S05.E08: Uncle Carl

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Gus tells Fiona he's leaving to go on tour. Frank seeks revenge on Sammi.

 

Promo:

 

Clips:

 

[Chaos Theory]

What a relentlessly depressing episode.  

 

I do think the best part for me was Debbie trying to play mentally ill and Carl getting chased by the cops,.  "Don't shoot!  I'm white!"

 

I know she was kind of right but I wanted to slap Sammy for calling the cops on Carl.   That's not the way you handle these sort of thing especially on your own family.  Then again she has always felt like an interloper in the house.

 

Did love both Veronica and Kevin have slept with Svetlana.  The conversation Vee and Svetlana was interesting.  

 

Also loved Lip's speech to the administrator guy.  I was very well done and touching moment.

[Primetimer]

When Ian gets released from the psych ward, his family is not quite equipped to help him ease calmly back into normal life.

Read the story

[ihartcoffee]

Tell me a story uncle Carl... lol

I had a feeling Gus wouldn't last. Smart of the show making him a musician who has to go 'on tour'.

What a relentlessly depressing episode.  

 

I do think the best part for me was Debbie trying to play mentally ill and Carl getting chased by the cops,.  "Don't shoot!  I;m white!"

 

I know she was kind of right but I wanted to slap Sammy for calling the cops on Carl.   That's not the way you handle these sort of thing especially on your own family.  Then again she has always felt like an interloper in the house.

 

Did love both Veronica and Kevin have slept with Svetlana.  The conversation Vee and Svetlana was interesting.  

 

Also loved Lip's speech to the administrator guy.  I was very well done and touching moment.

Didn't Frank tip the police? They are all awful! Lol

I think the convo with V and Svetlana was an eye opener for V. That and the failed date.

The parts you mentioned were funny. I agree.

[CynicalGirl]

OMG poor Lip. But I'm glad he knows he needs to stay in school or he'll be sucked back into the white trash tornado in the blink of an eye. 

[backhometome]

I wish they would stop with the Ian/Mickey and Frank/Monica parallels. Just because they have the same illness doesn't make Ian and Monica the same person. Mickey is not Frank. He doesn't exploit Ian's illness like Frank did Monica. Plus Mickey actually gives a crap about Ian. The bed scene was nice.

 

I actually enjoyed Debbie this ep. Maybe because she wasn't doing her usual boy crazy routine.

 

Fiona continues to be a shitty guardian. Leaving Ian and Liam with Frank seems like a real smart thing to do. And she was going to live in a van with Gus leaving the kids??? 

 

Lip and his college story continue to bore me. Did he actually try to use Ian's illness to get an extension on his loan.

 

Carl is the best. One of the few people that don't annoy me on this show.

Edited March 9, 2015 by backhometome

[tennisgurl]

Sammi...shut up.

 

Damn it, but I think I have come down with a case of the feeeeeeeeeeals. There has to be something I can take for this. 

[wovenloaf]

Yeah I've to be quite entertained by Carl!

Liam running up to Ian when Ian got home was so adorable! At least in this episode it was like Liam actually still exists. Still with no one who can bother to take of him, though.

Fiona does the "Okay, I apologized for the horrible thing I did, so everything should immediately go back to normal now, and I'm gonna act like the wounded one when it doesn't" thing. That always annoys me.

Edited March 9, 2015 by wovenloaf

[AlliMo]

Jail will be good for Carl. Not because it will straight him out - there's no hope of that - but at least he'll learn to be a better criminal.

 

I thought JAW knocked it out of the park on his scene with the financial aid guy. Lip is trying to walk the line between doing what he needs to do to ensure his future and still being there for his siblings. His stress level right now has got to be off the charts.

 

Svetlana has become my favorite character. She's like some kind of Russian oracle of divine wisdom.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Tell me a story uncle Carl..

I was really expecting Carl to say something along the lines of, "Okay, I'll tell you a story. Once upon a time, there was a boy named Chuckie. He talked to the police AND THEN HE GOT STABBED. You know why, Chuckie? Snitches get stitches!"

