S07.E02: New House, Old Grudges

[LIMOM]

Oh I love Sonjia's place! It needs repairs, but I'll take it any day of the week and twice in Sunday. As for the parking lot. Ehh. You're in Manhatten. There are worse neighbors. It's probably pretty quiet, has built in security, and provides tons of parking for your guests. Better than being next to a nightclub or even a noisy apartment building in some ways.

The only plus for me is the proximity to Bloomies!

Being adjacent to a parking garage is such a disadvantage IMO, between the noise, littering and on lookers.

There is Spike Lee townhouse for sale across the street for less money as well. Sonja is not being practical.

On the other hand, that is all she has left from her time of being associated to America's blue blood. I can totally understand her attachment to her house.

Edited April 20, 2015 by LIMOM

[ScoobieDoobs]

The only plus for me is the proximity to Bloomies!

Being adjacent to a parking garage is such a disadvantage IMO, between the noise, littering and on lookers.

 

 

Well, I'm only a few blocks away, so I'm way over being near Bloomies.  I pass by Sonja's place all the time on my way to the subway.  From the outside, Sonja's townhouse looks nicely kept & rather charming.  But it's definitely the tiniest place on the block.  And the garage next door is so busy & noisy, with cars constantly coming & going, that I've ever seen.  It seems to vibrate the ground too.  Oy, can't be fun being on top of that.  Still say someone would absolutely buy it at the right price, which would certainly be millions.  Surprised Ryan & Fredrick aren't all over Sonja, or do they focus their efforts only on downtown?

 

What's the deal on Dorinda?  Is she jealous of Sonja cuz she has her own townhouse & Dorinda just has that cramped ho-hum condo/rental, which a billion other middle-aged women have in the neighborhood?  Could be, could be.  We can snark on Sonja for the interns/slaves & no hot water & being on top of a garage & everything falling apart around her.  That's easy.  Seems to me, having your own townhouse in Manhattan is pretty freakin' cool, & not too many peeps can make that claim.

Edited April 20, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[Sincerely Yours]

I think Bethenny is naturally witty and can easily come up with a quick, funny comeback in any conversation. That's what I liked about her during her first run on the show. Now that she's back, I get the impression that she think she needs to play that up as much as possible since it is what she is known for. So, I think you're right, she's turned it up to 11, to the point that it doesn't feel spontaneous anymore. She talks a million miles an hour and throws out zingers so fast that it comes off as her trying way too hard.  

 

On an unrelated note, Dorinda's Berkshire getaway was mentioned a couple of times. I hope we get to see it at some point this season.

I think her comebacks are soooo lame and the reason why she does get so many memorable one's is cause she shoots out about a million of them at once so definitely agreed on that point. I mean she babbles and babbles and then she says something randomly odd so it give the illusion of it being witty. Like that comment about the Emperor has no clothes... I mean what? I think I get it but not really but it sounded good I guess. I mean that's how I take most of her "comebacks" or "wittiness" I don't know but I hardly ever get that official clever "read" from her even though I know this ain't RHOA but still. It never really lands well even if it is a good one so yeah, Bethenny doesn't really impress me at all with anything she says. We'll see where her storyline goes cause aside from being ridiculously intense and defensive and abrasive for no real reason I can't see what else she has to add. I mean, things around her business, sure but if the only aspect of her business is going to be about how "hectic" everything is and she's working out of the car and hotels then blah.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[Sincerely Yours]

I was thinking about Ramona's apology to LuAnn and was thinking that Bethenny kind of owes LuAnn one too…not that it will ever happen. I'm thinking of their Hamptons meeting when LuAnn referenced not seeing Bethenny that summer, and going through a challenging time (her divorce from the Count). Bethenny said, "I sent flowers," and LuAnn said (in a TH) "I didn't want flowers…I needed a hug."

 

I don't know if Bethenny thought she really was making a sincere gesture, and was clueless about flowers being a sufficient expression for someone going through a divorce…or maybe she just didn't care about LuAnn enough to be there for her. I wonder if B has similarly had her own epiphany about LuAnn, now that she's going thru the same thing.

 

 

But Dorinda's not in any danger of foreclosing and she has a second home that she presumably will not have to sell to support bad business decisions. Unless Sonja's interns live with her, I suspect that she cuts off heat to the upper floors to save money. I'd have thought that Sonja would know that bitterness is not a good look on her.

Funny, Bethenny did the whole "I sent flowers" thing for Bobby too. When he was in the hospital. I know Jill Zarin is supposed to be "the scum of the earth" but I do think Jill made a valid point. Bethenny kept making excuses about not knowing the severity or seriousness of the surgery but at the same time if you're really close friends with someone the way Jill and Bethenny were you push a little harder for details. Make sure things are in fact on the up and up etc. etc. I mean I get it Bethenny was busy and that's fine but at least own the fact that you dropped the ball a bit on something important. I always felt that Jill got a raw deal about that. Yeah, Jill is the type to hype it up but this is her husband. He is important to her and whether or not others think it's a commonplace surgery with lower level of risks I'm sure it was unnerving for Jill nonetheless so a bouquet of flowers from her close friend? I can see why she felt Bethenny fell short in the friend department.  It's where Bethenny gets defensive and doesn't just say "I see that it meant a lot to you, I'm sorry I didn't make a more personal attempt it wasn't my intention to make you think I don't take Bobby's health seriously". She was too busy mapping together what Jill agenda was and honestly agenda or no agenda the subject matter is pretty cut and dry so trying to pick it apart and apply your logic to portions of the ideal just seemed a bit insensitive. I get that Bethenny had a slightly legitimate excuse but the fact that she still wanted to put Jill on the defensive about just how "severe" it "really" was (sort of like, oh come on now Jill you know that shit wasn't all that serious). That left me rather cold.

