S04.E01: Panopticon

[IndependentMind]

GP said that in episode 5 will get some flashbacks about Root and the Machine during the time the team had to go their separate ways, and that Root and her relationship with the Machine isn;t as solid as it seems. Remember this is just the first episode of the season. Root will for sure get frustrated because her communication with the Machine is limited. Let's see how long she can keep this up.

[halaciHU]

Sigh... I know that Root can't remain a crazy-ass Machine-worshiping witch for her entire time on the show, and that she has to undergo some sort of development... but, I was really hoping for her to go full hog and meld with the Machine.  We don't have enough female characters on TV who are "out there" enough to not need the company of other humans - male or female.  I loved Root when her one and only fascination was with the Machine.  Now she's getting all socially conscious and shit.  Well, I understand it, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.  I liked her better when she was a wild-eyed, obsessed spirit woman dabbling in the dark arts.  If they just make her crypto-lusting after Shaw, I'll be kind of disappointed.   Just because that's been done on so many other shows.  Sorry, I'm bored to death with ho-yay, I've seen it so many times.  (and yes, I'd be just as annoyed if she started lusting after a man)

 

Not that I hate her now or anything, but I knew deep down they wouldn't dare have a female character who continued to not need people.  I mean, the relationship between Root and the Machine was PURE, dammit.

 

Well, i have a completely different vibe on her. Regarding her being socially conscious - she was able to play very different persons before to lure and mislead her victims, so I don't see her ability to behave like a girly girl in the beauty department as social consciousness, more like proper camouflage. That now she is less ticked then when she were in the hospital in the beginning of S3? there she only recovered from the shock and adjusted to the knew direct contact with the Maschine - later in the season she was absolutely not crazy. Plus she always handled the team by mocking them and a different level of superiority.

 

Regarding Show: I wouldn't like the lusting part either, but IMHO we are far from it. Root is as much a loner as Shaw is. She might have needs (like Shaw told in S3 premiere that she has), but IMHO she handles them the same practical and unemotional way as everything else: if she feels antsy, find a relief object (person), then it's dealt with for a while. On the other hand she always liked to mocked Shaw with her feminity - right because Shaw wants to be so much not feminine.

 

I don't rule out that she looked up her considering how well she could serve as a relief if she needs one, but IMHO Root is very-very far away from feeling any kind of human compassion towards anybody, and this includes sexual desire as well. I don't see any changes in her. She smiles and speaks nicely to the people, because she knows that this is the easiest way for beatiful woman to achive what she wants - plus she looks down on everybody, her smile always have a tinge of superiority. The team or anybody else with whom she contacted or saved aren't important to her because she developed some bond with them, at least not a tighter one than when you have a favourite, handy tool. If it brokes you are a little sad about the loss, but isntead of grieving go and buy a new one.

 

What looks like compassion or feelings that's only the eagerness to serve the Machine the best way. If the Machine needs Finch to come out of his funk, she uses her best convincing and manipulative abilities to persuade him - but that doesn't mean she looks the things the same way. To Finch the Machine is a tool to save people. To Root people are means to protect and serve the Machine. That occasionally this concludes to the same acts, it doesn't make their base the same.

[bros402]

With the book, I was thinking that the Machine might've been telling Finch an idea it had - since it might not know if the bomb shelter/abandon subway station/whatever was still there/not flooded. It could've just been going "hey admin this might be a good place for your base"

[immortalfrieza]

Well, i have a completely different vibe on her. Regarding her being socially conscious - she was able to play very different persons before to lure and mislead her victims, so I don't see her ability to behave like a girly girl in the beauty department as social consciousness, more like proper camouflage. That now she is less ticked then when she were in the hospital in the beginning of S3? there she only recovered from the shock and adjusted to the knew direct contact with the Maschine - later in the season she was absolutely not crazy. Plus she always handled the team by mocking them and a different level of superiority.

 

Regarding Show: I wouldn't like the lusting part either, but IMHO we are far from it. Root is as much a loner as Shaw is. She might have needs (like Shaw told in S3 premiere that she has), but IMHO she handles them the same practical and unemotional way as everything else: if she feels antsy, find a relief object (person), then it's dealt with for a while. On the other hand she always liked to mocked Shaw with her feminity - right because Shaw wants to be so much not feminine.

