Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[YaddaYadda]

It's exciting, but that seems like so much for half a season and I also saw a tweet from the actress playing Marian who is now in street clothes and thawed. 

 

They are throwing the kitchen and everything in it at the second half.  Not gonna lie, a tad worried about how this will go.

[KingOfHearts]

 

They are throwing the kitchen and everything in it at the second half.

Maybe they feel like they have to since Frozen is such a tough act to follow? I'm still not sure what the main overarching story is about.

Edited November 5, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Emma]

The second half is going to be packed. The only thing about that that gives me hope is that maybe it's not all going to be about Regina.

[ParadoxLost]

https://twitter.com/VictoriaSmurfit/status/529824405174886400

 

Actress confirms she's playing Cruella.

 

I wonder if A&E are upset that she confirmed.  I thought they liked to keep this kind of thing under wraps until they decide to do an interview about it.

 

I can't see how Cruella can be an arc villain.  She skins puppies alive.  Its got to be a one and done.  Evil Queen can kill villagers but generally you don't mess with dogs. 

 

Archie's dog is Pongo, in case anyone doesn't recall..

Edited November 5, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[YaddaYadda]

Maybe Cruella is a villain for the non magical folks?

[Mari]

I can't see how Cruella can be an arc villain.  She skins puppies alive.  Its got to be a one and done.  Evil Queen can kill villagers but generally you don't mess with dogs. 

The spoiler said "3 female villains", right?

 

It could be one head villain and a couple of minions.  If Cruella's minioning, that could stretch out her arc.   

[Anakerie]

Any chance she could just skin Belle, Henry,and Regina instead? Belle could finally be useful for once. Although now I'm picturing a naked Cruella dancing around to "Goodbye Horses" and asking her reflection something highly inappropriate.

 

Mirror of Truth:   No I most certainly will not!

[HeimrArnadalr]

If she's a villain from our world, that could potentially be interesting. Greg and Tamara aside, there really hasn't been that much interaction between the world without magic and Storybrooke.

[KingOfHearts]

 

I can't see how Cruella can be an arc villain.  She skins puppies alive.

Unless she's more of a dark gray character? I could buy that. Not all villains to be rubbing their hands together and twirling their mustaches... and look what show I'm talking about.

[myril]

Guess I am in the minority then, thinking reading this news: meh. Liked Victore Smurfit in Dracula, and she might play a great Cruella, but couldn't care less about Cruella. But I already didn't find Peter Pan / Neverland that exciting as idea, and Oz only a little more because of the richness of the tales connected to it (which they sorely avoided to make any good use of). There are so much more story telling treasures in the whole fairy tale worlds of the globe than this bunch of goofy (animated) Disney heroes and villains, but whatever. Seeing what they're doing with the main characters of the show, and particular have done to Emma an episode ago, consider this show to be soon on my sickday or rainy-summer-bore-day binge watch list at best.  Might lose even its appeal to discuss it for me.

[ParadoxLost]

Any chance she could just skin Belle, Henry,and Regina instead? Belle could finally be useful for once. Although now I'm picturing a naked Cruella dancing around to "Goodbye Horses" and asking her reflection something highly inappropriate.

 

I still don't get how most fairy tale animals are people in Storybrooke ; but now we need to expect that Pongo stayed a dog.  Based on Jiminey and Gus, we should be expecting Cruella to be making coats of people.

[SiobhanJW]

Who would be the 3rd Villian? We have Cruella and Malicifient?

[InsertWordHere]

I love Cruella too, she and Ursula are my two favorite Disney villainnesses (did I spell that right?). Note to showrunners, her name is CRUELLA. Meaning please no sob stories. Don't muck this up, okay? (Belle being involved does not give me great confidence.)

But it's not her fault her parents named her Cruel Devil! Just like it's not Green Green or Queen Queen's fault they turned green and became a queen, respectively. They were only doing what they were born to do. Evil isn't born, it's made with faulty naming practices!

 

I'd love for the third baddy to be Ursula, but with Cinderella coming back and Will's connection to Anastasia, I wonder if it won't be Lady Tremaine.

