S01.E07: What's In A Name?

[Tara Ariano]

Cait is reluctant to use her new name at her country club—that is, until she discusses the matter with Candis; at the same time, she deals with anxiety over the 2015 ESPYS and a sit-down with Kris Jenner.

[HumblePi]

I just watched this episode and I'm absolutely disgusted at the way E! has yet again insulted our intelligence and manipulated viewers into believing that they were finally going to see the face-to-face meeting between Cait and Kris. They showed the upcoming first moment of the meeting before each commercial break. (cue the dramatic music and a view of Kris's laced up shoes) We were led to believe it was going to happen when the commercial pause ended. But, it didn't. Time after time with the same tease for 57 minutes! I thought holy crap, the hour is nearly finished and we haven't yet seen Kris actually come in, sit down and begin 'the talk' with Cait. Then, at minute 58 Cait answers the door and lets Kris in, directs her to go to the living room and sits down like a stature glaring at her. She looked like the newest wax attraction in Madame Tussauds museum. Then the 'to be continued' appears dramatically on the screen. I'm so angry at E! and Cait and any producers on this show to have such nerve as to so blatantly taunt and tease the viewers. What a cheap shot! This shows me that E! and Caitlyn Jenner are suffering the low ratings and they'll do anything to bring them up.

 

I have a huge problem with something else that was said by Cait in this episode. When her sister and mother came to Cait's house before the ESPY awards, her sister asked 'Is Kris come (to the ESPYS)? Caitlyn said "no, I didn't invite her". Later in the episode, after the awards, Caitlyn said "she's been there for me for the last 25 years, at all the big events, and she wasn't there, to be honest with you, that makes me sad".  Cue the tears. That was an out and out lie to get sympathy from the viewers.

 

Here E!, rebait the hook, you'll surely catch some of us again next week.

 

Edited September 7, 2015 by HumblePi

[Kromm]

Here E!, rebait the hook, you'll surely catch some of us again next week.

Next week is the last episode. It has to be then, or perhaps never.

[iwasish]

There's been several lies or mistruths, but then this a Kardashian influenced show.

Just how long haven't they spoken? Months and months? A year? Longer? Caitlyn described it at times as all three.

How many hours a day does Cait spend getting made up?

I wonder if Cait introduced her new friends to her kids at the Espys?

[Cosmic Muffin]

They also showed J-bo telling Cait that when they do meet, she should listen to Kris. And the preview shows Kris airing some issues with Cait and Cait steamrolling right over Kris. I don't like either of them, but it was especially not a good look for Cait.  Plus, even with fairly civil divorces I think it's normal to not continue to see or talk to the other person. Their shared children are old enough to make their own plans to see Cait, so they don't have to cooperate on child rearing. Or on their shared complete lack of parenting of their two youngest, but whatever. I don't think it's weird that they haven't spoken in a year. Or anyone's fault.

[Kromm]

I wonder if Cait introduced her new friends to her kids at the Espys?

Assuming the last episode is 50% "meeting with Kris" and 50% "Caitlyn is reborn as a hero and gets lauded at the Espys", perhaps that was engineered.

 

Part of me thinks that perhaps there's a chance the Espys might have been taken out of the last episode (and that REPLACED with the Kris meeting). Firstly because a Kris/Caitlyn Stare-Off gets better ratings. And secondly, because I suspect the glow has come off the Courage Award in the months since, so perhaps they might de-emphasize it a bit.

[iwasish]

I'm betting the Stare - Off ends up with a teary embrace and "Family Unity". At least for the camera.

[rck]

I teared up a bit during the scene at the support group. I think the story of the woman whose father just recently contacted her shows that it really means a lot to have a transgender celebrity. Caitlyn often rubs me the wrong way, but I think it's undeniable that her coming out is incredibly significant for the transgender community.

Edited September 7, 2015 by rck

[Thumper]

I was surprised at how directive Cait was in practically ordering Kris to "sit there!"

I've seen her take charge in other situations in a way that (to me) indicates that she is used to being in charge or followed. It is an interesting sociological study in a way -- she was never raised in the "niceties" of being a woman. Not that all women are (or need to be) that way, but I definitely notice it in Cait.

[Madding crowd]

I'm finding the show kind of dull. It has an odd juxtaposition between teaching moments and lots of makeup and closet stuff. I'm never sure what Caitlyn is really feeling and she still doesn't look very happy to me. Everything here still looks like it's for show: the house, the friends, the closet. I'm guessing a lot of that is trying to make everything more Kardashian like. I am interested in the meeting with Chris, I might be a sap but I saw genuine love between them at one time.

