Tara Ariano July 6, 2015 Share July 6, 2015 A Kansas City, Mo., company that specializes in skin-care products and cosmetics suffers from its founder's impulsive and unrealistic business model. Link to comment
Primetimer July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 And John Ramos has some not-quite-burning questions about his attempt to streamline a cosmetics company's branding. Read the story Link to comment
Gregg247 July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I liked the fact that this company was already successful, so the owners weren't desperate for a life preserver from Marcus. I felt that their negotiation in the restaurant was more of between equals, which I liked. Miranda sure had a lot of ideas, didn't she? On the one hand, that was great for her company. On the other, some of her ideas were a little out there, and she seems to fall in love with each of her ideas. Marcus will be a good partner for her because he can keep her in line. How was Marcus able to fight his way into the QVC office building? I thought Lori Grenier was guarding those doors 24 hours a day! 4 Link to comment
ethalfrida July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I did not like the new logo. It was so sterile and looked so medI cinal. 1 Link to comment
rehoboth July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 Marcus had better keep an eye on that business. I have a feeling that those tweezers will make their way back into the product lineup if sales don't skyrocket. I wasn't crazy about the woman. It was said twice that she made bad business decisions and bought truckloads of extraneous stuff to sell because she was "excited". I think she gives businesswomen a bad name. Link to comment
citychic July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 It's kind of a marketing gimmick, I'm really interested in what they call medical grade lanolin. My mom taught me about lanolin when my kids were born in the 90's. I went to the local small pharmacy and bought it from the pharmacist and used it along with fullers earth powder for diaper rash. I also used it on our faces, lips and hands during the winter months. My mom used it on us in the 50's and 60's. It's harder to find but a few years ago we ordered it through Kroger pharmacy for our aging dog since it is all natural and the dog could lick it. Lanolin is a great natural product but anyone could buy it themselves and use it pure on any part of their body and then apply their make up and lotions over the top. I didn't like Miranda at all. Her bottom lip looks like it was permanently pushed out making her look like a pouty child, which kind of matched her attitude. When that woman from the make up company was critiquing her products Miranda's ears were bright red. She wasn't a strong woman, she was pushy and demanding. Link to comment
attica July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I've used lanolin-based soap for, like, ever, so I was interested to see what-all this company did. Not a bad ep. I was honestly shocked when we were shown the poor woman filling bottles by hand. That's just nuts. I certainly get why she was panicking about the Marcus Makeover, but geez, you have to know that besides being time consuming, there's no good way to ensure quality control on a manual process like that. Robots! (BTW, the manufacturer is the same one Marcus used for the 'erica cole by raquel' or whatever that salon brand was, am I right?) One of the things sidestepped with the two vendors is that lanolin, being basically sheep fat, isn't vegan. Anyway, I wonder when BirchBox Lady talked about customers being concerned with ingredients, if that's a factor. Maybe it isn't. Burt's Bees isn't vegan either, so what do I know? 1 Link to comment
sarthaz July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 "Medical grade" in this case refers to the purity, and it's been shown that lower quality lanolin can cause irritation. The real question is whether anyone else is actually selling non-medical grade lanolin products. One would assume that Lansinoh uses the highest quality lanolin available, seeing as it's made for babies to suck on. Are there competitors in this space that use non-medical grade lanolin, or is it just marketing silliness? Overall, yet another good episode. Solid business lacking direction. Marcus helps them, the listen to most of his suggestions, and improve. Love it. Keep 'em coming. While I didn't love the new logo, I was happy that Marcus didn't make it some bright and obnoxious orange and blue and start franchising 1-800-LANO-LIP with an ugly mural on the side of the building. 3 Link to comment
BusyOctober July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 This is so very shallow but he lack of movement in Miranda's face was disturbing! Her lower lip and chin moved, and she could blink, but the rest of her face was like a block of wax. The light up lipstick wasn't anything I'd want. The mirror was good, but the LED was way too bright! I agree with the lady that said she wouldn't want that glowing light shining a spotlight on me in public. In my car, maybe? 2 Link to comment