 

Now considering her lukewarm friendship with Luanne I can see why Bethenny would think flowers would be enough. Also, Bethenny doesn't do "personal" too well anyway so I totally see her using the very basic etiquette and niceties to handle really sensitive situations in her "friends" lives. Material things to convey the message that her thoughts are with you cause it doesn't seem like giving out hugs is her thing even if she really is emotionally invested in whatever's going on. I will give Bethenny that but the problem I've always had with her is that she knows this but when it comes down to someone addressing it she has all these excuses and reasons and XYZ but can never just say hey I'm sorry you felt it wasn't as personal as it should have been just know that in my heart and way of doing things acknowledgement of some event through flowers or well wishes from afar is the equivalent of me sending you hugs. That's what I got. The sincerity is there, take it or leave it. Instead she likes to spin it like she's being treated unfairly or responded to in an insensitive, non-understanding way. Bethenny needs to learn how to incorporate her way of being into what the society's norms are. I mean she doesn't HAVE to but if she doesn't want to keep being chastised for not complying with the normalcies of relationships then she should be less condescending of other people expectations of friends and be clear about the sincerity of her efforts instead of snubbing those that question it in the first place. Give and take Bethenny, give and take.

[robroy]

Okay- so whoever said to go read their blogs for context gets the cookie for today.

 

Mother of Mary is Sonja delusional. Her light snark on Luann's house explodes by 10X in the blog. She apparently thinks that Luann (who knows how to hold to a budget & whose ex made his $ by being a financial wiz) and Ramona (who could probably haggle with the devil himself) do not understand real estate at all. Per STM-real estate is investing- you make money buying not selling??? My mind is blown. This daffy broad really thinks spending money is the equivalent of making money?

 

Dear Sexy J- you might gain wealth/equity by wisely purchasing real estate but to convert that into money you either need to sell it or you need it provide some type of rental income. Sonja does not have the income to purchase/hold appreciating properties at will. And your primary residence is not a source of income if you are living in 100% of the available space. At least Simon/Alex squeezed a couple of rental units from their digs and sold for multiple millions to actually realize a profit.

And not to be pissy but Sonja didn't sell her property in France- the court listed/sold it for her. But not before significant sheep damage had occurred. Sheep damage- happens to the Rothschilds and Rockerfellers All.The.Time!

[robroy]

Oh- I forgot to correct something up thread. IIRC- Bethenney sent Luann a gift basket of Skinny Girl products when the divorce went down. I like Lu but it would have been an awesome dis had Bethenney not steadfastly thought it was an appropriate offering. 

She really should pen an advice directive on which Skinny Girl merchandise is most appropriate for the various milestones in life. 

[LIMOM]

What is Sheep Damage?

[KFC]

Funny, Bethenny did the whole "I sent flowers" thing for Bobby too. When he was in the hospital. I know Jill Zarin is supposed to be "the scum of the earth" but I do think Jill made a valid point. Bethenny kept making excuses about not knowing the severity or seriousness of the surgery but at the same time if you're really close friends with someone the way Jill and Bethenny were you push a little harder for details. Make sure things are in fact on the up and up etc. etc. I mean I get it Bethenny was busy and that's fine but at least own the fact that you dropped the ball a bit on something important. I always felt that Jill got a raw deal about that. Yeah, Jill is the type to hype it up but this is her husband. He is important to her and whether or not others think it's a commonplace surgery with lower level of risks I'm sure it was unnerving for Jill nonetheless so a bouquet of flowers from her close friend? I can see why she felt Bethenny fell short in the friend department.  It's where Bethenny gets defensive and doesn't just say "I see that it meant a lot to you, I'm sorry I didn't make a more personal attempt it wasn't my intention to make you think I don't take Bobby's health seriously".

 

I just watched several episode of S3 over the weekend, and I have to jump in to defend Bethenny here. Who, again, I'm sure is an unpleasant person in real life, but based on the pieces we were presented with on the show, I really can't side with Jill at all on this matter. Jill and Bobby were snapped at parties in the Hamptons during this time, and Bethenny and Jill had already been in a bit of a fallout over the spinoff/The Today Show/Bethenny getting the Kentucky Derby invite/etc. My timeline might be a little off, but to me it sounded more like there was already some lingering issues between the two women, and that combined with the fact that Bethenny was off doing press/her book tours, circumstances limited the amount of communication between them.

 

So between that, Jill not disclosing all the information to Bethenny, and the pap pictures of Jill and Bobby, I can absolutely see why Bethenny wouldn't have made more of an effort to reach out to Jill. And all that aside, what I found so odious about Jill's behavior is that she basically was storing up all her grievances against Bethenny and withholding information from her so that she could gain the upper hand in launching her "feud" on the actual show. I don't think Bethenny is good enough of an actress to fake the way she seemed so blindsided by Jill's level of animosity toward her during S3. I genuinely think Jill left her in the dark intentionally until the cameras rolled so as not to give Bethenny any space to defend herself.

 

It took calculating to a whole new level of inappropriate. But then again, we're talking about the same woman who created fake Amazon.com profiles to boost her book's ratings. They're both controlling and calculating women, which might be why they initially bonded when Bethenny was still the "struggling" single girl.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Okay- so whoever said to go read their blogs for context gets the cookie for today.

