S11.E02: Acheron: Part 2

[raven]

Quote

The group discovers a member did not make it to safety inside the subway car. All eyes are on Negan as the rule of survival shifts. Meanwhile, Daryl is in his own intense hellish situation trying to find Dog and finding more than he expected; and Yumiko challenges the process at the Commonwealth outpost, which threatens her future and that of Eugene, Ezekiel, and Princess.

NOTE:  AMC+ will stream each episode a week before airing on AMC.  Enter this topic at your own risk if you haven't watched yet.

AMC+ airdate: 2021.08.22  AMC airdate: 2021.08.29

Be mindful if you participate in the Live Posting Topic - that topic will follow the show as it airs on AMC, so AMC+ viewers will be one episode ahead.  DO NOT SPOIL those who are watching on AMC.

 

[OoohMaggie]

I never thought I’d be more interested in what Princess and the Stormtroopers got up to, rather than all the hacking and slashing going on ‘down in the tube station at midnight’

They really were trying to ramp up the tension and excitement, sadly continuing with those Oh! Please, silly moments so abused in Ep1. The one person actually believing Maggie died must have been mightily relieved, her anger at being left by Negan was only matched by the speed at which she decided poor old Gage was to be left to his fate. 
All that ammunition wasted in the train carriage, they seemed to enter panic mode again, thank heavens for Daryl going all John Wick, although he should have used a pencil.

An Avenue of hanging corpses obviously isn’t enough to stop them standing there in a big bunch looking gormless, it’s a shame they didn’t save any ammo for the real threat 🙄

Hurrah! the group are finally through processing,I admit I can’t wait to delve a bit deeper into the Commonwealth, I so hope they somehow manage to make it interesting and enjoyable, as I’m finding it a struggle to get excited about yet another bunch of bloodthirsty, ruthless villains.

We’re finally in the Commonwealth and out of the Subway, Dog and Maggie are alive, the season starts now 😋

Edited August 23, 2021 by OoohMaggie

[Mr. Sparkle]

1 hour ago, OoohMaggie said:

The one person actually believing Maggie died must have been mightily relieved, her anger at being left by Negan was only matched by the speed at which she decided poor old Gage was to be left to his fate. 

THANKS FOR SPOILING IT!!! 

Interestingly (not really, but...) Angela Kang spoiled it yesterday on Talking Dead when she said something about Negan and Maggie. Fool me once... 

[raven]

3 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

The one person actually believing Maggie died must have been mightily relieved, her anger at being left by Negan was only matched by the speed at which she decided poor old Gage was to be left to his fate. 
All that ammunition wasted in the train carriage, they seemed to enter panic mode again, thank heavens for Daryl going all John Wick, although he should have used a pencil.

That was sooo heavy handed.  Maggie's facing the same decision that Negan did!!!  ooooh  /saracasm

As for Daryl, they just need to break out some more heroic music every time he's around.  Though I have to say, I found his and Dog's adventures interesting, with the cave painting and note on the money.

Eugene's a virgin!!!  We should have had a poll.

[heisenberg]

5 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

I never thought I’d be more interested in what Princess and the Stormtroopers got up to, rather than all the hacking and slashing going on ‘down in the tube station at midnight’

I am, but only because I have read the comics. 

Anyway,  The metro part is all non-sense.  They could all have done what Maggie did. 

When the guy was knocking on the door:  "Crawl under and pass by the floor trap!"... 

When they were all trying to get out: "Pass by the floor trap and crawl under!"...

But then there is no episode left.😐

Edited August 24, 2021 by heisenberg

[Mr. Sparkle]

That was actually a decent episode, logic aside. It had some suspense, and the plot moved forward. I'm not that psyched for the inevitable drawn-out battle with this new group of baddies. 

[OoohMaggie]

On 8/24/2021 at 2:41 AM, heisenberg said:

But then there is no episode left.😐

Unfortunately people using common sense would sound the death knell of the show, the writers have  painted themselves into so many corners over the years they’ve forgot where they’re up to, what happened to covering yourself in Walker blood and just strolling leisurely out of danger or don’t they teach that to newbies?

