S01.E10: This Is Not Your Heaven

[CountryGirl]

Release Date: February 27, 2022

James and Margaret face a heavy decision. Shea and Thomas take bold action to help one of their own.

[CountryGirl]

Well, that was a very depressing season finale to end a really depressing season. With the exception of Thomas and Noemi reaching the Willamette Valley, that is.

I'm one of the few that wanted to see Elsa make it, not that it would have been at all realistic. James holding her while she died was gut-wrenching.

I liked Elsa's version of heaven being that she was reunited with Sam and it was just the two of them riding on the open prairie.

I was hoping we would see Shea in S2, but I guess his story arc was done since he finally reached the ocean.

I was a little surprised we didn't see James, Margaret, and John in the one-year later flash forward. 

I will definitely be in for S2. 

[MzLiz]

Ditto to all countrygirl said.

I couldn’t believe no look at the Duttons one year later. I guess that’s the story for the fall. Looks like Tim McGraw and Faith Hill are the only ones left to be able to come back (well and their boy John). Season 2 can hardly compete I would think. But I’ll be back in the fall (because Tim and Faith killed it this season). But…

That was seriously depressing. I bawled my eyes out. the series didn’t need to be quite so cutthroat. I have no desire to see the episode again. 

Wow, literally only Neomi & Thomas got a happy ending. Of the entire cast of characters. 

The scenes between Elsa and her Daddy. Some powerful stuff. 

Off to find some happy movie to wash to taste out. And cancel Paramount plus until the fall. Oy..

 

 

[NeenerNeener]

I guess I'm in for season 2 as well, since the wagon train part is over. Based on the end of the episode Josef stayed in Montana but Thomas, Noemi and her kids actually made it all the way to Oregon. The rest of the wagon train was wiped out by bandits, and Shea made it to the ocean. I question the hummingbird that close to the water, since, you know, no flowers in the vicinity. 

[LilaFowler]

I am new to the entire saga and wanted to finish this series before (finally) starting to watch Yellowstone. My god, what a grim ride that was. I was starting to get annoyed with Elsa, or maybe just the actress playing her, but I still shed tears when she died. Sam Elliott was my MVP, he is such a quality actor.

[aqusdealer]

I must say that I was disappointed with the last few episodes of the show and definitely this finale. It seems like they wasted at least two to three episodes getting to the end and then they just cut a major portion out of what I was looking forward to seeing. First, Elsa doean't make it, okay, that was a very real possibility....but then *boom* fast forward and we're in Oregon a year later and Sam  Elliot fulfills his wishes at the beach. There was so much more they could have done in place of the boring episodes to make the end better. I don't feel there was any closure to Elsa's death. I would have liked to see her mother arrive at the new homestead. I would have liked to have seen a true arrival in Oregon of the settlers and some setup. As a viewer, I felt cheated. Sort of like when the season finale of the Sopranos just faded to black. I doubt I'll watch a second season if they go there.

[toodywoody]

So is the tree the same one that John was talking about in Yellowstone? Or am I reaching?

[Haleth]

Well, that was depressing. Beautifully acted but grim as hell. 

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

I was hoping we would see Shea in S2, but I guess his story arc was done since he finally reached the ocean.

Plus he shot himself.

I also am disappointed we didn’t get a glimpse of the Duttons one year later. 

[North of Eden]

Very confusing where Joseph was and what he was doing with that wood at the end.

So all all the Pioneers amounted to little more than the LOST Red Shirts that cashed out on Oceanic Flight 815 and Ajira Airways 316. I guess the  ones Sam Elliot exiled around episode 3 got the last laugh by living.

In all seriousness...dissapointed in Killing of Elsa....she's the focal point of the whole show and I wanted a happy ending with Sam...that was real. I still look forward to season 2 but it won't be the same show without her.

[Rorysmom]

15 minutes ago, North of Eden said:

Very confusing where Joseph was and what he was doing with that wood at the end.

