Tennis Thread

[Avon.Blakes7]

51 minutes ago, MostlyC said:

Why did the players retire?  Did they give a reason or where they, "I'm not going to win so why bother?"

I haven't read the thread, but my "take" on this subject is quite in line with some players like Roger Federer and Novak Djokovic suggesting a remedy to this problem of early round retirements! Top players are almost forced to fill their schedule ahead of time, but with extra stress and a very long physical season, a lot of players are breaking down these days! Some like Milos Raonic and Kei Nishikori are constantly withdrawing before they even hit an event, but being in the top 10 don't feel compelled to push it by playing hurt! Lower ranked players will go ahead trying to compete, fully aware they aren't physically or in the self-diag of Aussie Bernard Tomic aren't mentally "fit!" By showing up and losing in the 1st round of an event, they still acquire ATP ranking points and of course a lot of prize money! Federer thought seriously of making a rule to give injured players the points and $$ so they'll give up their spot in a draw, but not sure it'll gain any traction! Some prefer this "Kabuki dance" and work the system which is so beneficial being a part of! ;-)

Edited July 6, 2017 by Avon.Blakes7

[theatremouse]

1 hour ago, MostlyC said:

Why did the players retire?  Did they give a reason or where they, "I'm not going to win so why bother?"

Most of them were already injured before the matches even started, but if they'd withdrawn from the tournament before playing, they get no money and no points; and for lower ranked players, that's a big hit. So they show up anyway. Possibly some of them thought they could play through and after a bit realized, nope, unsustainable. Possibly some felt OK at the start but then made it worse and had to stop. Possibly others knew they'd never last anyway so they just showed up and hung in there for a set and a smidge to not look completely ridiculous and then bailed so they still get paid. The commentators are making it sound like all the first round retirements were the latter but I'm willing to guess it's more of a mix than they're currently acknowledging. Klizan certainly knew he was too hurt to play, but he's not exactly known for his sportsmanlike good attitude so...no shocker there.

Tomic did not retire. He just tanked his match (and basically said he didn't feel like bothering).

But from what I know about the retirements it was a mix of sustained-new-injury-during-match-and-couldn't-continue and went-in-already-injured-and-couldn't-continue.

[Harry24]

So sad Kvitova is out already.  I was looking forward to seeing her languid, powerful game on my TV screen for several days longer.  Alas.

[Avon.Blakes7]

19 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

So sad Kvitova is out already.  I was looking forward to seeing her languid, powerful game on my TV screen for several days longer.  Alas.

 Martina Navratilova was so proud sitting in the champions' box watching someone from the old country win Wimbledon back in 2011.... ;-)

[Spunkygal]

21 hours ago, BlackberryJam said:

I think they do anything they can to get Andy to talk about Dublane.

I hope Tomic gets fined.

Tomic was fined $20,000 for unsportsmanlike conduct according to the Sydney Herald. ESPN is saying it was $15,000.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Spunkygal

[theatremouse]

I believe the Sydney Herald is reporting in Australian dollars but ESPN is reporting in USD.

[Spunkygal]

2 minutes ago, theatremouse said:

I believe the Sydney Herald is reporting in Australian dollars but ESPN is reporting in USD.

D'oh! My coffee hadn't kicked in yet! Thank you!

[BlackberryJam]

Good...and that seems about the right amount. Enough to deter, but not crippling. 

[Spunkygal]

40 minutes ago, BlackberryJam said:

Good...and that seems about the right amount. Enough to deter, but not crippling. 

If I recall correctly, ESPN said that first round losers receive around $35,000 USD, so $15,000 is a decent chunk of that. 

Best wishes to Mattek-Sands. That was awful to watch and to hear her cries. I was so hoping for Safarova and her to win doubles.

adding: and now Tomic's racquet sponsor Head has dropped him! 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Spunkygal

[topanga]

2 hours ago, Spunkygal said:

Best wishes to Mattek-Sands. That was awful to watch and to hear her cries. I was so hoping for Safarova and her to win doubles.

What happened? I haven't been watching this week. 

[Spunkygal]

@topanga, she suffered a horrific knee injury.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/tennis/825633/Wimbledon-2017-Bethanie-Mattek-Sands

ESPN chose not to air the audio, just video, when it reran the moment it happened. It was just terrible. Everyone was clearly and understandably shaken. 

[theatremouse]

In her opponent's press conference, Cirstea said something to the effect of she'd never seen a knee look like that other than in a movie. So, pretty much, her leg was very wrong.