[OoohMaggie]

On 8/23/2021 at 10:24 PM, Superclam said:

THANKS FOR SPOILING IT!!! 

I feel bad about all the money they so obviously spent on making that scene so convincing 💰🤧

Edited August 27, 2021 by OoohMaggie

[Mr. Sparkle]

I actually got it wrong, I thought they would milk that for 2 episodes at least until the big Maggie reveal at the end. 

[OoohMaggie]

No thread for episode 3 yet 😮

[Colorado David]

2 minutes ago, OoohMaggie said:

No thread for episode 3 yet 😮

yeah, what the heck....one of the mods needs to jump on it :) 

[raven]

44 minutes ago, OoohMaggie said:

No thread for episode 3 yet 😮

 

41 minutes ago, Colorado David said:

yeah, what the heck....one of the mods needs to jump on it :) 

We're busy!!!

[Colorado David]

14 minutes ago, raven said:

 

We're busy!!!

ah ok, i get that. we will try to be more patient.

[raven]

19 minutes ago, Colorado David said:

ah ok, i get that. we will try to be more patient.

I did make it 🙃

 

[GustavMahler]

I guess the last movie the old man with the shopping cart saw was BOXING HELENA. It never occurred to me that this movie was actually a survivalist guide.. 

[xaxat]

I laughed my ass off when they dropped into the subway car and there were two walkers just waiting (forever) for the train to start rolling again. As a one time resident of Alexandria, I definitely had commutes that felt like that.

Did we really need two scenes were Maggie talked about losing her humanity? Also, I don't remember her being in the X Files episode Home.

So we have a new faction. You know who I would really like to see? The Baseball Furies from the movie The Warriors.

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by xaxat

[TattleTeeny]

7 hours ago, GustavMahler said:

I guess the last movie the old man with the shopping cart saw was BOXING HELENA. It never occurred to me that this movie was actually a survivalist guide.. 

I was thinking X Files a little bit, with some Ariel Castro thrown in.

ETA: Haha, I replied before I saw your post, @xaxat! Thank you for accompanying me in the dark place I call my brain!

Edited August 30, 2021 by TattleTeeny

[Madding crowd]

Hate Maggie speechifying as much as Negan. Honestly I know these people have been through a lot but if you have such a jaded sense of humanity why stay alive? Not sure I feel any great love that Maggie has for her son; she would rather leave him with whoever and be a “leader”. Happy that Eugene met his radio love even though I always feel like slapping him when he starts blubbering. 

[madmax]

I don't care about Maggie anymore.  I did, but not anymore.  Why is everyone looking to her to lead them?  Didn't she disappear on them for years?  But oh, no, she's Maggie, let's let her make all decisions, even stupid ones!  She gave Negan shit for not saving her from having to crawl under the dumpstertrain, but she left Gage to die when there was PLENTY of time to open that door, pull him in and close it back up.  Maggie's hulking flunky could have pulled up a seat and wedged the door closed like the other one was.

A grenade?  Seriously?  All Daryl did was blow up one zombie brain and paint the walls with a bunch of blood and guts.  The zombie heads are still ready to snack on anybody that walks by.

How did Ponyboy get so hurt if he wasn't bit?

I actually liked the Commonwealth storyline better and I'm not fans of any of those characters.  Stephanie seems a bit hinky to me.

[diebartdie]

Rob Bricken over at io9 is by far my favorite reviewer of this show and I gotta say, I totally agree with him.