So all all the Pioneers amounted to little more than the LOST Red Shirts that cashed out on Oceanic Flight 815 and Ajira Airways 316. I guess the  ones Sam Elliot exiled around episode 3 got the last laugh by living.

In all seriousness...dissapointed in Killing of Elsa....she's the focal point of the whole show and I wanted a happy ending with Sam...that was real. I still look forward to season 2 but it won't be the same show without her.

He was staking his plot of land. Hopefully, he gets some help building on it! 

Edited February 28, 2022 by Rorysmom

[sashabear21]

So is Ennis hanging out in cowboy heaven waiting around all, “What the hell? Seriously, what the hell!” I guess now that we know the Dutton story we’ll get a monologue from Beth next season all, “this ranch was built on the bones of a dead woman! She was childless like me!!”. I’m glad Thomas and Noemi made it through. I need more shows with Sam Elliot, his goodbye with Elsa just damn near broke me. 

[blackwing]

So depressing.  I was so sick of Elsa and wanted her to die, but this episode she was much less irritating, since she was no longer being presented as this warrior woman that can do anything. 

With 10 minutes to go I was convinced she was going to make a miraculous recovery.  As the father of a young daughter myself, I was broken when watching Tim McGraw’s grief.  And Faith Hill’s refusal to accept that all of it was happening.

The skeptic in me says that we didn’t actually see Elsa in the ground.  I was surprised that we didn’t get to see the Duttons on their new land.  I would not at all be surprised if (despite the strong insinuation that she is in heaven, and in her heaven she is with Sam… even though Sam shouldn’t be in heaven since he is probably alive?) she comes back next season.  Those scenes were in real life, she made it back to Sam, he is her heaven on earth?

Poor Josef.  His wife dies and he is all alone somewhere with one leg.  I would have thought he would stay on with James and work with/for him.  How does he build a house with only one leg?

Thomas and Nomi make it to Oregon.  Shea makes it to the ocean, sees a hummingbird which he seemed to take as the spirit of his dead wife, and kills himself. 
 

So I guess in Season 2 almost none of the actors seem like they would return except the three Duttons?

I would have loved to have seen a scene of the Duttons one year later, Elsa’s grave at the tree, and then a fade into a scene of modern times of Beth or John looking at Elsa’s grave.

[loki310]

I liked the ending, more or less. Was glad Elsa died as there no way she could have survived an arrow wound like that on the frontier. Plus we got to see some heart rending acting from the leads as they said goodbye. As a sort of new mom to a toddler, those scenes gutted me. 
 

I liked the Crow healing rituals and beautiful outfits. I really appreciated all the native representation here and would have loved to seen even more. I will miss seeing the story of the immigrants next season and was sad that none of them made it. You’d think after all they had been through they would have stuck with the guides, but oh well I guess not. 
 

I also wondered about Ennis, but I assume Heaven is a multiverse and in his version he and Elsa are roping cattle. And speaking of cowboys, I was sad when they parted ways from the group. I’m realizing that I pretty much liked all the characters in this show, once Elsa was doomed. 
 

one last thing - I really liked the dialogue between everyone… Elsa’s soliloquies got a little tiresome for me, but the dialogue between the characters was great and the actors really sold it. 

[Affogato]

first season starts with Elsa’s death and it takes all season to actually get there. The second season may well have Shea and show how he gets to the ocean. 

Edited February 28, 2022 by Affogato

[sadie]

I loved all of this! Sad we only got 10 eps and now have to wait.

I thought Elsa dying fit, they couldn’t have the Duttons be the only ones that didn’t lose anything from the journey. I cried like a baby. I liked Elsa and I’m sorry we won’t see more of her. Tim and Faith killed it in these roles, I am happy to look forward to their story. I want more Sam Elliot, he was the best part of all of this.

I will say it was a depressing show, beautiful but heartbreaking. How this country ever got settled is a miracle. I wouldn’t have lasted a day. I thought mostly all the settlers dying was just a gut punch but once they separated from the people who knew what they were doing you knew they were doomed. 
 