Just watching the video, it is not at all obvious how bad it is. It just looked like she went down. But she stayed down for 20 minutes and there were about 8 people standing over her blocking her from view and stayed there until they took her on a stretcher to an ambulance, which then took her directly to a hospital. But you can tell from the reactions of everyone else on the court, it was pretty bad. 

Also I suspect they're not airing the audio when they re-run the clip because she was not only in obvious agony, but she was also cursing a lot, so it'd be mostly bleeps.

[Spunkygal]

Yes, she dropped the F bomb when she first went down. Then she sounded like a dog that had been hit by a car. As her opponent said, it looked like her knee cap. Ugh. They'd have to give me a horse shot of morphine.

[mojoween]

Hearing her cry "help me" seven times in a row was the worst part.  It seemed like it took forever for anyone to get to her the poor thing.

This is the second time in two days I've heard fuck at a tennis match.  At Wimbledon of all places!

[topanga]

52 minutes ago, mojoween said:

Hearing her cry "help me" seven times in a row was the worst part.  It seemed like it took forever for anyone to get to her the poor thing.

This is the second time in two days I've heard fuck at a tennis match.  At Wimbledon of all places!

Clutch the pearls! Was anyone in the Royal Box those days?

[theatremouse]

This didn't happen on Centre Court, not even one of the show courts. Tiny outskirt court.

[Ohwell]

I feel kinda bad for the Aussies, having two jackholes, Kyrgios and Tomic, representing their country.

[MostlyC]

I think I heard on the news that Tomic lost a sponsor over his "I was bored" comments and something else he did that was "unsportsmanlike."

[Harry24]

Spoiler

I feel kinda bad for the Aussies, having two jackholes, Kyrgios and Tomic, representing their country.

To be fair, despite the ugly incident with Wawrinka, Kyrgios has the reputation of being very well liked ... off the court.  Tomic, not so much.

ETA - Sorry, I mistakenly put the quote in spoiler tags and can't get it out.  Definitely NOT a spoiler.

Edited July 7, 2017 by Harry24

[Ohwell]

49 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

To be fair, despite the ugly incident with Wawrinka, Kyrgios has the reputation of being very well liked ... off the court.

Then what does he have against the viewers and those people in the stands?  You know, the people who pay good money to see matches, not someone who's prone to act like a jackass at any moment.

[Avon.Blakes7]

1 hour ago, Ohwell said:

Then what does he have against the viewers and those people in the stands?  You know, the people who pay good money to see matches, not someone who's prone to act like a jackass at any moment.

Besides being very young, no one likes to be bothered with obnoxious fans rooting for "the other guy!" I played tennis for 30 years; half of it competitively, from high school comp. to city championships! Polite applause is not the problem, but some people feel the need to express something gratuitous for all to hear and get reactions! I actually had the friend of this guy playing in the final of a college intermural; "what are you doing messing around with this guy?" You can take it either way; my op better and should have beaten me quicker or comment meant to unnerve me to give his bud an edge! You try staying emotionless and not react! I didn't cuss at him, but I made both their lives miserable using every trick in my arsenal to make him work for his victory and frustrate his fan from achieving his goal! I wish I knew why people acted as if Kyrgios is the only one out there acting boorishly? Back in my day it was only  more noteworthy because tennis considered a gentlemen's sport with just a handful of real jerks on the tour; Ilie Nastase, John McEnroe, Jimmy Connors, & Boris Becker! Becker being more the master of surreptitious psychological warfare under the tutelage of Ion Tiriac! A lot of Becker victories over someone like Edberg were usually enveloped in drama we didn't even know was going on! In a US Open match, to get to Andre Agassi, supposedly Becker was blowing kisses to Brooke Shield! Becker wasn't half as good as some thought; usually running game on all concerned to steal some of those victories! Heaven knows today Rafa Nadal has been stealing matches for years in so many different ways! Fortunately for him, he's still a fan favorite! ;-)

[Ohwell]

I'm quite familiar with all the "bad boys" in the past, but that still doesn't change the fact that right now, Kyrgios is the biggest jackass of them all on the court.  I haven't heard anything about how the players feel about him so I'll just wait and hear from some of them (anyone?) to tell me how great of a guy he is.  

[theatremouse]

I think the difference is probably to an extent that Kyrgios is sometimes an ass, but seems to realize that? He's apologized a few times for particularly boorish behaviour and, while my opinion of him hasn't really changed, it seems some other players found him genuine. So even though he keeps having outbursts, they see the potential for him to mature and grow out of it? Whereas Tomic is and pretty much has always been a DGAF kind of guy. I think that's the main difference. It also seems like Bernie is pretty consistently an asshole, when he wins, when he loses, when he's not even playing. Peak Tomic outburst is generally way less offensive than peak Kyrgios, but Kyrgios actually has good days (or weeks) where he's, if not outright nice, at least neutral. It probably also doesn't hurt that Kyrgios has better game than Tomic too.