 

 

Raising hand here & waving hello, hello, hello.  My post is just a wee bit above, but sorry you don't know who I am.  Anyhoo, I'll still take your cookie, even tho you don't know who I am, but it better not be a SkinnyGirl piece of crap.

 

I think her comebacks are soooo lame and the reason why she does get so many memorable one's is cause she shoots out about a million of them at once so definitely agreed on that point.

 

 

Well, that's the thing about B.  She throws a ton of shit out there, hoping something will stick (and be entertaining/funny).  Quite frankly, I'd find Bethenny's nervous energy draining & way too exhausting to want anything to do with or be anywhere near in real life.  Me?  I'd avoid her at all costs.  But I fully believe this nervous energy & her drive is what's responsible for her extreme success.  And this nervous energy of hers (as I suspected it would) is saving this show.  Without Bethenny, this show would have died a quick death.  I'm curious what, if anything, Heather & Kristen are gonna do to make their respective presences known.  Cuz as of now, they aren't needed in the least.

 

I just saw that awful, boring, annoying, non-entity Billy Bush interviewing Carole.  She said she's "good friends" with Bethenny & went to Miami with her on a "girls trip".  Ah, smart gal, that Carole.  Her strategy is to smooch up to B cuz she figures that's a way for her to have some sliver of relevancy to stay on the show.  Despite Carole saying she's not sure whether she wants to continue to be on the show, I say bullshit.  She'll be on the show as long as they'll have her cuz she needs to promote her books/whatever.

Edited April 21, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[Sincerely Yours]

I just watched several episode of S3 over the weekend, and I have to jump in to defend Bethenny here. Who, again, I'm sure is an unpleasant person in real life, but based on the pieces we were presented with on the show, I really can't side with Jill at all on this matter. Jill and Bobby were snapped at parties in the Hamptons during this time, and Bethenny and Jill had already been in a bit of a fallout over the spinoff/The Today Show/Bethenny getting the Kentucky Derby invite/etc. My timeline might be a little off, but to me it sounded more like there was already some lingering issues between the two women, and that combined with the fact that Bethenny was off doing press/her book tours, circumstances limited the amount of communication between them.

 

So between that, Jill not disclosing all the information to Bethenny, and the pap pictures of Jill and Bobby, I can absolutely see why Bethenny wouldn't have made more of an effort to reach out to Jill. And all that aside, what I found so odious about Jill's behavior is that she basically was storing up all her grievances against Bethenny and withholding information from her so that she could gain the upper hand in launching her "feud" on the actual show. I don't think Bethenny is good enough of an actress to fake the way she seemed so blindsided by Jill's level of animosity toward her during S3. I genuinely think Jill left her in the dark intentionally until the cameras rolled so as not to give Bethenny any space to defend herself.

 

It took calculating to a whole new level of inappropriate. But then again, we're talking about the same woman who created fake Amazon.com profiles to boost her book's ratings. They're both controlling and calculating women, which might be why they initially bonded when Bethenny was still the "struggling" single girl.

But she knew enough to send flowers. That's what stands out to me. I admit I'm going off of complete memory from seasons ago but my thing is even when things are strained between friends, health trumps all else so if Bethenny knew enough to send flowers then there should have been a more of an effort to be completely informed. I do realize that Jill's approach to it did nothing for the point she was trying to make but I still think Bethenny was expecting more understanding than she deserved. I don't really mind that Bethenny fell short I mind that she seems to get offended when people apply very common reactions to her social ineptness. I do get that Bethenny feels like these social norms are a burden inflicted upon her because in her mind there's no "normal" and she's on the other end of what's considered "warm and fuzzy" but at the same time I feel that she leans on that waaaaaay too much especially when she wants to get out of feeling guilty. This isn't the perfect example but with Bethenny, she seems to think that it's okay play fast and loose with other people expectation because she's not as "traditional" as other people or takes basic social etiquittes as "law" and I find thats one of the biggest reasons I don't take a liking to her.

[racked]

Funny, Bethenny did the whole "I sent flowers" thing for Bobby too. When he was in the hospital. I know Jill Zarin is supposed to be "the scum of the earth" but I do think Jill made a valid point. Bethenny kept making excuses about not knowing the severity or seriousness of the surgery but at the same time if you're really close friends with someone the way Jill and Bethenny were you push a little harder for details. Make sure things are in fact on the up and up etc. etc. I mean I get it Bethenny was busy and that's fine but at least own the fact that you dropped the ball a bit on something important. I always felt that Jill got a raw deal about that. Yeah, Jill is the type to hype it up but this is her husband. He is important to her and whether or not others think it's a commonplace surgery with lower level of risks I'm sure it was unnerving for Jill nonetheless so a bouquet of flowers from her close friend? I can see why she felt Bethenny fell short in the friend department.  It's where Bethenny gets defensive and doesn't just say "I see that it meant a lot to you, I'm sorry I didn't make a more personal attempt it wasn't my intention to make you think I don't take Bobby's health seriously". She was too busy mapping together what Jill agenda was and honestly agenda or no agenda the subject matter is pretty cut and dry so trying to pick it apart and apply your logic to portions of the ideal just seemed a bit insensitive. I get that Bethenny had a slightly legitimate excuse but the fact that she still wanted to put Jill on the defensive about just how "severe" it "really" was (sort of like, oh come on now Jill you know that shit wasn't all that serious). That left me rather cold. 

