Bruce Jenner: The Interview (ABC)

[GreatKazu]

Darknight- Money can entice people to break HIPAA laws.  

Exactly.

[LotusFlower]

Actually that's not at all true.  Young people, notably those under age 25, have a higher rate of acceptance of gay marriage because they've never known a world without gay marriage. This does not mean they led, or are leading the charge, for gay rights.

They most certainly have known a world that prohibited same sex marriage, as it only started to roll out in the past decade, starting with Massachusetts in 2004. And it's still illegal in over a dozen states, so the issue continues to be on the table. But more importantly, if more and more people are accepting of gay rights, including same sex marriage, then polls reflect this, and politicians pay attention to polls. Hence, they're leading the charge, whether they're out on the streets marching or not.

Yes and no. The changes you see now are happening because of past generations coming out, fighting to pass GLBTQ rights legislation, etc. I'm 53, straight and have been a GLBTQ rights advocate most of my life and activist for well over a decade, Generations before mine made progress that we built on, which the younger generation is  building on. And, yes, transgender rights have been part of that. The younger generation deserves a huge amount of credit, but so do those who came before.

I would never dismiss the work and the strides that an older generation made on GLBTQ rights. Yes, the younger generation is building on the progress made from the generation before it, and everyone deserves credit. In terms of Bruce Jenner, however, and I admit this is a cynical take, but I question his awareness campaign. Sadly, and right or wrong, the younger generation thinks of him as kind of a joke (from his portrayal on The Kardashians), and I'm curious as to who and what demographic will be watching his reality show.

[iwasish]

That's horrible. HIPPA laws are there for a reason. Medical professionals should uphold them.

I doubt it the medical professionals who leak it. It's the people that surround the family. The hangers on. The ones they treat like wallpaper while they have their hair and makeup applied, the little nobodies on the E!. They see and hear plenty. And figure why shouldn't I make a buck or two?

[RemoteControlFreak]

Not kids. Teenagers, like 15 or 16 years old, and who get parental consent. A child, no way, too young. That would be irresponsible.

I'm not sure if you are talking about surgery or hormone treatment.

 

Surgery is not done on children or young teens.  

 

 In some cases, hormone blockers are given to forestall puberty. This has to be done at the age at which puberty begins. So a child born male who feels he is really female will be given testosterone blockers right at the brink of puberty to prevent male puberty.  So this would be at around age 11-12.  Without it, the child would go through male puberty which can be devastating emotionally for a trans kid.   If, as the child matures emotionally and intellectually, he then decides that wants to be a boy after all, the blocking hormones can be stopped and male puberty will resume with no lasting physical effects.

 

In rarer cases, cross-gender hormones are given to young teens in addition to hormone blockers. So a trans girl (born male), would get estrogen. This is controversial and done in rare cases, because the effects are not entirely reversible. The most severe effect is that a boy given estrogen would be unable to father children ever. It's done only when the child is so emotionally traumatized with their body that there is a real risk of physical harming or suicide without it.

 

Also, any medical treatment for any reason on anyone under age 18 requires parental consent.

Edited April 26, 2015 by remotecontrolfreak

[DangerousMinds]

In retrospect, I shouldn't have been surprised.

 

It was, in a sense, inevitable, and obvious to anyone who paid attention or "did the math".

 

Nevertheless it was shocking.

 

At least to someone who remembers him winning the Olympic decathlon.

 

Part of me still can't get over it.

 

 

Bruce Jenner is 65?

And his sister even older, and she looked amazing.

[maraleia]

thank you for the correction

Happy to oblige.

[RemoteControlFreak]

In terms of Bruce Jenner, however, and I admit this is a cynical take, but I question his awareness campaign. Sadly, and right or wrong, the younger generation thinks of him as kind of a joke (from his portrayal on The Kardashians), and I'm curious as to who and what demographic will be watching his reality show.

I agree that the 1976 Olympics were a long time ago and the Kardashians is hardly high brow entertainment. However, something like 17 million people watched the interview with Diane Sawyer.  An average episode of Keeping with the Kardashians gets about 1.3 million viewers these days.  

 

So obviously a lot of people who don't watch the Kardashians and are probably too young to remember the 1976 Olympics watched this.  Even if they were scarcely familiar with Bruce Jenner before Friday night, they know who he is now and may continue to watch what happens with him, either through his summer series or in other venues.

 

I still don't think the main reason for the reality show is to raise awareness. Like all things in the Kardashian-Jenner circle, it's done to make money.  Awareness may be a side-effect.  I hope the show can be done in a dignified manner. With E! and the Kardashians involved, I'm skeptical.

