General True Crime Shows

[KellsBells]

The latest A Crime To Remember was about a triple murder that took place during Easter Weekend in 1937, and that received a lot of press because one of the victims was a 20 year old women who posed for "true crime" magazines.

 

It was well done, but I wish they wouldn't use cases that old.  The case isn't beyond living memory, but there aren't many people alive today who could have an adult memory of the case or or life in 1937.  In short, there aren't many people alive today from my grandparents' generation (none of my grandparents are).  I prefer cases from my parents' generation.  Even if my mother doesn't remember a particular case, I can at least get her perspective on the times.

 

I also thought that was a pretty old story, although interesting in that I hadn't heard of it before. I found it particularly interesting how involved her publication got in solving the crime, that was pretty cool. But it doesn't seem to go along with the general theme of crimes that are still well-known even today. It was sort of random. 

[auntjess]

I wonder if they'll just do US crimes, because a lot of the older famous crimes, are English.
They could do Anne Perry, too.

[Maizie131]

Did anyone watch the new Serial Thriller last night?  I DVR'd it but was kind of hoping you guys would give your opinions & I wouldn't have to waste my time if it sucked.  I think this is the same company that did that awful rehash of Ted Bundy a few months ago, which is why I really didn't wanna bother to watch it. 

[Brattinella]

Yes I watched it.  It was quite a bit better than the Bundy one.  The actor playing the bad guy was horrifically scary, and the women I just wanted to slap across the face and say WAKE UP!  I got so interested in this case, I looked it up.  Stephen Peter Morin. 

[walnutqueen]

I watched it, too, but I can't wholeheartedly recommend it.  It was a bit better than the awful Bundy movie, for sure, and the bad guy is very creepy.  But serialized fiction is just not ID's forte.  Guess I'll DVR the last episode, just to see how it all shakes out. 

 

FYI - ID is airing all 3 episodes twice tonight.

[friendperidot]

Never cared much for Snapped, my mom used to have it on, but I usually skipped past it. But now that I don't have satellite and Escape is the only true crime channel I have, I've had it on several times. And now I've realized one of the reasons I don't like it, the narrator, she has such a flat affect, no highs/no lows in her narration. She's boring to listen to. And the stories are all about the same, nice, good woman, everyone likes her, gets married, has perfect family and then something happens and she kills her husband/family. Boring stories, boring narration.

[Maizie131]

Greatly appreciate your opinions...I decided to watch but couldn't make through it more than 15 minutes before deleting.

 

Thank you, walnutqueen & Brattinella, but I'm just gonna Google Brattinella's suggestion (of the "perp") & be done with it.  However, I have to agree with walnutqueen's opinion that "serialized fiction is just not ID's forte."  Couldn't have said it better myself.  I'm done w/that shit.  Thanks to you, both, for freeing up 3 hours of my life!  (And maybe...just maybe...I'll go organize my horribly disorganized linen/hall closet!!  Ha!)

[Brattinella]

Be prepared; he was all that and more.  A VERY bad man.  He was executed for 3 murders, but a suspect in 30 more.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

 

The latest A Crime To Remember was about a triple murder that took place during Easter Weekend in 1937, and that received a lot of press because one of the victims was a 20 year old women who posed for "true crime" magazines.

It was well done, but I wish they wouldn't use cases that old.  The case isn't beyond living memory, but there aren't many people alive today who could have an adult memory of the case or or life in 1937.  In short, there aren't many people alive today from my grandparents' generation (none of my grandparents are).  I prefer cases from my parents' generation.  Even if my mother doesn't remember a particular case, I can at least get her perspective on the times.

I not only had heard of this case, I read a book about it:

http://ww.amazon.com/Mad-Sculptor-Maniac-Murder-Nation/dp/0544114310/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

 

written by Professor Harold Schechter, author of many true-crime books and one of the talking heads in the episode.  A number of the cases they've done have had books written about them, probably one of their criteria for choosing their cases.  I liked how the episode showed kind of a constant in how media folks decide whether or not  a crime makes the news - in this case, the victim was a pretty girl who had posed for hundreds of revealing photos, all of which ended up in the New York tabloids.  Some things never change.  

