All Episodes Discussion

[Enero]

22 hours ago, Tenarife60 said:

Tonight's episode about Dwight Jones was so disturbing.  I can't believe she was paying $6,000 a month to him in spousal support and he was driving a Mercedes on top of it.  I did wonder where he was getting his money from when they show started because they said he rarely worked and would sometimes sleep for days, not leaving the house, mostly going on tirades.  

Well the wife stated that she supported their life with her income. I’m thinking after the divorce and even after the spousal support stopped in 2016 (?) he was able to keep living off that money. $6,000 a month is a lot. He could’ve saved a good portion of that when he was receiving it, and therefore was able to remain unemployed and have the time and money to stalk his Ex and their son. 

I agree. This case was very disturbing. I really can’t say what could’ve stopped him though except death or being locked in a psychiatric hospital indefinitely. I know extending the restraining order would’ve prevented him from legally buying a gun, but he could’ve still obtained a gun by illegal means or even inflicted death and violence in some other way. 

Was I the only one who pegged that Ex-wife and bodyguard were an item before it was revealed? I could sense something was there in their first segment together but wasn’t certain until it was confirmed. 

Edited July 1, 2018 by Enero

[sinycalone]

11 hours ago, Enero said:

Well the wife stated that she supported their life with her income. I’m thinking after the divorce and even after the spousal support stopped in 2016 (?) he was able to keep living off that money. $6,000 a month is a lot. He could’ve saved a good portion of that when he was receiving it, and therefore was able to remain unemployed and have the time and money to stalk his Ex and their son. 

I agree. This case was very disturbing. I really can’t say what could’ve stopped him though except death or being locked in a psychiatric hospital indefinitely. I know extending the restraining order would’ve prevented him from legally buying a gun, but he could’ve still obtained a gun by illegal means or even inflicted death and violence in some other way. 

Was I the only one who pegged that Ex-wife and bodyguard were an item before it was revealed? I could sense something was there in their first segment together but wasn’t certain until it was confirmed. 

I had the same hunch.

[saber5055]

14 hours ago, Enero said:

This case was very disturbing. I really can’t say what could’ve stopped him though except death or being locked in a psychiatric hospital indefinitely. I know extending the restraining order would’ve prevented him from legally buying a gun, but he could’ve still obtained a gun by illegal means or even inflicted death and violence in some other way. 

I haven't watched Dateline for a while, it's been so many reruns. But this episode was new to me, and put the spotlight on how little defense we have when someone is out to kill, hurt, scare or stalk us. A restraining order is going to stop someone? Please. If a guy needs a RO against him, some piece of paper filed in a courthouse somewhere is laughable. And it's easy to get a gun if you want one, legally or illegally.

I commend this show for saying legal/police protection isn't going to happen if you have someone stalking you. You need to take care of yourself. This woman was lucky to have the money to hire a bodyguard and be able to move from place to place to hide her son. Most of us are not that privileged. We just end up as a Dateline subject.

[ChristmasJones]

On 6/28/2018 at 4:31 PM, Annber03 said:

Yeah, I can't begin to imagine what it's been like for her family. So many years and no answers. They've had billboards in the area recently trying to appeal to people for new tips, since this year would've marked Jodi's 50th birthday. 

The case has taken some rather weird twists and turns over the years, too, which adds to the creepiness of it all. 

Have you listened to the What Happened to Jodi? podcast?  It was pretty good.

[Annber03]

I haven't, no! Didn't know there was one. I'll have to seek that out. Thanks for letting me know. 

[UsernameFatigue]

18 hours ago, Enero said:

 

Was I the only one who pegged that Ex-wife and bodyguard were an item before it was revealed? I could sense something was there in their first segment together but wasn’t certain until it was confirmed. 

 

No, I thought so too, if only because they were being interviewed together though it had been years earlier than she had initially hired him. 

 

3 hours ago, saber5055 said:

 

I commend this show for saying legal/police protection isn't going to happen if you have someone stalking you. You need to take care of yourself. This woman was lucky to have the money to hire a bodyguard and be able to move from place to place to hide her son. Most of us are not that privileged. We just end up as a Dateline subject.