Edited April 26, 2015 by remotecontrolfreak

[DangerousMinds]

Many people I know are not taking this seriously specifically because of the Kartrashian connection. I wish Kimmy would just shut up, it's not her business and she is harming his reputation. It had to be illegal for the paps to put a tracker on his car. That's so low!

[Guest]

...Sadly, and right or wrong, the younger generation thinks of him as kind of a joke (from his portrayal on The Kardashians), and I'm curious as to who and what demographic will be watching his reality show.

She's no average teen but mine likes Bruce (based on KUWTK) and was really concerned about him from the time he admitted this.  Several weeks ago, out of nowhere, she asked me, "What's going on with Bruce?  I'm worried about him.  I hope he has people to talk to."  Heh.

 

It'll be interesting to see how many people will bother with the E! show.  I hate to patronize the network but I have to admit I might check it out, if I remember.  It's just really interesting.  I guess the show is only going to be 8 hours and starts in late July, which is deadsville.  I'm glad he's not doing an ongoing show.  

[LotusFlower]

 

I still don't think the main reason for the reality show is to raise awareness. Like all things in the Kardashian-Jenner circle, it's done to make money.  Awareness may be a side-effect.  I hope the show can be done in a dignified manner. With E! and the Kardashians involved, I'm skeptical.

Well he did say: "We're going to change the world!" If that isn't about awareness, I don't know what is. (Although I agree he's certainly doing the show on E! for money, as well). Maybe he was only referring to the interview itself. Yes, the ratings were huge, and I think that's great, but I only wish he came across better. I found the interview very controlled and at times superficial. Frankly, I'm learning more about transgender issues here on this board than I did from a two-hour TV interview.

[Irlandesa]

 I admit this is a cynical take, but I question his awareness campaign. Sadly, and right or wrong, the younger generation thinks of him as kind of a joke (from his portrayal on The Kardashians), and I'm curious as to who and what demographic will be watching his reality show.

The interview got a 5.2  in the coveted 18-49 demo which is pretty massive.  (Even more surprising is that 68% of that demo was male).  I wouldn't be surprised to see his reality show do some pretty decent ratings, at least initially. 

Most of the reaction I've seen has been pretty positive towards Bruce in this interview.  I didn't watch KUWTK so I don't know if he's a 'joke' on that show or not.  But he was only a supporting player on that show.  This reality show is his opportunity to redefine who he is and how he is seen.  If he's a joke, then he'll show it.  Or maybe being free of the Kardashians will give him the freedom to take control of his life and image.

 

I doubt it the medical professionals who leak it. It's the people that surround the family.

Oh I think it's both.  I think some medical professionals will violate HIPAA laws for enough money and if they think they can cover their tracks.  So many people get patient info that some may think they're covered by numbers.  Then you have people who might get tricked into sharing info.  I know someone who works in HR at a small hospital and she's had to fire a couple of people in the past few months for HIPAA violations.  The violations weren't deliberate, usually, but careless. They'll do things like telling patient information to a presumed family member who isn't cleared to know that information. Or sharing information with someone they're close to who might know or know of the patient.  Knowing that, outlets like TMZ may be good at tricking someone into thinking they're cleared to know. 

[Dejana]

Oh I think it's both.  I think some medical professionals will violate HIPAA laws for enough money and if they think they can cover their tracks.  So many people get patient info that some may think they're covered by numbers.  Then you have people who might get tricked into sharing info.  I know someone who works in HR at a small hospital and she's had to fire a couple of people in the past few months for HIPAA violations.  The violations weren't deliberate, usually, but careless. They'll do things like telling patient information to a presumed family member who isn't cleared to know that information. Or sharing information with someone they're close to who might know or know of the patient.  Knowing that, outlets like TMZ may be good at tricking someone into thinking they're cleared to know. 

 

Yes, medical professionals are like anyone else--some keep their mouths shut and others take the tabloid payday, especially the ones who aren't doctors making the megabucks. There's also trickery (a famous example being the morning show prank when Kate was pregnant with Prince George and the nurse was fooled by the DJ pretending to be Queen Elizabeth) or other patients/family members who see a celebrity whisked in/out of a waiting room, and can run to a tabloid about it without being beholden to HIPAA. I don't doubt that the Kardashians cooperate with TMZ when it suits them, but so do other people.

Edited April 26, 2015 by Dejana

[Pjxf99]

I just wanted to say I was talking to my 74 year old mother on the phone yesterday and asked if she'd watched the interview. She 's not the MOST conservative older person I know, but she still whispers the word 'gay' in conversation and will talk around what she considers a delicate subject so much, "he's um...well....YOU know..." that no, I often DON'T know what the hell she's trying to say. 