[Blue Castle]

My favorite part in this episode was when Fiona casually mentioned she was moving back into the Gallagher house--I was like, when the hell did you move out?? Was there some cut scene where Fiona decided to move in with Gus and forgot she was the legal guardian to four kids and decided to leave them in Sammi's psychotic hands? That crazy offhand remark sums up this entire season to me. Such thoughtful, quality writing.

Not to mention Sammi SHOT someone in their house last week and Lip and Fiona had no problem with this??! She still seems like someone qualified to take care of Liam to them? They dont even say anything about it to her? Whatever.

The Ian and Mickey plot continues to be very sad and moving. I also actually found Debbie sympathetic in this ep. So that's something.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ha, I love how practical Svetlana is ("it's just oral manipulation!"). And say what you will about her, but she seems to have her own code. She didn't have to service Vee but she figured it was her daily duty.

 

Although Sammi really annoys me and she can't leave soon enough, I can understand her anger. Carl taped heroin to her son and then let him get arrested. It's not like Chuckie knew what was going on or what the risks were. Chuckie's not the sharpest knife in the drawer and he has been Carl's slave so he's used to following his orders without question.

[iMonrey]

 

What a relentlessly depressing episode.

 

There's an underlying sadness to this whole show, and every character, but yes - this episode in particular was a real downer. Especially in regards to Ian. I can see the temptation to do a bipolar story with one of the kids, but nothing good can come from this. 

 

Fiona had a great conversation with Gus, but that was sad too. And this was definitely Jeremy Allen White's Emmy reel, if the Emmys ever recognized anyone on this show besides William H. Macy or Joan Cusak. But again, sad scene. 

 

I guess, hooray for the comic relief of Carl and Chuckie. And Svetlana is turning out to be a whore with the sole voice of reason.

[SimoneS]

Ian and Mickey make my heart hurt; Ian's denial. Mickey's fear. I was glad that Deb did an intervention with Mickey. Alcohol and raging can only make it worse. I teared up when Mickey went to Ian at the end. 

 

Liam running up to greet Ian when he came home was so sweet.

 

Oh, Lip. Watching him desperately pleading with the counselor was so sad brought back college memories for me. I am glad that he realizes that he has to find a way to stay in school because he is his siblings' only hope of ever having a stable financial future. Lip needs to talk to Amanda's father about a loan. 

 

Carl is so terrible, but he cracks me up. Poor Chucky. Sammi did the right thing giving up Carl to protect her son.

 

The scene in the police station in the waiting area was hysterical. It goes from sober as they reflect on their messed up relationships to banging on the window telling Carl not to say anything and ask for a lawyer.

 

I hope Svetlana's sexual therapy will heal Kev and Vee's marriage.

Edited March 9, 2015 by SimoneS

[Gulftastic]

The Lip/Financial Aid Guy scene was very good indeed. You could see the strain he was under.

 

And I loved Mickey's 'Sorry I'm late..'. Noel Fisher again with the amazing facial acting. How does he do it?

[junemeatcleaver]

 

I wish they would stop with the Ian/Mickey and Frank/Monica parallels.

 

It's cheap is what it is.  Then I think the entire Ian bipolar storyline is bordering on cheap and lazy anyway, I really hope it takes a turn for the better soon.

 

I don't blame Sammi for calling the cops.  I had to roll my eyes at the Gallaghers indignation over Sammi calling the cops because they would do the same if, by some miracle, Chuckie pulled that shit on Carl. 

[Chaos Theory]

I wish they would stop with the Ian/Mickey and Frank/Monica parallels. Just because they have the same illness doesn't make Ian and Monica the same person. Mickey is not Frank. He doesn't exploit Ian's illness like Frank did Monica. Plus Mickey actually gives a crap about Ian. The bed scene was nice.

 

 

Actually I think that's the point.   Mickey ISN'T Frank/    There was bound to be parallels, there had to be.  Ian has been fighting his mother and HER illness all his life and now to have that same illness.  Yes it could e different in him but he needs to have someone in his corner who won't give up on him or add to the fire.  Its not how they are the same.  It is how they are different.  