 

I don't rule out that she looked up her considering how well she could serve as a relief if she needs one, but IMHO Root is very-very far away from feeling any kind of human compassion towards anybody, and this includes sexual desire as well. I don't see any changes in her. She smiles and speaks nicely to the people, because she knows that this is the easiest way for beatiful woman to achive what she wants - plus she looks down on everybody, her smile always have a tinge of superiority. The team or anybody else with whom she contacted or saved aren't important to her because she developed some bond with them, at least not a tighter one than when you have a favourite, handy tool. If it brokes you are a little sad about the loss, but isntead of grieving go and buy a new one.

 

What looks like compassion or feelings that's only the eagerness to serve the Machine the best way. If the Machine needs Finch to come out of his funk, she uses her best convincing and manipulative abilities to persuade him - but that doesn't mean she looks the things the same way. To Finch the Machine is a tool to save people. To Root people are means to protect and serve the Machine. That occasionally this concludes to the same acts, it doesn't make their base the same.

That's my interpretation of Root as well, it just fits a lot more with her established personality than this idea that she suddenly gives a damn about people just because Harold and The Machine is trying to get her to. A psychopath doesn't just stop being a psychopath without years of therapy and medication, so if they're really going for this "redeem Root" arc it would make far more sense for the writers to work with her insanity instead of against it.

 

One quote I can't quite remember "Just because you stopped listening doesn't mean she's[The Machine] stopped looking out for you" kinda pissed me off a bit, because if I were in Harold's position my response would be somewhere along the lines of "stopped listening? That would require that it actually talked to me in the first place!" I wouldn't blame Harold in the least if he called The Machine out on it's refusal to talk to him. The Machine outright refuses to talk to Harold at all for any reason or explain it's motives and reasoning and is surprised that it's "daddy" doesn't want to listen when it finally tries. All The Machine has to do to solve Harold's problem with it is directly talk to him or at least try, and not through a surrogate like Root. It still seems like the writers are still going with the idea that The Machine actually wanted the Senator dead and sent Team Machine to do it, despite that idea making no sense as The Machine would know perfectly well that they'd never do it. I'm still waiting for the part where they retcon that.

Edited September 25, 2014 by immortalfrieza

[Bort]

if I were in Harold's position my response would be somewhere along the lines of "stopped listening? That would require that it actually talked to me in the first place!" I wouldn't blame Harold in the least if he called The Machine out on it's refusal to talk to him. The Machine outright refuses to talk to Harold at all for any reason or explain it's motives and reasoning and is surprised that it's "daddy" doesn't want to listen when it finally tries.

I beg to differ on this point because when Harold first created the machine, they talked plenty. It was HE who severed the regular lines of communication. Now I'm not saying the Machine is mad about that but it might have come to the logical conclusion that Harold does not wish to talk to it like Root does and thus hasn't made the attempt.

[halaciHU]

One quote I can't quite remember "Just because you stopped listening doesn't mean she's[The Machine] stopped looking out for you" kinda pissed me off a bit, because if I were in Harold's position my response would be somewhere along the lines of "stopped listening? That would require that it actually talked to me in the first place!"

 

Sometime in the first half of S3 (while Root was in the cage in the library) she told Harold, that he shouldn't be jealous because he can have the same level of contact, he only needed to want it. So even if I completely understand and support his choice when he didn't take the offer, the Machine had offered him the chance.

[DrLar]

Man I think this episode had a missing scene, maybe Shaw punching her supervisor in the nuts before leaving that store.. LOL

[DeLurker]

Oh Show - how do I love thee?

 

I've become inexplicably fond of Scarface.  I love Elias, but with very few scenes and a lot fewer lines, Scarface has become gold.

 

I didn't know John knew about the Elias Lair.

 

ETA:  Bear's Tweets!

 

• Bespectacled man has my opinion on a high frequency decision not asked
• ... I read a good paper on stochastic control theory I'd like to share
• TALL MAN. TALL MAN. LOOK AT ME. I MISS YOU. DO YOU HAVE A BALL? HI. TALL MAN. I LOVE YOU.
• What Samaritan? I have a secret identity? Dog the dog?
• Tall man rescued some books from the library for me! My mouth waters at the prospect
• I should not act suspicious. Because Samaritan. Instead of eating books, I will eat shoes
• Wait. I also need to eat the books. Less conspicuous. That's what "dog dog" would do
• Hooray, the park again. THE PARK. With my friends. AND PEOPLE. Hurray.
• All is to survive, with the exception of death. - Oscar Wilde
• Where are we going? This is a strange route for our evening constitutional.

