would get. The soup would love it. I would love it.It takes a lot for me to feel the same about a character and  the actor.

[BestestAuntEver]

If everyone just acknowledged that Sonny was an asshole and a bad guy, it would make things a whole lot easier.

People that hate him disappear or die (Trevor Lansing, Taggart, Mac, RF!S)

[sacrebleu]

 

Sonny should be in talk therapy of some sort as well as taking meds, but they probably think that makes him look weak.

I seem to remember that therapy was suggested and Sonny refused. I thought at the time that Frons was itching to do a full on Sopranos rip-off, but take it one step further with Sonny actually sleeping with his therapist.

 

I don't think they could help themselves, so I say, no thanks. 

[magnolia11]

I seem to remember that therapy was suggested and Sonny refused. I thought at the time that Frons was itching to do a full on Sopranos rip-off, but take it one step further with Sonny actually sleeping with his therapist.

 

I don't think they could help themselves, so I say, no thanks. 

 

I do remember Sonny actually having a couple of therapy sessions with Laney that went nowhere (yet indeed made me think that they would end up sleeping together, yuck -- thankfully they axed it if that's where they were going to go with it).

 

[dubbel zout]

I do remember Sonny actually having a couple of therapy sessions with Laney that went nowhere (yet indeed made me think that they would end up sleeping together, yuck -- thankfully they axed it if that's where they were going to go with it).

Lainey. World's worst therapist. No wonder she and Kelly Lee were great friends—Pillowena stumped Kelly. And yes, Sonny did try to put the moves on Lainey so he wouldn't have to keep talking. It was so, so gross.

 

I was talking about actual well-written therapy sessions—pause for laughter to subside—not the insulting nonsense we got.

[General Days]

Because we've had to put up with Sonny's claustrophobia for at least 20 years. You know, the reason he can't be put in jail. Never mind that he's a killer, illegal-gummi-bear smuggler, etc. The claustrophobia is the deal breaker.

 

If everyone just acknowledged that Sonny was an asshole and a bad guy, it would make things a whole lot easier.

Right, the claustrophobia. I was waiting for claustrophobic scenes when he was in Pentonville, but was relieved we didn't get any. I think MB has been open about his own diagnosis for a long time, so I must have conflated actor and character, in terms of how long they've been diagnosed.

 

 

Well, didn't SJB's Carly once try to calm his ass down once with a glass of OJ? 

 

 

I'm surprised Ron never mined the archives for that scene, because clearly, it's mismanaged blood sugar levels that have caused Sonny to be a murderous thug. 

[dubbel zout]

Hey, we all get cranky when we need a snack!

[Happywatcher]

I think John Smith the Notary is in deep trouble when that deed gets recorded with Clay's signature.

 

That being said, I wish I still hated these crappy 'plot twists' as much as Dillon did today.

[TeeVee329]

Oh man, I cannot believe they gave Kiki/Hayley Erin these big, overdramatic scenes today, pontificating on the woes of Kiki's life:

 

"This is where Silas and I became a family."  Uh, too bad the show put no time or effort into their relationship, which always felt like an also-ran to her relationship with her SERIAL KILLER bestie, so her whining about this rings hollow as hell.  And she forgot about poor dead Rafe!

 

"This is where I gave you a second chance."  Why again did Morgan have to beg for a second chance when Kiki was making out with his brother behind his back for months and then dated said brother for close to a year the second she dumped him?

 

"This is where my dad died, where I lost him, lost everything."  There's still your life, girl.  Hopefully Donna Mills swings by and sticks a knife into you.

 

UGH.

[ulkis]

TeeVee covered everything Kiki.

 

If TJ doesn't want to run into Sonny and Carly canoodling, maybe he should move out of the house. The pool isn't worth it TJ. It isn't.

 

Silas: oh, you bitch!

 

That was some great unintentional comedy.

 

I did like this:

 

Madeline: No wonder you're still single.

Silas: Yeah, that's the reason.

 

Morgan: I love you.

 

I don't get whether Morgan is delusional or we're really supposed to think this.

 

Is Lulu jealous? Sigh. So stupid. I wouldn't care, except I'm annoyed because Dante will probably use it to justify (some more) to himself jumping into bed with Valerie.

 

Sonny: You're the perfect wife for me.

 

Things That Sound Like Compliments but Really Aren't for 500.

Edited August 31, 2015 by ulkis

[Lillybee]

Why is dead Silas getting a better storyline than alive Silas ever did?