Quote

At its base level, the story is just another chance for a “hero” to remind everyone that compassion is a weakness and will get you killed. I’ve talked at length about how much I dislike this, but it’s the final season and I’ve made my peace with it. What sucks is the content of [Maggie's story about the house of horrors], which is so purposefully vile—I’m sorry to repeat myself, it’s the only appropriate word for it— that it’s purely for shock value, and nothing else. The story feels like three horny 16-year-olds came up with it after they saw The Human Centipede or Texas Chainsaw Massacre or something and decided to create something even more reprehensible. I know The Walking Dead has always been a show about murder and death and how awful people can/will be in civilization collapses, but this is about nine bridges too far.

https://gizmodo.com/well-that-was-a-thoroughly-unpleasant-episode-of-the-w-1847570691

[Crashcourse]

I've always thought Lauren Cohan was a bad actress as Maggie, and that monologue last night was awful.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if she and Negan wound up having hate sex.  

[Mr. Sparkle]

1 hour ago, Crashcourse said:

It wouldn't surprise me at all if she and Negan wound up having hate sex

With their socks on??? 

[Nashville]

14 minutes ago, Superclam said:

With their socks on??? 

They could get really kinky and do it with everything on EXCEPT their socks….

[Persnickety1]

Ugh, I was watching Hurricane Ida updates on The Weather Channel and forgot all about this show even being on.  The DVR caught it, so I'll watch it tonight.  Maybe.

I remember the glory days when I would plan an entire watch party around every episode with a special menu and appetizers and drinks.  

Now it's worthy of maybe a few pizza rolls heated in the air fryer.  

And that would be the generic pizza rolls, not the brand name.  

[Colorado David]

42 minutes ago, Persnickety1 said:

I remember the glory days when I would plan an entire watch party around every episode with a special menu and appetizers and drinks.  

 

oh so praying those days return. for me it was Lost. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

1 hour ago, Persnickety1 said:

I remember the glory days when I would plan an entire watch party around every episode with a special menu and appetizers and drinks.  

I remember having to stay off facebook because of the spoilers. And then talking about it the next day at work. Those days are long, long gone. 

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

1 hour ago, Colorado David said:

oh so praying those days return. for me it was Lost. 

Probably why Z Nation kicked so much ass as a Friday night party your ass off show to watch. The Walking Dead jumped the shark years ago. 

[Nashville]

2 hours ago, One4Sorrow2TooBad said:

Probably why Z Nation kicked so much ass as a Friday night party your ass off show to watch. The Walking Dead jumped the shark years ago. 

GOD I miss Z Nation.

[Iguessnot]

So they finally explore the DC metro. They've been in Alexandria Virginia about 10 minutes from DC for about a decade. Oh well.

Still funny to see them looking for packaged food, all of which is older than Judith.

[Ms Lark]

6 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

So they finally explore the DC metro. They've been in Alexandria Virginia about 10 minutes from DC for about a decade. Oh well.

Still funny to see them looking for packaged food, all of which is older than Judith.

Seriously. This has been driving me bonkers. So near and yet so far! BUT, no food allowed on the Metro, so good luck with that!

 

19 hours ago, Crashcourse said:

It wouldn't surprise me at all if she and Negan wound up having hate sex. 

This is my greatest fear, that TIIC are so enamored of Negan that they would go there with Maggie. 🤮

[ctlady]

On 8/23/2021 at 6:54 PM, raven said:

On 8/23/2021 at 3:51 PM, OoohMaggie said:

The one person actually believing Maggie died must have been mightily relieved, her anger at being left by Negan was only matched by the speed at which she decided poor old Gage was to be left to his fate. 
All that ammunition wasted in the train carriage, they seemed to enter panic mode again, thank heavens for Daryl going all John Wick, although he should have used a pencil.

That was sooo heavy handed.  Maggie's facing the same decision that Negan did!!!  ooooh  /saracasm

That's the first thing I said.  Oh, how quickly the tables can turn, Maggie.  I'm surprised Negan didn't call her out on her hypocrisy.  AND they wound up breaking down that door anyway.

 

[Persnickety1]

14 hours ago, Superclam said:

I remember having to stay off facebook because of the spoilers. And then talking about it the next day at work. Those days are long, long gone. 

I remember when AMC spoiled almost everyone by posting Beth's RIP when the episode had only aired on the east coast.  That thread had well over 10K comments on it by pissed off viewers.  

