The Kelly File: Duggar Interview 2015.06.03

[Churchhoney]

It seems like their message is- fear men!! They cant controlled their urges. Even though they know what their doing is wrong they cant help themselves. Woman!!.... don't entice these creatures. Stay indoors untill you are old enough to be the sacraficial virgin and then your parents will give you away to control these heathens sexual appetite and the world will be safe from them.

 

This. And fear your little brother playing hide and go seek ....

 

I wonder what the hell they told the children about the reasoning behind this particular rule. Especially when they claim that at the time of the original incident the older girls (who ranged in age all the way up to 12 at the time, I think) didn't know what the "improper touches" were all about. (obvious bullshit, since in the police report it's clear that they did know, but anyway ... )

 

And what kind of message did it send to the other boys -- that they could not be alone with their sisters in any circumstance, even playing outdoors like a bunch of kids, because if they did they'd probably molest them? WTF? Just thinking about the messages, explicit and implicit, that they must have sent out to these kids is chilling .... It takes Gothard crap and actually ratchets it up a notch. And also kind of explains why they may have gotten more and more devoted to the crazy Gothard rules over time (although they should have gotten the message that those rules actually didn't work -- since they were pretty long-time devotees when their whole mess first happened.)

 

When it comes to psychological warping of those children, we're only seeing the very tip of this awful iceberg, I have a feeling.

[NextIteration]

Takes a whole nother' year to be offically a pedopile. Does anyone here know any legal info about that age 16 rule JB claims?

 

That heathen psychiatric and psychological book the DSM V - puts the criteria at 16 for medical and insurance purposes.  I'm sure that state statutes would define the age individually.

 

It's probably not worth mentioning, but there is are some distinctions in names of the disorder based on the age that the perpetrator seeks or (brain bleach) "desires".

[msblossom]

We have no way of knowing if Jill and Jessa are being coerced into doing this interview. Since they are the victims, I feel I must respect their decision to speak. As victims, only they can decide how they feel and what they want to say. I realize because of the way they were raised, and the things they are expected to say, people are assuming they're being forced into this, but we can't be sure of that.I hope this is their decision, I hope this isn't triggering a bunch of things for them, and I hope they're allowed to tell their own story without undue pressure from their parents or the public to react a certain way.

It sure is triggering for me -- that's why I couldn't stomach watching this knowing the Duggars would be making excuses for themselves and their son and not standing up for and protecting the victims. I guess for me, reading about everyone's outrage and anger at the perpetrator and their compassion for the victims is somewhat vindicating, if that makes any sense.

[MargeGunderson]

Things I learned from the interview:

 

• If molestation - sorry, "improper touching" - occurs while sleeping, it doesn't count.
• "Over the clothes" is a mitigating circumstance
• The first two times don't count if you really really mean that you are sorry
• The lesbian agenda is real

 

I sincerely doubt that the Duggars would have handled the situation the same if the perpetrator had been someone other than their own son (or someone else close to the family.). I do understand that it is a complicated and heartbreaking situation when it involves family (from personal experience), but when "mistakes" of that caliber are made, there are - and should be - consequences for the perpetrator and every effort should be made to protect those who have been impacted.

[Dawn16]

I was out of town all day yesterday and thankfully missed the interview, but I have read more than enough about what was said.  I would have thrown things at the television.  Right now, all I can say is it is extremely common for victims of sexual abuse to pretend to sleep through it.  They don't want to be awake. They may even convince themselves that they were asleep.  The thought that the parents of molestation survivors would state on television, for other victims and perpetrators to hear, that it was less bad because they were asleep makes me ill. 

Edited June 4, 2015 by Dawn16

[NJRach]

 

 

Because I think the Duggars might be in for a surprise. From the moment this story broke, and Josh Duggar wasted no time in releasing a statement and resigning his position, I've believed that one or more people from the FRC were responsible for outing Josh and getting him out of their employ fast. Fellow conservative Christians, that is. Not all those fake bogeymen the Duggars so easily accuse.

PAC groups know where the bodies are buried and how to exhume and expose them. Either somebody on FRCs staff resented an uneducated, poorly-skilled guy coming in as the Executive Director with a six-figure salary, at the expense of other much-more qualified no-name staffers....or coworkers had had enough of his pompous, know-it-all asshatterry...or higherups decided he was a true liability, but were afraid to fire him outright...it's my opinion that the Duggars should look under the rocks in their own backyard for their "betrayer."

 

I think this is spot on, and something I never even thought of.

 

And I just can't get the image of Joshie sneaking around at night, to commit his incestuous acts, out of my mind. It's so creepy. I picture him lying in his bed, waiting for everyone to be asleep, then getting up and slinking into his sisters' room. He is a very disturbed individual. And if Boob declares he is cured, he's a delusional dimwit.