[Blue Castle]

 

Sammi did the right thing giving up Carl to protect her son.

 

Maybe it was right, maybe it was wrong, but I don't think Sammi ever has good motives.  She says she's trying to protect Chuckie this week when last week she literally put Chuckie in her line of fire with a loaded gun at one point.  She could've easily hurt or killed him.  This week she covered Chuckie's ears when she talked about screwing that whole cover band when earlier this season she literally had sex in front of him without caring.  She's a bottomless pit of need and victimhood who doesn't care about other people at all.  And while people like her do exist--I don't want to watch her every week.  We already have the terrible narcissist that is Frank--must we have Sammi, too? 

 

I think she views Chuckie as an extension of herself (she treats him that way, at least) and she was angry that something that was "hers" had been mistreated.  I don't think she's capable of loving or caring about Chuckie in actuality.

[Automne]

Maybe it was right, maybe it was wrong, but I don't think Sammi ever has good motives.  She says she's trying to protect Chuckie this week when last week she literally put Chuckie in her line of fire with a loaded gun at one point.  She could've easily hurt or killed him.  This week she covered Chuckie's ears when she talked about screwing that whole cover band when earlier this season she literally had sex in front of him without caring.  She's a bottomless pit of need and victimhood who doesn't care about other people at all.  And while people like her do exist--I don't want to watch her every week.  We already have the terrible narcissist that is Frank--must we have Sammi, too? 

 

I think she views Chuckie as an extension of herself (she treats him that way, at least) and she was angry that something that was "hers" had been mistreated.  I don't think she's capable of loving or caring about Chuckie in actuality.

 

100% this. Let's also remember that she's unable to provide any of the basics for her own son. This isn't a Gallagher-type situation where the kids are forced to fend for themselves because their parents are useless. Sammi is the parent for Chuckie and yet provides zero stability for him. She doesn't even have a roof over his head (yes, the destroyed RV is Frank's fault, but why is she having a child live in an RV in the first place? The Gallagher kids were managing to scrape together the money to pay the mortgage and taxes on their house when even Fiona was under 18. Sammi can't get some rent money for an apartment in the South Side?); instead, she squats in other people's homes and pulls stunts that should have her ass out on the streets. He's obese and we clearly see why: Sammi uses food as a replacement for actual affection for Chuckie. We've seen Fiona hug and cuddle her siblings, have we seen Sammi do the same for her own son?

 

And what does Sammi even do for a job? She's relying on the Gallaghers quite a bit, so turning in Carl would and should only work to her detriment. She's not the legal guardian to the kids, she has no right to the house, she wasn't even invited to live there by anybody, and oh yeah, she shot Frank in the house in front of three minor children. In fact, Carl witnessed Sammi shooting Frank. Sammi just turned against a kid with a pretty big trump card against her. Assault with a deadly weapon and her calm comment about how a few inches and she could have hit a major blood vessel could get that bumped up to attempted murder.

[dangwoodchucks]

This episode was indeed depressing.

 

Although I'd like to see him on my screen every week, Run Gus. Run. Most guys probably wouldn't want to talk to Fiona after what she did, but Gus explained to her calmly and honestly how he felt. She can't expect things to go back the way they were just because she apologized after admitting to screwing StimJack. I loved V pointing out Fiona's hypocrisy when she blasted V for going on a date and throwing her marriage away.

 

The lost promise of Jeffrey Dean Morgan is apparent to me every time I see Dermot Mulroney's scenes with Fiona. It's not the actor because I loved him in The Wedding Date among other things, but there's something about the character that doesn't work for me. And what kind of advice is asking Gus not to go on tour? Playing in the band is part of his livelihood. What, he should stay at home and not make that money while he waits around for Fiona to spend whatever little bit of time she can with him? A nice gesture, but about as feasible as Fiona joining them in their van.