I don't know that I would consider her privileged. Her wealth came from her own hard work, and her own hard work in turn provided this monster with the ability to live off his ex wife while he was stalking her. If anyone was privileged, it was him. 

This a Dateline episode that could have been 2 hours. And what a coincidence that Josh actually was friends with the first victim. I will have to watch the episode again because there were a few things I was unclear about. When the private detective was tailing Jones, he said they went into the family home and into the room he was staying in, where they found the disturbing books among other things. Whose family home was it? 

When Connie said at the end that she has been married twice, but has only ever had one husband I teared up. I am so glad those two found each other, though what a horrible reason to have had to come together in the first place. 

Edited to add - while I had a minute I read a couple of reports on this case. Jones got more than $6000 a month in support (for 5 years). He also got $97,000 in a checking account, $131,000 in a retirement savings account, $50,000 from his son's college savings account, and other payments. The one report I read also says that he had unsupervised visits with his son until he tried to abduct him, then was changed to supervised visits which he was supposed to pay for but refused. The article then said the visits stopped, but that doesn't seem to be the case as Connie said she had to pay for the visits. I really wish this had been a 2 hour episode. 

In any case how many lives were changed by this monster? When I think back to the day that the first victim was murdered I remember the day well as hubby and I had just celebrated an anniversary a couple of days previously, and he left the morning of the 31st on a trip. To think all 6 people were alive and well then, and within a short time they would all be dead. Sickening. 

Edited July 1, 2018 by UsernameFatigue

[biakbiak]

43 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

When the private detective was tailing Jones, he said they went into the family home and into the room he was staying in, where they found the disturbing books among other things. Whose family home was it? 

I believe it was to the couple that he also killed who were his friends.

Ir was convoluted because the murders happened less than a month before the airing. My boyfriend rewound it twice to check the year because he thought it was no way June of 2018. 

[ButterQueen]

On 6/30/2018 at 12:00 AM, Tenarife60 said:

Tonight's episode about Dwight Jones was so disturbing.  I can't believe she was paying $6,000 a month to him in spousal support and he was driving a Mercedes on top of it.  I did wonder where he was getting his money from when they show started because they said he rarely worked and would sometimes sleep for days, not leaving the house, mostly going on tirades.  

The judge who handled their case was a total idiot.  

[Blissfool]

The one about Justin Moffitt was intriguing, I thought. Lots of twists and turns. Chance played a big part in solving the case, especially because Moffitt was such an irrelevant quasi-boyfriend.

The girlfriend and the mom were very calm in their 911 calls. And the girlfriend was very flippant throughout her police interview. "Oh, by the way, I remember his last name," instead of blurting it out. The officer even had to follow up with, "well, what is it?"

[JudyObscure]

Agreed  The Shadow, was interesting.  It, along with some of the cases we've seen where old girlfriends kill the man's new lover, make me think how dangerous some of these casual relationships are.  She  didn't even remember  the guy's last name and thought it was all just "friends with benefits," while he was so invested in her he killed  a man. 

[saber5055]

I was grateful for Dateline doing a show on Jonestown. I remember when it happened, it was all the news, and that's how "drinking the Kool-aid" came into popular lexicon. I didn't know about the other things that happened there. Even if national news reported it (I'm sure it did), I had forgotten about the congressman and the other people being murdered on the air strip. I can't imagine living through that, and understand and sympathize with the people who were there being unable to "really" get past it.

It was sort of "assumed" that everyone drank the "Kool-aid" voluntarily. In truth, no one had a choice.

Like the sign that was shown at the Jonestown compound: “Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it.” (Even though it was repeated at Waco.) So thank you Dateline for helping us remember, and teaching those who were not born yet that this "stuff" happened and happens.

Edited July 14, 2018 by saber5055

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, saber5055 said:

So thank you Dateline for helping us remember, and teaching those who were not born yet that this "stuff" happened and happens.

I'm among those who were not yet born when Jonestown happened, so yeah, I can only imagine what it must've been like for those of you who watched the story unfold on the news back then and whatnot, or what it must've been like for the newscasters having to report on something so bizarre and extreme, too. Ghastly, tragic stories that happen during wartime, or some other form of political upheaval, or things of that sort, are sadly common enough to where newscasters have experience knowing how to handle reporting on and discussing those kinds of stories. But this wasn't one of those types of situations. This was just some lone nutjob leading 900 people* to commit suicide/kill their children all at the same time....just 'cause he told them to. How does one even begin to explain that to viewers at home? 