I do wonder how accurate the whole Indian guy telling Dutton “yea just go over that hill and take a left and it’s all yours”? Did any Native Americans really so easily hand over their land to white men? Nit picks aside, great show, what a ride! 

[The Pretender]

I saw this episode yesterday and was gutted the entire evening. It's been a while since I cried that hard in front of the TV (I'd like to think, or 'like' is the wrong word, but all awful things happening in Ukraine right now probably meant I needed an outlet like this to just cry my heart out for a while) 

I'll miss Elsa. I just feel like her baby brother didn't get enough time with her to get the full impact of her as a person & her life & death, and it will be him that carries the legacy on. But perhaps the gravestone and his parents mourning will be that impact!? I too missed seeing the Duttons 'one year later' but it's really nitpicking as the show has been awesome throughout. 

As in Yellowstone I really enjoy seeing the Native americans and their customs and rituals. As I follow Mo Plenty I do trust Sheridan does his history lessons when it comes to this. I really like that we got to hear what was actually said & promised to, & by, James Dutton when he was offered the land. It sheds a lot of light to Yellowstone now and what rights John Dutton really has to the land. I'd be on the side that the verbal contract should rule. 

It was so sad to see Risa die as well and leaving Josef without both a wife and a leg. But he got land and a house... (that will be built in about 10 years at that pace). I also hope he stayed somewhere near the Duttons and that we will perhaps see him in season 2. 

Nice to see at least Thomas, Noemi and the boys settling down and hopefully living a nice and prosperous life. 

I hoped Shea would find a reason to live just so we could have Sam Elliott in season 2 but at least he got to be 75 and see the ocean I guess... I'm intrigued on where season 2 will go. Will we enter just one year later or will it be about ten years later where we see James Dutton get shot and die(?) on the porch? So many questions so much time until we'll get the answers ugh 

[CountryGirl]

11 hours ago, Haleth said:

Well, that was depressing. Beautifully acted but grim as hell. 

Plus he shot himself.

I also am disappointed we didn’t get a glimpse of the Duttons one year later. 

I wish they would have shown Shea continuing to sit on the beach and leave it to our imagination what happened next. Or even that he sees a young girl far down the beach, standing near the shoreline several feet away from her family who are picnicking on the beach. She reminds him of his daughter and surrogate daughter Elsa and he thinks “okay, one more day” which becomes another and another. 

Then a scene of Margaret talking to someone about her day and the camera pulls back to show her next to Elsa’s grave, pulling a few weeds, and as she talks to her, you see their cabin in the distance, James in the paddock with the horses, Elsa’s among them, with John there, too, who waves at his mother and she smiles through her tears. 

[kaoz]

OMG!  We still have Episode 11 to go - to tie some loose ends together... But OMG!  I don't know if I can take anymore...

This Series just mule-kicks you in the head from the first episode, and then horse-drags your emotions through the briars, sagebrush, and gravel until it rips out your heart and does a dance on your face.  I'm a full grown man, and I cried so hard when Ennis got killed and Elsa killed the killer then crumbled down beside him on the ground.  Now I'm trying to write this... Dammit!  You know, If 'Yellowstone' and '1883' don't literally sweep the SAG Awards, Golden Globes, Emmy Awards, and Oscars, then Hokkywood and our entire entertainment media establishment has become so corrupted and is so decadent with frivolous 'social justice' issues that they cannot see the forest because of the buttercups.  They are worthless as any kind of reference to excellence in the performing arts. (Like the Pulitzer prize becoming a mutual pat on the back for propagandizing the biggest political hoax in our nation's history.)

In both Yellowstone and 1883, every scene; every frame of every scene; every nuance of every interaction within every scene; is breathtaking... a literal work of art.  The character portrayals are nothing short of phenomenal... And the cinematography, so integral to the impact of the story, reaches a level of mastery that I have never witnessed before... with the exception perhaps being 1990's 'Dances With Wolves', which is another American Epic fraught with the joy and sorrow of our nation's creation.