They can do as many older cases as they want for my taste as long as they have that kind of  historical background available to them from professional researchers - I like how this show uses so many writers as sources - writers who've often spent years  researching the case.

[applecrisp]

The next one is the Sheppard case and then another one set in the thirties.  I also enjoy the older ones and the thirties is fertile ground has anyone read The Poisoner's Handbook or seen the PBS show on American Experience?  Just fascinating.

[Fraoch]

That was a great episode of American Experience! (And I think it's on Netflix now.) My husband was watching it recently and I got completely sucked in despite myself.

I'm curious to see how the Sheppard case is covered -- is this the first crime covered on the show that has pop culture ties (i.e., inspired a popular TV series and then a movie decades later)?

Edited December 12, 2015 by Fraoch

[ratgirlagogo]

The Roseanne Quinn murder for sure - the Looking for Mr Goodbar case.  The Kitty Genovese case also in the sense that it was referenced in so many things later on.

[Constantinople]

Joan Didion's essay "Some Dreamers of the Golden Dream" was about the crime that was the subject of Accident on Banyan Street in Season 2.

[auntjess]

A real-life mystery, currently unsolved.
Thought I'd pass it on to my buddies here.https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/12/15/the-strange-sad-quest-to-match-a-severed-embalmed-head-with-its-body/?hpid=hp_no-name_morning-mix-story-a-duplicate%3Ahomepage%2Fstory
 

[Maizie131]

Really enjoyed A Crime To Remember re: Sam Shepard.  Neat clips of F. Lee Bailey.  I didn't realize he'd only been a lawyer for a year before he defended Shepard.  Wow - way to start a career.  Also, introduction of "forensics," which apparently very few people had heard of prior to this case.  Interesting!

[Fraoch]

The potential jurors' photos and *home addresses* being in the newspaper -- OMG! Just insane. Very interesting episode all around!

[ratgirlagogo]

 

The potential jurors' photos and *home addresses* being in the newspaper -- OMG! Just insane.

That was pretty shocking.  It's hard to believe that not only was it allowed, but that it took an appeal to the Supreme Court to prevent it happening again. And yes, that it was one of F. Lee Bailey's first cases!  I didn't know that either.  And again I love how ACTR so often chooses cases that ended up having a larger legal or cultural influence.  Everyone knows about The Fugitive but I didn't know that this was the case that focused attention on invasive press coverage making a fair trial difficult or impossible.  Just as I didn't know that it was the Charles Whitman shootings that led to the establishment of mobile emergency medical services.

 

Also I hadn't realized that this was yet another case in which the oddness of the defendant worked strongly against him, in this case his eccentric way of expressing himself - he saw a "light-topped bipedal form" on the staircase????!!!!  

Edited December 17, 2015 by ratgirlagogo

[roamyn]

Did they talk abt Eberling? Or Paul Kirk the famous forensic scientist? Or Marilyn's affair with Spenser Houk (former Bay Village mayor)?

There are still many older people in Cleveland who believe he did it, and that Louis Seltzer was a god. To the day he died, I don't think Seltzer ever showed remorse.

My grandfather died at Bay View Hospital where Shepherd worked. It's an old turn of the century mansion on Lake Erie that is now luxury condos.

Sadly for forensics, the Shepherd house was torn down abt 15 yrs ago because it was in bad shape. People in Bay would never confirm where the house was. But one day driving down Lake, my mother pointed it out.

Edited December 18, 2015 by roamyn

[ratgirlagogo]

Yes, they had a long sequence on Paul Kirk and the bloodstain/splatter work.  Also ended the show suggesting that Richard Eberling was almost certainly the killer, but that the cops never bothered with trying to prove it - first because when they interviewed him in the late fifties Sheppard had already been convicted, and later in the 90's because Sheppard had already died.  Nothing about Marilyn having affairs with anyone, just about Sam having affairs at the hospital.

Edited December 18, 2015 by ratgirlagogo

[Maizie131]

Yes, they had a long sequence on Paul Kirk and the bloodstain/splatter work.  Also ended the show suggesting that Richard Eberling was almost certainly the killer, but that the cops never bothered with trying to prove it - first because when they interviewed him in the late fifties Sheppard had already been convicted, and later in the 90's because Sheppard had already died.  Nothing about Marilyn having affairs with anyone, just about Sam having affairs at the hospital.