 

Ian and the pill flushing. First, I'm angry at Fiona for leaving Debbie in charge of Ian and his meds. I know she had to go to work, but still. I'm also annoyed with Debbie because she was so busy texting she didn't pay attention to Ian, which was kind of important. She's a teenager, true, but she was more responsible a few years ago when she ran the daycare. Now her caretaker skills are on par with Fiona's. Speaking of that, WTF was Fiona thinking leaving Liam with Frank?  And did she take a joint from Frank and rub it out on the floor with her foot, then just leave it there? Where Liam could pick it up? Did I see that right? Why is she even ok with Frank and Sammi being in her house (other than to watch the kids because she can't be bothered)? And why can't Sammi get a job? Surely Fiona's waitress job can't be paying all the bills.

 

I worry about Ian not having his meds. Intentional or not, his actions did put Yevgeny in danger. I teared up a bit when Mickey finally came to see Ian.

 

Lip's scene in the financial office was amazing. I don't think he was using Ian's illness to get the extension, he was merely explaining the things that were going on in his life and why it was so important for him to continue his education without interruption. 

 

 

And what does Sammi even do for a job? She's relying on the Gallaghers quite a bit, so turning in Carl would and should only work to her detriment. She's not the legal guardian to the kids, she has no right to the house, she wasn't even invited to live there by anybody, and oh yeah, she shot Frank in the house in front of three minor children. In fact, Carl witnessed Sammi shooting Frank. Sammi just turned against a kid with a pretty big trump card against her. Assault with a deadly weapon and her calm comment about how a few inches and she could have hit a major blood vessel could get that bumped up to attempted murder.

 

I'm surprised having Carl tell the police that Sammi shot him didn't occur to Frank, it would have taken care of Sammi with a lot less collateral damage. But instead, Frank got Carl to strap the drugs to Chuckie. Then Frank called the police on Chuckie which led to Carl getting arrested as well. So Frank got Carl arrested, the same son he protected a couple of seasons ago by saying he robbed the foster couple's apartment by himself.

 

I feel so sorry for poor Chuckie being part of this fucked up family.

 

I'm loving Svetlana and how matter-of-fact she is about everything.

[tennisgurl]

When Ian has stabilized a bit, he really needs to consider telling Mickey to cut back on the drinking. He`s only about 18/19, and his response to his crappy life is pretty much always getting drunk. A lot. He has seen the guys down at the Alibi right? He can`t really help Ian if he wont deal with his own issues. More things to deal with in the Ian and Mickey spin-off show I desperately want to see created! No actually, scratch that. Give Frank and Sammi a spin-off. That way, I can avoid it like the plague, and they wont be taking up screen time here anymore. Chuckie can stay on this show though. The farther he`s away from his mother, the better.

 

I am already depressed by the fact that, after a season of brilliant performances, the only person who will get recognized during awards season is WHM, and his leg-chasing antics. What a world.  

 

I love Carl more than I think I should. 

 

Fiona Fiona Fiona...I love you girl, but look at your life. Look at your choices. You have kids, they are all having major league crisis's, and they need you! Next week looks like a step in the right direction, but you got to keep stepping. 

 

I don't think Lip was trying to get an extension using his family's problems, I think he was just trying to let the guy know what was going on, and he started unloading all over the place. He has a lot on his plate, especially for a 18/19 year old. It was bound to hit him sooner or later.  

[40Love]

Ian and the pill flushing.

 

What I don't understand is why were Fiona and Debbie trying to get the pharmacist to break the law by re-filling the prescription? Wouldn't the easier solution be to just call the psychiatrist who wrote the scripts, explain what happened and have her phone in them into the pharmacist. Based on her sessions with Ian, I doubt that doctor would have any doubts that Ian flushed the meds. Did I miss something? Why was that never brought up as an option -- not even by the pharmacist?

[Chaos Theory]

What I don't understand is why were Fiona and Debbie trying to get the pharmacist to break the law by re-filling the prescription? Wouldn't the easier solution be to just call the psychiatrist who wrote the scripts, explain what happened and have her phone in them into the pharmacist. Based on her sessions with Ian, I doubt that doctor would have any doubts that Ian flushed the meds. Did I miss something? Why was that never brought up as an option -- not even by the pharmacist?