The primary thesis I gleaned from '1883" so far, as so eloquently stated by Elsa's narrative during her death's journey in Episode 10, remains the same today: "To survive the frontier, you must learn to recognize those who won't and be weary of their doomed decisions.  They are to be avoided at all costs - because their fear is tragedy's closest cousin.  And tragedy is contagious in this place."

All you have to do is substitute the concept "today's world" for "the frontier" then zoom-out to 50-thousand-feet and really examine what's happening today... right now... even as we speak.

Much more of this, and I'm going to need a full-on emotional support group.

[blackwing]

3 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

I wish they would have shown Shea continuing to sit on the beach and leave it to our imagination what happened next. Or even that he sees a young girl far down the beach, standing near the shoreline several feet away from her family who are picnicking on the beach. She reminds him of his daughter and surrogate daughter Elsa and he thinks “okay, one more day” which becomes another and another. 

Then a scene of Margaret talking to someone about her day and the camera pulls back to show her next to Elsa’s grave, pulling a few weeds, and as she talks to her, you see their cabin in the distance, James in the paddock with the horses, Elsa’s among them, with John there, too, who waves at his mother and she smiles through her tears. 

Yes, I agree that these scenes would have added a lot.  I found an article online which talks a little bit about this episode:  https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/1883-finale-producer-interview-death-1235100345/

It seems that Taylor Sheridan writes the entire script at once... he doesn't go along and tweak/change things in future episodes as they go and shoot the episodes in order.  He knew each character's fate from the beginning, and nothing got changed to do a last minute save of Elsa and/or Shea.

It did seem to me that the last few scenes were intended to be a series finale, the Duttons reached Montana, Shea reached the coastline, Thomas got his life with Noemi.  But then the series got renewed for a second season so we will get more of the Duttons.

I do think it is interesting that they say that the upcoming "1932" series was intended to kind of be sort of like a second season of "1883", a continuation of the Dutton storyline.  If we look at the purpose of "1883", it really was to lay the groundwork and foundation for the modern Duttons of "Yellowstone".  The Crow chief being so kind to James and his family and telling him where to go to settle and make a home.  James telling the chief that his people will always be welcome on his land.  The chief telling him they will be back and reclaim the land one day.

So really, the "1883" story was complete and there probably wasn't a need to continue.  From Sheridan's perspective, he was done with these characters, and he didn't feel the need to explore anymore about what happens to James and Margaret.  As a viewer, all we need to know is that they survived and their descendants begat the modern day Duttons.  However, I for one am glad that there will be a second season.  I am eager to see more of James and Margaret.

It's too bad we won't see more of Sam Elliott, but really, what was he going to do in Montana?  Act as foreman on James' ranch?  He's already 75.

Now watch Taylor Sheridan want to hang on to these actors and decide to bring them back.  Shea only grazed himself in the head, someone came along and rescues him.  Margaret comes across a young barmaid in the saloon who is a dead ringer for her dead daughter Elsa.  

If there is a narrator and voiceovers next season, I hope it is Margaret and not young John.  I'm also curious as to how much of a time leap we are going to have.  Ten years to get us to 1893 as already depicted in "Yellowstone" last season?

[aqusdealer]

4 hours ago, sadie said:

I do wonder how accurate the whole Indian guy telling Dutton “yea just go over that hill and take a left and it’s all yours”? Did any Native Americans really so easily hand over their land to white men?

I swear the Indian guy had a bit of a Brooklyn accent.

Edited February 28, 2022 by aqusdealer

[blackwing]

22 minutes ago, aqusdealer said:

I swear the Indian guy had a bit of a Brooklyn accent.

Yes.  All of the Native Americans depicted on the show this season who spoke English all spoke perfect English with little to no accent, which seems a bit unrealistic for the time period.  I guess the showrunners didn't want to be accused of being racist or stereotyping.  But this particular guy was the strangest... he was using colloquialisms and expressions that I don't think a Native American in 1883 would have been familiar with.

[JayDub1987]

Wow! What an episode. My wife and I were absolutely gutted. I turned my parents onto this show on Saturday, and they both binge watched all 9 episodes on Saturday before watching that one. They loved it as much as we did. 