Yep...the "press" most definitely crucified Shepard by citing his extramarital affairs, but never mentioned hers.  He was an odd duck, to be sure - but in my opinion...and based on the "forensics" (!)...I've no doubt he was innocent.  Acquittal was the only way to go. 

[NewDigs]

Bolding mine

Yep...the "press" most definitely crucified Shepard by citing his extramarital affairs, but never mentioned hers. He was an odd duck, to be sure - but in my opinion...and based on the "forensics" (!)...I've no doubt he was innocent. Acquittal was the only way to go.

And forensic evidence is coming increasingly under attack

That NYTimes article is just one of many.

How many innocents were railroaded by overzealous prosecutors? Sad and extremely troubling.

Thanks! FBI...

edit: "over zealous" is one word.

Edited December 18, 2015 by NewDigs

[roamyn]

My 2nd cousin's murder case will be on Paula Zahn on 12/27.

Originally we were told November, but due to production delays, it got pushed back.

[Maizie131]

Why oh why did I turn on ID channel while wrapping Christmas presents?  WTF was I thinking?!  Reruns of (in my opinion) one of the scariest shows on that channel, My Worst Nighmare, were on.  Holy shit - I know much of the show leading up to actual murder(s) is supposition/acting, but boy it sure gets my heart pounding.  The murders as depicted are true, and in some cases even worse (after reading on the internet).  Absolutely horrific!  There's a new ep. @ 10:00 tonight & I'm just about done wrapping, so what the hell -- what's another little temporary spike in my blood pressure? 

 

P.S.  Promise tomorrow I'll turn off the frickin' TV & listen to NOTHING but beautiful Christmas music all day long while I'm cleaning getting ready for company!

 

P.P.S.  Merry Christmas, my wonderful fellow PTV-ers!  Over the past year since I found this website, there have been so many times you made me laugh my ass off until I cried.  Thank you all so much!  I wish the VERY best in the coming year to each & every one of you!  (And that's no bullshit!)

 

Sincerely,

 

Maizie's Mom

[Fable]

I was just watching some ID reruns on Youtube to fill up my winter hiatus from shows, and came across Cry Wolfe.   This show seems completely staged, at least the first episode which is probably as far as I'll ever get, and if not, Wolfe is the worst kind of amateur. 

 

First of all, you don't announce that you are pretty sure the husband is cheating until you know for sure and then ask the spouse to sit tight until you can get proof.  Then said wife shows up and exposes herself as a cheater all while trying to catch cheating husband, who PI suspected was innocent all along!  Good Grief!  

 

Obviously the husband was cheating.  He would barely speak to his wife for months and yet is trying to plan their 10th anniversary with her best friend…of course!  In 10 years of marriage, he has never bought her lingerie, but now he is having some shipped as a surprise for her to her best friend, and if you could even buy that, why in the hell is he sending her flowers and arranging a dinner date.  No way!  

 

Like I said, I think this was a farce of a story, and not even halfway convincing!   If this guy is a real PI, he needs to go back to his factory job or whatever he was doing before!

Edited December 28, 2015 by Fable

[Maizie131]

My 2nd cousin's murder case will be on Paula Zahn on 12/27.

Originally we were told November, but due to production delays, it got pushed back.

roamyn - I just watched Paula Zahn featuring your cousin's murder case.  I'm very sorry for your loss.

[applecrisp]

I really like this site too.  I am so glad the christmas frenzy is over.  Roamyn. do you know when this will re-air?  I forgot to record.

 

I looked for the shows coming up and was happy to see 2016 pop up.  I know it is new. I am looking forward to Vanity Fair Confidential because I used to get the magazine and they do dig deep into their stories.  Also like Murder Comes to Town, I like the small town stories a lot.

 

Still enjoying A Crime to Remember and Fatal Vows.  Bad Blood has proved to me it has some good stories.  Murder really does leave so many victims, collateral damage.  I would love a show about the many innocence projects out there.  The stories need to be told.

 

IT is a new year so there is some hope that it can be a good one.

