S04.E01: A Tale Of Two Sisters

[formerlyfreedom]

A scared and confused Elsa from Arendelle finds herself in Storybrooke and creates a powerful snow monster for protection, Regina wonders if her relationship with Robin Hood has been completely quashed now that Marian's back in the picture, and in Arendelle of the past, Elsa's sister Anna wants to complete their parent's fateful journey and discover if their quest may have held the secret to containing Elsa's out of control ice powers.

 

Topic will open after the series premieres on the East Coast on Sunday, September 28.

[Mari]

I started by watching the preview.  That was a mistake.  That alone made me want to join the table-flipping club. 

Actual episode?

Good points:

•Emma pointed out to Regina that Regina killed her.  Because Regina not killing her boyfriend’s wife is a good thing.

•I did think the Robin/Regina “I need to stay with Marian”discussion was well-done

•Okay, I shouldn’t enjoy this, but I do--Leroy in his screamy town crier position always kind of makes me laugh.

•Hook calling Emma on avoiding him, and on it being about more than just Regina. 

 

Bad points:

•‘Cause Regina actually taking responsibility for killing Marian, instead of pretending that the Evil Queen was a completely separate person would be bizarre and out of the question.

•still really hating Elsa’s costume.

•So, apparently heroic Regina still has a super secret cell block of useful people?  Yeah.  Heroic.  And I’d like to point out that remirroring someone is probably anti-heroic, too.

•While parts of Rumbelle worked, that dance scene was . . . not good.  Very not good.  Blech.

•lots of it was just . . . dull.

•the snowman.  It’s worth repeating.  The snowman.

•Why does doing magic on this show always look like they’re doing jazz hands?

•Oh look, yet again, everyone but Regina is useless.  Yay. 

 

So, was Regina serious about saving Marian, or was that just covering so that if something happens to Marian she’s less likely to be blamed? 

Either I quit watching, or there’s a lot of fast forwarding in my future.

[ParadoxLost]

Did Rumple just reveal Mickey Mouse's hat from Fantasia?  If Mickey Mouse wrote the book I am going to lose it.

 

More likely its Merlin's hat.  Or is this some thing from Frozen?  I haven't seen that movie.

Edited September 29, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[prospazzinator]

Regina is basically a toddler. Mine, mine, mine. Temper tantrum. Crying to get attention. 

[RandomWatcher]

Letting the narcoleptic dwarf drive is a bad idea.

Was not expecting the trolls and was glad there was only one

When did Emma get her magic back?

[stealinghome]

So I have mixed feelings about this episode. As a normal, run-of-the-mill episode, it's pretty strong--certainly better than most of Season 3 (and Season 2). If it had aired mid-season, I would have liked it. As a premiere, though, it was pretty underwhelming. If I was a new viewer, even a Frozen fan, I'm not sure I would tune in again next week.

 

The show has officially made Robin Hood into the World's Biggest Douche. I love how he literally does not give any fucks at all that Regina killed Marian in the past and is all "Sorry, I really want to be with you, but I can't." World's. Biggest. Douche. Guys, he's officially worse than Belle--he keeps excusing and minimizing Regina's evil, including the murder of his "beloved" wife, the mother of his child. He may actually be a psychopath.

 

Also the Woegina stuff made me want to throw up. Every time one of the Charmings was yammering on about how Regina is just oh so redeemed, all I could think was "Except she's concocting a plot to kill Marian right now. Oh look, she's still got a bunch of people locked away that she doesn't give a shit about. Oh look, she's not bothered at all by all the murders she's done in the past--ha ha, I'm glad the peasants you murdered were so vanilla you can't remember them. Oh look, she just imprisoned poor Sidney back in the mirror with nary a second thought to serve her own selfish aims." I actually laughed out loud when she was all "I've worked so hard to be better!" Yeah, obviously you're working so hard to be better...when you're plotting murders and enslaving people. Changing the book isn't going to help if you don't change yourself, yo. Glad to see that still hasn't sunk in. (Also, Regina and the Evil Queen are not separate people. That is ridiculous, writers. And you show that it's a lie when you have Regina plotting to murder people even as she whinges on that she's so reformed.)