[CountryGirl]

The man who played the Crow who made the verbal bargain with James Dutton was Canadian (Oneida) actor Graham Greene. You might have seen him as Kicking Bird in a little movie starring Kevin Costner (aka present-day John Dutton), Dances With Wolves. 

[The Pretender]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

The man who played the Crow who made the verbal bargain with James Dutton was Canadian (Oneida) actor Graham Greene. You might have seen him as Kicking Bird in a little movie starring Kevin Costner (aka present-day John Dutton), Dances With Wolves. 

Oh yes I forgot to mention Graham. I love him, phenomenal actor. He wasn't listed in the episode over at IMDB in advance (or even now from what I can see) but it was such a nice surprise to see him. I think I saw him last in Wind River and before that in Defiance. I actually thought about picking up Goliat again so I could watch Graham but I never got around to do it (Maria Bello was what pulled me in and when she left I did as well). Taylor really has good pull on awesome actors, although I believe it was McGraw & Hill who pulled in Hanks & Wilson. 

[Haleth]

2 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

The man who played the Crow who made the verbal bargain with James Dutton was Canadian (Oneida) actor Graham Greene. You might have seen him as Kicking Bird in a little movie starring Kevin Costner (aka present-day John Dutton), Dances With Wolves. 

I love Graham Greene and was thrilled to see him. The episode already had a bit of a Dances with Wolves feel to it (for example, the ineffective fort) so it was nice to have Greene in the cast. 

[mojoween]

Elsa said that stars die but would a girl who doesn’t seem to have much schooling in 1883 have known that?

This episode was grim but very moving.

Also super gross because the knife noises when Thomas was liberating Josef of his leg was way too much for me.

[mythoughtis]

I couldn’t tell where Josef settled at.  It looked more like Montana than the Oregon scenery.   I’d like to see him next season.    It’s so sad that only 4 of the immigrants made it to the end.   Wonder if the attrition rate was that high on every wagon train  in reality?  
Would have  liked to see Wade stay on with James, keeping the cattle.  Don’t care about new cowhand. Maybe Wade is part of the origin story for 6666.  
Did enjoy the tie ins to Yellowstone this episode- Elsa picking her grave.  The bird showing up there when she died- all tied into Lee’s actual gravesite.  
The 7 generation comment.  James being 1 and Tate being 7.  Which means James is John’s , great great grandfather. Not his great grandfather as others have said.  This signifies that Tate most likely marry a Native American and the land will go back to them that way / or Tate loses the land to the Native Americans somehow. 
James letting the elder Native  American be buried on his land and giving them a heifer in 1893. 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2022 by mythoughtis

[NeenerNeener]

1 hour ago, mythoughtis said:

couldn’t tell where Josef settled at.  It looked more like Montana than the Oregon scenery.

I assumed he stayed in Montana because they didn't say he was in Oregon, like they did with Noemi and Thomas. At least, I didn't see a place title like Noemi got.

[mythoughtis]

33 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

I assumed he stayed in Montana because they didn't say he was in Oregon, like they did with Noemi and Thomas. At least, I didn't see a place title like Noemi got.

That was my thought.  But he wouldn’t of had to wait so long( ( screen says one year later)  to stake his claim if it was Montana.  Actually it shouldn’t have taken a year for Thomas and Noemi to get to Oregon either.  Surely Late spring  - so 6-7 months? 

[mythoughtis]

Season 2 is not season 2- it’s a whole new century 

https://tvline.com/2022/02/28/1883-season-2-ending-limited-series-finale-over/

[Badger]

5 hours ago, Haleth said:

I love Graham Greene and was thrilled to see him. The episode already had a bit of a Dances with Wolves feel to it (for example, the ineffective fort) so it was nice to have Greene in the cast. 

He was also in "The Green Mile."  He played the prisoner who asked Tom Hanks if someone truly repented of his crime would he be allowed to go back to the time he was happiest to which Tom Hanks said he believed that to be true.  Graham Greene said the time he was happiest was when he was first married to his first wife when they were teenagers and they would spend hours talking by the firelight.  According to him, she was "bare breasted" so I'm assuming they did other things too.