 

Her response to the interview was "I don't see the big deal."

[GaT]

In terms of Bruce Jenner, however, and I admit this is a cynical take, but I question his awareness campaign. Sadly, and right or wrong, the younger generation thinks of him as kind of a joke (from his portrayal on The Kardashians), and I'm curious as to who and what demographic will be watching his reality show.

Every Kardashian is going to be plugging his show on Twitter & Instagram & all the people who follow them will turn in to watch Bruce.

[bluebonnet]

I can't say that I understand this outrage over Bruce Jenner's upcoming show or even the timing of his interview.  He wouldn't be able to sell this product (reality tv, tabloid covers) if there wasn't such a voracious appetite for it.  It sort of feels like having outrage at Bill Gates and Steve Jobs for people being hungry for tech products.  It's his job, keeping himself in the limelight has been his job for 40 years.  It feels rather disgusting to suggest he should no longer do his job now that he's finally and happily able to share his real self with us.  

[GreatKazu]

Oh I think it's both.  I think some medical professionals will violate HIPAA laws for enough money and if they think they can cover their tracks.  So many people get patient info that some may think they're covered by numbers.  Then you have people who might get tricked into sharing info.  I know someone who works in HR at a small hospital and she's had to fire a couple of people in the past few months for HIPAA violations.  The violations weren't deliberate, usually, but careless. They'll do things like telling patient information to a presumed family member who isn't cleared to know that information. Or sharing information with someone they're close to who might know or know of the patient.  Knowing that, outlets like TMZ may be good at tricking someone into thinking they're cleared to know. 

Exactly. There have been people who have been caught selling patient's social security numbers to those who who in turn sell social security cards to people who come here illegally. It is not far-fetched to think a person working at the medical office where Bruce went to, had an employee who has access to his files and just made a quick call to TMZ. As a matter of fact, back in 2013, Cedars Sinai hospital fired several employees for breaching patient privacy. There was a breach where 14 patients' medical files were looked at by employees, and Kim Kardashian's file just happened to be one of them:

http://www.tmz.com/2013/07/13/kim-kardashian-cedars-sinai-medical-center-hospital-records-leaked/

 

It also happened when Rihanna's photo of her battered face sprung up on gossip sites. The police department stated it was an internal leak that shouldn't have happened. It also happened when Michael Jackson died. All it takes is for TMZ to pay a janitor or someone who works in a facility who is desperate for some quick cash. Here is an article on this very matter where TMZ is accused of such practices:

http://americanpowerblog.blogspot.com/2009/06/tmz-said-to-pay-for-tips-quotes.html

 

Within that article is a link to a Los Angeles Time article about TMZ's tactics. Here it is:

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/jun/28/entertainment/et-tmz28

 

Someone here noted people watched this special because of the Kardashian connection. I wouldn't doubt it. Bruce was a big part of that show. Just today my nephew's wife - she is 25 - asked me what I thought about Bruce. I was stunned for a moment, but then I quickly realized she watches KUWTK. I told her I applaud him and waited to hear her opinion. She is happy for him and she mentioned how she felt for him because he had to wait all of these years before he felt comfortable to be himself.

Edited April 26, 2015 by GreatKazu

[kathe5133]

People have been transitioning and having SRS for decades now, without fanfare and without exploiting their situation for profit or publicity. Bruce Jenner is no pioneer. In fact, he's no representative or champion of any kind for transgender people.

Jenner's experience is worlds apart from the other 700,000 transgender people estimated to be living in the United States. He leads a life of luxury and privilege. He is so famous that no one in the lofty strata of society he occupies would dare mock, abuse or discriminate against him for fear of a public relations backlash. Not so for the average transgender person who has to seriously think about their personal safety before just walking down the street or trying to use a public bathroom.

Bruce Jenner will never worry about getting proper medical care, or trying to scrape the money together to make his face and body look right. He'll never have to work as a prostitute or some other part of the sex trade to get that money, or some minimum wage job far below his qualifications just to put a roof over his head. He'll never have to fear being beaten when he goes out. Really, compared to the average transgender person, Bruce Jenner has virtually no worries at all.

Rejection was never a risk for Jenner. There was no chance he would face disapproval after that interview. In America, if you have money and you can command a spotlight, you'll always be welcome. Even if you kill a woman with your car. And Jenner has been priming that spotlight for quite awhile now.

Transgender people have been struggling for a very long time and have made progress in recent years. The people responsible for those advances are the ones who are changing the world, not Bruce Jenner. They have names America will never know. In part because America doesn't care about ordinary transgender people and will still ridicule anyone who looks like a man in a dress who doesn't happen to be rich or famous. But also because Bruce Jenner put his ego and bank account ahead of their hard-fought accomplishments and appointed himself the new symbol of transgender America.