*That's the part that always sticks with me when I see stories about this-the haunted looks on the investigators'/reporters' faces as they stare out at all the bodies just lying there, and the images of all the deceased lying together, too. It just all looks so freaking surreal, and almost looks more like something out of a horror movie. The footage proves it actually happened, but it's still hard to fully wrap your head around that fact anyway. 

[UsernameFatigue]

Wow, just watched the episode "The Threat". This one, and the Dwight Jones case last week really shows how law enforcement/prosecutors and others who testify against these madmen put their lives at risk. All I could think of when Bradford's smug lawyer claimed that he was no threat to anyone and should be paroled, is that she had better hope that he does not blame her for his parole release being overturned. She may be next on his hit list. 

[cooksdelight]

The late actor Powers Boothe played Jones in the movie version of that massacre. He was the perfect choice, you really thought you were watching Jones himself. 

Boothe won the Emmy Award for his role, beating out veterans Henry Fonda and Jason Robards. As the Screen Actors Guild were on strike in the fall of 1980, he was the only actor to cross picket lines to attend the ceremonies, saying at the time, "This may be either the bravest moment of my career or the dumbest."

Catch the movie on Netflix or something if you can. “Guyana Tragedy: The Story of Jim Jones”

[JudyObscure]

I saw "Guyana Tragedy," and I'll never forget it.  I agree Powers Booth was awesome in it and the whole thing was just horrifying.

[saber5055]

Thanks Cooks. I didn't know there was a movie made about Guyana, although I'm not sure I want to watch it, like no way do I want to see the yet-to-be-made movies about the Thailand soccer kids. Following the news stories was stressful enough for me.

What I didn't think about until the Dateline episode is what happened to all the bodies. 900 is an overwhelming amount. So it was interesting the government of Guyana told the U.S. to take them all back to the States. Wow, that's a job that I'm sure is still etched in memories. I did a search to find out where the mass grave is (because I missed that in the show), and came across this article about how five victims were discovered in 2014 in Delaware and were just buried. The article has some interesting side notes, including that Jim Jones had a son (adopted). I didn't see the entire Dateline so don't know if he was at Jonestown. Maybe I do need to watch that movie.

Here is the news article link.

Edited July 15, 2018 by saber5055

[Zella]

Just caught the Jonestown episode and had to see if there was a Dateline forum.  Agreed on how haunting it was! I didn't sleep well last night after watching it. I liked that it focused on the journalists, hadn't really seen that perspective before.

I  also second all the praise for Powers Boothe.  Guyana Tragedy can be a little hard to find--I ordered it from Amazon some years ago--but it is well worth watching.  He captured Jones's craziness and charisma in equal measure. There's something almost reptilian about him in the end.

Have any of you read Jeff Guinn's Road to Jonestown?  It's highly disturbing but is an excellent look inside the Jonestown cult. I've heard it's supposed to be made into a documentary but entirely sure when.

1 minute ago, saber5055 said:

Thanks Cooks. I didn't know there was a movie made about Guyana, although I'm not sure I want to watch it, like no way do I want to see the yet-to-be-made movies about the Thailand soccer kids.

What I didn't think about until the Dateline episode is what happened to all the bodies. 900 is an overwhelming amount. So it was interesting the government of Guyana told the U.S. to take them all back to the States. Wow, that's a job that I'm sure is still etched in memories. I did a search to find out where the mass grave is (because I missed that in the show), and came across this article about how five victims were discovered in 2014 in Delaware and were just buried. The article has some interesting side notes, including that Jim Jones had a son (adopted). I didn't see the entire Dateline so don't know if he was at Jonestown. Maybe I do need to watch that movie.

Here is the news article link.

Jones had multiple biological and adopted children. Some died at Jonestown and others were away. The Guinn book I mentioned above includes a really good discussion of his family. They were interviewed for it.

[saber5055]

3 minutes ago, Zella said:

Jones had multiple biological and adopted children. Some died at Jonestown and others were away. The Guinn book I mentioned above includes a really good discussion of his family. They were interviewed for it.

