The Musketeers - General Discussion

[Jazzy24]

But where was the beehive-throwing, rabbit-and-protestant-shooting reverend mother from season one??? I really missed her.

I heard that she had passed :-( really sad because I loved her as Mother Superior.

[ennui]

Santiago Cabrera is a beautiful man, but geez - could he have LOOKED more apathetic when Rochefort had him arrested? Okay, maybe not "apathetic", but it was the exact same mildly intense look that he makes all the time. How about some genuine fear? Panic? Guilt?

But he probably didn't feel any of those. Aramis probably felt annoyed at the inconvenience more than anything else.

When Aramis told the others about Anne and the baby, I found it amusing that Athos had to do the prompting, like a parent with a child.

[mybabyaidan]

Athos made this episode for me.

 

"There's more."
"There's more."
"And....there's still more."    All completely deadpan.  Amazing. 

 

Loved the nun too...."Boasting is a sin"   Not the forgery part.

[Ariah]

I believe we needed to see the doctor's execution to fully gasp Constance's horror and to realize the stakes were really this high. I will miss him, though. He was an honest, decent man.

 

As many of you've already mentioned, the scene in which Aramis told the other men about his affair with the Queen was perfect. From Athos' calm snark, through Porthos' hit-an'-hug, to Treville's hat tossing (with a hint of D'Artagnan's high-morality horse). I do agree that in the end, when Rochefort ordered Aramis arrested, the latter expressed no panic or guilt because he felt neither - I belive he's more afraid for Anne and his son now.

 

I'm all ready for Rochefort to get his comeuppenance any time now. But, unlike many, I don't want hm to die. I want him disgraced and forced to flee, alive to cause trouble another day (and another season). They may speed the history up again and introduce Mazzarini, the next Cardinal, as a deadly foe. The Duke of Buckingham plot from the books would mirror the Anne/Aramis plot, so I don't think they'd go for it...

 

Marguerite... She looks like a ghost now, dressed in dark, with pale face, as if her conscience was eating her up from the inside like a tumor. I think she'll pay the ultimate price, perhaps sacrifice herself for Aramis?

 

Also, Athos and Milady? I too feel guilty, but they work so well together. Batman and Catwoman of the 1630's Paris.

[Marie Claudine]

Santiago Cabrera is a beautiful man, but geez - could he have LOOKED more apathetic when Rochefort had him arrested? Okay, maybe not "apathetic", but it was the exact same mildly intense look that he makes all the time. How about some genuine fear? Panic? Guilt?

 

Agreed. I was a bit annoyed in this scene. I get that the musketeers are supernaturally brave and all that, but this was not just about Aramis. He knew that at this point, Anne and probably sooner or later the little boy were in grave danger. The logic of his character up to now would make it likely that he'd be scared for them, or at least outraged, but the "You start to get on my nerves" stare he went for instead did not convey that. He seemed to be more inconvenienced by the musketeers learning of his night with Anne than by Anne's life being in very real danger.

[ennui]

He seemed to be more inconvenienced by the musketeers learning of his night with Anne than by Anne's life being in very real danger.

I wouldn't say inconvenienced. When someone shares a deep secret, there are a lot of emotions and risks attached.

I'm not sure how I feel about Marguerite. I think she's probably a decent person in a tough spot.

[thuganomics85]

Well, then!  They didn't just merely kill Rochefort.  Nope, they dragged it out as long as possible.  First, it looks like Aramis stabbed him several times during their fight and literally ends it with putting a dagger in his back.  But, he still manages to hobble out and attempt to fight the rest of the Musketeers.  They play around with that, until D'Artagnan's like "Fuck this noise!", and finally impales him.  Even then, he manages to monologue a bit, before he finally fades away.  And, then hilariously, Anne doesn't even allow them to close his eyes.  Ha!  That is so stone-cold, but I kind of love it.  Anne wasn't going to let his passing have any dignity!

 

So, basically, the heroes managed to pull through.  Constance is literally saved before the opening credits.  Then, Milady sneaks in and gets Aramis out from the world's least protected dungeon.  Whiles she's doing that, the rest (Constance included!) go over and help Porthos get Vargas.  They drag his ass to Louis, so Louis finally accepts Rochefort is a spy.  Anne almost bites it, but Aramis puts a stop to that.