This! I am sorry. Bruce Jenner is no role model. This entire thing has bothered me. I do not have an issue with him being transgender. I have an issue with, the big Diane Saywer interview with months of hype, the years of reality TV. How many marriages? I think a couple of kids that he couldn't bother to parent. Oh he was living in hell? Must be tough to live in "hell" splitting your time between the Malibu beach house and the mansion in Calabassas (sp)! How much was he paid for the Diane Sawyer interview? How much for his reality show? Yes, he may open a dialog but I am afraid this dialog will be ignored or misunderstood. I feel Bruce Jenner lacks character, and that is a key component to being a role model.

[Almost 3000]

I doubt it the medical professionals who leak it. It's the people that surround the family. The hangers on. The ones they treat like wallpaper while they have their hair and makeup applied, the little nobodies on the E!. They see and hear plenty. And figure why shouldn't I make a buck or two?

My next door neighbor was the office manager of a group that did medical work ups for life insurance coverage. She told me the results of a client's test before they even knew. It ended up being a probably more major story of its time then Jenner's is now. It only went as far as gossip between us and the story was broken much later by the celebrity. But who knows where whispers can lead or at what point in the gossip chain someone decides to sell the information even if the originator didn't intend for that to happen.

[LotusFlower]

Every Kardashian is going to be plugging his show on Twitter & Instagram & all the people who follow them will turn in to watch Bruce.

I don't know if they will, but regardless, the logic doesn't follow since each Kardashian/Jenner girl has around 20 million followers on Twitter and Instagram, and the Kardashians shows only attract around 1-2 million viewers.

I feel Bruce Jenner lacks character, and that is a key component to being a role model.

I tend to agree. I just think he brings too much baggage to champion this cause as well as others might.

[RemoteControlFreak]

Hey, no one's perfect.  And given how few public figures are openly transgender, Bruce is not a terrible example.  He won't be a role model, but he'll do no harm. It could be a lot worse. I think he handled the Diane Sawyer interview pretty well, and I think he'll give a fair representation of one person's life as a middle-aged, white, wealthy, famous, transgender woman.

 

As for lobbying Congress or talking to John Boehner and the Republicans, forget about it. He's not a political guy to begin with. An overriding aspect of his personality seems to be to want everyone to just get along.  He's not the person to fight this uphill battle.  But perhaps his openness will encourage someone better suited to take up that campaign.

Edited April 27, 2015 by remotecontrolfreak

[SimoneS]

I can't wait to see Jenner campaigning for and with the Republican presidential nominee. I also look forward to Jenner making a speech at the Republican national convention. *sarcasm*

[RemoteControlFreak]

My next door neighbor was the office manager of a group that did medical work ups for life insurance coverage. She told me the results of a client's test before they even knew. It ended up being a probably more major story of its time then Jenner's is now. It only went as far as gossip between us and the story was broken much later by the celebrity. But who knows where whispers can lead or at what point in the gossip chain someone decides to sell the information even if the originator didn't intend for that to happen.

Similar story ...in the late 1980s, when we were both very young,  a friend of mine who worked in a doctor's office told me that a famous actress who had just been nominated for an Academy Award came to see the doctor for treatment of a serious condition. She told me both the name of the actress and the condition. This was pre-HIPAA, but still unethical if not illegal.  I never said anything about it. We could have both probably sold the story to the tabloids but we didn't. Twenty years later the actress went public with the diagnosis.  

Edited April 27, 2015 by remotecontrolfreak

[GreatKazu]

I had a similar situation. I was having surgery back in the early 90s. I was being prepped for anesthesia. The anesthesiologist was chatting it up with the nurses and they began talking about some celebrity.  He mentioned a few celebs he had given anesthesia to over the years. He then mentioned being the anesthesiologist for an actress who was on a tv show in the mid 80s (I won't mention her name). He went on talking about her and how she went on to lie in an interview about the procedure she had done.

 

 

But who knows where whispers can lead or at what point in the gossip chain someone decides to sell the information even if the originator didn't intend for that to happen.

Agree.

 

 

I am sorry. Bruce Jenner is no role model.

He never claimed to be.

Edited April 27, 2015 by GreatKazu

[iwasish]

It seems he's booked to do the standard run of tabloid talk shows next week, along with Kim and probably other family members. I would have preferred a more dignified route. I do think it kind of cheapens things, but I guess that's the world Bruce is used to and comfortable with. He's not an intellectual or very deep, he brushes off his failings as a father and a husband a bit too easily. I think he may enjoy being in the spotlight and being listened to, instead of being Ignored, dismissed and made fun of on KUWTK. He'll be all over the news for a few weeks/months and then until he decides to reveal himself as "her" interest will die down.