sarthaz July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I was honestly shocked when we were shown the poor woman filling bottles by hand. That's just nuts. I certainly get why she was panicking about the Marcus Makeover, but geez, you have to know that besides being time consuming, there's no good way to ensure quality control on a manual process like that. Robots! (BTW, the manufacturer is the same one Marcus used for the 'erica cole by raquel' or whatever that salon brand was, am I right?) Yeah, that was crazy! I feel bad for her. I know the producers went out of their way to make it look like she could be a productive employee to create some human-interest angle to this episode, but I'd be surprised if she still has her 40 hours. It looked like they were spinning it as "she's on the sales team now!", but they probably tossed her into a commission-based position she has no skills for. Link to comment
ethalfrida July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 Miranda, to me, wasn't that bad. Her body language with her husband showed a lot more than her communications with Marcus. And I don't know why he got all bent when she wanted to hear what he told her employee. She was still majority owner and had a right to know. However, it was the way she did it... she should have had a seat at the table right beside him. It was basically a Human Resources situation. I think the lady is brilliant because she invented and sells a product that brings in a considerable amount of money whereas other companies needed Marcus to fund them. 3 Link to comment
eddy July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 Overall a very good episode. I was shocked that before Marcus took over, the lanolin product was only 3% of total sales. That means all that other crap was 97% of sales. Somebody is a very good salesperson to get P.O.'s for what appear to be mediocre products. I guess the philosophy was, put a bunch of stuff out there and see what sells. Clearly the owners needed outside guidance, even for obvious decisions (Filling bottles by hand? Swastika logo? Dead inventory? Non-productive floor space?) Good thing that logo didn’t get printed on thousands of dollars of packaging! I really liked how Marcus re-focused the company (and with minimal drama). It was a show any business owner could learn from, which is why I watch it. To me THAT is entertainment. 5 Link to comment
selhars July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 (edited) I have some of the same questions posed by the PTV article this week. Marcus' comment about a product needing to 'solve a problem' sounded like a generalized mantra people just say....to sound like they know what they're talking about. A product does NOT have to solve a problem. It CAN do that -- if that's the kind of product it is. But it doesn't have to. To me -- he just sounded like he is out of his element in the cosmetics business. A product can also just make you feel a certain way because you like it and it appeals to you for whatever reason -- packaging, color, whatever. Does every. single. product he sells in Camping World "solve a problem?" I doubt it. And uh, what "problem" does a piece of candy or a cupcake "solve?" His comments about the makeup brushes just sounded ignorant, IMO. Somebody is a very good salesperson to get P.O.'s for what appear to be mediocre products. Uh, drug store and discount store aisles are FULL of mediocre products and more are being launched every day. Someone is getting credit for those re-orders. And what's mediocre is "subjective." Some people like makeup that "COVERs a GIRLs face" or "MAY BE (line) cheaper'...others online by Trish McAvoy and Lancome, or Laura Mercier. (and even so, price and quality don't necessarily correlate). All a person has to do is be able to convince someone a product will SELL....mediocre or not. Big box discount stores and making BILLIONS selling mediocre products....including makeup. As for other competitors using medical grade lanolin....or people being able to buy it themselves. On the first point, you could say that about any number of products. One company started using peptides in make up, or AHAs.....and competitors did too, MOST companies compete with the same ingredients.....they just use their MARKETING to set them apart. Oil of Olay has made millions testing to show it's just as good as stuff that costs twice as much. On the second point, people being able to buy it themselves. You could say that about any number of products. People can use natural products right out of their pantry of fridge for skin care....like our grandparents did.....cucumber for your eyes, eggs or oatmeals for facials......But they still BUY commercial products that are laden with additives.....so that shouldn't stop a company from launching a product. Make up and skin care sales are all about marketing and sales pitches. Except for products that "solve a problem" the entire beauty business is about 'making people feel good....push the right EMOTIONAL button...have the right PACKAGING...and it will sell. That's also why I'd hesitate to put all my eggs in the lanolin baskets. If you've got products that are selling, why get rid of them? You can't keep those, AND build the lanolin line? Or figure out SOME way they can "complement" each other or co-exist. Edited July 10, 2015 by selhars 3 Link to comment