 

I am so Team Marian and all about Marian giving everyone a reality check on Regina.

 

Also, Rumbelle. Show, you're making it so that I can't root for them at all anymore. Stop. It. I did really like the first half of Rumpel's monologue to Neal's grave, though.

 

Surprisingly, I really enjoyed the Frozenbacks. Elsa, Anna and Kristoff were all really strong, and the relationships between them were lovely. That is the kind of thing the show excels at. I've not seen Frozen, so that was all new to me, and I quite like it. I'm all about more Frozen, less Woegina. However, as I predicted, the Charmings got totally sidelined in favor of 70% Frozen, 29% Woegina bullshit angst, and 1% Rumbelle. Wow.

 

So...A+ for the Frozen stuff, F for the Storybrooke stuff, and a big fat meh to it as a season premiere, though an "okay" for it as an episode.

Edited September 29, 2014 by stealinghome

[Writing Wrongs]

I thought the troll was cute and I liked how they did Sven.

 

I just can't with Regina's crap anymore.

 

What was with that bad over the shoulder shot of Regina talking to Sidney? The stand-in had noticeably shorter hair than Lana.

 

I'm beginning to think Emma is a prick tease.

[CatMack]

I have been extremely tolerant of Regina's redemption arch.  She was a victim of abuse and grew up with a twisted sense of love because of it.  That doesn't excuse the things she's done, but it made me sympathetic enough that I was willing to see her earn a happy ending.

 

This episode pretty much killed that for me finally.  It was the straw that broke the camel's back.  I'm done.  She wants instant gratification, instant happiness.  She thinks the bare bones of being a decent person (ie not actively murdering anyone in, like, a couple months) means she's entitled to happiness.  Grow the fuck up.  I'm tired of her tantrums.  I no longer care. 

 

I did like all the Frozen stuff.  Anna was adorable, Elsa is intriguing as an antagonist who's not really a villain, and Kristof was a cutie-pa-tootie.

 

Also liked the Captain Swan stuff.  I'm easy, what can I say. 

[Guest Accused Dingo]

Find the writer.

I like the Frozen storyline better then the Peter Pan one and think it has potential.

I also like what they are doing with Regina. Is she a monster? That has always been her overriding story arc. I would like to see it continued.

Killer Snowman!

Edited September 29, 2014 by Accused Dingo

[ParadoxLost]

Kristoff's hair made him look weirdly like Claymation.

 

I really don't think I'm focusing on what they want me to.

 

When Regina decided she was going to take out the author of the book I was thinking A&E are so dead, the egomaniacs.

[scarynikki12]

It's nice to know that Regina still thinks she can get her happy ending the easy way rather than working for it.

Rumple found a tall blue wizard hat. Does this mean Mickey's coming to town to enchant some broomsticks and flood Storybrooke?

I like that the Enchanted Forest has a proper name.

I really hope Regina fails in her "villains need happy endings" quest. She and Rumpel are still alive, not in prison, are being kissed up to by their victims, and are not being yelled at constantly by said victims. I'd say they already have happy endings.

[ShadowFacts]

Did Rumple just reveal Mickey Mouse's hat from Fantasia?  If Mickey Mouse wrote the book I am going to lose it.

 

More likely its Merlin's hat.  Or is this some thing from Frozen?  I haven't seen that movie.

 

Yes, from Fantasia, there were a couple bars of music from that movie.  And it is a little weird that right after Regina says they're going to find the writer, they cut to Gold and the Mickey sorcererer's hat.  Usually cuts like that point to what was just spoken about.  So, I'll  lose it with you if Mickey wrote the book.

 

The Frozen stuff was pretty well done aside from the ridiculous monster and the rock troll.  Just no.

[NotBothered]

So...umm...Frozen was a lot more enjoyable than I expected?  At this point, I would watch that spin off and quit the main show.

 

Ugh.  Regina.  I want to buy the redemption arc.  I want to give them the fanfic benefit of the doubt.  But they keep undermining it.  And at this point I blame 1/2 of it on Lana.  A&E don't get it, but she keeps dropping into the villain voice.  If you keep using it in Storybrooke, we are going to keep thinking you're evil!  And it has been, what, a month since her last evil deed with this screwed up timeline?  Stop undermining the redemption arc you seem so committed to!