[ShortyMac]

14 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

I wish they would have shown Shea continuing to sit on the beach and leave it to our imagination what happened next. Or even that he sees a young girl far down the beach, standing near the shoreline several feet away from her family who are picnicking on the beach. She reminds him of his daughter and surrogate daughter Elsa and he thinks “okay, one more day” which becomes another and another. 

Then a scene of Margaret talking to someone about her day and the camera pulls back to show her next to Elsa’s grave, pulling a few weeds, and as she talks to her, you see their cabin in the distance, James in the paddock with the horses, Elsa’s among them, with John there, too, who waves at his mother and she smiles through her tears. 

I thought the finale, and this series was outstanding.

I just wish that we would have had a final scene with Margaret and Elsa.

[LadyIrony]

I might check in for S2 after all (edit: just read no S2), although I have a feeling Elsa will plague us throughout as some kind of Angel that no one will ever live up to. 

I did some reading on the Oregon trail and by 1883 there should have been some rail so I am confused as to why they are making the trek by wagon. It was still a decent series but Sheridan needs to take his hand off it when writing female characters, they all seem to be hot headed super women with him. Although I haven't watched anything else he has done asides from Yellowstone which has modern Elsa in the form of Beth.

And if it were my loved one I would be taken her to the fort doctor. You just let her die, no fight, no trying?!

Edited March 1, 2022 by LadyIrony

[blackwing]

11 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Season 2 is not season 2- it’s a whole new century 

https://tvline.com/2022/02/28/1883-season-2-ending-limited-series-finale-over/

Hmmm, that's not the same as what was previously announced.  They announced both "1932" as well as "additional episodes" of "1883".  While they stopped short of saying there would be a second season, the previous announcement did make it clear that "1932" and the "additional episodes" were two distinct things.

I suppose they could claim that when they said "additional episodes" they meant "1932", but to me that would not be additional episodes of "1883" since they wouldn't involve the same time period or characters.

I will be disappointed if we don't get more of this show, I want to see how James and Margaret get the ranch started.  If Paramount wants to give Sheridan more money, I don't see why he would turn it down.  I know he seems very invested in this "6666" show but I vow not to watch that one.

[NeenerNeener]

2 hours ago, blackwing said:

I know he seems very invested in this "6666" show but I vow not to watch that one.

But if you don't watch how will he pay the mortgage on the actual 6666 ranch? He owns it.

I think the thing I'm most curious about is that flashback we saw during Yellowstone, when James was shot and collapsed at the kitchen door. Did he die? How did Margaret fare as a widow running a ranch if he did?

Edited March 1, 2022 by NeenerNeener

[blackwing]

11 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

But if you don't watch how will he pay the mortgage on the actual 6666 ranch? He owns it.

I think the thing I'm most curious about is that flashback we saw during Yellowstone, when James was shot and collapsed at the kitchen door. Did he die? How did Margaret fare as a widow running a ranch if he did?

If he kills Jimmy in the first episode a la

Spoiler

Kyle Chandler

then I MAY consider watching hahaha.  But the Jimmy actor seemingly has naked pictures of Taylor Sheridan schtooping a camel, so I am sure we are stuck with Jimmy for all time.

I too am curious about that flashback, and I will feel cheated if we don't get to see more of this story play out.

[mythoughtis]

3 hours ago, blackwing said:

Hmmm, that's not the same as what was previously announced.  They announced both "1932" as well as "additional episodes" of "1883".  While they stopped short of saying there would be a second season, the previous announcement did make it clear that "1932" and the "additional episodes" were two distinct things.

I suppose they could claim that when they said "additional episodes" they meant "1932", but to me that would not be additional episodes of "1883" since they wouldn't involve the same time period or characters.

I will be disappointed if we don't get more of this show, I want to see how James and Margaret get the ranch started.  If Paramount wants to give Sheridan more money, I don't see why he would turn it down.  I know he seems very invested in this "6666" show but I vow not to watch that one.