[possibilities]

I honestly can't figure out what the hell is going on with this show. The gulf between the golf course conversation and the support group conversation was so huge! They used it to "show Caitlyn deciding to get on with her legal name change because she realized how serious it was for other people" but it still... why are they going out of their way to make her seem so dim? With a show this scripted and self-conscious, you'd think they'd polish the protagonist a little.

 

Maybe they think that "the average American" will identify with her more if she's acting like someone who hasn't thought about these issues for decades? Is it working? That story from the support group made it sound like it is, but the ratings seem to say it's also turning off quite a few people who initially were interested.

 

I agree the teasing of Kris's visit was obnoxious. I have no interest whatsoever in seeing her, but I'm sure they're doing it because they know lots of people are tuning in just for her, and it was a blatant ploy to try to keep that population tuning in. It's been going on for a few weeks now, and I don't blame anyone who wants to see Kris if they are really sick of being manipulated.

[Cosmic Muffin]

There was a moment when they flashed back to Kim talking to Cait, and they both had wonk eye going on, both from surgery I think, or maybe an errant false eyelash, but it was incredibly distracting. 

 

Hearing Cait say why she wanted to register at the gold club under her old name made that decision make a little more sense, although she still needs to figure out who she is and what she's doing.

Edited September 7, 2015 by Cosmic Muffin

[nexxie]

I have a feeling they'll show very little of the convo with Kris.

[Kromm]

Maybe they think that "the average American" will identify with her more if she's acting like someone who hasn't thought about these issues for decades? Is it working? That story from the support group made it sound like it is, but the ratings seem to say it's also turning off quite a few people who initially were interested.

This sets up an odd dichotomy, with two sides where neither is all that pleasant.

 

On one side is the possibility that Caityn Jenner really IS this achingly dimwitted, selfish, and egotistical.  That she genuinely never thought about, or investigated ANY of this in the decades she claims she's been on the verge of this.

 

On the other side is the one that she's acting. Which on one level might SEEM like a relief, until you have to figure out if the motives are really to create "teaching moments", or if they're to create sensational ratings/controversy moments (in which case they'd be more like lies than acting). 

[TomGirl]

Best part of this episode by far was the time spent with Jenny and DeeDee Boylan. What a truly beautiful couple!

[Cosmocrush]

I just watched this episode and I'm absolutely disgusted at the way E! has yet again insulted our intelligence and manipulated viewers into believing that they were finally going to see the face-to-face meeting between Cait and Kris. They showed the upcoming first moment of the meeting before each commercial break. (cue the dramatic music and a view of Kris's laced up shoes) We were led to believe it was going to happen when the commercial pause ended. But, it didn't. Time after time with the same tease for 57 minutes! I thought holy crap, the hour is nearly finished and we haven't yet seen Kris actually come in, sit down and begin 'the talk' with Cait. Then, at minute 58 Cait answers the door and lets Kris in, directs her to go to the living room and sits down like a stature glaring at her. She looked like the newest wax attraction in Madame Tussauds museum. Then the 'to be continued' appears dramatically on the screen. I'm so angry at E! and Cait and any producers on this show to have such nerve as to so blatantly taunt and tease the viewers. What a cheap shot! This shows me that E! and Caitlyn Jenner are suffering the low ratings and they'll do anything to bring them up.

 

I have a huge problem with something else that was said by Cait in this episode. When her sister and mother came to Cait's house before the ESPY awards, her sister asked 'Is Kris come (to the ESPYS)? Caitlyn said "no, I didn't invite her". Later in the episode, after the awards, Caitlyn said "she's been there for me for the last 25 years, at all the big events, and she wasn't there, to be honest with you, that makes me sad".  Cue the tears. That was an out and out lie to get sympathy from the viewers.

Oh that continuous tease for what turns out to be the last two minutes of the show happens on every reality show I watch whether E! or BRAVO or even Discovery Channel.   They all do it but it's a standard on every Real Housewives of Wherever show.  I knew we wouldn't see Kris Jenner show up before the last five minutes.   I know Caitlyn,  E!,  and whomever is shooting all the closeups of hands, like to think this is a docu-series but it's shot and edited just like all the other reality shows.  Well, except the facination with hands. 

 

 

I think Caitlyn not sharing the ESPY's with Kris can still be sad even if the reason is Cait didn't invite her.  Both things can be true at the same time.    it's possible to miss someone even while knowing it has to be that way.  They were a family, married for 25 years; I think it would be unusual if Caitlyn didn't feel that way sometimes. 

Edited September 7, 2015 by Cosmocrush

[princelina]

So I'm from a family of golfers - they are ridonkulous.  They miss birthdays, anniversaries, holidays, etc. (not little things but BIG celebrations) because they "have to golf".  I'm dying to skip one of their special days one time and say, "I had to read a book."  :)  So I actually had no problem believing that while Cait was more than happy to upset her family with her transition, she wouldn't risk her golf membership.