[stealinghome]

If she's a villain from our world, that could potentially be interesting. Greg and Tamara aside, there really hasn't been that much interaction between the world without magic and Storybrooke.

I agree, but I wonder if the negative reaction to Tamara&Greg scared Adam and Eddie off doing any "real world" stuff pretty permanently. It would be a shame if so--the idea behind Tamara and Greg was actually interesting, but the execution was utterly abysmal--but it would be so like Adam and Eddie to ignore the crappy execution as being the real reason it didn't work.

[KingOfHearts]

 

I wonder if it won't be Lady Tremaine.

Lady Tremaine was actually in OUATIW. Don't know if she could be a Big Bad, but she could definitely be there to annoy the crap out of Ashley and Anastasia.

 

 

I still don't get how most fairy tale animals are people in Storybrooke ; but now we need to expect that Pongo stayed a dog.  Based on Jiminey and Gus, we should be expecting Cruella to be making coats of people.

I believe it only applies to talking animals.

Edited November 5, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[ParadoxLost]

I believe it only applies to talking animals.

 

So we are going with even though the dogs talk in the movie that doesn't count because they are "talking" to each other and the barking is being translated?

[KAOS Agent]

 

but it would be so like Adam and Eddie to ignore the crappy execution as being the real reason it didn't work.

 

They shouldn't have made it a taser. It's all the taser's fault! 

[InsertWordHere]

Wild speculation: Pongo is the sorcerer in disguise. He's been living as a dog this whole time, pulling a Peter Pettigrew.

[retrograde]

Oh man, first a reindeer, then a whole bunch of babies, and now a whole bunch of dogs. That must be super frustrating for just about everyone on set.

[Jean]

Ursula's about the only iconic female villain left. It would have to be her if their strategy is throwing the kitchen sink in a desperate bid to keep Frozen watchers. But in Ariel they de-villained her no? She was a goddess that was worshipped?

I'm not too sure about this 3 female villains thing on the heels of Wicked, Eva and DQ. It's a bit much. Can't they mix in a male or 2? There's plenty of them left. I'm sure a hot Scar can regain some viewers.

They also have way more restraint with male villains in the requsite "look at these poor poor victims" sob story than they do with the females. Not sure what that says.

[RadioGirl27]

The next half season looks less and less interesting. While a have a soft spot for the animated "101 Dalmatians", I'm not a fan of Cruella. She is fun in a "I'm totally nuts" kind of way, but I don't find her a particularly interesting or compelling villian. I'm sure the writers are going to give her a sobbing backstory. Knowing them, Snow's dog (or Emma's if they decide to make her from our world) bite her when she was a child and that's why she hates dogs and the Charmings.

Edited November 5, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[retrograde]

This TVLine article on the Cruella de Vil thing doesn't have much new, but there is this:

 

Series cocreator Eddy Kitsis previously told TVLine of the Season 4B arc, “The seeds are planted in the first 10 [episodes], so that when you see [the fall finale reveal] in 11 you go, ‘Ah, OK.’”

 

 

I get that for the DQ but not Maleficent or Cruella. The only "seed" I can think of is the hat. Will they both be in there? Or does he really mean "We're going to cram a whole bunch of new stuff in episode 10."

[FurryFury]

The next half season looks less and less intetesting. While a have a soft spot for the animated "101 Dalmatians", I'm not a fan of Cruella. She is fun in a "I'm totally nuts" kind of way, but I don't find her a particularly interesting or compelling villian. I'm sure the writers are going to give her a sobning backstory. Knowing them, Snow's dog (or Emma's if they decide to make her from our world) bite her when she was a child and that's why she hates dogs and the Charmings.

 

Yeah, I just don't give a damn about Cruella. She could probably be great comic relief, though, But at least we aren't getting a whole half-season of her, she'll likely be nothing more than Mal's sidekick. Although I don't understand why couldn't they have just Maleficent, there should be definitely enough material for just her. Especially if she's the Black Fairy.

[myril]

This TVLine article on the Cruella de Vil thing doesn't have much new, but there is this:

 

 

Series cocreator Eddy Kitsis previously told TVLine of the Season 4B arc, “The seeds are planted in the first 10 [episodes], so that when you see [the fall finale reveal] in 11 you go, ‘Ah, OK.’”