 

I never completely understood what went down between Bethenny and Jill and how much of it was fake and how much was real. I may be the only person left who still really likes Jill Zarin. I know she can be awful and I don't feel the need to defend her at all, but I still get a kick out of her. I can't help it, I still enjoy Nene too.  I think the story that is out now is that Jill made up the whole falling out to have a storyline but didn't tell Bethenny? But I always thought Jill was jealous Bethenny was getting all this attention, felt she was the reason Bethenny was brought on the show and she brought Bethenny under her wing, and Bethenny was abandoning her now that she was getting fame and money.  But I also thought there was some genuine hurt there, that Bethenny didn't seem that concerned about Bobby.  I just don't know how much of any of that was real and how much was fake. 

[mostlylurking]

But I seem to remember B telling some stories about how she was late to parties/events for the first season of the show cuz she couldn't even afford to take a cab, so she took the subway, which made often her late.

 

I like B, but if she said this she is completely full of BS.  Trying to get around NYC at any time especially during midday is MUCH easier and faster using the subway rather than a cab.  I use the subway frequently and I have seen some celebrities who can surely afford a driver if they wanted.  B spending all day being driven around is just odd (where is she always going??) and for someone who proclaims herself to be such an astute business woman it is a gross waste of time and productivity.  Apparently she brings Cookie with her too??  Don't get it.

 

LOVED Luann's new home!  I think it is beautiful and the view spectacular.  Sonja tried to get a dig in by saying it was "cozy" but obvi that was the jealousy talking.  I don't get bringing the beer.  Was she just trying to be "zany Sonja"?  It just seemed a little pathetic.

[mostlylurking]

ETA:  Oops I forgot to add that I also believe Ramona's apology was genuine.  She took responsibility and did not get all offended when Luann was cautious.  I thought Luann's initial reaction to hug Ramona was also very kind.

 

Ramona is batshit crazy at times, but I don't think she has a bad heart.  I remember last year when Sonja went off on her for something ridiculous and Ramona just responded by saying "you're right, I'm sorry" and trying to diffuse the situation, because it's clear Sonja is just looney.

[Grneyedldy]

While I agree with you it was one of the stupider arguments in the history of arguments, I don't see a production hand. I think it was just Ramona being Ramona. She has a weird thing about etiquette rules. She's always pulling these random etiquette rules out of the air and making them into hills to die on. I've always said that she does this "memorize an Emily Post book" thing to hide the fact that she doesn't really get human interaction. Plus she was already irritated with Bethany. I thought her making a giant production out of a perceived social slight over an archaic point of behavior was a total Ramonacoster move.

It was a strange argument and I agree with you that I don't think it was producer driven. Did anyone else notice the scene with Ramona and Dorinda (in Ramona's kitchen) when Sonja arrived...........Dorinda was putting napkin rings on napkins and they showed a stack of plates and other dishes? I was expecting them to show that Ramona really had been planning to host a brunch. Then she talked about the restaurant and we later see them at the restaurant. Hmm

[robroy]

I misspoke earlier. She had boar damage not sheep damage. But I swear another article made it sound like some damage was to the house & this says just the grounds..

 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/06/17/sonja-morgan-loses-french-home-to-bankruptcy-plus-her-rhony-salary-revealed/

 

Scoobie- thanks for reminding me of the blogs. Almost better than the show.

 

I wonder if the Sonja cray-cray or battle of the she-devils is part of a larger arc or simply a temporary scenario.  I think Beth and Ramona are pretty much the only one either fear during filming at this point. Its like the two poster children for addicted & dysfunctional parents can both read that the other is out of fucks and out for blood.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

I loved that, too!  One of my favorite Countess moments (right up there with "Even Louis Vuitton makes mistakes, darling" to Alex McCord after Morocco).

I am quite partial to "This is not the Four Seasons this is Mo-ROCC-oh" from the Countess as well. :-)

[LIMOM]

I misspoke earlier. She had boar damage not sheep damage. But I swear another article made it sound like some damage was to the house & this says just the grounds..

 

http://www.realitytea.com/2014/06/17/sonja-morgan-loses-french-home-to-bankruptcy-plus-her-rhony-salary-revealed/

 

Scoobie- thanks for reminding me of the blogs. Almost better than the show.

 

I wonder if the Sonja cray-cray or battle of the she-devils is part of a larger arc or simply a temporary scenario.  I think Beth and Ramona are pretty much the only one either fear during filming at this point. Its like the two poster children for addicted & dysfunctional parents can both read that the other is out of fucks and out for blood.

Oh thanks for the details. I never heard of any houses being damaged on the coast . Where was her house located?

[ridethemaverick]

Ugh, Bethenny. There was no ten year old slang this week but her THs were still annoying as hell. It used to be effortless but now it's just trying too hard. Stay thirsty, my friend.

Ramona is hilarious. She'd be exhausting to be around (along with her bestie) but she's so fun to watch.

Whatever Carole did to her face really worked. She looks great.

Lu's house is fabulous. THAT is why I watch these shows.

[FamilyVan]

Do me a favor and click on the link shoegal posted above, and I think it will become clear. Well, it did for me - HE'S A HIPPIE!

 

 

Re; Carol - I think her and the chef are both into the 4:20 club.  He was like "she seems fun" uh huh.  This is what is bridging their age gap.

 

I though Carol sounded super dumb when she was like "I am very attracted to very attractive men" - yeah you and everyone else - who isn't?  Oh Carole you think you are so unique with your quirky attraction to attractive men!  You're so set apart from everyone else who is not attracted to very attractive men.  LOL

[ElsieH]

I though Carol sounded super dumb when she was like "I am very attracted to very attractive men" - yeah you and everyone else - who isn't?

 

Dorinda maybe?

Edited April 30, 2015 by ElsieH

[aradia22]

I do not believe that Luanne forgave Ramona when she apologized/believed her apology. Though Ramona is becoming a slightly better actress. I'll give her that. 