Edited June 4, 2015 by NJRach

[Julia]

Well, that's not what I'd hoped for (I would have hoped Megyn Kelly would have called them on the obvious lies about the timeline and what actually took place and their minimizing the abuse - if Michelle's hypothetical transexual pedophile was post-operative and used the ladies' room with their daughter, that person wouldn't be able to "rape" her, so it wouldn't be that bad? Maybe they edited those questions out?) but it was better than I expected. 

 

I still live in hope that in the interviews on Friday they address the contradiction between the parents' insistence that the offense was minor and the girls weren't really harmed and the clear sense of victimization the girls feel, but I won't hold my breath.

 

And despite the fact that I dislike their world views, I'm going to enact the liberal agenda on the two victims who chose to speak out by refusing to deny them agency. Whether or not I believe they were carefully trained to feel that they should think of the family before their own violation, they do seem to feel that way, and it's not my place to tell survivors how to take their power back.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Julia

[NextIteration]

The Daily Beast weighs in on the interview.

[kathe5133]

I "watch TV" on line, so I wasn't able to watch in real time  I did log on here at 9:30 pm last night and things appeared as I expected they would.  I just started to watch the interview, but everyone here was right.  Denial, excuses, it just turned my stomach.  Bottom line?  They are idiots.  Pure and simple idiots.  Simple minded fools who are not capable of running their own lives so they are clinging to their religion to tell them how to live and act.  It's best they be forgotten.  I hope the show is over.  I hope the publics fascination with them is over.  I also hope that those who truly have no perspective or boundaries, find a new "cause" to champion.  Over the past weeks I have seen more websites detailing the "lies", providing facts about "who".  Time lines, not done by major publications (and honestly that gave me pause), but individuals with web access, and in my opinion, way too much free time.  They are determined to "bring the Duggars down".  They are down.  I hope these people won't lend "credence" to the Duggar claims of "persecution" by quite frankly persecuting them!  

 

I saw a small clip of the Friday show and Jill sobbing........  and I'm done.  I am truly done. Not with Previously TV, but done with the Duggar threads, interviews, sound bites, etc. and of course done with the show.  It's actually a peaceful feeling now that I've decided to "mark as read" and move on to other forums.   

[Cherrio]

What a ridiculous, softball interview.  The choice of FOX's Megyn Kelly for the first and only interview thus far was not a coincidence.

 

* I kept waiting for Jim Bob and Michelle to admit that the girls came to him in tears, seeking help with what Josh had done.  That never happened.  The prevailing fiction is that the girls were asleep and otherwise unaffected during all but two of the incidents.  They bent over backwards to frame Josh as a repentant, reluctant fellow victim.  It was around the 14-minute mark that I first wanted to put my fist through my television screen.

 

* We could have made an excellent drinking game of how many times either Jim Bob or Michelle uttered the words "over their clothes" or stressed Josh's tender age at the time of the incidents.  I'm sorry, but 14 or 15 is damn well old enough to know not to fondle your underage siblings' genitals.

 

* With any other interviewer, the Duggars would have been asked why their religious teachings tell them to basically lay some of the blame on the female victim(s) of sexual abuse.  I'd have paid $1,000 to see how they'd have responded to that question.

 

* Michelle needs an Oscar for her tearful performance at the 22-minute mark.  She was dabbing her eyes as if her life depended on it.

 

* I was sickened by Jim Bob and Michelle's focus on Josh as opposed to their daughters.  The tears and emotions only flowed when they were talking about their precious, fallen boy.

 

* I'm going to need to see some receipts for the visits the girls had with licensed, accredited counselors.

 

* Did anyone else consider the behind-the-scenes aspects of tonight's interview?  Just picture it: 25-year-old Jana and her younger sisters were upstairs, watching their siblings just like usual, while Jim Bob and Michelle sat downstairs, trying to keep the boat afloat.

 

* Megyn's factoid about how teens who touch children rarely re-offend was pretty transparently pro-Duggars.

 

* I'm slightly horrified that Jessa and Jill are being trotted out on Friday to share their recollections and feelings.  You know they'll toe the party line along with their parents.

 

* As angry as I am after watching the interview (and the rebroadcast airing now), I know enough to hold my breath for the real anger that's coming on Friday when I watch the girls' interview.

Your post is important.    It needs to be repeated and put out in the news that the report states a daughter went her to her parents upset and crying.  Second, as you wrote the blame lies entirely on the female, How many friggin times have we heard that come out of the Duggars mouths?

               Not only were these victims molested physically and emotionally by Josh, they were emotionally molested by their parents too.