[millennium]

I already said quite a bit about Jenner's hypocritical and self-serving plan to register under her former name at the golf club in the Media thread.   What I haven't commented upon, and which upon reflection continues to irk me, are the faces Jenner made as she explained her choice to Rhonda.  The exaggerated eye-rolling, the scoffing ... it was for the audience's benefit.  And every one of those expressions telegraphed the message: "What an idiot Rhonda is."

 

I don't believe that Caitlyn Jenner truly respects anyone, be it family, friends, other transgender people, or those trying to help her or teach her.   I think she regards everyone as assistants or inferiors and believes they exist for one reason only -- to facilitate her wants and needs.   The instant they stray from that script, she gets condescending and difficult.

 

God help anyone close to her.   Life must be hell.

[jonesingjay]

I'm enjoying the friendships that are developing between the ladies. They probably wouldn't have met if it weren't for being put together for this show.

I can definetly understand Caitlyn's pain when a person who was such a big part of your life is no longer around in the way they once were.

Edited September 7, 2015 by jonesingjay

[CousinAmy]

She changed her name before the Vanity Fair article came out. What name did she use to sign her contract? She's also being sued for an accident she caused when she was known as a previous name. But now she is known as Caitlyn. And she never wondered if her name change was legal? Absurd.

Edited September 7, 2015 by CousinAmy

[Artsda]

Interesting the 4 bio kids didn't even allow themselves to be shown on this episode in the ESPY audience. They even blurred out the faces of the oldest bio daughter and others.

Candis seemed shocked in a taken back way at Caitlyn saying she was going to be Bruce at the golf course. And if she's going to continue to use Bruce when she sees fit then there's no point really rushing the legal forms. Obviously legally and in eyes of the law she's going to be sued/charged as Bruce.

 

There's been several lies or mistruths, but then this a Kardashian influenced show.

Just how long haven't they spoken? Months and months? A year? Longer? Caitlyn described it at times as all three.

The whole thing with the not talking for a year or months & months is all not true just for sake of show drama. Kris was at the house and paparazzi caught her and Kourtney coming and going after Caitlyn's breast augmentation surgery. There's also when Kris was there when Diane Sawyer aired. Which was like less than 10 weeks from them filming this segment.

 

They can't go from this apparent year of not talking to this one conversation.Which was probably filmed around July 29th when Kris was paparazzi'd at the house again to a few DAYS later taking selfies with Caitlyn over multiple days, and sitting with her and Corey Gable in a booth. Taking pictures with Corey too.

Edited September 7, 2015 by Artsda

[CousinAmy]

The most important part of this episode, of course, is that Caitlyn wanted to be styled like Angelina Jolie.

Angelina is extremely elegant, and dresses in a sleek, minimalistic style. Oh, Caitlyn, find your own unique style.

[Muffyn]

On a purely shallow note, Cait’s upper lip barely moves and she is already starting to get bunny lines from Botox.  She can look really lovely but that drives me nuts. 

Cait came off very self-possessed this episode.  It seemed like she was ready to yell at Ronda about the golf course application, then she remembered she was on film.  I would hate to see her in that situation off camera.  Her comments about her mother’s broken hip also came off very me-me-me. 

 

Since they showed the clip that I assume came from KUWTK of Cait telling Kris that she had not been treating her well for 4-5 years, I think we can say that the marriage did not fall apart because of Cait’s transition.  I’m sure it didn’t help, but there were other issues in that marriage.

 

I yet again love Chandi.  It was wonderful to see that she runs a support group for young people.  They are such an at risk group.  Because it was for the show, the focus was on Cait’s name change.  I did enjoy hearing a variety of people speak about their experiences.  I know this show is an odd mix of learning and fashion focus, but I did enjoy this part of the learning curve.  Though I agree, Cait does not exactly come off as thoughtful.  In fact, a little dim is a good way to describe her in this context.

[whoknowswho]

I've tried to watch with an open mind. But--I can't do it.

Not because I think there's anything wrong with transitioning, I don't. I give everyone credit for their complete bravery. But Caitlin comes off as a dim bulb, and as shallow as a dinner plate. She is BORING. The show is BORING. I'm not sure if I can stay awake for another episode next week.

[millennium]

The most important part of this episode, of course, is that Caitlyn wanted to be styled like Angelina Jolie.

Angelina is extremely elegant, and dresses in a sleek, minimalistic style. Oh, Caitlyn, find your own unique style.