 

Oh, here we go again with Carole's dating adventures. I really couldn't care less. Though I will say that if I think the guy looks boyish, he's probably out of her age range. 

 

It continues to annoy me when the newer ladies comment on the more established cast members' lives like they have any idea what they're talking about. They met them what, 2-3 years ago? Calm down. It's the same feeling as when psychologists and psychics and whatnot on the news comment about celebrities they've never met in person. 

 

Sonja is awful. In a funny way... but still. Constantly bringing up Mario... 

 

Luanne's new house seems really nice. I like that she doesn't have this whole team of people. She has a chef but her son still helps with the cooking. 

 

Why does Heather keep calling everyone "mama"?

 

I'm intrigued by all the ways Dorinda is attached to people in the cast. It means her loyalties could go a lot of different ways. 

 

If I didn't already like Bethenny, she would have won me over by making Ramona realize she'd just called herself an old dog. 

 

Don't come after Bethenny, Heather. Sit down.

 

I'm really going to have fun with Bethenny if she keeps calling the ladies on the stupid shit they say.

 

Ramona is ridiculous. Bethenny won that exchange.

 

I enjoyed how little Kristen talked this episode. 

[tribeca]

Still catching up.  Since I detest Bethany wondering if I can hang in this season.  This was my favorite HW show but I only really started watching it after B. left.

[MatildaMoody]

Funny, Bethenny did the whole "I sent flowers" thing for Bobby too. When he was in the hospital. I know Jill Zarin is supposed to be "the scum of the earth" but I do think Jill made a valid point. Bethenny kept making excuses about not knowing the severity or seriousness of the surgery but at the same time if you're really close friends with someone the way Jill and Bethenny were you push a little harder for details. Make sure things are in fact on the up and up etc. etc. I mean I get it Bethenny was busy and that's fine but at least own the fact that you dropped the ball a bit on something important. I always felt that Jill got a raw deal about that. Yeah, Jill is the type to hype it up but this is her husband. He is important to her and whether or not others think it's a commonplace surgery with lower level of risks I'm sure it was unnerving for Jill nonetheless so a bouquet of flowers from her close friend? I can see why she felt Bethenny fell short in the friend department.  It's where Bethenny gets defensive and doesn't just say "I see that it meant a lot to you, I'm sorry I didn't make a more personal attempt it wasn't my intention to make you think I don't take Bobby's health seriously". She was too busy mapping together what Jill agenda was and honestly agenda or no agenda the subject matter is pretty cut and dry so trying to pick it apart and apply your logic to portions of the ideal just seemed a bit insensitive. I get that Bethenny had a slightly legitimate excuse but the fact that she still wanted to put Jill on the defensive about just how "severe" it "really" was (sort of like, oh come on now Jill you know that shit wasn't all that serious). That left me rather cold.

 

Now considering her lukewarm friendship with Luanne I can see why Bethenny would think flowers would be enough. Also, Bethenny doesn't do "personal" too well anyway so I totally see her using the very basic etiquette and niceties to handle really sensitive situations in her "friends" lives. Material things to convey the message that her thoughts are with you cause it doesn't seem like giving out hugs is her thing even if she really is emotionally invested in whatever's going on. I will give Bethenny that but the problem I've always had with her is that she knows this but when it comes down to someone addressing it she has all these excuses and reasons and XYZ but can never just say hey I'm sorry you felt it wasn't as personal as it should have been just know that in my heart and way of doing things acknowledgement of some event through flowers or well wishes from afar is the equivalent of me sending you hugs. That's what I got. The sincerity is there, take it or leave it. Instead she likes to spin it like she's being treated unfairly or responded to in an insensitive, non-understanding way. Bethenny needs to learn how to incorporate her way of being into what the society's norms are. I mean she doesn't HAVE to but if she doesn't want to keep being chastised for not complying with the normalcies of relationships then she should be less condescending of other people expectations of friends and be clear about the sincerity of her efforts instead of snubbing those that question it in the first place. Give and take Bethenny, give and take.

 

 

Remember though, that while Bobby was having this surgery, Jill was partying in the Hamptons, so it's not like Jill treated it as a high risk surgery either. It only became a high risk "throat cut from ear to ear" surgery when the cameras turned on for filming. That was one of the things that really bugged me about that entire feud. Jill was exploiting Bobby's cancer as a way to gain the upper hand in an argument that she created for story line purposes. Bobby on the other hand, was grateful for the flowers (Bethenny sent them to Bobby not Jill, which is as it should have been), and thought that Jill was being silly by fighting with Bethenny over any of it. 

Edited May 11, 2015 by MatildaMoody

[Leroux]

Remember though, that while Bobby was having this surgery, Jill was partying in the Hamptons, so it's not like Jill treated it as a high risk surgery either. It only became a high risk "throat cut from ear to ear" surgery when the cameras turned on for filming. That was one of the things that really bugged me about that entire feud. Jill was exploiting Bobby's cancer as a way to gain the upper hand in an argument that she created for story line purposes. Bobby on the other hand, was grateful for the flowers (Bethenny sent them to Bobby not Jill, which is as it should have been), and thought that Jill was being silly by fighting with Bethenny over any of it. 

 

The way Jill used Bobby's cancer scare against Bethenny was awful and only speaks volumes to the lenghts that Jill would go to get rid of Bethenny.

