S08.E20: Godwin Page

[paigow]

Liz, Red and Dembe are forced to work together to survive an attack from Townsend; Cooper and the task force attempt to de-escalate the increasing danger to all.

*****************************************************

Evil Gunther must die... 

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by paigow

[paigow]

It would be par for the course if Page is ranked around 150 and Townsend ends up at 2... 

ETA: Within the Top 100, only 4 TBA spots are open... 2; 39; 45; 49

Edited June 6, 2021 by paigow

[Surrealist]

I'm bored with the Townsend storyline. I want to be over already.

[NeenerNeener]

Liz isn't ashamed of anything she's done this season...but she ought to be.

They should have her examined for early onset Alzheimers; she's forgotten everything Red's done to keep her alive over the last nine years, including what he did to save her bacon in the last episode.

[redfish]

Is Panabaker the only one who is doing her job and not "dazzled" by Liz?

Well, Aram you're almost there and realized Liz is not really your friend and develop a backbone ... .... Well that didn't last long. Seriously, Aram? Helping her talk to Ressler? Are you in competition of who is the biggest chump?

How stupid are they? Did they actual believed that she was safe in the box? A target that's in one place is easier to find.

 

[Neiman]

Liz is crazy. She really thinks anybody else would have done the same if in her situation? 🙄

Aram’s Tale of Two Lizzies speech was ridiculous and waste of time.

Love Edna ❤️

Edited June 5, 2021 by Neiman

[Neiman]

Great line was when Red told Harold to tell Pannebaker he’d pay for the roof...”Or, I have a guy.” 🤣

[edhopper]

Liz is a belligerent, spoiled brat who doesn't care about anyone but her stupid fee-fees.

She isn't trying to save anyone, only bringing more death. 

How many have to die for your mommy issues?

[redfish]

Burn Notice. Wow, Liz doesn't understand consequences until it's too late. That seems pretty much her character.

I don't know if it's the acting or the writing but Liz acts more petulant like an immature child than righteous.

 

[NeenerNeener]

Sounds like Red faked Katarina's death to help her go back into hiding again, pretty much what I thought a few weeks ago. What I don't understand is why, when they met in Europe last season, she chained him up, tortured him and tried to drain all his blood.

[Neiman]

So, they went on a plane ride for several hours, and while Liz slept, Red didn’t have time to check his phone messages, and during that time no one got through to Dembe to warn him about Liz’s tracking device?  🙄

1 minute ago, NeenerNeener said:

Sounds like Red faked Katarina's death to help her go back into hiding again, pretty much what I thought a few weeks ago. What I don't understand is why, when they met in Europe last season, she chained him up, tortured him and tried to drain all his blood.

I’m with you. I wonder if that woman was really Liz’s mom.

[paigow]

1 hour ago, redfish said:

Burn Notice. 

Great idea... Sam Axe / Chuck Finley would be a great replacement for Red.

Edited June 5, 2021 by paigow

[mxc90]

I would love to have seen how Red handled the officer in the convenience store. Did he go back, apologize to the officer or give him a long winded speech about Funyuns and Fritos or current politics that bored the officer to tears, resulting in the officer to not want to hear anymore, told Red/Dembe to leave and told backup don't bother with this call? 

8 seasons of all this running around and now we are at the epicenter/The Blacklist. Oh Joy! We have finally made it to Latvia. I feel so used and abused by this show!!!!!!!!

So Red is N-13. Glad that's put to rest. Only to be replaced with some fresh out the oven "Bullshit"!

I was screaming: Please put Liz in the box and cut off the air supply!!!!!! We've seen this attempted a few seasons ago. 

Liz tells Aram: there's another "Liz". How are both jackasses different for Aram to tell who is who?

Did Aram really had to ask if Townsend has people in FBI SWAT??!!!! Was Aram asleep during last week's episode regarding the fake cops shooting at Ressler/ Liz and killing the driver?

WTH! How many times have we seen an elevator used to go many levels down in the Post Office. Now the box has been on the first floor all this time and the roof is made of some cheap material??? Go fuck yourselves writers!

So the box is taken and Cooper doesn't have the sense to call for air support to tail the helicopter carrying a box? It's not like the big orange container would be hard to see during the clear day. Why hasn't Panabaker finally seen enough of Cooper to fire him? After all the murders there and now an escape/damages, why is this place still open and all these people employed??