 

Poor Angelina.   Now the online rags are running side-by-side pics of Jenner and Jolie.   I suppose it's only a matter of time before the media starts to claim that Jenner looks like Angelina, the same way they ludicrously tried to make her seem a twin of Jessica Lange upon publication of the Vanity Fair cover (despite a scientific facial study which confirmed that Jenner does not resemble Jessica Lange at all).

Edited September 7, 2015 by millennium

[millennium]

double post

Edited September 7, 2015 by millennium

[Lesia]

And,let's not forget that she has to redecorate her home.  Because on top of trailblazing to have the name change thing be federal law, it is very important that a cavalcade of designers parade through her home because all the furniture is old.  What a dolt.

[iwasish]

That's cause she's never leaving to her house again. Maybe she'll have Candis up for a girls night or Jen Boylan to "counsel" her. But she's not going to move out of HER community and into "Theirs"

When Kate discussed the Freak factor you could see the horror in Caits eyes. She realized she's now considered a freak by a huge percent of the population.

[Misslindsey]

 

Since they showed the clip that I assume came from KUWTK of Cait telling Kris that she had not been treating her well for 4-5 years, I think we can say that the marriage did not fall apart because of Cait’s transition.  I’m sure it didn’t help, but there were other issues in that marriage.

This. I think both Cait and Kris were at fault for their marriage falling apart, and it was not just about Cait's transition, which like you said, probably did not help, but there were other issues. They seemed to grow apart. Watching KUWTK there was so much disfunction in that relationship for the last so many seasons of that show. What I think bugs me though is that Kris, Kim, and Khloe would treat Cait awful a lot on KUWTK. Then when Cait says nothing all that extreme, especially if one watched KUWTK, about Kris in the Vanity Fair article. and they all pile against her saying that she does not have to take down their mom on her rise, when that is what they did to Cait.

[ClareWalks]

Just a shout-out right off the bat to millennium and Kromm for always having well thought out, articulate "Caitlyn is obnoxious" posts. They are consistently true and enjoyable to read while still being respectful!

 

Loved the exasperated-sounding "Hello?" from Kris when Caitlyn finally got through on the phone. That said it all. 

 

I thought when Caitlyn called Jen while in the closet that she was going to ask Jen for wardrobe advice. I suppose that indicates how I am feeling about Caitlyn at this point. She seems like she has a heart for others and I believe she is sincere in her transition, but she is about as deep as a puddle. It's like she has no concept of actual suffering. The disconnect when she is talking to these kids about how cops pull them over and demand to know if they "have a dick," meanwhile Caitlyn's biggest problem is how she's gonna wear her hair at the ESPYs or some shit. Or whether her locker at the country club is going to be moved. Really? Your locker at the COUNTRY CLUB? Meanwhile transgender women across the country are afraid of being assaulted in locker rooms, if they're even allowed in at all.

 

I wasn't too upset about the Kris confrontation fake-out, because I saw it coming a mile away. When the previouslies only showed Kris showing up at the house, I knew the episode would end there. Not too eager to see them "duke it out" anyway, since I cannot stand Kris Jenner. 

[Primetimer]

Kris is like the elephant who's barely even in the room in the season's penultimate I Am Cait.

Read the story

[Fostersmom]

Damn, I'm not sure if Cait is the most clueless bitch, the most self absorbed bitch, or all of the above. The ridiculousness makes my head hurt.

 

First, the golf course. Of course Cait doesn't want to change her name and still wants to be Bruce there. It was well documented the golf course isn't exactly inclusive and the club house and restaurant is men only. This was reported MONTHS ago. So, as soon as Cait is Cait there, those doors are permanently slammed shut. She's looking to straddle both sides to make it work for her own needs. I can't believe this is the only golf course in the area and a 9 month renovation seems like the perfect time to join a new, inclusive, club as Cait.

 

The Espys. Loved that not only did Cait sound all putout her 89 year old mom dared to fall and break a hip, she then acted like she'd be devastated if Mom wasn't there. Why? Because the cameras would be? Even nicer was Cait having mom hauled up the 100 steps in a wheel chair…. and then leave the family standing outside. Let's make sure to name drop Donatella, Angelina, and anyone else we can. Nice touch of acting hurt Kris wasn't going to be there…. when she wasn't invited. Imagine if Kris had just showed or asked to be invited.

 

Chandi's group and name changes. It's pretty obvious Cait put no thought or effort into figuring this out and 100% just thought going by Cait made it all legal. You know she's not going to fill out a single one of those docs on her own. Anyone know if the assistants have filled this out and filed it for her? I remember when the person I used to know first obviously partially transitioned and got pulled over and had to go to court for the ticket. For years she had been dressing as a female, but had just recently had a lot of plastic surgery and began using a female name exclusively professionally (she would say additions and no subtractions). Her driver's license was still in the male name and sex. She was oddly pissed the cop and court kept calling her ma'am and "she". I kinda thought that was the point, but 15 years later, I guess I kinds get it. If legally she was still male according to the law, then the law offices should not pick and chose when to use the law against her. Chandi's group is so very needed and I'm sure does wonderful things. I don't think Chandi appreciates Cait's "we" in regard to her group though. No Cait, that's Chandi's group and work. You are there for the camera and I'd bet she's never been there since.