 

ETA: So what is going on with the Mirror scenes?  Did they rewrite them? Did they film them all upfront? Because it is obvious that Giancarlo and Lana did not film the scene in the crypt together (maybe the prison? I dumped my old cable and can't rewind to check anymore).

Edited September 29, 2014 by NotBothered

[YaddaYadda]

The show was okay for a premier, I just thought their choice of bringing in Emma after 30 mins of the show had already lapsed was stupid.   I did enjoy her blasting the snow monster and I think she and Hook are really pretty together.

 

Regina is now background noise for me.  Could care less what she does, what she says.  I like how she just showed up to save the day.  Regina is so good, she wants to travel back in time to kill Marian before Emma and Hook show up and now she wants to find the author of the book so that she can basically coerce him into writing her happy ending.

 

Could have done without the honeymoon though I have to say that Rumple looked like an addict staring at his crack in the scene with the hat.

 

The Frozen gang seems to have hit the ground running.  I actually enjoyed them.

 

ETA - The Belle fashion, with the bra showing under the shirt?  So 2000!

Edited September 29, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[stealinghome]

Oh, and I actually didn't think the CGI was that bad. We've had much, much worse on this show.

 

So...umm...Frozen was a lot more enjoyable than I expected?  At this point, I would watch that spin off and quit the main show.

If they bring over Emma and Charming (Snow and Snowflake and Grumpy can make cameos every once in a while), I am so there it's not even funny.

[Crimson Belle]

Sven was the overall best actor tonight.

Meh. MEh. MEHmehMEHmehMEHmeh to the rest.

And now I'm firmly convinced that the head idiots in charge have a dictionary that does not define words the same way that I learned in school. Redemption my ass.

[bmoore4026]

Marshmallow 2.0!  So much love!

 

The actress they got for Anna is cute looking!  And live action or animated, Kristoff is a slab-o hunk-o man worthy of much adoration.

 

Sven better show up in more episodes.  Could they just swap out Henry for Sven?

 

And Regina needs her ears boxed.  Maybe they can find a portal to the Marvel Universe, chuck her in, and she ends up in Latveria and hooks up with Doctor Doom.  They have so much in common.

 

And even in death, Baelfire/Neal is a load on this show.

[Mari]

When did Emma get her magic back?

When she and Hook were in the past. 

[marieYOTZ]

I cam into the show wanting to be Team Regina, and hoping for a show that would take 'good' and 'evil' characters and push them into the middle. I have been so disappointed, and tonight might have broken me.

I have hand waved a lot of Regina/Evil Queen's stuff. I can't hand wave forgetting someone in a basement cell for a couple years while you're having your redemption arc. That's beyond fucked up. My hand waving wrist is broken. Not to mention the follow up of her remembering when she decided to off someone. If i can't have a cohesive move for Regina from black to grey, then i just give up.

And yes, the Fantasia hat? I felt despair well in my chest. The very few withered hopes that this was a show with some sort of theme/message-based purpose died on the vine, and i accept it's just 100% "squeeze in as many disney references as we can" drivel.

I'm so sad.

[AmeliaBedelia]

Reading the recaps from last week definitely helped lower my expectations (which turned out to be a good thing).

 

I enjoyed most of the Frozen scenes, but was annoyed by how little we saw of Emma and company. Episode basically felt like set-up. I don't care about Rumbelle, but their dance was surprisingly short.

The snow monster was silly looking, and I hated how everyone was conveniently knocked out for twenty seconds...just enough time for Regina to save the day. The Captain Swan kiss was cute. I appreciated Hook's exasperation with her. The troll was perhaps the best bit of CGI the show has done. Looking forward to next week where Emma will hopefully get more than five minutes of airtime.

[bmoore4026]

So...umm...Frozen was a lot more enjoyable than I expected?  At this point, I would watch that spin off and quit the main show.

 

I'm all for it.  Maybe make it sitcom.  Call it My sister-in-law, the Ice Queen.