 

Jill dared to send emails to her other castmembers to request they isolate Bethenny and refused to film with her as a way to punish Bethenny because she got the spin off and Bravo rejected the idea of a spin off with both of them that Jill was trying to pitch. Jill just couldn't cope with the idea that Bravo wanted no part of her as a solo act and then tried to fabricate a feud against Bethenny to have an excuse as to why she was not filming with her.

 

When Jill realized that she had gone too far, it was too late, Alex and Ramona probably told Bethenny about the e-mail and Bethenny realized that behind all this was a horrid woman who was never her friend so she broke the friendship clean. Jill can try to explain her behavior any way she want and try to rewrite history but by her own mouth we learned that she came to Andy with the idea of creating a fake fall out with Bethenny (without letting Bethenny know) and that Andy tried to talk her out of it but Jill already had a plan and she went for it.

 

I know it must have hurt Jill that every single venture she took on the show went south all while Bethenny's products were selling like crazy but the way she went about this whole friendship was the true mark of her character and how low and dirty she is willing to fight when things do not go her way.

[MatildaMoody]

The way Jill used Bobby's cancer scare against Bethenny was awful and only speaks volumes to the lenghts that Jill would go to get rid of Bethenny.

 

Jill dared to send emails to her other castmembers to request they isolate Bethenny and refused to film with her as a way to punish Bethenny because she got the spin off and Bravo rejected the idea of a spin off with both of them that Jill was trying to pitch. Jill just couldn't cope with the idea that Bravo wanted no part of her as a solo act and then tried to fabricate a feud against Bethenny to have an excuse as to why she was not filming with her.

 

When Jill realized that she had gone too far, it was too late, Alex and Ramona probably told Bethenny about the e-mail and Bethenny realized that behind all this was a horrid woman who was never her friend so she broke the friendship clean. Jill can try to explain her behavior any way she want and try to rewrite history but by her own mouth we learned that she came to Andy with the idea of creating a fake fall out with Bethenny (without letting Bethenny know) and that Andy tried to talk her out of it but Jill already had a plan and she went for it.

 

I know it must have hurt Jill that every single venture she took on the show went south all while Bethenny's products were selling like crazy but the way she went about this whole friendship was the true mark of her character and how low and dirty she is willing to fight when things do not go her way.

 

I agree with everything you say here. I wanted to point out the bold part of your post, because I think this was a pattern with Jill. 

 

She wanted that "Bethenny and I had a fight" story line, so even after she was warned against it she went with it. She wanted to dictate the terms on which she made up with Bethenny, so even though she was obviously ready to make up with Bethenny when Ramona set up the meeting between the two, she didn't want to disrupt the time frame she put on the make up. So, she left with Luann leaving it unresolved. By the time she heard that Bethenny was pregnant and getting married she realized she messed up and tried force a makeup by crashing Ramona's trip after she had already declined the invitation. Even though the Countess warned her that showing up uninvited was a bad idea, Jill had an image in her head of "two girls on the beach with gifts" so she went for it.

 

I'm sure that if we revisit some of the earlier Jill footage - even back when she was on good terms with Bethenny she was repeating this same pattern. 

[Sincerely Yours]

Remember though, that while Bobby was having this surgery, Jill was partying in the Hamptons, so it's not like Jill treated it as a high risk surgery either. It only became a high risk "throat cut from ear to ear" surgery when the cameras turned on for filming. That was one of the things that really bugged me about that entire feud. Jill was exploiting Bobby's cancer as a way to gain the upper hand in an argument that she created for story line purposes. Bobby on the other hand, was grateful for the flowers (Bethenny sent them to Bobby not Jill, which is as it should have been), and thought that Jill was being silly by fighting with Bethenny over any of it. 

High or not high risk, seeing Jill out and about and going off of those sort of details is not what good friends do. Friends, PERSONALLY check in and don't count on appearances. I've put plenty of stuff on social media that would suggest things are A OK and still have my GIRLS texting me about to make sure I'm okay because they may be privy to more information about what's going on in my life. When health is involved, even somewhat distant friends will check in even if they have the most minimal information. My girlfriend was preparing to have a hysterectomy. Had months to come to terms with it but I also knew it was hard on her. Her facebook had this that and the other going on and I was happy to see all that positive stuff she was sharing but that didn't mean I didn't call her the day before, the day after and kept in touch while she was recovering. Same with my another friend who I found out had to have her appendix out. Health is ALWAYS a big deal and there really is no excuse for when something like that fails to make it on your radar. Now I'm not saying that it's some God awful, burn 'em at the stake offense however if a person calls you on it, there really isn't any leg to stand and trying to explain how it didn't seem that "serious" when the basics of the whole "miscommunication" revolves around someone health just falls flat. I know that if I catch wind of a friend either going into the hospital, was in the hospital, had some sort of medical procedure being done then I would be taking it upon MYSELF to get thoroughly informed to determine what sort of supportive role or level of support is needed. Bethenny sending flowers just read like it was one of a million things that was on her checklist of things that had to get done and not about a dear friend. I know Jill is Jill but I can't minimize her point just because it's Jill.