 

He really does have a point on the first one.

 

Edit of Edit - Oops!  Forgot Bear had his own thread and the tweets were already posted there.  Will remember in future.

Edited September 25, 2014 by DeLurker

[tessaray]

After the 2nd watch, I noticed something that I hadn't before.  It's kind of interesting how the criminal element has adapted to the new world of all surveillance, all the time.  I have a feeling that it will play more into the story at some point.

 

Question though - do we know anything about what kind of activities are getting Samaritan scrutiny and why?  The fledgling AI's I get, and the political rivals but not sure I understand the reasoning behind what it classifies as a deviant.  :-)  Not sure if the question even makes sense...

[HappyDancex2]

This show has transcended Lost. I thought this was a pretty clear opener reestablishing everything but at the end I couldn't help but wonder if the end of the series is imminent. There is no way anyone new could pick up this show anymore, the standalone story was not compelling and the complexity and concentration needed to watch this show seems like it is severely limiting potential audience.

I worry. I like this show a lot and I love the layers....but it's so not...mainstream.

[Shadda2]

How clever of them to have Marshal Marshall from In Plain Sight set the scene for the episode.  Or I guess the entire season.  I'm assuming they will be hiding in plain sight for a while. 

 

Okay, I started this post much earlier today but then my internet went down, and stayed down.  Anyway, since I've completely forgotten what I was going to say, I'll just nod to what everyone else has said and agree.  I enjoyed it but am not real crazy about the complete omnipotence of Decima, okay I'm misspelling that, sorry.  Is there a flaw somewhere in the programming that Harold will eventually be able to exploit, at least marginally? 

[halaciHU]

This show has transcended Lost. I thought this was a pretty clear opener reestablishing everything but at the end I couldn't help but wonder if the end of the series is imminent. There is no way anyone new could pick up this show anymore, the standalone story was not compelling and the complexity and concentration needed to watch this show seems like it is severely limiting potential audience.

I worry. I like this show a lot and I love the layers....but it's so not...mainstream.

 

It's not the classic mainstream I agree, but at the same time a new viewer won't understand more from GoT S4 premiere either (or from Breaking Bad, or Scandal), yet the audience is growing year by year. I don't think that there are no demand for compelling and complex stories, I think it's more like PoI is too complex for the CSI/NCIS consumers. Outside the geeky portals (like io9) had generated no buzz in the mainstream media. Most people doesn't even know about it, or believe it's just another COTW CBS procedural.

[pcta]

Love PoI AND NCIS. PoI is more complex than NCIS, for sure. But, to me, the commonality is that both are character driven

Edited September 26, 2014 by pcta

[Camera One]

That was a solid premiere, though I didn't find it extraordinary.  A good POI of the week story, nice moments of the characters reconnecting, and a nice, though somewhat obvious setup for the upcoming season with new headquarters.

 

It was difficult to buy that John, Finch and Shaw have been walking around NYC and Greer doesn't have his people scouring the city for them.  Samaritan might not recognize them but a person would, since they have not changed their appearance.  Shaw's cover was just purely for comic relief.

 

I'm already annoyed by that blonde assassin.  I just find the villains on this show so annoying.  We're already stuck with that obnoxious Greer.  I'm not an Elias fan either, so too bad to see Reese making a deal with him, when it didn't fool the Samaritan assassin.

[tessaray]

 

This show has transcended Lost. I thought this was a pretty clear opener reestablishing everything but at the end I couldn't help but wonder if the end of the series is imminent. There is no way anyone new could pick up this show anymore,

 

I think people are  more used to catching up now via Netflix or even dvd thanks to shows like Lost - or Breaking Bad - or whatever... I didn't start watching until after the 3rd season had started.  

 

ETA:  I watched the show as it aired while I caught up on the previous 2 seasons.  It took about a month and a half. I do think that 3 seasons might be the max that I'd try to catch up on though.  

Edited September 26, 2014 by tessaray

[halaciHU]

Love PoI AND NCIS. PoI is more complex than NCIS, for sure. But, to me, the commonality is that both are character driven

 

Might be (not following NCIS for a long time), but PoI is character and story driven, not just character driven. Some people like to solve crosswords or building plastic kits with miniscule details, others find these things boring and tedious. To really enjoy PoI one need to enjoy the mind game of the details as well and that's not what everybody wants.