[Dani-Ellie]

You know, it would be wonderful if Regina actually took some damn responsibility for something for once in her freakin' life. The book doesn't give out happy endings, Regina. You know who's responsible for your happy ending? You. You are. That's why those around you can find their happy endings in the unexpected places, because they're open to finding them in the unexpected places. And how changed can you really be if literally everyone around you is expecting you to fully revert back to Evil Queen mode? Because guess what? It's not everyone else, Regina. It's you.

 

*sigh*

 

On the positive side of things, Anna is freakin' adorable. (I've not seen Frozen, so I have zero idea if Show!Anna is matching up at all with Movie!Anna, but here, she's adorable.) I loved all the Captain Swan stuff, and the "Be patient" was just so sweet because here's Hook, wanting to freakin' shout it from the rooftops that he and Emma are a thing and Emma's still being Emma but she's no longer shutting down the possibility and * dreamy sigh.* [/Captain Swan 4eva]

 

Loved Emma not apologizing for saving a life AND telling Regina that she saved Marian from Regina herself. Loved Charming deciding that maybe they should have named the baby Baelfire. Loved Grumpy and Sleepy. Loved Grumpy running into town, screaming about the snow monster, much to Emma's chagrin. More humor like that, please, show.

 

Also, is it next Sunday yet??

Edited September 29, 2014 by Dani-Ellie

[El Seed]

"What is wrong with you people?!" I say that all the time about the inconceivable relationships characters have with Regina.

 

"I won't apologize for saving a woman's life." Hold onto that, Emma. It's the correct response! Never let it go! No cheerleading!

 

Multiple characters about Regina: "She's changed!" Oh please. She's like a well-lubricated weather vane. Wait 5 minutes, she'll change again.

 

Why the fuck should I feel sorry for Regina? She doesn't want to work for her redemption, she wants it handed to her. Cry me a frigging river, Regina. Move on. Look at your life, look at your choices.

 

Also, does this mean Regina had Sidney locked up all this time? And I'm supposed to believe she's working on being redeemed?

 

The Rumbelle stuff...meh. I was singing "Beauty and King Dork" from The Critic during their dance. No apologies.

 

That CGI snowman...damn, that was bad. And not in the good way.

 

I liked the Frozen stuff, Captain Swan, Leroy taking up his town crier mantle once again, and Marian telling it like it is. That's...sad. Let go of the Woegina fanfiction, showrunners.

[RandomWatcher]

And where were all those townspeople when Elsa was freezing up main street?

[bmoore4026]

And where were all those townspeople when Elsa was freezing up main street?

 

Granny's probably.  Everybody's either at Granny's or town hall.

[Cindy McLennan]

Oh, and I actually didn't think the CGI was that bad. We've had much, much worse on this show.

 

 

Yes. And I can take CGI that creates fantastical creatures. What exactly would a snow rock monster look like? Well, why not like that?

 

The show was okay for a premier, I just thought their choice of bringing in Emma after 30 mins of the show had already lapsed was stupid.   I did enjoy her blasting the snow monster and I think she and Hook are really pretty together.

 

 

Agreed. Generally speaking, this show's rule of thumb is that it succeeds when it remembers it is the fairy tale about Princess Emma. When it shoves her to the sidelines, it fails. 

 

I'm far more over Rumpelstiltskin than I am Regina. I expected Regina to act up. That she saved Marian in the clinch tells me she's going to waffle in going evil again. She's just hurt and doesn't know how to behave normally.

I've been over Rumple since he married Belle, while faking her out about the dagger. That he didn't confess to her (after his tearful confession to dead Neal's headstone), but rather switched the daggers, means nothing to me. At this point, his storyline tastes of ashes, which is a damned shame, considering his heroic exit in 3.11.

Edited September 29, 2014 by CindyMcLennan

[NotBothered]

This was a weird mixed bag of Disney makes it better and Disney makes it worse.  I give Disney Corp. all the credit for making Frozen work.  I swear someone else helped on those dialogue sections, because they worked way to well for it to be the usual crew.  But I also blame them for the stupid shoe-horning of the dance (and the terrible costumes).  At least Rumple's redemption is sticking more than Regina's though.

 

Tumblr, etc. keeps making me pro-Regina, and then I watch, and it all goes to pot.  She was inexcusable in this episode.  I am more than happy to buy into Robin's argument that the Evil Queen and Regina are different people (because I am a fangirl, and will allow show-runners to admit to mistakes...like taking Regina way way way too dark), but the show keeps showing the opposite!