Thanks Zella. I "assumed" if he was the head of a cult, he had kids by many of the cult women, as did David Koresh. That always seems to be one of the perks for being a cult leader, polygamist or not. Newscasts back in that day avoided most controversial things. Those were the days when bras could only be shown on mannequins in Maidenform commercials, and Lucy/Desi slept in twin beds.

[Zella]

14 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

Thanks Zella. I "assumed" if he was the head of a cult, he had kids by many of the cult women, as did David Koresh. That always seems to be one of the perks for being a cult leader, polygamist or not. Newscasts back in that day avoided most controversial things. Those were the days when bras could only be shown on mannequins in Maidenform commercials, and Lucy/Desi slept in twin beds.

Yes you're correct! He adopted children with his wife but fathered children with women who were members of the cult.

Edited to add: He and his wife did have 1 child together.  I had thought she was not able to have children,  but I was wrong.

Edited July 15, 2018 by Zella

[cooksdelight]

I just downloaded the Kindle edition of Jeff Guinn’s book, thanks for mentioning it here. I’ll be sure NOT to read it at night when it’s dark. :)

[Zella]

2 minutes ago, cooksdelight said:

I just downloaded the Kindle edition of Jeff Guinn’s book, thanks for mentioning it here. I’ll be sure NOT to read it at night when it’s dark. :)

That's a good idea! Guinn is a favorite of mine but that book is super creepy! 

[ridethemaverick]

I googled Guyana Tragedy to see who's selling it and this popped up. It seems to be the full film:

 

[CelticBlackCat]

Re:  Guyana Massacre Tragedy:

I will never forget Senator Leo Ryan.  He was assassinated there on the day of the mass suicide.

[mamadrama]

On 7/16/2018 at 3:47 AM, CelticBlackCat said:

Re:  Guyana Massacre Tragedy:

I will never forget Senator Leo Ryan.  He was assassinated there on the day of the mass suicide.

And, for a politician, he was a really "good" guy and had done some good work. A lot of people just know him from the massacre, When he wanted to know more information about something, he put himself right in the middle of it. (Even entered Folsom Prison as an inmate to learn more about what was going on there when he was working on prison reform.) It was natural that he'd want to travel to Guyana and help those relatives. 

[mamadrama]

On 7/15/2018 at 11:14 AM, JudyObscure said:

I saw "Guyana Tragedy," and I'll never forget it.  I agree Powers Booth was awesome in it and the whole thing was just horrifying.

Ti West did a kind of found footage movie a few years ago called THE SACRAMENT. It's fiction, but is clearly based on Jonestown. I am not a fan of ff films, but I do love Ti West so I gave the film a try. I was kind of blown away by it. I've seen all the Jonestown documentaries, as well as the famous movie, but THE SACRAMENT is the first time I've really felt like I was a part of what was going on. It disturbed me for days. After I watched it, I also got on You Tube and listened to the recorded tape of the last hour or so of the actual massacre. It is absolutely heartbreaking and harrowing. Jones recorded himself and his followers and you can hear one poor woman clearly trying to reason with him and talk him out of what he was about to do, but she was eventually silenced. And the sounds of the children in the background...Ugh. 

[Annber03]

2 minutes ago, mamadrama said:

After I watched it, I also got on You Tube and listened to the recorded tape of the last hour or so of the actual massacre. It is absolutely heartbreaking and harrowing. Jones recorded himself and his followers and you can hear one poor woman clearly trying to reason with him and talk him out of what he was about to do, but she was eventually silenced. And the sounds of the children in the background...Ugh. 

...damn :(. 

[mamadrama]

5 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

...damn :(. 

I'm one of these people that HAS to know stuff. In order to truly process everything I need the visual (or in this case, the audio) to really put everything together. My husband sat there and listened to it with me. At first, hearing the kids crying and talking was absolutely horrible. It was equally infuriating us and breaking our hearts. But 20 minutes later, when it was almost totally quiet, it was even worse because you KNEW then that they were dead. Just awful. In the Ti West movie, they actually use Jones' exact speech at the end. 