Red's men couldn't be negligent just once and not safely harness the box and Liz gets dropped in the middle of downtown (Splat)????? Or at least give the box a little shake a few times during flight and blame violent winds to Red for Liz's concussion and broken shoulder.

Sorry Panabaker! "Curtain Call" on the program should have been a few seasons ago.

Why is Panabaker giving Cooper 24 hours? He's just going to spend 18 hours of it drinking that fine brandy.

I like Edna but next time don't be nice to Liz. Just tell her "Shut the Fuck Up! I'm talking dear!".

Not sure why Red put Liz next to Godwin and not check her for a knife.

I was hoping the barn Liz was in had an enormous amount of horse shit and flies to keep her company.

Once again Cooper is made to look stupid by Red. He spent a good time trying to tell Panabaker it was Neville. When Red just said "Yeah. It was me", Cooper was in such disbelief/disgust! I thought he was going to cry.

Poor Ressler! He is close to death and that's the "D" plot of the episode. No one really cares about him! They couldn't even get Anthony Michael Hall to make a return as his brother to pay him a visit?! 

Did Godwin take a horse to get to town? Also, who gave him change to use a pay phone? 

Aram is such an intimidating and smart interrogator. I guess with Ressler out of commission, Aram and Cooper had to share responsibilities to be the clowns this episode.

Damn! I was hoping that fast approaching object towards Neville was going to be a missile! When that plane flew over them, I was soooo pissed!

That may go down in TV history for the weakest exploding flash-bang grenade ever (tossed Neville's goon earlier in the episode)!

Liz's scar just somehow magically gotten so big. Someone in the make up department went a little over the top with their work.

Yes! Juris! It was an easy flight for Red. Took them 4 minutes to get there!

Edited June 5, 2021 by mxc90

[KaveDweller]

Just tell us Red's secret already.  Episode after episode of vague hints are super annoying.

[dwmarch]

I got a laugh out of Panabaker once again standing in for the audience. And she basically said if we have to put up with another year of this nonsense we reserve the right to reboot the whole show. I love her.

I thought Red was openly talking about the tracking device because he wanted to set Liz up so she would lead him to Townsend. But no, he has no idea even when she phones Townsend right in front of him. And then at the end he reveals that all of this has been to create some super-sophisticated intelligence agency... that can't even intercept phone calls... or check voicemail for that matter.

And of course Red says he's going to spill the beans but spends nine hours cooped up with Lizzie and doesn't say anything meaningful to her. She is oddly passive about this but while I will note the discrepancy I will also say I didn't mind.

Not being a student of Eastern European geography, every time Lizzie asked "What's in Latvia?" I answered "Lattes?" It would make about as much sense as anything else on this confounded show.

I am hoping that Katerina as originally played by Lottie Verbeek comes back. The other one can be some failed experiment at implanting memories or whatever sci-fi concept this show dabbled with back in the day.

As for the heist of the box, while I do enjoy a tribute to Saints Row the Third I find it absurd that it would actually work. Then again, Red has been in that box a couple of times and may have given some thought to how to get out of it if he ever ends up in there again. So there might be a touch of fridge brilliance to it.

Ressler has sepsis which means even his own body hates him. Harsh!

Aram and Park have a kind of cute vibe in how they snark at each other constantly.

Speaking of Aram, goddamn it, out of all the people you could possibly choose to put on gate guard duty! He'd let Lizzie out of the box after about five minutes of listening to her whining. The only reason he didn't is because she was broken out of there one minute too soon. Might as well have had Robert Vesco's cat guarding her!

Speaking of cats, Lizzie is desperate to get her hands on a phone so she can call Townsend who was trying to kill her five minutes ago. Hey Lizzie, I have an idea! Call someone who lived next door to Jennifer and tell them she won't be coming home so feed her cat please! Too soon?

[milkyaqua]

3 hours ago, paigow said:

3 hours ago, redfish said:

Burn Notice. 

Great idea... Sam Axe / Chuck Finley would be a great replacement for Red.

Ha!  I was thinking, this show wishes it was Burn Notice.

As soon as I heard the noise at the bunker I knew it was Red which is why I was so annoyed that Cooper only knew that when Red told him.  The person knew exactly where it was, what it would take to break in, no one was killed, they warned Liz it was going to move, etc.  Cooper's been drinking too much brandy.

I have no problem believing that Katerina is alive.  Which one it is, I don't know and don't really care.

And yes, who doesn't answer their phone/check their messages after spending almost half a day in the air?