nobodyyoucare July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 you have to know that besides being time consuming, there's no good way to ensure quality control on a manual process like that. Robots! (BTW, the manufacturer is the same one Marcus used for the 'erica cole by raquel' or whatever that salon brand was, am I right?) Yep same company and Marcus actually says so. A machine to fill those bottles is actually pretty expensive and only makes sense versus a human doing it when you have ten thousand or more bottles to fill for an order using that color/formula. Hundreds to a 1000 a time a trained employee can be cheaper then using a series of machines to do the order. Link to comment
Bungalow July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 Us old nurses used Johnson's Baby Cream on our dry hands at night and they were healed by morning...washing your hands a trillion times a day really does a number on them. Then Johnson's took the lanolin out of their baby cream. We were back to trying all kinds of hand creams that didn't work on chapped hands. When I went to England I realized I left my hand lotion at home and bought a sample of E45 cream. It has lanolin in it! I have been buying it at Amazon us even though it is a UK product. I don't know if it is medical grade but the brand name referenced for the lanolin is Medilan 1 Link to comment
Bungalow July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I got more curious. Medilan is Medical Grade lanolin which few people are sensitive to. I guess there are some people who are sensitive to lanolin. Link to comment
nobodyyoucare July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I got more curious. Medilan is Medical Grade lanolin which few people are sensitive to. I guess there are some people who are sensitive to lanolin. There are people who allergic to lanolin. Its most often misunderstood as a wool allergy. Some people are more sensitive to certain products containing lanolin while another product may not get a reaction at all.Medical grade just means its purified more. Due to wool sheep being outside critters their wool often soaks up contaminants such as pesticides.. Hence purification to remove these. Btw sheering a sheep is necessary for the health of the sheep if the breed produces wool. Not all sheep breeds produce wool. 1 Link to comment
Amarsir July 8, 2015 Share July 8, 2015 I think the lady is brilliant because she invented and sells a product that brings in a considerable amount of money whereas other companies needed Marcus to fund them. Well ...all that unsold inventory speaks otherwise. If you sell something for a gain, then spend that gain on more supply that just sits there, then your business is profitable but cash-flow negative. And if that inventory sits around so long that it expires or can never be sold, then you end up with a loss down the road, wiping out the earlier profit. Which is to say that I'm not sure it was an especially successful business. Certainly it's better than others, and she's more competent than many owners we've seen. But I'm not willing to sign off on her not needing Marcus. Marcus' comment about a product needed to 'solve a problem' sounded like a generalized mantra people just say....to sound like they know what they're talking about. A product does NOT have to solve a problem. It CAN do that -- if that's the kind of product it is. But it doesn't have to. To me -- he just sounded like he is out of his element in the cosmetics business. A product can also just make you feel a certain way because you like it and it appeals to you for whatever reason -- packaging, color, whatever. Does every. single. product he sells in Camping World "solve a problem?" I doubt it. And uh, what "problem" does a piece of candy or a cupcake "solve?" His comments about the makeup brushes just sounded ignorant, IMO. Candy solves the problem of hunger or cravings. I know what you're saying; it is overused to the point of cliche. But too many would-be inventors go "It's a dog leash that plays mp3s!" and then can't understand why no one buys it. So it's a way of focusing your ideas into an actual market. 1 Link to comment
attica July 9, 2015 Share July 9, 2015 Candy solves the problem of hunger or cravings. And cupcakes are an effective Frosting Delivery Device! 4 Link to comment
Process July 9, 2015 Share July 9, 2015 This was indeed a very different kind of episode. The drama was different as you had someone who had built a business that Lemonis values between $1.7M and $2.5M and was netting $400k/yr. It takes time to change by moving to a focused product line and getting rid of old habits. If I had built such a business and was looking at a new partner, I wouldn't hesitate to ask a question whether the guy thought I was interviewing him or not. The great thing about Lemonis' approach here is that it moves the owner away from decisions that result in waste and inventory. She gets out of manufacturing and can focus on the fun stuff where she can have greater positive impact. Even having a nicer office eliminates the opportunity to have a lot of junk around because she doesn't have the space. Her negotiations netted a slightly better deal (assuming that the existing $400k is correct which lessens the risk of a $50,000/yr payout) than Lemonis' first offer; however, in the end if he helps the company grow to more than twice its existing size (and that was just with Birchbox) then the difference is not meaningful in the long run. The pie grows so big that what you start with is less important. Change is hard and Miranda seemed to get through it ok. 1 Link to comment