Edited December 28, 2015 by applecrisp

[roamyn]

roamyn - I just watched Paula Zahn featuring your cousin's murder case. I'm very sorry for your loss.

Thank you.

I didn't know Shannon. I only met Bob once or twice. Caroline - Shannon's grandmother - I no very well and keep in regular contact with her. There was actually more evidence, and another witness, than was shown.h

Even tho I didn't know Shannon, it's still family. It's a confused feeling watching this, knowing the people. Especially abt the condition her body was in, even tho I already knew.

Bob seems more mellowed since I've last seen him (which was in the 80s). I'm very glad he did not find her, which apparently he is too.

Oddly this is not the only family tragedy (same side). Very distant cousins had a child disappear in the 20s. Almost assuredly abducted. What's odd, is that pictures of Melvin resemble my grandfather, who was a few years older than Melvin.

I'm sorry applecrisp, I don't know when it will re-air.

Edited December 29, 2015 by roamyn

[Fraoch]

I had never heard of the case profiled on A Crime to Remember last night -- so bizarre!! That poor girl.

[ratgirlagogo]

And slutshamed even after the football hero MURDERED her.  Again we see how some things never change.  

 

And today she's the Vengeful Ghost who haunts the high school:

http://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/a-kiss-before-dying/

Edited January 1, 2016 by ratgirlagogo

[Andyourlittledog2]

Just watched Forbidden Love and holy crap the boy's mom was a romantic idiot.  She kept rhapsodizing about their great love, they were soulmates, tehy were each other's light, etc. She couldn't keep them apart even though her son's very life was threatened because tru wuv etc. I kept wanting to punch her in the throat. All they were waiting for was to graduate high school and turn eighteen so they could run away and get married and their love would last forever etc. When teenagers fall in love it's usually for a time and then they grow up and get lives etc. I was planning for my teenage son to go to college not encouraging him to run away and marry his young girlfriend. This boy's mom acted as if her son was a grown man and ready for a forever marriage at eighteen.  She was soooooooo stupid. 

 

The case itself I've seen several times including America's Most Wanted so it was not a shock to me. Oh, and the girl's mom married her older psycho Egyptian husband when she was fifteen even though she was an American from Kansas or something at the time. I don't know how they met or why in hell her parents let that happen but she was a real doormat (as she had to be married to Mr control Freak) and even though she broke free to save her daughter's life at first, she took her back to the asshole knowing he was set on killing the girl. She know who he was and what he would do but she gave her daughter over to him anyway.  

 

All in all an episode of extraordinary parental FAIL.  

 

Glad some of my favorites are coming back this month. It's been an ID desert lately. 

[auntjess]

Glad to read about Forbidden Love.  I recorded it because there was no description, but reading this, I know it's not for me.
I like to come here and let someone else make the sacrifice of watching some of this crap.

 

And now, here's an article on all the Discovery channels, which I found no topic for, but as it talks some about ID, I'll post it here.https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/life-after-honey-boo-boo-inside-discoverys-fight-to-grow-up/2016/01/01/df53888c-99cd-11e5-94f0-9eeaff906ef3_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_discovery-833pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory
 

Edited January 2, 2016 by auntjess

[grumpypanda]

I watched Forbidden Love also but I didn't have a problem with Joseph's mom. She wasn't encouraging her son to drop out of school and marry Amenia and I don't think she did anything wrong. Joseph loved her and was going to be with her with or without his mother's blessing.

Anyway, I kept waiting for the announcement that Joseph committed suicide and I'm relieved that he's still alive. This story is such a tragedy all around and it disgusts me that the monster that killed those two girls is walking free. His wife should also be in jail.

I've never heard of this story so I looked it up after I watched this show and they left out a lot of important information. I realize that a one hour show can't cover everything but I don't think this show did Amenia and Sarah justice. I saw that a documentary was recently made so I'm going to check it out.

Edited January 2, 2016 by grumpypanda

[punkypower]

Y'all!!

Tomorrow night at 8pm central, Lifetime is premiering a Snapped episode on Brynn Hartman!!