I hate loose ends, so I really want them to find Heath at the Commonwealth.  

[iMonrey]

OK, I get that Yumiko wanted to stay because she wanted to find her brother. But why did everyone stay? Solidarity?? Even Eugene wanted out of there by then. And how did they get back in? Did they get recaptured? What about the soldiers they stole the uniforms from? This entire scenario was yadda yadda yadda'd. 

Plus why in the hell wouldn't the guard just punch her in the face when she marched up to the fence and demanded to see a supervisor?  Like she has any sway or pull around here.

The hardest thing for me to get past is Negan being the new star of the show. And the show has to make Maggie "come around" on him and as I'm watching it happen it's just too big a pill to swallow. I think somehow it would have been easier to accept (or ignore) if Maggie had never come back because that's just way too much of an ask. The guy bashed her husband's brains in right in front of her. Seven years down the line she shouldn't be all "oh well I'm sort of over it now." Nobody should.

[Mr. Sparkle]

21 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

OK, I get that Yumiko wanted to stay because she wanted to find her brother. But why did everyone stay? Solidarity?? Even Eugene wanted out of there by then. And how did they get back in? Did they get recaptured? What about the soldiers they stole the uniforms from? This entire scenario was yadda yadda yadda'd. 

I noticed that. Several days of interrogation, but jump some guards and try to escape and they're like "nah, it's cool."  

[Crashcourse]

16 hours ago, Nashville said:

GOD I miss Z Nation.

The zombie cheese wheel! 😁

[raven]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

The hardest thing for me to get past is Negan being the new star of the show. And the show has to make Maggie "come around" on him and as I'm watching it happen it's just too big a pill to swallow. I think somehow it would have been easier to accept (or ignore) if Maggie had never come back because that's just way too much of an ask. The guy bashed her husband's brains in right in front of her. Seven years down the line she shouldn't be all "oh well I'm sort of over it now." Nobody should.

Exactly how I feel.   She should have put a bullet in his head and kept on walking ages ago but nope.

I was thinking this ep that Darryl actually might have been able to carry the show.  I was very doubtful about it when Andy Lincoln left but I think Reedus is charismatic enough to pull it off.  The problem is that NR and the showrunners are absolutely in love with Darryl stalking/skulking around, looking smelly and dirty, rather than doing anything interesting with him.  Earlier episodes showed more to Darryl's personality but we are stuck with tough guy on a bike with a dog, which isn't the most interesting place to be.                                                                 

[rmontro]

8 hours ago, iMonrey said:

OK, I get that Yumiko wanted to stay because she wanted to find her brother. But why did everyone stay? Solidarity?? 

Maybe they thought Yumiko would be punished for the others escaping.  But she also said that her brother being there and posting on the wall meant that there was some legitimacy to the Commonwealth, which was something they were doubting before.  This would likely give Eugene more hope to meet Stephanie also.

One big shortcut annoyed me.  Since last week I was wondering how Yumiko was going to explain how she knew her brother was there?  Was she going to admit to escaping and seeing the wall, and coming back?  Make up some sort of intricate lie about meeting someone on the road that told her?  But what we got was "I have reason to believe my brother is here" and the interrogators never blinked an eye.  No "Where did you hear that?", nothing.  Just serve her some coffee.

[ctlady]

On 8/31/2021 at 6:13 AM, Ms Lark said:

Still funny to see them looking for packaged food, all of which is older than Judith.

MREs, l believe, can last up to 25 years.

[Nashville]

32 minutes ago, ctlady said:

MREs, l believe, can last up to 25 years.

Better shelf life than most of the cast, at least.

Fun fact: MRE is initial slang of the DoD’s designation for field food rations; it stands for “Meal, Ready to Eat” - which my father always liked saying was either “three lies in one” or “three lies in a row”.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Nashville
Loved my dad

[OoohMaggie]

On 8/31/2021 at 1:20 AM, Superclam said:

I remember having to stay off facebook because of the spoilers. And then talking about it the next day at work. Those days are long, long gone. 