 

Fear of authority figures is the simplest answer.   It is always a chance that the shrink would want to see Ian again and would write that info down as reason to commit him involuntarily.   Paper trail is the simplest answer.  They don't want one for Ian if they can avoid it and non compliance is something they don't want if they can help it.  

[40Love]

Fear of authority figures is the simplest answer.   It is always a chance that the shrink would want to see Ian again and would write that info down as reason to commit him involuntarily.   Paper trail is the simplest answer.  They don't want one for Ian if they can avoid it and non compliance is something they don't want if they can help it.

 

Ok... got it...thanks Chaos Theory! What you say makes sense. I get their loyalty to Ian. I wish there was a viable way to help him without institutionalizing him or tearing him and Mickey apart. I want them to have a happy ending... and not be the next-generation Monica and Frank. 

 

Fiona and Lip sounded so hopeless and defeated when talking the psychiatrist. I don't know that much about the disease, so forgive me if it's ignorant or silly to ask aren't there functioning, well-adjusted bi-polar patients out there in the world?

[tennisgurl]

There are plenty of them, just the only one they know is their Mom, who is not even close to functioning or well-adjusted. 

[Mindymoo]

Fiona and Lip sounded so hopeless and defeated when talking the psychiatrist. I don't know that much about the disease, so forgive me if it's ignorant or silly to ask aren't there functioning, well-adjusted bi-polar patients out there in the world?

There absolutely are. I am one of them. The thing is, not every medication works for everyone. Lithium is not good for everyone as a mood-stabilizer. They often use anti-seizure medications as mood-stabilizers, which is what I use. But you have to want to get well, and take your medication as prescribed. There are also different types of bipolar disorder. I have bipolar 2, where I have hypomanic episodes rather than manic episodes, and tend to fare more on the depressed part of the spectrum. It's also good to have a therapist, because the medications only help treat the symptoms, while therapy can help get to the root of your problems.

[fliptopbox]

There absolutely are. I am one of them. The thing is, not every medication works for everyone. Lithium is not good for everyone as a mood-stabilizer. They often use anti-seizure medications as mood-stabilizers, which is what I use. But you have to want to get well, and take your medication as prescribed. There are also different types of bipolar disorder. I have bipolar 2, where I have hypomanic episodes rather than manic episodes, and tend to fare more on the depressed part of the spectrum. It's also good to have a therapist, because the medications only help treat the symptoms, while therapy can help get to the root of your problems.

This. I am also bipolar 2 and generally on the more depressive side. I can't take any of the SSRI's because of that whole suicidal ideation thing, and now I am on Tegretol. Seems to be working alright. I still get my bouts of depression but otherwise I am a functional "normal" (whatever that is, anyway) member of society who grocery shops, walks her dog, and goes to Target just to browse around the dollar area for cheap Hello Kitty merch, cos secretly I am a 9yr old girl.

 

But I can imagine being raised by Frank and Monica Ian being in denial about his bipolar is pretty understandable. And lots of patients are non-compliant and don't take their meds, or will only take them til they "feel better" and then stop. It's a tough diagnosis to have if you're not willing to deal with it in a realistic way.

[Tatum]

Fear of authority figures is the simplest answer.   It is always a chance that the shrink would want to see Ian again and would write that info down as reason to commit him involuntarily.   Paper trail is the simplest answer.  They don't want one for Ian if they can avoid it and non compliance is something they don't want if they can help it.  

 

That makes sense, and certainly I could see why it would be preferable if they could convince the local pharmacist to just refill the scripts, but the alternate methods Debbie was trying- like trusting the Milkovich clan to get the right drug or dosage, or faking her own mental illness- seems a lot riskier than just admitting to the original doctor what Ian did. I'm sure he's not the first patient to have done so. This is such a heartbreaking story.

 

 

I don't blame Sammi for calling the cops.  I had to roll my eyes at the Gallaghers indignation over Sammi calling the cops because they would do the same if, by some miracle, Chuckie pulled that shit on Carl.