My mother was one of Jones' followers when he was based out of Indianapolis. When I was a kid, she'd tell me stories about being in his congregation. He didn't start out completely whacked. In fact, in a time when few were doing so, he spoke out against racial inequality and was pro-feminists. A lot of people who were feeling kind of "lost" found themselves pulled towards him and his message. A lot of his early stuff was actually pretty "good." Oh, how it crumbled after that, though. His son has been very outspoken about his dad's drug use and mental instability, especially there at the end. Jones terrifies me on a level that few other people have. 

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, mamadrama said:

I'm one of these people that HAS to know stuff. In order to truly process everything I need the visual (or in this case, the audio) to really put everything together. My husband sat there and listened to it with me. At first, hearing the kids crying and talking was absolutely horrible. It was equally infuriating us and breaking our hearts. But 20 minutes later, when it was almost totally quiet, it was even worse because you KNEW then that they were dead. Just awful. In the Ti West movie, they actually use Jones' exact speech at the end. 

I get that "HAVE to know" feeling, yeah. Educating oneself and getting the full picture does indeed help put everything in order for some people. I mean, we're all here in this forum/thread discussion because we have a curiosity about how and why people are able to do some of the heinous things they do, and we've all got those cases that haunt us to the point where we feel we need to know every last detail, no matter how painful or disturbing. 

I feel I should be glad that at least you weren't alone when you listened to those audio clips. I think I'd want somebody with me, too, in a situation like that. Your description of everything going quiet is chilling. How awful. Those poor children. 

Quote

My mother was one of Jones' followers when he was based out of Indianapolis. When I was a kid, she'd tell me stories about being in his congregation. He didn't start out completely whacked. In fact, in a time when few were doing so, he spoke out against racial inequality and was pro-feminists. A lot of people who were feeling kind of "lost" found themselves pulled towards him and his message. A lot of his early stuff was actually pretty "good." Oh, how it crumbled after that, though. His son has been very outspoken about his dad's drug use and mental instability, especially there at the end. Jones terrifies me on a level that few other people have. 

I've heard about the early stuff he promoted, yeah-this paragraph perfectly captures why you and other people would, and should, find him so terrifying. Usually people like him start off preaching and promoting things that sound fairly reasonable and normal. That's exactly how they can lure people in. People presume everyone who joins a cult is dumb or ignorant or whatever and no, there's some very smart people who've been conned and fooled, and it's tactics like Jones' that help attract them. They have a scary talent for being able to pinpoint either people's weaknesses, or interests and ideals that mean something to them, or both, and exploit them. 

I can't even begin to imagine what it must be like for your mom, having to reconcile knowing him and seeing what he became, nor can I imagine what it's like for you to know your mom was connected to somebody as scary as him. I'm very glad your mom was able to get away from him before things went completely to hell, and hope she was (is?) able to move on as best she could. 

[CelticBlackCat]

5 hours ago, mamadrama said:

And, for a politician, he was a really "good" guy and had done some good work. A lot of people just know him from the massacre, When he wanted to know more information about something, he put himself right in the middle of it. (Even entered Folsom Prison as an inmate to learn more about what was going on there when he was working on prison reform.) It was natural that he'd want to travel to Guyana and help those relatives. 

Exactly!  Thanks for writing more about Leo Ryan.  I've never been a registered Democrat, but Senator Ryan was a really good guy and did a lot of good work, so I admired him.  I was only 22 when this tragedy happened and I was so impressed that a politician had gotten out of the office or off the campaign trail and actually traveled to find out what was going on amidst reports of Americans being held in a foreign country against their will.  He's one of my heroes for having done that.

[mamadrama]

On 7/18/2018 at 3:33 AM, CelticBlackCat said:

Exactly!  Thanks for writing more about Leo Ryan.  I've never been a registered Democrat, but Senator Ryan was a really good guy and did a lot of good work, so I admired him.  I was only 22 when this tragedy happened and I was so impressed that a politician had gotten out of the office or off the campaign trail and actually traveled to find out what was going on amidst reports of Americans being held in a foreign country against their will.  He's one of my heroes for having done that.

He was definitely a real hero for physically taking the press and the families down there to see what was going on. It's too bad that his name is associated with the massacre, but that a lot of people don't know much about him beyond that. :-( The whole thing was a true tragedy. 