Aram has "chump" written across his forehead.  Ressler is possibly dying and is concerned about Liz who is sort of the reason he's in the shape he's in.  Because it can't be said enough, Harold needs to lay off the booze, "We can bring her in."  Thank goodness for Panabaker tossing ice water on that although since this show shows no signs of going anywhere, Red and Liz will be playing dynamic duo next season and the task force will somehow have managed to survive.

Liz hasn't checked in on her daughter which isn't surprising since she's still not taking any responsibility for all the deaths she's caused just so she can have her truth.

Can we just be rid of Townsend already?  Sheesh!

Loved Edna.

[Surrealist]

Thank you for bringing me up to speed. I fell asleep in the last 15/20 minutes of the show.

[Brian Cronin]

Is "Red is Katarina" Still the Only Way That This All Can Make Sense? Check-In

Yep, Red being Katarina is still the only way for this to all make sense, even though that's a terrible plot idea. 

Please, show, don't go there!

[paigow]

In 30 years, no spy satellite has seen a giant above-ground bunker in the middle of nowhere near Riga????

Red has longer exposition monologues than his pre-murder ones...

Is Godwin [#141] ranked below The Highway Kings?

ETA: FFS! Blacklist Wiki says they are #108!!!!!!

Edited June 6, 2021 by paigow

[seacliffsal]

Just think how much good Red could have done in the last 30 years if he hadn't promised to keep Liz safe.  What with all of her inconsistency in actions and decisions, he has had to pick up after her while trying to protect her (and himself from her!).  We could potentially have achieved world peace if not for the stupid promise he so rashly made those 30 years ago.  Sigh.  If only...

[FrankOFoley]

12 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

Sounds like Red faked Katarina's death to help her go back into hiding again, pretty much what I thought a few weeks ago. What I don't understand is why, when they met in Europe last season, she chained him up, tortured him and tried to drain all his blood.

Twoo Wove???

[paigow]

This episode title should be changed to - The DOJ Directive

Edited June 5, 2021 by paigow

[tljgator]

3 hours ago, paigow said:

In 30 years, no spy satellite has seen a giant above-ground bunker in the middle of nowhere near Riga????

I'm surprised it hasn't been featured in an episode of Expedition Unknown...

Josh: Oh my God! This is amazing!

Random Conspiracy Theorist with a vaguely European accent: Yes, we've been searching for years, combing through forests, studying detailed ancient maps, and then one day, there it was.

Josh: Just out in the open like this?

Rando: Yes, yes. We were surprised to -- but here it is...The Blacklist. Do you want to go in?

Josh: Can We?! Yes, of course!

[Neiman]

Red apparently didn’t check his phone messages, but did he not check his caller ID as well? Seems like he would have followed up on that phone number Lizzie entered. I imagine he’d locate Agnes and send guys to protect her and in the process learn the whereabouts of Townsend and that Liz is still in kahoots with him.  
 

Disappointed Townsend was so easily persuaded to give up on killing Liz. 😐

[Utpe]

Didn't they blow Alan Alda up in the box and completely destroy it at one point?  I don't remember it ever being reused after that.

[Dowel Jones]

14 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Damn! I was hoping that fast approaching object towards Neville was going to be a missile! When that plane flew over them, I was soooo pissed!

I was hoping it was one of Liz's dogs.

My take on "The Blacklist":  Red and Liz walk into the nuclear weapon-proof bunker, and all that's there is a library with shelves of binders.  Red points out the first shelf and says "These are all the screenplays from season 1 to date.  Have a look if you wish."  Mr. Kaplan walks up and says "Can I help you find something?"

[paigow]

Red is N-13, The Sikorsky Archive is pre-Snowden Wikileaks... Red 13  blackmailed corporations and governments with these secrets to become a global criminal mastermind who sacrificed it all for... Liz???????!!!!!! 

[paigow]

16 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Did Godwin take a horse to get to town? Also, who gave him change to use a pay phone? 

Edna was so careless with her knife, she probably dropped her coins for the toll booth...

[Surrealist]

11 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

Is "Red is Katarina" Still the Only Way That This All Can Make Sense? Check-In

Yep, Red being Katarina is still the only way for this to all make sense, even though that's a terrible plot idea. 

Please, show, don't go there!

This is really the only viable route. Unless the writers do a full retcon of the earliest seasons.