Edited to add:

http://www.oxygen.com/snapped/season-16/episode-9/videos/snapped-sneak-peek-1609-brynn-hartman-part-1

http://www.oxygen.com/snapped/season-16/episode-9/videos/snapped-sneak-peek-1609-brynn-hartman-part-2

Edited January 2, 2016 by punkypower

[tobeannounced]

I've caught up on the last couple episodes of A Crime to Remember.  I haven't really been enjoying it this season like I did last season.  The one about the woman who killed her husband seemed so draggy and slow.  The only thing that caught my eye was her husband and the prostitute in a 69 position in bed.  Sweet baby Jesus!  I've never even seen that on any of ID's most ridiculously sex-soaked series.  I was so scandalized that I had to rewind and watch a couple of times to make sure of what I was seeing - lol.

 

Anyway, the one about the Texas teens was a lot more engrossing.  That girl was ahead of her time.  I think the thing this series has taught me is that there's nothing new under the sun.  I always think of the first half of the 20th century as being so innocent and pristine, but I guess that's because I've mostly seen it in a sanitized TV version. Humans have been struggling with the same things since the dawn of time.

[ratgirlagogo]

TEENAGE prostitute at that.  I wonder if the husband kept his socks on the way all the guys in those old pornos from the 20s and 30s did.

Edited January 3, 2016 by ratgirlagogo

[Brattinella]

Paula Zahn is such a sick bitch.  She gets so much pleasure from asking things like: "So, are you aware of how much your sister suffered while she was being murdered?"  GAH!

[tobeannounced]

I didn't notice that, but geez, how many times can you have a show about a crime committed 20, 30 years ago that goes unsolved until the cold case unit tests the DNA and gets a match?  I guess this was a little more interesting because the guy they were sure did it was exonerated.  Thank God that prosecutor wouldn't charge him because I bet he would have been convicted on the eyewitness testimony.

[ridethemaverick]

Just watched Forbidden Love and holy crap the boy's mom was a romantic idiot. She kept rhapsodizing about their great love, they were soulmates, tehy were each other's light, etc. She couldn't keep them apart even though her son's very life was threatened because tru wuv etc. I kept wanting to punch her in the throat. All they were waiting for was to graduate high school and turn eighteen so they could run away and get married and their love would last forever etc. When teenagers fall in love it's usually for a time and then they grow up and get lives etc. I was planning for my teenage son to go to college not encouraging him to run away and marry his young girlfriend. This boy's mom acted as if her son was a grown man and ready for a forever marriage at eighteen. She was soooooooo stupid.

The case itself I've seen several times including America's Most Wanted so it was not a shock to me. Oh, and the girl's mom married her older psycho Egyptian husband when she was fifteen even though she was an American from Kansas or something at the time. I don't know how they met or why in hell her parents let that happen but she was a real doormat (as she had to be married to Mr control Freak) and even though she broke free to save her daughter's life at first, she took her back to the asshole knowing he was set on killing the girl. She know who he was and what he would do but she gave her daughter over to him anyway.

All in all an episode of extraordinary parental FAIL.

Glad some of my favorites are coming back this month. It's been an ID desert lately.

I agree 100%. I was half expecting her to drive Joseph over there so the psycho dad could see their amazing love in person. What parent uproots their whole life so that two teenagers can be together "forever"?

Also agree about Patricia. Just an episode full of fail. Ugh.

[auntjess]

Someone has requested forums for Vanity Fair Confidential and A Crime to Remember, both of which we discuss here.
I pointed it out the last time that happen, and hate to be the one to do it again.

[WendyCR72]

Someone has requested forums for Vanity Fair Confidential and A Crime to Remember, both of which we discuss here.

I pointed it out the last time that happen, and hate to be the one to do it again.

 

I already have.  :-)

[Fraoch]

Speaking of A Crime to Remember -- is its season finished? I don't remember seeing the most recent episode being advertised as the season finale, but the DVR didn't pick up anything this week.

Edited January 7, 2016 by Fraoch

[tobeannounced]

Did anyone see Shadow of Doubt?  I really think the narrator is the same one from Disappeared.  I liked it just for that alone.  And it made me miss Disappeared so much.  I kept waiting for the little gong sound.  Anyway, I thought it was well done, not cheesy at all, but I know it's been covered on another series because I remembered the story.

