Spoilers and Spoiler Speculation: Benchmarking

[HazelEyes4325]

8 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Jessica posted a photo of her and Sarah on set in scrubs yesterday. And then Sarah posted a photo with Jesse and mentioned how it was her one day to work with him as a director, and Jesse is directing episode 22. 

Also, wasn't that the day the fan-funded plane flew by?

[Lady Calypso]

35 minutes ago, funnygirl said:

If it's true, it's probably intern Sam Bello, since the actress got cast in the Roswell reboot. 

That wouldn't be too bad, especially since it might fuel a DeLuca story for next season instead of him having nothing to do. From the appearances I've seen of him (bits and pieces of last season, and all of this season so far), he hasn't really done anything besides be a character to prop another character's storyline, or making googly eyes at Sam. I haven't seen much of him in his first season or two (whenever he joined). 

[craziness]

According to IMDB Jessica was an intern on Schindler's List and had a part in Minority Report, both directed by her step-dad, but those were the only Spielberg movies I recognized.  And she was on a lawyer show, The Practice, for a couple years.  

I will miss her on my tv, and hope she gets another series or movie soon (assuming that's what she wants). 

[BaseOps]

Matthew is in episode 14x19; Arizona treats his baby. 

[beautifulGA]

1 hour ago, BaseOps said:

Matthew is in episode 14x19; Arizona treats his baby. 

oh boy. well when he first showed up i thought maybe they will explore mapril again. he might be the best person right now to help april in her crisis of faith.

[moonorchid]

6 minutes ago, beautifulGA said:

oh boy. well when he first showed up i thought maybe they will explore mapril again. he might be the best person right now to help april in her crisis of faith.

I wonder if instead of a shallow “endgame” scenario, he offers april some forgiveness. He doesn’t owe it to her per se but hearing it from him might go a long way for her. 

[Pallas]

3 hours ago, moonorchid said:

I wonder if instead of a shallow “endgame” scenario, he offers april some forgiveness. He doesn’t owe it to her per se but hearing it from him might go a long way for her. 

Set up by AZ, in one (for the road) of her trademark, "Tell certain people what I think they need to know about certain other people."  She can fill Matthew in on April's decision to carry and give birth to Samuel, her two stints in Iraq, and her divorce. And her current crisis of faith and more, set off by the death of Matthew's wife. You're so right: Matthew and April's beliefs are meant to be empowered by compassion and forgiveness; his might revive her faith.  

[JNM5505]

Does anyone know if April is actually dying? Or is this all speculation? What's the basis of speculation, other than Shonda's M.O. for killing off characters we love?

[Lady Calypso]

26 minutes ago, kinnej5 said:

Does anyone know if April is actually dying? Or is this all speculation? What's the basis of speculation, other than Shonda's M.O. for killing off characters we love?

Just speculation at this point, mostly because of Shonda's M.O with getting rid of characters, but also because of Harriet. I think it would be out of character for April to either leave Harriet behind with Jackson as she went away, whether to the army or somewhere else, or to bring Harriet with her and take her away from Jackson. The only way I see her leaving Harriet is if she thought she was a danger to her daughter. And unless Krista really wants Jackson to be with Maggie with no other attachments (which would be Harriet), then I can't see Jackson giving Harriet up. Though I think April taking Harriet with her somewhere would be more likely than April leaving her daughter behind to go find herself. 

[Starscream]

They could always copy the stupid custody agreement that Callie and Arizona have.

[Pallas]

6 hours ago, Starscream said:

They could always copy the stupid custody agreement that Callie and Arizona have.

Written on a Tweet?

 

16 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

And unless Krista really wants Jackson to be with Maggie with no other attachments (which would be Harriet), then I can't see Jackson giving Harriet up. Though I think April taking Harriet with her somewhere would be more likely than April leaving her daughter behind to go find herself. 

Vernoff may indeed want Jackson free of the need to say "day care" every few episodes. There's also the convenience of writing out Harriet: no more continual casting for older and older twins to play her, references to her, etc. (I'm betting Vernoff isn't thrilled to be saddled with a Meredith who has no less than three children to work into the occasional scene or afterthought.)