[Madding crowd]

I thought Bruce seemed glassy eyed and almost like he was medicated during the interview. I'm basing my opinion on seeing him speak and act over the years in the Kardashian shows. I found it odd and was wondering at his demeanor (don't believe it has anything to do with gender).

 

I'm no fan of Kris Jenner, but anyone would be thrown for a loop if their spouse of many years revealed they were actually a different gender. Kris may have known some things but I don't believe Bruce was a 36B breast size when they married. Their wedding pictures have been shown many times and he does not have breasts in the photos. Like most things, we won't know the whole story and shouldn't know because it is their private business. But I don't fault Kris for not saying anything-it might take her awhile to be comfortable. 

 

Bruce was not a good father to his children, was better with the step-children and his youngest daughters. On the K shows he always seemed disinterested and checked out, while Kris seemed controlling and exasperated. Like most divorces, they were probably both at fault. And to be honest, not every woman would want to be married to another woman even if she had known the person and loved the person. His ex wives are much more removed from Bruce's life, so it is probably easier for them.

 

Of course I wish him well and hope he can be happy and spend the rest of his life doing what he really wants to do and being who he wants to be. 

Edited April 27, 2015 by Madding crowd

[Guest]

He never claimed to be.

Yeah, he made a point of saying that he was no spokesperson for the trans community.  

I thought Bruce seemed glassy eyed and almost like he was medicated during the interview. I'm basing my opinion on seeing him speak and act over the years in the Kardashian shows. I found it odd and was wondering at his demeanor (don't believe it has anything to do with gender).

It wouldn't surprise me if he needed a drink or two to do this.  But I also thought he seemed different.  But maybe on the show he was working from a script, or maybe here he was.  

 

To be honest, mostly he seemed older to me.  There were segments where he reminded me of my 77 year old mother.  

Edited April 27, 2015 by Guest

[GreatKazu]

 

Their wedding pictures have been shown many times and he does not have breasts in the photos

He could have binded his breasts, much like Chaz Bono did, to flatten his breasts. He could be wrong about the size, but I don't believe Bruce was lying about having some breasts.

 

I am reminded of the late jazz musician, Billy Tipton, who was thought to be a man, but when he died, he was discovered to have been born a girl. There was a documentary on Billy's life and it was mentioned how he would bind his breasts. Here is Billy's story: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Tipton

 

 

Tipton kept the secret of his extrinsic sexual characteristics from Betty by inventing a story of having been in a serious car accident resulting in damaged genitals and broken ribs, and that it was necessary to bind the damaged chest to protect it. From then on, this was what he would tell the women in his life.

Edited April 27, 2015 by GreatKazu

[mostlylurking]

I hate to ever cut Kris some slack but I will in this case. As another poster said, his two previous ex wives divorced him decades ago, so they are very removed from all this. Kris and Bruce still have a relationship of sorts, so I'm sure it's tough on her. I also have to say that if it weren't for Kris managing Bruce and getting him back in shape financially he wouldn't have half of the security he has today. She's a nightmare, but she is a hustler in every sense of the word. A mere sex tape would not have been able to keep this family afloat and in the news for 8 years.

I hope Bruce can find his happiness now. I found him very genuine and emotional in the interview, and I think Diane Sawyer did a really great job and was very sensitive to his emotions. I think it's wonderful that he has the support of his children. Of course the paparazzi will still be the pack of vultures they always are, but at lest he has taken some of their power away by being open with his truth.

[Thula]

As happy as I am for Bruce, this whole thing smells like a big publicity stunt. I think he told his kids a couple of years ago when he and Kris separated, and they asked him to wait to transition until after North's first year, the Kim/Kanye wedding....basically until season 10 premiere when they ran out of big lead-in stories to grab viewers. The whole way the Kardashians are showing 'support' for Bruce has PR stamped all over it. They don't participate in the 20/20 special (albeit ABC is a rival network to NBC which owns E!), they wait until after the interview to see which way the wind is blowing and then show support (all of their tweets are basically rewording of same thing). Kris claims she wasn't asked for a comment (BS) and that she was watching the interview live with Bruce. Also a lie, Bruce was watching it with his first wife. Now Kim has launched into her post-interview publicity tour, and the spotlight is right back on the Kardashian Klan. Even Bruce's story about Kanye during the interview felt like a plug.

[Blakeston]

Regarding the term gender confirmation surgery, I know of a number of trans people who dislike it. They prefer the term "genital confirmation surgery," because they feel that calling it "gender confirmation surgery" suggests that someone's gender isn't confirmed until they have the surgery. Other trans people hate the term "genital confirmation surgery" because it places emphasis on a trans person's genitals, and they feel trans people are defined by their genitals enough already. And a good number of trans people still call it gender reassignment surgery.