[madhacker]

yeah, they bring the Mouse into this I'm gonna loose it, and whoever is playing Kristoff is certainly easy on the eyes.

 

Is it just me, or has Henry hit puberty between seasons? He seems to have grown a few inches to me.

Edited September 29, 2014 by madhacker

[stealinghome]

And now I'm firmly convinced that the head idiots in charge have a dictionary that does not define words the same way that I learned in school. Redemption my ass.

For real. You know what the craziest part is? The show broke its own logic tonight by having each of the Charmings wonder--multiple times--if Regina was going to turn evil again and hope that she wasn't going to and say things like "It's what she's going to do that I'm worried about." (Which, you know, given that she was halfway to murder, they weren't wrong to be concerned.) But a) you're nowhere near redemption when your boyfriend of two days breaking up with you sends you into a murderous rage, sorry writers, and b) if the Charmings are truly, seriously concerned that she'll revert to evil at the drop of a hat, why do they let her walk around town like a normal person??? I can kind of--kind of--buy them letting Regina do her thing if they truly feel she's redeemed and so forth. But if they don't, it just puts a big neon sign over the ridiculousness that is Regina at this point, the total illogicality of how the show treats her. "In general I'm concerned this person could fly into a murderous rage at the drop of a hat...so I'm going to let her walk around town, no surveillance, no guards." Show, you can't have it both ways. Either the Charmings believe she's redeemed or they don't, but then they need to act in the appropriate way given how they feel about her.

 

I sound really cranky about it, but I'm actually not. I'm more just totally amazed that the writing has got this bad. What a meh episode.

[YaddaYadda]

The Rumple scene at Neal's grave was a "yeah yeah yeah, move it along.  Heroism, really?"  I just can't deal! 

[Mari]

You know, it would be wonderful if Regina actually took some damn responsibility for something for once in her freakin' life. The book doesn't give out happy endings, Regina. You know who's responsible for your happy ending? You. You are. That's why those around you can find their happy endings in the unexpected places, because they're open to finding them in the unexpected places.

I'm confused about the book handing out happy endings.  What, exactly, has the book shown that hasn't already happened?  In the time-travel adventure, when the past was changed, half the book vanished, because it hadn't happened yet.  This makes no sense.

 

(Also, yes to everything you said about Regina.)

 

Why the fuck should I feel sorry for Regina? She doesn't want to work for her redemption, she wants it handed to her. Cry me a frigging river, Regina. Move on. Look at your life, look at your choices.

 

Also, does this mean Regina had Sidney locked up all this time? And I'm supposed to believe she's working on being redeemed?

Yup.  We're apparently supposed to feel horrible for Regina because 13 months of not actively trying to kill people for no valid reason whatsoever means she should be completely happy right this minute! 

 

Who cares that she still has a son who is devoted to her, or that she's only been dating Robin for four days?  She wants Robin, too!  Since one thing didn't go her way, her happiness is destroyed. 

[Actionmage]

IA that the recap special was only for total newcomers, i.e. folks who never saw a frame of this show.

 

I liked the stone guy, Granpopi/Granpoppy/someone with an assist?  He was charming and only as long as needed.

 

Emma still hasn't learned that guns a-blazin' isn't the way to go with the usual threats Storybrooke gets.

 

Always glad to see Sydney! He looks good with the facial hair, but he was so sad and lost. Then re-mirrored. Sydney needs a hug and I have one for the poor guy. We may end up with a snarktastic Syd as a result, so that could be fun too.

 

Poor Marian. First, she sees the woman who was going to kill her and put her head on a spike. Then her husband, her rescuers, and the charmings are all "You okay, BoobooGina?" On top of that the bombshell that Regina was..."seeing" her husband and was around Roland? She has every right to freak out, Show. (Yes, I remember everyone giving Belle "space" in the immediate aftermath of Rumple killing Pan and himself.)  I hope Marian isn't fully believing that Regina is not a monster. I hope Marian is played as smarter and wilier than that, being the King of Thieves' beloved.