I don't think April needs to be killed off, and I'm not sure they will. Of course you're absolutely right about Shonda's M.O., but I bet it's the showrunner's call. As Starscream pointed out, for Callie, Shondaland managed to put down the gun, and recognize the possibility that joint physical custody is not the only moral option. I realize that this was to leave the door unlocked for Ramirez's return. But Vernoff might be willing to try the new option of leaving April in Seattle and writing her off without killing her off (as with Jeff Perry, for example). In this era, Vernoff might decided to work with the meta that most of the audience understands where Sarah Drew is and is not, and why we don't catch glimpses of the character.

Finally, though, I guess it seems more likely that Arizona will survive, and I don't think both characters will: not in Shondaland, where a sudden chill can snatch you away..."I just saw her last week!"

[Lady Calypso]

12 minutes ago, Pallas said:

I don't think April needs to be killed off, and I'm not sure they will. Of course you're absolutely right about Shonda's M.O., but I bet it's the showrunner's call. As Starscream pointed out, for Callie, Shondaland managed to put down the gun, and recognize the possibility that joint physical custody is not the only moral option. I realize that this was to leave the door unlocked for Ramirez's return. But Vernoff might be willing to try the new option of leaving April in Seattle and writing her off without killing her off (as with Jeff Perry, for example). In this era, Vernoff might decided to work with the meta that most of the audience understands where Sarah Drew is and is not, and why we don't catch glimpses of the character.

True, but even to get rid of Callie without killing her off so they could leave a door open for Ramirez to return, they had to completely demolish Callie, and Callie/Arizona, to get to that point. Callie had to look like a bad guy (well, she didn't have to but she did) and even when they tried to correct it and make both women end on a happier note, the damage they did with Callie was done. At least for me, anyway. That plot was what got me back into Grey's in the first place. Luckily, they might have an easier time with April/Jackson, since they had already been hostile before, but I think with April and Jackson's history, and with their first child dying, the situation is more fragile to handle than just "one of them gets sole custody". 

I think the best move for Vernoff is to just let April take Harriet somewhere else and let Jackson be single without attachments. It beats the alternative of April dying, at least. 

[Pallas]

2 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

True, but even to get rid of Callie without killing her off so they could leave a door open for Ramirez to return, they had to completely demolish Callie, and Callie/Arizona, to get to that point. Callie had to look like a bad guy (well, she didn't have to but she did) and even when they tried to correct it and make both women end on a happier note, the damage they did with Callie was done. At least for me, anyway. That plot was what got me back into Grey's in the first place. Luckily, they might have an easier time with April/Jackson, since they had already been hostile before, but I think with April and Jackson's history, and with their first child dying, the situation is more fragile to handle than just "one of them gets sole custody". 

I think the best move for Vernoff is to just let April take Harriet somewhere else and let Jackson be single without attachments. It beats the alternative of April dying, at least. 

Agree with every word, esp the bolded. Only caveat: April would probably request sole physical custody, not sole custody. And I like the idea of the showrunner's and Jackson's being sensitive to the history of this couple -- even though Vernoff would have told Jackson to sit his ass down at that barn, and Jackson may well wish he had -- and finding a way to work within its complexity, just a little. As Vernoff has with April's own complexity. Instead of throwing her onto the pile of young parents in the mass grave behind the writers' room.

[beautifulGA]

57 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

True, but even to get rid of Callie without killing her off so they could leave a door open for Ramirez to return, they had to completely demolish Callie, and Callie/Arizona, to get to that point. Callie had to look like a bad guy (well, she didn't have to but she did) and even when they tried to correct it and make both women end on a happier note, the damage they did with Callie was done. At least for me, anyway. That plot was what got me back into Grey's in the first place. Luckily, they might have an easier time with April/Jackson, since they had already been hostile before, but I think with April and Jackson's history, and with their first child dying, the situation is more fragile to handle than just "one of them gets sole custody". 

I think the best move for Vernoff is to just let April take Harriet somewhere else and let Jackson be single without attachments. It beats the alternative of April dying, at least. 