A different article stated that they will have a few episodes to bridge the time between 1883 and 1932.  So my guess would be an episode per generation.  You know, John gets married, his son gets married.  And then bam, we are at 1932

[ShortyMac]

4 hours ago, blackwing said:

Hmmm, that's not the same as what was previously announced.  They announced both "1932" as well as "additional episodes" of "1883".  While they stopped short of saying there would be a second season, the previous announcement did make it clear that "1932" and the "additional episodes" were two distinct things.

I suppose they could claim that when they said "additional episodes" they meant "1932", but to me that would not be additional episodes of "1883" since they wouldn't involve the same time period or characters.

I will be disappointed if we don't get more of this show, I want to see how James and Margaret get the ranch started.  If Paramount wants to give Sheridan more money, I don't see why he would turn it down.  I know he seems very invested in this "6666" show but I vow not to watch that one.

We are getting more episodes of 1883, as a bridge to 1932. It is a continuation of Season 1. This is so they don’t have to redo contract negotiations for a Season 2/increase salaries. All of the cast only signed on for one season. 

[LadyIrony]

4 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

But if you don't watch how will he pay the mortgage on the actual 6666 ranch? He owns it.

I think the thing I'm most curious about is that flashback we saw during Yellowstone, when James was shot and collapsed at the kitchen door. Did he die? How did Margaret fare as a widow running a ranch if he did?

Lol that’s part of the reason I won’t watch it! It feels like a desperate tax write off instead of a genuine creative project.

6666 as a ranch has none of the charm of Yellowstone. 
 

@blackwing that would explain why Jimmy was chosen to spearhead the 6666 crossover. As an actor he seems capable enough but the character is nothing special. 
 

then again maybe Sheridan wants it to fail quickly?! 

[mythoughtis]

The actor who plays Jimmy appeared to be the ‘host’ of the Stories from the Bunkhouse trailers on on Demand. So he definitely had somebody’s ear.  

[Artsda]

It was a really good although sad ending. Just to see the amount who made it to Oregon alone. 

All the deaths and especially Elsa. 

It was a great series.

[Affogato]

The free sex and marrying a native American and so on is a bit much and unbelievable, but it might have been interesting to have Elsa try to deal with the customs and prejudices of a small town/ranch after having developed a taste for freedom on the trail. I think it was a lost opportunity. Most Westerns are fantasies where men, usually white men, have the power, the control, the freedom and the last word. Honestly, With Elsa and Thomas and the immigrants they could have told a slightly different tale.

[Affogato]

On 3/1/2022 at 2:22 AM, LadyIrony said:

And if it were my loved one I would be taken her to the fort doctor. You just let her die, no fight, no trying?!

I think since Margaret had worked as a war nurse and James as a soldier they had encountered a lot of the current to them surgical practices and outcomes. I did read an article about arrow wounds and perhaps they could have opened her up and cleaned the wound, and maybe you can chop off a chunk of liver and have people survive--I mean, liver transplants--but I don't know if survival would have been likely. In any case, I see their point and I see they spoke from experience.

Edited March 10, 2022 by Affogato

[LadyIrony]

4 hours ago, Affogato said:

I think since Margaret had worked as a war nurse and James as a soldier they had encountered a lot of the current to them surgical practices and outcomes. I did read an article about arrow wounds and perhaps they could have opened her up and cleaned the wound, and maybe you can chop off a chunk of liver and have people survive--I mean, liver transplants--but I don't know if survival would have been likely. In any case, I see their point and I see they spoke from experience.

I think I would still do all I could to try and save my loved one. It would be better than just allowing them to die without a fight. 

[mythoughtis]

2 hours ago, LadyIrony said:

I think I would still do all I could to try and save my loved one. It would be better than just allowing them to die without a fight. 

They looked at it as 100% she would not survive even  with surgery.  Their choice was to let her enjoy her last few days or to have  another week of life laying in bed.  Compare it to today… if your loved one has cancer and can either live 3 months on their own terms relatively good every day or 5 months with chemo and radiation, but too sick to move… which do you choose? 