 

JBo and Deedie. I just feel bad for JBo at this point. I think she's more than fed up with Cait's lack of community reality and assumptions all trans people have the same unlimited funds, paid rah rah sections, families who don't dare to not be supportive, and those who have personally seen the hate and vitriol that's unfortunately a very big reality for so many. Cait obviously expected Kris to just make the first move, tell her how wonderful she looks, how awesome she is, and kiss her ass and be a-okay with her husband of 25 years becoming a woman. When JBo asked Cait about talking to Kris, and Cait said she hadn't, the side eye Deedie gave JBo was all kinds of awesome. You know those two have had plenty of conversations about Cait's lack of reality for their community.

Edited September 7, 2015 by Fostersmom

[HumblePi]

I was surprised at how directive Cait was in practically ordering Kris to "sit there!"

I've seen her take charge in other situations in a way that (to me) indicates that she is used to being in charge or followed. It is an interesting sociological study in a way -- she was never raised in the "niceties" of being a woman. Not that all women are (or need to be) that way, but I definitely notice it in Cait.

I noticed that in the previews last week of this episode. Her body posture said volumes including,  "this is MY turf 'babeeeee' and you'll do as I say"

[HumblePi]

Caitlyn was short-sighted in her quest to transition into a female and that's becoming more and more apparent with each episode. She ruminated for years and years about being female. Dressing female, feminizing her face, wearing the makeup, living as a female. But after that short-term goal was realized, she's suddenly faced with all the other baggage that accompanies gender transitioning.Fascinating though it all is, there's even more fascination because Caitlyn professes to be a Christian and a Republican. Both of these are in direct conflict with her transition.

 

Is my family going to feel the same and treat me the same?

Are my friends going to be there for me?

What are my legal rights when it comes to changing my ID?

What will I do if I'm abandoned by lifetime friends and I'm left with only other transgenders?

How is this transition going to impact me financially?

Is my lifelong reputation as a hero and Olympic champion going to be second in importance to the general public?

Will I find someone that will remain with me until the end of my days and love me no matter what my choices are?

How will she accept being ostracized by formal religions and directly conflicted with the beliefs of her politics?

 

Had she ever thought of most of those questions prior to 'coming out' or was she too focused on being able to buy herself new Jimmy Choo shoes and Gucci handbags?

[Cosmic Muffin]

I didn't know that parts of the golf club were male only and that's what was really behind Cait wanting to register as her old name. I heard about it, thought it was weird, saw the episode, thought she really didn't want to upset women in their 70s be being in their dressing room (although I also thought 70 year old men would be upset by Cait as she is now being in their dressing room), thought it was just another thing she hadn't thought through, that at some point you change bathrooms and dressing rooms. But the whole thing is really about retaining male privilege when it suits her. She hasn't spent decades fighting for inclusiveness in the golf club world, that worked for her, and she just wants it to continue to work for her. 

 

How would it be to play a round of golf with her new transfemale buddies, and then sashay into the restaurant? Cait knows she can't take them there (or Ronda, or her mom and sisters, or Kris, Kylie, Kendall, etc.) And she does not care. Not as long as she has away around this, and no one tells her "no".

 

These other transpeople struggle with routine traffic stops. Cait hasn't even spent a night in jail over the car accident. She doesn't get it. She kinda gets a bit how she doesn't get it, and she pays some lip service to learning, but she doesn't want to. Not really. I do expect everyone from her old life will flee when they aren't making guest appearances on her show. And that's a shame, and that can be typical of what happens when someone transitions. But I don't see her finding a new community, LBGT or otherwise. I think this might surprise her. So, I expect she'll end up pretty lonely, except for Ronda and other staff. She was a loner before, I hope she's ok with it.

 

I think her biggest problem is how shallow she is. Not even how privileged she is. I don't think she's actually stupid, but she's as deep as a finger bowl, and that works for her too. She isn't going to transition into someone with introspection or empathy. Her mom falling and breaking a hip matters only in regard to her attending the ESPYs or not. She behaved this way in front of the cameras, she's executive producer, she ok'd showing all this. This is who she really is.

Edited September 7, 2015 by Cosmic Muffin

[possibilities]

Last night I said I couldn't figure out what the show was doing, or why, and this morning I have a theory.