 

I get that for the DQ but not Maleficent or Cruella. The only "seed" I can think of is the hat. Will they both be in there? Or does he really mean "We're going to cram a whole bunch of new stuff in episode 10."

 

Suddenly have to think of Storybrooke flooded with evil characters seeking either their happy ending or revenge or both - though that would be more something for a final show down, last season thing. Regina appearing as an angel compared to the combined evil power of three, saving the town heroically, and Rumple sacrificing himself again but now ultimately for his grandson to survive that evil frenzy. Going to have nightmare, I think.

[Writing Wrongs]

It can't be coincidence that whenever Disney puts out a blu-ray that Once intros the character, can it?

 

Little Mermaid Diamond Edition came out when they brought in Ariel.

 

Peter Pan Diamond Edition when they brought in Pan.

 

Malificent came out and now we get Malificent back.

 

They just announced the Diamond edition of 101 Dalmations and now we get Cruella.

 

I guess I should watch 101 Dalmations now.

Edited November 5, 2014 by Writing Wrongs

[YaddaYadda]

I think 4B is going to be one hot mess.  I don't even know how they're going to work any of this out.  The only thing I can come up with is that the plot will extend to next season.

[NotBothered]

Yeah....I'm having a hard time getting excited about this.  I do like the potential for a non-magical villain, but I just did not care for 101 Dalmatians.   And it's not the visceral childhood fear and dislike I had for Dumbo and Pinnochio...I just found 101 Dalmatians boring.  I like her look, but that's just about it.  I just don't see how this fits in with anything else.  Or how a villain who skins dogs for a coat works for more than a one off.  Are we going to have an episode of Emma wondering where all the dogs in town (that we have never seen before) are disappearing to, and then an episode where we meet the person in head of the pet shelter  who no one has ever met before (even though David worked there) and is just a little too helpful?  

 

I wonder if the multitude of villains means that 4B won't have an arc-long big bad and that the 4B arc is actually the book.  Does Regina go on a hunt for the the other villains to try and go get all their happy endings together?  Is there a villains support group in Storybrooke? 

Edited November 5, 2014 by NotBothered

[patchwork]

Could they be going Inkheart on us? 

 

Someone has the power to bring characters from books, in this case The Book, to life including Maleficent, Cruella and ?

 

Episodic or or mini arc villains would make a nice change of pace.   

[sharky]

Do we know if Cruella is going to be there all season or just make an appearance in an episode or two?

And could the third villain be the Snow Queen? It would be nice to see a villain actually not be defeated at the end of their half season arc if they don't want to get predictable. What's the point of having a villain if it's assured that the villain dies after 11 episodes?

[RadioGirl27]

I think it's either Regina doing something to change the book and bringing back all this villians, or they are going to destroy the hat and all the magical beings trapped there are going to be freed, both good and bad. Either way it's going to be a hot mess. It can be a cool cliffhanger to have a lot of iconic chatacters, like Maleficent or Cruella, arriving to Storybrooke. But after that, I don't trust this writers to do something compelling with it.

[ShadowFacts]

 

Yeah....I'm having a hard time getting excited about this.  I do like the potential for a non-magical villain, but I just did not care for 101 Dalmatians.   And it's not the visceral childhood fear and dislike I had for Dumbo and Pinnochio...I just found 101 Dalmatians boring.  I like her look, but that's just about it.  I just don't see how this fits in with anything else.  Or how a villain whose is skins dogs for a coat works for more than a one off.  Are we going to have an episode of Emma wondering where all the dogs in town (that we have never seen before) are disappearing to, and then an episode where we meet the person in head of the pet shelter  who no one has ever met before (even though David worked there) and is just a little too helpful?

 

This show is not what it once was, pun intended.  After Season 1, it's just become a giant cartoon-y merchandising vehicle for Disney. 

[shipperx]

I still don't get how most fairy tale animals are people in Storybrooke ; but now we need to expect that Pongo stayed a dog. Based on Jiminey and Gus, we should be expecting Cruella to be making coats of people.