[Patrizio]

Is there no picture of Josh Duggar where he is not doughy looking and unshaven? Why isn't he talking to the press? I'm no PR expert but it seems to me that the last thing I would want is the family associating themselves with the situation. I guess their egos are so out of control, that they felt compelled to do so. Personally, I would have just kept my mouth shut. I think they made a huge mistake going after the police chief, seems like they went off script on that one. I agree that whoever started this juggernaut was probably in that DC conservative PAC that Duggar worked for. I would be so mad if I worked there and had to see this moron making bank. Could also be from the church. I think that the show will probably go back on the air for a special or two, but I think the novelty of them is truly over. There will be calls to the conservative advertisers who stick with them, but, it will end when the numbers dwindle to such a low that it won,t be economically feasible to continue. TLC might be able to come up with a fresh new family angle, maybe a family of circus performers.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Patrizio

[Skittl1321]

 

 

I still live in hope that in the interviews on Friday the contradiction between the parents' insistence that the offense was minor and the girls weren't really harmed and the clear sense of victimization the girls feel, but I won't hold my breath.

If Jill and Jessa say anything other than "the media has victimized us", I will eat my socks.

 

They are crying over the liberal media exploiting their family and their pain.  There is no way I believe those tears are them crying over what happened to them, or that their parents have completely dismissed them to save their brother.

[mbutterfly]

Good grief, they even lost Ablow? That actually kind of gives me hope that their goose is well and truly cooked.

Is it conceivable that FOX -- obviously looking for quick feedback from their audience -- gave Ablow the go ahead to rebut much of what the Duggars said? 

[Cherrio]

I knew there had to be some kind of skeleton in this family's closet.

Just a matter of time

Sad

Maybe now some of them can get the hell out

And they won't have to wear snow suits to bed anymore.

[HumblePi]

Jim Bob said one single honest truth at the very beginning of this interview. He said "Twelve years ago we went through one of the most darkest times that our family has ever gone through."

 

That's it. After that first statement everything either he or Michelle described as far as what happened, when it happened, how many times it happened, and what they did about it was all smoke and mirrors. Michelle's low-tone almost kindergarten-teacher sounding voice just made everything worse because it didn't work to desensitize the whole molestation occurrences. The dabbing of her dry eyes and cracking voice didn't pull a smidgeon of sympathy out of me. When Jim Bob said "nothing like that ever happened like that again, in the girls bedroom. We had safeguards for that."  What safeguards Jim Bob? Did you make sure that the girls dead-bolted their bedroom door at night? Did you padlock the door from the outside? Did you put an alarm on Josh's pajamas that goes off once he tries to get out of bed? Tell us what those safeguards were.

 

I'm already cringing just thinking about the interview coming up tomorrow with Jessa and Jill. They're going to say that the public is being unreasonable and they feeling persecuted and judged by popular opinion in a very public way. They can't understand why people can't forgive and forget what Josh did to them because they have. They will vehemently support their brother and parents and not view their sexual abuse as it should be seen. There are families that are going through, or will go through, this same situation with their children. Demonstrating to those families that hiding and covering up for the perpetrator just to shield the victims is not going to help resolve a very serious problem. They can't see that. They only see how they're being held up in front of the public eye in a negative way and they're feeling that intense pressure and negative scrutiny. This family is accustomed to being idealized and venerated for their wholesomeness, not publicly shamed and criticized.

Edited June 4, 2015 by HumblePi

[Bean421]

 

* I'm going to need to see some receipts for the visits the girls had with licensed, accredited counselors.

 

This infuriates me! I personally know some youthful sex offenders and those treatment programs are no joke. They take, at a minimum, 18 months to complete. They require polygraph tests and hours of individual, group, and family therapy. Megyn wasn't wrong about the recidivism rate for youthful offenders, but she missed the catch....THEY HAVE TO GET PROPER EVALUATION AND TREATMENT!  No way Josh was able to pay for anything resembling that with pocket money.  Josh (and the victims) needed real help.  I've seen good parents who's kids have done terrible things, put aside their pride and get their families help even though it was incredibly painful. It's a shame that didn't happen in this situation.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Bean421

[Twopper]

Well, I can't imagine the  Duggars helped themselves, the show, or Josh with this performance.  And I am appalled that they are trotting out Jill and Jessa, but I guess I should withhold comment on that until I hear what they say.  Yet they don't trot out Josh?  So he's still hiding behind his parents.  I expected a line like "Fox reached out to Josh for an interview, but he declined."  Oh, well, and I did expect her to question the discrepancy between the report that Josh was reported to his parents rather than confessed.  Tender heart, indeed. And since the Oprah show was cancelled over this, you would think that they would realize that there was a good possibility the secret could come out again especially if you go on tv to show what a wonderful family you are.  Well, Michelle does talk about her husband as wonderful, but I don't recall her saying that about her children.

I just don't see an hour show about parents trying to protect their own image and that of their adult son (who is nowhere to be seen) doing them any favors or saving the show.