[General Days]

I liked the meta discussion about Southwest General recasts between Maxie and Lulu. I like meta, though. I know not everyone does. 
 

 

Is Lulu jealous? Sigh. So stupid. I wouldn't care, except I'm annoyed because Dante will probably use it to justify (some more) to himself jumping into bed with Valerie.

 

I couldn't decide. She seemed jealous during/after Maxie's reading, but then during the discussion (and because of the context of the discussion), it seemed more to me like she was worried about having to put up with a lot of bickering between Maxie and Dillon, and/or about Maxie flaking on Dillon. 

 

Why is dead Silas getting a better storyline than alive Silas ever did?

 

Dead Silas has been awesome. I was particularly stuck on Ghost Silas, though. I was hoping he'd haunt Ava some more before his killer was revealed, but no such luck. Since he was shoved into the Silas role, I most enjoyed Michael Easton's scenes where he was snarking on Franco, or working with Maura West. What an ill-conceived character for this actor. When they first brought him on, he was like a more-aspie Dr. House. His story really went to pieces once they brought on Nina. He should have been caustic and snarky for his whole run. 

The reveal seemed to come about so quickly (not that I'm not grateful for it). Do you think that's all there is to the story, now?

Edited: because Silas wasn't "as pie."

Edited August 31, 2015 by General Days

[LeftPhalange]

Donna Mills is the killer. I'm shocked and devastated. I'm crying so hard right now as I realize my favorite character will be sent to prison for 4-6 weeks until she's magically released and makes another appearance in PC because reasons. 

 

I teared up when Kaka got emotional over her dead vampire doctor sperm donor. 

[ulkis]

The reveal seemed to come about so quickly (not that I'm not grateful for it). Do you think that's all there is to the story, now?

 

Yup. I think they meant literally when they said it was a month-long murder mystery.

 

Donna Mills is the killer. I'm shocked and devastated. I'm crying so hard right now as I realize my favorite character will be sent to prison for 4-6 weeks until she's magically released and makes another appearance in PC because reasons.

 

I think with Ron gone I think DM might be done. Although honestly, I kind of like the bitchy dymanic between her and Maxie. They should make her Nathan's bio mom after all. After all, does O. really need Nathan to show her vulnerable side when she has Son of her Heart Franco for that?

[Perkie]

Dialogue issue of the day:

 

Madeline says she killed Silas, heard Nina at the door and hid.  Heard Franco and Ninas' conversation, saw Franco wiped the knife and then ducked out.

 

When?  How?

 

Franco left and immediately ran into Kiki, mere feet from the door.  No way Madeline ducks out while they're in the hall.  Then they come back in, and almost immediately Kiki calls the police.  Did Madeline hide out until the police left?  No one checked to see if there was anyone else in the apartment?  

 

Ron's constantly giving me flashbacks of what happened yesterday because i'm too stupid to remember, but maybe he needs flashbacks to remember how his own scenes were put together.  

[dubbel zout]

Yup. I think they meant literally when they said it was a month-long murder mystery.

 

Too bad most people never cared about the victim or the people his death affects.

 

I hope this means the end of Madeline. There's no reason for her; there never was. She might make good snark with Maxie, but plenty of other characters can fill that role. 

[sacrebleu]

So... Ric wore a wire, does that mean that Sonny will break up with him?

 

Madeline killed Silas, over the money she's been angling to get her hands on since she arrived on the show. I recall the brilliant words of Veronica Mars, "Why can't the evil just get jobs like the rest of us?"

[P3pp3rb1rd]

Sonny should be in talk therapy of some sort as well as taking meds, but they probably think that makes him look weak. It could be sort of interesting to watch Sonny try to justify all his crap to someone who's trained not to take any, and not let him off the hook for his actions. It'll never happen, though.

 

I'd enjoy this therapy story line except that it would probably make the show even more Sonny-centric. Might be better to have someone close to Sonny or who interacts with him a lot who can be in therapy so we get the therapist opining and snarking about Sonny while Sonny goes his merry way, not having to answer for anything as usual. I'd like to see Carly in talk therapy because she needs it so badly--choosing significant others like Franco and Sonny to marry--yet is all teary and motherly and vulnerable over her worthless children (Morgan)  while neglecting other children (Joss) --and who can throw a bitch mood like the best of 'em. And the weird parental bonds she and Sonny "share" for kids not their own (little Avery and even TJ, for heaven's sake!). Carly is a goldmine for a therapist. Of course she would toss her blond hair and try to seduce a male therapist, who could find it amusing and keep her at arm's length, which would enrage and fascinate her at the same time. Or maybe give her a strong female therapist and make her attracted and thus very miserable, not knowing why.