[DeLurker]

Does anyone know name of the song and artist playing at the end? 

 

I think they do a good job at finding appropriate music (lyrics and tone) for this show, but once in a while they just do a fantastic job.  I didn't think anything could be a better match than Johnny Cash's version of Hurt (in general), but using it in the post-Carter ep last season?  That was brutal devastation.

[Princess Lucky]

Does anyone know name of the song and artist playing at the end?

It was 'I'd Love To Change The World' by Jetta, apparently a cover (the original was by a band called Ten Years After. I was super-familiar with the original - from a commercial, I believe - and I almost didn't recognise it.).

 

This show has transcended Lost. I thought this was a pretty clear opener reestablishing everything but at the end I couldn't help but wonder if the end of the series is imminent. There is no way anyone new could pick up this show anymore, the standalone story was not compelling and the complexity and concentration

needed to watch this show seems like it is severely limiting potential audience.

 

I worry. I like this show a lot and I love the layers....but it's so not...mainstream.

I do think it's harder for new viewers to just start watching, but I think it's a little easier than it would have been for a viewer when Lost was airing. People binge-watch much more now, and I think the show has been getting more noticeable online attention now that it's gotten so serialised. I think genre fans (already more prone to binge-watching, judging from myself) might try it out, now that it's clearly no longer "just" a procedural. Plus, I think a random episode (especially a season premiere, that's always a bit more expository and "PoI lite") would be a good place for someone to start, and they could go back and watch the previous episodes if they feel so inclined.

 

This season's premiere was carefully put together, I think, just for that purpose. It wasn't at all the next step after the finale, it wasn't a "to be continued" cliffhanger being resolved. Some time had clearly passed since the finale and they were all established in their new fake lives. You could conceivably watch it say, out of curiosity, and still get a handle on the characters and their overall predicament; they're on the run, an evil computer and an evil old dude are looking for them, a good computer is helping them, Reese is a badass with occasionally poor judgment, Shaw is triggerhappy and socially awkward, Fusco is craggy and hilarious, Root is mysterious and Finch is a reluctant vigilante.

 

The relationships were also shown clearly; we saw the deep trust and friendship between Reese and Finch, we saw that Reese and Shaw share an eagerness to kneecap/defenestrate and can't just be normal people (and I think we also saw there's nothing romantic between them, something a new viewer might assume), we saw Root and Finch being strange geniuses together and we saw Reese and Fusco joking and being gruffly affectionate with each other. The elements were all there. The plot, well, that can't be condensed. And Elias (not to mention the Carter reference a new/casual viewer wouldn't even pick up on) would have been a mystery, but oh well.

 

That said, and I say this as a genre fan, this is season 4. I'd like to think we'll get at least one more season after that. At that point, 5 seasons in, well. I wouldn't be surprised if the show ended. It could potentially go on forever but it doesn't feel like it, that might diminish its impact. I'd take 5 great seasons over, like, season 8 on autopilot.

 

But another thing is that PoI isn't mainstream in terms of content, but it is in terms of viewership (which even skews older). CBS viewers do watch it. So it just might last. I think it's benefitted from not being a huge hit, actually. The solid, if unspectacular, ratings it's consistently gotten have made it a good performer for CBS and they haven't messed with the show almost at all. It's like they've left Nolan and Plageman alone because, well, if it ain't broke (ratings-wise). So we might not need to worry, it might go the CBS route and get more seasons.

 

This premiere did well enough, I think. I am surprised Forever did so well, actually, but I think it might eventually settle a bit lower and Chicago Fire will not have the Voice lead-in for much longer. Tuesdays at 10 has long been problematic, and PoI is working just fine for CBS, I think. At least for now. I think all 3 networks are likely happy with the aforementioned shows that performed fairly well.

[supposebly]

 

It was difficult to buy that John, Finch and Shaw have been walking around NYC and Greer doesn't have his people scouring the city for them.  Samaritan might not recognize them but a person would, since they have not changed their appearance.  Shaw's cover was just purely for comic relief.

 

That was what kept me from getting immersed and made this a rather lackluster season premiere for me. Granted, I don't normally feel like I missed a lot when I don't watch right away, but I do catch up eventually. The topic interests me and I hope it doesn't descend into some sort of Skynet-type Terminator story.

[stealinghome]

It was difficult to buy that John, Finch and Shaw have been walking around NYC and Greer doesn't have his people scouring the city for them.  Samaritan might not recognize them but a person would, since they have not changed their appearance.