 

Basically, they feel a need to portray every other transgender person (besides Caitlyn herself) as a victim. I know on one level they are trying to raise awareness, which I agree is important. But there is a level at which they are also going out of their way to draw a line between Cait and everyone else, and make Cait all about the glamour and everyone else all about the sadness.

 

I like the glimpses they give us of the support groups, but it fits with the tearful narrative. If you follow the media thread, it seems they are determined to edit out any references to interviewees as successful, empowered women, and only air segments of conversations that make the subjects look downtrodden and either sad and lonely and broken or "brave in the face of terrible odds". They even show Candis Cayne as a lonely woman with car trouble, instead of as a successful woman with a life and a career. She needed to be uplifted by Cait and couldn't even take her car to a mechanic on her own-- they played it like she didn't even know about supportive summer camps for transgender kids, and needed Cait to inspire her. It's more likely she knew about it and had to inform Cait, but that doesn't fit the narrative, that all sad things come from everyone else and all fun things come from Cait.

 

Cait has her own issues of sadness and self-pity, like how they portray the kids as defending Kris and abandoning Cait. And how her mom's broken hip was all about how much Cait wanted her at the Epsy's and not about how worried she was about her mom. I think she's trying to come off as a savior by portraying other people as worse off and in need of her leadership, to make herself look better and to deflect from her own problems. I don't think it's working, but that's my working theory on why they make her look so clueless about the real world, while intercutting scenes of the closet of high fashion. They're trying to elevate her and the only thing they can use is her wealth and supposed innocence, compared to "the masses of pathetic others and mean people who torment them." It's making her look stupid and shallow but I think it's meant in this other way. Even when they show people calling her on her shit and educating her, it's meant to make her look innocent and well-meaning and heroically willing to bring herself down into the sad world that others live in (as a savior), like she's above it. I think it's making her look like something else, but I don't think the impression they're making is the one they thought they would be making with those stunts.

 

It reminds me of one of my grandmas who, if people made dirty jokes, would pretend she didn't know what they were talking about. If she had acted offended, she could have been called uptight. But if she acted innocent, it made her feel "above them"-- she wasn't embarrassed about "not knowing what is going on"-- she thought it made her look saintly and pure.

Edited September 7, 2015 by possibilities

[Foghorn Leghorn]

When Cait cries I blame the hormones!  And all her years spent watching the K women wipe their mascara tears off their faces is paying off!

[mamey2422]

I think her biggest problem is how shallow she is. Not even how privileged she is. I don't think she's actually stupid, but she's as deep as a finger bowl, and that works for her too. She isn't going to transition into someone with introspection or empathy. Her mom falling and breaking a hip matters only in regard to her attending the ESPYs or not. She behaved this way in front of the cameras, she's executive producer, she ok'd showing all this. This is who she really is.

Cait's shallowness has been so disappointing. I had high hopes for this series after the Diane Sawyer interview but it's clear that whatever Cait's role was as a transgender advocate and pioneer will end with this show. I highly doubt we will hear about any advocacy by Cait when the cameras stop rolling.

I've been trying to cut her some slack on her focus on clothes/makeup as it seems like that's a normal phase of transitioning. Jennifer Boylan called it a "pink cloud" and DeeDee used another term in last night's episode. However, I can't excuse Cait's meanness. Anytime anyone tries to correct her or stand up to her or express anything that isn't all flowers and rainbows she talks over them, shuts them down or brushes them off.

Rhonda pushing her on applying to the club as Cait not Bruce is a perfect example. She wouldn't let Rhonda finish a sentence and just kept saying she'd deal with it later. Anyone with advocacy in mind would have been open to an honest conversation in the least and maybe willing to take a stance with the club about their stale rules. Maybe it's asking too much for Cait but she's the one who said she wanted to take this stuff on

Edited September 7, 2015 by mamey2422

[HumblePi]

I didn't know that parts of the golf club were male only and that's what was really behind Cait wanting to register as her old name. I heard about it, thought it was weird, saw the episode, thought she really didn't want to upset women in their 70s be being in their dressing room (although I also thought 70 year old men would be upset by Cait as she is now being in their dressing room), thought it was just another thing she hadn't thought through, that at some point you change bathrooms and dressing rooms. But the whole thing is really about retaining male privilege when it suits her. She hasn't spent decades fighting for inclusiveness in the golf club world, that worked for her, and she just wants it to continue to work for her. 

 

How would it be to play a round of golf with her new transfemale buddies, and then sashay into the restaurant? Cait knows she can't take them there (or Ronda, or her mom and sisters, or Kris, Kylie, Kendall, etc.) And she does not care. Not as long as she has away around this, and no one tells her "no".