I agree with the Callie part. Her character was so OOC that I have to double check whether it's the same character I fell in love with. She became so self absorbed and thought-less, along with that custody sl, and chasing tails a useless resident that somewhere I wished that Shondaland should just kill her off instead of such severe character assassination.

Coming to the current sls, I think the way Jackson is acting, it would be just great for April to skip country with Harriet but then again I also know that Shondaland loves portraying the guys as 'super dads'. They pretty much have great characters after characters servicing at Owen's foot, only to show his 'aching womb'

So, I think to prop Jackson's character over the current incest-y hook up, they'll show him as some super single dad extraordinaire. And for that to happen, April has to be killed off. Or do something equally damaging for Jackson to seek and win sole custody.

While I'm not a fan of Arizona chasing Callie yet again, but I guess that's the only way she can be written off. The writers could do something respectful for her and allow her to get a more pristine job at, let's say John Hopkins, and thus be nearer to Sofia all the time, but I don't trust these writers so that's that.

[Lady Calypso]

11 minutes ago, beautifulGA said:

Coming to the current sls, I think the way Jackson is acting, it would be just great for April to skip country with Harriet but then again I also know that Shondaland loves portraying the guys as 'super dads'. They pretty much have great characters after characters servicing at Owen's foot, only to show his 'aching womb'

So, I think to prop Jackson's character over the current incest-y hook up, they'll show him as some super single dad extraordinaire. And for that to happen, April has to be killed off. Or do something equally damaging for Jackson to seek and win sole custod

I hope not. Personally, I think Jackson's a good dad and he cares about Harriet, but with Vernoff's obsession with Jaggie that puts his relationship with his daughter in Offscreenville, it's better to not have Harriet attached to Jackson at all for next season. That way, Vernoff doesn't have to worry about a kid, April doesn't get killed off, and it's a win-win (just not for Japril fans). Of course, the hard part is getting April to leave with Harriet and not make Jackson look like the absentee father who only cares about his new boo instead of his little girl. But, at this point, I'd rather sacrifice Jackson's reputation than April's life.

12 minutes ago, beautifulGA said:

While I'm not a fan of Arizona chasing Callie yet again, but I guess that's the only way she can be written off. The writers could do something respectful for her and allow her to get a more pristine job at, let's say John Hopkins, and thus be nearer to Sofia all the time, but I don't trust these writers so that's that.

What would make sense for Arizona is to just take a job elsewhere, probably closer to Callie so their custody agreement with Sofia can work out better. I think Arizona can leave the show gracefully without having her put right back together with Callie. I think they caused enough damage with that relationship and even though it'll satisfy the Calzona fans, I don't think it's necessary. 

[AriAu]

Quote

What would make sense for Arizona is to just take a job elsewhere, probably closer to Callie so their custody agreement with Sofia can work out better. I think Arizona can leave the show gracefully without having her put right back together with Callie. I think they caused enough damage with that relationship and even though it'll satisfy the Calzona fans, I don't think it's necessary. 

I think they will have Arizona leave to somewhere that is easier on Sophia...it makes perfect sense....and therefore, they will pull a Henry Blake and have her be killed on the way! Yes, I am kidding, but it is just as ridiculous as her walking around like she doesn't have an artificial leg! Oh, maybe the plane will crash and she will fight off the wild animals that ate Lexi with her artificial leg.

FWIW, I think April has to die-nothing else makes sense given Harriet since there is no way Jackson (or his Momma) is letting her go) and the writers are not disciplined enough to have her be at another hospital in Seattle.

[moonorchid]

I still think Jackson can look like a hero by allowing April to take Harriet where she needs to go to be happy. It would be a sacrifice. It would be one last crumb to japril fans. April would actually live which I want, and it can totally be believed that off screen jackson Is using his immense billions to visit his daughter whenever he wants and she’s with him in Seattle on occasion. Krista does not want to deal with attachments while pushing jaggie to the forefront.

[jschoolgirl]

I was always holding out hope that SaRa would return, and it would be far less likely without Arizona.