 

Sammi is annoying, but what did Lip and Fiona think was an appropriate response? Let someone like Chuckie sit in jail indefinitely when he has no idea why? And I understand that there really isn't a low Frank won't hit, but using Chuckie- who is already a victim of extreme neglect and other issues- as a way to hurt Sammi was just unbelievably shitty.

 

My understanding of drug laws are pretty minimal- would they really hold a minor in a jail like that? I mean, I understand it was a lot of heroin and he was sitting there with it strapped to himself, but shouldn't it be pretty clear that Chuckie is no drug lord mastermind?

 

 

And why can't Sammi get a job? Surely Fiona's waitress job can't be paying all the bills.

 

I think Sammi must be on some kind of assistance. They've never shown her working yet she's able to buy Chuckie McDonalds for nearly every meal and she does buy groceries for the Gallagher house. There's always food in the fridge and they always show her cooking pancakes.

[40Love]

There absolutely are. I am one of them. The thing is, not every medication works for everyone. Lithium is not good for everyone as a mood-stabilizer. They often use anti-seizure medications as mood-stabilizers, which is what I use. But you have to want to get well, and take your medication as prescribed.

 

Thanks Mindy McIndy! So, here's hoping the writers will lead Ian to some kind of realization that he needs help... and that Mickey will be the one to make him see the light. 

[Mindymoo]

Thanks Mindy McIndy! So, here's hoping the writers will lead Ian to some kind of realization that he needs help... and that Mickey will be the one to make him see the light. 

That would be really nice. Even though Mickey freaked Ian the fuck out with the hospital talk and he took off with Yevegny, him realizing something was seriously wrong is very important. The people that you are closest to should know about your illness, so they can let you know when your behavior starts changing. I can always tell when I'm in one of my lows, but sometimes hypomania is harder for me to realize until my wife and family point it out to me. Usually it just means I need a change in medication and to see my therapist more. If Mickey is going to stay with him and stay in the picture, it will be vital for him to pick up on Ian's behavioral cues.

[TyranAmiros]

Just one more thought on Lip's situation. I know that when I was at school, the financial aid forms came in late April/May (just after tax season). So even though he was living at home for part of the summer, the forms probably came a month before he got home, at which point he was probably less involved there (Fiona was doing okay, Ian was home, Frank was at Sheila's). It's likely Carl or even Debbie signed for the packet and simply forgot about it.

[Empress1]

 

My favorite part in this episode was when Fiona casually mentioned she was moving back into the Gallagher house--I was like, when the hell did you move out?? Was there some cut scene where Fiona decided to move in with Gus and forgot she was the legal guardian to four kids and decided to leave them in Sammi's psychotic hands?

Right - and she said "for a little while," not permanently, which is insane. Like, show, I watched her fight for custody of her siblings. It was a multi-episode arc. The judge was like "Are you sure, really? Your youngest sibling is two, you can't shirk responsibility even if you get married and you and your husband decide to have your own children [emphasis mine and I'm paraphrasing]." She can't just move in and out when she feels like it. The kids go where she goes - in the eyes of the law, they are her children. Gus has to move into that house - that's the only option since she can't take the kids on tour with him. She does not have the luxury of behaving like a frivolous 23-year-old, because she fought to give that up. It's ridiculous.

 

Does it cost two grand to buy a plot into a community garden?

[Chas411]

In the scene where Fiona has a moment of realisation and starts running, I thought she was running to get Mickey for Ian but wait, no... she was just concerned for her lovelife. Shock.

 

Great scene by Jeremy Allen White where Lip unloads to the financial aid. It really makes me sad that none of the other actors bar Macy ever get any award acknowledgement. Emmy Rossum in particular over the years.

 

In the minority here but I really felt for Sammi in relation to what Carl did to Chuckie. I love Chuckie. He's gross but kind of endearing.

[cafetrong]

season 5 episode 8, when Fiora go home to find Debbie.

Frank and Liam are watching Strip sex show on TV, anybody know what's that program??

Edited March 28, 2016 by cafetrong