Edited January 7, 2016 by tobeannounced

[Brattinella]

Did anyone see Shadow of Doubt?  I really think the narrator is the same one from Disappeared.  I liked it just for that alone.  And it made me miss Disappeared so much.  I kept waiting for the little gong sound.  Anyway, I thought it was well done, not cheesy at all, but I know it's been covered on another series because I remembered the story.

 

What was the topic?

[tobeannounced]

Texas teens in the '90s maybe?  Anyway...

girl sneaks out and meets ex and his two friends out at a trailer to party.  She gets super drunk and has sex with them.  One gets freaked out that they're going to be charged with rape, so they take her to a bridge, shoot her dead, and dump her body in a creek.  I guess that makes sense to the teenage mind.  So then they all go to jail for murder.  Jeez Louise.  

Edited January 7, 2016 by tobeannounced

[Shriekingeel]

I tried Discovery's Killing Fields, expecting it to be a more or less straightforward story like an ID show. But this is the Discovery channel after all, so of course it's nothing like that. Instead it's one of those shaggy-dog "mystery/adventure" shows where they go digging for something every week and never find anything. Cannot stand those shows.

[Shriekingeel]

The Murder Book episode about the hit and run boat death in Texas was a bit odd for me. First, the name of the show is Murder Book. It should be about, y'know, murders. The perp was a doofus but clearly he didn't intend to kill anyone. The light sentence was a surprise but, bottom line, it was an accident. I guess the producers of the show just got carried away with the Bonfire of the Vanities aspect of the story.

The one really intriguing thing in the episode was the use of hypnotism to obtain a plate/registration number from the boat. I've never seen that on any ID show before.

[Kitty Redstone]

One, I can't believe he buried an entire speed boat to cover his tracks.

 

Two, I can't believe the piddly sentence he received.  He let that boy's family suffer for years.  The man is a coward from start to finish.  I wonder if his wife and children can even stand to be in the same city as him.  Creep.

[Josette]

 

The light sentence was a surprise but, bottom line, it was an accident.

 

I thought that if he had pulled the boys (who he saw bobbing in the water) into his boat, the one boy would never have drowned.  So, yeah, I think he needed a harsher sentence.

 

Regarding the Betty Williams death in A Crime to Remember (which was the season finale):  I thought Betty might have had a mental illness or chemical imbalance.  I didn't think her sexual activity was due to being a free spirit.  I took it as a symptom of something serious.

 

Anyone watch this week's Your Worst Nightmare?  It was a crazy story (former student stalks teacher for years unbeknownst to her, then kidnaps her and her daughter), but the episode left out some things that made it even stranger.  The kidnapper also kidnapped some poor six-year-old boy whom he considered a witness and then murdered the child.  Later, when he was on trial for that, the teacher testified against him and he leapt across the courtroom and ended up slashing her face while she was on the stand. 

[Maizie131]

Josette - yeah, last night's Your Worst Nightmare was very scary, and I think I remember the story being featured years ago on 20/20 or one of those shows.  7 frickin weeks they were kidnapped?!  Can you imagine?!?  The mother was a real hero to keep it together like she did for her daughter.

 

Did any of you by chance see the I.D. commercial with the lady looking out her window at her neighbor digging in the yard, and tells her husband she thinks he killed his wife.  Her husband says, "He's planting azaleas!"  Anyhow, it was pretty damn funny.  The tagline of the commercial was "It's how we think."  Yes, indeedy -- it's how I think, for sure.  Ha!  (I tried to find the commercial to post it here, but no luck.)

[Maizie131]

Another one of my favorite shows on ID is Web of Lies.  Just watched a rerun from last year, "Only Way Out," about the 2 teenagers who lived a couple thousand miles apart that got into an online chat that turned into a "love" relationship.  She comes from wealth and he lives on "the other side of the tracks."  She tells him her father has abused her & convinces him to kill her parents.  The ending was, in my opinion, unjust.  I think the sentences for the crime should've been reversed.  She gets probation?!?  Really?  Not that he shouldn't have had to pay a price, but shit!  Little bitch!  Anyhow, I've enjoyed every one of these shows.  (I feel bad using the word "enjoyed" in context w/these murder shows, but you guys know what I mean.)

Edited January 9, 2016 by Maizie131