[Francie]

Why is dead Silas getting a better storyline than alive Silas ever did?

It plays to Michael Easton's strengths.

Dialogue issue of the day:

 

Madeline says she killed Silas, heard Nina at the door and hid.  Heard Franco and Ninas' conversation, saw Franco wiped the knife and then ducked out.

 

When?  How?

 

Franco left and immediately ran into Kiki, mere feet from the door.  No way Madeline ducks out while they're in the hall.  Then they come back in, and almost immediately Kiki calls the police.  Did Madeline hide out until the police left?  No one checked to see if there was anyone else in the apartment?  

 

Ron's constantly giving me flashbacks of what happened yesterday because i'm too stupid to remember, but maybe he needs flashbacks to remember how his own scenes were put together.  

Perkie, I hope someone can answer you.  But, according to recent Nielsen reports, you may be the last person left who is actually watching the show.

Edited August 31, 2015 by Francie

[TeeVee329]

I kind of like the bitchy dynamic between her [Donna Mills] and Maxie.

 

But it's weird, they've only had one bitchy confront before and now Maxie of all people is the one...previews...yelling at Donna Mills about killing Silas?  Maybe Ron was setting up for there to be more there?

 

I wonder if Dr. O will get a moment with Donna Mills.  Wasn't Donna Mills still threatening her about the Nathan secret?

[Francie]

I wonder if Dr. O will get a moment with Donna Mills.  Wasn't Donna Mills still threatening her about the Nathan secret?

 

My head just exploded at the thought of those two villains getting a last "moment" together.

[Perkie]

 

Perkie, I hope someone can answer you.  But, according to recent Nielsen reports, you may be the last person left who is actually watching the show.

I sort of have to, I write a recap for Daytime Confidential.  But I'm also determined that MY show will go back to it's former glory, come hell or high water.  

[ulkis]

But it's weird, they've only had one bitchy confront before and now Maxie of all people is the one...previews...yelling at Donna Mills about killing Silas?  Maybe Ron was setting up for there to be more there?

 

I wonder if Dr. O will get a moment with Donna Mills.  Wasn't Donna Mills still threatening her about the Nathan secret?

 

I would have been fine with it if only Maxie had said, "you killed that guy Madeline! You're so awful for killing . . . that guy!"

[TeeVee329]

My head just exploded at the thought of those two villains getting a last "moment" together.

 

I would get some amusement from Dr. O reveling in Donna Mills' misery.  But I was more wondering if they were going to tie off the Nathan paternity thread or leave it wafting in the wind.

[Tiger]

Donna Mills is the killer. I'm shocked and devastated. I'm crying so hard right now as I realize my favorite character will be sent to prison for 4-6 weeks until she's magically released and makes another appearance in PC because reasons. 

 

I teared up when Kaka got emotional over her dead vampire doctor sperm donor.

Quick, someone grab some hot cheese fondue and throw it on "leftphalange"!

[Oracle42]

I would get some amusement from Dr. O reveling in Donna Mills' misery. But I was more wondering if they were going to tie off the Nathan paternity thread or leave it wafting in the wind.

 

I don't think RP can pull off a paternity storyline - or any story that requires him to pretend that he's not a mannequin.

Also? I don't care.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Oracle42

[dubbel zout]

Madeline says she killed Silas, heard Nina at the door and hid.  Heard Franco and Ninas' conversation, saw Franco wiped the knife and then ducked out.

When?  How?

 

She said she "snuck out." Don't question it—we're almost done with this story. 

 

I wonder if Easton and Erin posed for that father-daughter photo, or if she was just Photoshopped in. Heh.

 

Who's playing Declan in the movie, Dillon? That might be one reason Lulu has a bitchface about Maxie playing Marjorie. Maybe she thinks Dillon and Maxie will get close and shut her out.

 

Pro tip, TJ: If you don't want to cause trouble for Sonny, don't tell him anything. FFS. It's not like Molly asked TJ to tell Sonny anything.

[ulkis]

I would get some amusement from Dr. O reveling in Donna Mills' misery.  But I was more wondering if they were going to tie off the Nathan paternity thread or leave it wafting in the wind.

 

do you think his dad was supposed to be Fluke/Bill Eckert?

[Tiger]

do you think his dad was supposed to be Fluke/Bill Eckert?

I will always believe that at one point in time both Nathan & Rosalie were supposed to be Bill Eckert spawn.