[ottoDbusdriver]

16 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Damn! I was hoping that fast approaching object towards Neville was going to be a missile! When that plane flew over them, I was soooo pissed!

I was thinking the same thing -- please let it be a missile and have Townsend look up at the last second and say "oh shit", and Ka-Boom !!!  That would have been awesome.

Yet another crappy episode with way too much Lizzie.

Is Ressler going to magically recover and save the day at some point ??  I don't think so either.

Why weren't there any fighter jets intercepting that helicopter over D.C. ?  That was flying within sight of the Washington monument no less.

Still no sign or mention of the dogs, Robert Vesco's cat or Sierra the Cat.  I was kind of hoping they were inside the bunker in Latvia.  :)

[CaptainE]

Garbage writing once again:

So the US govt issues a kill order on an ex agent, on US soil, and tells the FBI head and a doofus agent about it?   Yeah happens every day.{roll-eyes}

Agent Park  gives such  a shit about Ressler  that she stays at the hospital?   Btw, so much drama there.  I wonder if he’ll be ok?  {roll-eyes}
Agent Park calls her “agent Keen”?

Aram rubs one off while visiting the box apparently .   Wtf?

Boone cries so well.  What acting.  Wait, not ONE tear rolled down her face.  Actor’s studio performance there. {again rolling}

The scar has grown fivefold.  Continuity department? 

Red had a pretty bad illness a while back.  Anyone remember that?  Bueller?

What are the odds we learn nothing next episode?

Edited June 5, 2021 by CaptainE

[ottoDbusdriver]

1 hour ago, CaptainE said:

Red had a pretty bad illness a while back.  Anyone remember that?  Bueller?

Yep, Reddington was practically on death's door -- and there has been no update since, and he seems to be pretty spry.

[Neiman]

I think they’re going to set it up so that Raymond dies and Liz takes over. That will be the series finale. 
 

I’d prefer that Liz die now and we get next season with a focus on Red.

[paigow]

1 hour ago, Neiman said:

I think they’re going to set it up so that Raymond dies and Liz takes over. That will be the series finale. 

Next season will be the Dembe & Marvin joint venture... they will recruit / conscript any surviving Townsend minions and cut ties with any Russian entities.

[Surrealist]

3 hours ago, Neiman said:

I think they’re going to set it up so that Raymond dies and Liz takes over. That will be the series finale. 
 

I’d prefer that Liz die now and we get next season with a focus on Red.

I agree with you that everything has been a set up for Liz to take over. I would be fine if that became the series finale, but not any sooner than that.

But, like you, I'd be fine if Liz was killed off and the show's focus (until its end) was on Raymond and Dembé.

[b4pjoe]

I read the Q & A over in the "The Blacklist in the Media" thread with JON BOKENKAMP. He really seems to think this storyline is some kind of masterpiece. Evidently he does not read this forum. 😃

The only way they can save this show is to kill off Liz Keen and the sooner the better. I'd rather watch Red and Dembe pick flowers in a park than watch another minute of Liz, Neville Townsend and this version of the FBI which obviously stands for Full Blown Idiots.

[Brian Cronin]

Oh man, the scar, I forgot about the scar. That was INSANE. How could they think that that made any sense? "La la la, oh yeah, here's this GIANT PULSATING SCAR OUT OF NOWHERE that I am trying to convince you has always been like this." 

Liz's shtick about "I was driven to this" and "Anyone in my shoes would do this" really makes me concerned that Bokenkamp seriously BELIEVES that. He has always seen something in Keen that just isn't there. 

[BrownBear2012]

On 6/4/2021 at 9:04 PM, NeenerNeener said:

Sounds like Red faked Katarina's death to help her go back into hiding again, pretty much what I thought a few weeks ago. What I don't understand is why, when they met in Europe last season, she chained him up, tortured him and tried to drain all his blood.

In Blacklist land that was then and this is now...in other words, the writers think we have the brains of an ant and can't remember a season or two ago what happened. 

[BrownBear2012]

15 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

Oh man, the scar, I forgot about the scar. That was INSANE. How could they think that that made any sense? "La la la, oh yeah, here's this GIANT PULSATING SCAR OUT OF NOWHERE that I am trying to convince you has always been like this." 

Liz's shtick about "I was driven to this" and "Anyone in my shoes would do this" really makes me concerned that Bokenkamp seriously BELIEVES that. He has always seen something in Keen that just isn't there. 