 

That said, while he did forgive them all and everything, I do think Louis at least still suspects Aramis/Anne.  The way he was looking at them at the end, makes me think a part of him will always wonder, but he's just going to put that aside for the sake of it.  I know he was a dick for the majority of this season, but I did feel for him when he realized that the baby might not even be his.

 

Aramis... resigns and wants to be a monk?  Ok, then, a bit random.  But, since the final shot is the trio riding off to recruit him back, I'm sure he'll be back again.  Meanwhile, Treville gets promoted to Minister of War, and gives Athos the position of Captain of the Musketeers!

 

D'Artagnan and Constance are now married, at least.  Milady asks Athos to join her in England, but he waits too long, so it looks like she's gone.  But, I have to think she'll be back again too.

 

So, it looks like the third season, we're getting a full-blown France vs. Spain thing, going on.  Could be fun.  I just hope whoever the main antagonist is will be more interesting then Rochefort.  And, hopefully we'll be getting more of the Musketeers doing Musketeer things, and not being stuck in the political, palace bullshit as much.

[Maelstrom]

Great episode! This is how you do it, show. The Musketeers saved the day, Rochefort was defeated (more accurately, got his ass handed to him) and Anne, Milady and Constance had their moments to shine. And the King finally got a clue. Someone in the thread for last week's ep mentioned that Louis kept trying to give Anne the benefit of the doubt even in the face of Rochefort's manipulations, and I like that they continued it tonight a bit. I also loved Rochefort's extended death scene, where they all take turns kicking his ass. And after all he put them through, I don't blame them one bit. I may have pulled a Nelson Muntz and shouted "Ha ha!" at Rochefort during this episode. Possibly more than once.

 

We know Aramis won't be able to stay away next season, and I doubt they'd really get rid of Milady. At least, I sure hope they don't. Speaking of Milady, those final scenes of her waiting and Athos showing up too late about killed me! Those two crazy kids might turn me into a shipper yet. Maybe I should start coming up with squish names for me - Mathos? The one time Athos finally makes a sober, proactive decision and duty interferes. Poor bastard. It'll be interesting seeing him as captain next year.

 

Overall, this season was largely mediocre but they sure pulled out all the stops tonight. This is the first episode of the season I didn't find myself longing for Capaldi/the Cardinal once, so that's something. And with a war against Spain, next season should be interesting. Here's hoping they stay away from palace intrigues, and stick with the Musketeers saving the day every week.

[voiceover]

Aramis... resigns and wants to be a monk?  Ok, then, a bit random.

 

Actually, that's how the book ended. When I read it as a child, I scoffed at that; but after learning more about the era, realized that the Lothario abandoning it for God was Romantic with a capital "R".

He comes back in the sequel Dumas wrote [edited to add that I previously used the movie sequel title here rather than the book title; apparently hospitals affect my memory in ways that make me look like a moron; thanks to everyone for finding and correcting my errors] as I suspect he'll be back for Season 3.

 

Nice scene between Milady & Athos, though it disappointed my hopes when she turned good.  Hopefully, she'll be back in Season 3 as the Prince of Wales' mistress, or some such.

 

Loving that Porthos got the big soldier scene in the hills.  When he wordlessly embraced Aramis, I was reminded of The Wizard of Oz:  the Scarecrow was speechless when Dorothy hugged him, too.

 

I confess to applauding at the end.  I'll miss Our Boys!

Edited March 23, 2015 by voiceover

[Jazzy24]

I loved it.

Rochfort finally getting that much needed ass kicking and biting it.

I loved that scene of Milady saving Aramis I want more of them :-)

Yeah I agree with above that the King will always wonder about Anne/Aramis and I don't forgive him at all for signing Anne's death warrent he never even gave her a chance to defend herself and just took Rochfort's word I can't forgive him for that.

I don't care for Dartangan and Constance but I'm glad they got a happy ending.

Milady and Athos are so damaged but I'm falling for them fast, I became a Milady fan and I still don't know how it happened.

Aramis becoming a monk or whatever had me sad but Athos/Porthos/Dartangan going after him made me smile even after the show ended.

[justmehere]

Also, Athos and Milady? I too feel guilty, but they work so well together. Batman and Catwoman of the 1630's Paris.

 

 

Hah! I love this description!

[millennium]

The timing of the episode seemed off and consequently (I thought) the climactic scenes lost some of their punch.  I'm grateful we weren't left with a cliffhanger.