 

And what was it with their hair? Someone already commented about Michelle's hair, but it looked like JimBob had been given a close cut so it no longer resembled AquaNet helmet head hair.

 

I wish Megyn (stupid spelling, but I blame her parents for that) had asked how Joshie could afford to pay for his treatment. Don't the kids make about 2-3 cents per hour for their jurisdiction?

Edited June 4, 2015 by Twopper

[autumnh]

So let me get this straight..

 

If you put safeguards in place to protect females who enter your home from a potential sexual assault from your son that means everything is all good? Because you put safeguards in place?

 

That spoke so loudly to me as to their delusion...and really? I DETEST Fox News  and I was so disappointed that as a professional , supposed role model (not for me or anyone I know) and as a mother...Megyn Kelly even participated in this shit show...I think she has sold her soul as much as the Duggars and TLC has...when they say money talks, they aren't kidding. 

 

WOW.

Edited June 4, 2015 by autumnh

[MrsMommy]

They aren't going to sue anybody. All of the legal issues aside, they need for this to go away. A lawsuit will just keep it in the public eye for a longer time. Besides, Jim Bob and Michelle don't have standing to sue.

I think this whole thing was a huge, tone-deaf miscalculation on the part of Jim Bob, Michelle, and FOX. Jim Bob and Michelle aren't going to persuade anybody that Josh didn't do anything wrong or that they handled it well, and FOX is going to get a lot of backlash for their kid-gloves treatment. All they've succeeded in doing is adding flames to a fire that was showing some signs of dying down. I'm really surprised that they aren't getting better advice.

Actually they do. If someone leaked one of my children's records I'd sue the pants off that person! It's illegal!

[NEGirl]

Last night when I posted I was so mad I could scream. However, after watching CNN and Lawrence O'Donnell on MSNBC, I have to say Megyn Kelly gave JB and MeChelle the biggest rope to hang themselves I have ever seen. On both shows clip after clip of the interview were shown, then the police report was read highlighting the difference in Smuggars statements - highlighting lie and lie and this went on and on. The Psy. called the Smuggars " unfit parents" with a "a dangerous home", and stated in all likelyhood the victims probably were awake but pretended to be sleeping.  Without discusssing ages, they pointed out that some of the victims were not as young as the Smuggars made them out to be. They also stated they never took precautions to protect the babysitter.  All the Psy. brough up the fact that Josh's actions occurred numerous, numerous times, involved more than what Boob and MeChelle stated and that his children should be investigated to see if they have ever been improperly touched.

The attorneys on the show stated the police reports were not a court document, were not required to be sealed as the information was never forwarded to a Prosecutor for investigation and becoming part of a court record. The attorneys stated the police reports were legally released.  The attorneys indicated Smuggars had no chance of winning any lawsuit.  All in all it was a damning review  and Smuggars were given their chance and hung themselves big time.

 

The clip of Jill and Jessa was heartbreaking. I am happy they both have Derick and Ben as husbands because in their own way, I think both deeply love the girls and will hopefully help them heal.  I can only imagine how  Derick and Ben felt after hearing this.

 

*All the Psy took Megyn Kelly to task, stating her statement was untrue about molestuation being cured in 90% of young boys. 

Edited June 4, 2015 by NEGirl

[HumblePi]

Maybe it was Ms Kellys plan to go soft on them to get them to show their true colors. If she went for the jugular at the outset they would have shut down and/or bolted. She may have given the rope to hang themselves. Just saying.

I think that Megyn Kelly was clever in her interview. She asked the tough questions but she also gave them enough opportunities to destroy their credibility. People would have to be blind not to see the transparency of the manner in which they defended Josh and made the victims a lesser concern to them. Megyn Kelly really accomplished two things. She came out of the interview as a professional who really didn't pander to their idealizations of what happened and she was able to basically let both Michelle and Jim Bob show how desperate they are to minimize a very serious moral offense.

 

*edited because of the frequent repetitions of the idiom 'enough rope to hang themselves'  LOL!

Edited June 4, 2015 by HumblePi

[Julia]

Actually they do. If someone leaked one of my children's records I'd sue the pants off that person! It's illegal!

 

Ironic, isn't it? If the Duggars had taken the appropriate legal steps at the time, those records would have been sealed.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Julia

[CofCinci]

That heathen psychiatric and psychological book the DSM V - puts the criteria at 16 for medical and insurance purposes. I'm sure that state statutes would define the age individually.

It's probably not worth mentioning, but there is are some distinctions in names of the disorder based on the age that the perpetrator seeks or (brain bleach) "desires".