It's probably like the old joke about Goofy and Pluto and how Goofy could talk and was Mickey's friend and Pluto was Mickey's dog. Sometimes the dog is a dog.

Wonder if Cruella could be part of the theories about Lily having been kicked into the real world via hat. It might fit with Cruella being a 'real world's like villain.

[angelwoody]

Am I the only one dreading Cruella?  I mean, she has style, for sure, but the whole plot of 101 Dalmatians has always sickened me.  Even as a child I found the movie stressful to watch because I've always had dogs.  I really don't want to watch a half season of puppy torture/ killing.  They can't really be thinking of doing that story, right?  I mean, it's horrible for something on at 8PM on a Sunday. 

[HoodlumSheep]

Fingers crossed for Perdita to finally make an appearance!!!!

[YaddaYadda]

I'm not looking forward to Cruella either.  She's one villain I've been less than excited to hear about.  Actually, I wanted the show to stay away from anything to do with animals, that's the Lion King and everything else like that.  I just don't see how she fits in 4B with Mal and possibly DQ.  I've been wanting a non magical villain for a long time, I just didn't want it to be Cruella.

[FurryFury]

I wanna see a male villain, TBH. I get it that most iconic fairy tale villains are female... But maybe it's time to get away from the easily marketable stuff? Why not do a story about the Sorceror (although maybe we'll get it next year, and he'll probably be Merlin, thus, hello Arhurian Mythos assassination!) or Scar or a hundred non-Disney villains? I mean, we got, in a row, Zelena, DQ and now the new villainess trio.

[Curio]

I just don't see how [Cruella] fits in 4B with Mal and possibly DQ.

I could be on board with it if it means a whole bunch of villains were released from the hat, but that would also have to mean Cruella is magical, which would be annoying. Unless we're all wrong about the hat only sucking in magical people...

 

My biggest concern is if they make her the new head of the stupid Home Office organization.

[HoodlumSheep]

Jabberwocky, Jabberwocky, Jabberwocky!!!!

JabberwockyFor3rdVillainess2k14! Too long to trend, I suppose?

I don't know if they could flesh out her background enough, but they could expand on the whole, "monsters aren't born they're made" saying she said in OUATIW.

[patchwork]

I could be on board with it if it means a whole bunch of villains were released from the hat, but that would also have to mean Cruella is magical, which would be annoying. Unless we're all wrong about the hat only sucking in magical people...

 

My biggest concern is if they make her the new head of the stupid Home Office organization.

 

In and of itself I don't think the Home Office was a bad idea but the execution sucked and then it got tied to the Neverland arc and never really made sense. 

 

I can't see how Cruella would work as a Storybrooke villain on her own, she needs to be either the one bankrolling the operation or be the snarky partner in crime who avoids physical confrontation. 

[shipperx]

Jabberwocky, Jabberwocky, Jabberwocky!!!!

JabberwockyFor3rdVillainess2k14! Too long to trend, I suppose?

I don't know if they could flesh out her background enough, but they could expand on the whole, "monsters aren't born they're made" saying she said in OUATIW.

Jabberwocky was creepy as hell on Once Wonderland... I'm all for it.

[YaddaYadda]

Unless we're all wrong about the hat only sucking in magical people...

 

When Belle takes the box after it falls out of Anna's satchel, Anna tells her that it's a hat that strips the magic from the most powerful sorcerers.  So I think that the hat is just pure, undiluted magic.  The people that magic belonged to are likely somewhere in a whole different world (as someone said the hat probably spits them out) after their magic has been taken.  

 

Jabberwocky was creepy as hell on Once Wonderland... I'm all for it.

 

How many Jabberwocky are there?  And Wonderland, the events did they take place before or after the curse or was it split in two.  I remember during one fairyback with James and Jacqueline (Tiny, maybe), they said that Jack had slain the Jabberwocky, so that's the reason I'm asking.



Edited November 5, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[patchwork]

When Belle takes the box after it falls out of Anna's satchel, Anna tells her that it's a hat that strips the magic from the most powerful sorcerers.  So I think that the hat is just pure, undiluted magic.  The people that magic belonged to are likely somewhere in a whole different world (as someone said the hat probably spits them out) after their magic has been taken.  