 

Deciding which term to use is a tough call, and any choice is seen as offensive by someone. I agree that "gender confirmation surgery" is probably the safest way to go - but it's not necessarily the only appropriate term to use, either.

 

Okay this is gonna be unpopular but here goes.
First of all if Bruce is serious and being honest I hope this is everything he wants and needs the transition to be.
But I do feel he is delusional if he thinks that the Republican Party is going to take up the causes of the LGBT community. They're the one's fighting them now, that won't change because Bruce Jenner is involved. It's far more likely he'll be asked to stop identifying as Republican.

 

Bruce's comments on politics bothered me somewhat. I already knew about him having ties to the Republican party, and that didn't surprise me much, or stand out that much in my mind.

 

But to suggest that the Republicans will start embracing trans rights once they meet with him? That's not only naive, it's also arrogant. "Oh, they'll change their minds once they realize that someone like me is affected."

[Wings]

Regarding the term gender confirmation surgery, I know of a number of trans people who dislike it. They prefer the term "genital confirmation surgery," because they feel that calling it "gender confirmation surgery" suggests that someone's gender isn't confirmed until they have the surgery. Other trans people hate the term "genital confirmation surgery" because it places emphasis on a trans person's genitals, and they feel trans people are defined by their genitals enough already. And a good number of trans people still call it gender reassignment surgery.

 

Deciding which term to use is a tough call, and any choice is seen as offensive by someone. I agree that "gender confirmation surgery" is probably the safest way to go - but it's not necessarily the only appropriate term to use, either.

 

 

Bruce's comments on politics bothered me somewhat. I already knew about him having ties to the Republican party, and that didn't surprise me much, or stand out that much in my mind.

 

But to suggest that the Republicans will start embracing trans rights once they meet with him? That's not only naive, it's also arrogant. "Oh, they'll change their minds once they realize that someone like me is affected."

 

 

More and more people will understand when people like Bruce come out.  A star athlete has more power for a cause than someone of less celebrity, absolutely.  I don't remember him saying your exact quote but I do remember him talking about staying in the public eye and speaking to the subject.  

[Guest]

As happy as I am for Bruce, this whole thing smells like a big publicity stunt. I think he told his kids a couple of years ago when he and Kris separated, and they asked him to wait to transition until after North's first year, the Kim/Kanye wedding....basically until season 10 premiere when they ran out of big lead-in stories to grab viewers. The whole way the Kardashians are showing 'support' for Bruce has PR stamped all over it. 

"No comment" from Kris shown on screen with supportive comments from his first two wives is pretty bad PR.  

 

Why would they ask him to wait until North is older?  And that wedding was almost a year ago.  Do you think he's changing his gender as a publicity stunt?  Or being open about it as a publicity stunt?  

[gutette]

I was 100% Team Bruce until the completely idiotic "Well, *I* believe in the Constitution." comment. Ugh.

 

I'm reading this all over the internet today.  "Wow, be whoever you want to be, believe whatever you want to believe...unless who you are is conservative. Then, fuck off!"

[Blakeston]

More and more people will understand when people like Bruce come out.  A star athlete has more power for a cause than someone of less celebrity, absolutely.  I don't remember him saying your exact quote but I do remember him talking about staying in the public eye and speaking to the subject.  

I don't recall the exact quote either, but he went a lot further than just saying that he wanted to stay in the public eye and speak to the subject - or that he thought he might help more people understand.

 

He suggested that he was going to meet with his friend Mitch McConnell, and "get this all worked out," or something like that.

[Wings]

I don't recall the exact quote either, but he went a lot further than just saying that he wanted to stay in the public eye and speak to the subject - or that he thought he might help more people understand.

 

He suggested that he was going to meet with his friend Mitch McConnell, and "get this all worked out," or something like that.

 

I remember his comment (get this all worked out) being light with bit of dry wit tossed in.  It will be a long road for transgender people to be viewed with respect and understanding and he knows it.  

-----------------------------

His comment about the constitution made no sense to me.   Declaration of Independence, maybe.  Not sure why that is causing a stir though.  Much ado about nothing. 

[Guest]

I remember his comment (get this all worked out) being light with bit of dry wit tossed in.  It will be a long road for transgender people to be viewed with respect and understanding and he knows it.  

-----------------------------

His comment about the constitution made no sense to me.   Declaration of Independence, maybe.  Not sure why that is causing a stir though.  Much ado about nothing. 