 

The vow he made in prison is not the reason Aramis should seek out the monastery.   He has real sins to atone for.   He betrayed King, Queen and country.    He violated his oath.   He disgraced the order of the Musketeers.   He placed his friends in jeopardy.   He used Marguerite, triggering a sequence of events culminating in the young woman's suicide.  He has condemned his son to be raised by the most foolish fop in France.

 

Just saying.

 

Oh, and I would have been waiting at the crossroads an hour before she arrived.

[ennui]

the Lothario abandoning it for God was Romantic with a capital "R".

Not so much romantic; saintly tradition. See: St. Augustine. But, really, good for Aramis to walk away, to keep Anne and the baby safe, even though Louis will forever doubt.

Loved Porthos, one man army.

I didn't like Rochefort ... until his death scene. Go down fighting, never give up. "I am alone," well, aren't we all.

D'Artagnan and Constance: world's shortest Catholic wedding. "Do you? "Do you?" "I now pronounce you ... "

I felt so sad for Milady, listening for Athos's horse. And he didn't show up in time.

Great finale! Loved the Friesians, galloping after the camera truck ... reminded me of The Virginian opening credits. ;)

[Souris]

Well, then!  They didn't just merely kill Rochefort.  Nope, they dragged it out as long as possible. … And, then hilariously, Anne doesn't even allow them to close his eyes.  Ha!  That is so stone-cold, but I kind of love it.  Anne wasn't going to let his passing have any dignity!

 

Oh, man, that might have been my favorite part of the much-deserved Rochefort death scene. Actually, no "might," it was. I was hoping that somehow Anne would get to be the one to stick the dagger into his heart, or even Constance on Lemay's behalf, but that was a great way for Anne to get in a last dig. No sign of the cross death blessing for that asshat!

 

Speaking of Anne's digs: "I never thought of you once." Oh, burn!

 

I knew Aramis became a monk in the book, but I didn't expect it to happen so soon in the series! He'd better be back next season. It does seem to be the case since the boys were on their way to get him at the end.

 

I don't particularly ship or not ship Athos and Milady, but I think her character adds spice and hope she shows back up.

 

Great ep. The last two eps of the season were smashing.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Souris

[Marie Claudine]

You are probably right, ennui :-). What I meant to say was that I already didn't feel a lot of emotion from Santiago Cabrera in the scene where Aramis's secret is revealed to the musketeers. I didn't feel the emotions and the rift such a secret between the four of them might potentially bring; from the others, yes, but not from Aramis. But at least I got the impression that he felt genuinely uncomfortable, which I thought was mostly conveyed by his body language. In the arrest scene, I couldn't tell what he was feeling at all. Come to think of it, maybe that's what the actor went for, but in the moment, it felt a bit odd to me.

[missbonnie]

I thought it was a great episode. Loved that Rochford finally got what was coming to him. I know that she has to be a villain, but I was so hoping that Athos would be on time. Aramis had better be back, that would truly upset me to lose that character. And, again we wait the endless wait.

Edited March 22, 2015 by missbonnie

[MostlyC]

Is there going to be a third season?

 

Oh, and I would have been waiting at the crossroads an hour before she arrived.

 

Yes.  Those two have mad chemistry.

 

Annoyed about Aramis.  I get why he's going to have to avoid the queen, and that he did the whole bargaining thing with god, but if my semi-catholic upbringing serves, god doesn't bargain.   Nevertheless, atoning for his sins in a monastery is certainly a common thing.  I am guessing that this is will explain his celibacy for the rest of the series?  He mentioned about his Love for the queen, and not in a duty to my country kind of way.

 

And practically speaking, better to have an heir than not, since the show has hinted at the King firing blanks (as it were).

But the shipper in me hopes for more Anne/Aramis angst and stolen kisses.  Because the king is an idiot, and he signed the death warrant rather than even bother to talk to his wife. 

[justmehere]

Great episode!

 

Well, I did feel some sympathy for Rochefort at the end, surprisingly. The talk of extensive torture to break him, and him saying how he held on to the thought of Anne to endure it made me dislike the drawn-out nature of his death. He was a warped bastard who needed to die, (Anne's line about not thinking about him was well-deserved), but I wish they hadn't made him so one-note except for the last moments of humanity. I'd have rather seen more glimpses of humanity along the way and been conflicted about his death, even knowing his actions still warranted it. This way did evoke some sympathy, and I didn't like the manner of it -- it felt like prolonging the suffering of a rabid beast -- but I am glad he's gone.