 

These other transpeople struggle with routine traffic stops. Cait hasn't even spent a night in jail over the car accident. She doesn't get it. She kinda gets a bit how she doesn't get it, and she pays some lip service to learning, but she doesn't want to. Not really. I do expect everyone from her old life will flee when they aren't making guest appearances on her show. And that's a shame, and that can be typical of what happens when someone transitions. But I don't see her finding a new community, LBGT or otherwise. I think this might surprise her. So, I expect she'll end up pretty lonely, except for Ronda and other staff. She was a loner before, I hope she's ok with it.

 

I think her biggest problem is how shallow she is. Not even how privileged she is. I don't think she's actually stupid, but she's as deep as a finger bowl, and that works for her too. She isn't going to transition into someone with introspection or empathy. Her mom falling and breaking a hip matters only in regard to her attending the ESPYs or not. She behaved this way in front of the cameras, she's executive producer, she ok'd showing all this. This is who she really is.

Note to Caitlyn Jenner. There's public golf courses, you know?  Yeah, as if she would ever be caught on a public course. She's accustomed to only the best private clubs. Make the transgender community proud, lower your standards and go play on a public course with some transgender golf enthusiasts, just once....please?

Edited September 7, 2015 by HumblePi

[iwasish]

Cait said she played golf almost every day. A round of golf takes a few hours (18 holes), then lunch at the club and the ride home. How much time is she going to have to devote to her new community? All the other ladies are quite involved with transgender organizations as employees or volunteer work with them, is Cait willing to sacrifice a day of golf for activism?

And why does she thank everyone who attends these groups for coming when she should be thanking them for welcoming her and allowing her to observe and participate?

[Texasmom1970]

My favorite part of the episode was Caitlin's mom, she is one spunky woman love her!

I also loved seeing the young group of people and hearing what they struggle with in the real world. It is quite a juxtaposition listening to them, and then seeing shots of Caiylyn's home hidden away from reality high up on a hill!

I only hope some acceptance and awareness comes to the transgender community from a celebrity transitioning. As for the show I too am tired of all the hair, makeup and clothing worries and shots. I was expecting the show to be deeper than it is, set the bar too high I guess.

[Fostersmom]

Cait said she played golf almost every day. A round of golf takes a few hours (18 holes), then lunch at the club and the ride home. How much time is she going to have to devote to her new community? All the other ladies are quite involved with transgender organizations as employees or volunteer work with them, is Cait willing to sacrifice a day of golf for activism?

And why does she thank everyone who attends these groups for coming when she should be thanking them for welcoming her and allowing her to observe and participate?

 

Cuz these groups only exist for Cait to waltz in, give a fake sad face, act like she's been thinking of all sorts of ways to throw herself into the works of others, and then waltz back out to never think of the many kids she'd met or their many legitimate worries again. 

[Granny58]

"a Republican. Both of these are in direct conflict with her transition"   It is?  I don't think Republicanism has a stand on this.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.  

 

Also, I get the impression that Cait really is only about the dressing pretty and make up, has fantasized about doing it for years, and now gets to and be admired for it.  Once the novelty wears off I would not be surprised AT ALL if Cait gives up on it.  I'm not saying that about all transgenders, it's just the vibe I get from this particular situation. 

[Muffyn]

I thought when Caitlyn called Jen while in the closet that she was going to ask Jen for wardrobe advice. I suppose that indicates how I am feeling about Caitlyn at this point. She seems like she has a heart for others and I believe she is sincere in her transition, but she is about as deep as a puddle. It's like she has no concept of actual suffering. The disconnect when she is talking to these kids about how cops pull them over and demand to know if they "have a dick," meanwhile Caitlyn's biggest problem is how she's gonna wear her hair at the ESPYs or some shit. Or whether her locker at the country club is going to be moved. Really? Your locker at the COUNTRY CLUB? Meanwhile transgender women across the country are afraid of being assaulted in locker rooms, if they're even allowed in at all.. 

If they do move her locker, maybe she'll encounter a smidgen of what the other people have felt.  She will be safe from being physically assaulted.  But I can imagine people whispering, perhaps even openly confronting her, and certainly complaining to the club.  The problem is I don't feel sorry for her.  She chose for all of these years to be a member of a club that, while it accepts women, does not allow women full privileges.  Cait obviously did not have a problem with that up until now.  I do not believe she is really going to follow up with any of the other activism that has been presented to her.  This is the only activism I can see her getting involved in.  If the club tells her that as a woman she is no longer welcome in the club house and dining hall unescorted, suddenly she will be all for women's rights; that is, wealthy women that are members of her club.  

 

There is an article in the media thread that points out she has not yet paid the tuition for the young women that was on the show.  Cait said they would help her thorough nursing school.  Oops!  Looks like that slipped her mind.  