That was what kept me from getting immersed and made this a rather lackluster season premiere for me.

See, that I could actually roll with, because I suspect Greer suspects Finch & co. scuttled off to Alaska or North Dakota or some other equally remote location. What's the point of scouring one city for them when for all you know, they left the country, even? There's kind of a genius to the team staying exactly where they were, because I can see why Greer might think his resources and manpower were better spent directed elsewhere. (Especially if he's disbanded Decima already.)

 

I was actually more bothered by the fact that John is "undercover" with the police. After HR circulated his picture to, like, half the cops in the city, not to mention the entire criminal population, I just don't buy that no one is going to recognize John as The Man In The Suit and cause him problems. (Especially since he'll now be wearing his usual suits, apparently!)

[FormerMod-a1]

It was difficult to buy that John, Finch and Shaw have been walking around NYC and Greer doesn't have his people scouring the city for them.  Samaritan might not recognize them but a person would, since they have not changed their appearance.

See, that I could actually roll with, because I suspect Greer suspects Finch & co. scuttled off to Alaska or North Dakota or some other equally remote location. What's the point of scouring one city for them when for all you know, they left the country, even? There's kind of a genius to the team staying exactly where they were, because I can see why Greer might think his resources and manpower were better spent directed elsewhere. (Especially if he's disbanded Decima already.)

 

Not only that, Greer et. al. might not even consider our guys a threat anymore.  As far as they know, they "won".  They got Samaritan up and running, they are doing as it says, the Machine was sidelined and our guys were disbanded, or so it seems, and have disappeared.  

[merylinkid]

Even if he thinks they stayed in NYC, do you know how hard it is to "scour" a city that big with that many people?   What do you do, hang out at Central Park 24 hours a day hoping they walk by?   To find someone you have to know their habits and hangouts.   Even then you might miss them going into the library through the side door as you are exiting the front.   And do you check every single building every single day?

[fastiller]

Does anyone know name of the song and artist playing at the end? 

 

I think they do a good job at finding appropriate music (lyrics and tone) for this show, but once in a while they just do a fantastic job.  I didn't think anything could be a better match than Johnny Cash's version of Hurt (in general), but using it in the post-Carter ep last season?  That was brutal devastation.

 

It was 'I'd Love To Change The World' by Jetta, apparently a cover (the original was by a band called Ten Years After. I was super-familiar with the original - from a commercial, I believe - and I almost didn't recognise it.).

 

 I feel so old now - all I could think was "nice cover, prefer the original" - even though I get that the cover better fit the atmosphere.

Edited September 26, 2014 by fastiller

[Trillium]

Ad me to the list of new comers. Well kind of. I did watch the first three episodes of the series but gave up after that because I was finishing up my masters at the time and it seemed like another NCIS that even JC's ridiculous good looks couldn't overcome. But this summer I decided to give it another shot while on maternity leave. Looks like I quit a few episodes too early because by the Elias reveal I was hooked and now the show is everything I wanted it to be in the beginning.

I think the show itself is one the best things in TV right now but it's in the wrong network. People who would love it won't give it a chance because it's on CBS and CBS watchers haven't embraced it because it's very different, the late hour and the fact it gets no promos. On another channel I think it'd do much better ratings wise. It does seem to have generated a little more buzz during last season which is why I decided to give it a second chance. I'm of the mind that no series should go more than 5-6 seasons anyway so the fact it won't go 10+ seasons doesn't concern me.

Very much enjoyed the premier and am happy to be watching the show in real time. Although it is a great binge watch.

[Julia]

People who would love it won't give it a chance because it's on CBS and CBS watchers haven't embraced it because it's very different, the late hour and the fact it gets no promos. 

 

CBS watchers were watching. Four million of them just stopped.

[tessaray]

 

CBS watchers were watching. Four million of them just stopped.

Were the ratings for this episode that bad?

 

ETA:  so I rarely look at ratings but I was curious.  NCIS:NO had 17 million more or less and PoI had 10.5.  10.5 seems good for a network drama except when you compare it to the 2 NCIS showings 17 - 18 million. 

Edited September 26, 2014 by tessaray

[ABay]

Maybe there should be a ratings topic?

[Bort]

The media topic would probably work.

[Julia]

Were the ratings for this episode that bad?