In the good old days, being the poor relations across the Atlantic we had to wait until Monday night to watch the show. I hated spoilers with a passion and thankfully the old AMC forum was spoiler free, oh for the days when that intro music had me genuinely excited 🥰. How did it all go so horribly wrong?  😭

[Nashville]

23 hours ago, Crashcourse said:

The zombie cheese wheel! 😁

Actually, that pic is simply a zombie ball.  My initial intention was to dig up a picture of the ZCW; unfortunately, I could find none which displayed it in all the grandeur and majesty I felt it so richly deserved - so I had to drop back and punt.

This was the closest to a decent ZCW pic I could find:

 

[Ms Lark]

8 hours ago, ctlady said:

On 8/31/2021 at 6:13 AM, Ms Lark said:

Still funny to see them looking for packaged food, all of which is older than Judith.

MREs, l believe, can last up to 25 years.

Except I didn't say that. @IGUESSNOT did.

[wrlord]

8 hours ago, Nashville said:

Actually, that pic is simply a zombie ball.  My initial intention was to dig up a picture of the ZCW; unfortunately, I could find none which displayed it in all the grandeur and majesty I felt it so richly deserved - so I had to drop back and punt.

This was the closest to a decent ZCW pic I could find:

 

I was hoping to see the liberty bell.

[Nashville]

21 hours ago, wrlord said:

I was hoping to see the liberty bell.

If you lick it, it tastes like freedom.

ETA: That’s what I’ve been told, anyway.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Nashville

[iMonrey]

Do we even know what Acheron is, BTW? Did they say but I missed it?

[Ava]

Acheron, in Greek Mythology, was one of the five rivers of the underworld, known as the "river of woe". (Thank you, Google)

[Starchild]

Not sure how they wanted us to feel when we saw the new baddies, but all I could think was "Again?"

Can't we have some other kind of story once in a while in between all the post-apocalyptic death gangs?

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, Starchild said:

Not sure how they wanted us to feel when we saw the new baddies, but all I could think was "Again?"

Can't we have some other kind of story once in a while in between all the post-apocalyptic death gangs?

No.  Next question, please.

[BasilSeal]

On 8/31/2021 at 4:20 PM, iMonrey said:

OK, I get that Yumiko wanted to stay because she wanted to find her brother. But why did everyone stay? Solidarity?? Even Eugene wanted out of there by then. And how did they get back in? Did they get recaptured? What about the soldiers they stole the uniforms from?

the whole point of them going to meet Stephanie was to find out about the commonwealth, they escape because it seems hopeless that they will be allowed entry, and from what they observe they could simply be stuck in the induction process for months or years, they change their minds when Yumico finds they have grounds for expedited entry, they all stay because getting an in with the commonwealth is what their mission is about, and now they have one.

They steal the uniforms from guards that Princess has deduced are sneaking off to have sex with each other and hence will need to remove their uniforms, they presumably simply put the uniforms back while the guards are still otherwise engaged, although it's hinted that the guards may have guessed what they've done. Ultimately it may be that they have but this doesn't matter as the induction  process is about assessing whether the new recruits are telling the truth, the attempted escape and about face doesn't necessarily mean they are unsuitable providing the commonwealth think they are ultimately truthful and do not have malicious motives.

[iMonrey]

Quote

they change their minds when Yumico finds they have grounds for expedited entry, they all stay because getting an in with the commonwealth is what their mission is about, and now they have one.

Exactly what made Yumiko think she had "grounds for expedited entry?" Has she read their bylaws, or something? They know absolutely nothing about these people or their community, I don't know where the hell Yumiko gets off telling them what their business is. She must be psychic. I don't recall them hearing from any of the other detainees that if you have a family member already inside the Commonwealth you have "grounds for expedited entry." But then again they seem to have skipped over a lot of details in this storyline so who the hell knows.