 

I think the stuff Regina said to Sydney about finding The Writer is trolling. There, I said it.  Commentators at TWOP held the writers to minimal standards of logic and common sense. While it may not be to TWOP folks, I felt it was too precious that Regina would blame the book's writer.  Though I'd rather Regina go after the nebulous Writer rather than muck about time. I really have no trust in this Show's ability to do more time travel.

 

I also hope they do not try to make parallels between Regina and Elsa. I haven't seen Frozen, but unless Elsa killed innocents for fun and stole people's agency and mindfrakked them? Not even in the same league. TPTB realize we heard Regina wanting Marian's head on a spike just this episode, right? Because Marian wouldn't give up Snow?

 

While I liked Elsa's dress, is it the only thing she is allowed to wear for eternity? I'd like Marian and Elsa to transition to current fashion in the next episode or two. (Marian, especially if she's planning on staying around.)

 

Not sure how much farther I'll stay with this.   It was an uneven episode.

[mustbekarma]

(Also, Regina and the Evil Queen are not separate people. That is ridiculous, writers. And you show that it's a lie when you have Regina plotting to murder people even as she whinges on that she's so reformed.)

Regina has separated the "two," so to speak, in her mind. Regina thinks since Marian had died in the past, and Emma interfered in that timeline, then she's justified to fixing the original timeline. So Regina is rationalizing Marian's murder. Infuriating as it is, that's Regina. That's why I was so surprised that Regina saved Marian. I guess time will tell if it's plausible deniability or actual growth on her part. I'm slightly leaning towards growth, because Regina was collapsed by the door crying. If it was part of her evil plan, she would have been smirking and drinking a glass of wine.

 

I truly loved this episode. The Frozen parts, especially Anna and Elsa, were all I hoped it would be. I'm so excited for this season.

[Artsda]

Compared to the CGI I saw on Grey's Anatomy this week the snowman CGI was great. Liked the Frozen characters and story so far.

 

I did feel for Regina, didn't blame her for her not wanting to listen to Emma. I too thought Emma was in the right too though for saving Marion. 

 

I also feel for Hook, he thought he and Emma were going to be together and then she starts avoiding him. At least she's not telling him no all together. The kiss she gave him in the woods was cute. He was right, there's always a crisis. They need to be happy in between monsters trying to kill them.

 

Loved the Belle and Rumple, Beauty and the Beast scene. 

 

The hat Rumple with reminded me of Fantasia/being in the middle of Hollywood Studios 

[Dani-Ellie]

I'm confused about the book handing out happy endings.  What, exactly, has the book shown that hasn't already happened?  In the time-travel adventure, when the past was changed, half the book vanished, because it hadn't happened yet.  This makes no sense.

 

Fully agree that it makes no sense and I hope that if and when Regina finds said Writer of the Book, he or she tells her, "You all create your own stories, I'm just recording them." It would even tie in nicely to the Back to the Future time-travel theme because Doc does tell Jennifer at the end of BTTF III that her future is whatever she makes it. Basically, I'm hoping that Regina turns out to be dead freakin' wrong.

[jacehan]

I was meh almost the whole episode - I didn't like that the Frozen bits were taking the movie as straight up exactly what happened, when every other fairy tale and such changed the background/past to be more suited to this genre. Otherwise it was fine.

 

I did feel like much of the episode was a little on the nose - just, very lacking in subtlety. I was almost ready to write it off until the last 5 minutes - I'm interested in the idea of where the book came from, even if Regina's reason is stupid.

 

As for the hat, I'm sure it won't be Mickey - if anything, it would be Yen Sid, the person who actually knows how to use it. And isn't a mouse.

[ParadoxLost]

Its really odd that when they try to portray Regina as having some epic struggle between staying good and turning evil, they do unnecessary stuff to undermine her supposed redemption.

 

They basically implied that Sydney stayed locked up because she forgot about him.  So what other victims does she have locked up down there that she forgot to free when she became good.

 

The whole thing with Robin seeing Regina as two different people because he used to be a bad guy and staying with Marian because he made vows and not because he loves her works my last nerve.

Edited September 29, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[scarynikki12]

I haven't seen Frozen, but unless Elsa killed innocents for fun and stole people's agency and mindfrakked them?