[MatildaMoody]

High or not high risk, seeing Jill out and about and going off of those sort of details is not what good friends do. Friends, PERSONALLY check in and don't count on appearances. I've put plenty of stuff on social media that would suggest things are A OK and still have my GIRLS texting me about to make sure I'm okay because they may be privy to more information about what's going on in my life. When health is involved, even somewhat distant friends will check in even if they have the most minimal information. My girlfriend was preparing to have a hysterectomy. Had months to come to terms with it but I also knew it was hard on her. Her facebook had this that and the other going on and I was happy to see all that positive stuff she was sharing but that didn't mean I didn't call her the day before, the day after and kept in touch while she was recovering. Same with my another friend who I found out had to have her appendix out. Health is ALWAYS a big deal and there really is no excuse for when something like that fails to make it on your radar. Now I'm not saying that it's some God awful, burn 'em at the stake offense however if a person calls you on it, there really isn't any leg to stand and trying to explain how it didn't seem that "serious" when the basics of the whole "miscommunication" revolves around someone health just falls flat. I know that if I catch wind of a friend either going into the hospital, was in the hospital, had some sort of medical procedure being done then I would be taking it upon MYSELF to get thoroughly informed to determine what sort of supportive role or level of support is needed. Bethenny sending flowers just read like it was one of a million things that was on her checklist of things that had to get done and not about a dear friend. I know Jill is Jill but I can't minimize her point just because it's Jill.

 

But, Bethenny did reach out to Jill, it is how she even knew Bobby was in the hospital in the first place, and why she sent him flowers. At no point did Jill let Bethenny know that Bobby was seriously ill - she phrased it as Bobby was having some tests done. Since Bethenny was on the west coast during all of this,all she could do was take Jill's word for it.

 

Jill misrepresented how ill Bobby was - first by downplaying it to Bethenny and then by using it to exploit the argument she wanted to use as a story line. Jill's anger was that Bethenny wasn't calling her multiple times a day and including her in all of her media rounds. It had nothing to do with Bobby being sick and everything to do with Bethenny telling her to get a hobby. 

 

And while I agree that people will put up a pretense on social media that everything is fine. My point wasn't about that. No one knew that Bobby was as sick as Jill would later claim he was. Do you think Kelly and the Countess were sitting vigil with Jill over Bobby's hospital bed? No, they were partying with her in the Hamptons and Jill was fine with it. Bethenny was limited by the fact that she was on an opposite coast. Unless she was supposed to drop all of her West Coast commitments because Jill told her Bobby was having tests, what more was she supposed to do to show that she cared?

[Celia Rubenstein]

Since the beer was lukewarm.....that is why (Sonja)  added ice to it. Sigh. Not sure what her purpose of even bringing it was......

 

Here is my theory about this... the other housewives have all started to recognize and comment upon the fact that Sonja is always drinking way too much, right? 

 

Well, somewhere I read that Sonja had been drinking cider at Lu's party (I guess making a show of it so everyone knew she was not drinking alcohol)?  I wish I could find that story now!

 

Any way, that made me think that Sonja was planning to make people think she was only drinking cider, but she brought beer in her purse and planned to sneak it into her glass while she was in the bathroom or something.  

 

I can think of no other reason why she would take a beer that would only be getting warm into a housewarming party where she knew there would be a well-stocked bar. 

 

Of course my theory bottoms out because Sonja is shown dumping her warm beer into a glass in front of everyone, making no secret about it.  But I wonder if maybe she had already had a few cider-beer switchouts and was just over hiding the fact that she was drinking.  Of course, that begs the question of why she didn't just go get herself a fresh, cold beer from Luann's stock. 

 

I don't know.  I guess I am seriously reaching, lol.  But I just can think of no other reason she would be taking beer to Luann's party in her purse.  Who does that? 

[Sincerely Yours]

But, Bethenny did reach out to Jill, it is how she even knew Bobby was in the hospital in the first place, and why she sent him flowers. At no point did Jill let Bethenny know that Bobby was seriously ill - she phrased it as Bobby was having some tests done. Since Bethenny was on the west coast during all of this,all she could do was take Jill's word for it.

 

Jill misrepresented how ill Bobby was - first by downplaying it to Bethenny and then by using it to exploit the argument she wanted to use as a story line. Jill's anger was that Bethenny wasn't calling her multiple times a day and including her in all of her media rounds. It had nothing to do with Bobby being sick and everything to do with Bethenny telling her to get a hobby. 

 

And while I agree that people will put up a pretense on social media that everything is fine. My point wasn't about that. No one knew that Bobby was as sick as Jill would later claim he was. Do you think Kelly and the Countess were sitting vigil with Jill over Bobby's hospital bed? No, they were partying with her in the Hamptons and Jill was fine with it. Bethenny was limited by the fact that she was on an opposite coast. Unless she was supposed to drop all of her West Coast commitments because Jill told her Bobby was having tests, what more was she supposed to do to show that she cared?

So Jill didn't tell Bethenny the truth about what was going on  with Bobby?  That was so long ago, excuse me if I'm not remembering the feud ver batum but from what I recall, Bethenny did seem to be emotional about the situation and sorry but I'm just calling foul on the "I had no idea" excuse. It's my opinion that Bethenny had enough initial information and that what she did know was enough for her to continue keeping tabs and checking in with Jill on a regular basis without prompting. There is no need for one extreme or the other. Bethenny didn't need to drop everything, making a point to call, check in and follow up doesn't not require one to "drop everything". Now if the case was that Jill specifically lied to Bethenny about Bobby being fine and there were absolutely no worries, no concerns, nada then that's where I can give Bethenny the benefit of the doubt but however much Jill supposedly "down played" it I don't get how having tests and cancer scares can ever be considered not a big deal because Jill wasn't displaying enough distraught behavior. I'm not saying it needed to get as crazed as all that but I'm more stuck on the specifics of the original slip up and how easy it should have been to own up to instead of running to find excuses and reasons why the oversite was justified. It's the trying to justify it that bugged me.