 

I can't help but feel bad for Louis. He's an eternal man-child whose upbringing isn't his own fault, and he's had only schemers to advise him. I'm glad Treville will be at his side now. Maybe he'll grow up a little.

 

Although Aramis will obviously be back, I did like that he carried through on his vow. They'd better bring back Milady too. I'm sure they'll find some way to put her at odds with everyone again. I hope it's more than Athos not showing up in time -- that can and should be resolved with a single conversation.

 

Really liked Porthos taking on Vargas' men single-handed -- his smile/laugh when he drew them out was great -- and equally liked the others showing up in support so that he wasn't ridiculously invulnerable.

 

The wedding between Constance and D'Artagnan didn't feel earned to me but whatever. I hope her involvement in catching Vargas signals some kind of inclusion with the boys now and then. Except I hope she stays with the queen too. Just, not "boring married couple."

 

Not a bad season after all. The last few episodes improved significantly, and at only 10 in total, the whole might come across better with binge watching.

Edited March 22, 2015 by justmehere

[millennium]

Great episode!

 

Well, I did feel some sympathy for Rochefort at the end, surprisingly. The talk of extensive torture to break him, and him saying how he held on to the thought of Anne to endure it made me dislike the drawn-out nature of his death. He was a warped bastard who needed to die, (Anne's line about not thinking about him was well-deserved), but I wish they hadn't made him so one-note except for the last moments of humanity. I'd have rather seen more glimpses of humanity along the way and been conflicted about his death, even knowing his actions still warranted it. This way did evoke some sympathy, and I didn't like the manner of it -- it felt like prolonging the suffering of a rabid beast -- but I am glad he's gone.

 

I can't help but feel bad for Louis. He's an eternal man-child whose upbringing isn't his own fault, and he's had only schemers to advise him. I'm glad Treville will be at his side now. Maybe he'll grow up a little.

 

Although Aramis will obviously be back, I did like that he carried through on his vow.

 

They maybe should have called this episode "Shades of Gray" or "Blurred Lines" because suddenly nothing could be taken for granted.   As you ably pointed out, Rochefort was a victim of severe torture and this revelation somewhat softened his edges ... BUT, he wasn't in Spain anymore.   He was in France, ensconced in perhaps the safest bastion available to any man or woman of the period.   He talked about the moment they "broke" him ... I have never been subjected to torture, never fell victim to Stockholm Syndrome (unless it applies to romantic relationships, lol) but it seems to me that if you can carry on a cogent discussion about the moment you were broken, then you probably have the wherewithal to choose whether you will pursue your torturer's agenda once you are far away IN ANOTHER COUNTRY!   Was he a victim?  Yes.   But did he choose to be bad afterwards?   The answer seems to be yes again.

 

Likewise, we see the softer side of Milady.   We have sensed her vulnerability through the episodes, but I wish they had kept it implied rather than put on display for us all to see.    I love that evil woman.   It would be tragic if the writers downgraded her to a broken flower.

 

Then there was the moral relativism of the episode, a development that continues to bother me.   The good guys lied.   Publicly and without shame.   They surrendered the moral high ground even faster than Aramis fell into bed with the Queen.   It could be argued their actions were the lesser of two evils ... but it doesn't change the nature of what they did.   I'm from the old school, where heroes would rather die than lie.   Potius mori quam foedari, or, more simply, death before dishonor.  

 

At the very least, Fate should have exacted some penalty for the deceit.  D'Artagnan should have lost Constance, Aramis should have been exiled, Athos should have been made to shave ... I don't know ... but you can't fall from grace and land on your feet.   That's not how it's done.   Yet the Musketeers failed to express even a note of regret.   

Edited March 22, 2015 by millennium

[Ceindreadh]

I liked D'Artagnan's comment about how Aramis could have protected the Queen's reputation by not actually having sex with her!

 

I do feel sorry for the nanny, she's caught up in this whole business mainlyl because Aramis seduced her so he could get close to the Dauphin.

I know she could have turned him down, but I'd say Aramis when he turns on the charm would be difficulte to resist!

[Souris]

And practically speaking, better to have an heir than not, since the show has hinted at the King firing blanks (as it were).

But the shipper in me hopes for more Anne/Aramis angst and stolen kisses.  Because the king is an idiot, and he signed the death warrant rather than even bother to talk to his wife. 

 

He is an idiot.

 

Historically, Anne had another son. So if they introduce him, we'll see who the daddy is. Aramis again? Actually the king? Or will they introduce Mazarin, who some historians claim may have been the father to one or both sons?