Diane asked him if he'd go talk to those Republicans, too.  Bruce didn't just offer it up.  

 

I think he was referring to a 'conservative interpretation of the constitution'.  The constitution limits federal government.  Conservatives believe in taking that more seriously and putting the onus on the people to fix their problems, not government programs.  So I guess a McConnell or Boehner would probably say, "What do you want the federal government to do about your gender problem?"  As in sarcastically, I mean.  But I know almost nothing about politics so maybe I'm wrong about them.  But I think that's what was behind Diane's incredulity.  

[Blakeston]

I remember his comment (get this all worked out) being light with bit of dry wit tossed in.  It will be a long road for transgender people to be viewed with respect and understanding and he knows it.   

 

You took it as sarcasm, about how it's unlikely that Republican politicians are going to embrace trans rights anytime soon? That seems like an odd thing for him to do, after singing the party's praises.

[GreatKazu]

 

. They don't participate in the 20/20 special (albeit ABC is a rival network to NBC which owns E!), they wait until after the interview to see which way the wind is blowing and then show support

And I am certain if the Kardashians had participated in this special, people would be slamming it because they appeared in it. The feeling would likely be, "how dare they try to get the focus on them when it is Bruce's story" or, "They are always seeking attention, those famewhores."

 

Bruce stated if Kris had been okay being married to a female, they wouldn't have divorced. Didn't Bruce say his first wife was more aware of what he was feeling? If so, it makes me wonder if she would have been willing to stay married to Bruce after the transition? After all, it was his "roving ways" that caused them to separate, not what he was feeling or what he had told her about himself. It seems, to me at least, his first wife was likely the one who would have been happy to be married to Bruce even after the change.

[thefog]

I hate to ever cut Kris some slack but I will in this case. As another poster said, his two previous ex wives divorced him decades ago, so they are very removed from all this. Kris and Bruce still have a relationship of sorts, so I'm sure it's tough on her. I also have to say that if it weren't for Kris managing Bruce and getting him back in shape financially he wouldn't have half of the security he has today. She's a nightmare, but she is a hustler in every sense of the word. A mere sex tape would not have been able to keep this family afloat and in the news for 8 years.

Unpopular opinion here - but it also sounds like Kris' situation was different than the first 2 wives - where Bruce had confided in them that he was a transgender.  Whereas with Kris, he never went that deep, so it just came off as cross dressing.  There has to be some hurt on Kris's part, especially after all these years.  And it sounded like that's what eventually broke the marriage up.

Edited April 27, 2015 by escape

[Wings]

You took it as sarcasm, about how it's unlikely that Republican politicians are going to embrace trans rights anytime soon? That seems like an odd thing for him to do, after singing the party's praises.

 

I took it as a general eye roll with humor, thinking anyone could embrace trans gender easily from a meeting with him thus his sarcastic comment "get this all worked out."   I did not give it much thought until now though!   I don't watch the show and I was pleasantly surprised to see what a nifty man he is.  I really like him.  I am liberal and really don't care that he is Republican.  

Diane asked him if he'd go talk to those Republicans, too.  Bruce didn't just offer it up.  

 

I think he was referring to a 'conservative interpretation of the constitution'.  The constitution limits federal government.  Conservatives believe in taking that more seriously and putting the onus on the people to fix their problems, not government programs.  So I guess a McConnell or Boehner would probably say, "What do you want the federal government to do about your gender problem?"  As in sarcastically, I mean.  But I know almost nothing about politics so maybe I'm wrong about them.  But I think that's what was behind Diane's incredulity.  

 

Yes, to this.  

Edited April 28, 2015 by wings707

[GreatKazu]

Unpopular opinion here - but it also sounds like Kris' situation was different than the first 2 wives - where Bruce had confided in them that he was a transgender.  Whereas with Kris, he never went that deep, so it just came off as cross dressing.  There has to be some hurt on Kris's part, especially after all these years.  And it sounded like that's what eventually broke the marriage up.

Not true about the first wives knowing all about Bruce's feelings.  According to Linda Thompson, she is quoted today as saying if she had known about Bruce's feelings about wanting to be a female, she never would have married him. She found out after they were married and had children.  This is part of her interview:

 

 

Linda Thompson said there were no clues that Bruce was living a lie–as he said numerous times during his interview with Diane Sawyer on Friday. She had no clue, in fact, until he confessed his true feelings to her.

 

“When Brody was about 18-months-old and Brandon was about three-and-a-half-years-old, Bruce came to me one day with a very somber look on his face and said, ‘There’s something about me that I really need to tell you, something you need to know,'” she wrote.