[crimsongrl]

Video shows Venus Williams legally entered intersection before crash

[khyber]

I don't think  the issue was  when Venus entered the intersection. It was her changing lanes in the middle of the intersection and thus colliding with the other car.  I think  the issue will be, should the other car have avoided her move.

[twoods]

I hope that video vindicates Venus so she gets that lawsuit against her thrown out. If someone is in the intersection, even if the light turns green you're supposed to wait for the intersection to clear before you go. I'm guessing the lady went when it turned green without checking the left and right side. 

[CheetaraThunder]

I am already preparing myself to sweat through a Nadal/Federer Wimbledon final. Both are playing just exceptional ( especially Nadal) with age and coming from serious injuries. Don't do my heart like that Wimbledon lol

Rooting hard for Venus even more. The media coverage and how the press basically made her break down and cry during her press conference has been disgusting.

[Spunkygal]

Injury update on Bethanie Mattek-Sands

http://www.tennis.com/pro-game/2017/07/bethanie-mattek-sands-needs-surgery-gives-update-facebook-live/67472/

[roseha]

Very sorry for Bethanie.  I didn't see the accident happen but I imagine something must have moved terribly out of place and torn to cause that pain.  When I was a teenager I dislocated my kneecap (I pushed it back in the car on the way to the doctor) and while I needed crutches for a couple of weeks or so I am sure I had no pain compared to what she must have gone through.  Something ruptured?  I wonder how the players feel sometimes knowing that could happen at any moment? Anyway the support from her fellow players is touching.

I'm sorry about Petra too, Harry, after what she went through with the attack I was really pulling for her.  However she's a great talent and a popular player so I hope she will have a W title in her future.

Vika looks great though, coming back so soon after having baby Leo (funny that Roger has said that the one of his kids who seems most interested in tennis is his son Leo...)

Edited July 10, 2017 by roseha

[theatremouse]

Bethanie's patella is dislocated and the patellar tendon ruptured. Sometimes people use "tear" and "rupture" synonymously, but I'm pretty sure in this case by "rupture" she meant "complete tear", since in this clip I saw it seemed like she started to say it was torn and stopped herself and said ruptured. So, yeah, clean through most likely. Assuming she's having the surgery in NY since they were flying her back there right away. She probably won't be able to walk for a couple of months. It'll probably be close to a year before she's fully recovered, and who knows at what point during the recovery she'll be able to do anything tennis-like, let alone get back to full form.

[BitterApple]

Holy crap, what a match. Mueller earned every inch of that victory. I think I need to go seek treatment for the ulcers I developed while watching the fifth set.

[Ohwell]

I drank almost half a bottle of sangria watching that match.  Good for Mueller.

[truthaboutluv]

Well I'm starting to think Rafa will never see another Wimbledon Quaterfinal again, much less a Final but kudos to Muller and surprisingly I'm still not that bummed by the loss. I knew as soon as I saw the match-up that Muller would be a challenge for Rafa because he's just the kind of player that has been the bane of Rafa's existence at Wimbledon in the last four/five years. I thought the match would be routine after the second set but was really impressed with the fight Rafa showed, especially fighting off all those match points. I knew he would lose though about 9-9 I think in the fifth because it was obvious he was working much harder than Muller to hold onto his serve. 

[Harry24]

I didn't see much of the Rafa-Muller match, but I am SHOCKED Rafa lost.  The first three rounds he looked as good as he did at the French, and that was terrifyingly great.  For those of you who saw the match, did he play on the same level or was there a drop off?

[Ohwell]

9 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

I didn't see much of the Rafa-Muller match, but I am SHOCKED Rafa lost.  The first three rounds he looked as good as he did at the French, and that was terrifyingly great.  For those of you who saw the match, did he play on the same level or was there a drop off?

I didn't see the whole match but I was shocked to see that he had lost the first two sets.  Then when he came back and won the next two, I thought "oh well, Rafa's back in form" and I figured he was on a roll and would cruise through the 5th set.  Mueller just wouldn't go away, to his credit. 

[BitterApple]

I caught up with the match midway into the 4th, so I'm not really sure. Based on what I saw though, Mueller was just playing amazing grass court tennis. For a big guy, he transitions really smoothly from the baseline to the net and his serve held up well. He definitely had a few lapses, where he hit some horrible drop shots, but he was able to shrug the bad points off and get back to business. 