[BaseOps]

10 hours ago, moonorchid said:

I still think Jackson can look like a hero by allowing April to take Harriet where she needs to go to be happy. It would be a sacrifice. It would be one last crumb to japril fans. April would actually live which I want, and it can totally be believed that off screen jackson Is using his immense billions to visit his daughter whenever he wants and she’s with him in Seattle on occasion. Krista does not want to deal with attachments while pushing jaggie to the forefront.

Eh, I don't really think essentially abandoning your kid is heroic, especially since Jackson was abandoned by his own dad. 

[moonorchid]

2 minutes ago, BaseOps said:

Eh, I don't really think essentially abandoning your kid is heroic, especially since Jackson was abandoned by his own dad. 

How is this abandoning his kid? Didn’t Arizona pretty much do the same thing last year for callie and Sofia? This isn’t that far fetched, and honestly I see April being more attracted to Harriet than Jackson anyway.

[pennben]

Honestly, people seem to keep forgetting we only see the kids maybe once or twice a season; even Meredith's.  Let April get back with Matthew, she stays in Seattle, moves to different hospital or goes to a nunnery....whatever; she and Jackson split custody, we continue to see the kid again once or twice a year, and presto! April's gone, her best friend Arizona moves to NY to be closer to Callie and permanence for her kid, so no need to talk about April that much, Jackson mentions he's got the kids this week/weekend once or twice a year and we are done, neither Jackson/April abandon the kid and all is well. 

The splitting of custody arrangement (by year?) of Callie/Arizona was ridiculous and should not be replicated. 

They aren't the lead couple, like Meredith/Derek, where I think the show gets thrown off-balance if one is forever off-screen.  Jackson/April are already broken up. They are a secondary couple, where recoupling is relatively easy for the remaining person (although many may not like the specific recoupling with Maggie at the moment!). 

Or.....kaboom, she's dead.  I really don't think that is the route they are going, but who knows. 

Edited March 27, 2018 by pennben

[moonorchid]

33 minutes ago, pennben said:

Honestly, people seem to keep forgetting we only see the kids maybe once or twice a season; even Meredith's.  Let April get back with Matthew, she stays in Seattle, moves to different hospital or goes to a nunnery....whatever; she and Jackson split custody, we continue to see the kid again once or twice a year, and presto! April's gone, her best friend Arizona moves to NY to be closer to Callie and permanence for her kid, so no need to talk about April that much, Jackson mentions he's got the kids this week/weekend once or twice a year and we are done, neither Jackson/April abandon the kid and all is well. 

The splitting of custody arrangement (by year?) of Callie/Arizona was ridiculous and should not be replicated. 

They aren't the lead couple, like Meredith/Derek, where I think the show gets thrown off-balance if one is forever off-screen.  Jackson/April are already broken up. They are a secondary couple, where recoupling is relatively easy for the remaining person (although many may not like the specific recoupling with Maggie at the moment!). 

Or.....kaboom, she's dead.  I really don't think that is the route they are going, but who knows. 

I agree, I don’t know why April can’t just work at another hospital in the state. Problem solved.

and yeah calzonas custody agreement was dumb as hell but abandonment it was not.

[pennben]

I do feel like they wanted to allow for Ramirez to come back, maybe even for just one episode, so cue the post-custody war reconciliation before she left. I feel like that was a groundbreaking relationship for the show/tv way back when. I just don't see that for Jackson/April, so I have different expectations for how this will end. It's not Meredith/Derek or Alex/Izzy or Callie/Arizona or Christina/Burke (at least in my mind). I don't think they want April to loom over Jackson or Jackson/Maggie, so I see a quiet exit for the characters (if not the actors). Again, I could be very, very wrong, so.... shaker of salt over my shoulder. 

Edited March 27, 2018 by pennben

[Joana]

The problem is that they made such a big deal deal about Mark having to die "because he'd never leave Sofia behind" (which was a total nonsense to begin with), so they'd look silly if they started writing characters walking away alive without their children. Arizona/Callie custody arrangement indeed completely ridiculous, but that's the closest they could come to a joint physical custody when the parties involved live accross the country. And yeah, it most definitely should not be replicated again.

But who knows, Mark's storyline was ages ago, so perhaps they've changed their mind/hope people have forgotten about it, so they take another route. 