[millennium]

Had Lemay lived a few weeks longer, I'm sure he would have pioneered the first paternity test.

[Souris]

I liked D'Artagnan's comment about how Aramis could have protected the Queen's reputation by not actually having sex with her!

 

He wasn't worried about a married Constance's reputation when he slept with her, so that was a bit hypocritical there, D'Artagnan.

[scarynikki12]

we'll see who the daddy is.

 

I vote Aramis because I want to see Athos' reaction.

[DCWash]

Santiago Cabrera is a beautiful man, but geez - could he have LOOKED more apathetic when Rochefort had him arrested? Okay, maybe not "apathetic", but it was the exact same mildly intense look that he makes all the time. How about some genuine fear? Panic? Guilt?

 

This is one of the few episodes I've watched twice, and I noticed some details on the second viewing that I wouldn't have picked up on a one-time viewing. (Partly because I was watching it merely inches away on a small tablet, partly because my internet connection kept getting hung up so I watched it in small bites.) One thing I saw was that, underneath that dashing beard, Santiago Cabrera is really...young. Almost D'Artagnonly (try spelling that!) youthful. Even though I went into the second viewing after having read your comment above and was prepared to go after him because of it, suddenly I found myself cutting him some slack because he seemed so young and vulnerable. And maybe Aramis seemed young and forgivably dumb. Queen Anne has always seemed very young.

 

King Louis seemed surprisingly--well, maybe not "surprisingly," in light of past behavior--humane in his attitude towards Anne on the first viewing, but it occurred to me in the second viewing that they may have been trying to make the point that there's a difference between a decent--i.e. a good--man and a good king. His heart towards her was in the right place. A good king, though, would have pushed Rochefort aside and done something about it right away.

 

And just a little thing I noticed in the scene where Aramis is telling them about his...indiscretion...with the queen: All four of the Musketeers are wearing their shoulder guards. I assume they've always been wearing their shoulder guards, the ones that mark them out as Musketeers, but I've never noticed--the really do blend in with their tunics pretty well.  What's interesting, though, is that each one is different, and a couple are quite plain while a couple are quite florid. I wonder what that means? Also, Treville doesn't wear one. That could be an indication of his loss of rank, but he's still a Musketeer, even if he isn't their captain any more, so that doesn't quite work, either. Hmmmm......

[ennui]

One thing I saw was that, underneath that dashing beard, Santiago Cabrera is really...young. Almost D'Artagnonly (try spelling that!) youthful.

Santiago is 36. Actually, he's the oldest. A quick 'net search says Luke = 25, Tom = 33, Howard = 31. Santiago has good genes, apparently.

[Llywela]

And practically speaking, better to have an heir than not, since the show has hinted at the King firing blanks (as it were).

But the shipper in me hopes for more Anne/Aramis angst and stolen kisses.  Because the king is an idiot, and he signed the death warrant rather than even bother to talk to his wife. 

Actually, we've been quite specifically told that Anne has had at least one miscarriage since marrying the king, which strikes me as clear evidence that he is not firing blanks.

[Pathetica]

Either he is not firing blanks or she found some other fella dumb enough to sleep with the Queen?

[scarynikki12]

He could just have lower sperm count or something. He wouldn't officially be sterile but the chances of him fathering a child would be dramatically reduced.

[Athena]

It could have been a lot of reasons:

 

• The real Anne had four stillborns (one who actually lived through birth) until Louis XIV and Philip de Orleans later
• Both of them were from royal houses; this was early enough before Anne's family started to become really interbred, but royal couplings often had issues of fertility
• Real Louis XIII had no known mistresses and was believed to be homosexual or bisexual; either way, they did not have a lot of conjugal relations by all accounts
• Low sperm count
• Anne probably being isolated and lonely for most of her early marriage did not help

[ennui]

I have read that those extreme corsets actually cause fertility issues. The problem may not have been with Louis at all.

[Llywela]

I have read that those extreme corsets actually cause fertility issues. The problem may not have been with Louis at all.

To be honest, since hearing of Anne's miscarriage, I never thought the problem was Louis. The evidence suggests that Anne has difficulty conceiving and carrying. It happens, and there can be all kinds of reasons for it, and doesn't automatically preclude having children at all, just makes it harder. And since Louis is capable of fathering children and hasn't spotted anything odd about the timing, and we know he and Anne wre trying to conceive, that means no one, least of all the characters, can know for certain whether the baby is Louis' or Aramis'. Anne and Aramis simply want to believe he's the father because of the Passion of their encounter.