I'm also curious to hear everyone's thoughts on the Referee choosing to postpone Djokovic's match as opposed to moving him to Centre Court. I'm not a fan of Novak, but I think they did him dirty. To sit around all day and night when a prime court was available  is kind of messed up, especially considering he now has to play back-to-back matches. They must really want an Andy/Roger final.

Edited July 11, 2017 by BitterApple

[truthaboutluv]

18 hours ago, Harry24 said:

I didn't see much of the Rafa-Muller match, but I am SHOCKED Rafa lost.  The first three rounds he looked as good as he did at the French, and that was terrifyingly great.  For those of you who saw the match, did he play on the same level or was there a drop off?

There was definitely a drop off. He wasn't as clean and sharp, especially with some of his forehand passes as he was all clay season and for the first three rounds. The first set and a half was largely Muller just dominating with his serve so there wasn't a lot Rafa could do because Muller wasn't giving him a chance to get into the points. But I definitely felt like late in the second set, when Rafa had break chances and could have served to even the match, he made some really bad errors and had some poor shot selection and that cost him.

Like Ohwell, I did think after he leveled the match at 2 sets apiece he was going to get an early break and run away with it but like I said above, the longer the match went, the more I felt like he wasn't going to win because he was having to work harder and harder every time to hold serve while Muller wasn't as much. Don't get me wrong, Rafa had his chance with the 5 break points game. That game will probably give him nightmares for a few weeks. 

Edited July 11, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[theatremouse]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I'm also curious to hear everyone's thoughts on the Referee choosing to postpone Djokovic's match as opposed to moving him to Centre Court. I'm not a fan of Novak, but I think they did him dirty. To sit around all day and night when a prime court was available  is kind of messed up, especially considering he now has to play back-to-back matches. They must really want an Andy/Roger final.

I think the trouble was, it was something like 9-8 in the Rafa/Mueller match when they finished on Centre, and I think Mueller may have even has match point around then. So it kept seeming like it was about to be over, and then it wasn't. And by the time they coulda shoulda woulda made the decision to move the Djoker match, A) too much time had passed and B) they would've had to move all the ticketholders to the other stadium, which would've caused a delay. So basically, unless they made the call to move the match within 10 minutes of Fed winning, it wouldn't necessarily have been more practical to move the remaining match to Centre court. But they also had no reason to anticipate the match on Court 1 wouldn't be over imminently. If they had made the call to move it, and then the current match ended, it would've wasted more time to either continue/complete the move, or bail and stay put. So either way they had a chance of the call looking bad. They went a more conservative approach. I agree it's a bummer for the players who waited all day, but it was going to be a judgment call either way.

[BitterApple]

Theatermouse, thanks, I didn't realize the Fed match finished that late into Rafa's fifth set. For some reason I thought it was like 4-4 when Roger got done.

[MostlyC]

The commentators keep mentioning Novac's shoulder?  Is he playing injured?

[theatremouse]

He called the trainer twice for a shoulder issue. Unclear if he's been injured this whole time, or just tweaked something during the match today, or if he'll still be hurting tomorrow.

[truthaboutluv]

By the way, while I am a little bummed that Rafa's out, I can't help laughing at the fact that he bumped his head on the ceiling before they walked out on court, while he was doing his usual jumping pre-match routine. Some joked that that may have contributed to the loss. I don't think it did but it is funny. 

[blackwing]

I am rooting very hard for Venus, Goddess on a Mountain Top.  She's got it!  I thought she looked great, especially against the dangerous Ostapenko.  Venus was poised and calm and her age and experience helped her against Ostapenko, who seemed rattled in the second set.

Question about etiquette.  When Nadal lost yesterday I read a blurb that said he was gracious in defeat, and waited for Muller before leaving the court.  I thought that the players were required by Wimbledon protocol to wait?  Ostapenko seemed like a very bitter loser.  I know that nobody likes losing, but it looked like she had a very curt one word response (probably "thanks") to what looked like Venus' "good game".  Then she barely shook the chair umpire's hand, she gave a limp handshake that she withdrew almost immediately.  She packed up her bags and started walking off the court and I believe the chair umpire called out to her to wait, she turned her head and looked annoyed.

On 7/7/2017 at 9:22 PM, twoods said:

I hope that video vindicates Venus so she gets that lawsuit against her thrown out. If someone is in the intersection, even if the light turns green you're supposed to wait for the intersection to clear before you go. I'm guessing the lady went when it turned green without checking the left and right side. 

I would agree.  It seems like from the report that she was in the intersection but had to stop because the car in front of her was waiting to turn.  It seems the light then turned red, the car in front of her turned, and then since she was in the intersection, she then went through.  Sounds like the other driver didn't yield.  I wonder if she was stopped at the intersection waiting for the green or if she was moving and approaching when the light went green so just barrelled on through.  Because it seems she must have been going fairly fast if the crash caused the death of her husband?