 

ETA:  so I rarely look at ratings but I was curious.  NCIS:NO had 17 million more or less and PoI had 10.5.  10.5 seems good for a network drama except when you compare it to the 2 NCIS showings 17 - 18 million. 

 

Or a string of 15-16 episodes mid-season 3.

[ABay]

Maybe the ratings discussion could move to the Media thread?

[Jipijapa]

The original "I'd Love to Change the World" used to get heavy airplay back in the 70s, I doubt it does now because some of the lyrics are embarrassingly homophobic...

[shura]

 

I totally have to believe The Machine was trolling Shaw.  Reese and Finch got jobs that might have been boring, but manageable to them.  But, to stick freaking Shaw in a customer service job?!  Ha!

 

My question is - how would the Machine get the store manager to go along with Shaw's appointment? The guy comes to work, finds some paperwork saying that Sameen So-and-so is now working for him there - fine, so far so good, maybe he was sick the day his new employee was interviewed, I suppose. But then, when he actually sees her "performance", why does he not fire her on the spot? Or are we to think she has only had the job for a few days? And it wasn't working out (duh!), so the Machine is now sticking her into that criminal enterprise or whatever it is this Romeo person is doing?

 

I don't know what to think of the glance Reese exchanged with Scarface after the latter took care of business. I'm not sure Reese would respectfully acknowledge Scarface like that, just because of who Scarface is, even if Scarface is doing Reese's bidding now. Just look at how long it took Reese to stop treating Fusco like crap.

[webruce]

All trying to stay out of the limelight. Reese getting antsy playing cop. But he is Det. Fusco's new partner. Fusco called him Crockett, lol Det. Riley(Reese) was welcomed in as Fuscos new partner and hesitated as he say at Carter's desk.
Martine is the new hit person. She takes down the Newsman Novak that had all the information about Samaritan. Thought maybe he would be around longer and Reese or Harold would "talk" to him.

Looks like John Greer will be getting rid of Senator Ross Garrison. Won't that bring up an investigation? It may piss off Maam Control and (I wish) Hersh.

Liked how Root kept dropping in to see Shaw in her perfume department at the store. She was flirting ofcourse. Shaw reluctant to help Reese. Reese telling Sam to " drop the eyeliner and pick up a gun and help!" lol It was funny how Shaw kept telling Reese to keep a low profile and then when they worked together Root called them the "Mayhem Twins!" lol

Harold(Mr. Whistler), had trouble keeping his class interested, lol. Nice how Reese and Root had to talk Harold into returning to help the 5, well six with Bear, lol .The new headquarters will work nice. Who was marking books? Root or The Machine? He was so worried about getting back to his job. Samaritan and Greer had him spooked. Using the old VHF antenas system is in genius.

COTW had Ali Hasan making bombs to stop a gang led by Link that needed his system to fly under the wire. Dominic was moving Heroin. I knew son Ben would be kidnapped. Reese and Shaw handled them. Reese saving the bad guys by jumping on the moving vehicle to grab the bomb was cool.

Worry about Elias helping John again. I believe he will have to take him down someday. Especially if Elias will want some help sometime to do something illegal. Reese will definately butt heads with Scarface sooner or later.

I wonder about Romeo and the men that Shaw is working with. Get in a Econoline van with all guys had to be intimidating. This must lead to some future story plot of course.

Also funny bear being passed back and forth between Reese and finch. Hope Samaritan doesn't get a doggy recogniton software.

Wonder if Zoe Morgan will be back?

Edited October 1, 2014 by webruce

[ABay]

My question is - how would the Machine get the store manager to go along with Shaw's appointment? The guy comes to work, finds some paperwork saying that Sameen So-and-so is now working for him there - fine, so far so good, maybe he was sick the day his new employee was interviewed, I suppose. But then, when he actually sees her "performance", why does he not fire her on the spot?

It's possible he isn't the store manager, just the manager of that department and doesn't have hire/fire authority, that he has reported her but the report was mysteriously misplaced, or he's been informed she's the sister/niece/daughter/cousin/in-law/girlfriend of someone who can fire him, there are myriad possibilities. Or a wizard did it.

 

We really don't know who the guy at the university was, either. The department chair? A Dean? Some human resources jerk? I guess I should just be glad Harold's dissertation wasn't about Napoleon although a conversation between Dr. Whistler and Dr. Linus would be fun for me.