[Shellie]

1 hour ago, Joana said:

The problem is that they made such a big deal deal about Mark having to die "because he'd never leave Sofia behind" (which was a total nonsense to begin with), so they'd look silly if they started writing characters walking away alive without their children. Arizona/Callie custody arrangement indeed completely ridiculous, but that's the closest they could come to a joint physical custody when the parties involved live accross the country. And yeah, it most definitely should not be replicated again.

But who knows, Mark's storyline was ages ago, so perhaps they've changed their mind/hope people have forgotten about it, so they take another route. 

I never understood why they didn't simply have Mark take a job at another hospital in the area. He could have said he couldn't deal with all the reminders of Lexie. 

[beautifulGA]

2 hours ago, Joana said:

The problem is that they made such a big deal deal about Mark having to die "because he'd never leave Sofia behind" (which was a total nonsense to begin with), so they'd look silly if they started writing characters walking away alive without their children. Arizona/Callie custody arrangement indeed completely ridiculous, but that's the closest they could come to a joint physical custody when the parties involved live accross the country. And yeah, it most definitely should not be replicated again.

But who knows, Mark's storyline was ages ago, so perhaps they've changed their mind/hope people have forgotten about it, so they take another route. 

I pretty much remember that Eric's departure was also because of budget cuts. Plus his personal life was a mess back then with multiple affairs, checking into rehab for addiction etc. I remember there was a interview where he said that he want better story for Mark that doesn't involve third wheeling a power couple (calzona) but with Chyler's exit (because of her son) the same couldn't be done. The lame line that Mark can't live without sofia ( a man who probably have a kid running around in each state attributing to his manwhore nature) was just a poor cover up by Shondaland (same as lack of creativity for Jessica n Sarah)

[jschoolgirl]

21 hours ago, pennben said:

 Let April get back with Matthew, she stays in Seattle, moves to different hospital

I've been thinking that might happen, but, eh, probably not. It wouldn't be tragic enough.

[OrigamiNightmare]

Maybe April agrees to go to treatment. Then next season all they would need is Jackson saying some line about how she chose not to return to the hospital, but that they're still sharing custody of Harriet, problem solved without a death. In some ways I kind of wish they would kill her off by alcohol poisoning because that would be one of the few deaths they'd have that would be realistic. Instead of eletrocution, plane crash, etc.

[AriAu]

Quote

Honestly, people seem to keep forgetting we only see the kids maybe once or twice a season; even Meredith's.  Let April get back with Matthew, she stays in Seattle, moves to different hospital or goes to a nunnery....whatever; she and Jackson split custody, we continue to see the kid again once or twice a year, and presto! April's gone, her best friend Arizona moves to NY to be closer to Callie and permanence for her kid, so no need to talk about April that much, Jackson mentions he's got the kids this week/weekend once or twice a year and we are done, neither Jackson/April abandon the kid and all is well. 

This is called "real life" and not television drama. It's what would really happen, but it's not all that interesting.....and everyone would complain that April didn't stop by.

Plus

Quote

It wouldn't be tragic enough.

[craziness]

Anyone else think Arizona really does have breast cancer?  As a way of having her leave the show?

[GalvDuck]

16 minutes ago, craziness said:

Anyone else think Arizona really does have breast cancer?  As a way of having her leave the show?

I believe April would have done a thorough scan to find something if they believed Dr. Hanson found something.  They would have wanted to be sure.  

[Deanie87]

This might be an awakening for her, though, and she decides that she wants to move with Sofia to NY, if not to reconcile with Callie, then at least to keep the family together.

As for April, I was skeptical before about her dying, but all those apologies and that speech about to Jackson about how she knew that Harriet was safe when she wasn't around do not bode well for her and that really, really sucks.  I honestly don't know why they can't just have her move to another hospital or back home with or without Harriet.  I know they say that fans would never believe that April would leave Harriet, but honestly if they cared about what fans wanted then April wouldn't be leaving in the first place.

[AriAu]

Quote

As for April, I was skeptical before about her dying, but all those apologies and that speech about to Jackson about how she knew that Harriet was safe when she wasn't around do not bode well for her and that really, really sucks.  I honestly don't know why they can't just have her move to another hospital or back home with or without Harriet.  I know they say that fans would never believe that April would leave Harriet, but honestly if they cared about what fans wanted then April wouldn't be leaving in the first place.