[dcalley]

27 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Question about etiquette.  When Nadal lost yesterday I read a blurb that said he was gracious in defeat, and waited for Muller before leaving the court.  I thought that the players were required by Wimbledon protocol to wait?  Ostapenko seemed like a very bitter loser.  I know that nobody likes losing, but it looked like she had a very curt one word response (probably "thanks") to what looked like Venus' "good game".  Then she barely shook the chair umpire's hand, she gave a limp handshake that she withdrew almost immediately.  She packed up her bags and started walking off the court and I believe the chair umpire called out to her to wait, she turned her head and looked annoyed.

Yes, Wimbledon wants both players to exit at the same time. I haven't seen Ostapenko much, but I believe she consistently gives curt handshakes. WTA writer Courtney Nguyen said this, and I think she was being genuine:

[truthaboutluv]

55 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Question about etiquette.  When Nadal lost yesterday I read a blurb that said he was gracious in defeat, and waited for Muller before leaving the court.  I thought that the players were required by Wimbledon protocol to wait?  Ostapenko seemed like a very bitter loser.  I know that nobody likes losing, but it looked like she had a very curt one word response (probably "thanks") to what looked like Venus' "good game".  Then she barely shook the chair umpire's hand, she gave a limp handshake that she withdrew almost immediately.  She packed up her bags and started walking off the court and I believe the chair umpire called out to her to wait, she turned her head and looked annoyed.

Interesting. Talented as she is and I give her props for her fearless play, something about her kept bugging me. Now I feel like I have a reason to not adore her. And yes, the players do have to wait so I was surprised Rafa was being lauded for it, much as I adore him. However, I think it was also more so for the fact that he then took the time to still sign autographs for the fans when he had to be and later confirmed in his press conference, so disappointed about losing.

[NowVoyager]

Oookay.... So, yesterday I was watching Wimbledon on ESPN. I was wondering why they were showing the beginning of Roger's match and not the end of Rafa's. During Rafa's 5th set, I finally heard the announcers say that it was showing on ESPN2. (Aaargh!!!) The part I watched was really compelling though.

Edited July 11, 2017 by NowVoyager

[blackwing]

42 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Interesting. Talented as she is and I give her props for her fearless play, something about her kept bugging me. Now I feel like I have a reason to not adore her. 

She seems cold.  And I truly hate the sounds she emits.  I know a lot of people hate the Sharapova Shriek, and the various versions of uh-AIHHHHH grunts that come out of the mouths of the ladies.  Personally, I don't mind the Sharapova Shriek.  But I really cannot stand Ostapenko's noise.  It's like a slide whistle.

I saw the end of Konta/Halep.  Props to Konta.  On match point, Halep hit a return that looked like it was close to out.  Some woman in the audience shrieked because I think she thought it was out and that Konta had won.  Konta returned the ball to Halep.  Halep seemed to have thought her return had indeed been called out, because she had a lackluster half-swing that put the ball into the net for the match.  The commentators said she stopped playing and it was a shame.

Could the chair umpire have ordered the point replayed due to the woman screaming?  Such a shame for Halep to lose that way.

[BitterApple]

Venus has always been my sentimental favorite, but she's even more so now after she was dragged through the mud over this car accident and now it turns out it wasn't even her fault. I'd love to see her win another title.

For me, Ostapenko is like Bouchard. I can't stand either one of them, but I can't figure out why. Something about their demeanor is so off-putting.

[theatremouse]

3 hours ago, NowVoyager said:

Oookay.... So, yesterday I was watching Wimbledon on ESPN. I was wondering why they were showing the beginning of Roger's match and not the end of Rafa's. During Rafa's 5th set, I finally heard the announcers say that it was showing on ESPN2. 

Last week Wimbledon was only on ESPN and they rotated through matches so you couldn't really watch one whole. This week ESPN=Centre Court. ESPN2=Court 1.

3 hours ago, blackwing said:

Could the chair umpire have ordered the point replayed due to the woman screaming?  Such a shame for Halep to lose that way.

I believe technically he could've called a let, but it would be very unusual for him to do so since she played the point. And he'd JUST told people to stop calling out too. Bad audience.

[dcalley]

Yikes, it's in black and white that crowd noise and out calls from spectators are not a hindrance. I do think the umpire should have some discretion, though I understand why the rules are for it to be as cut-and-dried as possible. It's easier that way. But hundreds of people gasping at a shot and one woman screaming out during play are not the same.