I'm a licensed mental health clinician and the first thing I did this morning when getting to my office was pull out my DSM-5. I have no clinical experience with work in paraphilic disorders (I'm with the VA and process combat and military sexual trauma all day) so I didn't know if JB was correct, which he was (to my dismay). I find myself really curious about how the Children's Safety Center would diagnose/bill Josh. Everyone gets a diagnosis otherwise the clinicians/agency do not receive reimbursement. Frotteuristic Disorder vs. Unspecified Paraphilic Disorder. Yeah, JB, your son isn't a pedophile. He's a paraphile.

[Churchhoney]

Is it conceivable that FOX -- obviously looking for quick feedback from their audience -- gave Ablow the go ahead to rebut much of what the Duggars said? 

 

Very interesting suggestion. I truly can't see why any network would want to look as if they were supporting all this. It's not as if JImBob and Michelle's  delusional rantings had anything to do with taking conservative political positions -- even if you define "conservative" as loosely as it's often defined today -- seems to me.

 

If Jill and Jessa say anything other than "the media has victimized us", I will eat my socks.

 

They are crying over the liberal media exploiting their family and their pain.  There is no way I believe those tears are them crying over what happened to them, or that their parents have completely dismissed them to save their brother.

 

I agree that this is what they probably think they're crying about. But I would also say that, an awful lot of the time, most of us don't actually know what we're really crying about -- especially while the crying happens. And I am pretty sure that goes double for people who've been living in a brainwashing setting AND have spent the last decade further obfuscating the truths about their lives by having to shape what they say and do to create certain images on reality tv.

[neural-plasticity]

Preface: I didn't watch the interview. Just read summaries and recaps and reactions here, but when I woke up this morning it was one of the first things I thought about.

I'm glad that JB and Michelle "claim" their kids got legitimate help. However, it's pretty obvious that if these kids actually got it (and as everyone else is saying, due to confidentiality rules in counseling we'll never be able to confirm), it still wouldn't have been until 2006. Good for them for taking them (allegedly), but it really shouldn't have taken them until they were mandated to do so (my theory for the fact that they waited this long was because if they did take them before, counselors are mandated reporters, and would have reported the molestations earlier).

My last thought: I am totally surprised (although I shouldn't be knowing the Duggars) that they are having Jill and Jessa speak out rather than Josh himself. It's disgusting. What else makes me sad about that situation is that, from what I'm reading, it sounds like they'll basically be echoing what their parents said. I'm actually really disappointed about that and will not be watching because it will probably make me sick. Instead of creating a platform against social media, the family had an opportunity to create a platform to speak out on child molestation. They could all say, yes we were victims of this and struggled with how to handle it. If the girls really did forgive Josh along the way, they could talk about the struggles of forgiveness they had, etc. There are sooooo many things they could do to reach out to others if they really wanted to be interviewed, but instead they're going to basically repeat what their parents already said.

I also don't really understand why these girls would be so upset at social media. Yes, they outed their brother, but after reading a lot of the posts, it seemed that they almost all steered clear of mentioning that he molested his sisters. The websites that did talk about that part (like this) seemed to be really respectful towards them and what they went through. Many of us have been victims of some form of sexual assault, so a lot of where we were coming from came from empathy, sympathy, or overall concern and love.

[Churchhoney]

This infuriates me! I personally know some youthful sex offenders and those treatment programs are no joke. They take, at a minimum, 18 months to complete. They require polygraph tests and hours of individual, group, and family therapy. Megyn wasn't wrong about the recidivism rate for youthful offenders, but she missed the catch....THEY HAVE TO GET PROPER EVALUATION AND TREATMENT!  No way Josh was able to pay for anything resembling that with pocket money.  Josh (and the victims) needed real help.  I've seen good parents who's kids have done terrible things, put aside their pride and get their families help even though it was incredibly painful. It's a shame that didn't happen in this situation.

 

Key phrase for why it didn't happen in this case: "good parents."

[CofCinci]

Gotta keep asking. Where's Josh?

Probably lounging by the Duggar's new pool while his wife or one of his sister-servants bring him tall, cool glasses on lemonade.

[CherryAmes]

Ironic, isn't it? If the Duggars had taken the appropriate legal steps at the time, those records would have been sealed.

 

My daughter and I were just talking about that.  Oh and also how the Duggars really do believe in the Big Lie.  You know, the kind where if you keep repeating something often enough not only do you convince yourself it's true but you think everyone else will believe it too.  Too bad for the Duggars that they were not just trying to spin to their fans last night but were also talking to people who don't think their family walks on water.

Edited June 4, 2015 by CherryAmes

[skippy]

Michelle said that one of the safeguards they put into place was "no sitting on the big boys' laps".

 

Does anyone have a tape of the last regular episode, "Digging in with the Duggars"?  Because I'm almost certain that toward the end, one of the little girls is sitting on Josh's lap.  I'm pretty sure it isn't Mackenzie because I remember thinking at the time that it was sweet. Of course that was before all this came out.  Now, it seems to me they may have put that little girl there on purpose, knowing the report was going to be released.