Edited September 28, 2014 by ABay

[DeLurker]

Thanks for the responses on the song - I totally did not recognize it from the part they played and because it was a cover!  I would have recognized the original most likely, even though I would not have known the name.

[webruce]

I wonder if Root had a hand in Shaw getting the perfume counter job. Not sure what Root's job is? But that way she can come visit. Shaw will dislike her job enough to want to work with Romeo and his gang. Shaw is funny spraying perfume on everyone,but would be interesting being a Detective to work with Fusco. But then what would Reese do?

[IndependentMind]

I think the Machine was aware that putting Reese in the police force is the only way to keep him from going all out trigger happy. Although Shaw is that way too, she is more likely to follow her cover than Reese ever will. Look what he did at the end, Martine barely missed them. But that stunt of Reese made Samaritan suspicious already.

[bros402]

I wonder if Root had a hand in Shaw getting the perfume counter job. Not sure what Root's job is? But that way she can come visit. Shaw will dislike her job enough to want to work with Romeo and his gang. Shaw is funny spraying perfume on everyone,but would be interesting being a Detective to work with Fusco. But then what would Reese do?

 

Root said she was trying to get ready for an interview.

 

So she might not have a cover job - perhaps her cover is that of someone who came into a bit of money?

 

Or perhaps she could just go back to being a psychologist, like her cover in the Season 1 finale.

[spottedreptile]

 

People binge-watch much more now, and I think the show has been getting more noticeable online attention now that it's gotten so serialised.

NCIS wasn't even a Top Ten show until it got syndicated by USA somewhere after Season 3, and then it just took off like lightning. Never underestimate the influence of syndication. Having said that, POI is far more serialised than NCIS ever will be. I love heavily serialised shows but understand they're not everybody's cup of tea. My favourite show is Fringe and you couldn't possibly come in cold after Season 2 and ever hope to catch up. 

 

I don't mind if POI has a limited life after syndication, though, as long as it gets a satisfying and plausible conclusion. I'd be happy to rewatch it as long as there is a proper arc. 

 

I really liked this episode. I've warmed to Shaw. I'm okay with the Root/Shaw hoyay as long as it doesn't take over the story lines for these two. Not sure about Cara Buono, she seems to be one of those characters who's there to move the plot forward, but has no real depth or anything we can get interested in. 

 

 

Shaw is funny spraying perfume on everyone

I'm allergic to perfume, so it's my nightmare going through a mall and having some moron spray stuff in the air as I walk past. They usually get an earful from me and lawsuit threats etc. You don't want to know.

Edited September 29, 2014 by spottedreptile

[Trini]

I just lost a lot of interest in the show. When Root is off the show, I'll pay more attention.

[Kris117]

After the 2nd watch, I noticed something that I hadn't before.  It's kind of interesting how the criminal element has adapted to the new world of all surveillance, all the time.  I have a feeling that it will play more into the story at some point.

 

That part reminded me of The Wire. The cops got a line on all the pay phones in a neighborhood, then the gangs got pagers. They figured out how to capture the information on the pagers, and the gangs got burner phones. They were always more than one step ahead of the police in dealing with technology. 

 

Looks like John Greer will be getting rid of Senator Ross Garrison. Won't that bring up an investigation? It may piss off Maam Control and (I wish) Hersh.

 

Given that John Doman also has a recurring role in Gotham and The Borgias, he may be praying for (character) death. 

 

I remember reading a couple of novels about NYC which had scenes set in forgotten subway stops or lines, so I really enjoy that that's where the team's new home base will be. I'm excited about this first episode and where the season is going. 

 

ABay, it was clever of you to notice that they were using the Library of Congress system! 

 

Figures that Shaw would figure out a way to weaponize fragrance. 

Edited October 1, 2014 by Kris117

[stealinghome]

I watched tonight's rebroadcast of Panopticon, and I have to say, while PoI has a history of having strong finales and weaker premieres, Panopticon holds up quite well. I'd actually say it's in the upper half of this season's episodes in terms of quality--other than Prophets and the Shaw quadrilogy, no episode jumps to mind as being head and shoulders better than this one. Random thoughts on rewatch below:

 

SHAW. *sniffles* You go be you, Shaw. Don't ever change. Keep being totally married with Root. Side note, it's interesting to think about whether/how much the members of Team Machine saw each other in the weeks between 3x23 and 4x01. Harold and John had clearly met up before, and I got the vibe that Root and Shaw had as well (though that one is less clear). But Shaw and John obviously hadn't seen each other, and I tend to lean on the side of Harold hadn't seen Root, either. Oh, to be a fly on the wall the first time Reese and Finch met up as Detective Riley and Professor Whistler.