Dollars to donuts Bokenkamp isn't writing this slop anymore. He probably handed it off to other people so he could work on other material for another show. Every show I've ever watched that has lasted longer than four seasons has had this problem. Sons of Anarchy, Game of Thrones, Seinfeld...etc.etc...the originator/writer has a hit and after four or five seasons moves along to other projects and has the secondary writers take over and the show sucks. 

[Brian Cronin]

1 hour ago, BrownBear2012 said:

Dollars to donuts Bokenkamp isn't writing this slop anymore. He probably handed it off to other people so he could work on other material for another show. Every show I've ever watched that has lasted longer than four seasons has had this problem. Sons of Anarchy, Game of Thrones, Seinfeld...etc.etc...the originator/writer has a hit and after four or five seasons moves along to other projects and has the secondary writers take over and the show sucks. 

That's very common and that exact thing that you describe takes place frequently (a show falling apart once the creator stops showrunning it), but Blacklist is one of those rare shows where the creator never stopped showrunning the show. He doesn't write every episode, of course (although he's written a few this season and I'm sure he'll write next week's episode), but he's very much behind everything that goes on on the show still. 

[BrownBear2012]

31 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

That's very common and that exact thing that you describe takes place frequently (a show falling apart once the creator stops showrunning it), but Blacklist is one of those rare shows where the creator never stopped showrunning the show. He doesn't write every episode, of course (although he's written a few this season and I'm sure he'll write next week's episode), but he's very much behind everything that goes on on the show still. 

Well…if that is true, then he’s failing. He might as well work on something else.

[Brian Cronin]

2 hours ago, BrownBear2012 said:

Well…if that is true, then he’s failing. He might as well work on something else.

I think something you'll often see with stuff like this is when someone creates a show and it lasts way past their initial expectations (there is no way that ANYONE could possibly imagine that their TV show will last past six seasons, ya know?), they have to come up with ways to keep it going while holding true to their original plans and, well, it usually fails miserably when that happens. Had The Blacklist ended after, say, five seasons, I bet Bokenkamp would have had a tight ending. 

The more it goes on, though, you have to just do these shaggy dog stories that go NOWHERE. 

And since he obviously thinks Liz is much more compelling than she actually is, Bokenkamp thinks we'll be interested in various divergent stories involving Liz.

[BrownBear2012]

7 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

I think something you'll often see with stuff like this is when someone creates a show and it lasts way past their initial expectations (there is no way that ANYONE could possibly imagine that their TV show will last past six seasons, ya know?), they have to come up with ways to keep it going while holding true to their original plans and, well, it usually fails miserably when that happens. Had The Blacklist ended after, say, five seasons, I bet Bokenkamp would have had a tight ending. 

The more it goes on, though, you have to just do these shaggy dog stories that go NOWHERE. 

And since he obviously thinks Liz is much more compelling than she actually is, Bokenkamp thinks we'll be interested in various divergent stories involving Liz.

To put it simply…this show has jumped the shark.

[saber5055]

44 minutes ago, BrownBear2012 said:

To put it simply…this show has jumped the shark.

Happy Days went on for six more seasons after Fonzie went waterskiing in season five.

That's not a good omen.

[paigow]

Red could sing Springtime For Hitler and NBC would renew Season 10.

Edited June 6, 2021 by paigow

[Neiman]

It’s been discussed here in the past, so I won’t dwell, but I think the show started going off the rails when M. Boone became pregnant.  Would love to know what they had planned before that happened. In retrospect, I wish they had given her baggy clothes and only filmed her from the waist up and not written the pregnancy into the show plot. 

[paigow]

6 minutes ago, Neiman said:

It’s been discussed here in the past, so I won’t dwell, but I think the show started going off the rails when M. Boone became pregnant. 

was not killed off in numerous opportunities...

[Neiman]

7 minutes ago, paigow said:

was not killed off in numerous opportunities...

LOL 😂

I guess it could be said the show started going off the rails when they cast M. Boone for the role, but I read somewhere that she was actually the first one cast. Unbelievable.

[saber5055]

25 minutes ago, Neiman said:

I wish they had given her baggy clothes and only filmed her from the waist up and not written the pregnancy into the show plot. 

I guess the pregnancy doesn't matter now though, since Agnes seems to be living with the dogs and Robert Vesco's cat.

[mxc90]

This comes to mind every time I hear "Showrunner" and "Blacklist". I believe this was the season 5 hurdle!

 

 

 

Edited June 6, 2021 by mxc90