Lola16 July 9, 2015 Share July 9, 2015 While I didn't love the new logo, I was happy that Marcus didn't make it some bright and obnoxious orange and blue and start franchising 1-800-LANO-LIP with an ugly mural on the side of the building Ha! To me, the new logo still looks like a swastika. I think they should have gone for a Greek key look with the Ls. I did agree that the branding needs to be more focused. I also think they can have multiple brands. One focused on Lanolin and another that's more trendy that feeds the profit margins. The issue with the boxes of inventory is that the husband stated that there were packaging errors and over orders. Donating them to charity is nice but better quality control and careful ordering is better. Link to comment
rehoboth July 9, 2015 Share July 9, 2015 I think this business is still left with some of the original problems. The business dynamic between the husband and wife was not a good one with the husband giving good advice about the mountain of unsellable product and the wife not listening to him. Because she was "excited" about the business. Will Marcus have to be on speed dial for all the times when the wife wants to do something the the husband disagrees? Does she still have a bigger percentage of the business than her husband? 1 Link to comment
selhars July 9, 2015 Share July 9, 2015 (edited) Candy solves the problem of hunger or cravings. So do an apple, or a banana.....although I'm the first to admit...not in QUITE the same way! Edited July 9, 2015 by selhars Link to comment
pbutler111 July 10, 2015 Share July 10, 2015 I have a lanolin sensitivity, so I always read the ingredients before trying any new products, particularly lotions and lip balms. Because I have to be hyper-aware of lanolin, I can say that the majority of lip balms and lotions contain lanolin. It's harder to find one without it than one with it. So I'm still not sure why making something with lanolin is supposed to be so awesome. Show me something effective without lanolin and I'll be all over it (or rather it'll be all over me -- heh!). 1 Link to comment
Tara Ariano July 10, 2015 Author Share July 10, 2015 In case you missed it: here's the Previously.TV post on the episode! Marcus Lemonis Meets Medical-Grade Lanolin / And John Ramos has some not-quite-burning questions about his attempt to streamline a cosmetics company's branding. Link to comment
ethalfrida July 10, 2015 Share July 10, 2015 I have a lanolin sensitivity, so I always read the ingredients before trying any new products, particularly lotions and lip balms. Because I have to be hyper-aware of lanolin, I can say that the majority of lip balms and lotions contain lanolin. It's harder to find one without it than one with it. So I'm still not sure why making something with lanolin is supposed to be so awesome. Show me something effective without lanolin and I'll be all over it (or rather it'll be all over me -- heh!). Those were my concerns also. I make moisturizing cosmetics and one of the first things I came across was that some people are sensitive to lanolin. So with her making a full product line with that ingredient has me concerned with people who do not read lables. My product is not on the market yet (just used by testers) but I am not going to include it in the commercial version... just for myself because it really adds to the healing properties. 1 Link to comment
pbutler111 July 10, 2015 Share July 10, 2015 Those were my concerns also. I make moisturizing cosmetics and one of the first things I came across was that some people are sensitive to lanolin. So with her making a full product line with that ingredient has me concerned with people who do not read lables. My product is not on the market yet (just used by testers) but I am not going to include it in the commercial version... just for myself because it really adds to the healing properties. Right. And using lanolin also cuts out your vegan customers (though I don't know if that's a significant part of the market or not). Link to comment
Kiss my mutt July 10, 2015 Share July 10, 2015 I can't use lanolin either. I don't know if it makes a difference that it is "medical grade" as they liked to point out incessantly. My husband and I started joking around calling things around the house medical grade. Like, this is really good medical grade ice cream. I thought their logo was bland. Maybe if they could tie it in with New Zealand sheep it might be sexier product. Not sure why deciding a product that only makes up 3% of sales is worth expanding but I guess that was her original vision and Marcus took her back to that. 1 Link to comment
Curious5 July 10, 2015 Share July 10, 2015 (edited) The wife had 51% and the husband 49%. They didn't say it but there are gov't benefits if a company is woman owner. Edited July 10, 2015 by Curious5 1 Link to comment
pbdist July 11, 2015 Share July 11, 2015 What was the name of the manufacturing plant in Long Island that Marcus used Link to comment