[biakbiak]

“The Good Son” the radio woman reminded me of Real Housewices of Dallas Leeanne Locken in looks and demeanor. The cops clearly fucked up this case from jump. I am glad he was convicted.

[LittleIggy]

On 7/24/2018 at 3:19 AM, biakbiak said:

“The Good Son” the radio woman reminded me of Real Housewices of Dallas Leeanne Locken in looks and demeanor. The cops clearly fucked up this case from jump. I am glad he was convicted.

When the guy mentioned the victim’s race, I knew he beat him up for that reason. Very sad case.

Edited July 26, 2018 by LittleIggy

[teebax]

On 7/25/2018 at 9:13 PM, LittleIggy said:

When the guy mentioned the victim’s race, I knew he beat him up for that reason. Very sad case.

Yeah, Gauge is the worst kind of racist in my opinion. He can't just think his hateful thoughts and leave it at that. He has to attack people and post vile things on social media about it. I didn't hear them mention a hate crime in the charges, but he should've been charged with one. 

Lovely and her family seem amazing, as does the radio personality. It's a shame such a fine young man was taken from us for such a stupid reason. 

[PepperMonkey]

Help me out here.... WHY are we revisiting the MacNeill murder case again? Is there new information? Didn't I just see something on either Dateline or 48 Hours about this recently?? Is this that re-run? It is re-run season, after all, but we just had a good new episode about the young man who was beat up and killed by the racist asshole, well it was new for me anyway, so I was hoping for some new or new-ish stuff this summer...

I swear, though, I did just see this again recently and it seems like Michelle's murder has been a long time ago, now. Tell you what.... there was some new info that I didn't know in the episode I saw recently. I'm probably all alone here but I didn't know about all the threats to his daughter. I honestly think that's the first time I saw that. And didn't their brother commit suicide? Or did I imagine that?

At any rate, I'm glad that jerk finally had the common decency to kill himself. Too bad he couldn't screw up the courage to off himself before he took the life of the mother of his children.

Edited July 28, 2018 by PepperMonkey

[AZChristian]

10 minutes ago, PepperMonkey said:

And didn't their brother commit suicide? Or did I imagine that?

He did.  One account I read says that dear old dad asked his son and/or son's girlfriend to get all of the suspicious medications out of the house after he murdered Michele.

[Mondrianyone]

I've also seen this case on one of these shows fairly recently (and fairly recently before that one), and I thought there was one huge element that was left out of last night's version.  Maybe someone can tell me if I'm imagining this, but didn't it turn out that Martin had faked both his legal and medical credentials and wasn't really either a legitimate doctor or lawyer?  (I know there are so many of these sociopath cases that I may be conflating this one with another.  Which might be the most horrifying thing of all.)

[AZChristian]

Much of his life was fake.  I feel badly for his children - knowing that such a sociopath donated DNA into their bloodlines.

[Mondrianyone]

Thanks, AZ!  That was an . . . interesting read.  I know they mentioned the faked college transcripts last night, but there was so much more than that.  The article didn't mention anything about faking his legal credentials, but it wouldn't surprise me to find out that his law degree is bogus as well.

What haunts me is what the real motive behind the adoption of those little Ukrainian girls might've been.  I'd always thought that the Mormon concept of having lots of children involved their being biological children.  Was he playing this crazy game so far ahead that he knew someday he'd be stealing the identity of one of them?  Or something worse that was never touched upon?

[truebluesmoky]

Apparently, in a separate trial, MacNeill was also found guilty of sexually abusing Alexis. I also read that the younges daughter supposedly adopted from the Ukraine was actually Vanessa’s, one of the older daughters, biological child. Who knows who the father was, but either way, the family’s solution to her pregnancy seems to have affected her. At the time of MacNeill’s trial, she was on probation after a heroin possession conviction.

[iMonrey]

The only thing I didn't get about the MacNeill case is that nobody disproved his alibi, that he was picking his daughter up from school when his wife was killed. So, do we think he hired someone, or maybe that his girlfriend/the nanny was in on it and committed the actual murder? 

[sinycalone]

Tonight's episode - The Figure in the Garage

Christine manipulated her fool of a husband into not only murdering her ex-husband -- the father of her child -- but convinced him he should kill himself for insurance money.  (BTW...I thought most life insurance policies were invalid if the insured committed suicide.)