Edited March 23, 2015 by Llywela

[Pathetica]

Either he is not firing blanks or she found some other fella dumb enough to sleep with the Queen?

[OakGoblinFly]

Then, Milady sneaks in and gets Aramis out from the world's least protected dungeon.  

 

 

Must be the same castle that Robin Hood kept sneaking into.

[IWantCandy71]

Dumas never wrote a sequel called "The Four Musketeers". The novel immediately following the first was called "Twenty Years Later". Some people may informally call it "TFM", (I don't know that I've ever heard it called that) but that is not it's title. There have been movies with that title, though.

 I am disappointed (again having not yet watched season two) about the direction of Rochefort.

Did he have an eye patch, too? *snort*

Rochefort in the novels wasn't really a "good" guy, but by the end of "TTM" , he and D'artagnan were friends. It's lazy to me, to constantly go that route with the character.

As far as Milady, it makes Athos stupid to want her.Even if he could forgive her the trangressions against himself and his family-there's the fact that she's a stone cold killer. I wouldn't want to remain with someone I couldn't trust, where I'd always be wondering if they'd turn on me.

One thing Athos is not, is stupid. Besides, Milady, if written correctly, can't change her nature, futhermore, she doesn't want to. GIving her vulnerabilities is one thing, but they should never be a couple again. Although I suppose, if they are following canon, she's got to get pregnant (if indeed a kid isn't already being hidden by her) because in the sequel novel, her son comes back for revenge. It's never said if the kid's dad was DeWinter or Athos, but age wise it could have been either one. Which makes it doubly sad when Athos himself is the one who has to kill him.

And yeah I know the show obviously isn't following canon-but IMO one thing that should never change too much is that Milady is basically a psychopath. Who poisons Constance, and threatens others. I believe Athos calls her a demon from the pits of Hell. So no, I can't even fathom the idea of them as a couple. I don't care if this isn't canon faithful all the way. NO to that, a thousand times no..

 

I guess I kind of look at it like this: the show felt the need to punish Rochefort for his crimes.

Yet Milady hasn't been executed or hanged for hers, yet? I despise double standards, especially when there's no good reason for them. Novel wise, she was way worse than Rochefort.

And really, just from what I've seen her do in this version, and read that Rochefort does in this version....I still say she's worse in this version, as well.

She was perfectly okay with leaving Athos to die in his burning childhood home. That's something to think about when you try to picture them living happily ever after. For me,there has to be more than just chemistry between two actors to root for their characters as a couple.

If the couple dumbs down or otherwise ruins the character one of them(or both), or you have to *really* fanwank it for it to make sense, it should never happen. Some people might swoon at the idea of Athos wanting to be with that witch.

It makes me cringe. I'm all for him forgiving her. But they should never, ever be romantic again.

Edited March 23, 2015 by IWantCandy71

[DCWash]

I have read that those extreme corsets actually cause fertility issues. The problem may not have been with Louis at all.

 

"Those extreme corsets" weren't popular until the 19th century. Before then, stays and stomachers provided structure and support, and would feel tight by today's standards, but didn't produce those extreme wasp waists we're used to seeing and associating with "corsets." Ask any reenactor. The bulging breasts we see in this show are more a modern costuming construct than historic reality, I think, but also because the tops are being squeezed, not the area where reproductive organs are being squeezed.

 

We also need to remember that miscarriages and stillbirths were much more frequent than we generally think, so much so that in the old days it was almost taken for granted and not written about--which is why we don't think about it when we talk about things like historic fertility rates or individual royal couples. Much of it was linked to nutrition. But miscarriages are still a major cause of concern. That's a big part of the reason for the IVF and surrogacy industry. 

Edited March 23, 2015 by DCWash

[Athena]

Changed this topic to be general speculation for future seasons. 

[MostlyC]

Here is my wild speculation about season 3.  Because I have a crazy over the top imagination:

 

The series picks up two or three years later.  The musketeers come home from the war.  In the meantime, Milady has become a spy for the Duke of Buckingham (the new big bad)- and sometime lover.  The Duke is also having an affair with Anne, because she thinks Aramis is dead, so why not?

 

Athos comes home to Milady back to her old tricks, and is furious that she slept with someone else.  Lots of misunderstanding about Athos being late..and they sleep together at least once. Because, they have mad chemistry.