 

Just to be safe I'm putting this under spoiler bars:  

 

In the movie, Elsa needed to learn control.  As children, she had it and would play with Anna using her powers.  Then an accident happened and Anna got hurt, resulting in their parents teaching Elsa that she should be afraid of her powers and the fact that she had them at all.  They even went so far as to isolate both sisters from their kingdom and each other, with Elsa spending hours each day locked in her room terrified of what her powers could do to others, Anna in particular.  When the proper story gets going, Elsa's powers go apeshit after she loses control and her nonstop fear prevents her from reigning them in and removing their devastating effects.  That's one of the focuses of the movie: Elsa letting go of her fear of who she is and what she has and getting the control she had as a child.  We see this a bit in the episode, with Elsa's obvious fear resulting in the snow monster and the trail of ice behind her, though she also seems to have that control by the end of the episode so I think she'll mostly be in control unless Anna's well being is threatened.

 

As for the hat, I'm sure it won't be Mickey - if anything, it would be Yen Sid, the person who actually knows how to use it.

 

 

Good point, though this show will undoubtedly reveal that Rumpel doubled as him too.  That trope is getting so old yet I'm 100% confident we'll keep seeing it until the series finale.

[El Seed]

For real. You know what the craziest part is? The show broke its own logic tonight by having each of the Charmings wonder--multiple times--if Regina was going to turn evil again and hope that she wasn't going to and say things like "It's what she's going to do that I'm worried about." (Which, you know, given that she was halfway to murder, they weren't wrong to be concerned.) But a) you're nowhere near redemption when your boyfriend of two days breaking up with you sends you into a murderous rage, sorry writers, and b) if the Charmings are truly, seriously concerned that she'll revert to evil at the drop of a hat, why do they let her walk around town like a normal person??? I can kind of--kind of--buy them letting Regina do her thing if they truly feel she's redeemed and so forth. But if they don't, it just puts a big neon sign over the ridiculousness that is Regina at this point, the total illogicality of how the show treats her. "In general I'm concerned this person could fly into a murderous rage at the drop of a hat...so I'm going to let her walk around town, no surveillance, no guards." Show, you can't have it both ways. Either the Charmings believe she's redeemed or they don't, but then they need to act in the appropriate way given how they feel about her.

 

Preach! I screamed into a throw pillow a couple times during this episode because it's all so fucking illogical and warped. Regina's working on her redemption, but they're afraid she'll do something evil at the drop of a hat, so they let her do her own thing, because that's what you do when a mass murderer is trying to rehabilitate. Say what? And while St. Regina of the Perpetual Tears is working oh-so-hard on her redemption she's still plotting murder and keeping people locked up (are there others locked up besides Sidney?), which really negates the whole working towards redemption thing. Gah, I'm so irritated I feel like Mrs. White from Clue: "Flames on the side of my face..."

[StaceyNotStacie]

I didn't hate the episode.  I wasn't happy about the Frozen stuff (never saw the movie and probably never will), but I thought it was well done.  The episode seemed very fast paced.  I couldn't believe that it was over so quickly.

[Writing Wrongs]

I guess now I'm going to have to watch Fantasia?

[Cindy McLennan]

Always glad to see Sydney! He looks good with the facial hair, but he was so sad and lost. Then re-mirrored. Sydney needs a hug and I have one for the poor guy. We may end up with a snarktastic Syd as a result, so that could be fun too.

 

I mostly agree with this, except I have to slop on a side of Screw Sidney. King Leopold freed him and welcomed him into his home as a friend, and then Sydney betrayed Leopold to his very death, for a little bit of Regina's um… gina, which he didn't even get. Sid is just as deplorable as Regina and even more pathetic.

[scarynikki12]

I guess now I'm going to have to watch Fantasia?

 

You so should!  There are dancing hippos!

[Guest Accused Dingo]

Here is the thing about Regina...at least in my opinion.  She is half way toward redemption.  At the end of last season she was neither a villain nor a hero but half way in between.  Right now she is on the edge of falling in either direction which is why everyone who.....cares about her is worried.  Which way will she fall now that her heart has been broken again.  Regina doesn't take rejection well and may go back to her basic instinct of revenge....or (and this is what I think her story will be this season) forgiveness....or an interesting line between the two.  Do you freeze your heart when it gets broken....or do you let warmth in?  