In addition, the victim's mother lost three children...the last murdered because he was a good father.

[biakbiak]

29 minutes ago, sinycalone said:

BTW...I thought most life insurance policies were invalid if the insured committed suicide

That is usually not true. Typically there is a stipulation in the insurance policy that it doesn’t cover suicide within a certain time period of any changes to the policy, 2 years is standard but it can vary.

Edited July 31, 2018 by biakbiak

[sinycalone]

10 hours ago, biakbiak said:

That is usually not true. Typically there is a stipulation in the insurance policy that it doesn’t cover suicide within a certain time period of any changes to the policy, 2 years is standard but it can vary.

I got the feeling the insurance policy was issued fairly recently....but maybe not.  Maybe Christine had taken it out when they first married....always planning it as a fall-back if she wanted to get rid of him, too.

[AZChristian]

Hubby and I are on vacation in Northern Utah right now. He agreed to stop at the cemetery where Michele Macneill is buried, so I could pay my respects. It's interesting that there's a big blank spot on the marker where Martin's name used to be. It is no longer there.

[12catcrazy]

Sigh.  I called it less than 10 minutes into this Dateline about the guy found dead in the garage.  When they started going into all the stuff about how he loved and doted SO MUCH on his young daughter, I turned to my companion and said,  "This is going to be another one of these child custody things and I'll bet either the kid's mother or current husband was behind this".  He laughed at me and said,  "Oh, you think you know it all".   Guess I do!  

There was a terrible murder/suicide a few days ago here in New York.   And it apparently revolved around child custody issues.   In this case, the mother had primary custody and took the child to live with her in Holland.   She had to come back to NY upon a judge's order so the child could see his father.  The father killed his ex-wife, the little boy, his current wife and himself.   No winners in that one.  

[UsernameFatigue]

On 30/07/2018 at 8:59 PM, sinycalone said:

Tonight's episode - The Figure in the Garage

Christine manipulated her fool of a husband into not only murdering her ex-husband -- the father of her child -- but convinced him he should kill himself for insurance money.  (BTW...I thought most life insurance policies were invalid if the insured committed suicide.)

In addition, the victim's mother lost three children...the last murdered because he was a good father.

This episode made me want to scream. So the poor daughter looses both her fathers (mind you her step father had a few screws lose to go along with her mother's plan), as well as contact with her half siblings, grandmother and uncle and is stuck being brought up by her psycho mother. I hope either the mother ends up convicted, or at the very least the daughter realizes when she is old enough what her mother has done, and cuts her out of her life. 

Edited August 4, 2018 by UsernameFatigue

[JudyObscure]

6 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

This episode made me want to scream

I know right? From the very first,  I thought the figure in the video was a woman.  She moved like a woman as she went over to the trash bin and she was much shorter than the man we see in the next screen.  I think they need to take another look at who was under that hoodie. I'm also tired of the excuse, "We can't use the felon's testimony because he's a felon and felons aren't credible."  We hear that on Dateline all the time.  This man had no reason to lie and sounded perfectly believable to me.  I'm sure some felons are  liars but so are some squeaky voiced housewives, it should be up to the jury to decide who they find believable.

[sinycalone]

2 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I know right? From the very first,  I thought the figure in the video was a woman.  She moved like a woman as she went over to the trash bin and she was much shorter than the man we see in the next screen.  I think they need to take another look at who was under that hoodie. I'm also tired of the excuse, "We can't use the felon's testimony because he's a felon and felons aren't credible."  We hear that on Dateline all the time.  This man had no reason to lie and sounded perfectly believable to me.  I'm sure some felons are  liars but so are some squeaky voiced housewives, it should be up to the jury to decide who they find believable.

I thought the "felon" made a very good witness....matter of fact, reasonably articulate, etc.     And I believed him.  I think Christine orchestrated the whole thing....including asking her husband to kill himself.  And it certainly could have been her in the hoodie.  

[cooksdelight]

Warning for anyone who hates Andrea Canning’s uptalking, she’s on tonight.

[teebax]

11 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

Warning for anyone who hates Andrea Canning’s uptalking, she’s on tonight.

I like her and never understood the scorn she gets here. I like all the Dateline correspondents.