 

Aramis comes back and is devastated that Anne is in love with someone else.  Of course, upon learning that Aramis is alive, Anne pines for him and vice versa (and eventually baby #2).

 

Porthos get to be bad-ass and gets lots of secret missions.

 

Louis is still a foppish jerk (still not happy about the signing the execution of his fine).

 

Curious to see what others speculate.  We've got like 9 months or so to kill.

[DCWash]

Porthos better get a woman, that's all I gotta say.

 

(Actually, I've got a whole very long-term plot line--like, longer-term than the show can actually run--thought out about the domestication of Porthos. Because I think he deserves, and is the one of the four who would most appreciate, a happy home life.)

[ennui]

when we talk about things like historic fertility rates or individual royal couples. Much of it was linked to nutrition.

And illness. I think even the mumps can cause infertility, not to mention infections, hormones, syphilis, endometriosis, etc., etc., etc. We all take modern medicine for granted.

[justmehere]

the show felt the need to punish Rochefort for his crimes. Yet Milady hasn't been executed or hanged for hers, yet?

 

 

Yes, Milady is a murderer - although much of it was under the cardinal's direction. Not that that completely absolves her, but she has also saved others, including the king and queen -- even if for selfish reasons -- and now seems to regret her past. Rochefort's crimes were directly against the king and queen, stealing power, threatening their lives, trying to rape the queen, and coercing Louis to allow her execution, which he perversely wanted to carry out himself. Rochefort was much worse.

[IWantCandy71]

It doesn't absolve her at all. She's still got a ton of blood on her hands, and if Rochefort must pay...she must pay. I have a feeling that perhaps the reason that they made Rochefort so slimy was to make her look better in comparison. IDK. As a rule, I take each character on their own merits. What Rochefort has or has not done doesn't change my opinion of HER one iota. And why should it? He could kill a group of orphans, and she could save them-and she'd STILL need to die/go to prison for her crimes. Doing one good deed-doing a hundred good deeds-doesn't erase all the bad ones.

And it doesn't make her reformed. I have a feeling that if her character returns(and she unfortunately will), she'll be more bitter and nasty than ever. I predict the canon death of Constance will happen now that she and D'artagnan are happy, and it will be at Milady's hand, and Milady's canon execution will also be carried out afterwards. It is Constance's death in the novel that pushes them over the edge, after all.

 

I think there can only be so many times that Constance can be saved in the nick of time, before eventually her luck runs out. However, as already stated, they aren't following canon, so.....anything can happen.

Edited March 24, 2015 by IWantCandy71

[DCWash]

I think there can only be so many times that Constance can be saved in the nick of time, before eventually her luck runs out. However, as already stated, they aren't following canon, so.....anything can happen.

 

And there's only so much canon you can follow when canon is a single book and you've got ten episodes--ten hours of production--a year to fill. If you want to stretch it, canon may be two books, or possibly three, but even then, you have problems.

Edited March 25, 2015 by DCWash

[IWantCandy71]

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say. Canon or not canon, they can fill all the hours they like, but chances are that they wrote Milady softer this season so that the most recent perceived rejection from Athos would make her go back to full on bad, but not just full on bad. Probably murderously full on bad. And yeah I could be wrong. I have no idea that is where they are going. That's why I said "I predict", not "I know.".

One of the only mini series done for TTM, back in the sixties, starred Jeremy Brett (more famous for being Sherlock Holmes in the Granada series) as d'Artagnan. It was, if memory serves, sixteen hours long by itself, and it didn't even cover everything in the first novel. If the show runners wanted to, they could easily fill several more seasons by blending canon with original stories.

 

At any rate, truly am looking forward to getting to see season two.

[ganesh]

I knew Catherine (Athos' sister-in-law) would never get the jump on Milady.

 

I know. When she was tailing Milady, I was rolling my eyes because Milady so obviously knew she was being followed. 

 

Glad Aramis finally told everyone the truth, and it was about as hilarious as I thought it would be.

 

You could have tried *not* sleeping with her. D'A did this dismissive hand gesture that was hilarious and then the Captain flung his hat across the room. There's *more*. ha ha ha

 

I agree that Athos & Milady have Teh Smokin' Chem, but I didn't want them kissing.

 

I didn't either. Especially in the seekrit room! I'm still confused at their history. He gave her a look like, where you came from wouldn't have mattered to me, but I thought he was betrothed anyway so it didn't really matter. They're good spies though. 