 

<---Edited to add....Did they really play the Beauty and the Beast song?   I am not a fan of the pairing because Rumple is still lying to Belle but my heart did melt for a moment.  Favorite movie ever!

Edited September 29, 2014 by Accused Dingo

[Straycat80]

I'm over Regina and Rumple and yeah, whoever said Emma is being a prick tease is correct.

Henry has really grown up! What happened to Regina feeling Henry was ALL she needed and loved? She meets Robin Hood, falls in love, pushes Henry to the side. SMH.

Poor Elsa is never going to be able to hide since her dress trails ice like a slug. Just follow the ice slick and you'll find Elsa.

I am enjoying the Frozen storyline. At least it's better than Peter Pan!

[SimoneS]

I am close to done with this show. I simply don't understand that Regina love and how they ignore all the people she has tortured and killed. Snow and Charming are the worse ruling couple, their subjects get absolutely no justice from them. The only thing that I like is that while Rumple is corny with Belle, he remains evil and no one other Belle buys that he is going the change. 

 

As apparently the only person who has never seen the Frozen movie, I enjoyed Frozen plot a lot. 

Edited September 29, 2014 by SimoneS

[Actionmage]

The whole thing with Robin seeing Regina as two different people because he used to be a bad guy and staying with Marian because he made vows and not because he loves her works my last nerve.

 

I can sort of, if I squint, handle Robin dealing with Past!Regina and Now!Regina, due to actually seeing her fight with Good Guys and wrestle with her past. It's the "I made a vow "/ ""I have rules" that has me rolling my eyes. If you have fallen out of love with Marian, that's not wrong or evil. Yet, staying with Marian solely because Robin married her first (in essence), is pretty douche-y. For Marian, it's like she hasn't been away for long at all, so I get her being more emotional about the Robin/Regina sitch. Maybe Marian and Roland should stay together at Granny's until the three adult persons can figure out what's what.

[KingOfHearts]

Pros:
- Elsa. The actress nailed the role perfectly.

- The Frozen stuff was easily the best part of the episode.

- Sorcerer's Hat was intriguing, but also very cool looking.

- Sven.

- Kristoff.

- Marian. Her flashback in the mirror was awesome.

- This episode was hilarious, for the most part unintentionally.

- Netflix reference.

- The troll CGI was amazing. Very surprised how good it was.

- Sorcerer's Apprentice music!

- Grumpy and Sleepy were extremely funny.

- Robin and Marian were both handled well.

- Regina actually admitted she's still a villainous monster. 

 

Cons:

- It was so slow and boring in some parts. Very soap opera.

- Show, just stop with the Neal tributes! He had two flashbacks and a baby named after him. He's done.

- Anna. Her perkiness and personality were so overplayed.

- Woegina. Oh my gosh, this episode actually topped Welcome to Storybrooke. It was so freaking bad.

- Sidney. So he's just been locked up all this time, then he's happy to work for Regina, then freaks out about the mirror? Okie doke.

- The snowman. Could not take him seriously.

- It feels like very little happened in this episode, flashbacks and present.

- Rumpbelle dance. Short and forced. It was funny, actually.

- All the Rumpbelle stuff as bland.

- Do You Want to Build a Snowman parallel was uncalled for.

 

This episode was mixed for me. Just when you thought Regina's character couldn't get assassinated any further... 

Edited September 29, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[stealinghome]

Also, can someone explain to me why Emma of all people was the one to say "Regina has worked so hard to be good"? If it was Snow, I could maybe buy it (especially given her Stockholm Syndrome), or even Charming or Henry (because he wants so bad to believe in Regina), but Emma wasn't there for the Missing Year. Emma's last experience with Regina is working with her in Neverland to save Henry...and before that, Regina trying to kill the entire town. That was another line that took me way out of the moment. It didn't make sense for the character saying it.

[Artsda]

I didn't hate the episode.  I wasn't happy about the Frozen stuff (never saw the movie and probably never will), but I thought it was well done.  The episode seemed very fast paced.  I couldn't believe that it was over so quickly.

I thought so too, the episode flew by.