 

Does anyone remember this?

[Skittl1321]

 

I agree that this is what they probably think they're crying about. But I would also say that, an awful lot of the time, most of us don't actually know what we're really crying about -- especially while the crying happens. And I am pretty sure that goes double for people who've been living in a brainwashing setting AND have spent the last decade further obfuscating the truths about their lives by having to shape what they say and do to create certain images on reality tv.

 

Oh, I'm not dismissing their experience or their feelings. Possibly, they have forgiven and moved on, maybe they haven't and it haunts them daily. Possibly they won't even be able to process what has really happened, both in the initial incident, or with this public reminder of it, until they are old women. 

 

But I think the tears we see are going to be about "the leaked report" and "the media".

And not about how they were hurt by their family member, let down by their parents, and generally exploited and abused.

 

I think they are doing the interview as shills of the family. Two more people to protect the golden child.

[NextIteration]

I'm a licensed mental health clinician and the first thing I did this morning when getting to my office was pull out my DSM-5. I have no clinical experience with work in paraphilic disorders (I'm with the VA and process combat and military sexual trauma all day) so I didn't know if JB was correct, which he was (to my dismay). I find myself really curious about how the Children's Safety Center would diagnose/bill Josh. Everyone gets a diagnosis otherwise the clinicians/agency do not receive reimbursement. Frotteuristic Disorder vs. Unspecified Paraphilic Disorder. Yeah, JB, your son isn't a pedophile. He's a paraphile.

 

I think the PR team fed him this little bit of "truth" to cover his and Josh's ass.

[Churchhoney]

Oh, I'm not dismissing their experience or their feelings. Possibly, they have forgiven and moved on, maybe they haven't and it haunts them daily. Possibly they won't even be able to process what has really happened, both in the initial incident, or with this public reminder of it, until they are old women. 

 

But I think the tears we see are going to be about "the leaked report" and "the media".

And not about how they were hurt by their family member, let down by their parents, and generally exploited and abused.

 

I think they are doing the interview as shills of the family. Two more people to protect the golden child.

ITA.

[RedheadZombie]

1. Parents aren't mandated reporters. So of course we can handle it. Because our son felt REALLY REALLY bad. He cried, yall. CRIED. Every single time he did it. He came to us and cried. TEARS. So he felt really bad. Like, bad enough to keep doing it. But at least he felt bad. Bad enough to stop doing it? Ehhh...#DuggarLogic

 

 

According to an attorney on CNN this morning, foster parents are mandated reporters in Arkansas.  Why in the world are foster parents held to a higher standard than parents?  Maybe that should be looked into.

 

They also had a psychiatrist (I think a child psychiatrist) who stated that "counselor" is a meaningless term, and wondered about the qualifications of the person who treated Josh.  She also said a therapist who isn't qualified to treat a child with oppositional tendencies could actually make the situation worse.

[MissMally]

Chad Gallagher has to be the Lionel Hutz of PR people then. This has been a complete gong show from the start. The public has the records with the names redacted and knows what happened due to the police report. Why make up stuff?

The Jill and Jessa interview is a last ditch attempt at saving the Duggar money train. There has been talk of a spin off with Jill and Jessa and this is to warm the public up to it.

Edited June 4, 2015 by MissMally

[Realitymom]

Michelle says there is an "agenda". If they don't realize how cray that sounds coming from them, they are even dumber than I already assumed. Wow. I can't even.

[CherryAmes]

I've got the CBC news network on TV right now and what is scrolling along the bottom is the gist of what CBC got out of the Duggar interview last night "Duggars tell Fox TV that their son molested 4 sisters".  Yeah, good job trying to shift the blame and take on the mantle of victimhood Jim Bob and Michelle.  The takeaway soundbite from your interview that is out there for anyone who is not following this story closely is that your son abused your daughters not that evil godless liberals are playing gotcha with your family. 

Edited June 4, 2015 by CherryAmes

[CofCinci]

According to an attorney on CNN this morning, foster parents are mandated reporters in Arkansas. Why in the world are foster parents held to a higher standard than parents? Maybe that should be looked into.

Because foster parents are paid. It's a job. In Ohio where I practice, foster parents can be paid from $9-$118 per day.

They also had a psychiatrist (I think a child psychiatrist) who stated that "counselor" is a meaningless term, and wondered about the qualifications of the person who treated Josh. She also said a therapist who isn't qualified to treat a child with oppositional tendencies could actually make the situation worse.

Michelle mentioned the Children's Safety Center. I looked at their annual report. This is not a religious organization. Their clinical therapists (clinical social workers and licensed professional counsellors, advance practice nurses) are licensed by Arkansas.