 

I did like the "oh, she won't stop talking. let's go."

 

I wanted an epic showdown between Dangerous Ladies.

 

I never thought Catherine was dangerous even though she knows how to shoot a gun well. She was entitled and pissed off about not getting what she thought she deserved. As shown by the show, she's no where in the league of Milady when it comes to cunning and guile. I think the resolution was apt. 

 

That takes courage, the courage Porthos was talking about.

 

Courage isn't just being able to shoot a gun and swing a sword, so I like that the show was able to underscore this. Plus she stared down Rochefort. That was great.

 

I'm disappointed that the doctor had to go because I was down for the platonic medical team of him and Constance. He was enough of a minor-major character that offing him was legit. Not like kill a red shirt. 

[Asha124]

I was starting to think Rochefort was Wolverine. That bastard just wouldn't die even though every single character stabbed him at least once. I didn't feel sorry for him at all. And I am probably a very bad person because I didn't feel sorry for the nanny either. She didn't have to sleep with Aramis and let Rochefort blackmail her...

 

I believe the filming of a new season will start soon. Once again in my lovely home country.

[Marie Claudine]

Glad the ladies survived the finale!

 

I think Milady is probably going to start working for Buckingham next season.

 

I've really grown to like Anne over the past few episodes. Don't get me wrong, I always liked her, but she has grown to be more than just pretty, naive, and kind. I liked her queenly poise and courage when facing Rochefort. I also liked that Aramis tried to make a deal with god to get off the hook. A very human thing to do...

 

Yay for Treville's promotion! Whatever happens next season, Louis will be advised better than he has been of late. Not sure he'll like that, of course.

[Ravenya003]

Man, that had more endings that The Lord of the Rings.

 

Ditto to what everyone else said about Rochefort's drawn out death, it was a bit like "Murder on the Orient Express" what with everyone getting at least one punch/stab in. Even Anne contributed, what with her telling Aramis not to close his eyes. Still, I'm SO relieved that he's dead. Hopefully they'll find a more nuanced villain for next season. 

 

Despite being the finale, I find I don't have much to say. Everyone got their moment to shine, they didn't sideline the girls to any great extent, and it ended on a note of "the adventure continues." I guess that's all I want in a finale.

 

Though Marguerite got a raw deal. A terrible ending for a character the writers clearly weren't all that interested in as anything other than a plot device.

[ganesh]

Would they have an interior villain next series if the focus would be on the war with Spain? We've had 2 series of internal intrigue, so

 

I do not care if they are pretty much ignoring canon except for the broad strokes. I'm glad Constance lived. I mean come on: Maybe I bring men to fight my battles! Then she shot someone too. I hope she doesn't get written into the 'damsel' corner now that she's married to D'A. I'm still holding out hope she'll be a field nurse with the war being declared. 

 

Though Marguerite got a raw deal. A terrible ending for a character the writers clearly weren't all that interested in as anything other than a plot device.

 

I slightly disagree. Constance earlier made the comment to D'A that women have literally zero options on their own. Lucky for her D'A got her a job at court where she proved to be quite capable on her own and a good, genuine friend to the queen, as well as more than capable as a nurse. Marguerite is basically a counterpoint. She didn't have nearly the support Constance did and wouldn't have been able to rise above her station at all. She got backed into a corner and there wasn't anything she could do about it. 

[Llywela]

Reading some comments online about Marguerite and how she wasn't allowed even a tiny degree of redemption or retribution before her inevitable death, even her suicide note coming to nothing, reminded me of something I noticed in this episode. There was a particular Red Guard who appeared to be noticing something shonky about Rochefort throughout. I noticed him particularly because the director kept making a point of showing this guy noticing stuff - he was there when Rochefort found Marguerite and tore up the suicide note, for example. It really felt like they were building this guy up to be important - he'd break rank and help the Musketeers bring Rochefort down or something, reveal what he knew...but after all that build-up, nada. He just got killed when the Musketeers fought their way through the palace. And with him went any hope of finding out what Marguerite wrote at the end. So I wondered what was the point of highlighting him like that through the episode.

 

The poison Marguerite took was the one Rochefort swapped for the king's medication, wasn't it?

 

The Musketeers have to get Aramis back if they're going to war - he's the only person on the show who knows any first aid, since Lemay's sad demise.

Edited April 1, 2015 by Llywela