Now, they'll probably both be Sonny's kids.

[bagert]

Yup. I think they meant literally when they said it was a month-long murder mystery.

 

 

I agree - good job on their part.

[Sake614]

Well, today actually wasn't awful. In fact it was kind of decent. AND Scott Sickles wrote it. I always knew he was capable of doing a decent job. Of course frank probably edited the hell out of the episode to wrap up Ron's stories but still, the show basically held my attention. Even though Madeline being the killer didn't come as even a slight surprise.

[TeeVee329]

do you think his dad was supposed to be Fluke/Bill Eckert?

 

I honestly don't know.  I was totally fine with it being Victor Cassadine.  I still don't understand why the show burned through that character so fast.

[Francie]

I would get some amusement from Dr. O reveling in Donna Mills' misery.  But I was more wondering if they were going to tie off the Nathan paternity thread or leave it wafting in the wind.

That's such an easy mystery to solve.  Dr. O said that Nathan's father was more terrifying than a Cassadine. Who is the only villain we know of who could have possibly fathered a walking piece of wood like Nathan?

 

The Whomping Willow from the Harry Potter series, of course.

 

It's elementary. Or deciduous.  I confuse those terms all the time.

[Sake614]

I thought Dr. O said Nathan's father was mor terrifying than VICTOR Cassadine, not A Cassadine?

[BestestAuntEver]

I thought Dr. O said Nathan's father was mor terrifying than VICTOR Cassadine, not A Cassadine?

They've forgotten about that plot thread therefore so should you.

~TPTB

[tvgoddess]

Madeline: She's a very sick girl.

 

Me: I don't care how many comas she gets put in, she hasn't been a girl in a very long time.

[SlovakPrincess]

I thought Dr. O said Nathan's father was mor terrifying than VICTOR Cassadine, not A Cassadine?

 

I suspect Ron had big designs on bringing back some other character, possibly Mikkos.   I would assume that "storyline" has been dropped at this point.  

 

Which is fine, since I'd rather Dr. O die horribly, and soon, and that everyone related to her would just fade into the woodwork (see what I did there?)

[DayPlayerAtKellys]

I would get some amusement from Dr. O reveling in Donna Mills' misery.  But I was more wondering if they were going to tie off the Nathan paternity thread or leave it wafting in the wind.

I always find it interesting how a new writing team chooses which stories to continue or to conclude (or just completely drop). For Nathan, I don't think Ron even knew so it'll just get lost until someone is looking for something to do with the character and then they'll grab it. I actually kind of like when there are some secrets that are just out there hanging. I don't think this particular one is compelling enough to warrant years and years of teasing, but in general there have been secrets that can take on a life of their own over time (like Who Killed Victor Lord? is probably the best in all of daytime).

[Bill C.]

I'm actually going to give Hayley Erin a continuing pass on the quasi-screechy histrionics.  Girlfriend's at least trying, and lord knows we've seen worse.  I still don't know what the heck BC is trying for at this point, since Morgan somehow keeps ending up at "Indian head test pattern," and I keep thinking he's trying to somehow be method about the possible/probable BPD thing.  Flip side, with Madeline being outed as Silas' real killer (red suit and all), they could actually go ahead and skip that...to whatever end.  And we even might get one last Morgan/Ava boink out of it, knowing this show.

 

As for the randomly meta bit about recasts: it bugged me, but I think that was largely because it was as subtle as Madeline's "Oh, shit" face.

[Tiger]

I suspect Ron had big designs on bringing back some other character, possibly Mikkos.   I would assume that "storyline" has been dropped at this point.  

 

Which is fine, since I'd rather Dr. O die horribly, and soon, and that everyone related to her would just fade into the woodwork (see what I did there?)

I kinda wish Ron had gone there so we could have seen Helena literally cut a bitch. And then toss her off a parapet.

[ciarra]

I'm still laughing at Nathan solving the crime.  He couldn't do Suduko if you spotted him 99% of the numbers.

[SlovakPrincess]

I kinda wish Ron had gone there so we could have seen Helena literally cut a bitch. And then toss her off a parapet.

 

Now that Helena's jumped on the Ruin-Robin's-Life bandwagon, imma need her to die painfully, too.

 

If Anna is going to just murder people now, can she at least catch a fucking clue and rescue Robin, and then murder everyone who has kidnapped and tormented Robin over the last few years?   Ugh, if you're going to be out-of-character and homicidal, at least do it in a useful, productive way.