[fliptopbox]

After seeing last night's mess of an interview I'm not really looking forward to watching Jill blubber her way through tomorrow's spectacle while Jessa sneers and sayss that since they *forgave* Josh for the molestations (I refuse to call it inappropriate touch because it is soooo much more than that) 12yrs ago why is anyone bringing it up? So we trot out molestation victims to cover for their deviant brother (while one is pregnant, the other just had her first, and both are newly married) to get a Duggar appropriate soundbyte to try and save their show. All the while JB and M are saying things like "well it wasn't rape or anything" and "it was over clothes, and about 5 seconds.." as if those justifications make it ok. Especially for the 5yr old, who supposedly had no idea what was happening was wrong. Again...ok.

 

I want to hear from the 5th girl. The non-Duggar. She doesn't have to reveal her real name, she could do an interview and still remain anonymous....but I'd like to hear the account of someone not under JB's influence. Then see what happens. We know Jessa and Jill are going to be coached and told they need to protect Josh, and by extension the whole family. But the non-relative does not have that burden. I would love to hear her account of what was happening during that time period, because obviously if she was babysitting she had more than just casual ties to the Duggars. Chances are she and her family were around for the church confession and lord only knows what else actually went on.

 

I would also like to hear from Josh himself. He's an adult, there's no need for him to hide under mommy's skirt anymore. Hell, he's even a father to 3 (4? not sure if the new one has been born.. ) including a little girl. That would make me nervous, if I was Anna. I would love to hear Josh justifying sneaking into his sisters' room and groping them over or under their clothes. And why a 5yr old? If he wasn't at least mildly pedophilic one would reason that touching a preschooler's genitals would never even occur to him. Nevermind that it was one of his sisters. Yuck. I think I need to wash my hands in bleach for even typing this.

[Skittl1321]

According to an attorney on CNN this morning, foster parents are mandated reporters in Arkansas.  Why in the world are foster parents held to a higher standard than parents?  Maybe that should be looked into.

 

Because foster parents are caring for OTHER people's children (and children who are already vulnerable).  And because there are qualifications to become a foster parent.  Any idiot can become a parent.

 

 

(In Arkansas clergy ARE mandatory reporters. Josh was said to confess this in front of his church. Which means a mandatory reporter did NOT report.)

Edited June 4, 2015 by Skittl1321

[Julia]

Michelle mentioned the Children's Safety Center. I looked at their annual report. This is not a religious organization. Their clinical therapists (clinical social workers and licensed professional counsellors, advance practice nurses) are licensed by Arkansas.

 

She also apparently referred to Josh's construction job as counseling, so while the Children's Safety Center may have been involved, we have no way of knowing in what capacity, and they obviously can't tell.

 

Strictly speaking, that young woman who speaks to schools could be said to have counseled the children about child sexual abuse. Which would explain a fair amount...

[NextIteration]

(In Arkansas clergy ARE mandatory reporters. Josh was said to confess this in front of his church. Which means a mandatory reporter did NOT report.)

 

I think this is because the confessions were in the church of the blackened window storage building.   No ordained clergy in attendance.

 

This could be me being overgenerous, but I suspect it's the case.

[Dawn16]

Because foster parents are caring for OTHER people's children (and children who are already vulnerable).  And because there are qualifications to become a foster parent.  Any idiot can become a parent.

 

 

(In Arkansas clergy ARE mandatory reporters. Josh was said to confess this in front of his church. Which means a mandatory reporter did NOT report.)

Also, although parents are not mandated reporters, they can lose custody of their children if they know they are being harmed and fail to protect them. 

[fliptopbox]

Well we already know M doesn't actively parent any of her kids past infancy so I am a bit surprised no blame is being put on their bullshit "buddy system" for failing to protect each other. You know, just to make the daughters feel more guilt about an already terrible situation.

[quarks]

To be clear, I've never seen the show, and I caught only clips of the interview. Just from those, Michelle struck me as someone with major issues, and Jim Bob struck me as a parent who had been totally overwhelmed and not sure what, exactly, he should do, which I find understandable - it was a very difficult situation. And had things ended there, everyone in the family would have had my full sympathies. 

 

But things didn't end there. Michelle and Jim Bob, knowing what happened, put their entire family on television. They wrote books.  They did magazine interviews. They invited media attention. Knowing, based just on their version of events, that several people knew about Josh, meaning that there was an excellent chance that this would all come up again. They claimed not just that transgender people would prey on people, but that people would try to pretend to be transgender in order to prey on little kids in public bathrooms, when the one person they knew had inappropriately touched their daughters, to use their words, is a married, straight man who, whatever else can be said about him, has never been accused of pretending to be transgender in order to access kids in public bathrooms.  