rehoboth July 11, 2015 Share July 11, 2015 I've already stated that it bothers me that she bought all that inventory because she was "excited" (her word and her husband's) and not because it was a good business decision. The second thing that bothers me is her "look". I know this sounds petty but the beauty business really is skin deep. Her tri-color hair looks terrible, at least on TV. I wished Marcus suggested, as the face of the business, she should visit a high end salon and listen to their advice. If I was QVC, I would never let her near their sets. Layne maybe. What was the name of the manufacturing plant in Long Island that Marcus used I think it was Rejuvenol. 1 Link to comment
Gregg247 July 12, 2015 Share July 12, 2015 I wished Marcus suggested, as the face of the business, she should visit a high end salon and listen to their advice. Maybe she could visit Unique Salon! Then again, maybe that wouldn't be such a good idea. :) 1 Link to comment
Shibori July 13, 2015 Share July 13, 2015 (edited) She had one of the worst cases of Resting Bitch Face I've ever seen. Made me wonder if that's the main reason I found her so unpleasant, or if she was just straight up unpleasant. Though there are some benefits to woman owned businesses (51% or more), they tend to be in terms of preference in government contracting (not likely to be relevant for these kinds of cosmetics) or small business loans, which wouldn't matter with Marcus's bankroll. That said, I thought it would play some part in the story when they brought it up, but was never mentioned again. Edited July 13, 2015 by Shibori 2 Link to comment
SyncMaster July 14, 2015 Share July 14, 2015 She had one of the worst cases of Resting Bitch Face I've ever seen. Made me wonder if that's the main reason I found her so unpleasant, or if she was just straight up unpleasant. Not only that but after repeatedly hearing the origin story of her lanolin-based lip care product I kept asking myself, "She had continuing problems with chapped lips? Her?" Her lips were so small that ongoing and severe issues with dryness seemed to be an unlikely problem for her. The way her itty bitty lips, when they were colorfully made up, stuck out--along with the rest of that face--gave her the appearance of being on the edge of cussing someone out about anything. Otherwise, I liked the entire episode including Marcus addressing the unlikely-to-be-used inventory. I also wondered about that lipstick with the mirror and the light. The light did seem to be too bright but I wanted to know how the light was powered--whether by battery or a solar cell--and if that required the top to be disposed in some special way. Link to comment
nobodyyoucare July 14, 2015 Share July 14, 2015 The light did seem to be too bright but I wanted to know how the light was powered--whether by battery or a solar cell Small leds can be by powered by a non replaceable batt (basically a high storage capacitor) meant to be tossed in the garbage. Usually two to three years of on and off use. Some led lights are meant to be used for only a 12-14 hour period then tossed into the garbage. Link to comment
JasminePhyllisia July 15, 2015 Share July 15, 2015 Interesting episode, the lanolin lip products made me think of my Nana and her Avon lip balms--full of lanolin. That smell! I thought Marcus was way off the mark with his comment about zebra stripes being a 1985 throwback. I guess he doesn't have kids, little girls or tween girls specifically. Animal prints are big for this demographic and have been for years. When they go to buy their first lipgloss at about age 12 they are likely to gravitate towards packaging or displays with zebra stripes. 1 Link to comment
ethalfrida July 15, 2015 Share July 15, 2015 This question just occured to me: how many lipstick wearers can put their lipstick on without mirrors? Link to comment
clod October 28, 2015 Share October 28, 2015 (edited) And I don't know why he got all bent when she wanted to hear what he told her employee. She was still majority owner and had a right to know. I agree. She was the biggest shareholder, and that was a business conversation. after the "listening" incident, it seemed like Marcus had an "Imperial" attitude. almost like he was wearing a "Don't you know who I am?" button. I guess that incident bothered him - but she was the largest shareholder in the company. he was not. when they met to make the deal, he acted like he didn't even want to say what he would change. iirc, he didn't tell them until after the deal. Imperial. So they took the mystery deal. Shook hands and did it. Then he says he is 100% in charge. (not even temporarily) It would have been really, REALLY AWESOME if they had looked at each other, then looked at Marcus. and said "No, you're not. That was not part of the deal. You're just a minority shareholder." :) How much coordination and cooperation was there? iirc, when they were in that big meeting with the buyers, the woman owner acted like she had not seen the labeling and packaging before. Edited October 28, 2015 by clod Link to comment
caligirl50 November 1, 2015 Share November 1, 2015 Marcus wanted to have a conversation with the employee that was honest and unbiased. He is an outsider and wanted to hear from the most senior employee in the company what her thoughts were. That's what I thought when watching. He's invested a lot of money into the company to save them/help them, why can't he talk to the employees and get some knowledge of the company from their perspective? Link to comment
clod November 2, 2015 Share November 2, 2015 didn't that convo happen before the deal? Link to comment
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