 

And why does she thank everyone who attends these groups for coming when she should be thanking them for welcoming her and allowing her to observe and participate?

Ooh, ooh!  Pick me!  I can answer this one!  Because she's a self-absorbed narcissist.  

 

If we made a drinking game based on every time they used the "Cait's in the closet" joke on this show, we would all be hospitalized with alcohol poisoning.  

[Cosmocrush]

Note to Caitlyn Jenner. There's public golf courses, you know?  Yeah, as if she would ever be caught on a public course. She's accustomed to only the best private clubs. Make the transgender community proud, lower your standards and go play on a public course with some transgender golf enthusiasts, just once....please?

 

Here you go:

 

Caitlyn Jenner eschewed the reality cameras and any sort of glitz or glamour to practice her swing Monday ... at a plain old public golf course.

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2015/08/25/caitlyn-jenner-golfing-photo/#ixzz3l5EhzQm7

 

 

[Kromm]

Last night I said I couldn't figure out what the show was doing, or why, and this morning I have a theory.

 

Basically, they feel a need to portray every other transgender person (besides Caitlyn herself) as a victim. I know on one level they are trying to raise awareness, which I agree is important. But there is a level at which they are also going out of their way to draw a line between Cait and everyone else, and make Cait all about the glamour and everyone else all about the sadness.

Good lord. It fits.  Especially when you try and reconcile it with that vile business with how the show took what Angelica Ross actually said and did and changed it to highlight (and only reveal) the stuff that made her seem like a victim.

Here you go:

 

Yeah, it's true. There's more than enough valid stuff to criticize Ms. Jenner on to have to leap to conclusions about stuff like this. I'm sure she's fine using public courses... assuming she's anonymous. Truly dedicated golfers wouldn't limit themselves to specific courses anyway, because they want to play as much, and in as many, places as possible.

"a Republican. Both of these are in direct conflict with her transition"   It is?  I don't think Republicanism has a stand on this.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.  

Republicanism isn't any kind of formalized doctrine that has absolute beliefs. They have a party platform, but it's malleable depending on who leads the party. It would be more accurate if the OP has said "Conservative" instead.. (or even "Conservative Christian").

[possibilities]

Doesn't the Republican Party oppose transgender rights and anti-discrimination efforts? There may be a few individuals in the Party who dissent, but the overwhelming majority of Republican elected officials are against these and other similar efforts, aren't they? I'm not being snarky, I genuinely think this is true but if I've lost track of a shift in policy, I'm open to hearing about it.

[thefog]

I don't know what more Caitlyn wants from Kris at this point.  They are divorce.  She walked off with a very nice settlement - because of Kris and the Kardashian empire.  Their children are grown.  I don't recall KJ ever bad mouthing CJ in the media.

 

Caitlyn came off more looking like a bully here.

[Kromm]

Doesn't the Republican Party oppose transgender rights and anti-discrimination efforts? There may be a few individuals in the Party who dissent, but the overwhelming majority of Republican elected officials are against these and other similar efforts, aren't they? I'm not being snarky, I genuinely think this is true but if I've lost track of a shift in policy, I'm open to hearing about it.

They dodge. They'll never say the national platform includes anything like that, I'd bet, but they definitely allow party officials to say it while stumping or pundits to say it on the radio, and assign it the place of an "individual belief". Local party platforms sometimes might go far enough to come close to condemning it though (then again in some locales, the local platforms still have racist stuff as riders too).  

 

On the national level, everything is couched in terms like "traditional family values", and leaving a big blank space where defining that actually might occur. It used to include an anti-gay-marriage plank, but in terms of transgenderism I think it might only apply to if a transgender tried to marry and violated some Bible thumper's notions on if it was a man and a woman marrying or not.  I think they'd tend to claim they don't care if people "dress up like women" (snerk), but the moment they try and marry, that's when they care.  Or perhaps they could also have a bug up their butt about public assembly rules too (so things like transgender marches, or performance venues, might have trouble from the Republican party too, the same way gay pride marches or gay bars used to). But again, it really all comes down to the current insidious invisible line between conservatism and Republicanism. When in fact in Lincoln's time the Republicans were often the Liberals. How times have changed.

Edited September 7, 2015 by Kromm

[Granny58]

Doesn't the Republican Party oppose transgender rights and anti-discrimination efforts? There may be a few individuals in the Party who dissent, but the overwhelming majority of Republican elected officials are against these and other similar efforts, aren't they? I'm not being snarky, I genuinely think this is true but if I've lost track of a shift in policy, I'm open to hearing about it.

I'm also not being snarky, but I wonder what transgender rights are?  I don't want an opposite gendered person in the restroom with me, but that's not a Republican thing....and is it a right?  And I don't think anybody is opposing people getting the surgeries done.