[MatildaMoody]

So Jill didn't tell Bethenny the truth about what was going on  with Bobby?  That was so long ago, excuse me if I'm not remembering the feud ver batum but from what I recall, Bethenny did seem to be emotional about the situation and sorry but I'm just calling foul on the "I had no idea" excuse. It's my opinion that Bethenny had enough initial information and that what she did know was enough for her to continue keeping tabs and checking in with Jill on a regular basis without prompting. There is no need for one extreme or the other. Bethenny didn't need to drop everything, making a point to call, check in and follow up doesn't not require one to "drop everything". Now if the case was that Jill specifically lied to Bethenny about Bobby being fine and there were absolutely no worries, no concerns, nada then that's where I can give Bethenny the benefit of the doubt but however much Jill supposedly "down played" it I don't get how having tests and cancer scares can ever be considered not a big deal because Jill wasn't displaying enough distraught behavior. I'm not saying it needed to get as crazed as all that but I'm more stuck on the specifics of the original slip up and how easy it should have been to own up to instead of running to find excuses and reasons why the oversite was justified. It's the trying to justify it that bugged me.

 

I can't tell you verbatim what the exact time line was. But here it is as i understood it. Bethenny was on the West Coast doing her book tour and a bunch of entertainment media outlets when she found out that Bobby was in hospital having tests done. Bethenny sent Bobby flowers and a note saying she hoped he would feel better soon. Jill starts freaking out and contacting every media outlet that interviewed Bethenny to try and get booked along side her and Bethenny left her the message about needing a hobby. 

 

Bethenny tried to reach out to Jill again to see how Bobby was doing and Jill had stopped returning her calls, texts, and emails. Bethenny had no idea other than that Bobby was having tests done, just how sick Bobby was. Jill downplayed it not just to Bethenny but to the other women as she was out partying with them in the Hamptons. 

 

I am not saying that Bethenny is saying she had no idea that Bobby was in the hospital. Jill told her he was getting tests done and she sent him flowers. Then, Jill cut off all communications before Bethenny was able to suss out what the actual situation was with Bobby. Bobby's illness was exploited by Jill to win an opening salvo in the feud she started for the cameras.

 

ETA: There was a conversation that Bethenny had with Mill during that season where she even said, that since Jill was so angry with her and not returning any calls, she didn't even feel like she could reach out to Bobby directly to check in on him when she got back to New York. Jill essentially cut Bethenny off from all contact with her and Bobby and used that to say that Bethenny had been uncaring that Bobby was in the hospital with "his throat cut from ear to ear."

Edited May 11, 2015 by MatildaMoody

[Sincerely Yours]

I can't tell you verbatim what the exact time line was. But here it is as i understood it. Bethenny was on the West Coast doing her book tour and a bunch of entertainment media outlets when she found out that Bobby was in hospital having tests done. Bethenny sent Bobby flowers and a note saying she hoped he would feel better soon. Jill starts freaking out and contacting every media outlet that interviewed Bethenny to try and get booked along side her and Bethenny left her the message about needing a hobby. 

 

Bethenny tried to reach out to Jill again to see how Bobby was doing and Jill had stopped returning her calls, texts, and emails. Bethenny had no idea other than that Bobby was having tests done, just how sick Bobby was. Jill downplayed it not just to Bethenny but to the other women as she was out partying with them in the Hamptons. 

 

I am not saying that Bethenny is saying she had no idea that Bobby was in the hospital. Jill told her he was getting tests done and she sent him flowers. Then, Jill cut off all communications before Bethenny was able to suss out what the actual situation was with Bobby. Bobby's illness was exploited by Jill to win an opening salvo in the feud she started for the cameras.

 

ETA: There was a conversation that Bethenny had with Mill during that season where she even said, that since Jill was so angry with her and not returning any calls, she didn't even feel like she could reach out to Bobby directly to check in on him when she got back to New York. Jill essentially cut Bethenny off from all contact with her and Bobby and used that to say that Bethenny had been uncaring that Bobby was in the hospital with "his throat cut from ear to ear."

I'm not remembering that "Jill cut all contact" angle of it. I know there was a shut down of communication by Jill but for me its all about when Jill finally shut down communication and I didn't buy the idea that Jill was thwarting and rebuffing Bethenny's "many, many" attempts to be supportive. To me it sounded like Bethenny was creating a timeline that didn't really convince me.

 

But whatever, Bethenny's a very busy, busy woman and as she has shown over and over again to me that she can't be expected to keep up with such things. Seeing her callous behavior over the years, seasons and shows just reinforces my opinion of what really went down there. I mean, Bethenny just isn't the sentimental type and I think the whole kefluffel that broke up Jill and Bethenny's friendship is one example of where Bethenny just can't manage that level of loyalty and commitment to someone else. Hey, she is who she is that's her life I'm just saying that I wasn't on Bethenny's side in that whole mess.  Regardless of the "facts" since of course there's always 3 sides to every story and when Bravo TV is involved there's even more.. LOL.

[izabella]

Well, somewhere I read that Sonja had been drinking cider at Lu's party (I guess making a show of it so everyone knew she was not drinking alcohol)?  I wish I could find that story now!

 

If she was drinking hard cider, which also comes in beer bottles if you like, that can have as much or more alcohol than a beer does.  A Corona is 4.6% ABV, Corona Light is 4.4% and Stella Cidre is 4.5%.

 

Can't fool me Sonja!

I don't know.  I guess I am seriously reaching, lol.  But I just can think of no other reason she would be taking beer to Luann's party in her purse.  Who does that?

 

I think she had a few in the car, but just didn't get to that last one so she drank it when she got to Lu's.  She was probably already toasted when she arrived so she didn't think to get a fresh, cold one. 

Edited May 12, 2015 by izabella