 

Having said all this:

 

After sleeping on things, in the spirit of Christian charity, I've decided that I'm willing to forgive the Duggar parents as long as they fully and completely forgive In Touch, whoever told In Touch, Oprah, and the U.S. media, recognizing that all of these people were only doing what they, too, thought best at the time or would sell zines, which is their job. 

 

And then stop exploiting their kids on television. 

[Ljohnson1987]

J'Chelle and Boob are just sorry that this came out. Their perfect facade is cracked.

[JoanArc]

If I were the Duggars, I'd be nervous that the fifth victim will come forward and torch their narrative. Someone totally out of Jim Bob's control, who won't take hush money. I don't feel this person is obligated to do ANYTHING, but after the Jill and Jessa defense of Josh, they may find not ALL of the victims don't feel liek victims.

[Kcat1971]

I want to hear from the 5th girl. The non-Duggar. She doesn't have to reveal her real name, she could do an interview and still remain anonymous....but I'd like to hear the account of someone not under JB's influence. Then see what happens. 

 

I don't necessarily disagree with the sentiment of your post, except why do we need to hear from the 5th girl.  She gave her account to the police.  And frankly, it was the least damning of all the reports.  She and her family specifically treated it as not a big deal and they didn't want the police to make more out of it than it was.

 

Unless she's going to come forward and change her story to say it was a big deal, why would she want to come forward?  If she comes forward and says the same thing as listed in the police report she will get ripped to shreds as a "kool-aid drinker", people will say she's been brain-washed to feel that its not a big deal, people will say that she's just another cult member protecting Josh. And if she does change her story there is a whole different group of people that will call her a liar. Either she's lying now or she was lying then.  Which is it?

 

I can't see any reason why the 5th girl would want to come forward.  (O.k. I take that back- maybe for financial reasons- a tell all interview/book would potentially make a lot of money.) Of course I'd like to hear an independent account but for her sake I hope she either stays quiet or makes a lot of money for her trouble.

 

Edited to add: If the 5th girl would say the same thing as in the police report it would actually be to the Duggars benefit because that narrative fits with their "no big deal" spiel.  I'd think they'd want to try to get her to repeat what they said but I really hope no one pressures her to do it.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Kcat1971

[Janet Snakehole]

It seems like their message is- fear men!! They cant controlled their urges. Even though they know what their doing is wrong they cant help themselves. Woman!!.... don't entice these creatures. Stay indoors untill you are old enough to be the sacraficial virgin and then your parents will give you away to control these heathens sexual appetite and the world will be safe from them.

Fear men, but give them all the power and make them the headship in your family, and if they ever do anything wrong, they don't have to be held completely accountable!

The patriarchy is a hell of a drug.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Janet Snakehole

[Lemur]

She wasn't a female judge.  She was the police chief.  Releasing the report was illegal. The law is crystal clear in Arkansas.  Sealed juvenile records are exempt from the FOIA without an order from a judge.  She did not have that.    It is claimed she consulted an attorney before she released it.  In that case the attorney should be disbarred.  As a parent of a child who had a juvenile record, I am appalled at what happened.  My child is not the same person he was then.  I thought Megyn's statistics about recidivism were interesting.  And I will state again that I believe those victims had come to terms with what happened and are being victimized yet again.  I share the opinion that most parents would have tried to handle such a situation by themselves.  Not unusual at all. 

 

I would suggest you consult the Arkansas FOI Handbook before making such sweeping statements  (available here for your edification: http://www.arkansaspress.org/publications/38-foi-handbook). Specifically on page 38:

 

Q. Must the contents of a State Police investigation be disclosed to the news media after the investigation is closed, is not continuing, and is not part of a larger

investigation?

 

A. Yes. Opinion No. 90-305.

 

And on page 25:

 

Q. What records are exempt from disclosure?

 

A. . The FOIA lists 20 specific exemptions, plus a catch all exemption that incorporates the confidentiality provisions of other statutes. If a public record does not fall squarely within an exemption, it must be disclosed.  Exemptions must be narrowly construed. Unclear or ambiguous exemptions will be interpreted in a manner favoring disclosure. At the same time, the court will balance the interests between disclosure and nondisclosure using a common-sense approach. ADFA v. Pharmacy Assoc., 333 Ark. 451, 970 S.W.2d 217 (1998). If a record contains both exempt and nonexempt information, it must be made available for public inspection with the exempt material deleted or redacted.

 

For one thing, a police report is not a police record or criminal record much less a juvenile one. Police reports do not fall under the exemptions for juveniles (Judicial proceedings involving juveniles and Confidentiality of juvenile records).  Josh's petition to have the investigation closed *is* covered as it's a judicial proceeding involving juveniles.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Lemur

[Cherrio]

Where's Josh / Where's Waldo - Similar?

I expect him to start showing up in Hidden Object games.