YMMV, but I don't think it is about what fans think about the character, but instead what fans think that the character would do-in other words fans and other continuity wonks, honestly believe that the April they know would not leave her daughter-in fact, as she was spiraling, she went out of her way to make sure her daughter was safe over her own needs.

And, yes, for a second there I thought they would give Arizona breast cancer to get her off of the show!

Edited April 6, 2018 by AriAu

[Deanie87]

9 minutes ago, AriAu said:

YMMV, but I don't think it is about what fans think about the character, but instead what fans that the character would do-in other words fans and other continuity wonks, honestly believe that the April they know would not leave her daughter-in fact, as she was spiraling, she went out of her way to make sure her daughter was safe over her own needs.

And, yes, for a second there I thought they would get Arizona breast cancer to get her off of the show!

But they could easily have April just transfer to another hospital in town and take Harriet with her.  Then she and Jackson can share custody and she gets mentioned twice a season and that's that.  

Edited April 6, 2018 by Deanie87

[GalvDuck]

So, I'm guessing ICE is going after Sam.  Carina is my second guess, but less likely.  

Definitely not Bokhee.  :o)

[beautifulGA]

it was jolex engagement that was cut off.....

[craziness]

I think ICE is going to go after DeLuca. 

[funnygirl]

1 hour ago, craziness said:

I think ICE is going to go after DeLuca. 

I think Intern Sam Bello is their target.

Edited April 7, 2018 by funnygirl

[BaseOps]

Based on the promo pics, ICE is almost certainly there for Sam. Also, she isn't in any more press releases. So...

Nurse Olivia is back for 14x21 (with her son!).

Edited April 7, 2018 by BaseOps

[Guest]

Which one is Sam? They all run together!

[Pallas]

Sam Bello is DeLuca Classic's intern girlfriend. And before anyone says it, I agree: I've never seen a person who looked less like a Sam. 

[Chas411]

whats ICe?

[Guest]

Just now, Chas411 said:

whats ICe?

Immigration Something that begins with C Enforcement.

The preview made it look like one of the interns is being kicked out of the country. Which probably means nobody is being kicked out of the country.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Pallas said:

Sam Bello is DeLuca Classic's intern girlfriend. And before anyone says it, I agree: I've never seen a person who looked less like a Sam. 

Oh, so the intern I typically think of as “the annoying one” not to be confused with “the other annoying one” or “the annoying one who wears glasses.”

[funnygirl]

5 hours ago, Chas411 said:

whats ICe?

ICE stands for Immigration and Customs Enforcement. 

[Pallas]

Maybe Owen didn't declare the engagement ring he bought on his way from the airport to Teddy's flat, and brought back with him. He tried erasing evidence of the trip by ripping the baggage claim off his luggage, but...

[transitfan]

On 4/7/2018 at 10:02 AM, deaja said:

Immigration Something that begins with C Enforcement.

The preview made it look like one of the interns is being kicked out of the country. Which probably means nobody is being kicked out of the country.

Immigration (and) Customs Enforcement, IIRC. 

[AriAu]

Per her Twitter, last day of shooting for Jessica Capshaw today. No spoilers, no hints, no pictures of body bags, not evening hinting that she is heading to the airport of packing up her house....or anything

[beautifulGA]

1 hour ago, AriAu said:

Per her Twitter, last day of shooting for Jessica Capshaw today. No spoilers, no hints, no pictures of body bags, not evening hinting that she is heading to the airport of packing up her house....or anything

they had table read for finale few days ago and are shooting till 25th. I am just gonna take a wild guess here and predict that the finale probably have 1 or 2 arizona scene.

It's looking more and more clearer that, the finale would not be Arizona-April heavy.

[Scatterbrained]

I feel as if most seasons have a “theme” and the final usually wraps up the current season’s theme and sets up the beginning of the next season’s theme.  Since JCap and Sarah won’t be around next season, they will probably just film enough to wrap up this season’s storylines.