 

How many Jabberwocky are there?  And Wonderland, the events did they take place before or after the curse or was it split in two.  I remember during one fairyback with James and Jacqueline (Tiny, maybe), they said that Jack had slain the Jabberwocky, so that's the reason I'm asking.



 

When we meet her the Jabberwocky is trapped in a tower and impaled by the the vorpal sword so she can't move. Jack did the best she could against an immortal creature. Jafar uses the same method at the end of OUAIW.

[HoodlumSheep]

How do I make the spoiler tabs?? Someone please tell me!!!

Patchwork, I can't remember, but was it specifically stated that Jack was the one who did the thing in your spoiler?

The jabberwocky once mentioned "monsters aren't born they're made." Except she used "we," so I always gathered there could be more than one.

Edited November 5, 2014 by HoodlumSheep

[patchwork]

It's been long time and I marathoned the last half of OUATIW so I don't honestly remember it that well. I'm linking the two events and making the assumption that Jack was part of imprisoning the Jabberwacky as we saw her in Wonderland but I can easily be wrong. 

 

To spoiler tag you use

 

Edited November 5, 2014 by patchwork

[Curio]

How do I make the spoiler tabs?? Someone please tell me!!!

 

Highlight the text you want hidden, and then click the circle icon with the line through it. If you hover your mouse over the icon, it should say "Spoiler."

[HoodlumSheep]

It's been long time and I marathoned the last half of OUATIW so I don't honestly remember it that well. I'm linking the two events and making the assumption that Jack was part of imprisoning the Jabberwacky as we saw her in Wonderland but I can easily be wrong.

To spoiler tag you use

Oh, okay. Thank you for telling me how to make a spoiler tag!

Test run (nothing spoilery though):

Did this work?

Yay!!! It worked!

Edited November 5, 2014 by HoodlumSheep

[Shanna Marie]

If we're getting Cruella, does that mean we get lots and lots of puppies? Because I don't really care what else is going on if we get to watch our cast playing with puppies. A Dalmatian puppy infestation would be the cutest thing ever. Puppies! (Sorry, I'm a big dog lover but have severe allergies so I can't live with one in the house, so I have to enjoy dogs vicariously and therefore turn into a toddler when a dog or puppy appears on a TV screen.)

 

The multiple villains could mean that Regina gets her wish and creates a world where villains get happy endings. Oops.

[Curio]

The multiple villains could mean that Regina gets her wish and creates a world where villains get happy endings. Oops.

I really want this to happen, but I don't know if they'd want to tackle that storyline until Regina finds out who's writing Henry's story book. Since Operation Mongoose is extending into 4B, I doubt we'll resolve the author's identity at the end of 4A.

 

ETA: Oops, I meant Operation Mongoose, not Cobra. Totally different operations!

Edited November 5, 2014 by Curio

[KingOfHearts]

I highly doubt Cruella's mission is to skin puppies. Pongo is the only dog in town, and I don't know if he's even enough for one coat. One things for sure - she's here for something more interesting than a random Big Bad. I'm going to have a little faith with this one. Her story doesn't have enough for a whole half-season, so I bet there'll be plenty of original material. I'm betting on her being a secondary character.

 

As to where she's from, she's probably from either our London or Victorian England World.

 

 

And I kind of want there to be a woman who's the perfect match for Archie who owns Perdita.

A love interest for Archie? I'm sold.

Edited November 5, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Shanna Marie]

I really want this to happen, but I don't know if they'd want to tackle that storyline until Regina finds out who's writing Henry's story book. Since Operation Cobra is extending into 4B, I doubt we'll resolve the author's identity at the end of 4A.

I thought Cruella was for 4B, along with Maleficent? Or are they bringing her in at the end of 4A?

 

Still, puppies!

 

And I kind of want there to be a woman who's the perfect match for Archie who owns Perdita. We need the iconic dog walking scene where the leashes get tangled. Though it would then be hard to get all those puppies before the end of the season, considering a season seems to span maybe a week.