 

“Bruce lamented, ‘I have lived in the wrong skin, the wrong body, my whole life. It is a living hell for me, and I really feel that I would like to move forward with the process of becoming a woman, the woman I have always been inside,'” she added.

Edited April 28, 2015 by GreatKazu

[gutette]

It's far more likely he'll be asked to stop identifying as Republican.

 

That's actually first on the agenda at the next meeting.

[thefog]

Not true about the first wives knowing all about Bruce's feelings.  According to Linda Thompson, she is quoted today as saying if she had known about Bruce's feelings about wanting to be a female, she never would have married him. She found out after they were married and had children.  This is part of her interview:

I never said anything about them knowing before they were married.  Bruce had confided in both his first 2 wives after they were married that he wanted to be a woman.  He said that Kris saw him cross-dressing, but that he never got into a deep conversation with her about it.  Someone who cross dress may not necessarily be transgender.

Edited April 28, 2015 by escape

[GreatKazu]

I never said anything about them knowing before they were married.  Bruce had confided in both his first 2 wives after they were married that he wanted to be a woman. 

Gotcha. My misunderstanding.

[iwasish]

I never said anything about them knowing before they were married.  Bruce had confided in both his first 2 wives after they were married that he wanted to be a woman.  He said that Kris saw him cross-dressing, but that he never got into a deep conversation with her about it.  Someone who cross dress may not necessarily be transgender.

He had already started hormone therapy and hair removal processes when he met Kris, did he ever say why exactly he stopped the hormones and basically shelved the idea of living as a woman? I have to rewatch to catch the time line of some of it. I did get the impression that Kris was instrumental in his decision. If she was anything like she is now back then, I think she stream rolled him into it. He seems to be a very passive person. 

[truthaboutluv]

He had already started hormone therapy and hair removal processes when he met Kris, did he ever say why exactly he stopped the hormones and basically shelved the idea of living as a woman?

 

 

I believe he said he more or less chickened out and the fear of telling his children and the world knowing made him stop.

[wrestlesflamingos]

That has to be difficult, to fear the loss of your family.

[Darknight]

Exactly. There have been people who have been caught selling patient's social security numbers to those who who in turn sell social security cards to people who come here illegally. It is not far-fetched to think a person working at the medical office where Bruce went to, had an employee who has access to his files and just made a quick call to TMZ. As a matter of fact, back in 2013, Cedars Sinai hospital fired several employees for breaching patient privacy. There was a breach where 14 patients' medical files were looked at by employees, and Kim Kardashian's file just happened to be one of them:

http://www.tmz.com/2013/07/13/kim-kardashian-cedars-sinai-medical-center-hospital-records-leaked/

It also happened when Rihanna's photo of her battered face sprung up on gossip sites. The police department stated it was an internal leak that shouldn't have happened. It also happened when Michael Jackson died. All it takes is for TMZ to pay a janitor or someone who works in a facility who is desperate for some quick cash. Here is an article on this very matter where TMZ is accused of such practices:

http://americanpowerblog.blogspot.com/2009/06/tmz-said-to-pay-for-tips-quotes.html

Within that article is a link to a Los Angeles Time article about TMZ's tactics. Here it is:

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/jun/28/entertainment/et-tmz28

Someone here noted people watched this special because of the Kardashian connection. I wouldn't doubt it. Bruce was a big part of that show. Just today my nephew's wife - she is 25 - asked me what I thought about Bruce. I was stunned for a moment, but then I quickly realized she watches KUWTK. I told her I applaud him and waited to hear her opinion. She is happy for him and she mentioned how she felt for him because he had to wait all of these years before he felt comfortable to be himself.

Wow thus is so wrong. There are HIPPA laws for a reason. I can't imagine important information that's supposed to be confidential leaking out. Can't believe that's how TMZ gets their stories

[Darknight]

You took it as sarcasm, about how it's unlikely that Republican politicians are going to embrace trans rights anytime soon? That seems like an odd thing for him to do, after singing the party's praises.

They might pretend to accept it. It's kinda like when some say they have one black friend but aren't racist or against black people

[bluebonnet]

For anyone wondering if Bruce Jenner's announcement could actually change things, we're already seeing some subtle change from comedians.  

 

 

 

A funny thing happened on Monday night. Although Bruce Jenner had just come out as a transgender woman in a groundbreaking interview with Diane Sawyer, almost every late-night comedian who joked about the story did so respectfully and creatively.

Which is harder: Winning an Olympic decathlon or singlehandedly changing the tone of jokes about transgender people? They’re different challenges, each daunting in their own right, but Bruce Jenner has made both of them look easy.

The late-night comedy crowd has long subjected Jenner and other transgender people to cheap jokes, some of which were re-aired in the middle of the Sawyer interview.