[LadyIrony]

18 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

They looked at it as 100% she would not survive even  with surgery.  Their choice was to let her enjoy her last few days or to have  another week of life laying in bed.  Compare it to today… if your loved one has cancer and can either live 3 months on their own terms relatively good every day or 5 months with chemo and radiation, but too sick to move… which do you choose? 

I personally would still fight if I were the patient. Where there is life there is hope.

Edited March 11, 2022 by LadyIrony

[millennium]

Graham Greene was great as Leonard the Native American doctor on Northern Exposure.   That's the character he reminded me of most in this episode.

Elsa's death would have been tragic had she been a more likeable, more sympathetic character.  But she was an entitled brat who sucked up all the oxygen not only in her own family but among the entire wagon train.   I don't know how she's narrating from the afterlife but whatever.

I took the hummingbird who visited Shea on the beach to be Elsa, not his dead wife.   Elsa said to him, "I'll see you on the beach."

I feel Faith Hill got robbed in this last episode.   Her character deserved more interaction with dying Elsa.  Instead it was a whole "Daddy's girl" thing (and maybe being a daddy's girl was Elsa's problem from the very start).   Her mother, who carried her and gave birth to her, was relegated to being just an observer of her daughter's final days.   And the little brother?  Back in the foot locker, kid.

I really wanted to see the wagon train make the trip to Oregon, even if it took two seasons to get there.

 

Edited March 21, 2022 by millennium

[millennium]

On 2/27/2022 at 7:44 PM, CountryGirl said:

I was hoping we would see Shea in S2, but I guess his story arc was done since he finally reached the ocean.
 

I will never (hopefully) understand the kind of despair that drives people to suicide.   For that reason I never judge them, either.

It just seems sad to me that Shea had to stand by helplessly and watch Elsa, a girl who would have given anything to live, die before her time, and then, with Elsa virtually the last thing he thinks of (the hummingbird), he cuts short his own time on earth.   Shea's journey to the ocean was on behalf of his dead wife -- she couldn't make the trip so he was going to do it for her, a task he completed.   If I had written the story, I might have given Shea a new mission the moment he saw the hummingbird -- he puts down the gun and says, you can't live, Elsa, so I'm going to keep on living for you.  

Maybe I'm just too sappy, lol. 

[seth]

We've been binging 1883 and loving it - I actually remarked (to wife & friends) that the only series that comes close in intensity and pure 'wallop' of each episode was Game of Thrones.

One nagging incredulity since Episode 1:
The obstacles for any 2,000 mile journey across the plains - weather, bandits, Native tribes, too much water (wide, deep rivers,) too little water, etc. - virtually guarantee futility ending in death, long before you reach the destination.

I can understand why Shea is willing to do it - he's already half-dead due to the War and his family deaths.
I can understand why the Europeans want to try anyway - any possibility is better than the repression they fled from.
But was it ever clearly explained what the Duttons were running away from in Tennessee? That was so awful, risking near-certain death on the trail was worth it?

James Dutton presents as a savvy, seasoned land journeyer (he was a War captain, too.) Clearly, he would know the terrible odds of completing the journey alive. Originally, he was going to just collect his family and go alone, minus all that extra manpower and gun-power that came with signing on with the wagon train...which would have made his chances of actually making it even more remote. He knew that. He was smart.

We find ourselves asking over & over, what was so terrible about their lives in Tennessee that he would choose near-certain death for most/all family members on the trail, over a family where everyone was still alive, even if having a crummy life in Tennessee? Was this ever made clear. If so, I missed it.

 

 

Edited April 19, 2022 by seth

[racked]

I’m late to the party but I just finished the series and was hoping for a second season focusing on the Dutton’s setting up their ranch, which it sounds like is not happening? I enjoyed the scenery and some of the trek but the focus on Elsa’s romances was a bit boring. Of the romances, Thomas and Nono were more interesting.