 

This time around, I really noticed how effective the guy playing Ali was. He never oversold it, but you really felt his emotion all the way through. I got a little choked up when he told his son that they were the store, even with as obviously anvilicious as it was for the listening Finch.

 

One thing this episode had that later episodes dropped was a real sense of paranoia and claustrophobia. The team felt like a team on the run here, like they were actually under constant surveillance and being hunted and living in a new world. It was interesting, and fresh, and pushed all of the characters in some really good and seldom-explored directions. But the show dispensed with that by, like, the third episode, and imo it was premature. One of my biggest gripes with this season is that the show has gone back to the status quo too much--I wish the "hunted and on the run" feel had lasted longer.

 

Similarly, injecting some conflict into the Reese-Finch relationship in this ep did a lot to make Reese more interesting. I'm very over Finch's pissiness with The Machine, but I do wish the show had taken the opportunity S3 gave them to shake up the team's dynamics a bit. I mean, not only did Finch stop Reese and Shaw from killing the congressman--therefore allowing Samaritan to go online and forcing them all underground--he walked away from them afterward! And only came back when Grace was threatened, and saw them for all of like five minutes before they all had to part at the very end of S3. And in this episode he was still refusing to come back to the team. It's hard for me to believe Shaw and (much more so) Reese were unaffected by Harold bailing on them like that. I wish that had led to a little more friction among them all (well, maybe not between Reese and Shaw--the Mayhem Twins are too fun together).

 

Amy Acker and Michael Emerson are so, so good together. Best chemistry (of any type) on the show, hands down. I'm hoping we have some scenes coming up where they yell at each other, 'cause they're just electric when they're at odds.

 

The next time Harold tries to tell Shaw John is a scalpel while she's a hammer, I want her to remind him of this episode. John is so hilariously UNsubtle he almost, almost does come back around to subtle. But the key word there is almost. (And this episode, Shaw's caution, and the way she recognizes that if one person's cover is blown all of their covers are blown, just solidifies my feeling that Shaw was OOC in 4x09.) I do wonder how much Sarah Shahi's pregnancy changed the storylines here; I don't believe the writers when they say Reese was on the chopping block, BUT early in the season it definitely seemed like Reese was going to be the one to blow his cover and be found by Samaritan. I wonder where that would have gone--if he would've gone back to being the Man in the Suit, but with 500% more caution now.

 

Elias! You're so much fun. Come back and play soon, because Dominic and the Brotherhood are not nearly as interesting as you.

 

Thank goodness they let Cara Buono drop the accent. But Martine was much more intimidating when she wasn't kind of a terrible shot.

 

On the shallow end of the pool, I thought Finch looked lovely in that nice blue shirt/gold tie combo--blue is such a good color for Emerson--but the suit accompanying it was pretty bad up close. And I realize that they use the status of John's stubble to indicate his level of emo-ness at any given time, so it won't happen, but I wish they let JC grow some stubble more often. I find him like 500% more attractive with stubble than when he's clean-shaven.

[johntfs]

Martine isn't a terrible shot.  She's just going up against people with high Dodge scores.

 

I liked the way that John was almost warm to Elias, like John appreciated that Elias had finished John's own personal mission of killing Simmons for murdering Carter.  I kind of wish one of the scenes we'd have had after 3.10 was John reading a paper with the headline "HR MOBSTER COP GARROTED IN HOSPITAL BED!" and just get that tight little smile he sometimes gets.

[bethy]

I'm way late to the PoI bandwagon, but I'm so enjoying the show. I loved this quote:

Root: Sorry. You have to pick a side, because this is war. And the thing we're up against, it has virtually unlimited resources, governments working unwittingly at its behest, operatives around the globe protecting it. You know how many we have? Five. [pause] Root: Six, if you count the dog.

I definitely count the dog. :) I actually really love how Bear has stuck around. I really expected never to see him again after his first episode. But he's such a part of the ensemble and I love how everyone interacts with him. 

[mtlchick]

Quote

But he's such a part of the ensemble and I love how everyone interacts with him. 

Even with the team were at odds with each other as before and especially in this episode as in how to move on, they all agree on one thing: Bear is the man...er, dog.